/lit/ - Literature

>>16143041
Why not be a Cartesian monk instead? They also get meditations.

>>16143041
I don't get to read what I want and have to disrupt work for praying for the umpteenth time while changing robes constantly.

Are you in US, Canada or Europe?

How do i become a capuchin monkey?
What keeping you in this soul-draining society rather than embracing a life of pure play, peace and arboreal acrobatics?

Because they only want you to pay them money to do a „sabbatical“. It‘s all filth now.

>>16143072
Europe, why?

>>16143056
>while changing robes constantly

What? You keep your clothes for the whole day actually.

>>16143094
Find the nearest one to you and write a letter or visit them in person. Having a recommendation from a priest helps but they have very low attendance so it isn't needed. Most people can't handle it but it's a good lifestyle.

https://www.chartreux.org

>>16143162
They do not allow visitors for tours but they will talk about a vocation in person.

>>16143080

Cmon man dont make me feel like this

because god don't real and being a young man who desires to be a monk in the 21st century is the absolute pinnacle of cope.

>>16143356
Even if God wasn't real, it is still desirable to be free from all social attachments and slavery to your flesh. This life will allow peace and tranquility. The only one coping here is you.

>>16143367
>even if god doesn't real, fk modern society i will be a monk! >:(

living a lie isolated in the mountains will not give you peace of mind buddy. there are less extreme measures

>>16143386
Cope.

>>16143388
being a fake monk (an unrealistic goal anyway) is literal textbook cope so...

>>16143393
It's not unrealistic. Learning to deal with society is a literal cope. Leaving it is not.

>>16143407
"cope" as in "dealing with emotional difficulty" as the meme goes seems to be the goal of becoming a monk when you don't even believe in fucking god lol. fuck's sake what a pathetic mentality one must have to be this way. why are we even arguing about the definition of some meme anyway lol

additionally, if you actually went through with this (you won't) you would quickly find that you have failed to actually run away from society. human beings are society, you don't stop the bullshit train just because you're some cloistered incel, if anything it would be magnified. you need to read more. read about the history of the church, about monks in general, about the various corruptions of clergy and the material reality of being a monk in the 21st century. if you are some coping fag who just wants to escape the modern world, you will not like what you read.

>>16143041
First, monasticism is not “peace”. The closer you get to God, the more you are tried and tempted by innumerable demons. The most holy of monks were sometimes physically assaulted by demons. It is, in fact, among the more hardcore things you could do. It is absolutely not escapism. Nevertheless, if you wish to become or discern becoming a monk, my recommendation is:
pray
> pray
pray
> pray
pray
> pray
pray
> pray
pray
> pray
(Did I mention praying?)

>>16143080
nothing is stopping you anon

>>16143041
you want to escape, they'll figure it out pretty quickly and you'll wash out. are you even a christian? if you turn up there saying you want tobe a monk they'll ask if you are active in your local parish, go to mass regularly etc. if you don't do any of that they'll know you just want to escape from your life problems and try to send you away

>>16143080
Follow your dreams, anon.

>>16143162
Not op but I live in Grenoble actually, be aware that these guy never speak expect at Mass (no idle chatter though) and during the weekly walk in the mountains

>>16144476
What good are monks when they turn someone away that needs refugee? God said ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

>>16144485
Read Corinthians

>>16144522
Sure but why?

>>16143041
>What keeping you in this soul-draining society rather than embracing a life of pure meditation, peace and monastic study?
I am strong.

>>16144485
you're more correct than you know. in theory, monks are ethereal spirit beings who are in touch with god. in practice, they are mere subjects suffered by global capital as we all are. if the state wishes to vanish them, then poof, the monks are gone. many such cases.

and so it doesn't matter if you are some worthless incel who wants to be a monk: in the meme this is the perfect candidate, someone separated from society looking for something more; in practice such a person has no chance of being a monk because monasteries are ruled by the same capitalist horseshit that binds us all. so ironically, being a total social pariah looking for truth in the desert doesn't matter, it's more about your material conditions and ability that matters to monastic orders. obviously it must be that way or any beggar could become a monk and poverty would not be a thing. all fucking monkniggers must fucking hang.

I've always been interested in monastic life.
Can anyone tell me the difference between Franciscans Benedictines and carthusians?

>>16144551
It truly is a shame but i do know how right i am.
See
>>16143082
It‘s sad times when one isn‘t even allowed to become a hermit or monk anymore unless you have the finances to do so.

>>16144485
It's not a rehab clinic. They are not there to help disaffected young men.

>>16144566
you don't know anything or you'd know it was like this since monasteries have existed

>>16144566
It's mostly homosexuals who become monks, didn't you know? I visited a monastery a few times and they were mostly obvious homosexuals, one monk even had prissy mannerisms.

>>16144602
What are they there for then? What else is monasticism than a way to abstain from the filth of the world and devote your time to god? Who would be in more need of that than misguided young men?

>>16144602
then what are they there for? to pray all day? seems like a weird way to jerk off

>>16144566
Even in the middle ages they didn't want losers hanging around. They'd make it very hard on you if you wanted to join , theyd tell you to get lost only if you could really show you wanted god then they would allow you in.

>>16144624
>to pray all day
Yes

>>16144637
personally i prefer brazilian foot worship but to each their own.

>>16144614
Maybe to some extend, sure. But it seems to become worse by the day.
But yes, i don‘t claim to know a lot about the history of monasticism.

>>16144617
Well those seem like the right ones to be in need of guidance from god.
I‘ve worked in a former monastery for a while (they have abused the building for other things), and when they renovated it they found secret tunnels between the monastery and the nunnery as well as a hidden burial ground for new born babies in the garden. I think that says it all.

>>16144618
>Who would be in more need of that than misguided young men?

Try it. You won't want to wake up at 3am to pray, they'll force you. And they won't let you stay in your cell all day to read and Jack off. You'll be running away from the place within a few weeks or theyll kick you out.

no 4chan poster will ever be accepted into a monastery. you dont think they'll see through your intentions?

>>16144649
That being said, you don't have faith, which is the key thing. You aren't on fire for the Lord, hence you aren't meant to live a life or prayer.

>>16144644
you mean monkey paw worship

>>16144656
>>16144677
What makes you think you know so much about me?

>>16144689
You keep saying you want to get away from the degeneracy, not saying much about God. It's pretty clear you don't care that much about God except in a notional sense. You just want to run away from your life.

>>16144689
they are not going to accept some loser who wants to run away from real life just so he can hide in a cell and jerk of all day.

>>16144699
Also it's pretty obvious it's not degeneracy in a non specific form that you want to get away from, but from your own negative reactions to it. Probably you do degenerate things yourself and want to escape those things too.

>>16144699
>>16144719
Just to clarify, i‘m not op.
I‘ve contemplated joining a nunnery a few years ago but decided that indeed it would have only been a sign of my weakness so i decided to instead become better at facing the filth.

>>16144649
>But yes, i don‘t claim to know a lot about the history of monasticism.

you don't have to be a scholar to realize that monasticism was always a position of privilege and that le monk asceticism was always a facade. again, if all you had to do was be a primo god botherer then there would have been zero beggars in the middle ages. literal lines outside the door of people ready to be monks.

c*pitalism strikes again.

>>16144740
Yes i agree that is true. But who doesn‘t fantasize about an ascetic life to cleanse oneself of one‘s own degeneracy?

>>16143041
Adhd

>>16144757
Yeah you‘re right. What a shame.

>>16144740
I hate arm chair psychologists like you, you'll probably burn in hell.

>>16143367
>it is still desirable to be free from all social attachments and slavery to your flesh
Why?

>>16144807
>Why?

>>16144757
I visited a monastery and all the monks seemed like they came from wealthy backgrounds. They had PhDs, successful careers, etc. Then they became monks when they were old.

If you want something that will accept you as someone who has nothing, it's not Christianity. The church wants people with money.

Sufi durgahs in the middle east are more like what you imagine a monastery would be like. They accept poor/loserish people, it's not a negative thing like it is with these Christian hypocrites, for sufis being a loser is seen as God drawing you to himself rather than something which is your fault.

>>16144824
Good argument, I'm convinced.

>>16143367
So become a Hindu then, Christianity is babby tier.

>>16144775
This is rich coming from someone who wants to be a monk

>>16144757
Yes, because all beggars would want to live a life of severe discipline and fasting. They would be happier begging on the streets, that's why they didn't join monasteries. Go point out a local beggar, you honestly think he would want to be a monk?

>>16144834
they sound poor and dumb lol. not a criticism, i'm just saying that you seem to think this is some remedy to the problem but really it's just third worlders who would be the same assholes if they had money. and we haven't even touched on theology.

>>16144834
>PhD
>Successful
Yes, disciplined individuals, there because they are mature enough, not because they were rich. Delusional. Plus, them seeing the vanity of wealth probably drove them to the monastery

>>16144856
if it meant a regular meal and bed and bougie support, i do. i have been in that position and if my choices were:

>be a piece of shit on the streets

or

>be a meme man and pray all day and get food and shelter and have a purpose

i'd obviously choose the latter, as the many beggars would.

>>16144888
>have a purpose
You act as if a "purpose" is something that can just be given to you

>>16144888
You say pray all day as if its something easy. Shut in all day as if its something desirable. It's only desirable to those who want to be close to God, not for people who want regular meals. If you can call a monastic diet "regular meals". Fasting constantly and vegetarianism. I disagree with you. Most homeless would prefer the streets. It feels completely purposeless if you don't believe in prayer.

>>16144916
fine, ignore the purpose part if you want. people just want food and a goddamn bed, a big appeal of the monastery to incels and other rejects is that they perceive these places to be sources of stability in our chaotic capitalist hell.

>>16144918
i'll try that and you try being an abused homeless bum and at the end of the day we figure out which is easier.

>>16144843
Im someone else, Ive just been watching the conversation and you suck.

>>16144945
Being an abused homeless bum is more conducive to your salvation and more honorable than a hypocrite who joins a monastery just for bed and water. Under your logic, no homeless person should exist, as they should just commit crime and find themselves in jail for bed and food. Issue is, man's desires are not materialistic. So too, monasteries should select the cream of the crop and not failures who just want stability.

>>16144987
>Being an abused homeless bum is more conducive to your salvation

thanks i'll munch on that jk i'll starve you faggot

>>16144987
And by failure, I don't mean societal failures, rather just undisciplined wretches who simply cannot operate in a strict monastery. Such wretch could be rich or poor.

>>16144888
>i'd obviously choose the latter, as the many beggars would.
Lol no. For homeless bums booze is priority #1, everything else (like sleeping in a bed and not dying from hypothermia) is a very distant second.

>>16144878
Unlikely, they seemed to see it more like "I've achieved everything in the world now I'm going to retire from it and 'achieve' god." As if this is putting the crown on a life of achievement. Nothing to do with humility.

>>16145010
ok boomer

>>16145012
How pitiful this materialistic society has come with its pointless, artificial class war between the rich and the poor, which has never existed. You'd prefer the rich man to retire in a Dubai condo, or live a difficult life in a communistic society that offers incessantly prayers for the rectification of the world, and furthermore, does other activities as run Universities, orphanages, create religious art, etc...

>>16145054
>artificial class war between the rich and the poor, which has never existed
Read any history book

>>16144878
They had successful careers and obviously came from comfortable middle class backgrounds.

>>16145061
>only reads history books written by Jews
>>16145062
As if that's a sin or something? Now should the monastery be limited to said wealthy individuals, of course not, and I believe that they are not. The monastery does have the authority to select individuals that have proven themselves to be disciplined, however. I consider the monastery, but only after I've struggled in the forum of society. But, my point remains that the monastery is not a comfy location, but a site of demonic harassment and constant spiritual warfare.

>>16145087
>antisemite wants to join a monastery
Classic

>>16145087
They are people from privileged backgrounds.

Devoting your entire life to larping? No thanks.

>>16145098
Being rich is not a privilege according to Jesus Christ, it is harder to be saved if you have the temptation of wealth and the responsibility of having to use that wealth wisely.
>>16145087
I am not an antisemite, I have no qualms with them on a biological deterministic basis, rather I am opposed to the pop-jew modern-jew mythos and philosophy/historical revisionism which I consider subversive. If a Jew is baptized, I have nothing but admiration for him.

>>16145264
That's a lot of bloviating just to say you're an antisemite

>>16145274
Would you care to define the term, then?

>>16145292
Anyone who talks in terms of a jewish cabal running the world is almost certainly antisemitic. Saying that you have respect for a baptized jew is really just saying you a christian.

>>16145322
You didn't define the term. I did not say I do not have respect for Jews in my above post

>>16145338
All you're doing is asking me to "define the term" so you can pick holes in it. You talk about the subversive nature of the "modern-jew" yet insist that you are not antisemite. How can you talk out of both sides of your mouth like this?

>>16145361
>All you're doing is asking me to "define the term" so you can pick holes in it. Y
Are you seriously refusing to define a word that you keep using?

>>16144748
hot
post tits

>>16145380
it's the secret sauce, you're not really expecting him to just hand over the keys to the kingdom, are you?

>>16145361
You don't have a definition that is impervious to hole-picking? I talked about the nature of the subversive modern Jewish mythos, which has nothing to do with the jewish individual, but is rather a philosophical school I oppose. Opposing the philosophical school is not anti-Semitic

>>16145361
Now, then. Please define that term, there is no word more wrongly used than the word antisemitism.

>>16144748
But I do not think a monastery is an escape from the filth, rather a spiritual confrontation entirely based on self-mastery in an environment suited to it

>>16145547
>>16145380
>>16145538
No, fuck you disingenuous faggots

>>16145757
Calling people disingenuous while refusing to define the term you keep lobbing at them requires chutzpah at least I guess.

>>16143041

I'm planning to head out on foot across Europe (starting in western France) soon, and hope to visit several monasteries on the way. Have read a couple of books including The Age of the Cloister and also Hermits by Peter France which are really interesting histories of monasteries, the former the more focused of the two and the latter covering the Egyptian desert fathers to the Russian hermits etc.

bump

>>16144834
>sufis arent losers

but they sure are considered kaffir