/lit/ - Literature

>>15870562
Biggest disstrack ever dropped during 19th century

>>15870560
Based.

>>15870562
Cringe.

>>15870560
It's actually a very insightful essay too. People seem to think it's just random antisemitic work.

>>15870560
>>15869416

>>15870612
>Music is like an auditory yummy cheese cake and sticky fucking yummy yummy cookies mmm big shit turd cake with lotsa nummies and sweeties for my nummy tummy

>>15870560
interesting shit about how medieval people didn't actually write new music they just patched together existing melodies

>>15870593
https://youtu.be/y4x6OiHe3AU?t=144
>implying Nietzsche wasn't just publicly humiliated by Wagner on a number of occasions

>>15870562
cringe

>>15870664

The idea of imitation upsets the notion of historical progress, of the inevitable linear march of culture. It offends the sensibilities of those who assume that the artist's separateness from society is synonymous with his separateness from other experiences of separation. It ignores the fact that without imitation, without the continuous willful exploitation of artistic tradition, no art of any importance could exist in a culture such as ours. In point of fact, to make art every artist must be engaged in imitation most of the time. Nevertheless, the view from his own area of separateness could never be exactly the same as the view from any other area of separateness, no matter what bond might exist between the vary ing degrees of artistic estrangement. And consequently, no matter how conscious or unconscious, willful or unintentional the imi tative process may be, the reordering and redistributing of detail will, of themselves, provide statistical assurance that no two artists are ever quite the same.

>>15870720
Invention is the other factor in the creative process of orna mentation, of providing for an already existing utility some small enhancement which it has previously lacked or which, perhaps more accurately, it has not thought necessary. The relation be tween imitation and invention is, on the whole, one of close har mony. Without imitation, without the conscious assimilation of previous points of view, invention would be groundless. Without the spur of invention, the desire to complement, to enhance, imi tation, the urge to redistribute, would lack a motivating force. Obviously, the rebel, the anarchist, the beatnik will hope to effect a higher invention-over-imitation ratio than the conservative who will be content to reorder the facets of the cultural kaleidoscope he already admires with only a hint of inventive ornamentation here and there. But even the anarchical disposition or the grossly rebellious beatnik temperament will sustain a preponderance of imitation in the creative pattern. We have only to examine the flaccid writings of Mr. Jack Kerouac or the ponderous musings of Mr. Henry Miller to realize how short a time is required for yester day's rebel to retire into the senility of today's village atheist. It is no accident that those works of art which cater most deliberately to the specialized tastes and problems of their own time are the ones which become most quickly outdated. Entire careers, George Bernard Shaw's is one, can be put in jeopardy because of the urge of the artist to address himself in consciously contemporaneous terms to his audience.

>>15870677
what is cringe about Nietzsche's criticism of Wagner exactly?

>>15870562
Wagner is no dramatist; let nobody be deceived on this point. All he did was to love the word “drama”—he always loved fine words. Nevertheless, inhiswritingstheword“drama”ismerelya misunderstanding (—and a piece of shrewdness: Wagner always affected superiority in regard to the word “opera”—), just as the word “spirit” is a misunderstanding in the New Testament.—He was not enough of a psychologist for drama; he instinctively avoided a psychological plot—but how?—by always putting idiosyncrasy in its place.… Very modern—eh? Very Parisian! very decadent!… Incidentally, the plots that Wagner knows how to unravel with the help of dramatic inventions, are of quite another kind. For example, let us suppose that Wagner requires a female voice. A whole act without a woman's voice would be impossible! But in this particular instance not one of the heroines happens to be free. What does Wagner do? He emancipates the oldest woman on earth, Erda. “Step up, aged grandmamma! You have got to sing!” And Erda sings. Wagner's end has been achieved. Thereupon he immediately dismisses the old lady. “Why on earth did you come? Off with you! Kindly go to sleep again!” In short, a scene full of mythological awe, before which the Wagnerite "wonders" all kinds of things.…

>>15870800
Would you believe it, that Wagner's heroines one and all, once they have been divested of the heroic husks, are almost indistinguishable from Madme Bovary!—just as one can conceive conversely, of Flaubert's being well able to transform all his heroines into Scandinavian or Carthaginian women, and then to offer them to Wagner in this mythologised form as a libretto. Indeed, generally speaking, Wagner does not seem to have become interested in [029] any other problems than those which engross the little Parisian decadents of to-day. Always five paces away from the hospital! All very modern problems, all problems which are at home in big cities! do not doubt it!… Have you noticed (it is in keeping with this association of ideas) that Wagner's heroines never have any children?—They cannot have them.… The despair with which Wagner tackled the problem of arranging in some way for Siegfried's birth, betrays how modern his feelings on this point actually were.—Siegfried “emancipated woman”—but not with any hope of offspring.—And now here is a fact which leaves us speechless: Parsifal is Lohengrin's father! How ever did he do it?—Ought one at this juncture to remember that “chastity works miracles”?…

>>15870800
>>15870830
Dumb.

>>15870946
Yor dumb.

>>15871044
No.

>>15870680
lmao it all makes sense, der coomermensch never recovered from this

>>15871054
>No,
Yes.

>>15870677
nuuuuuu i luv mai 24 hr opera cycles about boring bougie coomers with horn helmets its so Epic and and based !!!!!

>>15870664
>>15870680
Was waiting for these posts

>>15871067

>>15870560
Any good books about krautrock?

Any good non-pozzed books about the ring cycle?

>>15872057
Try Houston Stewart Chamberlain and George Bernard Shaw. But at the end of the day the best explanation will be Wagner's own writings and whatever philosophy of art or life that you have.

See:
>Religion and Art
>"What Boots this Knowedge?"
>Know Thyself
>Introduction to a work of Count Gobineau's
>Hero-dom and Christendom
>On Poetry and Composition
>Judaism in Music
>What is German?
>Modern
>Art and Revolution
>The Art-Work of the Future
>Opera and Drama
>On State and Religion

>>15870560
How Bluegrass Destroyed My Life - John Fahey

>>15870664
almost completely unrelated, but i highly recommend Richard Burton's recitation of poems by Wilfred Owen https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFmUp1jgsfY

Based on what?

>>15870560
What to listen for in music by Aaron Copeland. Hands down the best way to get deeply into music if you’re not a musician