/lit/ - Literature

It's based being the Chad of progressivism.

>>15866480
What do you think is going through Scruton's mind? lmao

>>15866475
well, we do have to grow up someday right?
we cant just go on believing in santa claus just because its comfy&spiritual

>>15866480
>>15866486
>ahh black
>I like blacks
>same with pakis and indians
>they're a nice people
>as a conservative i want my country to remain white
>but i don't dislike these childrens company, it's nice meeting them

>>15866493
It connects to something within man, and to ignore that is nihilism. "Erido cog asum delelo; Man is what his nature is".

>>15866493
then grow up and get your head out of Freud's ass

>>15866493

There's nothing adult about internal chaos, dysfunction and cynicism. Who do you think is more infantile - Palestrina or Johnny Rotten?

>>15866475
Take the newagepill.

>>15866475
>read something I like and agree with
>"I like this and agree with this"

>read something I dislike and disagree with
>"I dislike and disagree with this"

wow.. depp

>>15866495
>conservative
>racist

oh anon...

>>15866534
When will you realise there is no spirit in it? It's a different form of materialism.

>>15866556
He said himself all the non-whites invading will be a problem, and already are. One of his writing friends wrote a thing about possible forced removal of recent immigrants.

That's why Scruton is likeable, he's a sincere conservative.

>comfy spiritual

>>15866554
I didn't say I disagreed with the left side. They both talked about issues concerning society while occupying a deeply pessimistic stance, the vibe was completely different though.

What are some good conservative comfy spiritual books? I don't want something inherently political, but just a traditional, reserved, tight-knit story- i.e. "conservative" in its literal defintion

>>15867576
Growth of the Soil by Knut Hamsun

I need more books like these.

>>15866475
Conservatism is just progressivism driving the speed limit.

>>15867830
Is Prussian Populism good? I've heard conflicting reports but I get the feeling it's only called "whacky" by modern day liberals.

>>15866559
Did you just call Hindu Pantheism a form of materialism?

>>15866475
What authors in particular?

>>15866475
Why are you guys so spooky? Conservatism weirds me out because it’s like that kid I grew up with that read too much lotr, thought he was a hobbit and stopped wearing shoes.

>>15868008
>I don't understand it, thus it scares me
Never gonna make it

>>15867937
Right-wing socialism at its finest.
>My fervent hope is that no one will remain hidden who was born with the ability to command, and that no one is given the responsibility for commanding who lacks the inborn talent for doing so. Socialism means ability, not desire. Not the quality of intentions but the quality of accomplishments is decisive. I turn to our youth. I call upon all who have marrow in their bones and blood in their veins. Train yourselves! Become men! We need no more ideologists, no more chatter about Bildung and cosmopolitanism and Germany’s intellectual mission. We need hardness, we need a courageous skepticism, we need a class of socialistic mastertypes. Once again: Socialism means power, power, and more power. Thoughts and schemes are nothing without power. The path to power has already been mapped: the valuable elements of German labor in union with the best representatives of the Old Prussian state idea, both groups determined to build a strictly socialist state to democratize our nation in the Prussian manner; both forged into a unit by the same sense of duty, by the awareness of a great obligation, by the will to obey in order to rule, to die in order to win, by the strength to make immense sacrifices in order to accomplish what we were born for, what we are, what could not be without us. We are socialists. Let us hope that it will not have been in vain.

>>15868025
I don’t find it confronting. I just don’t understand all the larping. Explain it to me.

>>15868008
That kid sounds based. You sound like a conservatard.

>>15867963
American Protties do this thing where they redefine words with actual meanings to "whatever I do or do not like". You're an atheist unless you're a Baptist, if you're not an evangelical Christian you're a nihilist, you can't have morality unless you attend the same church as them, etc.

When they say dumb shit like
>How can you have morality without God?
What they're actually saying is
>You're a bad person if you disagree with me

It's because American Protestantism grew in an environment where actual proselytism and religion interaction was impossible. Because everyone basically believed the same thing but with incredibly minor differences, and because you can't actually remove people who disagree with you from the territory that you inhabit, inter-denominational (and interfaith) dialogue could only ever be used to score points with your own team. Communication stops being about conveying information, but instead about signalling. The reason to have a debate is not to try and convert non-believers, but rather to demonstrate your personal goodness to other members of your in-group.

>>15868066
You don't even have the empathy and intelligence to put yourself in his perspective and try to understand. It's so simple, but you failed to do it. Why would I give you the simple answer when you won't be able to comprehend it and it's just going to make you angry and make you insult me?

>>15868068
Na. Just don’t like hippies. Speaking of which; I live in Australia and the bushmen hippies that live out in currumdinga, nowhere often have views I could only describe as reactionary/alt-right. Is this a global phenomenon or just Australia?

>>15866493
based

>>15868106
Geez. I was just asking a question. I didn’t need all the guilt. You guys a really big on saying no.

>>15868089
> The reason to have a debate is not to try and convert non-believers, but rather to demonstrate your personal goodness to other members of your in-group.
So American Protestantism created modern virtue signalling due to it's rejection of rationality in argumentation and doctrine and focus on emotional states? That's what I'm getting out of this.

>>15866475
diarrhea post

>>15866475
based

>>15868031
>Right-wing socialism
What would I give to personally strangle every pseudo-right NEETSoc who ever uttered that mind numbing phrase.

>>15868132
Eco-fascism/An-prim, the movement grows

>>15868066
easy. it seems like we care about things only indofar as it is aesthetic and empathetically close. there is little that people really care about a death of a random person in 1212 ad or about some random string of numbers. people like naritives. people want an ideal, not a particular. people feel nostalgic for the 1950 because a lot of things felt serendipity and in place and order, while a non conservative instead opts to focus on a problem of the time rather than its value. this enevitably leads to one trying to deconstruct and the other constructing. the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle, but the core essence of trying to kindle some good and order from something rather than admonishing its blemishes is apealing and optimistic.

>>15869642
going of this, i would ask you to think of how the japanese seem to treat things. they obviously have problems, but they tend to side on the side of the ideal image rather than deconstruction.

>>15867830
Me too

>>15866570
interesting observation

OP literally read two books and now thinks he understand the political spectrum. Psycho-analysis is marginal, even in left-wing circles, and spiritualism is incredibly marginal, especially in conservative circles.

>>15869542
If that nearsighted 5'6 german nerd said this to my face, I would snap his neck on the spot like a dry twig. I deadlift 550 pounds. I could rip his spine apart without breaking a sweat.

>>15870706
You'd just get shot

>>15866475
>read a libertarian writer
>each chapter requires a $5 subscription plus automatic sign-up to a monthly newsletter

>>15869542
>>15870712
Pathetic.

>>15866493
Funny how the people who say this sort of thing are always notably immature

>>15867911
/thread

>open conservative book
>"HURRRRRR JEWS"
>"DURRRRR WOMEN"
>"SHMURRRRRR POC"
yeah, real achievement you got there, nazis.

>>15871623
Some of them you can read for free, but only if you promise to move to New Hampshire in the next five years

>comfy spiritual
Sounds like the pacifist anarchist Tolstoy
>psychoanalytic mess
Sounds like the slavophile reactionary Dostoevsky

>>15871623
This is to prevent women and other undesirables from acquiring valuable knowledge. Back when they didn't know how to read, charging people wasn't necessary. Look at it as something taken from SocDem doctrine, "nudging".

>>15872763
funny how that pacifist Spooked the communists so much

>>15867911
step 1
>Boomerisms, propaganda, corporate news
step 2
>even worse propaganda, Intergalactic lizard people, orange man
step 3
>kekistani meme fags, da jooos, we wuz aryans
step 4
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tio_ZmHf4Y

>>15868577
Well yea progressivism is the most advanced protestantism

>>15866493
Kids belive in Santa. Lkberals believe in oppresion, /pol/ believes in jews. All of them are mentally children.

>>15866564
> he's
Anon...
Said this, yeah, Scruton is open in that he dislikes inmigration. He was truly the Last Social Conservative intellectual given the progressive's purge of right leaning opinions

>>15875020
This might be the biggest irony here. Modern Progressivism is basically Secular Protestantism

>>15872726
Good observation, you seem very smart.

>>15872726
Said by someone who has not even opened a conservative book in their life.

>>15867911
>he's never heard of Conservative Revolution
Cringe, not all conservatives are liberal conservatives.

>>15872726
I once saw a study done that showed that people on the left struggle with conceptualizing what, and why, people with opposing polical opinions believe in. I guess its a natural consequence of painting them out as topical pop-culture fantasy villains.

>>15875606
I know very well about it. They didn't really oppose progressivism. At most, they considered it dangerous, but inevitable. Read Perfektion der Technik by Jünger's brother and Der Mensch und die Technik by Spengler.

>>15866480
>sadoconservatism

>>15875822
>They didn't really oppose progressivism. At most, they considered it dangerous, but inevitable
That entirely depends on which thinker you're talking about. Spengler was very much like that, but others were not.

>He hasn't read Sloterdijk

>>15875895
Is he worth the read? I only know about him from Zizek. What's his basic premise/ideas?

>>15875047
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Feminists_by_religion
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Feminists_by_ethnicity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Anarchists

>>15866515
Whats wrong with Freud?

>>15875671
What about all the sweeping umbrella term of "the left" that even OP used

>>15875876
Give me one (1) example.

>>15876049
Well Ernst himself for one, most of the thinkers were not a deterministic as Spengler and wanted to create a new order, hence the name.

>>15869542
>killing leftists isn't murder because leftists aren't people
based

What makes someone conservative and what makes someone left leaning? Also wouldnt most writers from the past tend to be conservative anyway because society is constantly changing

>>15872726
What conservative book have you read? Mein Kampf?

>>15876115
Marx

>>15875606
They weren't conservatives, especially Junger.

>>15866475
>read this post
>incoherent

Can you actually level an argument?

>>15876418
Junger was absolutely a Conservative Revolutionary. What else would he have been?

>>15876557
Ok but that's not conservative.

>>15876569
It is conservative, just a different strain of it. There's also traditionalist conservatives, who aren't liberal conservatives.

>>15875916
I have only read rage and time, it is about the evolution of rage and ressentiment trough history. Sloterdijk is Nietzsche's follower, he is pretty conservative and doesnt ignore psychoanalysis.

>>15876583
>it has conservative in the title
>therefore anyone even remotely connected to this made up title is also conservative
Time to learn how to read.

>be low iq conservative:
Psychological-Science-2012-Hodson-0956797611421206.pdf
>find dumb things comfy

>>15876607
You dumb nigger, Junger was one of the primary figures of the Conservative Revolution. What else would he be?

>>15876620
>two words in title
>only sees one
Autism.

>>15872726
post chin

>>15876648
>two words in the title
>ignore one arbitrarily
Autism

>>15866480
He’s dead lol

>>15876620
The "Conservative Revolution" is a retroactively applied title.

>>15875974
you mean the same term the left literally uses to describe themselves so it makes perfect sense to use? or one of the 7-8 different sub lefts which each claim to be the only real left?

>>15875606
look at them narrow ass shoulders

>>15878132
What's your point, retard?

>>15878307
here we go.

>>15867830
Is that edition of the Spengler book good? I’ve been meaning to buy it.

>>15866475
This is why I stopped being a leftist. You either grow out of leftism or you remain a messed up individual.

My problem with leftoid philosophers is that they just make up a bunch of word salad -- utterly meaningless except within their own narrowly defined framework.

Right-wing philosophers tend to appeal to things that people actually understand -- volk, blut, boden, etc.

>>15866475
>read a conservative writer
>reactionary fear-mongering largely proceeding through reification

>read a liberal (this is the word you were looking for) writer
>prophetic tradition that is often spiritual and/or evidence-based argument for progress

We can do this all day, or you can just admit your biases are shit and you should be reading a wider variety of writers.

>>15866534
What the point and relevance of New Ageism? Why are you posting a Hindu deity image, when the Hindus believe the universe is in its fourth stage, the Kali Yuga, the age of death, destruction, and decline in which we are past the point of return. All that is left is the death and rebirth of the universe. Is that what the New Age is?

>>15878458
>word salad
Someone needs to go back and tell conservative talking heads and their parroting masses that "word salad" doesn't mean "specialized jargon my ignorant, uneducated ass doesn't understand and is intimidated by". I know you guys just figured this word out recently, but there are literal dictionaries. You can learn something from some source that isn't a right-wing media source.

>>15878529
>>read a conservative writer
>>reactionary

Pseud take.

>>15866475
Deleuze lived a great life, and was top notch mentally.

>>15866475
>ME NOT LIKE LEFT WING PEOPLE

Wow, that's a fresh perspective.

>>15866493
>>15866493
marxism and psycho-analysis is just as retarded as religion or (right wing) mysticism with none of the aesthetic/moral qualities.

>>15875944
freud was a pseud. you know it's true cuz it rhymes

>>15878605

Leftoids hate rightists much more than rightists hate leftoids.

Except for me.

>>15872726
Ah, yes, I remember that one Chesterton rant about jews. Good stuff

>>15878594
You saw the words "conservative" and "reactionary" together, got triggered and assumed I was saying all conservative thought is reactionary, and you're still calling me the pseud.
Grow up, kid.

>>15866520
I don’t see a Metal Box on Palestrina’s CV desu

>>15878327
The "conservative revolutionaries" did not call themselves that. It's just inane theorizing of that swiss guy.

>>15878307
he was not a big guy
but he did drop acid with hofmann
people are complex

>>15866520
>the entirety of the left is cynicism, dysfunction, and chaos
And the entirety of the right is obviously reactionaries and regression.
Just shut up, dumbass.

>>15878617
So?

You need to read some Simone Weil anon

>>15876557
after like 1935 he was mostly a quietist, my dude.
the anarch is an interstitial figure, seeking freedom within rather than forcing the external world to fit some vision.

>>15878639
>You saw the words "conservative" and "reactionary" together, got triggered and assumed I was saying all conservative thought is reactionary

You do believe that, though. It's obvious. Bad time to start pulling punches.

>>15878704
I don't believe that at all, idiot.
>We can do this all day, or you can just admit your biases are shit and you should be reading a wider variety of writers
Obviously, what I meant by this was
>right bad, left good, kys
You're just a triggered fuccboi trying to accuse me of back-peddling because you misread what I wrote and projected a bunch of shit that wasn't there.

>>15878728
>Obviously, what I meant by this was
>>right bad, left good, kys

Correct. This is what (you) actually believe.

>>15875974
OP also used a sweeping term "the right", which you seem to take no offense to

>>15878704
>>15878728
Before you go any further embarrassing yourself, let me explain what I was saying since it's going over your fucking head.
OP presented a lop-sided perspective on conservative and liberal writers that makes the obvious, topical favoring of conservative writing the all conservatives love to push while ignoring the negatives aspects of conservative thought and the positive aspects of liberal thought. I did the same thing from the liberal perspective to highlight the flawed analysis OP was making.
I specified that OP makes this bad judgement because he doesn't read enough of either side of things to have a nuanced take. You, similar to OP, are grossly ignorant of not only the body of works in both right and left schools of thought but also of how people discuss these things, so you can't even identify that I was also making a lopsided argument on purpose. You have no option but to take my statement at face value, because you have no insight or perspective that will allow you to receive it any other way, because you're too caught up in shitposting on social media about GOODBADTHINK false-dichotomies to discuss this in a rigorous or critical fashion. You have a predisposition to arguing asinine fallacies, because that's all you ever do. You had literally no option available to you but to get triggered at the very first thing your monkey-brained MO has been programmed to react to.

Fucking educate yourself.

>>15878784
Well I tried to get in before you, but it's hard to be faster than idiots vomiting up the first dumb thing that pops in their head.

>>15878795
>words words word

I LITERALLY did not read this.

>>15866480
The last true Conservative, now all that's left are Ben shapiro clones.
By allahs will the left and right will mold together and destroy the world with their obnoxiousness

>>15867911
How does that work out when liberals hate Conservatives
Try saying you are a Conservative at uni, its social suicide or be right wing on twitter.

>>15878795
Look at this amygdala hijack lmfao
Sounds like the right wingers here are inside your head bro.

>>15872726
How's HRT going?

>>15878795
take your meds

>>15878591
Not him but verbosity is very much a bad thing.
Maybe its because I am a lawfag but all it does is dilute the conversation to words rather than that of the arguments being made.
Its a headache, but it makes sense since most left wing talking points are the same ol thing, I.e. racism, diversity, inclusiveness, cis white male etc etc

>>15878795
reminder that schizoposting is cringe

>>15878795
Proof that leftism is a mental illness

>>15867911
>>15875606
Yeah but conservative ideology is just liberal ideology 30-60 years earlier. How many conservatives do you see already trying to compromise on gay marriage? How many do you see saying we should repeal social security and other parts of the New Deal? Anti-federalists? Repealing the income tax? Revoking women's right to vote? No one in Congress is attempting to repeal the federal minimum wage.

We are all gradually moving more and more to the left.

>>15878795
You can tell this guy hasn't been on /lit/ for very long by how invested he is in the OP's shitpost.

>>15879006
OP here, I was a little mad because I got memed into society of the spectacle

>>15878591
Academia is inherently classist and crypto-right, you fellas use made-up fancy-talk to keep the poors and the slow out of the conversation so that you can be the controlled opposition for the right.

>>15878795
>I'D LIKE TO SPEAK TO THE MANAGER OF THE OP WHO PRESENTED A LOP-SIDED PERSPECTIVE WITH THE TWO WORDS PER PERSPECTIVE I DEMAND TO SPEAK TO THE MOOT MOD MANAGER YOU UNEDUCATED MONKEY BRAINS

>>15878795
>Fucking educate yourself.
/lit/ leftists kept telling me these "educate yourself" types don't post here and were a figment of my imagination

>>15879118
Not only that, but they allege that these types don't even really exist, and that most leftists are normal well-adjusted people. Really makes you laugh.

>>15866475
examples of the former

>>15872726
You saw one /pol/ thread and now you know every conservative book?

>>15879128
Guenon

>>15879118
>says "educate yourself"
>doesn't recommend authors

>>15879128
Hitler

>>15872297
>is not being immature, dad. I'm being myself

>>15878602
>pedo
>kills himself
kek

>>15866475
>Read based monarchist writer
>Comfy spiritual psychoanalytic mess

>>15879682
based

>>15878795
fag

>>15878795
you're literally something the leftie psychoanalytic mess writers would critique

read moar fag

This should clear up Junger's relation to conservatism, apart from the perhaps more damning "If everything went wrong it was conservative forces that were to blame." (In relation to the catastrophic rise of the NSDAP.)

"The true conservative does not want to maintain this or that order, but to restore the image of the human being who is the measure of all things. That is why any conservative approach today is questionable.

With increasing depth, conservatives and revolutionaries become very similar because they necessarily approach the same reason. In the case of the very great changeers, in the case of those who not only overthrow orders but also establish them, both qualities can therefore always be demonstrated.

...

The conservative, if there are still forces worthy of the name, is like someone who wants to keep things in their usual place in an ever faster moving vehicle. This is precisely what increases the violence of the catastrophe. The artificially fortified objects form a growing danger. This is especially true where the nation state is to be preserved in its ethos and institutions, in the broader sense of the ideas of 1789 in general. What lies before it is museum-like. This is the reason for the growing sympathy for the princes, even where they still rule, the social protection of nature and monuments in general."

>>15866475
>unsubstantiated mysticism that appeals to my biases

>rigorous examination of the actual mechanics of the physical world and the human mind

It's okay to be filtered OP, you never would have made it anyway

>>15880075
>rigorous examination of the actual mechanics of the physical world and the human mind
Post just one.

>people attacking OP never post authors

are you afraid /lit/ will rip them apart?

>>15866475
Can you list some examples? I kind of like psychoanalytic mess writers like Dostoevsky and Nabokov

>>15879975
>"If everything went wrong it was conservative forces that were to blame." (In relation to the catastrophic rise of the NSDAP.)

What a shame he was retarded. Hitler's efforts might have been the most valiant, heroic, and selfless in history.

>>15880595
right.

Left wing capitalists are the best authors

>>15880595
lol

Name one thing conservatives conserved

>>15867911
what was the fourth tier in the original?

>>15878868
Everyday we are nearer to a neoliberal left and an anti-capitalist right. Embrace national bolshevism.

>>15880075
> >rigorous examination of the actual mechanics of the physical world and the human mind
You mean WORDSWORDSWORDS, right? Can't wait until we all get run over by the neoliberal machine.

>>15880595
>>15880595
>In relation to the catastrophic rise of the NSDAP.
That probably should have been stated in another way...
It may be best to understand Junger's position as he understood Nietzsche, as a timepiece of the era and towards whom one must not bear resentment of faults. Germany died in 1917 and the events of the 1920s and 30s were essentially a funeral amidst demonic forces (not only Germany's), wherein a return of German pantheism mourned for Europe - or would come to mourn for it after facing a final injustice in Valhalla. Few could have anticipated the extent to which Europe would trample on its own grave after the death of its internal enemy, and if we are not to judge the Heidegger figures then we must extend the same benefits to Germany's detractors. The suffering of the whole of Europe is what has been on trial for the last century, and is what now seems inescapable.

That catastrophic end of Germany is an Antigone myth, without burial of the dead - or an Orestes without an Iphigenia. The situation that unfolded holds eschatological qualities, a secular cataclysm without morality, values, nor even power, but rather something much more raw and brutal. The force in culture which suggests a chasm from the Enlightenment era, or even the modern totality, may be true. That world has ended, the destruction was simply so great that it has taken a century to escape the ruins. A dead century and its failed attempts to reestablish European Law through treaties - thus the return to the first days of the Katechon, and a revolt against all of its timed events... This is what lies behind our divided West and its inability to reconcile with its own victory, a Pyrrhic victory of the spirit if not in material forces. Junger handled the situation as best as anyone could.

If one takes the position that Hitler was well-meaning, and I'm not entirely opposed to this considering the other choice of trampling on the German grave, it must also be remembered how he was incapable of rising to the occasion: the crisis of the European spirit was beyond him, but also anyone else. 'Only a god can save us.' The millions dead could only have found fruitful sacrifice in an equal peace - this was already true of The Great War, and no second war was needed for failure or betrayal to reveal itself. Only time could reveal the deep wounds of a dead state.

>>15881635
The theological potential of Germany's war had been abandoned in its relinquishment of Verteidigung in der Tiefe, as a political theology, for a bare strategy of material warfare. Instead of allowing the sacrifice of its soldiers to bear fruit from the burning earth Germany sacrificed its own history and eschatology of the forest. FG Junger found himself incapable of poetry in Flanders, while the rest of the European people accepted their fate as dead soldiers - not of the Wild Hunt but something like it.

Hitler was a Hagen figure, one who tries to convince the gods they must fear their end. Perhaps in this one may see that there was no difference between Hitler and his enemies throughout Europe, they all sought the same fate. Where the gods survive the forest dies, and the last humans with it.

https://youtu.be/RUlaiQc9Vpg

>>15880730
Hope

>>15868089
>When they say dumb shit like
>>How can you have morality without God?
>What they're actually saying is
>>You're a bad person if you disagree with me

>It's because American Protestantism grew in an environment where actual proselytism and religion interaction was impossible. Because everyone basically believed the same thing but with incredibly minor differences, and because you can't actually remove people who disagree with you from the territory that you inhabit, inter-denominational (and interfaith) dialogue could only ever be used to score points with your own team. Communication stops being about conveying information, but instead about signalling. The reason to have a debate is not to try and convert non-believers, but rather to demonstrate your personal goodness to other members of your in-group.
interesting
There is a based anon in /lit/