/lit/ - Literature

>shitaly
>white

>>15810783
Not relevant to my interests

>>15810769
Check out Michel Thomas. Probably worth it if you are a native English speaker.

>>15810769
https://archive.org/details/LitalianoSecondoIlMetodoNatura

>>15810817
Thank you, this looks very interesting!

>>15810826

>>15810769
Gabagool
Moozadell
Past
Bragiole
Moolinyan
Gooma

There you go now you’re fluent

>>15810769
To learn to read I did Clozemaster and Duolingo for 2 months and then read the first 4 Harry Potter books over like 4-5 months. I knew how to read French though. If you don't read Spanish at an intermediate level then the first phase will take longer and will likely have to involve explicitly learning to recognize grammatical structures.

>>15810769
I learned italian by meeting italians, on facebook and in general, it's a bit hard but they are nice people, so I really recommend you to do it

I've been learning Italian, on and off, for a year and a half . I can read newspapers and novels reasonably well, though very slowly – always some new words but understandable overall.

Assuming you've done your grammar and have reasonable vocabulary (and if you haven't, grammar should be the first thing you do) here's what i'd recommend.

If you don't have a natural way of immersing yourself in the language, friends, uni courses Etc... make an effort to do so artificially. For example, only read Italian newspapers, use the Italian version of google, change the default language on whatever operating system you are using. This can be miserable at first but you will learn

for newspapers i'd recommend, .la repubblica, la stampa, corriere della sera, il tascabile, open.online and the Italian version of various magazines (National geographic for example)

Make lists of new words and learn them, first by heart (i used Anki, but it's piece of shit so maybe find something better.) Here the trick is to use every available moment. Waiting for an appointment, bus, test result .. whatever, take out your phone and do 10 min of words. Later on move over to whole sentences .

Pick some texts and learn them well. Go through 5 texts articles, book chapters, or short stories and learn them as well as you can. Then reread one every other week ( don't go mad here, you don't want to learn it by heart but you'll be amazed by how much you forget)

For beginner's i'd recommend Goffredo Parise's Sillabari. It's proper literature, but is internationally very shot and light.

For poetry, some of Leopardi's poems are fairly easy. They also have the advantage of having wonderful recordings.

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pl-888LgBnQ
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0lhF2s_5s4
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4Je7YiOEo0

Later on Svevo and Moravia are also fairly clear.

It is a fault of Italian literature that was always so ornamental. The language is so full of filigree as to make id very hard for a newcomer. There is no Hemingway like writer, For clarity articles and interviews are better, and even those are often full of it.

>>15812619
What filigree do you think there is? I think the opposite

The only method that's worked for me is learning the grammar first, then painstakingly going through the language word by word. Not a fashionable method but it got me to literary fluency (in German) in ~2 months. People will argue for the 'learn naturally method', but that does not work unless you live in the country. That is my experience anyway. You should definitely keep this method in mind.

>>15810769
The Assimil books are the best way to learn a new language, in my experience.

>>15810769
shitalian

Why do Italians make some sperg the fuck out anyway?

>>15810817
Was about to recommend this myself

>>15814418
Because you can cherrypick italians to fit any narrative. Northern italians are the smartest people in the world and southern italians are the niggers of Europe. Some italians look like aryan propaganda posters and some look like literal pajeets. Rome was the greatest empire to ever exist but modern Italy has done nothing but blunder.

>>15810783
>salvini
>israeli bootlicker
>fascist

Also related to the thread, start with the grammar, italian it's a language that as you read it you pronounce it

>>15810769
Simply keep going. If you already speak Spanish the grammar and basic elements shouldn't be very foreign

>>15814418
Success breeds jealousy.

Get into frequency dictionaries. Don't listen to anyone itt trying to sell you a method of specific resource. They're all cucks.

>>15815870
your method is for cucks

>>15810799
Cuck
>>15810817
Cuck
>>15810842
Smug cuck
>>15810989
Nigger
>>15812324
Mega faggot cuck.
>>15812354
Cuck
>>15812619
Cuck
>>15814220
Double cuck

>>15815882
Wrong. Frequency dictionaries are based and you can roll your own if you learn Python or Perl. Quit being a consoomer.

>>15810769
The only way to the actually acquire the language is through a shit ton of reading and listening. Don't fall for anyone trying to sell you snake oil like Duolingo, grammar books, flash cards, drilling vocab and grammar, living in the country.
Following a method actually backed by science, the one I have highlighted, is the best way.

>>15810769
How long have you been learning? I have about 3 years of learning experience, and I would recommend to you Italo Calvino's "Fiabe Italiane" for reading material. The stories are easy for beginners to comprehend, but reading them will allow you to expand your vocabulary great lengths.

>>15815895
Robert Daleson

>>15810769
Start with ancient Greek, then classical Latin, then move on to Italian.

>>15815958
Several weeks.

>>15816018
> he didn't start with Proto-Indo-European

psood

>>15810769
move to Italy in 10 years you'll be talking like a native with a really cool roman accent, is not hard to learn but getting the accent takes a while

>>15815895
butthurt amerifat detected

>>15810817
I've been using this method to learn Latin with Lingua Latina, is this by the same publushers? I would love something like this but for German which is the language I want to learn next after Latin.

>>15815895
You are a sneed cuck

>>15817524
If you want more Latin readers, you can find a ton on archive.org
https://archive.org/details/texts?and%5B%5D=latin+reader&sin=
As for German, check this.
https://libgen.is/book/index.php?md5=8F87F529472E05CDAC71F2074AA72183

>>15810769
Anon, ti scrivo in italiano visto che stai provando ad imparare. Qui c'è qualche informazione se ti interessa: https://old.reddit.com/r/italianlearning/
Ti suggerirei di imparare la grammatica, che è piuttosto complicata. C'è anche un'imageboard italiana, purtroppo poco frequentata (https://www.diochan.com/).).

In English: here you can find some info (https://old.reddit.com/r/italianlearning/).). I'd suggest that you focus on grammar, since it can be quite complicated. There is also an Italian imageboard, which unfortunately isn't much popular (https://www.diochan.com/).).

>>15817574
Thanks anon I will check them out

>>15815034
>northern italians are the smartest people in the world
have you ever been to north italy, anon?

>>15815906
based, reading, listening and experimenting writing with some occasional theme focused exercises

>>15815906
Why is language learning so mythologized and shrouded by bullshit? It's literally grammar + vocabulary. Seriously, how did these retarded methods spring up?

>>15815902
Now this is some dumb monoglot pseudery. I doubt you can even code. We're not there yet. Automated frequency vocab lists still have to be verified manually since there's too much ambiguity involved.

>>15818530
Just apply an ad hoc neural network to an unlimited 3-dimensional array. Yes, there are minimal edge-cases that the average blooser won't catch with his fish net carp code but you can easily insert a dummy plug filter into the collated list and filter results manually with a little extra code? With reasonable discernment even... You know, like an active reader/learner does? I guess it's no surprise that the NEETs on 4chan can only code in amateurish standard library jargon that piles Google Perfect results into their fat gaping maws. If you can't hack it, get good.

>>15818437
Everyone wants to make a buck however they can, if they can do it by coming up with bullshit methods to learn a language they will do it, and there's no shortage of retards who want to learn a language the "easy way" without putting in the work that will pay for it.
That being said, the natural method is kino.

>>15812619
Is D'Annunzio diffcult? I've heard he's kinda gay but I'm interested in reading him.

>>15818437
>It's literally grammar + vocabulary
This is an axiom that people receive from school. It's bullshit with no scientific backing.

>>15818578
It's more than minimal you pseudery spewing buffoon. If it were that easy shitty snake oil language apps would have had a niche for it.

>>15815034
t. polentone di merda

>>15818437
You don't really need grammar.

>>15819730
This. Most native speakers don't study their language's grammar since they attain their language via many examples over many years. For example, I winged my grammar tests in high school by going off of what sounded right in my head. I only learned of English grammar via studying Latin in uni.

>>15819615
Wrong again, bucko. LL apps cash in exclusively on user engagement. If an LL app did anything valuable it would become useless because studying is offputting. People want a furry friend to tell them they are doing a good job and please don't worry you will be fluent if you keep coming back for 20 minutes a day.

And you will not get perfect frequency lists. I never said you would, and I'm not sure why you want to make me an app developer. You have to edit the lists by hand and go over each word and know what you're doing. This is still something in anybody's power, and much better than relying on a universal list when you're working with a narrow set of materials.

>>15819800

>If an LL app did anything valuable it would become useless because studying is offputting.
True of most but there are exceptions. The niche I'm talking about doesn't exist yet, nor can it, unless AI can replace natural language users. But if that happens we have much bigger issues to reckon with.

>And you will not get perfect frequency lists. I never said you would
Yes. Okay fine.

>You have to edit the lists by hand and go over each word and know what you're doing.
With all the second guessing you might as well construct it entirely manually. Even with an authoritative dictionary, there's still 10% ambiguity that has to be ran through with practical knowledge. Doesn't have to be a person with native knowledge, but that'd be the best option.

>>15818625
His prose is very flowery but i greatly enjoy it. His early inspirations are from the English romantics and so it's all very difficult. He gets easier over time. The poetry is better. I started with the Laudi del cielo books (Alcyone is the best, i think) and it's generally quite easy.

>>15819730
Yes you do.

>>15815034
this nigger never met a veneto

>>15820934
Lel

>>>/int/

>>15820861
Not really since millions of people learn languages without knowing a single thing about grammar, how do you think you learned to speak? Did they teach you grammar before you spoke your first word?

>>15821319
I learned my language before I was 4 years old, and I was exposed to it every day. Learning a new language as an adult is a completely different matter. I am not saying that grammar is the only thing you need, of course you also need to read and listen to it, but it would be fun seeing you trying to understand Italian without knowing how verbs are conjugated. Besides, as I turned six and started school I got to study grammar and understand how correct sentences are formed. But if you want to speak as a five year old child go on and don't study grammar; see you when you get your first "congiuntivo" wrong.

ne vale la pena imparare il latino?

>>15821496
Io l'ho studiato al liceo e mi è piaciuto molto. Non è necessario per imparare l'italiano, ma può valerne la pena se ti interessa approfondire la cultura classica.

>>15821387
>Learning a new language as an adult is a completely different matter
factually wrong

>>15815034

>>15822390
promemoria: questi due sono innocenti e sono stati pagati per fingersi colpevoli
solo pensare che siano stati capaci di saltare giù da un balcone alto 10 metri è da scemi

is this the language learning thread? how do I go about learning russian? I have some books but I don't know which one is best that I should commit to working through all the way. recs?

>>15822390
Olindo e Rosa sono innocenti, punto e basta.

>>15822430
Esatto anon, esatto.

>>15815906
Quite literally the only legitimate post in this thread, anyone else doesn't even understand language learning tee bee age