/lit/ - Literature

>>15730829
I mean you can always go back to some historical cause of what's happening to us westerners nowadays. There are hundreds of potential scapegoats that you can ease your nerves with. In the end though it's still a sloppy, lazy, bad habit because you're 1° ignoring the causes of the causes (after all if it's the misbehavior of the Church that caused protestantism to take off, isn't that the actual original problem?) 2° neglecting the good that has come out alongside the bad (Bach, waking on the moon, the resistance to Habsburg hegemony, are all due in part, large or small, to protestantism).

>>15730829
I'm Reformed and subscribe to Calvin's interpretations mostly. If you have more specific questions I could try to answer.

>>15730829
No. As a complete outsider, its very obvious that catholicism is idol worship with extra steps. Protestants suck shit, but at least theyre free to interpret the bible.

>>15730829
>Is Protestantism and its offshoots the worst disaster that has ever struck Christianity?
Can we separate the birth of Protestantism from the reformation of the Catholic Church? Because the latter was absolutely necessary.

modernity began with john huss.

>>15731143
You're not fooling anyone, prottie.

>>15731233
I agree. The Church has went through before and since the Protestant Reformation like the Saeculum Obscurum in the 900s - 1000s AD. The Church is and was a political organization to some extent and naturally due to human nature, became corrupt over time. However, there always were people that reformed it from the inside without becoming heretics and getting rid of Tradition, Sacred Scriptures and Apostolic Succession (like in the SO mentioned before, Pope Gregory VII did a lot to end the SO in the first place). It's also not a coincidence that most of these movements took place in heavily Germanic areas. Protestantism has more to do with cultural independence from Rome than it really does with anything theological tbqh. If it was mostly theological than Protestant Churches would be more like Orthodox ones and just deny papal supremacy or something like that rather than separating themselves from Sacred Tradition, Apostolic Succession and Sacred Scripture (by removing 7 books from the Bible because they give credence to Catholic theology), all of which no one can deny that all Orthodox Churches have because they haven't really modified any of the above at all. Plus they wouldn't misinterpret St. Augustine and all the Church Fathers so severely, wouldn't deny Early Church History and Tradition (which even the Churches in the East agree with the Church in the West on) and they wouldn't have such wildly different views from the Church on the Sacraments. In my opinion, the corruption of the Church was more of an excuse rather than an actual reason why a lot of these "reformers" bastardized 1500 years of Church History.

>>15731233
>Can we separate the birth of Protestantism from the reformation of the Catholic Church?
No.

THE PAPACY BELONGS TO AVIGNON

>>15731840
*The Church has went through corruption

>>15730829
Christianity has been a disaster ever since the first batch of followers because nobody can act like Christ properly. There are some martyrs and priests and random people scattered throughout history that did OK and that's about it.

It's not like it's actually that complicated to believe in Christ and follow what he said, it's just nobody wants to do it. Every church ever, whether orthodox, catholic, or protestant, has been a joke

Can we talk about how Calvinistic predestination offers a theological foundation for the creation of Judaism-tier ethno-religions? The greatest tragedy of the West is that spirituality died before Christianity could be taken to its fullest creative extent.

>>15731840
Wow, he even capitalizes Church History.

>>15732086
Christ is the goal we grow towards. Do you think a tree is trying to touch the sun? No, it's getting nourishment so it can grow. Every day is a new day to do something Christ-like.

>>15733644
In a world of Christs nature would be the crucifier.

>>15733655
Sorry I didn't realize there was only one...
Eh nevermind

>>15730829
Yes