/lit/ - Literature

I wish more philosophers wrote dialogues. That shit’s a lot of fun.

Diving straight into primary sources is retarded

>read a summary of chapter
>read chapter
>read a different summary of chapter afterward
that's what I do. Also, I can understand calling Kant dry but Hume?

>>15690010
Why are you starting in the middle of philosophical developments anon? Its not a book where you can start in midias res. Start with something easier and down to earth like Plato or one of the Greeks. The ones you mentioned are people who had a long line of developments by the time they wrote.

Plato by and large consists of relitively layed back understandable conversations between people.

>>15690010
this. that's why I don't consider Nietzsche to be a philosopher exactly.

>>15690010
It’s all language games, anyway

I beat Destiny at starcraft several times

>>15690010
>start with the Greeks

Destiny actually tried to read Hume and I remember him saying something like this on stream:
>He's such a bad writer, holy fucken shit dawg. If you have to use more than 3 fucken semi-colons per sentence you're just a bad writer. That's it. Just go back to highschool writing class because holy shit you are impossible to read.
It was so cringe. It just proves Destiny is not well-read at all. He doesn't even know the 18th/19th century English writing style involved a lot of semi-colon usage.

>>15690042
I'm not interested in some dipshit's view on some dipshit's view.

>>15690121
Isn't he a starcraft grandmaster or something?

>>15690136
The thing about Destiny is that he doesn’t pretend to be well-read or an “intellectual” like Vaush or Hasan Piker do, he fully admits to being a twitch gamer first and a “political debater” second, that’s why I like him compared to other political streamers like the two I just mentioned.

>>15690010
Philosophy was never meant to be democratic.

>>15690172
Zoomers are truly the most hopeless generation yet. And I thought Millenials were fucked

>>15690169
Grandmaster on the NA ladder, which means he was shit, especially for someone who spent so much time playing. I used to play on the EU server, but I sniped him several time thanks to his stream, and he was shit every time.

>>15690136
Every person who debates low IQ people for a living ends up like that, just look at Sam Harris who also said retarded shit about Hume for example. Winning petty arguments really gives you a distorted idea of how smart you are.

>>15690172
Do vaush and Hassan even read? I feel like if you lose a debate to the likes of Sargon of Akkad you’re either illiterate or and idiot if not both. Have either of them ever debated a legitimate, well-read, right-wing intellectual (or and intellectual of any political persuasion, for that matter)?

I know we all hate twitch streamers but essential philosophy is pretty dry. Especially starting with Kant is super hard and kinda stupid for a beginner. Idk what he's trying to achieve here. The best way for getting into german idealism is by reading an introductory first and foremost. Nobody just dives into it with no prior knowledge
>>15690219
I've seen 1 (one) video of hassan and I think he had das kapital in his shelf. not sure tho

>>15690219
Vaush proudly doesn't read.

>>15690172
Destiny is a blot on society and his debates are utterly worthless. He tries to make sociopolitical discourse into a bloodsport to attract more low attention span zoomer viewers. You watch any of his debates and you will experience sensory overload. It's just two guys screaming at each other while donations play in the background and the text to speech talks over them. His worldview is about the same as any standard liberal boomer. I don't think he has ever read a book seriously.
Vaush is basically a clone of Destiny, even to the point of using the same intonations and phrases that Destiny uses, only he is a communist. To do a perfect imitation of Vaush all you need is (1) use a lot of nominalisations, (2) scream 'ITS CONSENSUS! IT'S ACADEMIC CONSENSUS!' and (3) spout off the standard left-liberal ideology.
IDK about Hasaan, because I haven't watched him much, but I've seen one video, and it seems just to be the same Destiny-esque cocaine-fuelled ADD stream where he screams and uses gamer language and donations play in the background.
I honestly don't get how any without ADD can watch any of these guys. All of them seem like they're on coke every time they stream.

>>15690210
You sound salty that he makes millions of dollars and fucks 6 women at a time.

>>15690466
He also unironically fucks dudes and is a cuck so no, I don't think anyone is jealous of him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__cgZzi_cEQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUMx9HsJnZs

>>15690403
How does he respond to the fact that anyone who’s moderately well-read would stomp him in a debate? How does he rationalize reading as being unnecessary?

If you're studying philosophy by yourself, starting with the works of major philosophers is one of the dumbest things you can do. You're going to struggle with the language, you're going to struggle with the historical context, you will not understand references made to other schools of thought, you will read terms to which the author attributes no clear definition and project a modern one into them, you will read a bad translation of a whacky german term with no english equivalent, etc. You need to know what you're getting into first.

>>15690552
Forgot this gem:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJB9Z6Q2CsE

>>15690560
Honestly, if you are reading philosophy by yourself, you are better off reading the Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy page or Stanford's Encyclopedia of Philosophy page on that person and their ideas first before you dive in head first. And go in chronological order since philosophy is mostly just responses to past philosophers and ideas. That also helps, but don't read everything if you don't have to/don't want to. Just read their IEP or SEP page if they aren't the main source of your inquiry.

>>15690172
yes like all neoliberals hes a fucking retarded animal who should be brought out back and put down

>>15690552
Nothing wrong with being gay and he is a cuck because it's the only way he could have a relationship and fuck 10 WOMEN AT ONCE. He is literally living the best life and you are sitting at home at 4chan wacking off being a wage slave writing about how you beat him at starcraft 6 years ago lol

>>15690617
>5'8"
>Best life
>Photoshoot with a woman => having sex with her
No Des-Tiny. Also I don't play autism simulators like Starcraft. Also it's kinda pathetic if the only way you can have a relationship is by being a cuck or outright sucking another man's dick.

>>15690654
Wrong picture

>>15690010
I don't think he's dumb or anything, he certainly knows more about philosophy than the average /lit/izen just by having his conversations and looking shit up on wikipedia. Unfortunately he can't produce anything of value whatsoever. Most of his debates are the garbage that >>15690407 mentioned and when he debates in a live setting it feels very reserved and awkward. Not to mention the rest of his "content" and his attempts at podcasting.

Holy shit look at these zoomers arguing about fucking youtube personalities. Are these retards even sentient anymore?

>>15690667
I don't think he knows more than the average /lit/ user. He couldn't even stomach Hume. I really don't understand how he is 130IQ.

>>15690654
>5'8"
Destiny is that 'tall'? He looked positively child like in all the pictures I've seen.

>>15690407
Vaush once said he didn't care about the destruction of small business at the hands of protestors because they're the petite bourgeoisie.I'd be interested to hear what he would have to say if protestors broke into his home, stole his tv/computer, and busted the rest of his shit.

>>15690704
Yeah. Unfortunately the only link that confirms this is reddit, so I used the archive of the thread so you don't have to touch that cursed site. But yeah he's a complete manlet:
http://archive.is/lDGdA

>>15690712
Read Marx retard

>>15690010
Hume is not too bad.
Kant is an autist, though.

>>15690172
Destiny is a retard you cultist. Gain taste.

>>15690219
Vaush loses every debate to anyone moderately well-read. Dude is a straight retard.

>>15690803
You wouldn't last 10 seconds in the ring with Godstiny.

>>15690820
Link at least one (1) debate he lost.

>>15690617
Any reasonably successful man can fuck whores at any given time. The fact you celebrate this shows how pathetic Destiny and his community are.

Ironically enough it was Metokur that shredded him the worst, because in a roundabout way, he made Destiny admit some absolutely dumb shit during that whole thing. Pic related is what Destiny looked like during the entire video. Even afterwards, if I remember right, he had to take a breather and a minor counseling session with his chat.

>>15690824
Lmao, just debate him on a topic he can't give an in the moment answer to like history or foreign policy.

>>15690617
i almost went to this meetup just for the memes because i live a 10 minute drive away, but he picked a location with no parking lot or street parking so i just drove around for 15 minutes and gave up. really wanted to meet reckful so kinda bummed but being around all these e-girls probably would've made me kill myself

>>15690688
His knowledge is very flat - he knows a lot of terminology / concepts / dilemmas about all kinds of topics but has no in depth knowledge about any of it. It's really not hard to be more educated than the average user on this board.

>>15690839
Do you have a harem of models?

>>15690824
Intellectual discussion isn't meant to be a boxing match. Written debate is the best way to have discourse.

>>15690860
Please try it his email is open. Tell your alias now so I know what video to watch when it comes out

>>15690838
Every debate he had with a tankie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a26IavjKgdo

Tankies are all forced to actually read books. So they destroy these types.

>/lit/ is full of gamer youtube watching zoomers

it all makes sense now

>>15690861
Bro he might of asked you if he could suck your cock while the egirls played with your balls

>>15690868
Camgirls are not models, anon. They're whores. And no, I am married.

>>15690875
That's what pussies who can't debate always say. If you weren't autistic you would know how to talk people

>>15690010
>How can you read philosophy?
Follow these simple tips:
1. Try to start with what's easiest and most introductory. That makes it so you get the later, harder stuff better.
2. Pay close attention to what's being said. Sometimes if you don't, later stuff can seem confusing.
3. Learn to track the structure of the philosophical system, rather than focusing entirely on making sense of the concepts or inferences. You can get a decently good understanding of concepts just by knowing the roles they play (inferentially and so forth) within the bigger system.
4. If there's something you don't completely understand even after you've tried as much as you are willing to do at the moment, bracket it. Follow 3 with the rest, and get the bigger picture. Maybe the thing tripping you up will make more sense later, maybe it won't but if it won't it might not even be that crucial to getting the bigger picture.
5. Remember you can always use secondary sources (commentaries, responses) and tertiary sources (articles surveying or summarizing said commentaries/responses) when/if you are able.

>>15690879
Whats his email. I go by FrankieTheTankie

>>15690881
Haven't watched the video but if they are like the tankies I've debated with they debate like poltards. "I have this statistics from 1937 from the Soviet Union that shows that crop production increased 600% after the revolution" and how the fuck are you supposed to counter that if you don't know the study. "This obscure Russian historian that no one has heard of says that Lenin only killed 16 people and he actually saved a drowning baby". I don't think these people even read the statistics they just have charts of statistics like poltards have about black people and iq

>>15690916
It's on his website Frankie or you might able to message him discord or reddit if that doesn't work. He doesn't do anal though

I wish JLP and Destiny had a podcast together. They have amazing chemistry.

https://youtu.be/9fueKBOzS3w

>>15690922
Nah all Tankies are experts in theory. Further Crop production did increase far more than 600% and Lenin Killed less than 16 people and saved a nation not a drowning baby.

>>15690922
sorry if you're clinically american but that just means you shouldnt involve yourself in intellectual discussion

>>15690407
>Vaush is basically a clone of Destiny, even to the point of using the same intonations and phrases that Destiny uses, only he is a communist.
Ironically Vaush is a far more effective capitalist than Destiny. He basically took Destiny's schtick and more effectively commodified it and curated his content to build a particular market audience.

Sometimes I wonder to what degree these people are consciously grifting, but the whole youtube/twitch "politics" realm is some of the most hyper-consumerist shit that's yet existed. The whole thing is just mass production of ideology, thought and discourse which is churned and filtered through the machines of social media, neatly packaged and then delivered as product.

I don't know whether it's funny or sad how these people actually consider themselves activists or "anti-capitalists".

>>15690935
>I wish all my zoomer friend simulator e-influencers would combine their brands and live in a big mansion for me to watch and listen to every day :3 I want to watch my favorite e-friends play video games together until I'm 40! I am a stunted manchild with low testosterone :3

>>15690971
>projecting this much

>>15690963
Great post anon.

To add to this these people act as enforced of orthodoxy and managers of emotions within the supposedly socialist subculture.

They are completely cut off from any form of labour power, managers in the capitalist marketplace..

>>15690010
I haven't read Hume mainly because I'm lazy and he doesn't seem interesting, you're right though Kant is really fucking boring. I'd recommend starting with more artful writers like Kierkegaard or Nietzsche

>>15690963
this reminds me of one specific part in capitalist realism.
fisher described how his students are not bored because of the content but because they are removed from the constant flow of sugary gratification on demand. "some students want nietzsche the same way they want a hamburger"
spot on

DESTINY - THE OMNI LIBERAL GOD
HASAN - CRINGE & GRIFTING FRAT BOY THAT DID NOT WORK FOR HIS VIEWS AT ALL, MORALLY LUCKY BASTARD

>>15690010
It just gets easier over time if you keep doing it. Your web of notions will grow and your ability to grasp texts will hockey-stick at a certain point. Probably after finishing Kant if you do.
>>15690042
I disagree, retarded is exposing yourself to secondhand judgments before engaging directly. You bias your own perceptions doing that.

>>15690010
I just read the "fun" philosophers like Kierkegaard, Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Foucault, Deleuze, Plato, late Wittgenstein, Rorty, various others. I used to be more systematic about my learning but I found that despite reading and rereading some of the drier philosophers, nothing they wrote ever stuck with me, so now I confine my reading to philosophers who care about presentation. That means most of the analytics I simply ignore.

>>15691684
fuck off rem

>>15690963
>I wonder to what degree these people are consciously grifting
Once they get their first taste of adsense crack it's all profit seeking optimization until all "content" is commoditized to the point indistinguishability except for the "personality branding" smacked on top.

>>15690654
>5'8"
That's actually quite a bit taller than I would have guessed. In that case he really is living a good life. I thought he was like 5'3".

>>15690617
White women are hilarious

>>15690688
Do you really think most /lit/izens have even read Hume?

>>15690042
absolutely fucking insanely mentally malformed dick chomping opinion

>>15693354
at least I plan to read Hume

>>15690554
>How does he respond to the fact that anyone who’s moderately well-read would stomp him in a debate?
He would probably say that most people who are moderately well-read lack the rhetoric needed to win the audience, so a debate before a live audience would be in the bag for him. Now, the few that are well-read AND capable of winning the audience would likely stomp him but Vaush would probably use that as a learning opportunity and try to befriend the stomper so he could get more of their rhetoric without having to do the reading.
>How does he rationalize reading as being unnecessary?
I forget what his answer to this was. I haven;t been watching him for a few months now.

>>15693402
he sounds like a fucking tool

>>15690010
Brainlet take

It feels like I am on adderall when reading Kant. Read the Cambridge translations of his work. Modern philosophy is generous to the reader but is also written with eloquence imo.

>>15691768
Hume is only "Hard" if you read his original works meant for achademia. He also wrote a more down to earth common mans version of his basic system that is pleasantly easy to consume.

>>15693354
At least said they have. Tho by osmosis some definitly know some basics even if they are noreads.

>>15690875
>ion isn't meant to be a boxing match. Written debate is the best way to have disc
This. Destiny and a lot of the people who bite off his style have an allergic reaction to debate that can't be monetized. Whenever someone says they don't want to debate them in a way that they can make money off of they immediately end the conversation and have their followers harass the individuals who have the "nerve" to not put money in their pocket. I wouldn't have an issue with it if they didn't behave like their debates were anything but a way of getting attention and making money but they make it seem as if they're sages or the political authority of twitch's political scene.

>>15690963
This, people like vaush actually end up preventing any real life movement by giving the illusion that you are making social changes by debating random who’s on discord, it’s a puppet show and he’s gets paid in the end for commodifying ideologies lmao.

>>15690922
i still don't even understand what a tankie is

>>15690172
Thats also why you shouldn't take him seriously

>>15693493
A communist who refuses to acknowledge any and all mistakes or intentional atrocities made by communist countries/leaders. They are usually Stalinist.

>>15690909
Point 3 is an incredibly important thing to remember when reading philosophy

>>15693508
What if you acknowledge them, but you dont see them as mistakes and were completely justifiable?

>>15690136
Destiny reads wikipedia articles, he doesnt actually read books.
So expecting very surface level and dumb takes from him is wise.

>>15690909
These are great tips. My two big tips are: read slowly, very slowly if necessary, and reread often. Combine this with moving on from a passage if you are spinning your wheels on it. There's nothing wrong with finishing the work and then rereading it to give your brain a second go around with it. It's the same technique I use when learning new songs on guitar. Even if I don't 100% it I just run through it over and over and it gets better each time.

And by slowly I mean there is no minimum speed, there is NEVER any shame in going super slow as fuck if you are having difficulty with a passage. Like even as slow as reading each word of a sentence one at a time, and methodically putting it together and slowly going through the whole sentence word by word, clause by clause, etc. Even rewriting it if you have to. Reading comprehension is the numero uno goal.

>>15693518
Also Tankie.

>>15690136
Maybe Destiny really is a brainlet. Hume's command of English was second to none. I can't think of any philosopher who expressed himself with as much clarity.

>>15690010
Philosophy, at least in the west where it's a discipline (at least predominantly) about making clear arguments and building on them is going to be somewhat dry by necessity. The key is to look for works that you believe (or that are able to convince you) that they questions they are grappling with are important somehow. But like... if you can't handle that, then you can't handle philosophy. Except for like Plato, I guess.

>>15690068
Hume's at his wettest in the dialogues on religion, but his Treatise can definitely be kind of brutal - even if he was less esoteric than Kant. But Hume literally wrote his two inquiries because he was sick of people not understanding the Treatise - just like when Kant wrote the Prolegommena because his contemporaries didn't know wtf he was saying in the first Critique.

I say this as a fan of both.

What an embarrassing thread. Jannies should really do their fucking job.
And you, e-celeb zoomers, should fucking hang.

>remember this goober as a sc2 sperg
>turn on twitch
>he has his own chapo splinter cult and 12 000 zoomers watching as he stretches definition of sexual abuse to fit current agenda

hilarious

>>15693550
He probably read the academic A Treatise of Human Nature instead of the more readable . An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding.

>>15690010
kant and hume are fags, read hegel and shopenhauer..

>stealth destiny thread
>on /lit/
Zoomers truly are the most pathetic generation. Do they unironically just sit there for hours watching a little man play video games while he rambles about subjects that he's woefully uninformed on? What an incredibly lame way to waste your life. At least previous generations threw their life away doing drugs and having sex. This is just sad and indicates low testosterone and poor social skills.

I watched him once and he was arguing against reading the Greeks claiming its irrelevant to knowing modern theories on subjects like Ethics. He also went on a rant about how all Marxists were secretly bloodthirsty Stalinists no matter what

>>15690884
>>15693652
I doubt too many people here actually like his views. Its still entertaining to have something on in the background to listen to.

>>15693825
How, exactly, did he argue that they were irrelevant. please tell me it's not just because they're old and write in a different world. please tell me he at least bothered to read SOME of the greeks before making a value judgement about their work. he didn't just say 'oh they're old so they must be bad and irrelevant, did he?'

>>15693652
Turns out when you waste your life doing drugs and having sex you raise some pretty Joker kids.

>>15693835
Basically that its irrelevant to the subject how it developed over time and claimed he didn't read any of Aristotle or whoever it was

>>15693848
what a fucking dumbass. Jesus christ why do zoomers take these people seriously?

>>15693652
I only watch him when he debates or talks to lilypichu.

>>15693876
He's entertaining, that's it. Most of the people who watch him parrot him but only a few of them have an idea of the "thought" behind his positions.

>>15690935
Just watched this whole thing, that was pretty good. JLP is the <100 IQ frog in this pic.

>>15693876
To be fair half of his chat just relentlessly mocks him

>>15694043
Kek I’ve seen this same image posted with so many different numbers in the place of the 130+ here. Everyone wants to be the topwit who agrees with the bottomwit

>>15694135
>tfw being a smug 120 who realized his midwittery and pretends to be <100 IQ

>>15694141
Just give yourself brain damage

Youtubers are the symbol of all modern degradation, just look at “philosophy tube” and “contrapoints”. They use their bachelors in “philosophy” (gender studies) to make bait videos presumably about philosophy which are in actuality are social and political shill videos with information from Wikipedia and hilariously bad takes when they actually approach the works of a philosopher

>>15690963
I clicked on vaush’s stream once and he was speed running dark souls 2 while giving dating advice to his audience. This is his gf

>>15694299
The only video i saw of Vaush was a weird thing were he was talking about r/gamersriseup being shut down and he horribly misunderstood the meme. Somehow he got the doumn idea that leftists often have that a movement started out pure but gets corrupted by an element when that element was there form the start. a total lack of nuance. He sounded retarded and like a polemicists so i never really clicked him again.

>>15691404
>start with kierkegaard

>Man is spirit.
Cool yeah makes sense!
>But what is spirit?
Yeah that's a good question haha.
>Spirit is the self.
Neat.
>But what is the self?
Bro when is this guy gonna get to the point, am I right?
>The self is a relation which relates itself to its own self, or it is that in the relation that the relation relates itself to its own self; the self is not the relation but that the relation relates itself to its own self.
o...okay. *closes book*

>>15690042
Midwit here, I skim primary sources for insight and look up things of note in secondary sources to make sure I get it right. Those secondary sources then typically have references outside of the primary source I'm reading which I can do the same with later.

>>15694325
I remember a video he did on stonetoss about how the left should try to make political cartoons that are as catchy and spreadable as stonetoss comics, I checked to see if this was actually tried and not only was it, but they were pretty bad. Most just edited the originals, the few that attempted to have an original style drew in a unappealing one, and they all failed to be funny. Shit was embarrassing and I think it's safe to assume nothing came of it since I rarely see anybody outside of lefty's post those comics. Vaush claims to be good at getting his message across but he seemed to fail in conveying what makes stonetoss memeable to his audience.

>>15690121
Starcraft is for bugmen.

>>15694391
Sounds like the demographic in question. Again, not very familier with the person in specific, so I will not comment on him specifically. But for some reaason leftists of that sort often come off as artificial when trying to produce something catchy. Maybe it has to do with the product having to fit a predefined ideology rather than being a pure expression of an experience that can have nuance placed ontop of it. I know there is a lefty youtuber who made a video about accelerationism and he tried way too hard to sound as nauncelant and blase as possible, but it still sounded rather manufactured at times. Something to do with sonic in his name, idk, Nordic by the sound of him.

So as a casual hypothesis, leftists of the sort do not seem to try and grast the quality of something as an object in itself, but as a tool explicitly for ideology rather than ideology becoming an implicit part of it. And this may be a factor of the lefts more dogmatic stance on what is "right" instead of an implicit sensation.

again, this is off the top of my head. Not rigorous.

>>15690172
you can fuck his gf and he won't mind

I dove right into Critique of Pure Reason with no philosophical knowledge whatsoever and I'm getting it. Not sure what your problem is. Maybe you're just retarded.

>>15694495
Its quite possible. some people have and others just dont for dynamic thinking. some require gentle expansions to how to think, and others find it more intuitive.

>>15694495
Some philosophical texts are written with the assumption that the reader has certain prior knowledge and education, while some works like CoPR do not. A trivial statement I know but still an important nuance.

>>15694141
This move alone moves you up to 130 IQ. Congratulations!

>>15694583
No! I don't want to be a big brain nibba! Make me stupid again!

>>15694495
But why would you do that? That's like starting to watch a movie in the middle.

>>15690029
They did, just many don't survive in the present.

>>15690172
Its just so he can hide behind that when he gets consistently schooled on serious topics. He wants to be the big boy intellectual when he 'debates' random retards but when he goes against someone actually intelligent hes just a gamer bro.

>>15694624
He's Schrodinger's Pseud

>>15690010
you should be able to a priori most of it.

>>15693560
>But Hume literally wrote his two inquiries because he was sick of people not understanding the Treatise - just like when Kant wrote the Prolegommena because his contemporaries didn't know wtf he was saying in the first Critique.
Did Hegel write anything for brainlets who couldn't understand the Phenomenology of Spirit?

>>15694744
His lectures + the Enzyklopädie der philosophischen Wissenschaften, and the Propädeutik if you're too retarded even for the former combo..

>>15691696
>>15693382
>t. literally has never interpreted a philosopher correctly

>>15690010
fuck hume. fuck kant. getting into philosophy? dude, the tao te ching. the meno. start with something approachable.
foundational texts define all of culture, so by the time you are familiar with artistotle's organization of the world, kant doesn't seem as autistic.

>>15690029
this
schopenhauer's dialogue on religion is amusing and engaging
>>15690407
he debates pseuds and pseuds alone, it really isn't anything serious
i would be damned if anyone actually took his debates for anything more than entertainment purposes
>>15691404
>I'd recommend starting with more artful writers like Kierkegaard or Nietzsche
you should read kant to grasp nietzsche and kierkegaard uses hegelian concepts
start with the greeks or you're out of your mind

The first JLP debate was 10/10 though

>>15690838
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW25QZs5AoU

>>15694361
>>The self is a relation which relates itself to its own self, or it is that in the relation that the relation relates itself to its own self; the self is not the relation but that the relation relates itself to its own self.
That was a parody of hegelianism

>>15694361
Kierkegaard was making fun of Hegel and his obscurantism with that line.

>>15694991
i remember seeing this one. i'm not a fan of moly and so on but vaush's argument really is very bad. he says that the origin wealth is labour, but this shift really doesnt answer much. wealth-making makes wealth? obviously work is a presupposition for wealth but it it's not enough as a sole explanation.

but in fairness i also have to say that moly's argument isn't much better. for all his talk about vaush failing to explain how labour can generate an increase in wealth his explanation boils down to changes in parenting norms. even if we accept that good parenting is the source of wealth moly would still need to explain why such a shift would occur.

sory if post is messy, my keyboard is fucked up

>>15695069
>moly would still need to explain why such a shift would occur
People learn not to be retarded with spending, not to commit crimes that fuck their life up, not to go up to their eyeballs in debt?

>>15693560
>Philosophy, at least in the west where it's a discipline (at least predominantly) about making clear arguments
That's really only a fraction of what philosophy is. Quantum Physics is philosophy too, for example. To further the gap in your lack of understanding what Philosophy is, Plato was one of the first people to prescribe the methods of dialectic as a part of philosophy. Beyond that, he implemented the atomist theories of Democritus, Heraclitus' Logos, the works of Thales, Pythagoras, Anaxagoras, some of the most analytical scientific minds of their era. Guy is still well above the head of many people today, you are one of them.

>>15695090
no, not why good parenting might be beneficial, but what could lead to good parenting? it's not a sufficient explanation because it leaves the question of its own origin unanswered.

but as for good parenting--good grief! the makers of wealth are hardly good people, and that goes doubly for those that got the trans-atlantic trade going. the this small-business perspective on world history - like a child explaining politics in terms of "nice" and "mean"

no but seriously, i think a better one word answer is trade

>>15695135
>but what could lead to good parenting?
Listening to Stefan (what he thinks)
Returning to religion
Strengthening local communities so that if you suck at parenting everyone knows and can act accordingly

just start thinking for fuck's sake. philosophy should be food for thought, thought that you have already begun, not 'systems' to learn.

Why would you read "philosophy"?

>>15695276
>>15695285
Because everyone who isn't an NPC has the existential questions of "What am I," and "What is the Universe," and "How was it all created."
While the bulk of that questioning should be done within your own intuitive contemplation, its akin to reinventing the wheel to not at least consider the product of millenia of discussing just these subjects and augment your own opinions.

>>15695309
This

>>15690552
There is no such thing as a bi male, only gay males and confused ones.

>>15691454
I don't understand how you can't get immediate gratification from Nietzsche, he writes in aphorisms

>>15690042
Based, only Dunning-Kruger midwits would disagree with this.

All these streamers or whatever look at the world and see nothing but surface, paying attention to them will actively make you dumber.

>>15690172
Recently came across this Vaush guy and it's insane seeing how many young men look up to his entire "fat gamer who happens to care about politics" ethos. Anyone with sense can tell he's a selfish fat disgusting retard narcissist just by listening to him for 10 seconds. Same with Destiny and all these "youtuber" intellecuals

Pity the poor zoomer who knows only these shit tier sophists instead of decent ones, like Terrence Mckenna, Peterson and Alan Watts.

>>15695276
brainlet take

Your 'food for thought' is going to be a jumbled, personal system that's already present in a more developed form by some other philosopher.

Why are leftoids such cocksuckers for Destiny?

He isn't smart, he isn't well read, he is a fucking gamer that "wins" debates by using the same anti-intellectual tactics that turned Ben Shapiro into a living meme.

Don't you have better public speakers to champion?

>>15696680
This is what happens when you pander to the leftists. Their entire existence is just a ruthless free-for-all where everyone throws each other under the bus as soon as it makes them look better by comparison.

This idiot here tried to make it big this election cycle by trying to ride the progressive bandwagon like every Democrat this cycle, but he's now finding out that leftists are fucking ruthless and only tolerated him as an attack dog on their political enemies.

>>15696680
His actual beliefs are that of a teenage nihilist with some hatred against Boomer Conservatism which may make him look like a leftist to the untrained eye. But in reality, he's still in the rebel against mommy and daddy phase (he openly shit talks his mom on Facebook and brags about it to his fanbase)

>>15690010
destinys said he finds all reading boring though, he's even said he'll sometimes watch movies on 1.25-1.5x speed because he just can't sit through it

>>15690568
a cuck derives plessure from their partner being with other people, destiny is fine with his partner being with other people but doesn't derive pleasure from it. He derives pleasure from the sex with multiple partners that his relationship allows due to him have, he is by definition not a cuck. You're just so insecure with the fact that you're a virgin you've managed to convince yourself the dude regularly fucking 15 different women is less sexual capabale and desireable than you are, grow up already no ones impressed with the fact you hate yourself

>>15695309
>>15696662
>>15695514
I'll reinvent it all I like and make it 100x better because everyone especially academics who managed to get themselves popularised are mediocre and some are unworthy of anyone knowing their names (nepotism and braindead trends, I suspect). I am smarter and much more selfaware than all.

Usually I only need a summary and life story, then I can predict everything a philosopher is going say and take his ideas far deeper (too limited by cultural, academic, and personal context as he is). I am a near-formless being of intellectual iconoclasm and superior refinement. I can't do anything without getting pissed off and instinctually making something better even if I have to spend years in study and remaking. This is my burden as the only aware being to exist.

>>15690971
4channel is a friend simulator buddy

>>15693886
based

>>15696836
Clam down little buddy, you'll grow up to be a man eventually I hope.

I genuinely cant imagine the type of person you have to be to watch and listen to these freakshow e celebs

>>15690042
100% correct
you need to get your hand at a good secondary source and then you can get inspired to read main primary sources

you can read a hundred of philosophy books while not understanding them

>>15698322
How did the authors of the secondary sources know what the primary sources were talking about besides reading them?

>>15698432
They were not self studying

>>15698471
This is interesting, would you say this perspective is an extension of the master-disciple relationship and tradition of disciplic succession? For example, for anybody to be considered initiated in a philosophy, they must have been taught by someone who was themselves initiated, and this chain of disciples and masters goes all the way back through time and space to when god himself revealed the tradition to the first man?

>>15697061
4chan is completely depersonalized, except for that butterfaggot.

>>15696836
Imagine writing all this to defend cuckoldry in addition to writing high school tier insults. Thanks for the laugh faggot.

>>15690010
Phil is mostly fucking garbage (as writing)

there are nuggets of gold but

>>15698485
I wouldn't say it's a must, but most people are of average intellect. A leading hand is there to suggest ways of approaching the material. Of course a very smart person will be able to self study completely.

>>15696680
>using the same anti-intellectual tactics that turned Ben Shapiro into a living meme.
What are those?

>>15690076
How is Nietzsche of all writers dry?

>>15691696
>I disagree, retarded is exposing yourself to secondhand judgments before engaging directly. You bias your own perceptions doing that.

Why would you think your own judgement is any better or more insightful than someone who's probably dedicated most of their life to studying them?

I agree it can load you up with the secondary author's biases but then if you can't even pick that apart from the good stuff you're hopeless anyway.

>>15695276
yes, philosophy is just more fuel to empower your own biases.

>>15696163
I'm a straight male with a penis fetish. Where do I land?

>>15696836
>I don't care who my girlfriend fucks because I always get to cuddle with her after! :)
damn man alpha as fuck you're so cool

>>15700408
%100 gay

>>15700423
okay cool thanks

>>15700369
>Why would you think your own judgement is any better or more insightful than someone who's probably dedicated most of their life to studying them?
As an egoist, it comes very naturally.