/lit/ - Literature

>>15669841
As I happen to live in Germany too, I'm curious:
Where exactly do you see censorship in this?
What would you prefer to read in the newspapers?

>>15669891
To be clear: All I see in the news at the moment is that motives and culprits are unknown.

>>15669904
I just looked again actually and it says it were simply young people without political motives. I haven't come across any mental gymnastics though in the newspapers though. So how is it censorship if there is leftist discussion in the leftist twitter bubble? What do you expect?

>>15669891
>>15669904
Assi got into a routine inspection and he played the le evil police is bad act -
Called up his assi friends and they vandalised the inner city

Taxpayer will have to pay again for it and be happy about getting taxed to hell while funding those deadbeats

>>15669952
>and it says it were simply young people without political motives
Exactly a straight up lie that the protesters themselves disagree with.

I'm somewhere between a liberal and a social democrat. As your image alludes to, this isn't anything new, so it's not the modern left, it's the authoritarian left. And it's actually creating an important division within the left, as well as the right to some extent.

Left-liberalism and social democracy both draw from two different philosophical frameworks: liberalism and conflict theory. Liberalism asserts universal rights and values - that everyone is entitled to be free, to live, and to do what they want so long as their actions do not infringe on the rights of others. Conflict theory, on the other hand, asserts a system where there's competition between the exploiters and the exploited, arguing that those without power must seize it, in order for there to be a just system. In a good, social democratic system, these frameworks coexist, but liberalism is the more important of the two.

We're in a time when conflict theory and liberalism are coming into conflict, which is why you see Maoist-minded people attacking liberalism. On the left, even some libertarian Marxist types, from Cornel West to Noam Chomsky to Michael Brooks, are warning against creeping illiberal authoritarianism on both the left and right. On the other hand, you're getting angry reactionaries denouncing them for it.

>>15669971
>>15669978
Ok, so you're a moron and don't have anything to say. This thread is pointless.

>>15670030
>Maoist-minded people attacking liberalism.
To give you an idea of what I'm referring to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cMYfxOFBBM

I'm somewhere between a liberal and a social democrat. As your image alludes to, this isn't anything new, so it's not the modern left, it's the authoritarian left. And it's actually creating an important division within the left, as well as the right to some extent.

Left-liberalism and social democracy both draw from two different philosophical frameworks: liberalism and conflict theory. Liberalism asserts universal rights and values - that everyone is entitled to be free, to live, and to do what they want so long as their actions do not infringe on the rights of others. Conflict theory, on the other hand, asserts a system where there's competition between the exploiters and the exploited, arguing that those without power must seize it, in order for there to be a just system. In a good, social democratic system, these frameworks coexist, but liberalism is the more important of the two.

We're in a time when conflict theory and liberalism are coming into conflict, which is why you see Maoist-minded people attacking liberalism. On the left, even some libertarian Marxist types, from Cornel West to Noam Chomsky to Michael Brooks, are warning against creeping illiberal authoritarianism on both the left and right. On the other hand, you're getting angry reactionaries denouncing them for it.

>Maoist-minded people attacking liberalism.
To give you an idea of what I'm referring to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cMYfxOFBBM

>>15669841
Does anyone know what kind of methods they used to edit pictures in this way. I'm assuming there wasn't much Photoshopping going around in the early 20th century, so was it like cutting up and sticking different pictures together of what?

>>15669841
You don't need to *know* anything when you're a leftist, you just need to pledge allegiance to their causes. As such, it's essentially a religion. Because your only connection to the left is a pledge, you can also be removed from status hierarchies with similar ease. Shaming and ostracization is the name of the game. The left always becomes a chicken race between people trying to signal harder than each other; "I love equality THIS much!" "well, I love equality even more!"

God I fucking hate the Germans. It's this kind of crystal clear language necessity required for even a basic conversation. OP does a backflip with "to be clear" the second another German shows up because he knows that if you communicate without watching your words you will be ripped to shreds.

Everywhere I've gone, Spain, the US, the UK, China, it's the Germans that are insufferable. The worst part is that I love Hegel, and I'm sure from his writing style that he would immediately be that guy. In all my travels, I wish never to see Germany.

>>15670116
Blow it up your ass faggot.

>>15669841
>despite the fact that germany is one of the best countries in regards to social benefits

>>15669841
>t. upper-class socdem

>>15670109

Your first sentence is correct in coherent leftist systems, because they believe in equality, solidarity, and mutual support. If you agree to support the all, the all support you.

Your second sentence and its assertion are incorrect, and I'm guessing it's some flavor of PragerU inspired. Religious practice tends to ritual meetings, Godheads, supernatural aspects. Beyond that, the tenants are not different than other ideologies in their notions of covenants, sins, virtues, localized "priests" who give sermons. What else is Shapiro than a pastor with his flock?

Third sentence, yes, depending on what the action is, generally if it breaks your support to the "all". If you no longer support the all, the all no longer supports you. It's not terribly complex. The last two sentences seem to be outside looking in commentary, the last of which is really exaggeration. The furthest left goal with authority government is Communism, which makes all immediately equal and seeks to assert the government through the poorest in society. If you can find the theoretically poorest person, in status, funds, ethnic/racial, and social disadvantage, communism would want to put this person in as high a position as they could possibly qualify for, because of this disadvantage. A disadvantaged person is better able to fairly govern the disadvantaged vs a person with significant advantage, because they better understand the situation. Or, that's how thee reasoning goes. Education discrepancy is an issue, which the communists seek to smooth over by railing universal education. First thing they give you is reading material, Cuba has a 96% literacy rate.

>>15670148
Cope.

>>15670280
>Religious practice tends to ritual meetings, Godheads, supernatural aspects
I'm not being pithy, a lot of things is like religion and a lot of things only requires your pledge. The left's treatment of race and racism is religious; making the treatment of the other the highest good and pretending that it'll usher in utopia
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNFCTPvcGjw
Being on the right side of history is the left's version of heaven. A spotless soul, immortalized in the annals of history
> If you no longer support the all, the all no longer supports you. It's not terribly complex.
"The all" must necessarily splinter because a status hierarchy where some can't climb is useless. Therefore you must always find someone new to cancel. Today you don't have to be vegan but it might come to that kind of signalling.

Today you do *have* to support BLM or you're excluded from "the all." You basically have to support the movement to racialize all discussion about law-enforcement even if their reason for doing this is not backed up by any kind of statistics; you're making good on your pledge instead of actually addressing issues. You don't need to know, you don't need to understand, you just have to smile and say yes; you have to get down on your knees and pray.

>>15670280
>PragerU
>Shapiro
what kind of redditor are you

>>15670034
> you see they are apolitical because the papers said so therefore I will disregard what they themselves have said and what their actions would point towards.
I fell like you are projecting your inability to bring anything worthy towards the discussion.

>>15670109
that is true for every side of the political specturm, we'd like to say that fundamental differences within morals and mindset is the reason us left leaning people in-fight so much, then again the right is so desperate for people "switching" to them that they don't even give a shit if they disagree,which is actually counterproductive if you cunts ever get in office lmao

also what the fuck do you even need to know in order to be on the right? redpilled premises and narrow-minded conclusions? some retarded historian writing about how the holocaust didn't have 6 million deaths (which he lost a trial trying to defend)? BELIEF in "traditions" that people only feel attached to because without them they have no sense of identity? it's all bullshit

>>15670418
The newspapers said that this is what is currently confirmed. Would you be happier if the newspaper started speculating and spreading possibly false information?
I don't want to get started on the point that police statements usually cannot be trusted so let's assume they are to be trusted. Then the newspapers should go and disregard the statement from the police to put out some speculations that suit your right-wing ideology?

>>15670385
>Being on the right side of history is the left's version of heaven.
well yeah they are? the french revolution, the civil rights movement, anything that makes the scandinavian countries so based, they all come from the enlightment-driven left
>Today you do *have* to support BLM or you're excluded from "the all."
yeah, because the message behind blm is not "cops bad blacks rule whites suck" it's living a society where everyone has equal opportunity, and that is the reason why everything that comes as a consequence sucks, if you disagree with the very premise of equal opportunity for everyone they're pretty much right when they say you're a cunt who doesn't deserve to be in the country lmao

>>15670563
>also what the fuck do you even need to know in order to be on the right?
That value is created either by building infrastructure or by improving it. This is ultimately the only thing that grows society, everything else is window-dressing. No pledge will ever make you better at writing code, building machines or producing medicine. The left maximizes the selection pressures for pledge-people which can quickly get dangerous

>>15670664
"growing society" means nothing without defining it, do you mean progress in technology? i'm pretty sure left leaning european countries have done more in that sense than highly capitalistic america ever has, PRODUCING medicine and BUILDING machines, doesn't make progress, it just means you're working class for someone who had the ideas for those products in the first place, if producing and building were what made a society "grow" then china should be the "biggest" country on earth

>>15670664
also thats not even what some left leaning people disagree with, most actually, hence why they propose policy for insuring that everyone can have better living standards and focus more on what YOU are proposing, while right wingers just shill to whatever the corporations want but hate it when it's ran by jews, fuck off brainlet

>>15670576
Le ebil Police lmao in fucking Germany
>Muh motive
Buch of jobless azzlacks just bored because they sit on their asses all day and smoke Shisha

>>15670415

Where else would someone get so misguided a notion as "An ideological system is a religion." Even for metaphor it's thin, but this fellow seems to be taking the notion literally. Left wing politics are not unique among ideologies. There is large degrees of overlap, they're not issuing robes and opening temples. The people I've seen seriously pushing the above notions have been Prager, and this anon. So I reference Prager.

Is this in any way incoherent?

>>15670385

That's an incorrect use of the word pithy. Equal treatment of all, including along lines of race, "gender", faith, will yield a more equal world. That this goal is (parodied?) a comparitive mythical utopia is a comment on the current state of the "land of the free".

To the spotless soul, no soul is spotless. The tactic is perfectly a guilt trip, though with no hellfire consequences, merely the disgust of your grandchildren and the social wish for your accelerated passing. Compared to religion, the consequences are not as extreme, the goal state not as good, and neither are supernatural. So no, it's not literally appropriate, and the metaphor is stretched beyond accuracy.

Lack of status climb and lack of monetary advantage are goal states in a communist system, though one may gain better positions in the party, or increase their skill in their chosen field. This climb is an illusion of the system we live in and is completely inapplicable to 70% of the current American population, much less the global poor. Climb, on top of that is itself an illusion of grandeur. The gain means nothing in the grave, and merely empties the pockets of some other in society. Assuming the immediate argument to be providing for the next generation, communist systems protect the next generation in equal degree to the former, if not better for their parents work to benefit the total capital of the society. Or at least, that's how the theory goes.

Want for climb is outside Christian, Stoic, and Buddhist ideologies. Any of the above can be firm foundations for a society, and it is therefore possible that a society can exist without a need for climb.

>>15670624

This is abrasive and poorly constructed, but essentially correct. Buddy, I'm on your side, but presenting your points in this way will not get you a kind objective light. You may never convince your opposition, but maintaining composure is it's own reward.

>>15669841
>those fucking bendy fingers in the picture of Stalin alone

>>15670624
>well yeah they are? the french revolution, the civil rights movement, anything that makes the scandinavian countries so based
Nothing of this is built to last. It's like you're hyping up the rainbow nation of south africa and mandela as some sort of success because they are "on the right side of history." I don't care, this stuff isn't real buddy
>yeah, because the message behind blm is not "cops bad blacks rule whites suck" it's living a society where everyone has equal opportunity
No, the message is "Black people are doing bad in society and the reason for this is because society is racist, policing is racist and everything will be better if we have nice cops"
You haven't even begun working on the problem and the discussion happening actually distances you even further from the solution
>>15670718
>"growing society" means nothing without defining it,
Building stuff that allows for the creation of more people; housing, food, medicine, roads. This is good because more people will help you if another group of people tries to overpower you.
>if producing and building were what made a society "grow" then china should be the "biggest" country on earth
I think it's the capacity for building and improving that's important. China is lacking in innovation even if they have the raw numbers for running the world.
> hence why they propose policy for insuring that everyone can have better living standards
You're dumb if you think living standards is what matters. What matters is relative wealth and power

>>15670815
>This is abrasive and poorly constructed, but essentially correct. Buddy, I'm on your side, but presenting your points in this way will not get you a kind objective light. You may never convince your opposition, but maintaining composure is it's own reward.
i know... but at this point i've stopped actually caring about alt right 4channers who just will never actually come back up from the rabbithole, i prefer to ridicule them as that is often the only thing they'll be intellectually honest responding to, probably calling me a racial slur and not addressing any point made

>>15670815
I used to think gays were just men who wanted to dress up as women or get fucked in the ass by other men, but now i see the truth is far more complex and sinister. These people are deranged cultural marxist ideologues bent on the normalization of pedophilia. It is completely reasonable for say eastern european countries to take steps to stop the lgbt ideology.

>>15670815
This isn't whatever website you're from, nobody here cares about Ben Shapiroberg or Denis Pragerstein. The correct view of contemporary liberal progressivism as the ideological continuation of Anglo puritan theology comes from Moldbug and NRx in general, which is itself just a repackaging of Carlyle and Nietzsche.

>>15670890
Someone should write "400 years together" about having to live in the Anglosphere with the various Nonconformist and Dissenter sects.

>>15669841
>artist wants to depict Stalin
>uses a photo as a reference to draw Stalin
>years later some retard: MUH CENSORSHEEEEEEP

>>15670864

2/10, if serious 1/10

Gays are just non-heteronormative people. The left position is that they are people, and that if they want to contribute to society, they can be part of a supportive society. To the kids, that would be considered harming a minor, which is still illegal under communism believe it or not. Just because the right has been shouting that communists want to rape your women, fuck your kids, kill your dog, does not mean they actually want to do so. Many communist organizations would like to shut down your church, but not your religion, and would like to give you a small plot of land. Depending on location, you may well end up with more land than you currently have.

>>15670890

I've been on 4chan since 2010, /lit/ since 2014. I do not have a reddit account, and maintain no other social media than a Fetlife profile and Twitter. Do either Moldbug or NRx propose Leftist political ideology as a religion?

Nick Land on twitter does not seem to do so.

>>15670815
HR panopticon dystopia for the middle classes, atomizing therapeutic or identitarian discourses and consumer monocultures replacing ttadition and self reliance, power descentralized armed gangs for those unlucky enough to live outside gated and guarded communities. Leftists are naive about power, and lack any vision of the good life, they want nothing more than to make others participate in their shame. My criticisms of the left are fundamentally aesthetic and thus irrefutable. Instead of letging them drag us down to the lowest common denominator obese pink haired mixed race blobs consuming the latest diverse and progressive products of the walt disney corporation why not understand human society and the human body as raw material for the total work of art think the synchronized motion of the nuremberg rallies.

>>15670624
>yeah, because the message behind blm is not "cops bad blacks rule whites suck" it's living a society where everyone has equal opportunity,
I would have believed you a week ago, in fact I did, they you burned small business you kept parroting the same bullish that "rioting is the language of the unheard" while you destroy the livelihoods of honest hardworking Folk, many of which a re minorities by the way, and then come with the bullshit that areas that are already under policed need even less police. I LIVED IN ONE OF THOSE AREAS YOU CUNT, THE PROBLEM WAS A LCK OF POLICING NOT TOO MUCH FR FUCKS SAKE! most people who live in those neighborhood are not criminal fearing fr their live every time a police car passes you bourgeoisie fuck, they are hard working people and they are the ones who have been fucked by you shitty riots. You don't care about then however you care about the criminals looting and pillaging already poor neighborhood hood, you defend them.
And for that, no matter what you say, how you try to paint your rhetoric I despise you. And I despise your lunacy in saying those who don't agree with you dislike equality. FUCK OFF!

>>15670109
Did people just up and forget William F. Buckley's tenure at the National Review? Murray Rothbard got purged for opposing the Cold War. Same with the John Birch Society. Joseph Sobran and the rest of the Paleocons were cancelled for opposing the First Iraq War

>>15670847
>Nothing of this is built to last. It's like you're hyping up the rainbow nation of south africa and mandela as some sort of success because they are "on the right side of history." I don't care, this stuff isn't real buddy
the french revolution is the reason you're able to vote, i never mentioned mandela, but the civil rights movement (mlk)
>No, the message is "Black people are doing bad in society and the reason for this is because society is racist, policing is racist and everything will be better if we have nice cops"
no, the point is that the economical oppression based on race suffered in the past has reprocussions such as the increased crime rates and consequently cops are trained by actual statistic to think that black people are more inclined to commit crimes and they act accordingly, without being racist themselves
>You haven't even begun working on the problem and the discussion happening actually distances you even further from the solution
you can disagree with "defunding the police" which is a really dumb slogan imo, and still support the actual cause giving solutions you deem better, people are usually open to that, and if they're not you know they're dumb and you can't reason with them

>>15670847
>I think it's the capacity for building and improving that's important. China is lacking in innovation even if they have the raw numbers for running the world.
it certainly is important, but you also need innovation, as you said, but that is not a right wing belief, it's one that can be attributed to both sides, the way you go about achieving that is what actually differs right wing and left wing
>You're dumb if you think living standards is what matters. What matters is relative wealth and power
what "matters" isn't arbitrary, different contexts are applied to different situations, sometimes wealth and power matters, sometimes it's an ideological movement and how it resonates with people is what does, and as you said
>Building stuff that allows for the creation of more people; housing, food, medicine, roads. This is good because more people will help you if another group of people tries to overpower you.
so explain to me what better way for a country to gain people who will help you by builing houses and roads, produing food and medicines, when your goal is to not be overpowered, to actually look after its people and be sure to give them free medical assistence if they're sick, imposing a decent minimum wage so that they atleast don't starve, be sure no one can be marginalized for something they couldn't control, these is what makes people get on your good side, as a government/country, and these are all left leaning ideas

>>15670974
i don't actually support violent riots (unless the police attacked a peaceful protest first, which didn't happen), i wholeheartedly agree with you, i agree with the statement the movement is trying to make, wether they're making it in the wrong way or not, but that doesn't justify these awful things happening to small buisness owners, i'm sorry buddy

>>15670976
They were cancelled for being too right wing or not globalist enough

>>15670956
>I've been on /lit/ since 2014 and never heard of le leather jacket thielbucks moldman
I don't believe you. His central thesis is that progressivism is the natural evolution of New England Anglo puritanism. First they took over Massachusetts then America then the world. He literally uses the term "the Cathedral" to refer to the decentralized network of leftist patronages and interest groups.
https://www.unqualified-reservations.org/2009/01/gentle-introduction-to-unqualified/

>>15671005
I probably shoudln't ahve lashed out at you but it just makes no sense. Even on a complete Communist revolution, why are you burning the low income housing, why are you targeting the small business? the suburbs are fine so why are the poor neighborhoods burning? no matter how radical you are that just makes no sense. And nobody except the "right wing" is even openly talking about it, and of course they use it as a political got you moment but at least it's something....

Right this is probably bait, but whatever.
>inb4 phone posting some nig got my apartment up banned so I do what I can

The left I’m coming from is the fairly affluent upper middle/lower upper class. The kind that was poor/lower middle a generation ago.

Anyway. Coming into the 2000s after the wildly partisan Clinton thing, maybe it was warranted maybe not whatever. It’s a new era, things are looking up technology is exploding. Then comes bush.

Initially he’s not so bad, just more (R) old money and he’s pretty par the course. Yeah the election was close but he’s not too bad so far so whatever. Then comes the wars, the recession, etc.

This is conservative policy in its end stage, and it fucked the country. Well never see this again hopefully.
Then comes Obama, and a tide of optimism. And yeah he wasn’t perfect not nearly so, but largely he wasn’t so different from his conservative counterparts. Except for that whole black bit.
Anyway by this point money and ideologue focused media has the American right in its grips. Obama goes from a middling centrist to the antichrist just because a bunch of oil billionaires decree it. Maybe around 1/4 of that was warranted.

It’s become clear by this point that propaganda not only works but it’s necessary. Most people in the country are retarded and will do what big face on the tv tells them to do.
So now you see the culmination of this trend with trump and the retards who lick his balls.

I guess the answer to your question is the left is realizing a bit late that propaganda not only works, but it’s extremely effective. Where this will go, idk

>>15669841

Why are countries with the most equal oppurtunity the ones most likely to romanticize and patronize the other and generally stagnate population wise? Like it all sounds good on paper but so far it seems long term its not great

>>15671094
It's rooted in Anglophone Nonconfirmist/Dissenter theology. The same people who in the 1800s believed in their own supremacy and duty to uplift the colored races equality now believe in their own supremacy and their duty to tear themselves down to achieve equality. They have the same class character as always (upper-middle and lower-upper class >>15671091
) and espouse the same positions as always. Nothing has changed.

Wasn’t leftypol’s BO a Marxist Leninist tranny who caused a board split because she kept banning everyone who disagreed with her? ahahhaha

>>15669904

yet we all know who it were

>>15670982
>the french revolution is the reason you're able to vote, i never mentioned mandela, but the civil rights movement (mlk)
I don't care about voting and I don't care about the civil rights movement. I don't care about being on the right side of history, just like I don't care to ponder whether my monkey ancestors were on the right side of history or not. It's a debased way of thinking
>no, the point is that the economical oppression based on race suffered in the past has reprocussions such as the increased crime rates and consequently cops are trained by actual statistic to think that black people are more inclined to commit crimes and they act accordingly, without being racist themselves
Do you have a single fact to back this up or is pure leftist myth and doctrine? Could we do something to test the validity of these claims? Could you accept the possibility of you being wrong?
>these is what makes people get on your good side, as a government/country, and these are all left leaning ideas
It's good if you get power by paying lip service to leftist ideas. It's bad if you reproduce too many leftists because suddenly you can lose the political process to a chicken race of signalling and at that point there's no more arguments you can make

I agree with this >>15671122 if you want to understand the arrogant White Man's Burden-tier worldview of the modern Anglo puritan, look no further than >>15671091 its been the same exact bullshit since the English Civil War

>>15670116
is this why Germans fear Derrida?

>>15671131
/leftypol/ had numinous splits, their BFF's on Reddit getting caught posting CP spooked a lot of people.

>>15671091
>It’s become clear by this point that propaganda not only works but it’s necessary. Most people in the country are retarded and will do what big face on the tv tells them to do.
>So now you see the culmination of this trend with trump and the retards who lick his balls.

Let's not pretend propaganda only flows in one direction. You even admit the Left has "realized" propaganda works -- as though it's a new revelation -- but seemingly lament its outcome when its to the Right.

Yes, people are largely retarded, and all spectrums are prone to it. The 'big face on TV" is largely more pro-corporate and Left than not.

>>15670056
>reacting to reaction with more reaction by a bunch of "yassssssers"

watching this was actually painful

>>15670815
>That's an incorrect use of the word pithy.
Sorry, I have a bad habit of using it as a synonym for piquant or whatever; a statement that's made for effect rather than substance. It's not my intention: the leftist movement is similar to a religious movement in the sense that it grows using the same tools. It probably utilizes the same parts of the brain as well
>Equal treatment of all, including along lines of race, "gender", faith, will yield a more equal world.
There's no equal treatment because we're not equal and we'll never be. The fate of humanity is one of eternal splintering and eternal war. I don't care if you think it's very important to pay lip service to trannies, it's ultimately of no importance. If this kind of signalling becomes vitally important then it's already too late
>and neither are supernatural
The left is beyond reason, they're above the natural. Any fact that is opposed to their utopian egalitarian vision is a hate-fact. I'm fine with this but it means that I have to interact with these people as if they were a religious group. I'm not a heretic but to a religious person I am. I'm not a "racist" but to a leftist I am.
>Lack of status climb and lack of monetary advantage are goal states
You're not going to outwit Darwin, there are no goal states for organic life

>>15671295
To a certain point I agree with you, it’s more than the 2000s were so dominated by the conservative flavor. Everything from global warming being demonized to the shifting of the blame for the recession. I’m not saying it’s different for the left, but to be a modern subscriber to the American right is to have little to no original thoughts about any relevant topics. Your beliefs are defined by your idols.

>>15671480
>2000s were so dominated by the conservative flavor
>global warming being demonized
What? like 80% of movies, documentaries and TV series were producing crazy pro-global propaganda that they're now trying to bury because of how inaccurate they were.

>>15671217
It's not just Puritans, though they're one of many such sects. There's a whole array of weird Nonconfirmist sects that seem to be associated with the upper-middle-class (in the US sense) that practice telescopic philanthropy, are moral busybodies, etc.

>>15671252
>/leftypol/ had numinous splits, their BFF's on Reddit getting caught posting CP spooked a lot of people.
Quick rundown? I've never heard about this incident before.

>>15671553
True, but I’d argue there’s a difference between that and what the voting public subscribe to. For the voting adults that matter none of that is relevant, as their beliefs by that point had already been concretely defined by day time television(and After 2010, social media, etc all.

So yes homogenized American culture is center left, verging a little obscenely far now with trannies and the like—but that will be the next generation. This generation was effectively already locked in during the late 90s, 2000s. That’s why you’re seeing the push to suppress the propaganda that ‘ruined’ a generation. There’s so much power and money in the political American right that it’s absurd anyone subscribing to it sees their beliefs as genuine or in-decline.

That said, I’m not sure the left is any better at this point, because it’s in the process of having the same thing that happened to the GOP happen to it—namely having the positions dictated by the partisan retards on Twitter/or for the GOP the trailer park.

>vandalism is bad
Vandalism is actually based and only chuds who want to censor dissenting opinions are against it.
We should cancel OP for being a fag

>>15671804
Poor bait

>>15669841
*contemporary

>>15671828
It's not bait, there is literally nothing wrong with vandalism so long as you aren't besmottering something beautiful. Destroying other people's property is OK and totally normal human behavior, and defacing monuments is a good thing because most monuments are shit. If any public art or monument, etc that is actually worth protecting gets vandalized, it's the fault of it's overseers for not preventing it.
Basically the only people who get triggered by vandalism are Karens and hall monitors.

>>15671766
Also, there’s something to be said for corporate culture choosing the center/mid left for its benevolent, guiding theology. Corporatism is all about compatibility and mass appeal. The fact that it’s chosen the left as it’s totem means that’s what’s largely compatible with the rest of the world, and moreover is what appears (as of a year or so in the past) to be the best ideology for long term sustained growth.
I’m not saying whether this is a good or bad thing, but it’s telling from a utilitarian sense.
For all the railing of pol-niggers, corporations are largely sterile and profit focused. So therefore seeing them gear themselves for this modern ideological bent is telling from more than a short term POV.
I’d say it’s rather the opposite than the normally recognized opinion that a cabal of long nosed individuals is shaping American corporate culture.
Rather, they recognize and adapt to what they perceive as long term trends in the cultural landscape and shape themselves accordingly.

>>15669891
>stuttgart riots
>read deutsche welt
>"some youths had a playtime"
>read junge freiheit
>"the vice-president of stuttgart's police said that 'multicolored groups' of young rioters from 'diverse milieus' assaulted police, looted 9 stores, and ransacked 40 other stores, after a demonstration escalated when the rioters began chanting that german cops are racist just like american cops. the leader of germany's second biggest police union said 'there's no wonder this happened, since our government just spent 3 weeks legitimizing propaganda that cops are systemically racist and violent'."

>>15669841
>The Jewish nigger Lassalle who, I’m glad to say, is leaving at the end of this week, has happily lost another 5,000 talers in an ill-judged speculation. The chap would sooner throw money down the drain than lend it to a ‘friend’, even though his interest and capital were guaranteed. In this he bases himself on the view that he ought to live the life of a Jewish baron, or Jew created a baron (no doubt by the countess). Just imagine! This fellow, knowing about the American affair, etc., and hence about the state of crisis I’m in, had the insolence to ask me whether I would be willing to hand over one of my daughters to la Hatzfeldt as a ‘companion’, and whether he himself should secure Gerstenberg’s (!) patronage for me! The fellow has wasted my time and, what is more, the dolt opined that, since I was not engaged upon any ‘business’ just now, but merely upon a ‘theoretical work’, I might just as well kill time with him! In order to keep up certain dehors vis-a-vis the fellow, my wife had to put in pawn everything that wasn’t actually nailed or bolted down!
t.BASED Marx

>>15672072
>It is now quite plain to me — as the shape of his head and the way his hair grows also testify — that he is descended from the negroes who accompanied Moses’ flight from Egypt (unless his mother or paternal grandmother interbred with a nigger). Now, this blend of Jewishness and Germanness, on the one hand, and basic negroid stock, on the other, must inevitably give rise to a peculiar product. The fellow’s importunity is also nigger-like.
t.Also BASED Marx

Just read Marx's letters to Engels.

>>15671954
That's quite some propaganda that right-wing tab is dishing out, oh boy

>>15671192
>I don't care about voting and I don't care about the civil rights movement. I don't care about being on the right side of history, just like I don't care to ponder whether my monkey ancestors were on the right side of history or not. It's a debased way of thinking
well i don't think they're using it in arguments as a way to win, it's probably because dumbfucks keep saying the left has never done shit ever, still you're right, it doesn't matter who's on the right side of history, but history does have meaning and consquences and if you fail to awknowledge that then you have the wrong way of thinking.
>>15671192
>Do you have a single fact to back this up or is pure leftist myth and doctrine? Could we do something to test the validity of these claims? Could you accept the possibility of you being wrong?
if you prove me wrong sure, but whatever i say will never convince you and i'm doing this anyway, so: there is a wealth disparity between black and white people in america, thats a fact, you can google it (gonna say that a lot), the reason for that is not that black people are lazy but that their grandparents suffered from redlining and jim crows, being able to accumulate less wealth to pass to their children; american kids are forced to go to discrict school, founded with district money, in poor ass ghettos the school will be underfunded and they will mostly suck (another fact), poor people tend to have less things to do, so they have more sex (and have no money to pay for condoms or plan b), google that up, thats africans reproduce so much, same happens in america with blacks, this time tho the father leaves, this is very important because data shows that your parents having a stable relationship is one of key factors in doing decently well in life, among other things; you can now look up studies on why kids drop out of highschool, the answers are the things i told you above (poverty, single parent households, a bad school), now then take into account the percentile of highschool dropouts who start committing crime, as they pretty much have nothing to lose, and now you see the main reason black people are overrepresented in crime statistics.
now, if you, a police officer, have data that shows that black people are more likely to commit crime, wouldn't you be more wary when approaching a black person than a white person? well thats it. thats systemic racism, no one is actually outwardly racist but the system still indirectly oppresses that group, or atleast it makes it so that they don't have the same opportunities as someone born into a different, more wealthy family

>>15672308
Yeah, actually reporting what the police officials said sure is propaganda, you neutered housepet. Enjoy your Caliphate.

>>15672527
That's what the police is actually saying:

"Staatsanwaltschaft und Polizei Stuttgart geben bekannt: Angriffe auf Polizeibeamte und Ladengeschäfte in der Innenstadt - Festnahmen
Stuttgart-Mitte (ots) - Polizeibeamte haben in der Nacht zum Sonntag (21.06.2020) bei den Angriffen auf Polizei und Ladengeschäfte (siehe Pressemitteilungen vom 21.06.2020) mehrere Personen festgenommen. Von den 25 vorläufig festgenommenen Personen werden heute im Laufe des Tages sieben Beschuldigte im Alter von 16 bis 33 Jahren dem Haftrichter beim Amtsgericht Stuttgart mit dem Antrag auf Erlass eines Haftbefehls vorgeführt. Bereits gestern Abend wurde auf entsprechenden Antrag der Staatsanwaltschaft gegen zwei weitere Beschuldigte im Alter von 18 und 30 Jahren Haftbefehle erlassen, wobei der Haftbefehl gegen den 18-Jährigen gegen Auflagen außer Vollzug gesetzt wurde. Den Beschuldigten, die die deutsche, kroatische, irakische, portugiesische und lettische Staatsangehörigkeit besitzen, wird dabei u.a. schwerer Landfriedensbruch (§ 125a StGB), gefährliche Körperverletzung (§ 224 StGB), tätlicher Angriff auf Vollstreckungsbeamte (§ 114 StGB) und Diebstahl in besonders schweren Fall (§ 243 StGB) vorgeworfen."

>>15672381
>if you prove me wrong sure, but whatever i say will never convince you and i'm doing this anyway
Because I've heard it a thousand times, it's the great art of the left. The Crying Boy painting of leftist theology, the Reason for Why You Should Feel Sorry. I can help you out: transgenerational epigenomics, lead pipes, chattel slavery, black bodies, colonialism and black wall street
You're basically telling me why the neck of the giraffe is long and why I should feel a certain way about it. It's lefty pablum with no insights because that's not the point, the point is that you want to preach and recruit
>Oh my, that's horrible and makes me feel sad. We must make amends and fix this by feeling sorry, giving them money and definitely not Be Racist

It doesn't matter that you have to write a wildly different story for jews, who have been genocided and hated for millenia, or for asian immigrants, who can go from chicken farmers and then immediately ascend up the socioeconomic ladder, or certain immigrant groups to europe, who came by their own free will with the promise of wealth. What's important is that you have satisfyingly sad story and you're going to stick with it because the alternative is too bleak for you. That's all fine and good

My only point is this:
Do you *actually* want to fix wealth disparity or do you want to have a political identity with a designated group of losers who you all rally around? Because you will have more wealth disparity if it's the latter, also you will probably get more than just wealth disparity since you'll be actively selecting for groups who are good at playing grievance politics

>>15670624
>because the message behind blm is not "cops bad blacks rule whites suck"
Except it is. Systemic racism has been dead since the 80s, 90s at the latest. The current black agenda isn't equality, it's black superiority. They're leveraging the current climate of social media fueled, out-of-control virtue signalling to further that goal, and anyone who calls them out on it is immediately racist... even if they're black themselves.

>>15672778
So where did you little fellow get your brained washed?

>>15669841
>mainstream Media/Twitter leftist
Lol. You are deeply confused.

>>15671804
>chud
You chapo faggots always reveal yourselves through your lame ass “insults”

>>15672905
What do you mean?

>>15672990
he doesn't like what you're saying so he's replying wowww you're crazy!

leftypol fags use this tremendously persuasive argument tactic on /lit/ all the time

>>15673021
It's weird with an appeal to common belief when I'm talking about that exact thing, how the myth-making and manufacturing of consent is different from what they'll be doing once they have power and whether it'll be effective

Someone mentioned something about redlining, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOi2jNpPFX0

>>15671295
>more pro-corporate and Left
Say what now?

>>15673336
Theres a narrative on 4chan that leftists are pro-corporation because corporations pay lip service to youth by pandering to left wing causes which right wingers take at face value. Don't try to argue with it, the people who espouse it need it to be true.

"left" isn't a good distinction. Both China and American liberals are on two different sides of the spectrum yet can be considered both left

>>15669841
>Books about why the modern left loves to censor and delete different opinions?
Any proof of this? In America censorship is entirely directed at leftists despite our freedom of speech.

>>15673336
Outspoken leftists want to belong to a managerial class, firmly lodged in the anus of academia, media and corporate culture so that they can treat the unwashed masses with the communion wafer that is the socioeconomic explanation for pakistani grooming gangs. Holders of capital allows it because this ideology is ultimately what keeps the show going. Both capitalist and leftists are doing the same thing; cashing in on prosperity built by white ethnic cooperation, replacing it with low-trust brazilification and small personal gains

>>15673452
Right wing twitter ecelebs have irrevocably destroyed the minds of countless young men

>>15673515
Sorry, the party is over, the grift is coming to an end

>>15673386
Lberals are not left and most certainly not those in America.

>>15673616
not only are they left the Republicans are left too. Right wing government is monarchical

>>15673404
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Just look at lit mate it surely sin't the ebil right winger banning gone with the wind or any such media for being "problematic.

>>15673404
Nigga in what world? The last time left wing ideas were censored in America was the 50s

>>15673616
Try telling /pol/ that

>>15669841
If history has taught us anything, it's to keep your head down and ride this out. I think the best thing we can do is to keep a daily journal, record events, how they are reported, and how the view of the events is distorted in the following days. Speaking as an American, the rioting in Minneapolis didn't become a BLM protest till days after the actual event. Now even mentioning that rioting happened is a racist faux pas.

I think there is a coup coming. it seems like the liberal technocrats have been systematically undermining their own authority for a while now, and I wouldn't be surprised if this eventually leads to a shuffling of seats and shoring up of powers for centralized governments in countries across the west.

Check out this article, for example,
https://www.wired.com/story/how-to-make-government-trustworthy-again/?utm_source=pocket-newtab
basically a long justification for using technology to constantly track and monitor not only people's geographical position, but who they are in contact with, their proximity to other people, what they are doing throughout the day etc. etc. while missing the seemingly obvious fact that wearing face masks is culturally ingrained in many Asian cultures thanks to their high population density and regular exposure to disease.

Do not make yourself a target. Record the lies, the distortions, the way truth changes a little bit every day, and keep it to yourself

>>15670718
>if producing and building were what made a society "grow" then china should be the "biggest" country on earth
It is though. What China has done in the last couple decades has been an economic miracle, and is widely celebrated by the Chinese people. Most people would rather have a comfortable life with social mobility than "freedom".

>>15672778
personally, yes i actually care about wealth disparity being solved, the reason for that is that it just wouldn't sit well with me if i was born in their situation, AND i find it dumb that it's there in the first place, so i want to get rid of it as fast as possible so we can actually better humanity on a breader scope and have more technological advancements as a result of it instead of caring about stuff like race.

personally i'd like for more people to adhere to getting rid of it because it benefits MY goals, but i think that could be stated for any political position and pretty much every individual don't you think?

p.s. you seem like a nice dude have good one

>>15672791
system racism hasnt been dead for shit, imagine thinkibg it was dead a dacade after 10 years from jim crows being abolished, no fucking way you could say something like that without denying it was there in the first place.

i mean they're pushing for it being normal? it seems hamfisted to you because you've always been used to not seeing black people in ads, the few people who are black nationalists/supremacists are usually hated by the black community but on a slightly smaller scale because they can use the good point of systematic racism to their favor just like the alt right can use unpopular white college aged kids' low self asteems to "redpill" them n shit, it's the same concept on both

>>15673924
well yeah thats the point i was trying to make, and i thought the anon i was responding to would've hated it since he was so adverse to leftism

>>15673372
yup, they legitemately don't understand why a corporation looking for the masses to give them money for their products, would advocate for what the masses believe

>>15673700
Leftists see criticism against them as equal to censorship, that explains how they justify actual censorship as soon they have power.

>>15673924
Yeah, the reason why nobody challenges the CCP is because history has traumatized them badly and the CCP is genuinely doing finally something that doesn't end with millions of chinese dying

>>15674335
Systemic racism implies that it is currently happening, as opposed to the legacy of historical injustices.
Mostly what bothers me is that claims of systemic racism are basically always going to be correct— all the institutions of modern democracy in America, Canada, Britain, Australia, etc. are descended from a uniquely Anglo Saxon tradition, created by and for Anglo Saxon’s. Just because liberalism is seen as a universal doesn’t mean it is, and all historical founded rights are “privileges”. The manga carta for example, was written with the blade of a sword for the specific interests of aristocrats.
So yeah you can criticize it, but I see the undermining of liberal ideals of “citizenship”, “equality”, “universal values”, “free speech”, etc. In the process. we’re in a weird historical epoch where every ethnic group is allowed to act as such, forming exclusive groups for their own benefit, practicing in group bias, claiming group ownership to art forms, using historical grievances to argue for more privileges, and on the other hand all “white people” are expected to act as universalists without any particular right to claim anything as “theirs”. Can you imagine if white people started arguing that English literature is inherently “western”, therefore publishers should have quotas to publish mostly white authors, immigrants should be excluded from book clubs, books like ‘Orientalism’ (always quotes and never actually read by brown undergrads with a complex) should be burned because they represent an appropriation of a distinctly western Anglo tradition.
Personally, I agree with liberal universalism. There are certain things I don’t agree with in it, and I do think there should be historical exceptions for certain groups, but overall if you vote, participate in society, use public info structure, etc. Then there needs to be some recognition of your rights and duties in regards to fellow citizens. What I see instead is a rapid movement towards racial tribalism driven by poverty on one hand, and a constant undermining of enlightenment principles by elite representatives of “the disenfranchised”. Plus lots of rhetoric which is obviously very questionable, things like ‘white fragility’ or ‘racialized people’ and ‘racism towards whites doesn’t exist’ which seeks to create a space for racial political games for some people while denying it to others.
And all of that is being used to push political programs such as clientelism, violent party affiliated street gangs, and centralization of federal power which doesn’t seem like it will fix any of the historical injustices of society so much as it will shore up power of a tiny ruling elite. Already truth has become casualty to a battle of “narratives” which don’t care about things like individual rights, dignity, fairness, or rule of law.

>>15669841
Based Stalin.

>>15669841
oh shut up you dumb cunt
they painted thousands of pics of that faggot and theyre all fucking different

>>15669841
Wow, the communists invented photoshop too.

>>15669841
>Books about why the modern left loves to censor and delete different opinions?
the whole political spectrum does it, nice leftie baiting tho poltard

>>15674335
>a decade after 10 years
You guys are riot. Never change.

>>15669841
Right wingers censor and ban books all the fucking time

>>15675358
Yeah righties keep on getting leftist books taken off of Amazon and refuse to publish books that don't fit right wing ideology

>>15675405
No, they only ban poems and books in school constantly.

>>15675413
Oh no some Karen parents got some smut taken out of a school library in nowherewsville Utah, such right wing censorship

>>15675413
>constantly.
The wacko fundie living in backwaters does have less influence that the activists nowadays

>>15675413
Not wrong.
>wah you can't do that that's... er... gay witchcraft?
>yes I believe in gay witchcraft, it's in the Bible
>one of the pages at the back

>>15672961
Haha, you chuds always reveal yourselves when I call you 'chud'. I call you that because that's what you are, and I've never even visited reddit. dumbass double-chud.

>>15674611
then we don't disagree on anything other than the fact that systemic racism is still around, there just hasn't been enough time for the legacy of historical injustices to give people equality of opportunity in a society right now and that's how i define systemic racism, i'm sure if we keep going at this rate in another 50 years blacks and whites will mostly have the same income i'm not arguing that could be true, just that i think it's better to try to solve this stuff right now since it seems to be such a win win solution for the population at large, and only impacts the ultra rich, this doesn't even have to be right or left, it's about corruption, if we were to elect someone who said they'd do something about it and then didn't, now that would actually unite the working class and below to fight the elites and have an ACTUAL second civil war, that would also help unify races by fighting against a common enemy, i don't get it why is everything in politics so dumb my brain aches

>>15675323
look i was phoneposting and it was 1am, and now it's almost 4 and yeah

>>15673689
>>15673700
Left wing protesters disappear for mysterious reasons, "antifa" is considered a domestic terrorist organization despite not being a centralized organization, it's illegal to hold office as a communist, it's illegal to take video in factory farms and expose the horrible conditions and slave labor. I know getting banned from twitter for wanting to behead immigrants is rough, but be confident that you're not being actively censored unless you're a leftist.
>>15674548
Pure projection

>>15675595
Wasn’t antifa literally promoted by the mayor of Minneapolis? And the UN spoke against it being labeled a terror organization? No on is afraid of you or feels the need to censor you. You live in a fantasy on the level of the average /pol/ poster

>>15675413
The only books being banned or censored are ones deemed racist or anti semitic

>>15675708
If nobody was afraid of antifa the police wouldn't be driving armored vehicles around and setting off illegal fireworks to try and stop them from organizing.

>>15675748
My grandma is terrified of antifa

>>15669841
The MSM does the same thing today...

>>15670956
Take for example the closed loop or Iron triangle between modern scientists and the government. Gov. gives money to fund research to find conclusions that support the government increasing their budgets or inching their power over the people a bit more. How different is that from the closed loop between priests and the government back in the 1400's? Moldbug asserts we live in an Orwellian Athiestic Theocracy and as absurd as that sounds on its face he makes a damn good argument for it. It's much easier to read in the kindle format. A gentle introduction to unqualified reservations. Or if you're further left on the political spectrum "An Open Letter to Open Minded Liberals"

>>15669841
>he's content with "social benefits"
liberals will never learn

>>15675595
>>15675748
good parody of a delusional "woke" retard

>>15670056
Brett was on joe rogan a few days ago claiming these people as a potential source of maoist revolution, but I don’t see their ‘wokery’ having any material goals other than their own self aggrandisement. None of the students in that video have a little red book. Just banal slogans, half remembered concepts from chic internet zines, a trendy haircut and vocal fry. These fags will never start a revolution.

>>15669841
See Rene Girard's work on sacrifice and scapegoating (I've read only "Things Hidden Since the Foundation of Time"). See also Nietzche's discussion of ressentiment and the origins of Good and Evil (in Beyond Good and Evil). Rogue recc but I also thought Edelman's No Future was very instructive on this topic.

NOTE: This is a behaviour endemic to all human groups whatever their super-ego/structure ideological affiliation.

After those texts - for more distant/esoteric echoes of this theme see Hegel (Master/Slave dialectic but don't appropriate it from without the context of his broader system - meaning don't read it as not originating in consciousness/self-consciousness dialectic) and Deleuze (thinking of ATP's chapters 7, 11 and 12)

>>15675929
That is a doctored meme - FAKE NEWS!. Though some semblance of your point does still stand of course.

>>15670066
They used scalpels to cut out the motives and ink/paint to add shadows. Once the composition was finished it would oftentimes be re-photographed.
A quick and dirty method was to simply print multiple negatives on top of each other.

>>15677357
They're too childish to start a revolution, sure, and I don't see the US ever going far left - it's way more prone to go far right. However, I am disturbed by growing authoritarian sentiments in parts of the left. If it was just Evergreen and a couple other campuses, I'd just ignore it. However, I saw a BLM protest, and while most of the people at the protest meant well, there was a disturbing dynamic I noticed. Basically, there were a couple speakers who were extremely hateful, and it was obvious they were trying to be confrontational toward random people in the audience. If anyone had spoken up against the extreme things they were saying, the entire crowd would've targeted the voice of dissent. It's not necessarily that the audience agreed with the hateful things, but they would've gone along with them, to belong to the group. In that dynamic, the more radical you are, the more praise you get for being woke or whatever. This excludes voices for moderation, because anyone who would temper the extremist voices would be labeled an enemy and outsider.

>>15670116
I'm German and getting to know people from Scotland, France and Poland really got me thinking. I'm German, but now I dislike my own way of thinking sometimes. Send help

>equating radlibs with actual leftists

christ, you /pol/tards have absolutely ruined /lit/, the collective IQ of this board is around room temperature now.

Hey frens, I want to dive fucking deep on Maoism. Any of you spergs have good recommendations?

>>15680181
Radlibs, leftists, just different flavors of shit

>>15680492
Also interested in good general Marxist history.

Trying to get my brain around this shoeshining mania. What are the most blatant historical parallels to public shoeshining and self-debasement?

>Everyone on the other side is just a rabid ideologue blindly following instinct and falling for charlatans, my side is for thoughtful patricians who see through it all and understand the world how it really is
What quadrant of the political spectrum would most effectively allow me to put everyone who says this shit into death camps?

>>15675514
The original proponents of Affirmative Action said it would only have to be around for about a decade before the gaps between blacks and whites would close. Well it still hasn't changed and its been twice that time. In fact the gap hasn't been changing at all. But this is unsurprising as the black-white IQ gap hasn't shrank at all either. Considering the difference in income between blacks and white goes away when you look at people of similar IQ there's no real reason to think that 50 years from now this will change at all. If the trend of black privilege continues as it has been, i.e. getting sinecures simply for being black, then maybe the "gap" will close. This seems pretty obviously unsustainable though. Since blacks are a saintly class that you are not allowed to question or else your life is destroyed then black dysfunction will materially harm the institutions they work in, if given any real power. Now of course we could just not give them any real power and just give them job titles and big paychecks, but they probably wont settle for that.

To the degree that there's systemic racism it's pro-black. Black students on average have more spent on them, are less likely to be reprimanded for bullying, have an easier time getting into schools, are less likely to be killed by the police given the amount of crime they commit, are more likely to have jurors side with them, hell people are even less likely to call black people fat.


At any rate there's ways we could easily increase black intelligence (or any group's intelligence). And other ways we should investigate which would likely start producing results rather quickly. They're just things that require actual scientific thinking and hard work, and also admitting that genetics plays a major role in psychological traits. Instead people would rather just trying the same things over and over again that we know don't work, like "better schools", power-posing, growth mindset, playing Beethoven to babies, and

>>15670116
Good. We already have more than enough foreigners here.

>>15680998
Take your pick. Nazis had death camps, Soviets had gulags, anarchists killed the rich, capitalists have modern slavery.

Have you tried reading "The Dictator's Handbook", OP? The authors build a three-dimensional model of societies, based on "nominal electorate", "influencuals" and "essentials". It's an interesting read and worth checking out if your question is serious.

Tha being said, I know this thread is most likely bait but does anyone here have some recommendations on the psychology behind autocratic measures? I know I have Gustave Le Bon's "Psychology of the Masses" lying around somewhere but haven't read it yet.

>>15680535
Kant -> Hegel -> Feuerbach and Stirner -> Marx/Engels -> Lenin -> Whatever that French Faggot's name was -> Adorno and maybe Heidegger -> Zizek
In that order.