/lit/ - Literature

>>15539333
>I swear I can understand unknown African tribe
yeah cause you're closer to them
lel crypto nigger

I'm studying India right now. They are a genetic mash of dozens of different invader races, each seperated into islands through their elaborate caste & jati system. Geneticists are untangling the mystery meat right now, but the human biodiversity community tends to stay away because generalizing is hard

In terms of mentality, their racial characteristics are:
-high ethnocenterism due to high parasite load
-mercantile and authoritarian disposition characteristic of Iranians
-low intelligence, no neanderthal admixture
-aggressive tendencies in the tribal buffer peoples

The region is a case study in what would have happened if the PIE steppe peoples in europe had been slightly dumber

>>15539333
the numbers don't lie

>>15539333
they love poopoo, shit, shitting, turds, blowing fece in the streets, and gurus. that’s about it, anon.

>>15539333
Ask me questions about Indian mentality culture and thinking and I will do my best to answer them.

>>15539404
are you Indian and if so where are you from?

>>15539407
Yes. My family is largely from Punjab but my immediate family were all born in Jharkand. We lived in Bangalore for more than half my non-adult life.

>>15539333
they are just socially awkward and have a funny accent and are kinda ugly.

>>15539423
Depending on the region, Indians can be quite bombastic and extroverted. Socially awkward is not particularly the norm in India.

>>15539418
so you're sikh? What is your caste? I'm interested in trying to map the culture and peoples of India and don't know much about the areas you've mentioned

the japanese are like squids of humanity

>>>/trv/

>>15539418
so basically we can expect you to regurgitate western opinions of india

>>15539333
Obviously not. Papua New Guinea is way weirder.

>>15539443
No I am not a Sikh. No one in my family is a Sikh, but I am somewhat familiar with them. I've been to the Golden Temple, I'm somewhat familiar with their teachings and the stories of their Gurus (you may have heard of Guru Nanak), and so on. Amongst neoliberalized city dwellers, you won't see many people dwell on their caste.

Bangalore is where most of India's tech industry is. Jharkhand has a lot of steel manufacturing (Tata Steel), and Punjab/Haryana has a lot of agriculture.

>>15539333
they're just braindead chimpanzees, anon. there's nothing to understand. they're subhuman animals.

>>15539450
Not really. I've grown up there, my parents have lived there their entire lives. I am not going to regurgitate 'I'm-an-undergrad-who-took-a-summer-trip-to-India-it-changed-my-life' or NYT foreign policy opinions on India

>>15539474
what do you think of my characterization? I think it might be more applicable to northeastern Indians than the south. I think India is a doomed colonial fiction destined to balkanize, the BJP will probably be the precipitating force
>>15539383

>>15539477

>>15539484
punjab is already least cultured part of the country and you moved to a metro city on top of that

>>15539486
>Genetic mash of different invader races
So indo-european nomadic cow-herders on horses came down around the same time the Indus Valley civilization collapsed. They settled on the Indo-gangetic plains in the form of several ~15-20 clans. They (along with whatever natives existed before them) formed, for the most part the Hindus today.
As for invader races you have a little bit of Greek near hillstations like Shimla (I think), Timur the Lame didn't conquer, but Babur (A Mughal, which is the word for Mongol) came and kicked out the Delhi Sultanate (Islamic rulers, it was the Lodis who were kicked out) and after that it was the English who never really integrated.
Caste and Jati are far older than the invaders, for the most part, so the caste system remains within Hinduism where it does exist.

>Ethnocentrism
It's more like communalism. Today you can see many Hindu-Musilm riots going on, with Muslims claiming to be the minority. The mistake in western coverage is imputing the minority status meaning in the west to the Muslims; the Muslims ruled India for a time, which so-called PoC never did in the west.
>Mercantile and Authoritarian
To an extent, yes
>The rest of the stuff
I don't know dude. My advice would be to get off /pol/. I don't think Indian people are particularly stupid. Like other Asian races in the west, we're quite successful (There are more than a few Indian CEOs of tech companies). The problem is poverty and corruption in the leftovers of the bloated bureaucracy that came about during India's failed attempt at a Socialist state. Also the fact that no one listened to Gandhi and Nehru kept trying to be buddies with the Chinese. In addition to all of this, we have somewhat dishonest, neo-liberal intellectuals who blindly follow in the footsteps of western intellectuals.
My father always likes to say that we Indians have now lost a moral sense we used to have back in the 80s and so on.

>>15539489

>>15539579
well. India ranks as one of the most racist countries on earth. Despite having a population of millions the tested IQ average is low and there is almost no technological development.

Genetically, they have seen multiple invasions from the northeast. The Sakas & huns who seem to have become rajputs for instance. Persians also in Sind, as well as an overall Iranian agriculturalist influence which was the origin of early Indus civilization. the Northwest sees admixture with nepalese. The South seems to be a genetically distinct basin with more mixture with abbo-types... although they test as much smarter. David Reich took the politically correct approach of defining a genetic "ancestral North Indian" and "ancestral south Indian", but it is almost certainly more complex

>>15539617
India is in fact very racist.
Depending on who you ask, Rajputs are descendents of Kshatriyas(Indian Nationalists) or invading Scythians(Colonial historians). Of course anyone who has access to the Khyber pass could invade and they would run headfirst into the Rajputs.

It is not that there is no technological development there, just a bloated corrupted infrastructure that slows down projects and eats up funds. Similarly IQ is largely a function of socio-economic status and education.

These terms you're throwing around I mentioned: Persians came in the form of the Delhi Sultanate and the Mughals (Mongols who conquered Persia). The Iranians came from the Persians as well.

One point of order: the south is not a geographical basin, it is a very large plateau. The region roughly south of the Vindhya Mountains is called the Deccan Plateau.

why does every thread about india devolve into tracing the genetic makeup of their ancestors and which indo aryans came from where?

is it just one guy that's autistic about this or is it white people in general?

>>15540002
Because Nazi propaganda co-opted the symbol and image of Aryans. so Indians being brown short circuits the brain of the /pol/ browser.

>>15539383
>-low intelligence, no neanderthal admixture
Northern Indians have Persian blood, which is Caucasian.

>>15540002
it's important because "Indian" in normal discourse basically refers to two types of Indians when the history and culture is a lot more complex (and interesting)

>>15540252
All humans are the same and we're all equal.

>>15539333
Madarchod, meri Gand study ker
Bharwa sala aya bara, philosopher chutiya

I swear I'm starting to hate this board so fucking much.

>>15540252
I get what you're saying but I don't agree that it's important.
A better way to phrase it would be to simply outline that the Indian subcontinent contains a massive collection of cultures and ethnicities which were pretty unfairly lumped together under the title "India" by Britain's colonialist ambitions.

>>15540504
Actually the process of nationalism had already begun by Indian people(who were mostly British-Educated) almost three-quarters of a century before India was finally independent.
That said, the British did do a terrible job of carving up the country, and states are constantly in conflict with the Central government even today.

>>15540234
Oh god, he we go boys.

I'm Indian. AMA and I will be brutally honest.

>>15540524
cope

>>15540526
What are your thoughts of Indian Muslims, and the Indian Govts treatment of them?

>>15540544
That doesn’t work for me browno.

>>15539333
They are cockroaches in human form
At least niggers have vitality

>>15540273
>we're all equal.
Go tell that to your boss or some police officer and see how equal you really are

>>15540548
>le meme pedocrat
get a load of this homo lmao

>>15540546
The Indian Govt is currently run by the political arm of a right wing Hindu organization.

This organization:
Had members fascinated with Hitler.
Hates homosexuality.
Is a Hindu nationalism purveyor.

Indian Muslims have for the most part lived in India for at least 500 years. Muslim dynasties ruled for a while and were powerful.

The govt is into the idea that those Muslim dynasties tore India apart and these Muslims aren't inherently Indian.

Here's why this idea is wrong:
Mughals helped in war of independence.
Indian classical music, art, and north Indian cuisine is basically a derivative of Mughal culture.

Muslims in India have been extremely integrated and non-extremist for the most part.

There's reports in north east India that govt officials have been coerced into classifying Muslims as foreigners. It's terrible.

>>15540548
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH IM GONNA
SNIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIF

>>15540601
The Mughal's 'helped' in the war of independence insofar as the last Mughal emperor was propped up as a figurehead in the revolt of 1857 (it can be added: without his consent). The fact of the matter is that the Mughal's and the Sultanates that came before them were foreign invaders. That said, they integrated quite nicely, and it is true, Moglai influences make up much of North Indian culture. However, when the Indian Nation Congress was politicking for Independence, they were content to have Muslims as part of the country. It was the Muslims who formed the Muslim League under Jinnah and demanded the creation of Pakistan, which resulted in tearing apart Hindu and Muslim communities alike.
The Indian government is using this historical context to justify slowly pushing Islam out of the country to create a Hindu nation. Modi himself remains more or less silent on this; he prefers that the rhetoric is dispensed by his subordinates.
But it would be a mistake to analyze the situation in India through an Anglo-American political lens. You must understand that there is much historical animosity between India and Pakistan(The Pakistani ISI has been sending terror groups into India and Afghanistan for a long time), and even between Hindus and Muslims. This sort of animosity goes back to the colonial days, and was encouraged by the British as part of their divide and rule tactics.

>>15540680
And to add to this, some Mughal rulers were quite progressive. Akbar was an example.

>>15539744
Large, corrupt government looks to have been a historical constant in India. I believe it is a racial characteristic tied to their persian blood - one sees the same phenomena throughout MENA prehistory. They certainly copied this government system culturally off Persians.

India has always had rudimentary technological development. They have had one nobel prize despite millions of people. IQ is largely genetic and while I accept environmental ways of lifting it slightly expert consensus wouldn't put a raise about 5-10 points.

This low intelligence, stemming from their failure to admix with neanderthals and relatively high proportion of african/premordial human blood is why it was conquered by multiple succeeding generations of foreign invaders bringing new innovation - the PIE, the Muslims, the British. Their one golden age was the Indus civilization and prehaps India today.

When I say south India I mean Tamil country. Dravidian language is the marker, they have more genetic links to the first people of India and avoided beig ruined by the invader influences

>>15540002
India nationalists are obsessed with proving they are the origin of the human race. The racial emphasis is a byproduct of India's fixation on caste and intermarriage, itself a proxy for racial units. Like all multicultural societies racism is thus paramount, I also believe the heavy malarial and disease presence in early India selected for higher rates of conservatism and ethnocenterism in their evolution

protip: NEVER trust an Indian's story of their ethnic heritage at face value. It is treated as a political topic and doesn't result in objective history

>>15540234
Persians didn't admix with neanderthals either, Iranian agriculturalists were the precursor race which became PIE amd later caucasians. Neanderthal axmixture resulted in intelligence gains and was largely confined to europe

>>15540763
>Neanderthal axmixture resulted in intelligence gains
Prove it.

>>15539333
i was listening to indian mantras today, so good, man

>>15539383
>high ethnocenterism due to high parasite load
I need to know more.

>>15540751
India has 9 Nobel Laureates that were born in India and were of Indian descent. They have won only one Nobel in Literature.

You don't seem to understand what IQ is. IQ measures something. That something is closely related to success in a capitalist system. We like to call it intelligence. It is nothing more than designing a bunch of questions and define the ability to answer those questions as intelligence, and then statistically ranking people depending on that. In order to have a discussion about IQ we have to have a discussion about Intelligence, and that can get very messy depending on you stances on structuralism,, post-structuralism, and so on, and we can reasonably get into some linguistic philosophy.

India has not historically had large corrupt governments. The very concept of 'Indianness' doesn't date back to before 1857.

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove. You sound very similar to right wing nationalists in India today.

>>15540786
>Lohse and Frantz (2014) infer a higher rate of 3.4–7.3% in Eurasia.
>admixture in African individuals... 0.3% of their genome
>East Asians have 8% more Neanderthal ancestry... compared to Europeans

https://www.livescience.com/65003-how-smart-were-neanderthals.html
http://honestthinking.org/en/pub/Fjordman.2010.06.08.Neanderthals_and_high_IQ.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiregional_origin_of_modern_humans

Now compare this with world IQ findings. Interbreeding with archaeic hominids is the origin of multiple human races and the differences we see today

>>15540865
How're you supposed to measure IQ without ranking a person against other people within the same popluation? Did someone timetravel and give historical poulations IQ tests specially designed for that population, and then prove that the performance of the historical person on their specially designed test is comparable to the performance of the modern person on a modern test?

>>15540860
1.A leading theory is Indus civilization collapsed in part because of a surge in Malaria. The coming of cities intensified this disease load- India is thought to have been the origin of Cholera for instance. Your typical european colonizer to India at first didn't last more than several years before succumbing to disease.
2.Parasite-stress theory has found social conservatism is highly related to disease exposure- the more disease prevalent the more ethnocenterism and intolerance there is, it is theorized that this is a coping respose to disease. See the COVID outbreak for instance, this is a fairly harmless virus that sparked a world frenzy because of these genetic predispositions.
3. Racism is highly prevalent in India, it ranks as one of the top countries for this. Their caste system is a systemic racial hierarchy that has not seen much interbreeding for 4000 years.
3. I theorize indians evolved in diseased conditions that resulted in thier predisposition towards racism

>>15540861
IQ doesn't measure "success in the capitalist system" it is a robust correlate of G, general problem solving abillity. Roughly equal to processing speed in a computer. Read Haier, Neuroscience of intelligence (on libgen). This is not a controversial statement among researchers. It is also known that the heritabillity of IQ is .8 by adulthood even with twins seperated at birth.

You're right India isn't really a country, a centeral authority is completely out of pattern with their history and a leftover colonial fiction on it's way out. Regardlessly, the Indias has always had corrupt, unstable governments subject to intrigue and sons killing fathers. Despite mercantile tendencies their economic system has always been tax-heavy and exploitative, peasants lived in utter poverty and some have even equated the untouchables as approximate socioeconomically to slaves. India never say democratic tendencies, Depotism political was the norm until British Invasion

I'm studying Indian history from a HBD perspective.

>>15540940
Based hakan rotmwrt acolyte

>>15540002
Blame that survivethejive cryptokike and in part those kaliacc niggers, most of them cali mouthbreathing twinks

>>15540940
I am not contending the heritability of IQ. I am contending the validity of IQ, or g, as measuring what we call 'intelligence'. My contention is philsophical and linguistic, not scientific.

Also see: Bruno Latour's work in the critique of science as applied to this. An example- https://web.stanford.edu/dept/HPST/wchss02abst/sl.html

Democracy didn't exist in most of occidental history either, which was filled with the same exploitative structure of feudalism. Democracy, while it existed in Greece, was heavily criticized by the thinkers we respect today.

Also keep in mind that many Indian histories were written by Colonial historians who had their own axe to grind. I am not claming that the modern Indian identity is a leftover colonial fiction on its way out. I am closer to Fanon's analysis of colonial and postcolonial blackness.

Hello obsessive India posters, answer me this: how different (better or worse off) would the Indian sub-continent be if we hadn’t come in and mucked up cultural borders and territories?

>>15539333
I have to say yes, I visited for 6 months in 2016/17 and not other country compared. It’s a different world. Each state could be its own country.

>>15539443
Sikhs are the most arrogant Indians

>>15541063
Very very difficult to say. There would probably be many more countries there. Some liberalized, some democartic, others still monarchies. The region as a whole woul dbe much poorer. The geopolitic would be a mess.
Sort of like the Balkans, maybe? Perhaps under monarchies into the 20th century something like the EU might have emerged?

Who knows?

>>15540234
Lol they don’t let you forget this if you visit. I had strangers telling me how they’re “aryan” like I would fucking care.

>>15540601
>The Indian Govt is currently run by the political arm of a right wing Hindu organization.


This true. Modi is a dictator. When I was there they had devalued the currency so that was total mess, anyway I pissed off in a line up at a bank for an hour and I was talking to a guy in line, I said “do you think they do this in England? They need the British back her to sort things out.” Then he snapped, I should y have said it, but what he replied was “ACCEPT THAT MODI IS THE GREATEST PRIME MINISTER EVER! ACCEPT IT! SAY IT!”

>>15539383
what the fuck are you talking about and what book do i read to understand it

>>15540601
>Muslims in India have been extremely integrated and non-extremist for the most part.

Yes historically, however there is new extremism rising in the south western states. The ISIS flag was risen in Northern Kerala, because of all these Indians going to work in Saudi Arabia, they’re bringing back wahabism. When I was there I noticed lots of new madrasas. When I was waiting for a train hundreds of boys in Islamic dress got off a train that pulled in, all coming to the schools in the area. It didn’t look like India at that moment.

>>15540861
>You don't seem to understand what IQ is. IQ measures something.

>unironically sounds like an idiot.

Its a diverse country with a great appreciation for education.

>>15540582
>At least niggers have vitality
I bet you love their vitality huh lmao

>>15539617
Your first paragraph is utterly retarded.
>There is no technological development
Ok...and? Proof? Meaning?

>Despite a population of millions iq is low
What? Elaborate on that I wanna know your point

>>15541083
They also commit a disproportionate amount of crime in western countries. In Canada for instance they form the core of ethnic gangs on the west coast that wouldn't otherwise exist. The British rightfully considered them a warrior race, it has always been their trade and hasn't dulled. Sikhs also have a predisposition towards alcoholism which becomes drug use in the second migrant generations. Particularly bitter since their religion actually bans alcohol consumption

>>15541063
Without Britain India wouldn't exist. It would be a smattering of nations with a poverty level and history comparable to Latin America. The major nations would probably be:
-the muslim deccan
-the dravidian south
- the asiatic northeast in assam
-the northwest, which rightfully became pakistan
-bangladesh, which also rightfully seperated but prehaps this time with all bengal proper
-Hindu India itself in the ganges valley region and periphery
-prehaps an independent gujarat or rajput nation
-Independent punjab
-Separatist ferment in the adivasi regions southeast of the ganges that probably never goes anywhere

Britain created India's Infrastructure, India's communication mediums, a modernized (somewhat) agrarian scheme and an interlocking Indian market. It created a westernized middle class looking towards european notions of pan-nationalism. All of this allowed the congress party to form and seize the Raj. Without a single european rulership the races of India would never have intermixed or formed shared adminstrative units, they chafe at this even today. It is true to say Britain also dumped on India economically, kept the exchange rate artificially high and had an exploitative investment regime particularly under the EIC- but that's the price of civilization. Without the european invader India would probably have been Invaded by some other regional aggressor, prehaps eventually China.

>>15541141
read the 10,000 year explosion for a quick rundown. Read the Chapter on India and the neanderthal admixture in Reich's Who we are and how we got here. Read Murray's Human Diversity just for good measure. Start obsessively studying haplogroup migration routes like pic related. Multiregionalism is back baby

>>15539500
What a load of bollocks.

aren’t South Indians smarter than fairer skinned northern ones? The initial inhabitants in the south contributed to mathematics more

>>15540751
>This low intelligence, stemming from their failure to admix with neanderthals and relatively high proportion of african/premordial human blood is why it was conquered by multiple succeeding generations of foreign invaders bringing new innovation - the PIE, the Muslims, the British
I hope this is a bit or you received your education from /pol/ because most civilizations, including Europa were conquered so this is an inane way to measure intelligence, if you are even able to define intelligence lol.

>>15541347
>Without the european invader India would probably have been Invaded by some other regional aggressor,
Such as? Without British colonialism the subcontinent would simply develop independently as states compete for economic superiority, with many states likely developed to first world standards by now.
>the races of India would never have intermixed or formed shared adminstrative units, they chafe at this even today. It is true to say Britain also dumped on India economically, kept the exchange rate artificially high and had an exploitative investment regime particularly under the EIC- but that's the price of civilization.
Despite India having had civilization thousands of years before Britain? Go open up a book nigger.

>>15539333
yeah.

>>15541347
>kept the exchange rate artificially high and had an exploitative investment regime particularly under the EIC- but that's the price of civilization.
This is where the Western ego kicks in as well as the whole defanged Aryan invasion theory. I’m not sure how the Anglo lenses fail to understand there have been many civilizations in India before the EIC.

>>15541646
Delirium induced by the loss of their own civilization as they’re made to kneel to blacks.

>>15541671
*Assuming that’s even a Westerner and not a Pakistani/Chinese/various other groups with an axe to grind against Indians.

>>15541646
>defanged Aryan invasion theory.
What are you talking about, nobody disagrees that the IEs invaded India, how the fuck could they speak an IE language otherwise?

Even Indians cannot understand their culture. Most of the literate people never go beyond Dan Brown or Murakami. And the people writing in Regional languages are stuck in literary styles of 19th century.

India had a rich Canon, matter of fact Mahabharata is bigger than Odyssey and Iliad combined (still maybe 3,4 times greater) and is also far more complicated and Philosophically erudite (Though Iliad is great, never really enjoyed Odyssey much).
I have been reading about Indian culture a lot lately. I realized that Neitschze was right, we have to have some historical sense of where we are from. But it's so hard to even find writers talking about this shit. We don't have a Pynchon or Delilo to write about modern India, colonial rule fucked us good, we're stuck with English. The movies also suck big time, they were good when I was growing up in the 90s but now they suck.

The point about mercantilism and authoritarianism is valid but then again, there is a sense of community. People will help you if you really needed help, there is no such thing as loneliness in India, I lived in USA for a while and I was surprised how hollow most of the friendships and relationships are. to me it seems like the kind of bonding American people feel with their partners, Indian people get that same bonding from their friendships. What else? Songs also suck but they were better a couple years back.

The point about IQ is not that true, firstly because IQ does not measure intelligence and secondly even a low IQ person can make 100k easily and raise his standard of life (thereby making IQ irrelevant) if given proper opportunity. Now don't come back saying IQ is valuable in itself as some sort of platonic ideal, only faggots think that way. Underground literature scene is very much alive and kicking. People don't argue about unnecessary ideologies like what is better, capitalism or communism?

People believe in God, and you can easily find spiritual guru and become a monk if you wanted to. Racism is true but most people get along just fine. Politics sucks. We too have the same American virus of us vs them mindset which destroys all discourse.

>>15541683
IE’s != Aryan. The IEs were Scythian nomads who came in far after the proposed Aryan invasion happened

>>15541393
precursor races are iteratively less intelligent than their conquerers. India is egregious for outside influences:

-Iranian agriculturalists set up shop
-PIE invasion
-Greek Invasion
-Sakas Invade
-Persians just India multiple times, having Sind for millenia
-Timur destoys their golden age
-Mugals
-Indian therafter do mercenary work for foreign anglos to enslave their own people

It is very consistent. All-Indian nations do poorly, grow corrupt, and then fragment amongst each other into princedoms which are subdued in turn by the outsider. Missing in this picture is technological development, development of national cohesion, or any other state-building exercise on par with western development. This is dispite India being very similar to Europe superficially as a cauldron of war and many nations. The answer is simple: native Indians simply haven't been smart enough to invent. Blame it on the caste system, the multiracialism, or prehaps more dammingly their low tested IQ. Whatever- India has never been able to resist foreign invasion because of intrinsic weakness in their government. Almost all inventions come from the invader - Iranians the harappan sewers, PIE the wheel, Persians fundamentalist religion, Mugals gunpowder, Anglos industrialization etc. Even to this day the pattern is consistent- India modernizes only as a IMF western dependency. If it didn't have the loans and foreign advisers, it would decay within a decade like Afghanistan.
>https://vdare.com/articles/perhaps-surprisingly-indians-really-aren-t-that-intelligent-on-average
IQ is majority genetic. It predicts meaningful life outcomes and is the most well-validated construct in all of psychology. It is not equally distributed. Evolution didn't stop at the neck. You cannot understand history without reference to race differences

>>15541584
the constant in their history is that this just doesn't seem to happen. India under the Guptas was tremendously wealthy, this didn't stop them from dissolving in the typical fashion. Many parts of India are destined to rank somewhere equal to Latin America socioeconomicaly, many (Hindu northwest in particular) are not. You have to understand what IQ realism means for the prospects of India. Of course I've read multiple histories of India at this point. So maybe you should take your own advice

>>15541646
The nuanced picture is the Anglos allowed economic development but also constrained the limits. After colonialism growth under the five-year plans was much higher before crashing into the typical Hindu rate of growth cesspit. The neglected premise is that India simply wouldn't have industrialized without foreign invasion at the same rate ever

>>15541781
What do you think Aryan means? It refers to the founding race that Europeans come from, the IEs which includes the Iranians which includes the Scythians

>>15541805
How is your view of objective migration patterns this warped by the subjective semantics of the word Aryan. “Aryan” absolutely does not mean that. Go back to pol

>>15539470
>Obviously not. Papua New Guinea is way weirder.

You would have to be disappointingly limited to find India of all places to be peak foreignness as a Westerner. Indian thought, even South Indian thought, is so much like the European. And I think you have not penetrated very far at all into African alienness if that seems more accessible.

>>15541840
Yes that is what Aryan means, the founding IE race

one thing I want to rectify is this disbelief that the Average Indian isn't very intelligent. Most likely people are thinking of North American migrant Indians, who score around IQ 109. This is the elite of their society and come from Brahmin and other affluent castes. The fact that their elite places this low on the bell curve indicates the rest who fail to make it are much lower

Some commenters claim Brahmins are IQ 120 neojews. There is no evidence to support this claim, the people who wrote the Upanishads have long since been replaced by dysgenics. Their immense population growth rate (around a fifth of the world even in prehistory) meant there never was a eugenic pruning event similar to other regions

>>15541795
Pure psuedointellectual trite; here, look at Indian inventions:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_inventions_and_discoveries
Make an attempt to actually read this before you shit out more conjecture.

>>15541874
Their indians (America) have inventive output that is unmatched in terms of IP filed with the USPTO being commercialized. Their lateral thinking skills are probably higher than their seemingly low placement in the bell curve suggests

>>15541874
>This is the elite of their society and come from Brahmin and other affluent castes. The fact that their elite places this low on the bell curve indicates the rest who fail to make it are much lower
You’re completely making things up. US migrants from India are absolutely not Brahmin. There are a lot of Brahmins disproportionately represented in Indian American diaspora but looking at those Indians who are in executive positions in the S&P 500, most are non-Brahmin.
You don’t have any source for indians in America being Brahmin. Brahmin as a title is also meaningless for IQ and wealth. The Indians that come to USA are not rich by any means, they are middle class and come on H1B visas.
I am genuinely curious where you got the figure for “elite” “upper-class” Brahmins coming to the US rather than simple indians who scored high in IIT entrance exams and such .
I would recommend you peruse indian names in tech and see if they are Brahmin or not. Most Indian inventors with the USPTO are non-Brahmin as well
t. Work in patent prosecution

>>15541890
Oh yes, a list I'm familiar with.
>Iron pillar of Delhi
Ironworking brought by the PIE
>Stepwell
brought by pashtun tribals
>squat toilet
brought by Iranian agriculturalists
>compass
Brought by Persian seafarers
>mathematics
cobbled from the greek invasion
>various other menial inventions which never changed the course of history

what India didn't invent and had to adopted through invasion:
-gunpowder
-ironworking
-fundamentalism
-industrialization
-agricultural revolution (mind the early two-season system was grabbed from china)
-statebuilding
-free-market capitalism (work in progress)

>>15541956
Tell me; is European civilisation indigenous to Europe?

>>15541874
My parents are immigrants to San Diego and work in biotech there and most other Indian scientists/engineers here are not Brahmin. My parents came from a line of merchants (vaishyas) and most others here are a split between Kshatriyas and Brahmins and vaishays. I don’t see how you conjured this little bit about Brahmins representing the IQ bell curve for Indian Americans exclusively

>>15541919
Their output is based on the infrastructure built by Greco-Roman values (America)

>>15541984
The PIE cut their way into the region through war against the celts and other precursor europeans, there's no doubt about that. Around mid-1500 Europe becomes ascendant and generates the technology that now supports the modern world. The significant departures are that unlike India, Europe is never thereafter conquered beyond the immediate periphery and repells Invasions. The profile of threats is very similar- both fought the mongols, Europe survived Gupta India collapsed. Both fought the Muslims and persians, europe repelled them whereas India did not. Later Europe rises to export a winning formula across the world.

claiming otherwise is semantics at this point.

>>15541946
I'm weak on the diaspora. The IQ figures in India are not 109, the continent is 76.24. Even a radical environmental adjustment is not going to make that 100. The obvious explanation is that it's the elites migrating like in every other overseas community. Patel is an old surname I suspect dating to royalty for instance

>>15541956
>mathematics
>>cobbled from the greek invasion
Also this claim is bizarre and I can’t find supporting evidence so you will have to elaborate.

>>15542059
>Patel is an old surname I suspect dating to royalty for instance
Patels are merchant caste, not royalty. Shop owners, generally business men. Your claims are just so bizarre and built on baseless assumptions, but you are well written so people on here won’t question you

>>15542059
> Patel is an Indian surname, predominantly found in the state of Gujarat and Mumbai from the Gurjar community in India, representing the community of mass land-owning farmers and later businessmen, agriculturalists and merchants.
Ah yes Patel’s sure are royalty! You could do some research before making these objectively incorrect statements

>>15539383
>low intelligence, no neanderthal admixture

In the United States, from 2012, stated that 48% of Hindus had a household income of $100,000 or more, and 70% make at least $75,000, which is the highest among all religions in United States. Fuck off to /pol/.

Indian Mars Orbiter: It was launched on 5 November 2013 by the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) It is India's first interplanetary mission and it made it the fourth space agency to reach Mars, after Roscosmos, NASA, and the European Space Agency. It made India the first Asian nation to reach Martian orbit and the first nation in the world to do so on its maiden attempt.

Indians invented the number zero. Aryabhatta caculated the circumference of Earth to be 24 835 miles, accepted value today is 24 902 miles. Birthplace of Meditation, Buddhism, home to all the mystics in the world.


Fuck off to pol and keep spamming poo-poo toilet pajeet memes.

>>15540317
Based

>>15539333
Follow this account twitter.com/TIinExile if you want learn about India.

Everything is euro-centrism POV trash.

>>15542074
>>15542098
>>15542109
>the eternal Indian breaks down over caste distinctions
Implying Gujews aren't the wealthy and powerful regardless

>>15542177
>invaded by Ironworkers
>invaded by steppegroids
>invaded by gunpowder empires
>invaded by the angloid
Their tested IQ is 76- See the vdare article. Their national sciences program is considered a corrupt joke. Their academia is so rife with cheating that it is merely paper credentialism. Meditation seems to have been a religious practice predating buddhism and associated with the religion of Indian tribals. Buddhism is nearly dead in India proper (probably dysgenics when I think about it). 1 Nobel prize.

The actual future of India is a demographic rise of Hindutva under the BJP leading to balkanization. Indian century is totally happening, Krishna!

>>15542177
Indian-Americans are not representative of India. There is a reason the smart ones fled that shithole and are responsibly for the renaissance of data science

>>15542221
>1 Nobel prize
Nigger you’ve already been refuted.

>>15542270
>

>>15539333
why do people say there is no such thing as white culture? Because there isn't. Whites are spread across the world, every group of whites has a different culture, which changes from region to cities. Hence it is ridiculous to speak of one thing as a homogeneous white culture. White people are afforded this understanding by the modern world.

When it comes to other groups however, we stupidly cling to the idea of a homogenous culture. We say 'black culture', cherry picking gangster rap, baggy pants, singing in church and speaking loudly and ignoring the diversity present within blacks. In truth, it is as ridiculous to speak of black culture as it is of white culture.

India is a land of a million cultures. Forget cities, cultures vary by street corners within a single village. Westerners speak of 'Indian culture' cherry picking yoga, wearing orange, street pooping and spicy food and call it one thing. This is ridiculous and laughable. Please understand it makes sense to speak of the 'cultures of india'. Speaking of Indian culture and Indian thinking is ignoring the basic fact that there is as much variance culturally and in thought in India as there is among any other group of people. In fact India in particular has always been a land of debate and introspection. "Hinduism" as such has absorbed contribution from diehard atheists to monotheists and every other 'ist' you can imagine.

>>15542221
>Their national sciences program is considered a corrupt joke.
Is this why the most elite companies in the world (high cap company like Apple) poach indians from these very institutes and offer them 200K starting not including RSU’s? Importing indians on H1Bs reflects the technical superiority of indian IIT institutions compared to Western ones. IIT students find Cs programs in CMU and MIT to be a complete breeze. I don’t disagree with most of what you’re saying but Indian academics have a higher ceiling than Western ones by far and that is reflected by their over representation in cutting edge data infrastructure inventions

>>15542221
>Their national sciences program is considered a corrupt joke
They launched Mars mission on the first try.
>Their academia is so rife with cheating
You are confusing India with China. IIT grads take most of the jobs in Silicon Valley.
>Buddhism is nearly dead in India
He doesn't know about North East India.
>demographic rise of Hindutva under the BJP leading to balkanization
Good for Hindus to step up against Islamic conversion and Christian missionaries. This has not happened since Gupta Empire. Good for India.

Also this
>>15542201
This twitter account is GOLD to learn about Indian history.

>>15541388
both of the nobel prize winners in physics happened to be tamils. an ultragenius mathematician, Srinivasa Ramanujan, was a piss-poor clerk from a tamil Brahmin family. it's a good question desu

>>15542309
I'd say that Indian STEM academia has lagged behind the west somewhat. Recently I've started to see more papers coming out of Indian Universities (Electrical Engineer), but they still are few and far between. Whether this is because no one is really paying attention or because there isn't anything of note coming from there is not for me to say.

>>15542244
They are Indians nonetheless so your whole argument that “Indianz r dumb” doesn’t hold up.

>>15542309
I'd guess white multinationals are so desperate to fill diversity hires they'd rather import them overseas. There is a bell curve, there are smart Indian castes. I'm willing to consider some kind of elite competitive edge in CS prehaps because familes herd their children towards STEM fields. I just don't think this is reflective of the billions of other people living in India.

>https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748703515504576142092863219826
I can only pick up reddit-style gossip on how bad the university system is. But if a tenth of what I can skim for is true, it's bad. Entirely consistent with the corruption present in all Indian institutions, itself a historic trend.

>>15541874
why the fuck would Brahmins leave? do you realise that life as a brahmin in India is fucking lush?

>>15541725
Could you tell me about the underground literature scene?

>>15542352
>I'd guess white multinationals are so desperate to fill diversity hires they'd rather import them oversea
You are grasping at straws here. Indians are imported because of the skills gap. American native engineers do not have the same technical abilities and lateral thinking skills. Research the “skills gap” in tech. It is ongoing and accounts for indians overrepresenting the Silicon Valley. In every single Tech company my wife has interviewed for, the interviewee was an Indian man. Indians represent the exec boards of a lot of big start ups (think of Khosla ventures).
Man you are out of touch, not every non-white is a diversity hire. Diversity hires don’t run the Silicon Valley through nepotism and diversity hires cant be responsible for a huge chunk of the IP developed in high cap companies as well as start ups. Not every non-white is a diversity hire. Non-whites have demonstrated their technical superiority in the Silicon Valley for decades now

>>15542434
I can only speculate at this point, my readings haven't reached the diaspora yet- only India proper. But my guess is there is an affirmative action component and there is a stereotype about ethnic nepotism in the Industry. The initial hiring was also driven by wage savings. So, we'll see about that

>>15542352
>I'd guess white multinationals are so desperate to fill diversity hires they'd rather import them overseas
Yes sundar pichai and satya nadella are diversity hires, you absolute dolt. Are white people willing to do this many mental gymnastics when they realize all the elites in their academia and high cap companies in tech and biotech are largely of East and South Asian descent?
This is an unbelievable amount of cope

>>15539404
I wish I'd never made this post?

>>15542475
neither of these two launched their respective companies

>>15542177
hindustani ke America men rehte hain aam hindustani log nahin hain.

>>15542461
Wage savings yes, diversity no. But savings were up to a point. Most Indians in America are largely overpaid. Initial salary offerings are inflated to high hell.
Diaspora reflects the Superior technical Education that Indian institutions provide. Most software architects or project managers are indian 40 somethings in a company like google (where you’ll find largely indian and East Asian engineers at their Mointain view and SF campuses).
Why do you believe there is an affirmative action component when the output and capital generated by Indian engineers far outweighs that generated by native / white engineers? Indians seem to be generating a lot of IP in terms of startups. I just think spending a lot of time on 4chan has made you think that affirmative action accounts for all non-white hires, but this couldn’t be further from the truth when you look at how well Indians have excelled in corporate environments. I believe Asian-Americans also have filed a lot of Law suits because affirmative action disproportionately affects them negatively

Who are North Indian Brahmins descended from?

>>15542495
Sure, but I can point you to dozens of other Indians who have started unicorn companies. Indian Americans have founded 11 startups that are valued at a billion dollars or more, a per capita rate far higher than any other race in America.
> Actifio. Founder: Ash Ashutosh
>AppDynamics. Founder: Jyoti Bansal
>Bloom Energy. Founder: KR Sridhar
>Instacart. Founder: Apoorva Mehta
>Jasper. Founder: Jehangir Mohammed
>Mode Media. Founders: Samir Arora, Raj Narayan
> Mu Sigma. Founder: Dhiraj Rajaram
>Nutanix (my wife interviewed here) Founders: Dheeraj Pandey, Ajeet Singh, Mohit Aron
>Sprinklr. Founder: Ragy Thomas
>Zscaler Founder: Jay Chaudhry

These are also just companies with $1 billion evaluation. This doesn't touch the IP and capital generated by the many other Indian-American startups. Indians are not diversity hires in America, they are the ones starting companies and doing the hiring. I actually met the 2nd generation Indian founder of Robinhood once (Bhatt). He was an asshole but thats the Silicon Valley for you

>>15542333
Dalai Lama with his 150k Tibetan refugees were given a special permission to reside in Dharamshala, India.

>>15541725
Germans in the late 19th century were obsessed with Upanishads, Bhagvad Gita, Mahabharat and all the Vedic literatures.

Arthur Schopenhauer was deeply impressed by the Upanishads and called it "the most profitable and elevating reading which... is possible in the world". Nazis were the ones that were majorly influenced by Vedic literatures. Heinrich Himmler in particular. Lot on stories you can read on this.

Robert Oppenheimer, one of the creators of Atom Bomb quoted the Bhagavad Gita when the first nuclear device was tested at Los Alamos: “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.”

Former Trump advisor, Steve Bannon is known to be avid follower of the Bhagvad Gita and has said it has played a major role in formulating his strategies.

Western Elites have access to Vedic texts and nearly all of them admit it played a pivotal role. .

>>15542333
Dalai Lama with his 150k Tibetan refugees were given a special permission to reside in Dharamshala, India.

>>15541725
Germans in the late 19th century were obsessed with Upanishads, Bhagvad Gita, Mahabharat and all the Vedic literatures.

Arthur Schopenhauer was deeply impressed by the Upanishads and called it "the most profitable and elevating reading which... is possible in the world". Nazis were the ones that were majorly influenced by Vedic literatures. Heinrich Himmler in particular. Lot of stories you can read on this.

Robert Oppenheimer, one of the creators of Atom Bomb quoted the Bhagavad Gita when the first nuclear device was tested at Los Alamos: “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.”

Former Trump advisor, Steve Bannon is known to be avid follower of the Bhagvad Gita and has said it has played a major role in formulating his strategies.

Western Elites have access to Vedic texts and nearly all of them admit it played a pivotal role.

>>15542569

This makes the entire 4chan seethe.

How long will it take for India to modernize significantly. Last time I went I was impressed, the metropolitan areas, the transit systems, etc. All exceeded those of the where I lived in the US. However this wasn't the rule of course. The real magic was in the older architecture - the temples and what not. I hope India can modernize while holding on to that magic

>>15539333
India is a subcontinent of many peoples and languages.

>>15542569
Oh I didn't know Instacart was Indian - interesting. Why do you think Hindu or Dharmic culture places such an emphasis on academic and professional success? I understand Sanskrit and Hindi are scholarly languages so I suppose the emphasis on academics has always been prevalent.

>>15541725
>colonial rule fucked us good,
True but not British colonial rule, you were already disconnected twice over.

>>15542595
Spreading the Vedic texts outside of India was clearly a mistake

>>15542595
Why were the Germans so interested in the Gita and Upanishads? I've seen mention of it in the books I've read about Schopenhauer and can see the influence but why did interest in the literature spike?

>>15539333
>I swear I can understand unknown African tribe
Yeah, well, sub-Saharan Africans consider rape a form of normal courtship, they eat each other, and they worship bundles of mud and sticks. Not much to understand.

>>15542649
The British destroyed the Mughal textile industry which was the most productive in the world at the time

>>15542595
>Former Trump advisor, Steve Bannon is known to be avid follower of the Bhagvad Gita and has said it has played a major role in formulating his strategies.
Kill me now

>>15542626
Depending on what happens over the next decade. It could destabilise or experience economic boom.

>>15539333
India is the most authentic country in the world outside of East Asia because they retain their ancestral beliefs and culture and have not adopted the artificial hoax religion concocted by Saul of Tarsus.

>>15542662
literally homemakers with wooden spinners. The cope is real

>>15540940
>evopsych
>sociobio

>>15539333
India is a country of Jews and Gypsies.

Jews = Bhramins who have an avg of 115 IQ (on par with Ashkenazi Jews).

Midwits = Kshatriyas (sub 90 IQ)

Gypsies = everyone else (85 IQ)

Indian Bhramin are scapegoat for the societal failure just like European Jews. They are small, articulate and visible minority in a society. Bhramins are always a natural target.

This thread is proof that Indians are alien, what a fucking spastic mess of a thread. All you pajeets write like schizos.

india isn't foreign at all, it's just exemplified anglofaggot culture. it's all there. the intense economic stratification, the unwarranted chauvinism and nationalism, the literal fascist government that pretends it's anything but fascist. the pedophiles, the kidfuckers, the child rapists. literally all 100% anglo culture. they're just a product of colonization. the white man's gift that just keeps on giving.

>>15542515
Acha beta. Jis thali me khaya usi me chori?

>>15543053

>>15543053
Here we see the perfect manifestation of the white liberal's narcissism. Everything wrong with the world maps back to Anglo white men, for they are the center of the universe. One side says everything good India's got it got from white people, and the other says everything bad that India's got it inherited from white men.
Look at yourselves, my God.

>>15539383
>human biodiversity community tends to stay away because generalizing is hard
lmao

>>15543530
*generalizing India is hard

Imagine a country with thousands of different distinct tribal and racial groups. Try drawing conclusions about their history. Before the Archaeogenetics started revving up it would have been impossible, today it is just taxing

>>15543539
>>15543530
our country is more devine than ur media will ever tell u

>>15542098
>Your claims are just so bizarre and built on baseless assumptions, but you are well written so people on here won’t question you
He does it in the threads about eastern philosophy too, he is obsessed with Buddhism and is always attacking Hinduism. It's because he is Jewish, his status as an outsider in society makes he him resent and want to tear down existing traditions, he was some weird inferiority complex where he idolizes white people and at the drop of a feather will try to deride others for being non-white, but never claims to be white because he is Jewish, he always go's through the same post-modern pilpul deconstruction bullshit with everything he wants to attack, the one that really proves it is how he has a high verbal intelligence but completely lacks any wisdom or insight and is completely oblivious that people often notice and call out his vindictive and duplicitous behavior.

>>15543749
Except I'm r1b. Taking lessons in Indian history from poos is hopeless, they're far too ethnocenteric to admit shortcomings such as an average national IQ of 76. The Natsoc fixation on a dirt poor, servitor race is frankly pathetic

Fun fact: India took in Jews at their port cities as well. They never experienced comparative pogroms like western nations because Indians had already been backstabbing each other for millenia anyways

>"Fun fact: India took in Jews at their port cities as well. They never experienced comparative pogroms like western nations because Indians had already been backstabbing each other for millenia anyways"

>>15543449
Are you trying to say that Britain isn't a country with a 100% rate of pedophilia?

>>15539579
>we're
why listen to you if you're biased towards them?
>communalism
the rest of your points are fine but what the fuck does communalism have to do with the racial tensions?

>>15539333
U can understand a African tribe better because you are a nigger loving cuck

>>15544203
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communalism_(South_Asia)

>>15539333
Read these and thank me later

>>15544290
You think these dumb mullah and white cucks will read any of that .

>>15544317
Fuck off kike

>>15539333
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ok8qO9-uws

why does this site always go off the shits whenever someone mentions india

I have gone through the entire thread and just want to address some things.
I am in one of premier institutions in the country (IITs/NITs) and know quite a few pretty smart people. Most of them are middle class or upper middle class but literally none of them ever took an IQ test. These people come from the best of schools and families but never took an IQ test, so its logical to consider most others haven't taken one either (in my experience anyway). So what this national IQ of 76 that anon claims is based upon? Is there some other way of measuring the National IQ? Most sites I visited made a distinction in performance in tests and research work so surely it can't be based on that.

>>15541725
>colonial rule fucked us good

Uh...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAXPIhnQocM

>>15542660
Interest in Indo-European studies and linguistics. In their eyes, poos had as much to do with the Vedas, Upanishads, and the Mahabharata/Ramayana as current arabs in Egypt have to do with Ancient Egyptians.

>>15542626
Hard to say, there are so many people living everywhere in cities, I can’t picture it. Everyone does what they wasn’t, families living under bridges etc. Say in Delhi, you have Connaught place with all the western shops but in a darkened corner you had people shooting in and a kid taking a shit right on the corner of one of the busiest intersections in the city. Honestly I can’t picture it changing much. My parents pictures from the 80s look the same, it’s just that they have some modern buildings and things like metros now. When my parents were there in the 80s people were sleeping in the middle of the floor of the train stations, dogs running through them it was the same in 2017. Maybe in the next 30 they’ll get offf the floor...

>>15542644
Not who you asked but (some to most sects of) Hinduism places a great deal of importance on scholarly tradition. Most Indians are multilingual and if you read Hindu philosophical work its actually very good, they were having arguments about dualist vs nondualist nature of consciousness and shit like that well before western thinkers.

>>15539333
This has absolutely nothing to do with literature. At least have the decency to end your post with
>Books for this feel?
Like all the other retards posting off-topic shit.

>>15539386
Why do they have such an indifferent attitude towards shitting? Virtually every other culture in the world finds it amusing at best and taboo at worst, why do Indians just not give a shit about shit?

>>15539589
Post still got deleted tho

>>15541350
bet you say bollocks like you had whitey's cock in your mouth mr cuckinder singh patiala

>>15541946
>>15541874
>>15542355
this
a lot of brahmins think it's taboo to leave the country cause they think it will corrupt them and bring their downfall or something

>>15544663
they hate us cause they ain't us
as they say

indo-europe was a stupid meme all along
now indo-china that is a better meme

>>15544689
Nobody’s here for honest discussion but to spout pee pee poo poo jokes.

>>15544689
probably extrapolate it from ngo data that they collect from random slums across the country

>>15544663
A lot of people have an axe to grind with Indians. Americans for example lose their high paying jobs to Indians. In denial of their subpar performance they look for any way to discredit Indians.

>>15545073
Because you don’t know what you’re talking about

>>15545211
Nah we got them to fuck off. You can enjoy Tyrone’s cock in your mouth now however with the rest of your family.

>>15545364
stfu coonjabi i know you live in cannnada on whitey's gibs

>>15545394
Nigger your family probably subsists off my tax contributions.

>>15540601
>>This organization:
>Had members fascinated with Hitler.
>Hates homosexuality.
>Is a Hindu nationalism purveyor.
wtf i love india now

>>15545678
You are a hindu nationalist?

>>15545678

Half Indian half Irish here, living in Australia.

Personally I find Indians mindset easier to understand and more amenable to me than Australians

>>15539383
So, very similar to the UK then

>>15539383
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

just quit posting, anglos

>>15546000
Feel free to fuck off back, cunt.

>>15546000
Let me guess, Irish mother?

/lit/ - Literature

I used to work with an older Jamaican lady and the teenage son of a an Indian immigrant. One time they were both laughing and joking about how lazy and useless workers/employees from either North or South India were. I can never remember which though. Is there a large cultural split between N and S India, or is that a huge generalization?

>>15546768
There is a fairly large cultural split. I prefer S. Better Food.

>>15546528
Yes

>>15546768
Would bet money on it being the North. In fact, I'd bet my house on it being the North.
> dated punjabi girl
> didn't get to meet her parents for a year because they were so pissed that she was dating a "gorah"
> finally met her mum, spends half the conversation dissing me out in punjabi
> when i finally meet her dad he tells me to my face how white people are backward and lazy
> "What do you do for a living, Mr. Sandhu?"
> ... is literally unemployed, as are all of his sons and daughters save two