/lit/ - Literature

>>15513551
Why did Iranian's paint Shahnameh characters as Asian twinks?

>>15513551
>Iliad
>Not Odissey
pseud

>>15513562
Same thing. Probably would have been better if I wrote "The Works of Homer" instead.

Isn't there an African one it's like Sunjata or something. Note: I'm not trying to dismiss, I have actually tried to find a copy but it's hard. The

I can’t read any of those languages.

>>15513598
is it this
"Epic of Sundiata"

>>15513610
they are all still good in translation, ossian was nearly exclusively read in translation and became the most popular books in Europe.

>>15513598
>>15513619
and it is about the founder of the mali.

>>15513619
Ok what should I read first

>>15513551
> Kalevala - Finland
not an epic poem, just a collection of folk tales from the 19th century
> Iliad - Greece
legit
> Mahabharata - India (Sanskrit)
legit but quite recent
> Shahnameh - Iran
literary work like the divine comedy
> Nibelungenlied - Germany
you mean the edda? that is hafway between a literary work, a collection of folk tales and an epic poem. snorri was a christian. but i'll give you that.
> The Poems of Ossian - Scotland (Gaelic)
hoax, retard. at best a re-worked collection slof scottish folk tales.
You have read at least ONE of them?
all of them except for Mahabharata

>>15513641
ossian wasn't a hoax.
no one could ever prove it other than
"Scottish people are incapable of writing that well so it has to be fake."
>>15513628
homer's stuff.

>>15513641
>not an epic poem, just a collection of folk tales from the 19th century
that is what all of homers works are...

>>15513647
it's a bad manufactured romantic hoax.
macpherson didn't even bother to write it in gaelic.

>>15513641
what about manas?

>>15513657
yes he did.
he left his gaelic manuscript in London for an entire year and allowed anyone that spoke gaelic to come and read it. he even offered that if he had enough subscribers he would publish the original manuscripts he collected though not enough people subscribed so it wasn't published then. the first gaelic edition in the original form was published I think 100 years after he first published the original.
and it is impossible macpherson made it up it anyway he had to have translated it.

>>15513649
the homeric poems are 2 unitarian artworks employing local mythological material. kalevale is at best the mythological material. but whether it is actually mythological or just folkloristic is debatable.

>>15513641
>you mean edda
completely uneducated.

>>15513663
i mean a gaelic manuscript of the ossian, retard. of course we have a certain number of gaelic manuscripts.

>>15513641
confusing the nibelungenlied for the edda invalidates your opinion you moron
t. germoid

>>15513671
nibelungenlied and edda are equivalent in regard of this issue. they were written in the xiii century by postumous cultures.

>>15513551
Retard you've forgotten so many like Gilgamesh and the epic of Manas
>>15513641
>you mean the eddas
AHAHAHAHAHHAAHA
LOOk AT THIS FUCKING RETARD PSEUD HOLY SHIT AHHAHA

>>15513598
https://www.jstor.org/stable/3820580

>>15513679
Retard, stupid, idiot, faggot, cretin
https://archive.org/details/poemsossianinor00londgoog

>>15513689
it's the same cycle, edited from the same period, in the same linguistic area. i didn't read the nibelungenlied but im not expecting anything better than the edda

>>15513679
first.
he never claimed he found one huge manuscript filled with all the ossian poems and he also collected many sources by mouth.
that is what I said. he left his gaelic letters containing ossian poems in London for an entire year.

>>15513551
>Shahnameh - Iran
Where i can read it? Please help /lit/

>>15513724
>For an entire year
How gullible are you? “yeah bro I left them there for an ENTIRE YEAR and you didn’t read them so now they’re gone :3. should’ve read them then ;3. Nope you can’t see them now! :p”

>>15513692
those are made by brown people so they dont count

>>15513706
that is not a manuscript YOU FUCKING RETARD. it's translation from the english that macpherson produced after johnson, mackenzie, etc asked him the manuscript without getting any answer. YOU FUCKING RETARD.

>>15513730
he never took them back.
he sent letters to his previous subscribers asking them if they wanted to see the gaelic manuscripts published but not enough people got back to him so he couldn't afford it then the manuscripts disappeared without a trace but all the gaelic speakers said they were original books when reading them.
why are you treating it as if macpherson is the only source? none of what I said is sourced from him.

>>15513736
I listed the Shahnameh and Mahabharata...

>>15513737
Chew you havisfaction a singlicious satisfact to snack that up, faggot?
>i-it's a translation, there's a conspiracy!
lol OK anonymous, believe what you want you delusional idiot.

Wheres paradise lost and the divine comedy

>>15513737
no it isn't.
I can explain it if you want how it is impossible for it to be a translation.

>>15513750
give me the original gaelic manuscript and i will believe that the ossian is an epic poem. simple as that. until then, it's an hoax. about the literary quality itswlf of macpherson's hoax, dr. johnson has said it all.

>>15513647
>>15513706
>>15513724

it has literally been proved via network analysis that ossian's poems were stolen from 12th irish ones. the matches were, to an extent, near identical.

https://arxiv.org/abs/1610.00142

>>15513551
What about Tale of the Heike or Tale of Genji

>>15513727
This is the best version of Shahnameh in English. A bit pricey but seems worth it. They also produced a good audiobook.
https://www.kingorama.com/epic-shahnameh

The Penguin translation by Dick Davis is also serviceable. You can check it out on libgen.
These translations of course won't give you the true experience of epic poetry, but capture the eternal mythology behind it.
t. Iranian

>>15513771
yes because Scotland and Ireland share this big culture. but none of the poems he had were identical to the irish ones. this isn't new. people knew the similarities 200 years ago.
and it couldn't be for two reasons, one macpherson never went to Ireland nor had contact with any irish when published and two he couldn't read nor speak irish.
but here are the points listed.
1. there are many letters from macpherson asking help from gaelic speakers to translate this poetry from gaelic into English, because he wasn't fluent in gaelic.
2. there are parts of the ossian, in English, which are completely boring compared to others due to poor translation which shows he translated, for why would he publish something fake but make it poor quality. it shows he published all he collected.
3. there are records of him having a book "the size of the new testament" and another man certifies he gave to him a book "and inch and a quarter in thickness"
4.his poems in English are terrible. none of them of any decent quality. so it seems strange he would nearly magically become an amazing writer for only a short period.
5.there are poems that do not fit in with others and seem to completely degenerate from others
6. then if you say macpherson had someone else do it for him then you are again false since he knew no one who could write that well.

>>15513761
The original Gaelic is here >>15513706
He recorded oral stories (proven by the existence the Book of the Dean of Lismore) and then translated those into English. You have the Gaelic right there you fool, the published transcriptions he took from his travels in the highlands.
You made the claim that it's all fake and a big conspiracy and he translated it back into gaelic, so the burden of proof lies with you, retard.

>>15513797
actually that isn't the original.
it is the ossian but it went through some journeys.
so macpherson failed to get enough support to publish them. and then went away from the controversies. I think at this time the original manuscripts were lost and now only the copies remained. he was given £1000 to publish them by a Scottish aristrocat but he waited a year again and died. but he sent the money to a friend. he then sent that to the highland society in London and then they published it. I think this is the story for the latin one you have.
then it received by another man who was not happy with the gaelic quality since it had been "polished" with using some irish forms and shortening words, sort of like instead of writing "is not" they wrote "isn't". so he then fixed the orthography errors and so published the ossian poems in what is the closest to the original gaelic possible due to nearly all of the manuscripts it was based on being lost.

>>15513562

Odyssey is the sequel to the Iliad in Homero's Expanded Universe, duh