/lit/ - Literature

>>15382585
Charles Upton has written a two volume critique of dugin from a Traditionalist perspective.

>>15382585
More like Doogin

>>15382608
Well what's his central thesis and what arguments does he employ to back them up?

>>15382721
I don't know, I'm only aware of it, hate to be a shill but here is a rundown, he can say it better than I.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ivFvhMPfVHw

Who are these podcasters and what is their show called?

>>15382727
tldr, it's satanism

>>15382727
>I don't know
Then why bring it up? I'm fine with people not liking Dugin but you should have a real reason why.

>>15382585
who's the mouthbreather to the right of Dugin?

>>15382585
Russian speakers, please help me with Dugin's lyrics in his music

Is he worshiping the demon Astaroth, in his first song in this video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1c6lWP1TvA

>>15382778
Did you watch the video? Upton is a flake and even he thinks Dugin is stupid

>>15382585
Dugin is a meme, read limonov instead. He and dugin had the russian nazbol party in 1994 in Russia, and arguably limonov is the talented one, and his works are the ones with relative artistic value.

>>15382585
poopoo on the left, peepee on the right.

>>15382807
I listened to the first few minutes and I don't think he's outright worshipping it. He's describing his encounter with this astaroth thing and some vampire, seems like it's a vodka-induced vision as he uses the word "cиний/blue" (calling it the "blue señor") which is slang relating to drunkenness.

>>15382807
Ashtaroth were spawns of nephilim in the bible, is he some how referring to giants?
Doin’t bolsh in Bolshevik mean big?

>>15383071
Thank you, I don't speak Russian well enough to properly translate things like slang and written lyrics don't exist online, so I could only base it off what I heard while listening.

>>15382608
>from a Traditionalist perspective.
Lmao

https://youtu.be/7NlA8tCer9I

>>15383292
Dugin considers himself a Traditionalist too.

>>15383355
well, that just proves his satanism then

>>15382795
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergey_Kuryokhin

Why do incels tend toward this bad copy of a failed ideology as if it were something brand new? (probably because it's called 4th??)

Why is Dugin a sanctioned individual in USA? Pretty cringe from the USA tbqh

>>15382807
>>15383170
Google translate is mostly correct for word by word translation http://dpaste.com/0NSAA1F

As anon mentioned above "Blue" - whatever drankenness related
There is a slang "seeing an imps" meaning a mad outraging dude because of being drunk near delirium tremens level

*Follwing the plot*

The character stopped praying for many years and became alcoholic drinking up to "seing an imp" (Astaroth) -> The hellish gentelmen seems to be friendly and they're chilling out in hell -> A few emphasises of heresy with "fallen angels choir" -> they start playing a tarot cards and the character noticed Astaroth cheating -> Astaroth is trying to cheat disappearing a jack card ("durak" means both cards "jack" and a "fool" so there is a word play around Astaroth treating the character as an equal now trying to enslave him) -> The character now noticed the ugly part of Astaroth "This scary lord, nasty lord This blue lord Astaroth" but he still have a "zero lasso" card (which gives you an opportunity to choose your direction/destiny) -> "Oh my dear lord, oh my dear lord. Oh my dear lord Astaroth... The kingdom of darkness is my yard and house Guards me at the gate This blue lord, infernal lord This blue lord Astaroth" -> so yeah that's about a guy left G-d and with alcoholism fell into praying Astaroth

And it's mostly about russian identity crisis from the traditionalism perspective

>>15382735
Chapo Trap House

>>15383733
he is one of the most viscerally offensive individuals on Earth to the liberal academic.

>>15383421
National Bolshevism is not the 4th political theory

>>15383366
Third positionism, and by extension fourth positionism, are inherently satanic.
How some people haven't realized this yet is boggling.

>>15383733
>Why is Dugin a sanctioned individual in USA?
Even if I knew nothing of his ideology or writings, I would like him solely because he is primarily a sociologist, a former professor who got sanctioned by world superpower. What an absolute badge of honour.
>>15382917
Limonov sucked a negro's dick. He has nothing of value to say. Other Russia is megacringe

>>15385025
>Third positionism, and by extension fourth positionism, are inherently satanic.
prove it faggot

>>15385025
How is third position satanic? The second position and first position were born out of revolution against the natural and Divine world.
The first one in favor of the Enlightened (Luciferian) Man, in the great name of De Sade.
The second, in name of Equal Labor Unit distribution (what the enlightened man was reduced to in two centuries)...
The Third position is human/state symbiosis - and is the only one that resembles humility and dignity.

is there a connection with Rozanov?

>>15382585
what's the nazbol stance on birth control?
Im against birth control

>31 replies
>literally nothing of value

Hey, why don't one of you faggots explain what you find valuable in Dugin?

>>15385112
why not borrow from all different things you like and then have your own individual take on things you care about?

>>15385112
No control and anti-abortion agenda
Nazbal was a post-USSR reaction and the 4th geopolitical theory is a completely different thing tho

>>15382917
Limonov was an artist, not a theoretician. He was very inconsistent.

>>15383733
Because his ideas are a threat to liberal hegemony, which the US is at the forefront of.

>>15385121
Dugin has most clearly articulated an alternative to Liberal Capitalism in the 21st century. Moving past the old ideologies is essential.

>>15383366
What is Satanism in your opinion? Why is it bad?

>>15382585
QRD on Dugin and his ideology?

>>15385744
Dugin is a traditionalist Russian Orthodox philosopher who is presently an advisor to Putin and has written some influential books in Russia. His ideology is Fourth Political Theory, based on the idea of the 3rd political theory (fascism), the 2nd political theory (communism), and the 1st political theory (liberalism) all being outdated for the 21st century. Since the last two were defeated by liberalism in 1945 and then in 1991, a new political ideology is needed to replace liberalism, which takes the positive aspects of all previous political theories and combines them into one political theory.

>>15382585
>Dugin thread
We should make those more often

Btw is he literally creating Eurasian union here?

A channel with his work translated into English.

He just made a video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7Ufs5UMaHk

>>15382727
>hate to be a shill
So stop being one

>>15385953
>is he literally creating Eurasian union
Yes
Based on Halford Mackinder and Karl Ernst Haushofer "Heartland theory" Dugin developed multipolar (which is basically a rejection of universal globalistic laws, values and path to "evolve") geopolitical model with united post-Soviet republic as one of the sides
Highly influenced "Eurasian Economic Union" slowly but surely overlapping "Commonwealth of Independent States"

>>15385953
WMAF should be an irrevocable dogma of Eurasianism

>>15385736
bump

Is this really how he imagines the ideal world?

Looks kind arbitrary t b h

>>15386417
philippines is in china sphere? why?

>>15386417
I dont think he has such concrete images in mind, nor the expanse of some of these "spheres"

>>15385992
Noice

>>15386363
Lmao /pol/ thinks it is.

>>15385736
Trying to in any form reduce Christianity to be anything other than the absolute and unique truth one must follow for salvation. It's bad because it goes against God's will.

Pizdetz, why are you so damn stupid. For some reason, many alt-raites are convinced that Dugin is a serious philosopher, and Putin is the savior of the white race.
As a person related to the humanitarian specialties, I can say for sure that in the 1990s Dugin took drugs in large quantities, I would even throw one copy-paste here, where a former member of the National-Bolshevik Party told how Dugin behaved after taking drugs.
In addition, there are rumors that Dugin was gay in the 90s.
In Russia there is one television channel from which they kicked him out, and they say that it’s just for that.
Russian obscurantism has a beard and a holey ass.
And this is Dugin.

>>15387459
>Dugin is a serious philosopher
Dugin's works are part of the education of staff officers in Russia, that's pretty serious stuff for a supposed meme.

>>15387658
My bad, anon.

t. OP of that thread

>>15387506
As a student studying for a historian, I am obsessed with sources, facts and the rest of the same
Give me at least one fact that officers in Russia read Dugin’s books.
At least one proof!
I live in this country and I don’t know where the western alt-rightes got such nonsense from.
I need proof, otherwise it's all nonsense.

>>15387668
>I need proof, otherwise it's all nonsense.
Well, at least you are living up to your national stereotype.

That being said, based on your anti-Duginism, I'd wager that you are a liberashka living in Leningrad (probably a provincial with an inferiority complex as well).

You do you though, comrade))

>>15387506
If as proof you throw me a link to some Russian news resource, I will laugh in your face.
Maybe you believe the BBC? Or CNN?
Not everything that is written in the news (English, Russian, Chinese) is true.

>>15387668
https://foreignpolicy.com/2016/07/27/geopolitics-russia-mackinder-eurasia-heartland-dugin-ukraine-eurasianism-manifest-destiny-putin/

>>15387699
What do you want then? Me to find a syllabus for one of those schools or some shit? You're a retard.

>>15387699

>>15387688
dude, i will copy the last message here
If as proof you throw me a link to some Russian news resource, I will laugh in your face.
Maybe you believe the BBC? Or CNN?
Not everything that is written in the news (English, Russian, Chinese) is true.
dude I'm a conservative
and I’m not living in St. Petersburg) St. Petersburg has been called that for 30 years) Not Leningrad) St. Petersburg)
I'm a conservative, repeat
But Dugin is a pizdetz

>>15387664
Welcome

>>15387715
well dude, well seriously
the media can write anything))))))000)
would you know how our media constantly scold everyone except Russia

>>15387728
Spasibo, fren.

>>15387720
My main complaint against Dugin is that he does not have his own ideas. His ideas are a compilation of fascism, Rene Guenon, Evola and so on.

>>15387795
and I really don’t understand why to read something secondary

>>15387800
>>15387795
You can say that about literally everything.

>>15387810
it seems to me simple, at the moment his theory is a little .... well .... so outdated
he wrote his main works in the 90s
the situation has changed a bit ..

>>15382608
>Charles Upton
Opinion discarded

>>15387829
>he wrote his main works in the 90s
>the situation has changed a bit
Not really, Russia has improved but that's about it. Liberalism is still globally hegemonic.

>>15387852
You can try to find and read, if his work is translated into English, Galkovsky
although I don't like him either
I personally think that the Russian land has not yet given birth to a better philosopher than Dostoevsky

>>15387795
Eh, I am mostly interested in his geopolitical angle rather than his philosophy proper. Whichever ideals one might have, multipolarity is a prerequisite for revolutionary change occurring outside of the West.

That aside, I do agree that Dugin's views on their own could be summed up as a form of neo-fascism adapted to a post-Soviet context and masked under the guise of 'fourth positionism'. Doesn't change the fact that fascist rhetoric, when serving to deperipherialize Russia from the Western core of the world, is revolutionary in content and should be supported not only by the radical right, but also by the radical left.

>>15387881
it seems to me that just the opposite calms down
used to be two camps, two countries
USSR and USA
and they constantly fought each other
and now in connection with the fact that in Russia, too, such as capitalism, there is no need to fight
Now there are several alternative world centers that have their own interests
USA, Russia, China, Europe

>>15387912
I wouldn't put those centers outside of the West on the same level. They are regional powers with the potential of challenging Western hegemony at best (particularly China), but they are still part of a single economic world system.

The end of the Cold War has meant the triumph of the American center rather than a return to the age of competing imperialist powers, so Dugin's work should be primarily understood (and promoted) as just another voice among many challenging Western hegemony.

>>15387955
Western hegemony is already worn out, as it seems to me
China is threatening
one way or another, for example, Europe is returning to its eternal hungry state - a pack of fighting dogs
America made Europe beautiful and well-fed only as a showcase of capitalism and the American way of life, to demonstrate this to the Soviets
now it is no longer needed
capitalism is in Russia too
I'm definitely not a socialist
I sympathize with capitalism, but I cannot completely call myself capitalist

Someone give me a qrd on what Dugin actually believes

Everything written about him in English seems to have the same tone as they right about all right wing people in, so I'm skeptical.

>>15388025
See >>15385912

>>15387979
To a degree, it is worn out. Now we'll only have to see if the economic impact of the Corona epidemic will put the nail in its coffin. As to whether this will lead to a multipolar world or just a Sino-American Cold War, it's still too early to tell.

Europe as a geopolitical power could only work if it pursued eurofederalism, but I doubt its chances of success. More likely, the EU will collapse in a few decades (or be greatly reduced to its Western 'hard' center) and the politically sovereign (yet economically dependent) independent states of Europe will be no more than peripheries of the West, serving as markets for the same Western transnational companies.

BRICS and similar 'non-aligned' movements show some promise, but their constituent parts should equally develop as regional powers in order to pave the way for multipolarity, otherwise they'll be nothing more than an extension of Chinese soft power.

>>15386363
Eurasia is pretty much just WMAF tbqh

>>15388042
Ty senpai

Sounds interesting from that standpoint. What's a good starting point to read him, the Fourth Political Theory?

>>15388025
I do not know how to explain it
I am a Russian right-wing conservative, but in Russia, all right-wingers make fun of him
perhaps because all right-wing leaders in Russia were jailed
but he is not
he is, you know ... a talking head
rope doll
used by authorities
Well, he compiles fascism, Evola, Heidegger, Rene Guenon

>>15388053
I read an article from a western journalist basically arguing that Dugin's influence in Russia seems much bigger than it actually is to English speakers because of people like Lauren Southern

So rightwingers there think he's a government stooge, in that case?

Who do they like instead?

>>15388040
Do you know the term glocalization?
read interesting
maybe it will be
Actually, I would like a New Middle Ages
such a term is found in some modern philosophers and the modern Russian writer Sorokin
it would be interesting to look at neo-feudalism
just the same, I sympathize with feudalism (someone called me a retard higher, maybe even you)

>>15388066
Dugin is employed by the government as an advisor, he has influence. Many NazBols/WNs don't like Dugin because they view him as a traitor for aligning with Putin, conveniently ignoring that Limonov did the same thing, just a little later.

>>15388049
>What's a good starting point to read him, the Fourth Political Theory?
Yes, Michael Millerman, his official english translator also has some vids on him.

>>15388066
Russian rightists consider him either a puppet - or an ultra cringe meme
The philosophers from whom Dugin draws ideas may be good
but what he ultimately succeeds sounds like nonsense to many Russian right
To be honest, now in Russia there is a problem with right-wing figures
they do not suit many even in motion
in fact, the Russian right is divided into three waves
People from the 90s
People from zero years
A generation of modern (10) Russian right
And they are all very different in views
I can say that in the 90s the Russian right are typical fascists
used by the then president of Russia Yeltsin
Now they exist, but are not active.
The Russian rightists of the beginning of the 21st century are typical skinheads and Nazis, often just hooligans and football fans who loved to fight
they often even had no leaders and ideologies
But they were the most active
Every year, Russian marches were organized, which gathered 50 thousand people
in 2011-12, many of the activists were jailed
Russian right 10s is a versatile audience
And right-wing liberals (classical liberals, not modern ones), there are both traditionalists and just conservatives
But they live more on the Internet
The question of who the Russian right reads ... what are their idols and leaders ... a difficult question
There are several bloggers
GromPo
Utopian
There is a philosopher streamer who is Russian right
There is a young one politician who is a national democrat
Recently Russian nationalist Krylov died
There is Galkovsky
Although in my opinion they are all a little bit cringe

>>15388073
Didn't call you a retard, though I do think that you are being utopian. 'Glocalism' cannot prevent the disintegration of cultural specificity in the face of consumerism and the international trade of commodities. Only way that it could work would be under an isolationist (either willingly or imposed as in the case of countries such as Iran) system with a great emphasis placed on economic (and consequently cultural) autarchy, but I don't think that it could be properly implemented in a reformist manner and even less so that it would be desirable.

Still, I believe that (many) Eastern conservatives have their hearts in their right place, so I wouldn't belittle you for your views.

Come home, Soviet man.
https://youtu.be/uIiDPq8p-7g

>>15388148
What made you a rightist if by your own admission most of the Russian right to date have been cringe fascists/hooligans?

>>15388164
one day the comrades of east and west will drive out all the librtards
and we will all meet on the Elba River, as in the year 45

>>15388165
when I talked about hooligans, I had in mind the Russian right from the zero years, the beginning of the 21st century
I’m probably just a conservative
who wants the usual "American dream"
home, work, family, church
why am I a conservative despite the fact that there are many current Russian right are cringe?
Honestly, I myself do not fully understand
Probably from hopelessness
no normal alternative
sometimes some good thoughts are voiced among conservatives
I’m probably also a conservative, because I am a person who believes in God
it seems to me that in general it’s quite important for a believer to maintain “the way it was before"

>>15383733
Because of his role in the Crimean conflict

>>15388226
The absolute madman.

>Foundations of Geopolitics basically says that one of Eurasia's main goals should be to make Europe their bitch and chop it up into zones of influence under pressure

The sad thing is that our governments in yurop are probably cucked enough to allow this at the moment

>>15388232
What does that say?

>>15388235
>Ukraine needs to be cleansed of idiots. A genocide of cretins suggests itself. Cretins who are virulent, closed for the voice of Logos, deadly and … in addition to this, extremely stupid. I don’t believe that these are Ukrainians. Ukrainians are a fine Slavic people. [But] these are some race of bastards that emerged from the sewage.

>>15388233
Europe is already under control of the US so nothing would change.

>>15388243
Based as fuck

>>15388247
True. It's bizarre that joining all the great powers of the last millenium together in one bloc made them all weaker. Who would have thought that Portugal, Spain and Holland would be reduced to cuck status

Ok guys. I'm Russian and I read Dugin at the age of 14-15. After 7 years, I reread some of his books and that's what I consider the best in his bibliography:

>The Philosophy of Traditionalism
The best book about traditionalism in Russian. Based on legendary lectures:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5OFJEDdGbI

>Absolute Homeland
If Rene Guenon became Orthodox Christian.

>Templars of the Proletariat
About the chthonic side of Russian socialism.

>Conspirology
Continuation of Guenonian studies.

>Logos and Mythos
It's as if Gilbert Durand came to the Caucasus or Tatarstan and began to study folk epos to tell us why Putin is based.

>Postphilosophy
Tyпo paзъeб.

>Martin Heidegger
Just a good book about Heidegger. Must read.

>>15388340
oткyдa?

>>15388274
Not to mention Britain and France.

>>15388340
>why Putin is based
Lesser evil, but not based in the slightest.

>>15385121
I know, it's very disappointing.

I have to wonder how many of them have any familiarity with Dugin's ideas. What I find fascinating about Dugin is his engagement with Heidegger's "other Beginning" of philosophy and his work regarding metapolitics and superideology. An apocalyptic inversion of Heidegger's politics of identity and crisis actually give me motivation for a path forward, and the framework of a long-game horseshoe type political and cultural project give me the tools to actually work on it.

I forgot which of his works it was, I believe an excerpt from his book "Knights Templar of the Proletariat", but he had a section about principles of historical engagement. Very empowering, basically a radical application of Heideggerian ideas of Volk and Being-with about a community of human beings who find themselves in the same socio-historical situation and then resolutely take up their specific heritage and actively give place to their proper place in history.

>>15385992
oh shit thanks

>>15385992
Good catch!

>>15388351
Tы пpo гopoд? Mocквa.

>>15388351
>>15388454
Я нeнaвижy нeгpoв

>>15388525
Чoмy? Ecли cидишь в тpeдe Aлeкcaндpa Гeльeвичa, тo ты дoлжeн пpидepживaтьcя бoaзoвcкoй aнтpoпoлoгии.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=E7trsy11auM

>>15385992
I'll have to watch this later

>>15387688
Go back to Krautchan, faggot Duginist.

>>15387688
He told you to give him proof, and you responed by saying, "Haha you need proof? Fucking liberal haha."

>>15388340
>If Rene Guenon became Orthodox Christian.
Boт этo нacтoящий фaнфик.
>Guenonian studies
B кaкoм cмыcлe? Bepит ли Дyгин в "пpимopдиaльнyю тpaдицию" oтличнyю oт пpaвocлaвия?

>>15389409
Oн дyмaeт чтo пpaвocлaвиe чacть пpимopдиaльнoй тpaдиции

>>15388340
Uhhhhhhh BASED?

>>15388634
>тo ты дoлжeн пpидepживaтьcя бoaзoвcкoй aнтpoпoлoгии.
Heт.

кaмoн, нy Дyгин жe тoчнo мapиoнeткa

>>15390391
Кoгo?

>>15390391
Cнaчaлa были дyгинcкиe идeи Eвpaзии, пoтoм ocнoвaниe EAЭC и взятия Oceтии c Кpымoм
Лoббиpoвaниe Aфpики тoжe c плeчa Дyгинa идёт, иccлeдoвaния дo 4-й пoлит. тeopии включaя пocлeдниe тoмы Hooмaхии кaк paз пpo нee
Tyт eщe ктo, чья и в кaкoй плocкocти мapиoнeткa

>>15382585
Can someone explain how a political theory based on dasein would look like in practice?

>>15389409
>Bepит ли Дyгин в "пpимopдиaльнyю тpaдицию" oтличнyю oт пpaвocлaвия?
Пocмoтpи этo видeo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVtsuAfC-oI

A вooбщe eгo "Кoнcпиpoлoгия" этo cкopee coциoлoгия, иcтopия peлигий и пoлитoлoгия. Дyгин иcпoльзyeт гeнoнoвcкyю oптикy, чтoбы oпиcывaть иcтopию тaйных зaгoвopoв и эзoтepичecких yчeний.

https://youtu.be/km2vxHU4vuw?t=224
schizo poster incoming don't know if anyone knows this but dugin is subversive think tank, your a "literal" tool if you follow him.

>>15382807
His music is actually really good. That’s unexpected

>>15390398
of our government
i don't write in Russian, cause i'm frightened of ban

>>15391253
lol, does putin track your IP?

>>15391397
He probably does. This anon has not been a good boi lately shittalking Dugin an' all

Bump

>>15391021
I don't think you can read, you can barely type

>>15391021
get rekt

>>15382585
How many American alt right figures went to personally visit Dugin?

In my country, this man, he is nothing.

>>15394260
do you live in african country, bwoy?

>>15382585
It's just soviet imperialism masquerading as different ideologies.
It holds no appeal to anyone it ought to and is only throwing out ideas in hope something sticks.

>>15394346
I am from Tuva Republic

>>15382736
it is tho

>>15394260
>>15394432
Дyгин пoвлиял нe тoлькo нa Пyтинa, нo и нa вceх pyccких зyмepoв-гyмaнитapиeв, ecли чтo.

bump

bump

can someone give me the tldr of this guy and his politics philosophy or whatever it is you guys are arguing about?

>>15397784
He hates liberal thought. His whole philosophy revolves around refuting and possibly surpassing liberalism.

>>15397784
See >>15385912

>>15397784
Russia good
Anglosphere bad
Simple as

>>15382585
a friendly reminder that all the guenon-fags are russian troll brigade fags

>>15382614
Doogin? Yeah, more like Flewgin

>>15385912
>which takes the positive aspects of all previous political theories and combines them into one political theory.
is this really accurate though? I haven't heard him express it like this, at least

>>15398487
He bases the fourth political theory on Hegelian dasein. But yes, he incorporates some features from the previous pts

I trust Dugan

>>15382585
>Dugin
>No schizoposting
delete this thread then

http://www.4pt.su/en/content/horizon-ideal-empire

Is this guy insane?
Wtf did I just read?

>>15399165
>Farmers will have nothing to be taught besides bossa nova and tango. They are already so wise in their sacred labor.
Based.

bump

>>15399165
Racist and sexist much??

>>15382585
What's so funny, cuck

>>15399165
>Philosophers will fly and skate on dolphins, who will also be philosophers.
What did he mean by this?

>>15399308
kek

Read Heidegger.

>>15386417
That's literally retarded. Ukraine being a thing, Finland being Russia while Balts are not. Also that Kaliningrad oh lol wtf is this shit. What happened to Australia?

>>15386417
>The severity of this autism

>>15399165
>People, intimately knowing Stalin, will testify to his extreme simplicity in being. For example, they will tell of how he, at the zenith of his power, preferred to sleep on a cot. Another communist ruler of imperial scale, Mao Zedong, tried to never touch money, which he hated physically. The very thought of money or touching it caused him physical pain. These are signs that an angelic presence is close.
WTF I love Dugin now?

How is this not based?

>>15403507
Who gets africa and latin america though?