/lit/ - Literature

>>15374708
I'm feeling pretty good atm, think its just you.

>>15374708
I would say it's a contributor. But also nihilism.

>>15374708
Communism is more likely to lead to suicide

>>15374708
I dont think it's the root cause but it definitely doesnt help that much.
Fisher was in a really tough spot I think with how the NHS and his teaching jobs were working out. DFW switched to some crackpot psychiatrist who transitioned him off of his TCAs even though he was used to those without extremely close follow up. In general if a psych drug is getting replaced as the first line with another ostensibly better drug due to side effect profile, and the patient in front of you has been doing fine with the side effects, you dont want to switch them even though it makes you seem super smart and updated compared to the last guy.
Dont go to female physicians, I'm serious. They have major chips on their shoulders and their interprofessional competitiveness hurts patients every day.

Yes

>>15374708
Generally yeah. The whole modern world is allegedly erected for our comforts, but its simply slaves lodgings, slaves entertainment, a slaves life. In the past forty years the ruling class has been eating away at the slaves shares of their labors. A labor surplus has been made worse with outsourcing and automation, so they’re becoming more and more careless with our health and general well being. The food is thoughtlessly tainted with poisons which also factors in why we see more mental cases.
And it’s crumbling apart when it didn’t have to.
>>15374711
You feeling alright that the US is heading into a depression because you’re not from there?

>>15374750
Nihilism ain’t shit.

>>15374767
You don’t know the meaning of the word

>>15374767
It doesn't "lead" to anything. It's not fucking real. It's never even existed outside of some irrelevant 19th century ideological dogma and CIA psyops used to extract wealth from South America.

We’re not in capitalism right now. The state deeming who is essential and non-essential is literally a seizure of the means of production. The solution to this is not anti-capitalism and more state control, that’s literally the problem.

>>15374784
>You feeling alright that the US is heading into a depression because you’re not from there?
That might be it but my country is capitalist too. Honestly i think you niggas are just whiny, life ain't that bad.

>>15374708
How good do you expect life to fucking be? You can have a pizza delivered to your door in 30 minutes or less, and the poor bastard who runs the company that does that has to live a nightmare every day thinking about about pizzas so you get your stupid fucking pizza.

How about some gratitude?

>>15374708
Sin is, as Christ leaves so does good

>>15374817
Getting cool stuff does not create happiness.

>>15374817
>the mind of a consoomer
whew

>>15374793
nihilism explains it all. nietzsche served it up to us on a platter. jews and academics spent the entire 20th century trying to fill the hole with science and that got us to where we are today (no where). why do you think catholic integralism, neopaganism and other esoteric spiritualism is making a comeback?

yes. “comfort” in the modern age really isn’t “comfort”. it’s more like a self-made prison.

>>15374864
>>15374872
Speak for yourselves, fuckwits. I hope you're all exiled. Make money, cum buckets, this is what it's all about. BOOYAH

>>15374804
What country?
Yes, people in this country are all sorts of whiny. The plastic twits walking the miniature dogs or going to the gym, or the impoverished ones eating their way to obesity where the have to ride around in scooters. They’re a mess because of capitalism though. The incentives of this system make the awful people. I’ve been observing it and reading about it all my life.

>>15374892
I'm not against people having cool stuff. I simply believe you need more than that to live a fulfilling life. Be a hedonist consoomer if you really want I guess.

>>15374892
Grim

>>15374708
no
cultural marxists are

>>15374873
Weakness.
I was existentially angst ridden in my agnostic phase, but nihilism didn’t bother me for more than a week. Seriously, it’s like clouds blowing away. You’re missing the clouds and scared of the color blue if you’re bothered by it.

>>15374930
>cultural marxists
i love you fuckin retards so much

>>15374708
It’s the technological society, not any one permutation of it. Read Ellul

>>15375047
I don't see this so-called "better society" that all the luddites rave about. The past was shit. The present has its problems, but the present is superior.
I love the atomization of individuals, I love being in control of my own destiny, I love absolute freedom, I love politics and interpersonal back-scratching bullshit being replaced with "It costs $5.99."

>>15375047
The technology of the 1800s was pretty rank too.
He advise we go back even further?
No, it isn’t technology. It’s the motivation the capitalist system.

>>15374936
Seethe harder tankie

>>15374708
yes

>>15374708
No. The democracy is making you all depressed.

>>15374799
Fucking this. What an unconstitutional fiasco.

>>15375068
It’s not just the tankies that are laughing at this stupid faux concept and all the Alex Jones watching Rascal riders Out there who buy it.

>>15375052
>>15375063
Read Ellul and you wouldn’t be embarrassing yourselves so much right now

>>15374750
nihilism is such a fitting word for what it defines.
just say it
nihilism
nihilism

nihilism

>>15375077
>>15374799
This isn’t even happening, much less is it the cause of crippling depression and suicide.
We are still using capitalism. DC is handing trillions to the wealthiest people, the capitalists. You wanna call it “corporatism” others want to call it “late stage capitalism”, but that’s all the same. It’s capitalism

>>15375081
I just debunked ludditism. You’re the one who should be embarrassed.

>>15374817
rhymes with: schmedonic schmepression

>>15375103
Trade isn't supposed to be regulated by the state under free market capitalism.

>>15374708
Open competition among companies to provide me with products and services that make my life more convenient and pleasurable has objectively, empirically, measurably, and irrefutably made my life better. So basically, seethe more Chapotraphouse and GTFO my board

>>15375123
The existence of states precludes free market capitalism, which has never existed.

>>15375150
>The existence of states precludes free market capitalism
Utterly irrelevant.

>which has never existed.
It has existed in a far greater capacity in the past. Right now, it doesn't exist at all. The whole "the state needed to intervene because of the crisis" is bullshit, they made it worse. Whatever happened to the libertarian movement in this country, the one that FOUNDED the country? It's completely gone.

>>15375163
it's alive in a few counties in New Hampshire; that's about it

>>15375137
My board. You get off, consumer boy.

>>15375163
>It has existed in a far greater capacity in the past
Yeah, the earliest stage, but here’s why it’s not irrelevant. The state supports capital, enforces property rights, prints the money, supplies the enforcers. Some people think you can separate the two, but it’s impossible. But even if it was, the wealthiest will always BUY their way into more favors of the government. This so-called “socialism for the rich” bs will ALWAYS happen in this system. Ready to go full an-cap? Have it all privatized? That still won’t work. Give it some thought, man. Please.

>>15374708
total boogeyman. the answer is no. if anything, i am banking on capitalism pulling me out of depression.
root cause is: no gf, ugly, squandered my youth. that's really it. but maybe if i'm rich i can numb the pain.

>>15375215
You poised to strike it rich, are you?

>>15375230
>You poised to strike it rich, are you?
not miraculously. just have a well paying job, and hope I can make the right investments.

>>15375239
China?
https://eand.co/the-american-economy-is-imploding-and-america-is-too-e998d3cfb1d9

>>15375239
Oh boy, you’re in for a rude awakening

>>15375239
>job not career
Sounds like you settled. I hope your cope isn't pierced.

>>15375210
Well if it isn't butterfly bitch. Up late tonight eh?

>>15375239
/biz/ poster here

>>15375109
>>15375052
>I love being in control of my own destiny, I love absolute freedom
If you actually understood the extent to which technology affects your life, you wouldn't be posting this sort of nonsense. A person living 400 years ago had far, far more personal freedom than anyone alive today. The only "freedom" you have exists within the constraints of an extremely controlling and restrictive system. You've spent your entire life surrounded by and acclimated to the bars of your cage to the extent that you don't even realize what they are.

>>15375257
What were my freedoms 400 years ago? Take a piss in the woods? Eat a fig from a fig tree? Play the lute?

>>15375257
Technology is made so intolerable and restrictive in this world, but not for its being created, rather for the system we inherited. IE statism/capitalism.
Lower technologies of the past have been used wisely from time to time, but also unwisely. There was environmental devastation in the age of coal and steam

>>15374708
Lefties blame the inherent suffering of life on capitalism.

The kinds of problems I see lefties ascribing to capitalism blows my mind. They basically explain it to be the Christian perception of "Satan", and all suffering in the world descends from capitalism. Even shit that is 5 degrees of separation from anything economically related, "it's capitalism!"

Of course capitalism kinda sucks these days. But holy smokes, the suffering of life is far more nuanced than capitalism

>>15374708
No, but secularism is.

>>15375341
We consider it and trace the causes of particular social ills. A hurricane obviously isn’t capitalism/statism’s fault. The tardy effort to aid hurricane victims is caused by all sorts of sickness found in the system of statism/capitalism. Do you really not see it? Dilapidated schools are not caused by bad teachers, cancerous water supplies aren’t caused by the color of the community’s skin. Politicians aren’t all crooks because of some defect of the soul that could be repaired if they all attended church.

>>15374708
Industrial labour, not capitalism. As much as I'm no believer in the Marxist theory that mankind only finds purpose in labour, I do have to admit that labour becomes meaningless when I cannot see the the people whose lives I'm improving, and I can't hear their thanks cause I'm locked in my wage-cage. We always find it easier to act in morally pleasant ways when we get praise for what we do. Morality relies on the idea that a reward for certain actions is highly likely, if not certain. Industralism takes away this moral component from labour; with industrialism, we work only out of self-interest, and that is ruinous to our mental health. We are social creatures and therefore like it best when we can live for others without interference or economic imperatives that radically conflict with our social existence.

So modern life is therefore characterized by continually being forced to do meaningless tasks just to survive, but with the key factor that survival is often the only goal of our work. We are warped by this experience of the concrete jungle; an artificial state of nature produced from the routines of industrialism.

>>15375261
You could build a house and start a family in the woods and yell nigger as loud as you wanted and the FBI wouldn’t stake out your house

>>15374708

>>15374708
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-X8T6vYkLI
Get FUCKED commie trash

>>15374708
>us

Who? Left-leaning whites? Might have something to do with how 'we' think of the society, not the society itself.

>>15375381
once again, you are describing the inherent suffering of life, which descends from the individual's tendency towards corruption.

You are going to suffer greatly if you sit around waiting for institutions to help you, this is the psyop of leftism. The leftist believes they'll change their life if they can just get a socialist into office, or build a revolutionary movement that never comes. Then in between the elections they just waste their time on politics, going nowhere.

People have to do things themselves. Especially now, the state/food/water/clothes is only going to continue deteriorating. People have to start growing their own food, getting their own water, making their own clothes, and getting the fuck out of the fucking cities already

>>15375341
You'll gain IQ points if you stop viewing things as surrogate religions

>>15375485
>stop viewing obvious religious substitutes as religious substitutes
Why would I do that

>>15375480
This is always the unspoken conservative fantasy, some kind of disaster so things reset back to "the good ol' days" where huntin' rabbits and growin' crops is the way things get done.

>>15375496
Blame existed before religion numbnuts

>>15375502
>This is always the unspoken conservative fantasy, some kind of disaster so things reset back to "the good ol' days" where huntin' rabbits and growin' crops is the way things get done.

City dwellers are so disconnected from reality they think stuff that huge portions of the world still does is an apocalyptic fantasy

Has nothing to do with an apocalyptic reset. The supply chain is fucked and like lefties say, capitalism is cancer. Why would you just sit there miserably suckling on the tit of a rotting system, crying and bitching about it, praying for Bernie to save you, when you could easily just start doing shit yourself

>>15375510
>before religion
>the man in the white labcoat told me this while diddling me

>>15375518
You could 'obviously' make good use of those extra IQ points my man

>>15375480
>the individual's tendency towards corruption.
Money corrupt. Remove it. Go on. How would we measure our wealth without money? No one person owning more than a reasonable home and lifestyle. I’ll tell you. Our wealth would be measured in each other. Who we know, who we’re friends with. Instead of sociopaths ruling the world, the friendliest will inherit the world.

>institutions
I’m not a progressive liberal. Bernie isn’t my savior. That’s not Leftism.

>>15375480
>People have to do things themselves. Especially now, the state/food/water/clothes is only going to continue deteriorating. People have to start growing their own food, getting their own water, making their own clothes, and getting the fuck out of the fucking cities already

How do people accomplish that under capitalism and no I'm not talking about just you as an individual - lets say like 33% of the population?

>>15375582
Socialism

>>15375582
It's probably easier for smaller groups to do this than it is for individuals, just due to the benefits of a division of labor and economies of scale.

But in general, find some inexpensive arable land. Purchase it. Homestead on it. The hippies managed to develop communes. Before that the USA had hundreds (if not thousands) of small utopianist groups (Brook Farm, Oneida, La Reunion, etc). Acreage is relatively inexpensive once you get away from the coasts.

Though not as inexpensive as it used to be, alas.

>>15375605
>once you get away from the coasts.
More socialism!

>>15375620
O..k....? Not sure what you are getting at there butterfly.

>>15375624
(many of those utopian communities I refer to were pretty explicitly socialist. Though based in Fourier's thinking as opposed to Marx's)

>>15375103
Current system is not state based capitalism, its a state run by private capitalist interests.

Capitalism is the belief reinvestment to amass capital gains, its in the name.

When was the last time UK and US truly put emphasis on investing in itself. China is more Capitalist than the US.

Depression/Suicide is inherent to the human condition. The more we try to fix depression the worse it is going to get.

>>15374708
Absolutely. We all know it’s true. Leave now and take up a 3rd world lifestyle and your sanity will be retained. Stick around and you’ll have a chip in your head shocking your dopamine receptors 24/7, with your consent of course, which you’ll give. Capitalism is a necessary step in the evolution of civilization. The step after it is on a downslope. Collapse now and avoid the rush.

I think Mark was wrong about some things like music culture. There is still a ton of great new scenes out there with new sounds

>>15374767
How can you say that if we haven't lived until it. Being communist under capitalism doesn't mean you live under it

>>15375576
>Money corrupt. Remove it. Go on. How would we measure our wealth without money? No one person owning more than a reasonable home and lifestyle. I’ll tell you. Our wealth would be measured in each other. Who we know, who we’re friends with. Instead of sociopaths ruling the world, the friendliest will inherit the world.
Right, this is the revolution that never comes. This plan hinges on things completely out of your control and that aren't going to happen.

Sociopaths will likely always rule the world on and off, because they have a unique drive to dominate over populations of dependent people.

>>15375582
>buy an acre of land for $10-20k
>build the smallest cheapest house you can (even tiny homes are a decent alternative)
>buy some chickens
>make a garden
>get a water well pump or collect rain water
>buy stuff from people who make their own shit

Right there you are self-sufficient and it costs less than renting in the city.

>>15375515
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-rUIjVS9os
Agrarianism is the right idea, but luddism is not. Agrarianism needs to incorporate technology and be brought into the 21st century.

>>15375637
Nonsense

>>15375687
wrong vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvmxxEs5_zo

>>15375687
>Agrarianism is the right idea, but luddism is not. Agrarianism needs to incorporate technology and be brought into the 21st century.

Sure utilize tech however you see fit. I'm just saying. disconnect from the supply chain and do your own shit, the government isn't going to improve anytime soon

>>15375684
It’s out of my hands because it needs many hands.

Sociopaths have a “unique” set of tools. Money, law and bootlickers.

i'm super depressed because some guy owns a factory, it should be owned by The People, if that were the case i'd be less depressed

>>15375697
>It’s out of my hands because it needs many hands.
Delusional narcissistic savior complex, thinks you're going to be a messiah to a broken world and overthrow a colossal beast system by posting on /lit/ all day

>money
acquired by working with other sociopaths
>law
gridlocked with sociopaths
>bootlickers
the majority of the population in on way or another

>>15375695
My ideal society would Free and Open Source Software movement fusing with agrarians/survivalism to make self-sufficient holonic communities.

Just think of making a self-replicable open source science fiction Mars habitat, but do it on Earth instead. All technology should be free, transparent, and open source.

>>15375714
How do you use tech to make self sufficient communities

>>15375721
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptlhgFaB89Y
You make a 3D printer that can print any part you want out of a super cheap "monomaterial" like some kind of carbon fiber.
Then you make a forge that can forge that monomaterial out of crap lying around.
You make a 3D printer that can print other 3D printers and forges out of that monomaterial.

>>15375709
>Delusional narcissistic savior complex
Are you sleepy headed or what? It’s the exact opposite.

>>15375725
extremely based

I need to learn more about tech, all I know is some basic html/css

>>15375725
Crucible, not forge, w/e. The point is that you combine hacker/maker/foss culture with farmer culture and then you have technoagrarianism.

pseud thread

>muh localism
>muh lefties
>muh ancap
>muh 3D printers

I read all of Fisher's work and seen hundreds of patients with depression. He is missing the point as is every anon in this thread.
Dogmatic view of nature/nurture or biopsychosocial model where they all stem from is just that. A model and a dogma. Its a theory and a flawed one.

Critiqe of current state od things basing itself on a preposition that "muh it makes me melancholic" and showin stats for depression is the biggest flawed strawman that seems to be, sadly, going to dominate discourse for some years now.

>>15375794
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdDXjyjAAGE
I just want to go back to the early 2000s and pound goth chicks.

>>15375794
You may be on to something, anon, but at least clear your thoughts up first.

Idc how much you drank; you can't expect people to follow the logic of a drunkard unless you type your points clearly and concisely.

>>15375825
I just woke up if this thread is still up in some hours I will try to formulate it a bit better

Now a time for coffee, a walk, pullups and some talks with my family

Yes. People find fulfillment in creative expression and social relationships. Capitalism leads people to slave away at unfulfilling jobs, and it makes them less social. It also can be a self-esteem killer for anyone working bad jobs, making under $50K.

>>15374708
absolutely, i am from a thridworld shit and almost everyone is miserable these days. because they have to think about money all the time, it's fucking depressing. you people wouldn't believe how much pessimistic they're about future.

>>15375052
All that says is that you're a shallow idiot and proud of it.

>>15375576
Money is an extension of the power of the human intellect. You can't remove it without losing something vital about humanity and preventing individuals from trading with one another and growing as individuals. We abstracted it in the past in order to preserve and protect the values of the intellect, like creativity and passion, from the crude values of the physical. It's been the backbone of civilization since it started.

>>15375794
What is anti-dogma? State your alternative. Or do all alternatives turn into dogma?

>>15374708
It's just chemicals in the brain bro

>>15374708
Yes.
Read this
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/perlman-fredy/1969/misc/reproduction-daily-life.htm

>>15374799
Based retard burger libertarian brain

>>15374799
under capitalism the state is the capitalists

test

>>15374767
[citation needed]

>>15374799
>it's not real capitalism
>it's not real communism
can you faggots shut the fuck up already

>>15374799
>The powerful elite of the state slapping down on workers who sees as non-essencial is anti-capitalism and a seixure of the means of production.
Just because the state is doing some intervention to help the capitalist machine in the long term doesnt mean you've seized any means of production and abolished private property.

>>15374817
>the poor bastard who runs the company that does that has to live a nightmare every day
Yeah, thank god the rich faggot who runs the company in his desk type job earning more in a month than many of you do in 5 years.

>>15374708
No.

>>15374892
hedonism is not an answer, your soul will rot

>>15374708
Yes. Essentially our environment and working conditions evolved into something more comfortable, but they're nonetheless oppressive and extremely competitive, which enables strong individualism and strays us further from communes and thus happiness. Not to mention the identity capitalism creates for us once we turn into plain cogs in its machine. Anyone who defends this filthy system of slavery is either at the top of it, a total brainlet, or a sociopath.

>>15375449
Industrialism and mass production is inevitable, it's the system of labor that didn't evolve that's causing us some problems.

>NOOOOOO HE HAS MORE MONEY THAN ME

Pseuds always focus on the money. They never realize that it's the "equal rights" nonsense that fucks them over. Democracy kills nations throughout history, wake the fuck up already.

>>15375670
please name a few

>>15376705
It’s a spook
You couldn’t be any more liberal.

>>15377072
Well put

>>15377120
Pseud that you are, you can’t even see that capitalism, money, buys democracy out. There is no democracy where there is capitalism.
Read a book

>>15377360
>There is no democracy where there is capitalism.
There is no capitalism right now, there is just democracy and socialism.

>>15374708
No. There is nothing wrong with Capitalism we are just living in a spiritual crisis. Capitalism has literally raised millions out of poverty.

>>15377292
Athens

>>15377404
Capitalism has stages it goes through, your “free market” phase was a lie and is done. “Socialism” as you see it, for the rich, isn’t socialism.
Voting is not democracy.

>>15377407
Liberal brain rot

No, the technological system does.

>>15377481
I find it obtuse and reductionist to blame those stages on capitalism itself. Society is more complex than just its economy. What has changed more drastically than anything else in Western societies isn't the result of capitalism but of democracy. Said societies have becoming decreasingly capitalist in the last century because they've been usurped by criminals who blatantly disregard the laws. Were these criminals brought into power because of capitalism? No, they were brought into power by socialists, who were brought into power by democracy.

>>15374708
Yes but the older generations chose this for us.

>>15374708
You're depressed and suicidal because of yourself. Capitalism is a label that you externalize bad feelings onto.

>>15374799
You can tell libertarians are disgusting morons because they haven't even bothered reading the supposed core texts of their movement. It's just a meme to bait the agrarian working class and urban petit bourgeois into supporting neoclassical economics which is, you guessed it, thoroughly unlibertarian.

>>15377540
The accumulative nature of money that supports unjustifiable hierarchies has been whats plaguing humanity since the beginning. Don’t talk to me of advances in “civilization”.
But here you seem to be making a case for monarchy. As stupid as advocating chattel slavery’s return. And a disingenuous charge that socialists caused the revolutionary age!
Ha! Yes, thing are more complex but you’re not fooling anyone.

>>15375210
The free market necessitates the state retard

>>15377610
The number of spooks in this post is off the charts! Is original thought even happening? Is anon's mind swimming in a sea of symbols?

I'll definitely be happier once things change. My unhappiness has nothing to do with me, it's all a product of my environment. I'd be on top once things change. I'd finally be happy, no doubt about it.

>>15377643
Try reading a book brainlet usually too high a bar for libertarians unless it has pictures or some moralistic anecdote.

>>15376993
Butthurt poorfag

The industrial society makes you depressed. A communist industrial society would be just as depressing as a capitalist one.

>>15377670
Take a deep breath. Try to go 1 day without using any "-ology" or "-arian" type words, or French words for economic classes. Go to the park and look at ducks. Return to the present. Abandon these abstractions, they are making you retard.

>>15377613
There is no accumulative nature of money. Money is defined by the value of the assets being exchanged for it. That is capitalism. Usury is anti-capitalist, monetary systems which no longer derive its value from the assets being exchanged is anti-capitalist.

Capitalism does not create unjustifiable hierarchies. That's like saying that assets create unjustifiable hierarchies. I have assets, the value of my assets is dictated by others, and I set the price for them based on that value. I willingly exchange them for that price. I barter if I see a good reason to do so.

What creates unjustifiable hierarchies is socialism. I have assets, which have been obtained by inheritance, talent, or work. It is the socialist who relinquishes these assets and changes how they are valued. Now there are people who possess assets they did not obtain by inheritance, talent, or work, and the value system falls apart. Exchange falls apart as a result, and money becomes something of a means of control rather than a means of exchange.

Democracy allows those with no connection to the exchange system to infiltrate it and manipulate it in order to orchestrate their own goals. They undermine and destroy the exchange system from within. Everything goes to shit once you extend your hospitality to the wrong people. It always happens this way. Democracy, the naive generosity of the "good man," is the real problem of the world.

>>15377686
Clear well defined terms are useful for analysis. The Agrian classes is obviously a joke at how backwards most of the US is.
If you opened a book you'd see how neoclassicsts like Mises, Hayek, Spengler, Friedman use these words with slightly different points everywhere. This is what libertarianism boils down to: anti-intellectualism and moralism, which is unironically considered a spook by libertarians themselves.
You haven't put forward a single argument because you do not have one, because you haven't bothered to educate yourself in actually existing libertarian thought: you're going to wait a long time for the free market to not make you an imbecile.

>>15375735
Based. I like the idea. Technoagrarism when?

>>15377613
Money does not have an "accumulative nature". People can accumulate money or potatoes or balls of yarn or whatever they want, it doesn't change its "nature". What hierarchy is not based on accumulation of such and such resource? And how do you "justify" it?

>>15377756
The libertarians are not in the room with us. It's okay! The abstractions can't touch you!

>>15377805
Capital is abstract brainlet

>>15374767
lmao you made them come out of the woodwork, based.

>>15375725
https://www.opensourceecology.org/gvcs/
though I guess one could always improve the blueprints for those machines.

Now, the thing is that you need people that are:
knowledgeable with the crafts, have something akin to an engineering education, or are heavily tech inclined. If you were to pretend to populate such a town with people who never laid a brick or can't lift a 50kg concrete bag, you're in for a rude awakening.
Sorry for being rude but I thought it was necessary to mention, plans and idealism are fine and dandy but imho it's necessary to have some screening regarding who gets in your tech hacker eco village.

Being said that, I was thinking it would be neet to attempt this in one of those european villages are are for sale for 1 euro, get your people and talk to the local govt and see if they let you do as you wish as long as they can provide (at least at the beginning) the utilities.

In exchange iirc they ask you to keep the whole thing accesible to tourism.

>>15374767
how so?

>>15375515
good post. I'm so tired of city nerds acting like lifestyles even just our grandfathers were living are some kind of video game-induced apocalyptic fever dream.

>>15374708
No, it's that we still maintain baby torture as legal, and then don't ban all positions of institutional power from the victims / practitioners of it. The grey cube / suit 'n tie culture is present among communists as well, because their ideology is shaped by that trauma.

>>15377855
Every label you throw at me is just the spooks in your brain jerking you around, "libertarian," "capital," you just can't let the abstractions go. They have cucked you out of your own mind

>>15377686
Based and mental health pilled

>>15374750
The only nihilists are the people in the graveyard

>>15374799
What an absolutely retarded take. The state did not “seize means of production” lmao.

>>15377682
Guarantee you’re either a child or a bootlicking Walmart employee

>how will the alternative to capitalism provide the same quality of life that only capitalism can? checkmate!

there are human beings who think this qualifies as an argument lol

>>15374708
No, we're increasingly insane because we were supposed to have Communism (and have it fail) - it's as if history didn't go how it was supposed to.

People who overthink life are suicidal. This is the brutal redpill.

>>15374708
Depressed, yes. Suicidal not so much, because suicides are more correlated with alcohol consumption rather than economics.

>>15378122
Good post

>>15377728
>Usury is anti-capitalist
Stopped reading there
Pick up a book, this is the /lit/ board after all

>>15374708
I feel like it’s primarily a result of consumerism, not necessarily capitalism. Most socialist societies in the modern age are also extremely consumerist. People are encouraged to associate happiness with material goods, and to value happiness above most other things. When those material goods fail to deliver, they are confronted by the fact that they’ve wasted a great deal of their life pursuing pleasure.

>>15374767
The only reason you'd think this is a relevant retort is if you cannot see any other alternatives than communism and capitalism, which actually plays into Fisher's point about capital realism. The question by the OP and your statement can both be affirmed without contradiction, bucko.

>>15378478
It’s more about the materialist/hedonist world view that has replaced our old idealist values that depress us. The most important thing to modern society now is maximizing pleasure, and when you are emotionally mature (most aren’t), you begin to realize the depressing nature of general modern value-system

>>15378493
As our actual actions in the day-to-day have become completely dominated by the system of production and consumption, our make-pretend political world puts more and more emphasis on the concept of "justice." The political expression of the times, is like the yelping of a dog being kicked.

>>15375687
> technological agrarianism

>>15374708
Capitalism incentivizes antisocial behavior and turns men into hungry ghosts

I forget where I read this view but it was an evolutionary theory on suicide. The theory goes that suicidal thoughts are triggered by a person's shared 'group' mind where at the macro scale a person's usefulness to group is seen as insufficient. In other words your awareness of the group bundled with your objective uselessness triggers thoughts for you to off yourself in order to benefit the groups overall fitness. As peoples jobs get automated and other jobs are the obfuscated to the point of bs more people become useless to the group.

>>15374708
Why do Marxist/Commie retards like to blame every single thing wrong in their lives and society on capitalism like Christcucks blame everything on sin and the devil?
>Lost all my money at the casino?
Fucking capitalism
>Broke because I spend too much on alcohol and drugs every weekend?
Fucking capitalism
>Crashed my car and now have to pay to fix it?
Fucking capitalism
>Stubbed my toe?
Fucking capitalism
>Morning toast was burnt?
Fucking capitalism

>>15378590
The simple answer is that certain personality types do really well under capitalism and other personality types don't.

>>15378127
So what is literally telling all businesses and firms what they should/shouldn’t do? Telling land owners they can’t invite people into their restaurant. Sounds like command economy and seizure of production to me. What is your definition of seizure of production?

>>15378607
The view that you're expressing here doesn't allow for any nuance in the control spectrum. Surely you recognize a practical difference between the government saying when you can operate, and the government swooping in with armed men and literally taking the physical property from the owners.

>>15378475
>Pick up a book
Okay, which one?

>>15374708
Idk why but yes I am suicidal

>>15378621
Not that anon but if you want the libertarian angle on interest you might consult the relevant chapters in Mises' Human Action or Rothbard's Man, Economy, and State. I'm not here to explain or defend them however

>>15374708
Capitalism is so close to the best system.
Stupid flaws of capitalism:
1) You can buy land once and own it forever.
Solution: Georgism
This is retarded. Ground rent and geoists are right on the money.

2) Externalities, you can shit in a river and it's someone elses problem.
Solution: Subsidiarity
Local jurisdictions should have the most authority. The people nearest to you have the most control over you because they have to deal with your stinky factory.

>>15378639
I'll check them out. My commentary on usury is based on this excerpt from Adam Smith:

>The legal rate...ought not be much above the lowest market rate. If the legal rate of interest in Great Britain, for example, was fixed so high as eight or ten per cent, the greater part of the money which was to be lent would be lent to prodigals and projectors [promoters of fraudulent schemes], who alone would be willing to give this high interest....A great part of the capital of the country would thus be kept out of the hands which were most likely to make a profitable and advantageous use of it, and thrown into those which were most likely to waste and destroy it.

>When the legal rate of interest, on the contrary is fixed but a very little above the lowest market rate, sober people are universally preferred, as borrowers, to prodigals and projectors. The person who lends money gets nearly as much interest from the former as he dares to take from the latter, and his money is much safer in the hands of the one set of people than in those of the other. A great part of the capital of the country is thus thrown in the hands in which it is most likely to be employed with advantage.

>Now before you say this approach discriminates against the poor, banks like ShoreBank of Chicago, and not for profit mortgage lenders extend credit to lower income individuals with loss rates in line with prime borrowers, It takes (gasp) borrower education and in person screening, something most banks eschew.

Not that I'm trying to make the case against you, since you say you're a different anon.

Current reading (and discussion) of Fishers Vampire castle

https://youtu.be/t4zcapqd_iY

>>15378664
I used to be a libertarian but I'm broadening my horizons and I'm not really sure where I stand on usury at the moment, is the main reason I don't want to defend them. I guess if I had to explain it in a post-sized nutshell, they view "usuary" aka ridiculously high interest as something the market will autocorrect due to the signals of people getting pwned by usurious rates. They see the prevalence of usurious rates in the real world today as the result of government intervention leaving people without options

many hardcore libertarian views follow this ideal-vision pattern because they derive from a priori principles

>>15378138
I’m neither and I also think you’re a butthurt poorfag

>>15378616
https://www.kwtx.com/content/news/Texas-sheriff-faces-calls-to-resign-after-bar-owner-armed-protesters-arrested-during-protest-570271881.html

There isn’t really a practical difference currently. Technically you may be right but the current outcome is the same; people can’t work unless the government lets them.

>>15374708
Liberal individualism is. Capitalism is part of a larger problem.

>>15379106
I'm sorry you're too retarded to function when given freedom, but you can hire a dominator to beat the shit out of you or whatever under a capitalist system. So go do that and keep me out of your need to have a daddy tell you what to do beyond age 18.

No. Capitalism is by far the best system humanity has ever had.

>>15374708
You’re just a meme machine trading in shitty memes. Get better memes machine

>>15379150
>t. has only ever known capitalism

now this really walks those walnuts

>>15379150
Indeed

>>15375510
Psychologically speaking, communism is just a substitute for religion, despite its pretense of being 'scientific'.
Read Hoffer.

>>15374799
the state doesnt deem who is essential and non-essential..

>>15374817
This

Life is shit to begin with i dont know what alternative these people want

>>15375257
>muh technology boogeyman!

you people are pathetic it doesnt matter what system is in place you would find something to whine and complain about.

>>15379385
>Ive got fucking cancer aah it hurts im dying
>"Bruh you're such a whining bitch, even if you didn't have cancer you'd find something else to complain about"

>>15374817
>How about some gratitude?
no lol

>>15379223

Sir this is a /lit/ board, we read history here. I know that word repels leftists but it’s the truth, i’m not being abrasive.

>>15379272
Who did then exactly?

>>15375257
>A person living 400 years ago had far, far more personal freedom than anyone alive today.
>have to till the fields of the lord for 350 days a year, can till my own for a fortnight, will die at 30 after working 18 hour days since the age of 5
You can criticize the present without glorifying the past. Just one hundred and twenty years ago, the work week was close to 80 hours.

>>15374708
No. Depression is tricking you into thinking the problem is in the world instead of in your head so it can continue to survive.

sometimes when i'm at the supermarket or a retail store and i'm standing by the register having my stuff scanned by a slightly depressed looking girl, i wish that i could just chat her up and we could hang out after her shift to take her away from the miserable shit job she has
but there's always people in the queue behind me

oh well

>>15380496
Those people wouldn't mind. :3

>>15374708
Communist subversion of every facet of life and culture is doing that, pic related
Ever notice how communists try to invert reality and think that if they say accuse someone else of what they're guilty of first, nobody will call them out?

>>15374793
>>15374794
>>15375674
>>15378488
Nobody gives a shit about your semantics and pilpul. "Communism isn't real/means something else!!" communists are real and your statement does not change their behavior or its consequences
"how do u kno it's bad!" because they behave like sneaky, subversive, murderous, censorious weasels and people who act that way don't have anything of value to offer

>>15374708
these sòycucks offed themselves because they were losers, not because of capitalism

>>15380568
>mentally abuse multiple successive generations of children especially boys
>deprive them of intact families, communities, nations
>throw them into public school gulag
>destroy the economy so they have no future
>blame them for being hopeless and lost
Boomer. Pass the buck onto the least powerful person and wipe your hands like they created the problem by themselves in a complete vacuum. '2 working eyes arms legs? You're not depressed just lazy.' Complete mental failure. Dementia. Treason

>>15380568
Losers in what regard? Both of them made a lot of money and held positions of power within their respective fields, therefore being successful winners in the capitalist sense.

>>15379123
The fact that you reduce this to my perceived flaws as an individual and your perceived superiority as an individual shows how deeply your mind has been warped. A society composed of independent rationally self interested individuals has never existed. Communal identity is both inevitable and socially beneficial. Failure of a state to foster and shape these identities results in toxic and dangerous identities. Liberalism in moderation can help promote cultural/technological dynamism and economic growth, but full blown libertarianism has never been a viable ideology outside the minds of its zealots.

>>15380548
Communists are REAL I've SEEN THEM

>>15374708
It certainly has a negative effect(along with technology) in the sense of community men used to have

>>15374708
Byung-Chul Han's analysis is one that makes the most sense to me. He theorizes the concept of burnout and traces its implications for mental health and society. Capitalist culture drums up a fast tempo of stimulation and productivity. This is a mode of being which stresses positivity to the point of delirium, gone from it are the breathing spaces, the "in-betweens" where one can find sanity and normalcy in just being in the present. The human subject has been fragmented through multitasking which prevents the contemplative repose which extends the self from happening. As a result too much time is wasted in a bewildered, centerless state of consciousness.

The educated worker of today is also trained to constantly be in self-competition. "Thus, the achievement-subject gives itself over to compulsive freedom, that is, to the free *constraint* of maximizing achievement. Excess work and performance escalate into
auto-exploitation. This is more efficient than allo-exploitation, for the feeling of freedom attends it. The exploiter is simultaneously the exploited."

You see it with this whole commodified notion of internet celebrity. Celebrities are nothing if model consumers, and have the ideological function of presenting the illusion of a carefree, glamorous lifestyle connected to the brands they associate with. The whole idea of a social media influencer is a way to create the illusion of a more democratic and achievable celebrity in order to more deeply embed this regime of commodified hyperstimulation. Aspiring young professionals are expected to take on the role of cultivating a personal brand image, their work is double, energy must be expended both in the realm of image and reality. Exhaustion, depression, and attentional disorders are not uncommon byproducts.

Why do so many people think the alternative to capitalism is full blown communism? Why not capitalism with more regulations?

>>15381217
The alternative to capitalism is capitalism? Mindblowing.

>>15381217
Because that's not an alternative, it's merely an (intelligent) adjustment.

>>15381217
We already have too many regulations. More regulations translates to promoting big corporations who are the only corps that can afford to pay lawyers to read piles of regulations.

Do you think the status of power of big corps is too much or not enough? More regulations means you think it’s not enough.

>>15381217
The only alternative to gabbidalism is Epicurean lepidtopteranarchism

>>15381235
Oh shut the fuck up. You know damn well that there's no place for small business when the goal is a monopoly. Fact is if you start a business today not intending to sell out you're a fool.

>>15381227
He probably means shit like welfare, like the scandinavian countries.

>>15381235
You are acting as if there is no regulatory scheme possible that could rein in corporate power when everyone knows this isn't the case

>>15381252
Well at least you acknowledge more regulations = pro-monopoly. So are you intentially an oligarchic fascist or has reddit not been very helpful in refining your ideas?

>>15381268
I don’t doubt there is, but the government has shown they’re incompetent at doing so. Another means/method is required.

>>15374784
Another whiny fag who spends too much time on reddit.

>>15380469
No, it's completely the other way around

>>15381276
The proposed benefit to capitalism is competition; a competition that gives the winner a monopoly. Regulation can be applied to slow or reverse (think breaking up the banks/alphabet/apple/amazon) the journey toward monopoly to allow for the conditions for competition to take place. Now will admit it's possible to use regulation to hamper competition (the regulations placed on the USPS which require them to prefund retirement for employees they have you to hire is a good example), but that's an issue with a particular regulation not an issue inherent to the idea of regulation. Nice try tho

>>15381393
They have yet to hire*