/lit/ - Literature

>>15273583
My experience with greeks was quite short - I've read a couple platonic dialogues, concluded that the man was mentally retarded, and moved on

start with greeks if you want to read philosophy
screw greeks if you just want to read fiction from XIX, XX, XXI century

>>15273583
I started with Descartes because that was the first unit in my History of Modern Philosphy class.

>>15273583
I started with Corduroy.

>>15273583
Anon... You know thats just a meme, right?

ofc not you think im gonna let some frog faggots determine my intellectual life? get a grip

>>15273583
I'm still on the Sumerians desu

Yes. I followed the chart pretty closely. It was a slog at times, but I pick up on more references in everything else I read.

>>15273766
Holy autist

>>15273729
Based.

>>15273583
we did, at high school (they make us study philosophy for 3 years).
presocratics > bruno, first year
descartes > kant, second year
schopenhauer > popper, third year

>>15273583
Nah, I started back when the greeks were not a thing.

>>15273583

I started with Bertrand Russell

>>15274156
That's sad.
It's already very effortful to wash off the bugman conception of history and philosophy as is.

>>15273583
I did then went back and forth for awhile

>>15273583
Yes, and I enjoyed it.

>>15273647
Me too, then I read Plato.

I started with the Illiad and one of the plays of Oedipus Rex

Will probably read the Republic and Nicomachean Ethics (or however it's written)

>>15273766
I’m having a similar experience. Always had an interest in English poetry and now having read some of major Greek works a lot of it makes a lot more sense.

>>15273660
It’s a good meme. It doesn’t take all that long to read, for example, Edith Hamilton’s Mythology, Iliad & Odyssey, and Herodotus’ histories, and if you’re already interested in western literature you’ll find it well worth your time, along with the fact that they’re all enjoyable works in their own right. Although Greek philosophy is a bit more of a time commitment, and doesn’t offer much to casual readers, so I’d understand someone generally uninterested in philosophy skipping that.

>>15273583
I started with Nietzsche and Stirner and now feel like the final boss of the world

I didn't but went back.. I am at the Romans.. Fuck I wanna read self insertion isekkai web novels again bros

>>15275213
Starting with those lunatics must be a tragedy.

>ywn be able to start with the Egyptians

>>15273583
Start with the paleolithics

I read Iliad, Odyssey, Last Days of Socrates, Edith Hamilton's Mythology.
I had to stop in the middle of Mythology because it had spoilers for The Iliad and Odyssey. The chart is kinda bullshit in that regard.
I'll probably read Plato's Republic, Herodotus' Histories, and Metamorphoses, and then more or less move on from the greeks/romans.
Obviously though, you don't read exclusively Greeks for a whole year or more when you start with the Greeks. You can still read other shit alongside it.

>>15275262
>I had to stop in the middle of Mythology because it had spoilers for The Iliad and Odyssey
How can you grow up in the west without knowing what happens on tbe iliad and the odyssey?

>>15275270
Better for him though

Why should I start with the Greeks if they recognize Freedom as an imperfection?

>>15275270
I mean I knew the basic story of the Odyssey. All I knew about the Iliad was the wooden horse thing (which obviously isn't even in it), and that they were fighting over Helen, who ran away with Paris. Idk why, but neither stories were ever discussed or talked about at any point in my youth. Might be something about the NZ school system.
I will note that Edith Hamilton's Mythology was very useful in providing background context for the stories, especially the Iliad, retelling the Judgement of Paris, etc. Without that context it made a lot less sense.

First time I got very interested in philosophy I was about sixteen. I was pretty much into hardcore determinism so I picked up both volumes of Système de la Nature by the Baron d'Holbach at the library. Read it back to back like I would've a novel. Felt enlightened as fuck. I'm afraid if I were to read it now I'd find that it was a load of crap. I'd rather rather keep that pristine emotion of every piece of the puzzle fitting so well, everything making sudden sense.

>>15273595
incredibly based

>>15275270
>Grew up completely ignorant of most 'big' works and get to experience the ride when I read them
Feels good

No, I started with the Russians.
Crime and Punishment was the first book I read when I took up literature as a serious hobby and it’s what got me obsessed with literature, authors, and the history of the art

>>15273583
I started with Deleuze and Joyce then worked my way backwards.

>>15273583
Unintentionally. The podcast that I was listening to at the time started talking about the apology by plato and so i read that just to be in the loop with things.

Thats the only book from the greeks ive read tho

>>15273583
I started with Dr Seuss.

>>15273583
Tried to read the Iliad, couldn't finish it, tried to read the Republic failed as well.

>>15273583
>not starting with neanderthal cave art and sex figurines

>>15273583
I started with the Romans, then went to the Greeks then returned to the Romans.

>>15273641
Can you even understand something like Anna Karenina if you don't have some knowledge of philosophy?

>>15273583
I did my first BA in the Greeks

>>15273583
My school was retarded and we had a semester of Parmenides/ Heraclitus, one of Plato, three classes on Descartes/Locke and the rest dedidcated to Nietzsche and Kierkegaard, because the teacher did his masters on Kierkegaard.

>>15273922
damn we got a rich ass private school nigga here if you studied philosophy for 3 damn years in high school

No, i started with politics and were wondering around other geners but eventually (not long after i started) i read greeks, all of plato´s dialogs

>>15275242
The birth of tragedy they say

>>15275483
>Can you even understand something like Anna Karenina if you don't have some knowledge of philosophy?
You don’t need any philosophy to read Tolstoy his work is very self-contained

>>15273583
I can unironically say that I did

>>15275595
If you choose humanities in HS there's no way you're not having philosophy for 3 or 4 years

>>15275658
Go to any large website and take a look at reader reviews of Anna Karenina.

>>15275672

Me too bruh

>>15273660
dont fuckin do this to me

goddamn right i did
ran out of steam midway through the Enlightenment though

>>15275681
your school must be well funded, inner city schools are a scam.

>>15273583
Academically speaking I ended with the Greeks. A Plato seminar was the last class I took.
I think I got different things out of Plato than I would've otherwise, and I think I respect and understand what I read more as well. But I still think it's better to start with it.

Granted, Republic X was one of the first philosophical works I read and it fucks with my head to this day

>>15275681
you're from france?

>>15274156
How did you fuck up? I guess you didn't consult /lit/, no one recommends his book on the history of western philosophy here. Everyone says to steer clear of it and read someone else e.g. Kenny of Copleston.

>>15275262
>I'll probably read Plato's Republic, Herodotus' Histories, and Metamorphoses, and then more or less move on from the greeks/romans
Wait, why did you skip Aristotle? Also what about Thucydides, greek dramatists like Sophocles and so on?
>Obviously though, you don't read exclusively Greeks for a whole year or more when you start with the Greeks. You can still read other shit alongside it.
Yeah. that's what I'm doing. It's always good to mix stuff up.

>>15275696
Can you explain what you want me to look for? (Don’t take this as me being confrontational, I am sincerely interested since I love AK and thought it was extremely easy to read and understand)

>>15275696
/lit/ is composed mostly of plotfags, you don't need to understand anything to appreciate the plot.

>>15276024
>Why did you skip Aristotle
Meh. I'll find a summary but I can't be bothered actually reading it. I want to get on with it and skip right to Descartes.
>Greek Dramatists
Doesn't interest me enough to read more than the versions presented in Hamilton's Mythology. If I could read it in the original language it might be worth it but meh. Also acquiring all those books would likely be a pain, especially in my country with no access to Amazon.

>>15276278
>I want to get on with it and skip right to Descartes
It's best not to rush this stuff

>>15274156
This is fine actually. He’s basically Epicurean. And he’s the most correct of all the Greek philosophers.

I went from Percy Jackson to homer to the playwrites to Ovid so yes

>>15275324
Based and nostalgiapilled.

>>15273595
yep, this one goes in my based compilation

>>15273595
>Sophist still seething 2500 years later

No, I started with the Bible, then the greeks. Herodotus, Thucydides, Plato, Aristotle, Xenophon (currently here). I haven’t finished Aristotle though, gonna read Nichomachean Ethics after i’m done with all of Xenophon’s works.

>>15273729
>he skipped the hittites

>>15275262
>you don't read exclusively Greeks for a whole year or more when you start with the Greeks. You can still read other shit alongside it.
Yeah i typically have something lighter to go with it. Like a sci fi book or something. Keeps me from getting burnt out

>>15273583
I started with R.L. Stine.

>>15277287
Actually based

Greeks are pretty important if you really want to grasp most works ever written, but they are not required if you just want to absorb the plot.

I'm Greek so I might be biased though, and I still think that Thucydides, Plato, Aristotle, Homer etc are extremely entertaining and worth a read for their ideas alone.

>>15273583
Technically I started with Descartes, Kierkegaard, & rudimentary Nietzsche.

>>15273654
>>15275089
>>15275098
>>15275257
>>15275722
What the fuck even are these posts?

>>15278626
meme people. they come here to try and be better, but their knee-jerk reaction is to try vainly for humour.

Why you would ever read the Greeks for anything other than poetry is completely beyond me. These people were hardly evolved past chimpanzees.

Start with Marx, Nietzsche, and Freud.

>>15278638
Well there's been a whole lot of them coming here lately and they don't seem to be able to meme about literature very well

>>15275681

you got to choose classes in high school lol?

my poor school only gave us the choice of PE or Home Ec

>>15278645
You one ignorant mofo huh

the russians >>> the greeks

>>15277302
אה יפה.

I ascended with the Aztecs.

>>15273583
The first book I read was not by the Greeks, no. But when I started studying philosophy and history I did indeed start with the Greeks.

I've never read a work of philosophy before but I've thought of reading "Works of Love" by Kierkegaard because it's in that bloomer chart. Will I be walking down a painful road?

>>15278618
What the hell doea that mean that youre biased because youre greek?
Coming to greece because of socrates is like going to oslo for the vikings.. i actually had a discussion with greek friends about this a while back and they just laughed at those people they know that were named after "the greats"... like, imagine meeting today someone named poseidon or xenophone.. they joked about it, anyway

>>15273595
based sophist

>>15278749
Not at all. The Greek philosophers reason like children and lose themselves in language games thinking they are in touch with reality.

Heraclitus is the only one of any interest among them and that's probably only because there hasn't survived enough work to embarrass him.

>>15278793
Then youve misread it..
The ideas themselves are obviously bogus, but they were the stepping stone to the development of laters schools of thought, which gives them at least one justification to study.
But the importance is not even the ideas themselves but the dialectical method socrates uses to reason with hes peers.

Heraclitus? Why is he more important that the other greeks? besides the bullshit reason you wrote

>>15278793
>ancient Greek philosophy
>losing themselves in language games thinking they are in touch with reality

>>15278824
*his

>>15278793
Pic related.

>>15278824
>The ideas themselves are obviously bogus
Then they're not worth reading. What kind of pathetic servant of academia do you have to be to care about "stepping stones"? The Greeks are of absolutely no use to me.

Heraclitus alone had an inkling of metaphysics.

only with philosophy.
just watch the movies for the mythology

>>15278852
You fucking selfcontradicting snake
>recommends to read marx
>then metaphysics

Seriously though dude, idk what kind of a post-academic "neo-thinker" you are, but your perception of philosophy and thought appears to be garbage.

>>15278884
>neo-thinker
I like this label, thanks.

>>15278910
It depicts in a correct manner dumbfucks like you, so im glad you appreciate it mate

>>15278824
>the ideas themselves are obviously bogus

You didn't need to concede this point, Anon. I presume you were thinking mainly of the primary element being fire, or water, and so on? Heraclitus and Thales may have been "stepping stones" to atomism, but stone must have weight and density, no? If it consequently seems to you that those ideas hold no truth at all then you just don't know your elements!

>>15273595
This. I was actually surprised to learn how many of the famous philosophers were more spleen than brain. You expect to find a honest search for knowledge and all you find is dishonesty and a total failure to consider any point of view other than ones own.

>>15278917
Sounds pagan the way you put it.
But if you cant see how these ideas (which indeed are wrong in describing reality) led (by way of finding flaws in them) to later modes of thought, then, idk, hfskdjrnrofnehdidksk is also correct
And martha washington eats pussy.

>>15278931
Bro... It was 400-300 B.C.

>>15278960
And heraclitus?

Im tired from this. I respect the thinkers you mentioned, while also knowing the ground for their thought in essence came from the greeks, especially nietzsche, who was actually a classical scholar whose metaphors came from the greeks traditions and texts, including poets and playwriters
So i dont know, you sound like a nobody, a niche in a cafe, nothing deep except the latest wikipedia page you read

>>15276298
>not Stoicism
ngmi

>>15273583
The real chads started with Byron, Coleridge & the romantics straight through Saussure into Barthes, Derrida, Bakhtin, Lyotard.

>>15279018
Bakhtin is incredible.

>>15279028
damn right

>>15273583
Yes. I read a simple prose adaptation of the iliad when i was nine.

>>15273583
Yes

>>15278989
Oh man, this is all over the place; I'm afraid your thinking is sadly inverted, Anon. I suggest you read about the esoteric symbolism of the four elements

>>15279125
What does that have to do with my thinking?
I think about "reality". What is real, what is thinkable, what is perceptable, what can be acknowledged and comprehended. Not about metaphysics or mysticism. The mere fact you mentioned esoteric symbolism just shows youre not actually interested in understanding thought but more interested in edginess, termdropping and namedropping. And then you say im a slave of the academia.. thats what i meant when i said youre a post-academy nonsense producer.. tomorrow youre gonna read nick land and start splattering your insights about the cabal and the dicks in disney flicks
I just caught you in the "anti-greek" period

>>15279163
Metaphysics is by definition thinking about reality, or the nature of reality. Mysticism is generally esoteric, religious, metaphysical truth. And a slave of academia? I didn't even mention academia; a very odd paraphrasing. I read Nick Land yesterday. And if one splatters too much cabal insight threads 404. Unfortunately we have all been caught in a public educational "anti-Greek period"
_
>slave
>splattering
>dicks
What a shibboleth.. This is how you know your opponent, gentlemen

>>15279271
Calling me a shibboleth? You fucking weasel.
Read your own goddamn post.
>>15278852

And your current post.
Now i see you dont really know or understand the terminology you use.
>Unfortunately we have all been caught in a public educational "anti-Greek period"
Huh? You sound like youre in highschool you dweeb.

Go peddle your shit somewhere else.

>>15273583
After School series by Welkinson, Palmer, Meiklejohn are great.

>>15273583
sorry if this thread is more geared towards philosophy but i am looking to read into greek mythology mostly for the stories/information about the Gods
Where would be the best place to start for this?

>>15279538
Homer, then Aeschylus and Sophocles.

>>15279538
Oh, and Hesiod before or after Homer.

>>15276039
There are people who think:

- Anna did nothing wrong
- Karenin was the villain for not easily divorcing her
- The biggest problem was the sexism of the Russian society that was too tough on poor Anna, they should have been as lenient with her as they were with her brother

>>15273583
>started with the republic, as my first book since reading in primary school, because a friend recommended it

>>15278824
>>15278852
In Ethics, the Greeks were not wrong. You will live a happier, more fulfilling life by following the advice of Plato or Epictetus than you will by following Nietzsche or Bentham or Russell.

>>15279538
Just the info? Then Edith Hamilton

>>15279739
As for Nietzsche, he actually wants you to live a shittier life for the sake of truth.

I actually memed my friend to start with the greeks. He started with the Symposium or something and moved onto some Aristotelian garbage. He really should have done more background research. He asked me who Achilles was.

>>15279794
Topkek

>>15273583
No, it was goosebumps

>>15278778
I don't know, I feel I have to disclose I'm Greek to say pro Greek things, or else it wouldn't be properly opinionated.

No one cares about being named after the greats, they are just names. People name their kids George or Peter without much thought, which are also greats in Christian dogma.

I think names like Xenophon sound cool though.

Start with the cambridge pill begin with the Cambridge Ancient History 12 volumes then go onto New Cambridge Medieval history 7 volumes then end with Cambridge Modern history 14 volumes. Who needs a car when your a giga chad. Supplementary books can be Cambridges history of: communism, capitalism, Russia, christianity, cold war and Ireland. (These are reasonable prices)

>>15275270
All I did until I was 22 was play video games. I had never read a book or got taught anything about it in school

>>15279942
Or you can take the contemporary introduction pill and read all the X: A Contemporary Introduction books.

>>15275564
You learned that in school? High school?

>>15275564
based if you ask me
kierkegaard and nietzsche were a great writers, albeit questionable philosophers (academically speaking, as opposed to hegel or kant and such), so i wouldn't complain studying them

I live in a shitty eastern european third world country and we covered like 90% of the shit this board talks about (philosphy and literature) in my public high school. What do angloids even do in school if they're not actually taught anything?

>>15280172
I learned about math equations that I don’t remember and never will remember, as well as reading many young adult novels about teenagers being insecure and how they’re just like me.. if I have a kid I will send them to a private school and also teach them what I wish I have learned here and what I should have been taught
t. Australian

>>15278997
Based

Yes. Then moved on to whatever i wanted.

>>15273583
Just finished Harry Potter where do I go nect?

>>15273729
>he didn't bother to read the egyptians

>>15278626
>filtered by the paleolithics

>>15275262
My Greek reading is first concerning background.
Already read E. H. Mythology. My shelf has Thucydides and Xenophon's Anabasis collecting dust. Afterwards I'll really start with the philosophers. Plato, Aristotle, Heraclitus and Parmenides.

>>15275564
Replace Locke with Kant and you've got yourself a based teacher.

>>15280172
We study BUSINESS and CREATIVE ARTS since our schools are filled with women and niggers who can't get into anything slightly off the bend.

>>15280360
Michel Foucault. He's also homosexual, so if you read Harry Potter and want a similar feel. His theory is about 'power being in everything', so basically magic.
Enjoy!

>>15273583
i started with guenon now i am retarded

>>15280443
Does it have pictures in it?

>>15280172
>What do angloids even do in school if they're not actually taught anything?
Learn to escape raving hordes of feral naggers, apparently.

A highly valuable skill in North America.

Tolkien aged 7-9
Homer, Hesiod, and assorted Greek myth collections 10-14
Plato and Aristotle, 15-17

There were some parts that were a blur and my imagination filled in the blanks. I was constantly surprised returning to both Tolkien and Homer some years later and finding that I had made a bunch of shit up in my head for parts where I wasn't really reading. I think Miyazaki - the guy who made dark souls - had a similar problem when reading fantasy as a kid.

>>15273583
nah but I got to them eventually. An honest dedication to literature will do you way more than starting with Homer. Either way you're gonna have to read everything over and over just so that whatever you could actually understand gets lodged in your brain.