/lit/ - Literature

>>14874791
suffering is not bad

>>14874791
I don't have an answer to this either but religion has kind of helped me be a bit less degenerate, I think... I seriously believe G-d made me a fucking tranny so He could test my will. I want to kill myself every fucking day but He only tests me because He knows I can withstand it. I'm being 100% fucking unironic btw.

>>14874804
/thread

>>14874804
But we have to feed the poor and be peacemakers and shit right? Why, if suffering is not bad? You annihilate all morality and then call to God. Yikes, just yikes

>>14874791
>Gods concept of justice = mans concept of justice
>Its all about us
>We are in a position to accuse God of malfeasance or maliciousness
>No answer to this

SOMEONE didnt read their Job

>>14874791
If the adults around them didn't freak out about it and make the kid even more miserable, it actually wouldn't be as bad for the kid.
Childhood bone cancer is pretty extreme, but I think most of us would have had a much better run at life if we were raised in the company of adults with something of a "philosopher-king" mindset, whatever that means.
We fuck over ourselves and each other and then complain that god or the universe or whatever is evil.

>>14874809
God didn't make you a tranny, estrogenic poisoning and jewish memes did.

>>14874791
No one can answer it. The arguments I've heard to continue the human race are such cope lol.
MUHH CIVILIZATION, MUH SPECIAL GIFT OF LIFE, MUHH BIOLOGICAL URGE, MUHH RELIGION.

>>14874791
You cannot confine good and evil to be totally dependent on subjective experience. What seems good to humans is good and what seems evil is evil. But this totally disregards God’s conception of good, which is more objective. A world in which humans only perceive good is therefore not necessarily objectively good.

God’s objective omnibenevolence/goodness/justice is not affected by our subjective views. God is good because God is Truth and is a glorious Creator. In the same way that I eat animals for my purpose, making it good for me, God does whatever he needs to do for his objective standard of good. Unfortunately this allows suffering to exist for us, but God is merciful, so he allows a way to salvation, which we can either accept or reject

God is objectively good, but also subjectively benevolent to humans. But God can also be subjectively malevolent. This has to be the case, since some people hate God, and some people go to hell.
Proverbs 8:17
>I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently find me.
James 4:8
>Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
Deuteronomy 7:9
>9 Know therefore that the Lord your God is God; he is the faithful God, keeping his covenant of love to a thousand generations of those who love him and keep his commandments.

The problem of evil is a subjective problem only, made worse when you’re an atheist.

>10But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.

>>14874804
I bet you wouldn't be saying that If someone was skinning you alive after killing your family in front of you faggot

>>14874809
Why put yourself through that? Why the fuck. Serious don't hurt yourself. These people are all hypocrites and adulterers anyways. Why do YOU have to be so pure? And it makes even less sense for LGBT because no matter what you do they'll always hate you. God will always hate you. Just transition and find some happiness and don't waste your life

>>14874827
twaddle. being an omnipotent god of love precludes a logic of "subjective malevolence" you fucking goof

>>14874791
wasn't this guy a gay/pedo type?

>>14874816
of course, we should try to do our best to get out of the chaos that our sin created

>>14874834
my feelings aren't important to the fact that suffering is an objective fact in our world that isn't apriori bad. faggot

>>14874836
Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

Look at this shit. Just one random example

https://twitter.com/alneamyyy88/status/1237072653183324160

This is the world we live in. Going on forever with shit like this happening. Useless miserable unending degradation. Nobody can fucking do anything because all that exists in this world with real vigor is POWER and DEATH. Watch this and tell me some shit about the "love of God" and how when they starve to death in excruciating pain they "get to go to Heaven"

>>14874853
I can't, the gnostics were right about everything

>>14874840
What does “God of love” actually mean, though? How exactly is love made infinite, or maximized? What is omnibenevolence? It may be argued that without suffering, God could not show the full nature of his love to anyone. Not to mention the love that interacts among humans in hard times. So could truly be loving if his love were not needed or displayed? How do you know what God’s love should be like?

>>14874846
BULLSHIT. This is all CRAP made up because the people who wrote this shit were trying the best to make this hideous existence a bit more bearable. Everything is about some vague promises of stuff that will happen later. It is useless now because nobody takes God seriously. It can no longer reverse just an iota of the shit on planet. I bet when every martyr died their last thoughts were all the same: "ny God my God why have you abandoned me?"

>>14874853
>we live in a world of sin because our parents sinned and do nothing about it to rectify it but continue sinning even more

HOW COULD YOU DO THIS GOD

>>14874836
God loves all his children. Cutting off your dick won't give you any happiness, you're sending yourself to a hell of your own making. Trannies are living a lie and bringing them out of it is not hate but compassion.

>>14874791
>Bone cancer in children?
The most curable, ~80% provided you do not get pneumonia while neutropenic, or win a particularly bad subset of it. First research from bone marrow damage from gassings in the WWI trenches. Not the best example.

>>14874827

> In the same way that I eat animals for my purpose, making it good for me, God does whatever he needs to do for his objective standard of good.

If God's conception of Good conflicts with a human's conception, why should I think of that conception as being good? Further, why would God create beings that perceive a different system of good altogether?

>>14874869
WHY THE FUCK IS IT THE CHILDREN WHO SUFFER THEN AND NOT THE FAGGOTS WHO PROFIT FROM WAR AND DEATH

THEY ALL LIVE HAPPY LIVES AND ARE INCREDIBLY WEALTHY

WHY DON'T YOU PEOPLE LIVE IN REALITY

We should form a religion that hates god rather than loves him and exalts all the positive parts of the human spirit that exist in spite of the cruelty of the universe he created. We need to worship our ancestors under a bonfire of burnt bibles and quarans and talmuds. We shall use all methods of control over nature to find ways to find god and kill him. This is the only way to assert dominance.

>>14874853
OHHH BUT BRO THERE'S SOME SUPER SECRET REASON THAT GOD DOES THAT. I DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW WHY BUT I'M GOING TO BELIEVE THAT TO STOP ME FROM KILLING MYSELF

>>14874872
>why should I think of that conception as being good?
Because he's making the rules, he's the writer of the book and the dreamer of the dream.

>>14874872
good is subjective. That’s why God’s laws for us (which are still objectively true) do not apply to God

>>14874872
It's kind of like playing a sandbox game, God gave you instructions so you know what is the best way to get through it but nobody is stopping you from doing whatever

>>14874834
not all suffering is the exact same either.

>>14874863
>It may be argued that without suffering, God could not show the full nature of his love to anyone.

absolute load of shit, then your God answers to a dualist logic of conditionality outside of him, which means he's no longer omnipotent

>>14874868
Cringe, they thought that today they would be with Him in paradise, also that was jesus quoting a psalm

>>14874869
this epic meme post is toothless in the face of non-human misery and suffering.

>>14874877
>WHY THE FUCK IS IT THE CHILDREN WHO SUFFER

it is the effect of original sin of our parents. unfortunately our world is a bit screwed up because of it.

>>14874877
>THE FAGGOTS WHO PROFIT FROM WAR AND DEATH

Have you met any of these people? To sleep at night while doing that you need to radically alter the essence of your being. Most of these people have made themselves so maladjusted they cannot even repent honestly. This is going to be a big problem for them when they die and make their way into eternity.

>>14874900
natural disasters are the effect of oiriginal sin. there is no non-human derived suffering

>>14874892
It may be argued that God wouldn’t be omnipotent in a boring world without suffering, nor even omniscient. That’s such a crippling requirement on an omnipotent creator. Imagine writing/reading a grand story without any conflict or suffering. And now reflect on the depths of meaning created by history and literature involving suffering. Imagine the lack of love or glory in the atheist fantasyland that lacks suffering. And you think THAT God would be more omnipotent? He does what He wants

>>14874881
it's not that super secret, they are victim souls and martyrs who satisfy for your sin

>>14874804
>suffering is not bad
except you're the same people threatening everyone with ETERNAL SUFFERING for not saying "I love Jesus" enough in the public eye.

>>14874892
there is no dualistic logic. sacrifice is the highest expression of love, was already said by Jesus. sacrifice implies suffering.

>>14874827
i'm always impressed by the extent to which the haunted will try to justify their spooks

>>14874935
the eternal loss of God is eternal suffering so you are right to claim that is bad

i'm going to be honest here anon, i am grappling with the same issue. many years ago, my little sister passed away from a very aggressive pediatric nerve cancer. i told myself back then that god would reveal his intent to me in time, that things would get better, that i'd understand etc because my home life was abusive and fractured and i couldn't handle a fracture of faith as well. i've looked up so many arguments in attempt to rationalize this but i can't type any with conviction right now. i lost my religion two years later and have been trying to find it again. her name still gets caught in my throat when i try to say it out loud. i know that i believe in something but i have a hard time squaring god's omnipotence and love with watching my sister pass away while wishing more than anything it could have been me instead. she did nothing to deserve that, and on some level i'm still raw. if any anons have words of advice about how these pieces fit together i'd like to hear anyways because i want to make sense of this—i just can't.

>>14874948
You are the demons immanentizing hell on this plane. One day your kind will be rightly vanquished. You're struggles in this realm will never be forgotten, I promise you, but you must die.

>>14874935
>in the public eye.
...Do not pray on street corners anon.

>>14874949
You’ll see her in heaven bro. Your reunion with her will be greater than most family reunions.
>Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted

>>14874960
Indeed. It isn't God's eyes full of vengeance and judgement. It's yours.

>>14874949
If she was a Christian ur just being selfish, if she wasn't then that sucks and you should have done something about it, but Jesus is a nice guy so he might let her in anyway

>>14874962
thank you bro, the kindness means more than you know rn

>>14874963
Why do people love to paint Christians as vengeful and full of judgement? Christianity =/= Boomer Protestantism. Christianity is a purgative ascent to God. Its not that different from Neoplatonism.

>>14874836
>And it makes even less sense for LGBT because no matter what you do they'll always hate you. God will always hate you
That's not true at all. I legitimately have such an extreme amount of respect for those who temper their sexual desires in the search for religious truth. When you say God hates you anyway, you unironically sound like some cartoony demon that you'd hear about in a Sunday School.

>>14874949
i am sorry to hear that anon. our world is a world of misery, death, pain and loss. if it helps you at all, we had a family friend who had a prophetic gift (the president of our country actually visited him regularly in the last years of his life), that i can attest to personally (none of that junk psychological tricks, but stuff that should be impossible to know). that was part of the reason among others why I became convinced that Christianity is the truth. Our friend would say that the hour of death is assigned by God from the beginning and there is indeed an afterlife to look forward to. Read the Bible as it is the book that contains the truth, but sometimes you do not get all the answers here and now and I imagine some you do not get while you are alive. I have nothing to gain by making this up, just my experience.

>>14874959
I do not threaten anyone with going to hell in public or in private nor do I concern myself with any such ideas about who should be going to hell or not. In fact, like most believers I do not walk around the streets screaming and announcing my faith, so it seems ridiculous to generalize a peculiar type of behavior of a small subset to the whole group. Though, that does not change the fact that hell is real of course.

>>14874989
there is a large group of people who believe christianity especially but religion in general is something that has to be destroyed before we can achieve this-worldly utopia. and these people have actually been winning since 1900. like with the tower of Babel, God will intervene in time though and it appears that could be really soon to boot

>>14874989
Look. I am extremely sympathetic to Christiantiy and closer to converting than you think despite my above larping about protecting this "plane." I am so horrified by my experiences with American protestantism and the fact that it is the historical child of catholicism saps my faith in either branch. The character of christ is compelling but not when it is framed as a threat. I think the suffering of this world needs to be remembered. I am not quite Nietzsche. But I have read the bible. I have spoken to many Christians. Please if there is something I'm missing tell me.

>>14875035
another strawman. The day one of you Christians actually infers my position is the day I'll be interested.

>>14875047
there are only two positions that matter. for-God or against-God. the former is just one, the latter has thousands of iterations, none of which matter.

>>14874997
thank you for your kind words and i'm glad you had that realization for yourself. my family is not christian and one of the few things keeping me from moving forward and converting is that when i think about my little sister (and i think about her every day) and try to situate her passing in christian theology, or even in the framework of my own religion, i just get so fucking angry at god. like, it is actively better for me to hold my faith at an arm's length because i just don't know if i'm spiritually mature enough to understand, or if there's anything to be understood to begin with—maybe shit just happens and there's too many tiny moving parts for god to manage. maybe evil is winning. i don't know. for my sister's sake i believe in an afterlife and i dearly hope for reunion with her in heaven one day. sorry for the long response this is mostly just me trying to articulate my weird religious position.

>>14874818
Of course, if God's concept of justice is unknowable and God is going to judge us, then we're all in deep shit.

>>14875051
I'm not against God. I'm against pretenders and I am not convinced by Christ's cult. I think Christ himself has an interesting story and even spiritual significance. Whatever faith he followed, today is infested by demons. Demons speaking in his name. The Demons must be removed from this world. I do not yet know if Christ should be forgotten. I don't want you or him to be forgotten. But I just think there are better ways to God than Christ. I think the only people who ever really find God are those who live hard lives and set themselves to infinite negation. Every Christian I have ever met is wearing a mask to hide their sinful pride.

>>14875063
>>14875043
Give him a shot.

>>14874791

What is an acceptable amount of suffering? If God eliminated what we perceive as intolerable suffering, we would then have a lower strata of suffering that then seems intolerable because we can imagine nothing worse. Then, the solution would be to eliminate all suffering. It's the same as asking to be lobotomized. Our achievements only stand, only exist, in the face of antagonism. That is what it is to be mortal. To eliminate that condition is to become God. But there is no meaning in being God because you exist in an infinite state of being where you are all at all times. Functionally the same as being nothing: infinite omnipotence without meaning is the same as infinite oblivion. God creates a world of boundaries, a world of dilemma, a world of finite actors who suffer from finite actions because they can draw meaning from that suffering or from standing in opposition to it. To fault God for having you suffer is to ask for God to revoke meaning and to revoke you.

>>14875105
Yes.

>>14874827
>You cannot confine good and evil to be totally dependent on subjective experience.
Not only can you confine good and evil to be totally dependent on subjective experience, you are capable of confining every aspect of your entire life and perception on subjective experience. You are nothing but subjectivity.
By all means, provide an objective basis for god.

>But this totally disregards God’s conception of good, which is more objective.
"More objective"
You've taken omnibenevolence as a given, you offer nothing for justification or evaluation. At least have the decency of presenting your beliefs as dogma rather than this cringe 16 year old catholic larp.

>>14875105

Mortal life is the transcendant state. We are bubbles out of the same collective un-state, individuated polyps existing at the juncture point at the zenith of the material and the nadir of the immaterial. Whatever awaits us after death necessarily involves the obliteration of the ego. Ecstasis in Heaven would be no different than to sublimate in the void.

>>14875118
>>14875105

And thus the absence of God is the same as the presence of God.

>>14874791
Would it make you feel better if it was 'no, you're right, there is no God! in fact, there's nothing, absolutely nothing! we're just gonna die, and that's it.' what difference would it make. It would be retarded to think that there aren't forces like 'angels' and 'demons' (just names for things) seeping into this reality, messing with it. Do you want to be on the evil side, or the good side? because this old faggot is fucking sick.

>>14875120

That is, assuming you don't believe in Hell, which is a nonsensical concept.

>>14875159
>Would it make you feel better...

>>14875160

Actually, maybe it's not. Because if your individual soul returns to the collective state of Godhood, you are returning to a state without meaning. So I guess in effect there's always a part of the sort of oversoul that would be in Hell.

>>14875166

>I don't have a desire to feel better
>I need to project my individual misgivings onto others for reasons that have nothing to do with personal validation

>>14875171
>It must be true, I'd be sad otherwise :(

>>14875196

Different anon, dude, but I'm not the one who has a gassed pepe on short order. But now that I read >>14875159, I wish I hadn't said anything in their defense.

>>14875196
Lol this is so true. I was listening to this one guy that' deep into philosophy and religion and he said he considered himself a rationalist but admitted that it leads to agnosticism yet he still goes around saying God exists lol.

>>14875220
being agnostic doesn’t mean you become a full skeptic. It’s good to be aware of your ignorance, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t have faith

>>14874966
>my dear sister died and I feel awful
>ur just being selfish
do christians have autism?

>>14874791


A ship once sank along with everyone onboard, and
A man who saw it declared that the gods decided matters unjustly,
“If one impious man is aboard a ship,
Many innocent persons die along with him.”
As he was saying this, the sort of thing that happens—
A swarm of ants came upon him
In their eagerness to nibble on some wheat chaff—
And when one of them bit him, he stomped on most of the others.
Hermes appeared and said, as he struck the man with his staff,
“So, then, won’t you let the gods
Be your judges the way you are the judge of the ants?”

>>14874791
Stop wasting your time in the internet,and go read least you want to end up as another coping drunk.

>>14875260
1. The man never claimed to be benevolent towards the ants.
2. It's lovely how Christianity is defended and explained through a pagan mythos.

>mfw both atheists AND christcucks are retarded

God is evil

>>14874791
Because you're a literal faggot.

>>14874791
What if they deserve it? I’ve been living with the ardent belief that everyone who suffers has done something to deserve it, and I’ve been having a great time. My stress level is down, I’m smiling more often, and I don’t mind being in shit situations anymore. I can reflect on my faults, and acknowledge I do deserve my misfortune, and move on.

>>14874804

>>14875620
see
>>14875625
you're not a monster, but you lack empathy, so you're a larval horror, waiting for the right pressure to bloom like a hideous tumor.

>>14875276
I have always rejected the idea of using gods to equate us with germs or insects, insignificant and meaningless. Humility is good, but abasement is just some charlatan trying to get you to lie down and empty your pockets.

>>14874853
Why isn’t the guy with his phone helping? He could feed those starving naked kids before he pulled out his phone. How many others are in a place to help, but refrain from doing so?

>>14874827
>But this totally disregards God’s conception of good, which is more objective
really did god tell you this?

>>14875643
He's getting the word out, and that is helpful. A man can feed and help a truckload, but a journalist can start some real political and economic things moving, usually if it also serves the interests of the fat cunts like you and me who utterly failed the test when 2 million people were on the move.

>>14874880
How do you separate the good from the bad? I personally enjoy violence and believe fighting, dueling, and minor assaults against other men should not be criminal offenses. But I recognize that many do not hold this view.

>>14874791
I dont get this, its like saying why should I respect the politice or your local drug peddlers, the awnser: because they are dangerous

>>14874827
Or.... God is not good, but good and evil come from God. Solves the whole problem.

what are the main books I need to understand Christian apologetics?

>>14874827
This is a good post.
>>14874872
>Further, why would God create beings that perceive a different system of good altogether?
Metaphysical natural selection. Beings that embrace good are fit to survive, so to speak.
>>14875653
God cannot be without objectivity. The hierarchical existence of good and evil lead us to infer He is good, just as we attribute the concept of "life" good (as in childbirth, plant growth, family).
If God exists -- he is a God of Life absolutely.

If you were falling from a great height, gravity would seem for an instant like the purest evil ever conceived.

>>14874804
only a person who has never lived in chronic pain will say this

>>14875723
And as you're about to smash into a pulp of guts and bonemash, you see some retard in a funny hat preaching to the crowd: GRAVITY IS ONE TRUE GOD! PRAISE BE GRAVITON AND HIS APOSTLE ISAAC

>>14874791
I like this world because I'm not an incel loser

>>14874834
One of my professors is a Liberian Christian, who had relatives in his village raped and murdered during the civil war. He's one of the most passionate defenders of the faith, even after having lost his daughters. Ironic that you project your weakness onto others.

>>14874853
>bad thing happen that mean world always bad
>muh childsren

>>14875643
One lunch is not going to help kids at that point. God knows what their stomachs can even process.

>>14875756
>bad thing happen that mean world always bad
Yes.

>>14874827
>actually kids dying of cancer is a GOOD thing
lol christoids

>>14875061
Exactly. If we choose to believe in god, then we also choose to live in abject horror at his wrath.

>>14874791
Yeah I’ll give you bone cancer.

It’s called MY ASS!!!!!

>>14874791
>He doesn't live a crackhead ascetism black heavy metal life thinking pain is good, ready to face anything
Fucking pathetic, grow some fucking balls

>>14875900
Actually bro kids being born as chattel slaves and then being killed without hearing about Yahweh was all part of God's plan bro. Don't question God bro, there's a explanation bro trust me.

>>14875711
Pascal's Pensées, firstly.
Contrary to popular myth, there is much more to Pascal than his famous wager. Many aspects of the Christian faith are defended well by Pascal in his recorded thoughts.
>>14874853
We hold stewardship over this world. This is our fault. Bone cancer is a better argument. But even that is our burden, not any else's.

Feed the hungry. Cure the sick. Smite the evil.
This is our calling. Blaming God for their existence is just shifting responsibility, and enabling continuation.

St. Jude's, or any virtuous hospital for that matter, is a good example of God's work as he works through the good of man.
Why resign the fate of the material world? Are we not capable of any good?
Even as an atheist, you would not denounce what is good simply for the existence of bad. Be the change you'd like to see in the world, anons. It is ours to change.

>>14874791
I would respect someone capable of such cruelty if they held that power over me. Why wouldn't you?

How do christians explain god not revealing himself to humans for nearly 90% of their total existence?

>>14876541
By coping and saying there is some super secret reason that we just can't know with our feeble mortal brains. Or they just come up with some elaborate theory that if God did that it would somehow be bad or something.

>>14874791
why yes i am a pederast how can you tell

>>14875724
It's the other way around. It's usually the people that suffer the most that attach meaning to it, because if it didn't have meaning why did they suffer? Just look at Nietzsche. His entire philosophy was one big justification for his suffering. Or if you like pop-psychologists there is Peterson. In my experience, it is only people who have never suffered, and thus have never gave suffering any considerable thought, who would say things like that.

>>14875625
Panzam was based

>>14875632>>14875625

why judeo christians push empathy so much? is it because they are fuckwits so their life is miserable and so they want successful people to care about them, like true parasites?

>>14874791
>why pain hurt
>why boipussy feel good
>must rape boy
What a pussy bitch.

>>14875061
IF God's concept is truly just, even if we don't understand it, there is no other justice. Eternal judgement =/ man's pussy bitch fake justice

>>14874914
Original sin is Catholic fanfic.
How could Adam and Eve have properly understood that eating from this tree was wrong if they did not possess the knowledge of good and evil? Anyone not steeped in ideology sees that the penalty upon all humanity and non-human animals is grossly out of proportion.

The worst part about this question is that it assumes Christian, or at least human morality, from the start but under the guise of atheism. Why would a divine creator share our morality? Just as he would be beyond our five senses, he would be beyond be our sense of suffering and our morality towards it. Read the Book or Job. Neither Christianity nor Islam nor Judaism nor any of the other old religions teach that God or reality is inherently benevolent for us humans.

> If God, an omnipresent divine creator of the cosmos who is far beyond me in every conceivable way, is real, the. why doesn’t he have my notion of righteousness?

That’s what you’re asking.

>>14876743
>How could Adam and Eve have properly understood that eating from this tree was wrong
The snake literally told them that if Eve eats the fucking apple, she and Adam will be like gods themselves.

>>14876743
>Anyone not steeped in ideology sees that the penalty upon all humanity and non-human animals is grossly out of proportion.
Out of proportion for a pussy.
Get your shit together and help your fellow man.

No Christian can walk up to a cancer-ridden child and tell them "This is what God wants".

>>14876964
Calvinist*
A real Christian would go and tell the child to be strong and hope for the best and that God is with him.

>>14874791
Should God also share his predilection for sodomizing twinks? Humanists are fucked in the head

>>14874843
Of course.

>Going on forever with shit like this happening.
>forever
I don't think you know what the word means anon.

>>14874853
The inconsistency in this is that on one hand you assume that this event has some moral force behind it, that someone is being degraded as if that has value. And then go on to say that all that exists is power and death. You don't get to borrow the moral charge of theism and then use the force of that to argue for a world where there are no moral values.

>>14875251
>NOOO YOU CAN'T TAKE MY SISTER AWAY FROM ME EVEN IF SHE WOULD BE 1000 TIMES HAPPIER AND HEALTHIER IN HEAVEN NOOO

definition of selfish

>>14875159
He's actually just mad that people used to be able to call him out on wrecking boypussy.

>>14876990
>be strong and hope for the best
Not gonna make a difference since god already planned everything out.

>>14877056
>NOOOOOO YOU SHOULD BE HAPPY YOUR SISTER DIED STOP BEING SELFISH NOOOOOOOO
literally a death cult

>>14877080
Bro you can raise numerous questions that these cunts most likely wouldn't be able to answer and they'll just resort to "NOOO THERE'S A EXPLANATION TRUST ME BRO TRUST MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE JUST BELIEVE BROOOOOOOOOOOOO"

>>14877113
do you expect men to know all the answers? God wouldn’t be so great, then, would he? Unless we’re omniscient, there’s always a question that we can’t answer.

>>14877078
>Not gonna make a difference since god already planned everything out.
Again. Calvinist*
Did God predetermine for babies to be born deformed or is it mother nature acting the fool?
Is God mother nature? If so, then why create humanity to be the wards and caretakers of nature?

>>14874853
>NOOOOOOOOOO NOT THE CHILDERINO YOUNGERINO

>>14877113
It's easy to think you have all the answers when you just make it up as you go along like atheists do.

>>14876710
I kinda feel that, by posting this, you're really just saying that you think God's concept of justice broadly lines up with your own. Since if God's concept of justice is truly unknowable (as goes the defense against the problem of evil), then nothing you think you know about justice applies; the true justice you're talking about could be literally anything. If you're actually capable of suspending your beliefs, and not taking for granted that "true justice is my concept of justice, but better," you'll come to appreciate how fucking awful it would be to have a judge who condemns people on unknowable standards.

>>14877223
God gives us plenty of standards for our behavior, though. God has different standards for his own behavior because the consequences are different

>>14877240
You're certainly making it sound like God should be going by "first citizen," or some shit like that. "I can commit genocide, but thou shalt not kill" sounds more like Stalin than pure love. Yes, you'll retreat back to the very convenient argument, only God can judge God, which, once again, in the USSR, only Stalin can judge Stalin. And strangely, Stalin was always found to be right.

>>14877248
no argument detected

>>14874861

Anyone who studies different theologies in-depth will invariably come to this conclusion.

>>14874836
>Just transition and find some happiness

Yeah man just waste thousands of dollars destroying your genitals and then kill yourself out of regret 10 years later. That is the meaning of happines, you can always trust balanced and reasonable individuals such as the fine gentleman of the LGBT community. Yup

>>14874880

Its called satanism. Not the edgy abrahamic satanism of evildoers, but actual esoteric theological satanism.(Shaytan/satan comes from the word knowledge, not adversary.)

>>14874804
Wrong. Not all suffering is bad, given a greater good. But even with a greater good, most suffering is bad, and a very large proportion is abjectly terrible.

>>14874827
That is but saying that good is not good.

>>14874877
What are 100 years of pleasure in face of the infinity of suffering?
What are 100 years of suffering in face of the infinity of joy?

>>14877328
Why is suffering bad though?

>>14874949
You haven’t gotten any serious replies so I will reply. I’m sorry to hear it. I also know what it’s like to lose someone and struggle. I was raised strictly catholic and I’m not sure I still am, but I will say I’m quite convinced that death is not the end even though it’s hard for those left behind and I will say I think it’s not logical to split over the idea in the OP. If God is an omnipotent and omniscient being perhaps above being itself then we can’t even rationally except he act upon all of creation with specifically our morality. Just like I can’t intuit him with my 5 senses, I can’t step outside of my righteousness to tell Him what is good for all his creation. The Book or Job deals with this topic and might be worth reading.

>>14874880
> We shall use all methods of control over nature to find ways to find god and kill him.

That just means antinatalism. You either accept existence, or reject it. There is no logical reason to keep going in a futile universe, so to keep going, you must embrace something beyond reason.

>>14874791
You find that out in the first 3 chapters of the bible

>>14874791
>gay faggot
opinion discarded. I hope he gets aids and cancer and rages at the mean sky daddy some more.

>>14874791
Because it’s easy to answer if you have faith.
1) Not all suffering is bad. God allows certain suffering to occur to rarify our immaterial body, the soul. The woes that befalls the physical body are finite and not the be-all-end-all of what we truly are.

2) A lot of suffering injustice and pain is self inflicted. Yes, even many cancers. We eat like shit, live like shit, and our bodies respond with shit. Aside from naturally occurring disease, we mostly the authors of our own pain.

3) Trust the plan. This one is immediately obvious if you’re faithful. Whatever happens, even if it means bodily destruction, is part of God’s divine judgement.

This is only an issue for agnostics/atheists. It’s often said that the faithful are only faithful out of fear, because we need a cope from death. It’s actually the other way around. We choose God not out of fear of suffering or death, but because we understand it. It’s the atheist who is afraid of death.

>>14874791
Why should I respect anything if not for my own benefit?

>>14874791
isnt this guy a cocksucker?

Here is what Augustine says on dieng.

"Why be angry that you get to see God sooner than most men?"

There is none its the natural conclusion to the athiest worldview, that or you are very optimistic (have faith) science will defintely solve it

>>14877512
yeah he's a gay bipolar anglo jew.

>>14874818
>We are in a position to accuse God of malfeasance or maliciousness

Yes.

>>14875105
>Our achievements only stand, only exist, in the face of antagonism

I disagree. Your reply is tremendously idiotic despite there being little to no opposition in this thread.

>>14876749
>Why would a divine creator share our morality?

Whence "our" Morality then?

>>14877248
Thou shall not kill does not correlate to thou shall not go to war to defend yourself against wacko desert bandits.

>>14877797
>claims to know god exists
>cling to a human body

hhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmm I love how hedonists would do anything to live 5 minutes longer

>>14877568
What God tells us in the Bible. It’s for our own good

>>14874791
>not carving suffering
>in fact, complaining about it
God doesn't want you to be a little pussy ass bitch, and if you tried to get out of your comfort zone even for a day you would feel true happiness, stay ignorant

>>14877837
>God exists
>therefore creation doesn't matter and we should just coom and then die so as not to suffer something, like, carrying your cross
Heh. Nice one there anon.

>>14876749
This is true.
By all accounts, it is we who are to oversee reality in the mirror of God's grace and not succumb to the evils that come from within us, but also from outside.

>>14874804
cope on never before seen levels

>>14874834
uuuh are you a pizza knife? Because you're all edge

>>14874995
No practicing Christian repects a gay person celibate or not. Keep coping. By the way, Romans specifically says gay people become so because God hates them. It is completely accurate to say God hates the very existence of fags

>>14874791
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ0sP_EzOVo

>Why can't any book actually ANSWER this question?
>Greg Bahnsen
>Cornelius Van Til
>the old reformers before them (Luther, Calvin, etc.)
>the church fathers before them (Augustine, etc.)
>the apostles before them (Romans 8, Hebrews 12, 2 Timothy 3, so much of 1 Peter, etc. etc.)
>Jesus before them (the gospels)
>the prophets before His coming (in the flesh, before his dying and bodily resurrection on the third day in fulfillment of prophesy)
>Genesis
>Job

I guess looking into what's been written all in long, millennia old paper trails isn't what you're after.

>>14877521
you should kill yourself to meet him even faster then

>>14877334
so you’re saying nothing that happens on earth matters and you can do whatever you want

>>14877168

>>14874853
NO DUDE YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND, MY INVISIBLE DEITY WROTE A MAGICAL BOOK THAT I'VE BEEN FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO CONTINGENTLY ENCOUNTER IN MY LIFETIME AND IT SAYS THAT IF I JUST BELIEVE IN THE MAIN CHARACTER THEN I'M SAVED AND I GO TO HEAVEN FOREVER WHEN I DIE!!!!! :)

how does this solve the problem you've shown us? well, it doesn't really. actually, if those skeleton children don't repent of their sins and accept the blood of jesus (and baptize themselves, and join the one true catholic church, which is the one i go to) then they're unsaved and are going to hell forever after they die their miserable deaths. sorry dude, wish i made the rules but instead i just worship the guy who did. there's no better system than this, really. this is the only way. also it's not a cult, it's a relationship

On a serious note, I'm not an atheist myself and believe in a non-dual spiritual philosophy in which God is Consciousness and these incarnative lifetimes are used for the Creator to experience itself in a finite form and thereby see what "separation" is like.

Check out the book series the Law of One, if you'd like. It's "channelled" material from the new age era of spirituality, and is said to be sourced from a non-human disincarnate entity which calls itself "Ra". Ra is a collective hivemind intelligence which inhabits another planet somewhere in our universe, and the Law of One material consists of their elaborations on the nature of reality. The human questioners ask them all kinds of questions, and receive answers in turn. On the subject of starvation in Africa, they said that apparently the "higher selves" of the populations in question chose to incarnate into those forms for the sake of learning something through it.

Now I'm not exactly pleased with that explanation myself, though I'm fascinated with many of the other ones given in the material.

I also believe that elements of gnosticism is true, namely in the idea that our planet and species have been taken over by a malevolent spirit/species who is using us for their own purposes, be it farming our spiritual energy or other ends unknown to us. I believe that previous civilizations existed and that humans used to have far greater abilities prior to our genetic downgrade - I believe that reality is multidimensional, that we are all the Creator experiencing itself through a limited form, and that we should normally have the ability to manifest matter (such as food and water, to speak to your example) through thought, rather than be forced to starve if our physical complexes do not access nourishment. But negative entities have taken over this place for their own uses and turned this place into the hellhole we observe it to be.

I know this view might seem as batsh*t crazy as another religious view, but I just wanted to share it as a means of introducing other possibilities which allow some kind of spiritual fabric to reality while accounting for the abject suffering we find here differently.

>>14874791
The same reason you don't interfere with a lion ambushing a gazelle.

>>14874834
I can literally smell the tears of impotent rage behind this post
The atheist goes to hell twice

>>14877558

Glad to see you also provided nothing of substance against it.

>>14874791
>Why should I respect a capricous mean-minded god willing to influct suffering and pain
I duno dude? Same reason you dont fuck with your local drug lord? Seems pretty straightforward. Might makes right and whatever god(s) or fundamental laws govern this universe have made it clear what will cause them to fuck you up. Maybe just listen and accept being obedient to the, for your own sake

>>14876628
It's because egoism is an unsustainable ideology.
You cannot exist in a society of exclusively egoists, as they must exploit the altruism of non-egoists to even exist. If everyone was simply looking out for themselves, there would be no functioning society.
In other words, egoists exist within the metabolism of generally cooperative society.

This is a traditional value honed over the years and justified by religion.
It seems like the real spook is your obsession with spooks.