/lit/ - Literature

Understanding the Shia

The Shia are a weird cult that believes Ali, radhi Allahu anhu, is omniscient and omnipotent. They build shrines to him. Twelvers believe this of all their Twelve Imams. This was a perseveration that arose out of believing he got short shrift in the dispute with Abu Bakr, radhi Allahu anhu, after Muhammad's, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, death. Which is debatable but they follow a belief that the Caliphate is hereditary starting with Aki, radhi Allahu anhu, as they see him as basically Muhammad's, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, son, which the Qur'an flatly denies (33:40). Because of this they made up ridiculous stories I
their Hadiths and put them in Wikipedia (just like pinkos do) as objective fact accepted by Sunnis as well, like the idea that 200,000 saw everyone swear allegiance to Ali, radhi Allahu anhu, which is obviously ridiculous. Then all these lies and slander about Umar, radhi Allahu anhu. And A'isha, radhi Allahu anha. In reality Abu Bakr appointed Ali his personal advisor, and Ali married his daughter to Umar. Shia agree here, Sunnis do not agree with their nonsense about Umar brutalizing Fatima, radhi Allahu anha.

Because Shia think A'isha was a witch, they reject her account of Muhammad's, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, teachings. For example saying men can't dress as women. Consequently trannies are halal for Shia

>>14841401
Another thing she said was temporary marriages are haram. These were marriages the man and woman arranged by oral contract, they lasted twenty minutes to an hour, with the man generally paying. Shia love these and say A'isha is a witch and so must be lying when she said Muhammad, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, prohibited them

Shia commemorate the martyrdom of Hussein, radhi Allahu anhu, by cutting their children's heads every year on Ashura

>>14841477

>>14841485

>why is Iran suffering so much more than everyone else from the Coronavirus?

Maududi

Finance

Qutb

Dating in Islam

https://www.learnreligions.com/courtship-and-dating-in-islam-2004430

Guide for women
https://idealmuslimah.com/

Clothing sites to buy for women
houseofjilbab.com
medinaparis.com

Nietzsche on Islam

I can only guess what you're trying to do here anon, but don't you feel even a little bit dirty spreading discontent within the ummah on 4chan of all places?

>>14842084
I'm not sure what you mean.

Shia fatwas

good readings for extreme platonic realism?

>>14842214
Plato?

>>14841157
I see this board has double standards when it comes to Islam.

Promote Islam = A-Okay

Criticize Islam = Temp Ban

Cool. Cool.

>>14842249
This board is only for patricians

>>14842274

Enjoy living a lie, I guess?

>>14842288
Truth is Tawhid

>>14842296
Hopefully you'll be able to think for yourself someday.

>>14842313
I have, Hume shows there is no logical continuity between moments, so why is there continuity when in terms of probability each state should be totally divorced from from every other state

>>14842326

You're still coping over the problem of induction?

>>14842393
How is it a cope when it's a problem for kuffar, not Muslims?

Is there a book that goes through the development of islamic life and thought?
For example how sharia, culture and political thought developed?

>>14842433
It's much to extensive an enterprise and b covered in detail in one book but

http://www.muslimphilosophy.com/hmp/

Try that. Also check out Malik and Medina, available on libgen.

The are primarily four schools of legal and political thought, Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i and Hanbali. The is also a small school, Zihiri, which boasts of Ibn Hazm and al-Shawakani. They all have different ideas on politics and law due to differing methodologies (for example, one Hadith might say the Prophet, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, disliked x, so Hanbal would say that is haram, Maliki say no it just means he didn't like it)

>>14842530
Thanks for the link it looks like what i wanted to know.

>>14842596
Also wondering what your opinion on Hamza Yusuf is?
I've been watching a lot of his videos lately and while I don't understand a lot of what he says I find him to be very fascinating.
Are there any other figures you think are worth watching to understand muslim thought?

>>14842606
I don't like Hamza Yusuf, he pushes for quietism to the point that he says the U.S. Constitution is Sharia. He is heavily promoted for a reason. If you read The Muslim World After 9/11 (not the book, the RAND Corporation report prepared for the U.S. Air Force), you will see it's the strategy of the American government to promote and fund quietist Sufis to say Islam is about what's "inside" and everything else is not real Islam, Murad in his quietist lecture "Riding the Tiger of Modernity" goes so far as to say hijab is just externalism.

If you want to understand orthodox Muslim thought I highly recommend you study pre colonialist Muslims. Every remotely orthodox Muslim scholar today gets banned from countries and accused of terrorism, even non political ones like Bilal Phillips (whom ISIS also wants to kill). A good rule of thumb is if the scholar is extremely liked and promoted by a government or media, be it America, Saud, Egypt, or any other, they are probably corrupt. If they are harassed and accused of crime with no evidence then they are probably solid. This is nothing new. Indeed the best old scholars,like Imam Abu Hanifa, Imam Ahmed, Ibn Hazm and Ibn Taymiyya were all persecuted because they refused to shill for the government

New Muslim Academy has free videos and books from solid scholars,I suggest that

>>14842641
Isn't Quietism as a completely orthodox position for muslims? For muslims living under a non islamic country, what more can they do besides either trying to overthrow the government or live according to quietism?
Also don't most Sufi's keep sharia? Why would a sufi say that the Hijab has no inner meaning and is just some superficial aspect of islam.

>>14842717
Quietism is not an orthodox position, it cannot be defended based on Hadiths or Qur'an. They justify it by saying "prior to Medina revelation...." Yes prior to the Medina revelation drinking wasn't prohibited either. They know what they are doing

Muslims ideally should not live in a country where Muslims are the minority and should leave if they have the means, or move to an enclave within the country. In those where Muslims are the majority they must establish Sharia. Muslims are prohibited from Islam from taking each other to kuffar for settlement, turning your brother into disbelievers to judge according to their law is a grave sin. You are supposed to protect him (as well as a criminal from the kuffar if he asks asylum). Muslims are only allowed to judge each other by Shari'a

An individual cannot keep Shari'a, as Shari'a covers things that must be socially implemented. For example men and women are to be segregated, mixing is haram. But in a western country work and education forces you to mix. If any man says you can "keep Shari'a" solely as an individual in a society of kufr, he is lying to you. This is completely incorrect according to scholarly consensus for over a thousand years, it's shilled now to get Muslims to integrate, assimilate and westernize as individuals

>>14842717
>Why would a sufi say that the Hijab has no inner meaning and is just some superficial aspect of islam.
And the answer to this, btw, is Murad supports eroding Muslims being distinct and not assimilating. He doesn't get to be a heads teacher at Cambridge by going against what the powers that be want

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/08/09/muslims-and-islam-key-findings-in-the-u-s-and-around-the-world/

Understanding Syria

https://twitter.com/M_Alneser/status/1104740658353446914?s=19

>>14841477
>>14841485
>>14841501
Holy shit. As a Muslim born and living in a country where the Muslim community is small and generally maligned by media and authorities, I have noticed that people from a Shia/Iranian background are always first to leave the religion, and attack practicing Muslims in our country. They give fuel to the Islamophobic political parties, they even join them and help them sabotage our community and our activities. Seeing this entire thread, I finally understand why - these people are literally insane

>>14843786
They are pure cancer

>For a Muslim deliberately to be sent to certain death has been considered sacrilege within Islam. Even the founders of the Islamist movement – Hassan al-Banna, Abu Mawdudi and Sayyid Qutb – never recommended that form of jihad. That is why in Soviet-occupied Afghanistan between 1979 and 1989 not a single suicide attack took place.[5] The systematic employment of Muslims as guided human bombs with the aim of killing as many people as possible was not seen in the first 1360 years of Islam but was invented only 25 years ago.[6]

>Suicide terror has little to do with Islam and still less to do with individual despair but a great deal to do with the ideology of Iran’s Ayatollah Khomeini. Khomeini was the first to develop a full-blown death cult and a new interpretation of the aforementioned sura 3/169 of the Koran. According to his theological worldview, life is worthless and death is the beginning of genuine existence. “The natural world,” Khomeini explained in October 1980, “is the lowest element, the scum of creation.” What is decisive is the beyond: the “divine world – that is eternal.”[7]


http://www.matthiaskuentzel.de/contents/suicide-terrorism-and-islam

>>14843786
The Twelfth Imam who has supposedly been hiding in a well for a thousand years and will come out and kill all the Sunnis

Shia have an interesting form of dhikr: it's cursing Aisha, radhi Allahu anhu, which they believe is a good deed. However many say it should be done silently when Sunnis are around

>>14843832
>Those children formed part of the mass Basij movement that was called into being by Khomeini in 1979. They consisted of short-term volunteer militias and represented about 30 percent of the personnel on the battlefield. Most Basij members were between 12 and 18 years young. They went enthusiastically to their own destruction. Before every mission, a small plastic key would be hung around each child’s neck. It was supposed to open for all of them the gates to paradise. “The young men cleared the mines with their own bodies,” a veteran of the Iran-Iraq War recalled: “It was sometimes like a race. Even without the commander’s orders, everyone wanted to be the first.”[8]

>>14842730
I think I have seen a number of your posts and comments over the last few months, and I have enjoyed and supported many of them, but this is the first thing I have seen you write that I am not able to support. And to be clear, I belong to the Athari creed.

It is true that much of the Sharia deals with matters of law and social interaction, but to say that a person cannot keep to the Sharia because he lives among non-Muslims is wrong. There would be no dawah if Muslims kept completely distant from non-Muslims. We live in complicated times, and the methods of dawah that we saw work for the Sahaba no longer work in these ages of complex philosophical and scientific discourse. You need to spend time with a people to be able to call them to the Deen.

I am born and live in a very white country, and Muslims make up something like 3% of the population. We have no political or social influence. Our community is small and powerless, but we are growing, and while many of our youth are falling into haram, our dawah activities and programs are increasing year by year, bi ithnillah. Many of us have been forged in the fires of doubt and desire, and have come out burning with the will to make changes. That would not be possible if we did not mix with the kuffar. It is a great fitna, and there is danger in Muslims going to places where practicing Islam is difficult, but we live in times where fitna is everywhere. It is impossible to avoid the poison of kufr even in your own home, unless you throw out the tv and cut the internet cables. We need Muslims who grow up among these people, who study beside them, who have degrees from their universities, and who can challenge them intellectually, and dispel the doubts that (let us be honest) a sizable portion of the Muslim community suffer from.

>>14843902
>There would be no dawah if Muslims kept completely distant from non-Muslims
Your idea of Dawah is a copy of colonialist evangelism. Islamic Dawah is done primarily after a people accepts jizya, or refuse and get enslaved (many of the great early scholars were former slaves), they live in Muslim households and see the beauty of the Deen. Certainly it can be incidental elsewhere like in South East Asia, but missionary work is western more than Islamic

>>14843839
Not any different than muslims and christians believing jesus/yousef is in hiding for 2000 years and will come out and kill all the unbelievers. Or jews believing the real Messiah will come and subjugate all gentiles, or medieval welsh peasants believing king Arthur will come and kill all english, or 19th century sudanese muslims believing the madhi will come and kill the british.

>>14843832
Suicide bombings have been succesful though, both mentally and fysically.

>>14843841
>>14843845
>>14843854
>>14843861
>>14843866
This is evil and has no basis in Islam. Daily reminder:
>The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "He who slaps his cheeks, tears his clothes and follows the ways and traditions of the Days of Ignorance is not one of us."
Pure bid’ah desu. The absolute state of Rafidis

>>14843957
No one thinks he is in a well

>>14843976
Yes ofc they are w natural substitute for artillery and drones. For a STATE to use them however is stupid

>>14843950
>Islamic Dawah is done primarily after a people accepts jizya, or refuse and get enslaved (many of the great early scholars were former slaves), they live in Muslim households and see the beauty of the Deen.
As I already mentioned, the methods of dawah that worked for the Salaf are not going to work in these modern contexts. It will never, ever happen again that a Muslim nation will come together under a pious leader, with enough military power to overtake a non-Muslim nation, and with enough power to implement the Sharia there. Not before the time of Esa (as) and the Mahdi, anyway. There are too many military alliances and complex power structures to allow anything like that to happen in the world. We are not even able to implement the Sharia in our own nations because of this. In addition to that, no one living today looks toward the Muslim world to see the beauty of the Deen - people are generally repulsed by what they see in Muslim nations and households. We do not lead the world in any field anymore. There were times we did, and during those times a person would convert solely because we were superior in terms of morals, strength, culture, cleanliness, dedication, and in every field of societal life.

The fact of the matter is that modern military technologies (like nuclear weapons, and missiles and drones) and alliances, as well as economics and politics, have made the kind of dawah you speak of obsolete. New methods are called for. That is not an innovation, but a necessity that arises when we meet something our Salaf did not meet. If you want to sit around and dream about impossibilities, that is up to you. But the world is in need of dawah, and even the Muslim communities are in need of being called back to the Deen. If we had better ways of doing it, we would, but as things stands, we do not. People today enter Islam because they read books defending and proving Islam, and they hear lectures about Islam. They talk with Muslims who are competent and knowledgable about atheism, scientism, and other fields.

>>14844050
You can get lost in a blip all you want. A good jihad is coming though.

https://twitter.com/Zalmay_Afg/status/1235921678384984064?s=19

>>14842641
>Hamza Yusuf
I agreed with something he said maybe 20 years ago about not attending protest marches, my thoughts are that it is not an effective means and allows your opponents to take note of everyone in attendance. If you have ascertained him correctly then his reasoning for not protesting in assembly/marches is very different from what I took away from his expression of that particular idea, he was mostly arguing the ineffectiveness.
I shared a house with a Shia guy once, had a few issues with him and a few problems, he was eating with both hands and we were alone so I reminded him of the hadith and he became angry and said something like if the Prophet (saas) or if Allah (swt) came to him face to face he still wouldn't stop eating the way he wants. I told my friend the retired Imam about it and he said that he would refuse to do his funeral prayers. He was also meant to my cat.
I think I should have been more wary about this guy before inviting him to live in the same house. I know a few other shias and they're not all entirely that difficult to get along with.

>>14844071
I assume you are not the guy I was talking with, because I expect better than this silliness from him.

>>14844000
Muslims and christians believe the Messiah is in the astral plane, waiting to come down to earth again on the day of judgment. medieval germans believed emperor Frederick ii was sleeping under a hill until germany would need him again. Don’t see why the idea of a mystic line of spiritual leaders hiding and teaching the faithful is so much more ludicrous.

>>14844093
No I am. It's not men like you who have kept the Deen alive, it's men like these

>>14843976
>Suicide bombings have been succesful though
I disagree. The targetted communities of these kind of tactics become more opposed to any kind of peace settlement regardless of who eventually wins the conflict, and suicide is not permitted in Islam except for under very certain criteria which is not the case in the vast majority of these kind of attacks.
There are also other non-suicide tactics which are as effective in most of these situations and it is important to be aware that the killing of non-combatants is against the sharia and also that if victory in battle occurs the matter of keeping the peace is the next priority which is one reason why there are rules of engagement in Islam.

>>14844105
If you believe that killing some mushrik streetshitters is going to "keep the Deen alive", then I have been mistaken in my assessment of your intellect. That is an impressive level of ignorance, and shortsighted as well. We live in times where countless Muslims living in every country are leaving the religion step by step, day after day. We live in times when Muslim leaders and scholars are not engaging with the great intellectual and spiritual failures in the world. People who pray beside us in the masajid are unable to answer basic questions about the Deen, and there is not a Muslim household on the planet without at least one member who is secretly a disbeliever - because of doubts that have not been addressed by our communities.

If you want to spend your time dreaming about young Muslim boys coming together to establish a khilafah, you are free to do so. But I can tell you this: the men who really kept the Deen alive were not blind to the needs of their time. They dealt with the problems in their societies - by the sword when that was appropriate, and by the pen and the tongue when that was appropriate.

>>14841157
Not you again. Fuck off you terrorist

>>14843902
>And to be clear, I belong to the Athari creed.
This btw doesn't necessarily mean anything. The Taliban are righteous Maturidi mujahideen, whereas the Madkhali are Athari collaborators. Aqidah is important but by itself doesn't indicate your sympathies

>>14844164
Suicide bombings don't necessarily target communities though they can

>>14844166
If you don't see this as a problem then you're worthless

https://twitter.com/NabeelgullAJK/status/1234514967241601025?s=19

Jihad is fundamental to the Deen, in Hanbali it comes right after the pillars. In defense of Muslims it's fardh. Keeping it alive is keeping Islam alive. Denying it us kufr

>>14844178
>This btw doesn't necessarily mean anything. The Taliban are righteous Maturidi mujahideen, whereas the Madkhali are Athari collaborators. Aqidah is important but by itself doesn't indicate your sympathies
I only meant to say that I am not some Sufi trying to dilute Islam down to only matters of the heart. I did not mean to say anything about particular political or social groups I support

>>14844178
>communities
Whether they are targeting combatants or non-combatants it is still suicide and it is not permitted except for in very certain (even extreme) circumstances in which case it becomes a matter of all apparent choices being wrong so taking the least wrong choice (which also though not necessarily has the most potential benefit). It is similar to a starving man being faced with death by starvation or eating something like a haram dead meat. The fact is, and my position on this is, that suicide bombing is not a permissible tactic and nor is it an effective tactic.

>>14844190
Oh, so you are a takfiri as well. Should not be a surprise, considering how childish everything you have been saying the last hour has been. I will waste no more time here.

>>14844225
You barely studied fiqh if you think saying something is kufr means you are saying someone is a kaffir or that you're making takfir. Imam Ahmed says kufr doesn't make someone a kaffir except in a few cases.

>>14844071
>a good jihad is coming through
>links to anti-Indian twitter post

Yes, I'm sure that Pakistan will go to war with India and defeat them and enforce sharia there despite losing the 3 previous wars they fought against India in and despite having an economy of life support and with an army less then half the size of India's

>>14844243
*on life support

>>14844243
I'm talking about the Taliban. Pakistan would probably get involved but they aren't my emphasis. That link had to do with Afghanistan, not Pakistan

>>14844241
I was referring to how easily you implied the worst of me, simply because I disagreed with you. You implied I somehow do not have a problem with Hindus slaughtering Muslims, and that I deny that jihad is a part of the religion. That is the exact methodology of the young fool takfiris we have been seeing all around the world recently. You people read a book or two, or even a few pages, and go around calling for blood as if you have any level of understanding. The proof of your deviance is in how you reduce the entire religion down to a couple of points - jihad, or al wala wal bara, or refutations - and that is all you focus on, when the Deen is far deeper and more encompassing than that.
I should have recognized the fact that half of what you write and post around here is perfectly in line with these deviants - I was too excited to see another seemingly well read Muslim on here to notice.

>>14844265
That's one op-ed, India is not going to send troops it would go completely against their usual foreign policy and everyone already knows that the Taliban are going to control the country eventually

>>14844265
Opinion pieces are testing the waters. Do you really think any sane person in authority would want to send in an occupying force to Afghanistan?

>>14844285
>>14844294
>India
>sane

https://www.thenews.com.pk/amp/624629-india-announces-support-for-ghani-govt?__twitter_impression=true

>>14844303
Announcing support and everything that may entail is not the same as sending in the troops. Fairly certain that the Americans and their vassals will also be supporting the Afghan government.

>>14844337
India knows Pakistan would fund and equip a Taliban incursion into Kashmir that would go through Hindus like shredded beef

>>14841157
How is this off topic filth still up

>>14844355
In the event of that possibility would India prefer to fight the Taliban in Afghanistan. They'd need to have full air support or somehow get the Russians via one of the northern countries or Iranians to allow them to resupply from those territories adjacent to Afghanistan.
I don't know but if India really wanted to do this occupation they'd likely end up with another war against Pakistan.

>>14844358
Shut it down

>>14844389
Iran supported the North Alliance so they would probably take that route. Either way though there is a real possibility of the annexation of Kashmir

>>14844355
Pakistan has already been giving massive amounts of funds and weapons to Kashmir insurgents for decades which hasn't been able to change anything

>>14844508
The Taliban are qualitatively different from Kashmiri. That's India's concern

>>14844519
Every inch of the line of control separating Indian and Pakistan controlled kashmir is covered with barbed wire and mines and manned by troops, the Indian and Pakistani sides often shoot at eachother with soldiers there being killed every year. A bunch of Pashtuns carrying guns are not going to be able to simply waltz into Indian-controlled Kashmir just because Pakistan is funding them, you are larping if you think otherwise. The Indian military there massively outnumbers any amount of guerrillas who might possibly be able to slip in, there is no chance of Pakistan ever aquiring Indian Kashmir.

Lol at how the only two somewhat literate muslims visiting this board end up disagreeing, to the point one calls the other a kaffir.

>>14844595
There are 12 posters itt and if you want to you can subtract the actual shitposters. There are more than two literate Muslims here. Also I don't think he did call him that so stop trying to cause trouble.

>>14844554
If Al-Qaeda can get in there (and they have, they wrote the above letter), so can the Taliban. They're not just a bunch of Pashtuns, they're an elite force fighting since age twelve with their own special forces units

>>14844164

Meh, blowing yourself up on a military control post or police station taking down 20 soldiers is definitely effective, and can be done without civil casualties. Plus the moral effect is not to be underestimated.

Besides, how come theoretically sharia forbids harming non combatants, yet in every conflict, during wartime or peace, infidel non combatants and civilians have been killed, enslaved and harmed by muslims? How would it for example be lawful jihad to sail all the way to iceland to abduct some random nordic peasants as slaves (as the barbary states pirates did)? Is the mere declaration of jihad by a sultan/caliph enough to make it lawful? Its not like those icelanders were spanish catholic fanatics waging war on the ottomans or anything.

>>14844480
>annexation of Kashmir
By whom?

>>14844672
Be up to Kashmir

>>14844663
Killing any fighting age male of the enemy is permitted. He says noncombatants but in Shari'a that means women and children (who can be enslaved during war, but you cannot mutilate or kill your slaves)

>>14844663
>How would it for example be lawful jihad to sail all the way to iceland to abduct some random nordic peasants as slaves
They lacked commercium

>>14844663
Enslavement is a different issue. As for the suicide bomber at a checkpoint example, there are other ways to blow up a checkpoint with the same outcome and without a suicide bomber.
The change in enemy morale will be the same whether the checkpoint is destroyed by suicide or by other means.
When I talk about a suicide attack being the best choice of all bad choices it is for example if you and one companion see a company of enemy forces approaching some village and you don't have time or means to alert the people in time to flee your choices are do nothing or attempt to slow down the advance of the enemy even though you know that you will not survive. So you send your companion to alert the village and you attack the overwhelming odds against you.
You can try yourself and think of quite a few ways to blow up a checkpoint when you have enough explosives to make a bomb already. Arguing the way you are about it is just being lazy, like how some Muslims will argue that there's no difference between taking a bank loan for a house and paying interest or taking a bank loan for a house and paying rent on the amount of the house that the bank owns. It is like food, a halal kebab and a pork kebab can have the exact same nutritional values, the difference is one of them is haram.

>>14844712
So that means that i (fighting age male infidel) am liable to be killed by any muslim at all times? If tomorrow some nafri cunt would stab me in the metro then thats alright according to the rules of jihad? Or does there have to be an explicit declaration by some authority(is that even possible since the caliphate doesnt exist?) or is there just a tacit enduring state of war, making it(killing infidel combatants and enslaving non combatants) lawful in general, without some aggravation, war declaration or specific motive?

>>14844751
Generally if you have a peace agreement with Muslim countries it means you can't be targeted. However if your country is making war on Muslims (as the United States was until recently), then it's halal to kill you, yes. Russians for example would be halal to kill (men) or enslave (women), because they are currently bombing us

>>14844747

Alright I understand your point, fair enough. Just pointing out that the idea of it being ineffective is not so valid as you might think. But I fully understand the reasoning as it goes against laws of jihad/shariah.

Could the ‘human waves’ tactics as employed by khomeini or the soviet union be in any way considered unlawful? Sending in 16-year olds without arms against machine guns and into mine fields is practically suicide no? Or is it lawful because the purpose of the act is not directly dead by yourself but by enemy means?

>>14844751
It's during war. Even if your country had a jihad (war) declared against it there are still tactical considerations and random men being stabbed on public transport may not be a good tactical choice. There ought to be a consensus of opinion reached amongst the current Islamic scholars pertaining to all of these matters otherwise these kinds of things can easily fall into anarchy, so long as there is no scholarly consensus of opinion and no direct command from whichever military force your country is fighting against then no you shouldn't be worried.
If I was riding public transport and saw someone yelling the takbir and just stabbing any man he saw I'd like to think I might try to stop him, he'd likely be a bit mental no doubt.

>>14844787
It's a tactical choice still. In those instances the ideas were respectively to clear a path through the minefield and to zerg rush the machine guns, by using meat shields in both cases, and neither of those examples are what I'd consider pertinent since the first is commanded by shias and the second one is commanded by communists.
Jumping in front of a bus is still suicide, it comes down to intention.

>>14844777

So you would agree that sailing all the way to iceland to enslave non combatants was not lawful jihad? Iceland was not an independent state and could not make acts of war against islam. Furthermore, the king of denmark, the sovereign ruler of iceland at the time was actively at war with catholic Habsburg(who were notoriously anti islam). Isnt it then wrong to sail 2000km to kidnap some random peasants who probably have never even heard of islam?

So the truck attack in Nice some years ago would have been a lawful act of war, since france was bombing Islamic State and Syria? Or only if all the french killed were men of fighting age? And what if the motivation for the act is not primarily jihad but for example monetary? Is a muslim allowed to pimp out infidel women who come from a country nominally at war with the ummah? Or robbery of an inhabitant of a country at war with the ummah?

>>14844824
Pimping even of slaves is haram and criminal

>>14844790
Isn't there a hadith or a verse of the Qu'ran that decries the killing of innocents?

>>14844843
Probably. You can find a Hadith to support about any point of view.

>>14844843
Fighting age males are regarded as combatants in wartime

>>14844848
How sound it is is another matter. All the maddhabs mostly agree on fiqh except some minor things

Traditional Sunni Muslims here from Mauritanian.
The caliphate will never come to be, let alone be powerful enough to take on U.S.A.
And to be honest i have my doubts about a lot pf other things too, at this point i'm just trynna make it into heaven.

>>14845001
The U.S. is just Rome

What does traditional mean in Arabic? That's a RAND Corporation term for collaborator

>>14845026
>The U.S. is just Rome
Rome didn't have nukes
>What does Traditional mean
It means that I'm not one of those "Islam needs reform" faggots.

>>14845036
Nukes are irrelevant, civilizations and states are mortal. The U.S will fall into disorder, poverty, decay and division in time

>>14842326
>citing Hume
You are cheating yourself, akhi

>>14845160
How? Like Ibn Hazm I'm an extreme empericist

>>14845168
Astagfirullah, why do you cheat yourself out of faith? I'd suggest you read "A Confusion of the Spheres" Genia Schonbaumsfeld

>>14845203
My conception of faith is Islamic, not Xtian

The main question is why are Muslim societies still stuck in the Iron Age?

>>14845210
What exactly do you mean by that? The top three lowest crime rate cities of over one million are all Muslim

>>14845207
I'd suggest reading books in full rather than taking a quick look at the blurb, seeing "Kierkegaard" and then assuming otherwise

>>14845402
I didn't look at it at all. I'm talking about your insinuation that Ibn Hazm lacked iman , which makes zero sense outside of a Christian tautological framework (belief because of faith--the two are the same word in Greek, Latin, Hebrew and Arabic)

I'm fascinated by Islam, I really wish I knew more about its beginnings and how it spread. 1,800,000,000 follow the religion. It's amazing how powerful Islam is in the world.

>>14845422
Check out Islamic Exceptionalism

>>14845422
There are some good bibliographies of Muhammad (saas) you can read one of those, or just watch the film The Message with Omar Shariff

>>14845422
Read a biography of the holy prophet.

>>14845483
>>14845539
>>14845597
The problem with a lot of these texts is that they're usually done by a Muslim who wants to spread Islam. They don't give objective detail but glorify Islam. I've seen Islamic works before and they dare not criticise Islam.

>>14841477
>>14841485
>>14841501
>"NO YOU CAN'T JUST CUT THEIR HEADS THAT WILL HEAL FINE ANYWAY"
>Cuts off foreskins

>>14845625
the sealed nectar is mostly about muhammads battles against unbelievers. it doesnt whitewash anything

>>14845658
Muslims do not live according to desire and conjecture, but live in line with divine decree, you disgusting pagan. God decreed that we should circumcise, and He forbade causing harm to ones own body. One is a general decree, while the other is specific - and they are both valid.

>>14845625
>never studied the Islamic field of absolutely autistic authenticity analysis that is the science of isnad
If any ancient history is known with certainty, it is the life of Muhammed

>>14845797
Absolute dogwank, read any scholar on the history of early Islam. We have absolutely NOTHING from the Muslims concerning themselves until late into the 8th and early 9th centuries (AD), and non-Muslim sources until then are as vague as vague can be when it comes to describing the movement beyond anything more than politics, theology is never mentioned in non-Muslim reports.

>>14845786
In other words, you copied circumcision from the jews, who in turn adopted it from the pagan egyptians. Circumcision seems to be of peculiar importance to the semitic mind

>>14845999
Circumcision in Islam is both male and female (although female is optional in most schools). This is clearly different from Jews. Also from pagan Egyptians, who cut off the whole clitoris, whereas Islam says only the hood

>>14841157
"How to fuck a 9-year old" is pretty inspiring. Loads of details on how to do it properly. Mohammed had a nice writing style.

>>14846111
Child marriage was the default. So much that A'isha, radhi Allahu anha, was the only wife Muhammad, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, had who wasn't widowed or divorced. Child marriage in fact has many benefits and ensures and a very well bonded and attached couple

>>14846127
nice meme answer

>>14846159
Meme, how?

>>14841157
are some people here unironically larping as muslims? I'm egyptian and i can tell you that this backwards ass religion is pure cancer. It is imposed OCD on your mind, every muslim i know has some sort of mental illness or another. You western idiots have no clue what it's like to live in a muslim nation. It's literally being forced to adopt bronze age traditions in a modern setting. Religion is a cancer on this society honestly and i hope this is all ironic and people aren't gullible enough to fall for this sham

>>14841157

Have you read To The Mountains?
It’s a very interesting read about Algerian jihadist Abdullah Anas and his time with what became of the Taliban. Very eye-opening perspective and opened my eyes to a more open view of jihad as a philosophy of sorts.

>>14846248
Most Egyptians would say secularists like you are the cancer, you are probably a collaborator and regimeist swine.

>>14846261
No, I'll check it out, thanks

>>14846248
You should be unironically beheaded and I would thank Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, if I had the honor to do it. Filthy murtad

>>14846248
امك عارفة انك ملحد و تسب الإسلام على الإنترنت ؟

It was narrated from Mu’aawiyah ibn Abi Sufyaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) that he said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) stood among us and said: “Those who came before you of the people of the Book split into seventy-two sects, and this ummah will split into seventy-three: seventy-two in Hell and one in Paradise, and that is the jamaa’ah (main body of Muslims).”

think for yourself

>>14846321
So Sunnis

>>14846321
I thought there were no sects in islam?

>>14846479
There are, but apart from orthodox Sunni they're all insane and not really Muslims. There are Barelwi, Shia, Qadiani, Nation of Islam, etc

>>14846625

https://twitter.com/UmAzzamAlmaniya/status/1235932445691834368?s=19

>>14846261
Read My Life With the Taliban

>>14847680

>>14847684

>>14847691

>>14847700
>>14847680
>>14847684
>>14847691
Great stuff. Keep it coming. Is it common for them to abduct soldiers and turn them into their own?

>>14847724
It's very common for hostages and prisoners to sympathize with them as they consider them guests. This lad converted though and they gave him a wife. He's still living there with several children

People are to coup the King of Saudi Arabia. Shame they got caught

>>14847981
>People
More specifically other members of the Royal Family. No surprise unfortunately.

>>14847996
It's doubtful they were alone. Then again with the king's death, it is very possible MBS just fabricated this to tie up loose ends. He is an extreme liberal and knows he is facing dissent

>>14845786
>forbids harm
>except this one really harmful thing that removes millions of nerves and dries out your dick
What the FUCK was Allah's problem?

Also
>complaining about pagans while worshiping a pagan cube, stealing a pagan moon symbol, and following an amalgamation of heretical religions like arianism

>>14846248
>replies prove you right
Lol
But seriously, what the FUCK is the problem with Muslim countries?
>kills you for apostasy

>>14846321
>think for yourself
>by which I mean blindly, dogmatically follow this savage religion brought to illiterate tribal savages by a pedophile warlord who copied the homework of Semitic belief systems

>>14846102
So it is just another variety of tribal ritual with origins in ancient semitic paganism? Thanks.

>>14844777
>>14844712

Lmao dirty savages, how about you just stop your rape urges and murder fantasies.

>>14848823
The cube isn't worshipped, what are you even talking about? It's destroyed and rebuilt regularly. Even the black stone has been broken and stolen before. These don't affect the direction we pray.

The moon is the symbol of the Ottomans, it only became associated with Islam through them. The Shahada is the only real religious symbol of Islam

Arianism believes Jesus, alayhe salam, is a super powerful created being who later became incarnate. Islam holds nothing like this belief

Reminder that Henri Lammens (pbuh) has never been refuted.

"Some Orientalists have alleged that it has been touched up in order to bring the language to the standard of perfection set by the pre-Islamic poets. In that case we must suppose that these purists in their revision have paid no attention to the extremely primitive rhymes of the most recent Suras and above all that they have passed over slight faults of grammar and style which it would have been so easy to rectify. (Qoran 20, 66: inna followed by a nominative; 49, 9, dual subject of a plural verb.) In 2, 106; 4, 40-41, the predicate is singular in the first clause of the sentence, and in the plural in the second although relating to the same grammatical subject. In 27, 61; 35, 25, passim, Allah speaks in the third person; then, without transition, in the first. Thus in 2, 172, the celebrated philologist Al-Mubarrad read al-barr instead of
al-birr, in order to avoid this singular construction: ‘piety is he who...’ In spite of all this there is no occasion for surprise in the fact that the Qoran, especially the Medinese Suras with their more polished phrases, less interspersed with ellipses and anacolutha than the pre-Hijran ones, has served as the standard for fixing the rules of national grammar...

>>14849028
The editors of the ‘qirav’a mashhura’, or textus receptus, worked under the domination of a servile scrupulousness for tradition. Otherwise they would not have been able to resist the temptation to improve, by means of equivalents readily furnished by the lexicon, the poor rhymes terminating the verses. They would not have scattered broadcast through the collection, sometimes in the course of the same Sura, groups of verses which have a logical connection. They would have tried to delete or tone down the principal repetitions and tautologies which make its bulk unwieldy. Revision after the author's death would have modified the verses relating to Zainab (Qoran 33, 37), and brought into agreement the differing versions of the same prophetic legend. In the enumeration of the prophets it would have separated and distinguished between those of the Old and those of the New Testament, and such a re-editing would have brought consistency into the story of Abraham's relations with Ishmael and Isaac, which are completely dissimilar as related in the Mekkan or the Medinese Suras. In deciding what order to assign to the Suras a critical revision would at least have adopted some criticism less primitive than that of length. Above all, it would have cut out the most glaring anachronisms: the confusion between the two Marys (19, 22), between Haman, minister of King Ahasuerus, and the minister of Moses' Pharaoh (Qoran 28, 5-7, 38; 40, 38); the fusion into one of the legends of Gideon, Saul, David and Goliath (2, 250, etc.); the story of the Samaritan (sic)who is alleged to have made the Jews worship the golden calf (20, 87, etc.). The Qoranic Vulgate has respected all this, and left everything exactly as the editors found it."

>>14848957
>the cube isn't worshipped
LOL okay
>circular procession, kissing the stone, etc

Arians denied the divinity of Christ, as did Mohammed (pic related)

>>14846313
aywa ya ikhwan ya 3ars ya ibn el mtenaka.
Also i no longer live there, i'm in europe and obviously i don't have an arabic keyboard. But yes my mom knows i'm an atheist, she's a secular who wants mubarak back so yeah. He was definitely way better than any regime we have now.

>>14846275
>Most Egyptians
nah they hate your kind and love the army, eat shit

>>14848827
most muslim countries are secular. Egypt is and islamists are regularly thrown in concentration camps like in china. But the people are deeply religious because of years of neglect and oppression by the secular government. But the Muslim brotherhood are basically just clinton backed goat fuckers

>>14842214
Avecina

>>14849125
>>14843329

>>14849129
Muslim countries apart from Turkey are secular because they're ruled by a secularist military caste created by colonialists. This is the case with Egypt wnd Syria

>>14849028
>Reminder that Henri Lammens (pbuh) has never been refuted
He should try a tafsir by an Arab instead of his own

>>14848864
By your logic bowing or sacrificing an animal or praying are pagan

>>14849122
>wants mubarak back
necromancy is haram

Reminder that OP is a white larper who doesn't know arabic. He used to go by the trip Constantine and shill Eastern Orthodoxy here.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bild-frankfurt-cologne-sex-attack-migrants_uk_58a4407de4b03df370dbef93

Sex attacks in Germany

>>14841157
If Allah guides whom He wills, isn't it futile to describe life as a test (as I've commonly heard)?

>>14849605
Not really because all life is, is a means for determining where you get allocated in the external cosmos (hell can be temporary). So it's a test regardless of the outcome being predetermined

>>14843329
If you’re a true Muslim, why wouldn’t you support theocracy or sharia law? Why is this surprising?

>>14849634
The U.S. has been supporting a secular government as representative of the people. It's the one recognized by the UN. Russia and the U.S. just signed a joint declaration refusing to recognize the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan even though it's far more popular, people overwhelmingly prefer Taliban courts to Kabul's

>>14849628
How does that make any sense? Answer the question.

>>14849733
I did. All life is fleeting and nothing but an indicator of how you will spend eternity. How is describing it that way futile when that's what it is?

>>14849733
He did answer the question quite succinctly.

>>14848877
Probably should stop bombing our women and children then

>>14848877
You can't just rape women. Having sex with a woman who is not legitimately your slave or wife is extremely criminal regardless of her being of the enemy

>>14848877
Do you think it is right to hold other people to a higher standard than you hold your own people?

>>14849396
i meant his son

>>14849129
Isn't apostasy illegal in Egypt?

>>14850039
>our women and children
Funny way to spell 'donkey'.

>>14850050
>You can't just rape women.
Raping infidel women is halal.

>>14850230
No it's zina

>>14850230
What? Fornication doesn't become halal just because it's nonconsensual. You can't even touch them unless they are your slaves. Are you actually a Muslim?

What do you fags think about Dr. Jonathan Brown?

>>14850318
>>14850318

He is suspect on multiple counts. First he is Hanbali but doesn't grow out his beard (Hanbali says it is haram to cut it if it's shorter than a fistful). He also argues against death for apostasy when Hanbali is the strongest regarding that, holding even those who stop praying are apostates and must be killed. His wife is an executive producer for al-Jazeera and her father campaigned for Bush. So he is owned I would say by subversive interests, most likely Qatar regime

See
>>14842641

>>14850340
Also, he tweets about Sex and the City, which would be extremely haram in Hanbali school to even watch

>Shit on Shi'a
>Make no mention of Jews or Israel
I see the Saudi brainwashing works well.

>>14849781
Because you completely dodged the problem of predestination.

>>14850374
You must have missed the last thread

>>14850425
It's only a problem for Maturidi

>>14846248
I agree, do you watch George Paul on YT by any chance?

>>14850457
Do you believe what you type, or are you just trying to do the Muslim pilpul, the Islamic talmudic small-talk?

>>14850374
picrel is worth reading to understand somewhat the distinction between the concept of Zionist State and the reality of Judaism and Jews. It's even written by a Jew. He explains quite well that the majority of the support for Zionism is from particularly American Evangelical Christians obsessed with eschatology.

>>14850621
Fascinating. A Jew who says it's all the Christians fault. Thanks for the recommendation.

>>14850448
You always loved Israel, Parkus/Constantine. Don't lie.

What islamic studies do you love the most? For me its studies of sharia law, its amazing

Also anyone tried to become a hafiz?

I used to be in relationship with a man but after reading the old testament and the quran I turned to Islam instead. Muhammad (pbuh) and all amazing scholars of the sunni faith saved me from a life of sin

>>14850631
He doesn't say it's all the Christians fault nor the fault of all Christians. Read it, it's not difficult to find and it's worth it, I gleaned a lot from it myself.

>>14850621
Jews are a problem beyond just Zionism. They were our main focus of concern in the 20th Century even though Iran treacherous supported the Northern Alliance. Islamists did not really consider Shia a major enemy until they collaborated in America's invasion of Iraq and tried to purge us there. Then they allied with the Alawites and Russian kuffar against a Sunni Islamist revolution in Syria. This makes them serious and mortal adversaries as much as Jews are

>>14851101

>>14851101
Qutb was a freemason.

Cringe religion that forbids adoption because its founder wanted to fuck his daughter in law and even arab pagans had higher moral standards than that.

A social disaster, and we see in this in how desperate Muslims are to leave Islamic lands and live with literal trannified kaffirs because their fellow Muslims are so unpleasant and derelict.

>>14851101
What your pic says is Zionism bro. I'm not going to argue whether the Jews were a concern outside of the Zionistic implications since more than 80 years ago and this >>14851134
is hypothetical. I share and recommend that book because I found it beneficial myself to understand something about what is going on and why it is going on because I think those questions are important in as far as that if you can understanding the motivation can inform strategies against.
I think, and I'm not accusing you of this, that just saying that Jews are bad end of story is not something which as an idea can be in any way constructive for the good.
Put it to you this way, if we retake Palestine what then do we do with the Jews living there if we control the terms of the peace? For mine I think that some of the Jews would be happy to stay and pay tax and whatever restitution for any lands they stole.
Another thing is that if the Zionists were actually isolated and did not have any kind of support from outside they would be weaker than they are now, so understanding why they are being supported and by whom is necessary to challenge that support. For example, some of the Christian Evangelical Churches in America support Zionism because they believed that they can quicken the bringing about of certain events within their own eschatology.
It's fine though, I've read it and have told you what I think was important about it, and I don't think it's worth reading for every single person either.

>>14850211
not quite, but courts would still fine you based on immorality or perversion charges. People are deeply religious

>>14851527
as a former muslim, this is true

>>14842288
Rumi said something like that: do not twist the words to suit your mind, twist your mind to the meaning of the words.

I've read Miyamoto Musashi and some Rumi

>>14851381
Evidence? I know Shia propagate that slander, but I find thatextremely unlikely as he hated secularism and the west.

>>14851527
Islam doesn't forbid adoption, in fact it encourages it as an alternative to orphanages. It forbids fathers from taking the inheritance of adopted sons, or giving their own to such sons, or altering their birth certificates. This was indeed part of the declaration that the Prophet ﷺ has no sons (33:40); indeed none of his male children would survive. This has major political implications because it means his prophethood is not a dynasty and his position cannot be inherited. The story that he saw her in a state of undress and fell in love and then that’s why her husband divorced her has no isnad--that is, there is no chain or source for this, it appeared hundreds of years after his death. Here is what does have isnad: the Prophet ﷺ knew her from childhood and told her to marry his adopted son, which she really did not want to do because he was a freed slave and she was from a noble line, she looked down on him but still did it because Muhammad ﷺ told her to marry for piety and not birth . Their marriage was not happy, she had a bad temper and was very proud. He divorced her--which put her in a very bad position--and the Prophet ﷺ married her. As his wife she continued to be hot tempered and competed with A’isha (may Allah be pleased with her) for leadership of the wives, but came to her to defence when the latter was slandered. This is the account based on isnad.

>>14851584
You would do well to familiarize yourself with Islamic eschatology

If they surrender, we segregate them back collect jizya. If they don't, we kill the men and enslave the women and children. Simple as

Christians who side with the Jews are just as bad. Christians who oppose the Jews are less objectionable unless they love the Shia, in which case they are a serious and vocal enemy

>>14852059
We also allow them to take their possessions and leave unhindered. They have three options, pay tax or fight or flee.

>>14852088
No, possessions? Why would we allow them to take their capital? As for even offering the choice to leave, I don't see think it makes sense for a group that large. They will just plot against us

>>14841157
are there any unironic western converts to islam here? I find that fascinating in a way that some view islamic culture as an alternative to neoliberal capitalist culture

why are all muslimoid countries shitholes

>>14852166
>shitholes
iran is industrialized and has high standards of living, so is turkey and the Saudi arabia and the UAE, Malaysia? Plus most muslims don't put their importance on the material world. Their goal in life is to submit to God. The rest to them is secondary

>>14852148
I am. لا اله الا الله

>>14852120
>why allow them to leave?
military fiqh

It's also can be more convenient than enslavement or forcing a belligerent populace to keep peace and pay tax.

>>14852148
I am but it had nothing to do with rejection of neo-lib culture in favour of Islamic culture.

>>14852227
are you some white guy who wanted a cute muslim gf? What made you convert?

>>14852237
what was it then ?

>>14852239
He was inspired by the Afghan holy men and their chai boys

>>14852229
Enslavement of the men is unwise. At best the men should be ransomed. They're Jews, some bank will foot the bill


Military fiqh for what maddhab?

>>14852239
Gf's are haram and I had to forgo a relationship with a woman who fell in love with me after I converted. I converted because I hated Islam so I researched it to attack it but ended up being converted by it

>>14852244
I just picked up a biography of Muhammad (saas) one day because I was working with a Bosniak and purely out of interest to find things to talk about with that guy and maybe understand him from his point of worldview. I read it and I knew Muhammad (saas) was a true prophet based on what I knew already about prophets from the bible (I was a protestant). Said the shahada at a mosque youth group probably a year later.

>>14852272
>Military fiqh for what maddhab?
I'll have look it up but I'm pretty sure Hanafi at least if not others. The three options is what the Ottomans were doing, maybe the options are optional too. Honestly I think it's across the board but will check.

>>14852289
Yeah I figured. Hanafi is pretty lenient to the conquered. I personally for example don't think mushrikeen should be allowed to be Dhimmi but Hanafi fiqh allows this based on Zorastrians having been Dhimmi under the Sahaba. For me that just means Zorastrians can

>>14852299
And by mushrikeen I mean Hindus, not ahlul al kitab

>>14852307
Ahlul* kitab

>>14852272
this has to be a larper.

>>14852247
uhmm, based uwu

>>14852299
I'm still looking for an actual reference for it. As far as I know only ahlul kittab can be dhimmi in general, mushriks would be a seperate category.

SHUT IT DOWN

>An event sponsored by the Muslim Students Association (MSA) at York University that was to feature a speaker with a history of anti-Semitic comments has been canceled.

>The event, part of Islam Awareness Week, highlighted a talk by Ustadh Daniel Haqiqatjou.

>The cancellation came after Jewish organizations complained that Haqiqatjou has a history of problematic attacks on Jews and homosexuals.

>The Jewish Defence League (JDL) was first out of the gate, publicizing an email letter to York University president Rhonda Lenton that called on her to cancel the event while noting, “Jewish students on campus have been victims of anti-Semitism for far too long."

https://www.cjnews.com/news/canada/controversial-speaker-will-not-present-at-york

>>14852361
Hindus were based on Hanafi fiqh. Imam Abu Hanifa's methodology is based mostly on determining universal principles which underlie Sharia in order to decide on cases where the Qur'an and Sunnah are not explicit. This is what distinguishes him from more textualist fiqh which rejects the idea of underlying principles unless they are explicit

Why did the Persians become retarded once they got assfucked by Islam? Also, should one think of Islam as a pastiche of real religion, or is it more like a parody?

I can't take the religion seriously at all because everyone of them I've met have been dope dealers, hedonists or consoomers. It's even more degenerated than Christianity and retains no genuine Tradition at all. It's only used by modernists to practice geopolitics, like salafists being an arm of the CIA and Mossad, or those street vendors who call themselves clerics in Iran with their tinpot regime.

>>14852400
Persia was undone by the Safavids, not Islam. Islam made Persia more influential and powerful than it had been since antiquity

Muslims who don't pray are apostates

Of Salafis, Madkhalis are the arm of the CIA. Sahwa aren't.

>>14852011
> Evidence? I know Shia propagate that slander, but I find thatextremely unlikely as he hated secularism and the west.

He literally published an article called "Why I Became a Freemason." Can you read arabic fluently?

>>14852400
They didn't. They literally produced the Islamic golden age and everything good that came from Islamic culture. Now Islamic culture has fossilized and returned to barbarism. Read Oswald Spengler.

>>14852451
>>14852011
Forgot pic.

And it's not Shia sources. Weird that you would assume that. It's in fact an Egyptian source. A biography of Qutb.

Are you not Arab? You're not some kind of white ginger convert larper brainlet, are you?

>>14852463
>a new biography from a literal who published under patronage of the Sisi regime discovers a previously unknown article where Qutb says he is a mason

Lol.

>>14852433
>Muslims who don't pray are apostates
Aren't they supposed to be killed or something? It's the only sort of muslim I've encountered, and we've been flooded with the shits. I know René Guénon got into Islam and I respect the man, but holy shit is it just as spiritually dead as any other religion these days. Their daughters are whores and their sons are lowly thugs. If the West wasn't so retarded and cucked we'd purge them.

I would respect them if they actually fought us like men with dignity and honour, but they don't. They rob kids, peddle drugs and rape stupid women while our politicians rain tax money over them. There was this one muslim who coomed to porn until he slaugthered an old liberal moron of a lady, who gave him money to help him out, to afford hiring a prostitute.
>>14852451
>Read Oswald Spengler.
I suppose I have to at this point, he seems to have been right about many things.

>>14852498
Bro, I'm Egyptian. Quit larping. You know that you're supposed to ease your way into Islam and not become a fanatic from the outset? You don't know what you're talking about and are overly proud. Islam isn't what you think it is.

>>14852463
what about women

>>14852506
Guenon wasn't right about everything. Nihilistic modernity is ripe in Islamic countries, but people hide it, unlike in the west.

Sufis hearts are in the right place but it's kind of cringe. Better than salafist dogs that's for sure.

>>14852506
Three of four schools say death for not praying, although tbf only Hanbali sees it as apostasy, the others allow a Muslim burial


>>14852508
You're an Egyptian who doesn't know who Sisi is and his stance towards the Ikhwan? That everything published online or off is vetted by the government? Are you really this stupid? This is worse than citing a biography of Trotsky published in Stalinist Russia and saying, "Bro, I'm Russian"

>>14852519
>Nihilistic modernity is ripe in Islamic countries, but people hide it, unlike in the west.
Yeah, that's what I've been assuming and seeing. They're faking it. I don't actually have a problem with the religion itself, it was once a proper Tradition. But most so called moslems are purely men of modernity and subhuman scum to boot.
>>14852544
>Three of four schools say death for not praying, although tbf only Hanbali sees it as apostasy, the others allow a Muslim burial
So how come it's not enforced then?

>>14852563
>So how come it's not enforced then?
The person must be told firstly, the given three days to repent and if they refuse they must be condemned to death by someone qualified to issue a fatwa

>>14852544
And you think it's guaranteed to be false otherwise it would shatter your anglo convert worldview. Muslim Brotherhood are the enemy of the people and always have been. Egyptians are right to oppose them.

>>14852596
Egyptians oppose them so much they need a dictator to tell them so and murder anyone who says otherwise wholesale and torture and rape the wives and daughters of dissenters.

>>14852563
Yeah and salafism does its part to help erode traditional Islamic culture and turns everything into a one size fits all Islam. What happened to Catholicism will happen to Islam, it's just slightly delayed due to material circumstances.

>>14852612
What is Salafism and how does it differ from orthodox fiqh?

>>14852607
Yes.

We begged the military to form a coup against them for a reason. I'm curious, where do you live and have you ever lived in a Muslim country?

>>14852627
Please stop. You are a murtad. Most Egyptians are Muslims. Even the regimeist rat El Tayyeb says murtads should be put to death

>>14852644
Answer the question. Where are you from and have you ever lived in a Muslim country?

>>14852647
No, you answer the question: where do you get off saying "we" when the majority of Egyptians would want you put to death? Including those I know?

It's the classic episode of the murtad trying to bully the convert.
I seen this before and the former calling the latter a muslim wannabe when he was drinking and not praying was pretty pathetic.

>>14852653
I see. So you are a larper who has never lived in Muslim lands...I've seen converts like you and you've all suffered some major trauma and are coping with a shitty life.

>>14852665
Not him but shut up. You say muslim lands like it means anything really.

>>14852665
Actually I get along very well with orthodox Muslims and have stayed with them and been offered a home in an extremely orthodox neighborhood which I plan to move to Insha Allah after I marry--my potential is a niqabi. I am considering hijra as well

>>14852674
>orthodox Muslims
Eh?

>>14852706
"""Fundamentalists"""

>>14852712
What the heck are you talking about? They're either practicing muslims or they are not, this isn't something you do by degrees. If they are of a particular sect or group then simply be specific.

>>14852737
They are practicing Sunnis. And of course there is a difference between what passes for practicing in the west and what is strict practice. For example not socializing, with the opposite sex, women not going about without a mahram and wearing jilbab and abaya and maybe niqab, men trimming the mustache and growing out the beard (at least Hanafi and Hanbali), etc

>>14852706
sunni is orthodox as in the majority and main body of the muslims, the other kinds are sects

>>14852750
There's no difference in what is halal, haram, obligated, sunnah, recommend, all that stuff.

>>14852768
Yes there is. For example Hanafi and Hanbali say it is haram to cut your beard below a fistful and recommended to shave your mustache. Maliki says it is haram to grow your beard longer than a fistful and haram to shave your mustache

>>14852832
In reference to this
>difference between what passes for practicing in the west and what is strict practice
see >>14852750

>>14852873
Oh yes. But this is because there is a lot of ignorance in the west as scholars give wrong teachings like "Islam gradually abolished slavery" as they are scared of being put on a watchlist. So many Muslims practice to the best of their knowledge but fall short of proper Islam

>>14852883
I recall a few years ago after isha prayers where I was living (in a western country) the imam would read a few hadith and have some open discussion with the brothers that stayed to hear them. One night he read some hadith about keeping slaves, and how to treat them and things of that nature, one of the brothers became upset and was asking why are we bothering to read about slavery we are wasting our time it isn't important there is no more slavery, I said then that there was slavery in West Africa and I knew this because I'd seen it on some current affairs news programme the day or a few days before.

>>14852980
Slavery is very important, first of all because it exists off the books in many places. Second it will probably be an element in jihad after the end of American hegemony Insha Allah. Third because Muslims should focus on a real legacy of Islam (improving conditions for slaves) instead of a completely bogus one (abolishing slavery)

This is the reason Christians love Assad

>>14853481

>>14853481
Pretty sure it has something to do with him not genociding them.

>>14853508
Pretty sure it has something to do with him genociding us. Trying to pretend Sisi treats Christians better than Morsi would be a lie, but Christians love Sisi because he kills us

>>14853508
Islamists don't genocide Christians. The Muslim Brotherhood doesn't. The Taliban doesn't. Al-Qaeda doesn't. Hamas doesn't. Even ISIS doesn't except for the occasional small group identifying with them.

>>14850374
Shia kill more Muslims than Israel does. Not that Israel isn't wicked, but Shia need to stop pretending to be friends based on simply opposing it

>>14853571
>>14853625
>>14854526
never seen such dishonesty

>>14852563
>They're faking it.
Faked it so hard they defeated the British Empire and both Cold War superpowers

>>14854695
Indignant Boomer

https://www.alaraby.co.uk/english/amp/indepth/2019/12/20/the-iraq-report-mass-graves-of-sunnis-found

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_2007_Mosul_massacre

>>14843832
Based. Sorry, Arabs, Iran follows the teachings of MANI

Is there something about the Sunni sect of Islam that makes them brainlets and terrible at war? It's literally Useful Idiots: the religion at this point.

>“We, as Christians, do not feel that we are isolated in Gaza, and Hamas reciprocates love, respect and appreciation with us,” concluded the Archbishop. “The Christian community in the territory is an integral part of the Palestinian people, and shares the same suffering and same hopes.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20191002-senior-hamas-delegation-visits-orthodox-church-in-gaza/

>>14854740
Terrible at war despite defeating the USSR and now the United States?

>>14854767
>Terrible at war despite defeating the USSR and now the United States?

Don't make me kek. Let's say Sunnis defeated the USSR and the United States (which isn't true but let's admit it for the sake of debate), why can't they defeat Assad or Israel? Why does every Sunni state support Israel?

>>14854777
Assad is backed by Russia and Iran, are you dense? He bombs every city to rubble and the rebels have no air support and virtually no anti aircraft capacity. An actual state, Turkey, got involved for just a few days and absolutely mopped the floor with the Shia during that time

>>14854777
>Why does every Sunni state support Israel?

First, this is false, see Turkey and Qatar.

Second, please do not conflate UN recognized states with Sunnism. The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan released a statement that Palestinians are the most oppressed people in the world but the UN will no more recognize them than Hamas. Regimes are as much an enemy of Sunnis as Israel is. Saud especially so. The scholars employed by Saud are in complete dissent from the scholars throughout the country. Furthermore loyalist Salafis, Madkhalis, support Assad.

>>14854800
>Assad is backed by Russia and Iran, are you dense?

But you just told me Sunnis can beat Russia.

> Turkey and Qatar

So secular states that are more often than not pro-Iran (especially Qatar).

>>14854839
Yes, Sunnis have, and indeed would if Russia is all they faced in Syria

>so secular states
All Sunni governments are ruled by secularists.

>>14854862
So Sunnis are cucked by their own people lel

>>14854871
The governments ruling Sunnis were in many cases installed by a military caste created by colonialists (Egypt, Syria--this used to be the case with Iran), in others by Sunnis who made deals with colonialists for power (Saud, UAE). Overthrowing these governments has been the primary objective for Islamists after the defeat of the USSR.

I think I should also mention that Islamists did not consider Shia a political enemy as we did Saud until the Shia collaboration with America in Iraq and attempt to purge us there. In fact Bin Laden's zeal was fueled by the infamous murder of Shia in the Sabra and Shatila massacre. Even though Iran backed the Northern Alliance, Islamists blamed the government of Iran, not Shia. But after Iraq and now Syria, Shia cannot but be regarded as a serious enemy of Islamists.

>>14852519
>Better than salafist dogs that's for sure.
How does it feel to be a cuck?

>>14854908
wahhabis and salafis have never been propped up by colonialists...not once...not ever

>>14854983
your reading comprehension is bad, he never said they were. He said they allied themselves with colonialists

>>14854983
You do not necessarily know what those terms mean as you use them mean any one who is orthodox. Al-Wahhab's distinguishing device was he made takfir (declared apostate) anyone for Eve minor kufr (the precedent had always limited it to major kufr) and not only that but said anyone who did not also make takfir was an apostate, and on this basis slaughtered many Muslims. No one actually buys this today except maybe ISIS (and even then only their wildest parties). His influence is largely limited yo reiterating what Ibn Taymiyya said. Saud does not follow his teachings, they just patronize his family, so Wahhabi was a political alliance between Saud and his family.

As for Salafis, that's a very confusing term. Are you talking about the movement inspired by Ibn Taymiyya dating back to the Middle Ages? The movement inspired by al-Shawakani who had nothing to do with al-Wahhab? The movement in the Levant and Egypt that started against modernist muftis appointed by the Ottomans and the Colonialists? Or the Madkhali cult which literally have their own "Salafi" mosques and exist primarily as Saudi booklickers, saying it's apostasy to disobey the House of Saud? Or the Sahwa movement which is a major Salafi movement that started against Saud for allying with America and Israel?

>>14855021
To simplify, when an actual practicing Muslim uses the word Salafi they mean either Madkhali (extremely negative for anyone who isn't one), or just the Athari aqidah (Atharis often call it Salafi, others not much as they don't like the implication it's the true creed of the Salaf and theirs is wrong).

I myself subscribe Salafi aqidah but I refer to it as Athari to avoid misunderstandings of association with Madkhalis

>>14842084
>the ummah on 4chan

I find this statement funny.

>>14852506
>Their daughters are whores and their sons are lowly thugs.

>if the West

Bro, you're describing the West except your sons are mentally neutured sexually frsutrated onions guzzling franchise addicts.

>>14855322

>>14852563
>I don't actually have a problem with the religion itself, it was once a proper Tradition
It was never perennialist lol

>>14845658
This picture is the opposite of what happened

>>14855322
Yeah, it's a pozzfest for everyone involved and the so called moslems aren't any different, they're the burning smelly garbage on the top of the trashheap. The retarded brown incels that the likes of Merkel wants to replace the people of Europe with are just as rotten if not worse since they are more destructive. And I doubt it's the case that they are very different from their countrymen, the entire middle-east is degenerate as fuck and most of the pretense of faith is just a larp.

if any of you convert and are from the uk, please marry me.

>>14855021
>>14855039
Nobody cares about your talmudism

Being Muslim is one thing, but being a fanatic is cringe, and white converts who act like this need to be locked up. People who act like this are almost always NEETs or ex-convicts and NEET.

>>14855825
>perennialist
In a sense Islam is perennial since it is following the tradition of all of the prophets, there is no distinction in the sunnah of Muhammad (saas) from the sunnah of Ibrahim (as) or any other of the prophets. Islam is not perennialist in the sense of acceptance of other religions in the current time (since Islam was established as a religion) being alternative paths to the truth, so I do understand what you mean there I think.
There's also some people get confused between what is meant by Traditionalist School in Philosophy and whatever /pol/ is talking about when trad is mentioned, there's clearly obfuscation obfuscation going on there.

>>14856712
You're calling him a fanatic because he is seeking clarification of terminology. Don't do that, it makes you look fanatical yourself about shutting down discourse and keeping the ignorant in ignorance. There's nothing wrong with establishing and clarifying various terminologies especially these days when the meanings of words are being changed by hive minded idiots and mob rule.

>>14856855
don't tell me what to do, samefag

get a job instead of becoming a fanatic terrorist

>>14842288
>katana
Not sure if joking but funny either way

Fresh bread

>>14857095
>>14857095
>>14857095