/lit/ - Literature

>>14662293
Have sex

>>14662300
I have had sex, that's the problem. Half of it involved me getting violently abused. Take your memes back to normieville.

>>14662293
The Piano Teacher by Elfriede Jelinek

>>14662343
I'll put it on the list, thanks. Any more details?

Who the fuck cares about women? It's 2020 nigger.

>>14662360
Is fag the hot new 2020 fashion? "Fuck you whores, we're doing it all ourselves now". Wish it were that simple.

>>14662293
The Bell Jar
The Female Brain
The Ethical Slut

>>14662374
The Ethical Slut looks entirely more self congratulatory than what I'm looking for, but the other two show some promise. Will add to list.

>>14662364
No. It's the new insight that we interpreted Kants imperative wrong for centuries. He said that you should never use a human only as a means to an end. The other person has always to be an end in itself. While this is true we have to ask ourselves what counts as a whole person. Women don't. They lack the intelligence, integrity and power that man have. Thus we can use women as a means to an end. This is what Kant was trying to tell us all the time. He just wasn't so obvious about it.

>>14662293
youre bitching because someone fucked you but didnt wanna be your boyfriend? is that correct? if someone fucks you they have some sort of obligations to you?

>>14662445
When you finally have an intimate relationship with a woman rather than your hand you might be able to appreciate OP's motivation. He is attempting to understand something that he has encountered ane endured, women. I unironically wish him the best of luck.

>>14662293
>complaining about getting laid too much
lol fag. anyway women are subhuman and have no inner lives so the book you’re looking for can’t possibly exist. good luck

>>14662293
The Bell Jar is a good rec. It reads like a self-deprecating Tumblr blog of a angsty teen girl. I couldn’t relate to it because of that, but I have no doubt there are people out there for whom it resonates with.

>>14662445
She didn't just fuck me, she made me jerk her off and constantly guilt tripped me. Told me I was sexually violating her one day, then the next she was calling me at 3 a.m. asking me to come over. Purposefully only told ME about her cancer diagnosis, so that she'd have an excuse to ask for my attention all the time that would make me feel obligated no matter how she was acting. Refused to acknowledge our relationship in front of mutual friends, as though she was ashamed of me.

>>14662364
I hate womeme and want to oppress them

>>14662293
Anna Karenina

>>14662293
currently going through Amor, Verbo Intransitivo(To Love, Intransitive Verb) and it looks like it dwells in this topic. I don't know how's the translation though.

>>14662479
ok seriously experienced frog poster.

>>14662494
so you bumped into an asshole - look for a book written by an asshole to learn more about assholes and stick your sexism up your ass while youre at it. sounds fun frankly.

>>14662515
Brekekekek Koax Koax
;-)

>>14662494
>>14662293
Fucking Christ OP, good luck. Although the most sane option might be to cut and run

>>14662515
Fuck off and die tripcode

>>14662521
Sexism? Your reaction to OP makes you sound like a girl to me. Are you? Asking for a frenn...

>>14662543
your reaction makes you sound .... underage?
Asking for a pedo cartel . . .

>>14662494
Jeez...
I would just dump her, and move on with life. Later the experience will make good grist for the writing mill. But in the meantime I would not delay, I would get out of such a toxic relationship "toot sweet"!

OP is in an abusive relationship, should bail out and cut contact with the manipulative bitch asap! Many chicks out there much more worth his time.

>>14662564
>>14662530
We broke up a year ago. I'm trying to understand what happened to avoid repeating the situation.
>>14662521
If it's sexism to acknowledge that there are differences in the ways men and women use their sexuality to abuse other people, the sure, I'm a sexist.

>>14662592
she was prolly just fucking with him because of his shit ideology and bad writing.

>>14662521
honestly, this is true. OP met a sociopath with a vag is all this is.

>>14662672
you seem like a pushover if you hadn't considered that

>>14662672
dont defend this fucking trash.

>>14662676
>pushover
Maybe so, but I need to know why and how it got to where it did.
>>14662677
Somethings really up your ass, huh tripfag. Don't like the idea that women should hold themselves accountable for the way they use their sexuality?

>>14662672
you're sexist because you are using this "there are differences between the sexes" thing as a way to get around saying: This woman is like all other women, whom I have not had the displeasure of meeting.

maybe you don't see it, but this assumption is what has revealed you.

>>14662672
in all fairness - yes you got abused and abuse takes processing time, because part of trauma , its difficulty, is that THERE IS NO REASON for it - it has no cause - its cause is someone's choice to be cruel and narcissistic and mean because thats the programming theyve got for survival. thats it. and you got your naive (no offense) self in the way in an honest search for love and friendship instead of just getting your dick wet. the problem is in your use of sexism as a coping device - you need to be researching toxic, abusive choices people make.

good luck.

>>14662689
>Somethings really up your ass, huh tripfag. Don't like the idea that women should hold themselves accountable for the way they use their sexuality?
again - you are , for whatever reason - barking up all the wrong trees.
good luck

>>14662697
>this assumption is what has revealed you

Ooh, get a load of Sherlock fucking Holmes over here.

Yes, all women have in common a gender, and this carries with it a specific set of sexual abilities, rights, restrictions, and privileges in their interactions with other people, also known as a "gender role". The way these gender roles inflect upon the way in which a woman chooses to abuse the men in her life is of interest to me, because I want to avoid being abused again.

But you know all of this, and are tossing out your accusations because you're uncomfortable with the idea that women should be held accountable for the things they do, likely because you're uncomfortable with the idea of recognizing women as having agency and power over other people in the first place. Likely because you are, yourself, a misogynist.

Or you're just a troll.

>>14662720
get a load of Shitlock Hurrduurr over here

>>14662720
>Gets cancer
Pretty sure god just held her accountable anon.
Just remember, male or female, if your enemies perish, go to their funeral to have a laugh and thank god.

>>14662697
to add so as not to just shit on you as a victim of abuse, cause I get that you're looking to make sense of things and being called sexist isn't a nice feeling (even though you are being sexist).

I'd suggest to analyze the ways you interact with people and the ways interact with you to highlight the times things feel most like an exchange, like someone is getting something from you or you're after something from them. In those times, is it acknowledged that is what's happening, or is it just the subtext no one is talking about? the former is healthy, the latter gets tiring and sometimes builds a platform to leverage someone's abusive actions.

the thing you should be looking for, across all relationships regardless of a person's sex, if you care and want to build and live in something positive, is to care about how YOU treat people and how they treat you. Sociopaths do not care how they treat people and will abuse you, and that has nothing to do with sex; although sex is already so manipulative and so it's prime territory to be abused, accidentally or deliberately.

>>14662705
Dude, you're fucking retarded. Everything a person does they do for a reason. Reducing it to biology is some frat bro pickup artistry shit. Go back to whatever pseud hellhole you crawled out of.

>>14662720
I am perfectly comfortable with laying the blame on sociopaths, just not an entire sex.

>>14662689
you being a pushover has nothing to do with women in particular, you should self reflect and try not to be prey the rest of your life

>>14662734
I'm not interested in advice, I'm interested in book reccomendations.

The idea that "sociopaths" are some inexplicable force of nature is peak pseudery. Everyone has reasons for what they do, those reasons are broadly explicable, and are consistent across similar types of people. Your vague "be nice to people and focus on YOU" bullshit is something assholes who refuse to take responsibility for themselves parrot to make other people seem like assholes for asking why the fuck they do what they do.

And no, I'm not sexist at all. You've just got a fucked up definition of the word.

>>14662741
When have I blamed the entire sex? Quote me the fucking sentence you're referring to. I asked for examples of the depths women can sink to. I never said they all do. I never said most do. I never said women were in any way inferior to men or anything. I just said that they share certain, specific patterns of behavior when they engage in abuse.

>>14662735
It's not clear what else there is apart from biology. Culture had to ultimately have been created by biology as well.

>>14662323
The key is to be the violent abuser, and to make sure they genuinely believe if they involve the authorities, leave you, or cheat that not only are they going to die but so are their parents, siblings and pets.

>>14662293
This thread again. OP you may be a newfag but everyone knows we hate women, why create yet another thread that hogs the entire board with anons chiming in their remarks and adding to the meeting pot of distrust and mental illness we have going on here? Just dump her and move on man, don’t be one of )))those((( guys

>>14662751
You know what you're looking for and just want validation in the form of a book, alright. I hope you don't abuse many people in your life.

>>14662748
It has everything to do with women in particular, because women are the ones who have abused me in this manner. Jesus fuck, why are you people so offended at the implication that women share common characteristics. This is bordering on PC shit.

>>14662762
If I met you, you can be certain I'd abuse the fuck out of you. You're fucking insufferable.

>>14662766
>>14662755
Seek therapy. With an Outlook heading in the direction you are, you'll come to conclusions like:
>>14662759

again, I just hope you don't abuse too many people in your life. goodbye.

>>14662751
Sociopaths exist because in a world filled with unsuspecting normies it can be a very good adaptation, but only as long as their percentage relevant to the general pop remains low and their doesn't exist widespread neurological testing to weed them out. It's also in many ways more suited to earlier epochs of human civilization

>>14662758
>it is not clear
The constant naysaying was exactly what she used to do, too. "there's no way to know" " the world is a complicated place" "you can't analyze it"

These are all lies people tell themselves when they're trying to hide from all the fucked up things they've done.

Dismissing the possibility of understanding isn't something intelligent, mature people do, as much as pseuds and juveniles like to pretend so on this board. It's something grown children who, I say yet again, refuse to accept responsibility for their actions, hide behind

>>14662735
i think you are the reductive one. i didnt reduce anything. so go fuck yourself ok?

>>14662792
My understanding of how the world works doesn't lead to this conclusion. Society only incentivizes sociopathic behavior in public, outward facing spheres. Within intimate spheres and familial relations, it incentivizes the opposite.

But even if this is true, I'm not going to stop thinking about it until I know how to spot a psychopath, how to prevent one from fucking up my life, and, ultimately, what it is they want.

>>14662778
You're an awful, judgemental, hateful person and I hope you get hurt bad enough that you realize what it means to say the things you do.

>>14662811
Familial spheres are where it's most useful, exploitation begins at home

>>14662820
I really wanted not to be. I suggested things because I am worried you are confused and looking for resolution in places that usually only cultivate more animosity and insecurity. My suggestions were sincere, get therapy or risk seriously considering the alternate survival mechanism against other people's abusive manipulations is to be the violent abuser and confront them quicker than they can ensnare you.

I did jump to criticize you as a sexist, because this is 4chan, and I should have put the other stuff first.

>>14662822
This has not been my experience. I was in many ways neglected and subjected to unhealthy environments in my own home life growing up, but I wouldn't attribute this to sociopathy, because it had clear sources.

My mother lost an infant before me. My parents relationship was built in deep codependence, both as a way of coping with this loss and because the history of their relationship was fraught before this with uncertainty. My younger sister had autism, which required them to expend more energy on her than on me.

The confluence of these events lead to me being largely neglected as a child, which warped my personality in various specific ways which I understand and try to deal with.

I need to understand how women work vis a vis sexual power dynamics in a similar cause-effect fashion, because know enough about how I behave and feel that if I can understand what terms they are operating on, I will be able to deal with successfully and defensively with them.

All of this is explainable without recourse to sociopathy or biological reductionism

>>14662799
What do you think can determine human behavior apart from biology? I mean we evolved like the other life forms

>>14662844
The sexism accusation was not as much an issue as the implication that I myself am an abuser, an implication that carries with it the idea that I am lying or being dishonest to myself about the abuse I have experienced. Thats, like, the first thing they teach you not to suggest to people in situations like mine.

But I am sorry for reacting so histrionically.

>>14662852
but you have been acting very sexist, very angrilly and judgmentally - that other anon was perfectly justified and you should give some time to reflect on their reaction.

good luck and good bye

>>14662852
The implication was not that you ARE an abuser but that you could become one.

>>14662849
Humans interact with other people based on their desires or needs. These needs are arranged into hierarchies of importance, which ascend in complexity and descend in intensity as one moves along the scale.

The biological needs are not necessarily purely the basis of the higher needs, because each step along this scale intensifies the abstraction of the need and renders it more spiritual and less physical.

To understand the manner in which women abuse people using their gender role, it is important to understand the ways in which this gender role interacts with the basic slate of human desires to emphasize some and deemphasize others, especially at this particular point in historical time and among specific classes of people.

For example, most women I've known value friendship more than men, and feel betrayed by the sexual interest of their male friends more than would be the case for a man. This must result from the ways in which female gender roles construct friendship. It must be a more scarce quantity for them than for men, if women are undifferentiated from them at the base level before the intercession of gender as a relation of means to ends. Otherwise, women are fundamentally different than women in their desires. I have, after some months of consideration, decided that the former is the case, and that the point of inflection which differentiates men from women is not in their desires except at the physical level, and that all upper level differences are resultant of the economics of these physical differences.

Therefore, I need literary examples of women at extremes of desire and therefore abuse, in order to map out the boundaries of where their incentives can lead them.

>women being honest with themselves

Lmao good luck

>>14662864
You're just not that intelligent, man. Goodbye and good luck.
>>14662866
If that's where understanding leads me, that's what I'll become. I don't think it's where it will go, I think the idea is laughable. But I'm not going to allow myself to fall victim again, and I'm not going to try to forge on without some kind of understanding of what I'm doing and why. For me, the alternative to a well reasoned relationship between my means and ends is suicide, because i will not charge blindly back into the place I was with her before.

>>14662883
whatever
i didnt jerk off a sociopath for a year.

>>14662883
Ya, seek understanding. We need it so I can't blame you.
....just don't blame the women.

>>14662883
Women have a different way of coping with our hypersexualized hypercapitalist society. Attractive women learn they can leverage their looks to manipulate men the same way men can manipulate women with money. Modern hook-up culture burns out men and women's dopamine receptors and then men withdraw into their ability to provide and women into their ability to attract. This is why young women expose themselves and you men flash their wealth. The ideal women in our culture is measured not by the virtue of being a mother but instead by the dimensions of her secondary sexual charateristics. Men measured by their bank accounts and the false god of fake masculinity.

Go to your local strip club, buy a few dances and try and make friends with the dancer. Take her out without the expectation of physical intimacy and buy her an expensive dress and a nice romantic meal.

>>14662343
(nobody is actually like that)

>>14662293
>thinly veiled "books for this feel" cuckporn post

>>14663515
just become a paypig 4Head

>>14663928
You remain an incel. You are trapped in your intelligent analytical bubble. Women don't want to be analyzed and treated like spending time with a doctor as a patient or a salesmen and a client. They want to feel comfortable being themselves and desired. Attraction is a game and women want to feel like they are accomplishing something by earning your physical contact.

Imagine you had a daughter and become the man you would be proud of her to be with. Stop expecting women to enjoy being treated like they owe you time or intimacy because you have money and don't do drugs (or even worse are a neet who thinks his intelligence and ability to get straight A's in highschool means anything in the real world)

>>14664260
>all this massive projection in response to a twitch meme
kek

>>14664296
My bad, I don't use twitch. I suppose I am projecting but the first step to resolution is recognition.

>>14664260
Femcel alert. Everyone has had sex and relationships itt but you lass. Settle down.

>>14664405

yes, shucking and jiving will solve your problems. it won't make you even more of a neurotic, flagellant wreck than you already are

>>14662389
I own it. Ethical slut is 7/10. More helpful than... Degenerate