/lit/ - Literature

>>14643495
The problems of Philosophy - Bertrand Russell

huh, all the newfags asking about philosophy must be from pewdiepie. i guess he made a video recently or something?

>>14643515
Yes, indeed, how did you know? I want to read philosophy so I can better understand Felix 'Ubermensch' Kjelberg talk about elon musks funny tesla memes!!!

>>14643495
just said this on a different thread but look up some philosphy phd programs and find their reading lists

with most lists you'll be starting with pre-socrates and working your way forward. there are no shortcuts

>>14643543
great suggestion, thank you

Just read a fuckload of Plato's dialogues. Then look through Wikipedia and SEP pages for other major philosophers/topics (Aristotle, Locke, Hume, Kant, Hegel, logic, metaphysics, ethics, epistemology, philosophy of mind, etc.).

>>14643722
>Look through the Wikipedia page for Hegel

>>14643495
Some basic theorems on the foundations of mathematics and their implications - Godel
Hegel's Philosophy as a Doctrine of Concreteness - Ilyin
Philosophy of Civilization - Towner
Metaphysical Principles of the Infinitesimal - Guenon
Fire in the Minds of Men - Billington
Ordeal of Civility - Cuddihy
Foundations of Geopolitics - Dugin
Collapse of Complex Societies - Tainter
Saint Clement of Alexandria
Saint Maximus the Confessor
Saint Ephraim the Syrian

>>14643515
He took a break, hasnt uploaded in a fortnight.

Just read a book on Category Theory.
Then you'll know philosophy and more math than 99.9% of all the pseud teenagers on /lit/.

>>14643722
Would you suggest his complete works, or is that too much overboard? (complete works always seem based to me desu)

>>14643495
Familiarise yourself through /lit/. Quite literally the best place for that.

Read Plato, the fragments of Heraclitus(and find "the speculative ideal), Aristotle, Homer/Hesiod, Greek tragedies, maybe some Stoics, Augustine, (Neoplatonists,) maybe one Hermetic text, some medieval literature, summary of Thomism, Machiavelli, summary of Descartes, Leibniz, Kant, Boehme, Fichte, Schelling, Hegel, Schopenhauer, Wagner, Nietzsche, kierkegaard, hoydeggewhite somethingi dun o' eny mor

>>14643495
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1y8_RRaZW5X3xwztjZ4p0XeRplqebYwpmuNNpaN_TkgM/mobilebasic?pli=1
open in a new browser so you dont doxx yourself
Get books on the high seas from zlib etc

>>14643815
the formatting gave me cancer

>>14643833
Same, but it is still a good resource.

>>14643769
wtf am i reading

>>14644442
a very excellent list

>>14643769
>Saint Clement of Alexandria
>Saint
Check Again

This is a good list though

Read the Platonic corpus and discover that anything beyond it is but a corruption of true Philosophia.

>>14644725

You're aware that most of the intellectuals and philosophists of that era adopted the guise of whatever religion was going on in order to study, aren't you?

Why is it trendy nowadays to go against religion? We scientists also praise a god, the god of logic. The basic axioms of mathematical logic are apparently "self-evident" and can't be questioned. Doesn't that sound familiar?

Why would we be able to use our logic to describe the universe perfectly?

MINIMALIST:

Plato's Trial Of Socrates / Aristotle's Organon / Epicurus Essentials
Plutarch's Lives / Plotinus Enneads / Proclus Elements Of Theology
Augustine's Confessions / Aquinas's Shorter Summa
Descartes Meditations / Spinoza's Ethics / Leibniz's Discourse
Locke's Human Understanding / Berkely's Human Understanding / Hume's Human Understanding
Kant Prolegomena To Any Future Metaphysics/ Hegel's Philosophy Of History / Schoppenhaur's Four Fold Root Of Sufficient Reason
Stirner's Ego And It's Own / Kierkegaard's Either Or / Nietzsche's Beyond Good And Evil

MAXIMALIST:

Epic Of Gilgamesh / First Philosophers by Waterfield
Hermetica / Upanishads / Bhagavad Gita
Patanjali's Yoga Sutras / Laozi's Tao Te Ching
Hesiod's Works And Days / Sappho's Odes / Aesop's Fables
Sun Tzu / Machiavelli
Confucius's Analects / Buddha's Dhammapada
Plato's Trial Of Socrates / Aristotle's Organon / Epicurus Essentials
Cicero's On Duties / Boethius Consolation Of Philosophy
Plutarch's Lives / Plotinus Enneads / Proclus Elements Of Theology
Seneca's Letters / Epictetus's Discourses / Aurelius Meditations
Ptolemy Almagest / Copernicus Heavenly Spheres / Kelper's Epitome Of Copernican Astronomy
Talmud / Bible / Quaran
Augustine's Confessions / Aquinas's Shorter Summa
Montigane's Essays / Bacon's Essays
Hobbes Leviathan / Pascal Pensees
Descartes Meditations / Spinoza's Ethics / Leibniz's Discourse
Locke's Human Understanding / Berkely's Human Understanding / Hume's Human Understanding
Montisque's Selected Political Writings / Voltare's Candide / Burke's Reflections On The Revolution In France / Tocqueville's Essays On America
Rousseau's Social Contract / Paine's Rights Of Man / Smith's Theory Of Moral Sentiments
Kant Prolegomena To Any Future Metaphysics/ Hegel's Philosophy Of History / Schoppenhaur's Four Fold Root Of Sufficient Reason
Schelling's Ideas For A Philosophy Of Nature / Fitche's Vocation Of Man
Federalist Papers / Marx's Manifesto / Hitler's Mein Kampf / Rand's Atlas Shrugged
Emerson Self Reliance and Nature / Thoreau Walden and Civil Disobedience.
Mill's Utilitarianism / James Pragmaticism
Stirner's Ego And It's Own / Kierkegaard's Either Or / Nietzsche's Beyond Good And Evil
Whitehead's Introduction To Mathematics / Guenon's Introduction To Hindu Doctrines

NOTE: I listed what I think is the best intro work to each author. Not what is considered their main most significant work. Why are some authors side by side, separated by a / ? See, it jumps around chronologically to lump them into groups.. For instance, the Stoics are all side by side even though they're separated in time. The Talmud, Bible, and Quaran are separated in time, but are together because they're all part of the monotheist abrahamic religious canon. The groups are all in correct order.

>>14644791
Great list.

>>14644783
Bro I'm not going against religion, I was just pointing out that in Orthodoxy, my religious tradition, he is not regarded as a saint.(hence the icon) You can read St. Photius' contentions with his syncretism if you'd like to understand more. I would've thought this was obvious since I didn't question St Maximus or St Ephraim's sainthood. I don't disagree with the rest of what you said tho.

>>14644783
logic is not a god. LMAO its more like a scalpel.

>>14644808

Ah, beg your pardon, missunderstood.

>>14644828

Indeed, it's a tool. But the point of what I said is that logic is unquestionable. Everything is built on that. Might as well be a scientific belief.

>>14644859
no worries mate. Still a very good list, and Clement is definitely worth reading as long as you are aware of his deficiencies (from our perspective)

>>14643495
pic related.

>>14644791
good list fren, saved

>>14644927
>Mexican philosophy

>>14643495
There's no such thing. If a work of philosophy isn't self-contained, it is probably garbage.

>>14643543
>with most lists you'll be starting with pre-socrates and working your way forward. there are no shortcuts
Utter bullshit.

>>14643495
See pic.

>>14644964
>>14644969
here's your (You) brainlet

>>14644979
>OP asks for essential books
>anon gives literally all the books of philosophy
good post

Get something like Continental Philosophy: A Contemporary Introduction By Andrew Cutrofello, Contemporary Analytic Philosophy by James Baillie.

After reading one of those you can go to historical figures or areas. Like for philosophy of math try Mark Colyvan's An Introduction to the Philosophy of Mathmatics or Susana Nuccetelli's Latin American Philosophy: An Introduction with Readings.

If you are interested in the other traditions of philosophy like Idealism try Idealism: The History of a Philosophy by Jeremy Dunham, Iain Hamilton Grant, Sean Watson

>>14644999
They're all essential, mongoloid.

>>14643804
If you buy Coopers edition you should read every dialogue in that book as it is ordered, except Parmenides which you should read last and Alcibiades I which you should read first. The Letters, regardless of whether they are canonical (they are), should not be skipped, the same with Minos.
It's only Laws and Republic that makes it feel like a massive ordeal, they alone are like a third of the entire corpus. But Laws is essential to understanding all the dialogues. I suggest, in fact, that you should read the first book of Laws right before Symposium.

>>14645058
>buy

>>14643495
A History of Philosophy Without Any Gaps by Peter Adamson
https://www.goodreads.com/series/157617-a-history-of-philosophy-without-any-gaps

History of Philosophy podcast
https://historyofphilosophy.net/all-episodes

What is some 19th century onward philosophy that is actually great?
I read a huge amount of Kierkegaard's works because you faggots love to suck his dick. He wasn't terrible, Either/Or was interesting and contained some novel perspectives, and Prefaces was at least funny. The rest of his stuff felt pointless and of no interest to someone not looking for re-encouragement in their faith.
Nietzsche on the other hand was amazing. So many interesting perspectives and ideas, not to mention he is one of the few philosophers who can actually make you laugh reading them. Zarathustra was a waste of time to read though.

>>14645134
this sexy man

>>14645134
>>14645138
i 2nd the gay-and-probably-autstic-tractatus-man

>>14643801
Applied?

>>14645134

It depends on what you subfield of philosophy you want. The one's below cover multiple fields and come to mind.

Nelson Goodman
Robert Brandom
F.H Bradley
Ludwig Wittgenstein
Michael Dummett
Michael C. Rea
Richard Swinburne
Linda Martin Alcoff
Ernest Sosa
Jaegon Kim
Bernardo Kastrup

>>14645138
>>14645152
i will acquire the writings of this strange fellow

>>14643769
>I only get my opinions from far-right youtubers starter pack

>>14644791
Saved. Thanks for being so based on this fine evening.

>>14643543
Almost no one in Philosophy PHD programs read anything published earlier than 1879. In fact, the reading is mostly articles published in that last 50 years. The same is true for physics, math, etc. These fields are not dead, they are progressing ever year, so keeping up with new developments is crucial.

>>14645207
If the authors mentioned there are the opinions of far right youtubers, then far right youtubers are far more intellectually literate than your breadtube faggots.

>>14645224
you're right. they read them and have to pass an examination *before* they're admitted for candidacy. though it's not one-size-fits-all and some departments vary
you would almost certainly see this in any history of philosophy-focused program, for example

>>14645242
Most of my friends with PHDs in philosophy have never taken a single history of philosophy class.

>>14645263
who said anything about a class

>>14645267
There are no exams outside of classes.

>>14645134
Hardmode: Is any post 1980 philosophy great? Post 2000?

>>14643495
THE PASSION OF THE WESTERN MIND AND FROM DAWN TO DECADENCE
trust me

>>14645285
Of course.

Since everybody on /lit/ is underage I'll give my rudimentary guide to Italian philosophy.
New Science: Principles of the New Science Concerning the Common Nature of Nations by Giambattista Vico
The Book of the Courtier by Baldesar Castiglione
The Discourses of Livy by Niccolo Machiavelli
The Defender of the Peace by Marsilius of Padua
If any Italians want to add to the list be obliged.

>>14645290
Thread is about philosophy, not cultural history.

>>14645282
?
comprehensive examinations?
maybe you're not from the US?

>>14645263
How do you happen to have so many friends with philosophy phds?

>>14645310
I went to a Top 3 PHD program in the US and I never heard of a comprehensive exam in philosophy. The only requirement is a mathematical logic course.

>>14645225
Not him but what's breadtube

>>14645285
no, western universities have been compromised since the 60's
painfully obvious by the lack of suggestions, compared to how quickly wittgenstein came up previously

>>14645330
See: >>14645339

>>14644979
Gonna read all this brb in 20 years

>>14645351
>painfully obvious by the lack of suggestions
Most of these books >>14644979 were published since the 1960s.

>>14645339
>mathematical logic course.
yes as i alluded to in a previous reply, different departments have different specializations
sounds like yours specializes in logic (and is probably berkley) and thus wouldn't have any need for students to be well versed in other areas

which is also why the friends you've mentioned haven't read anything prior to Frege.

>>14645366
>>14645373
based, it'd be a shame to get through life not having read.... speech acts by searle, yea, that one
desu you should be banned from posting on /lit/ unless you can take a 3 month comprehensive exam on every author in that picture

>>14645377
>sounds like yours specializes in logic (and is probably berkley)
Nope, not Berkeley. It is a top-rated program in general. Strong in all areas. But now that I think of it, there was a requirement to take two history of philosophy courses. However, a lot of people 'cheated' by taking both of them in 20th century history of philosophy, which in effect served as a survey of the 'core' topics in contemporary philosophy. The upshot is, you can get a PHD without having ever read Plato or Kant.

>>14645387
'Speech Acts' is certainly a classic. I'm not a big Searle fan myself, but he has his devoted followers.

>>14645418
>PHD without having ever read Plato or Kant.
depending on the program, sure (which i think is rather unfortunate)

but some departments have comprehensive reading exams and post the lists for said exams online, and said lists would serve as a good guide - which was the entire point of my initial post

>>14645458
>but some departments have comprehensive reading exams
Name some.

>>14645348
lefty youtubers like contrapoints, philosophytube, hbomberguy etc

>>14645535
That's social commentary, not philosophy.

>>14645470
harvard, pitt, bcu, cua

>>14645571
Of those, only the University of Pittsburgh has a top-tier philosophy program (I don't even know what bcu and cua are). Their definition of 'comprehensive exam' is just a review of papers from prior courses, and a new paper on a topic of the student's choice. There is no 'comprehensive exam' in the sense of a battery of tests concerning some fixed body of knowledge (historical or otherwise). Pitt does require three courses in history of philosophy, however.

>>14645565
thats my point. Youtube leftists fall far short of engaging in philosophy

>>14645535
Lol disgusting but not surprising youtuber taste from /lit/

>>14644828
"In the beginning was Logos, and the Logos was with God, and the Logos was God"

>>14644791
Awful, why is there so much political philosophy?

>>14643495
Start with the Greeks then continue with medieval philosophy, Descartes, then some of those smelly Germans, then analytic time

>>14643808
I think starting with Greek epics, histories, tragedies and comedies then going to philosophy makes more sense

>>14644964
Name a single self contained philosophy please

>>14644791
what a massive fucking legend!!
Many thanks anon

>>14643502
>>14643543
>>14643722
>>14643769
>>14643801
>>14643808
>>14643815
>>14644745
>>14644927
>>14644979
>>14645010
>>14645132
>>14646660
>>14646664
Thank you, I shall transform myself into the most elite of intellectuals

>>14646892
It's a joke list lol

Pleb: filtered

Never show your face here again. You're finished.

>>14643792
heh

>>14646993
Thats from someone asking for a list, as he is not familar with philosophy. Subjecting him to the pleb filter is unjustified

>>14647068
One look at the list gives the joke away to anyone who reads philosophy (^=

>>14644794
>>14644944
>>14645217
Thanks anons.
>>14646525
I don't think there is, though. The minimal list doesn't have any.
>>14646892
>>14646993
>>14647068
>>14647078
It's not a joke list. It's an introduction and overview of philosophy. What's wrong with it?

>>14643495
Montaigne's essays and that's literally all you need

>>14645684
>white genocide
>le jewz!!!
>women bahddd
>vibeo game
>debate college students

yup, sounds like right tube is doing many philosphy, unlike the philosophy degree holding contrapoints and philosophytube

>>14643495
plato, hegel, kant.

>>14643495
Parmenides and Heraclitus are the only two philosophers you need to read. Everything after them is just addition semantic arguments. The world is fake and the senses are a lie. What is cannot come from what is not. Yet within the fake world, things morph in a logical and rational way thus "Logos".

>>14647339
>contrapoints and philosophytube

>>14647788
>philosophy degree
it's true tho

>>14647878
The only purpose of a degree is to show it to others in order to get a job. Only an unironic retard would willingly pay and waste their time attending an arts degree.

>>14647374
>just addition semantic arguments
>one is literally founded his entire theory on one word "esti"

>>14647878
Having a degree doesn't stop a person being a shallow retarded brainless cunt with nothing to contribute and nothing of value to offer.

>>14644791
Just wondering, why no “the republic”? For Plato?

>>14647311
He probably saw Guenon at the bottom and auto thought it was a meme.

>>14645285
Martin Heidegger
Michel Foucault
Jacques Ellul
Jean Baudrillard
Ernst Junger
Slavoj Zizek
Nick Land
Jason Reza Jorjani

>>14647897
>entire theory can be translated into English without the need to keep the word, and still holds up
>muh semantics
Reminder that the only way anyone """refuted"""(protip: they never actually did) Parmenides was by intentionally misrepresenting his arguments, or by distorting them to reincorporate into a a different idea.

>>14647928
let's took out Berkely, Schop, and Stirner and put Republic and Gay Science
and at least one 20th one, maybe Tractatus

>>14643515

I can smell your autism.

>>14647972
None of those people are philosophers.

>>14643495
Most philosophers want to write about life. So live life if you want to understand philosophy.

>>14644791
If these are intros to each author, would these only be read to then later read their main, most significant works?
Is it not possible to understand their main works without this foundation of knowledge?

>>14643769
Interesting and decent list. Though I have only read Billington and St. Maximos personally.

>>14643495
Just read Fontana Modern Masters, it is a student's cheat primer.

>>14647374
Based

>>14647374
Based but we dont have any Heraclitus works!!

>>14651025
So? You don't need a complete works to understand his arguments.

>>14643808
Every part of this advice, from recommending /lit/ as a place to get familiar with actual philosophy, to your recommendations themselves, is terrible.

>>14648136
Spotted the analytic.

>>14644979
Have you read all of these?

>>14645134
Hegel
C. S. Pierce
Wittgenstein
Heidegger

>>14643769
Reading this will turn you into a retard.

>>14644791
>Hitler's Mein Kampf / Rand's Atlas Shrugged
There us nothing to be gained from either of these books. Other than understanding the views of retarded 4channers I guess.

>>14643495
Frederick Copelstone's History of Philosophy would be a start, for the lay of the land