/lit/ - Literature

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stop making fun of herodotus :(

>>14630407
Herodotus drops a YUGE redpill on like p2

About Helen only being abducted because, at least secretly, she was open to the idea.

Didn't get much further before I reshelved it. I still have a few more greks to read before I get to him

>>14630407
>H-Herodotus is wrong
>cites him anyway
>Great Zigguret wasn't real Herodotus never went there
>le wild Babylonian tablet appears proving it
>G-greeks never fled Ionia to go to Italy
>Itallians proven to have that group of Greek's DNA in them
>THAT EGYPTIAN PHAROH NEVER WENT NORTH ALL THE WAY TO THRACE
>Other sauces from other nations prove Herodotus right
When will you fags accept the Herodotus wasn't BSing? Dude has been proven right again and again

>>14631554
>About Helen only being abducted because, at least secretly, she was open to the idea.
It gets better. He goes to Egypt and they confirm the story that she wasn't even in Troy, the Greeks just destroyed it in an autistic rage for nothing.

>>14630407
Xenophon's Anabasis is my favorite.

>>14631652
based

>>14631543
im not making fun of herodotus in a negative way, just being cheeky. he’s based as fuck

>>14631690
as if that wasn’t already obvious from the text of the iliad itself. it was just chimp out over loot

>>14631904
He predicted Nietzsche

>>14631719
Based and thalatta-pilled

>>14632329
*inhales smoke* He predicted 9/11 too. If you read the opening of the text carefully you’ll see that the whole conflict between Greeks and Persians (the West and the Middle East) was precipitated deliberately by Phoenicians. Who were Phoenicians? They were international Semitic merchants. The instigated the whole thing by “abducting” a Greek princess which led to a an escalating series of abductions which ended up precipitating the war. As Herodotus himself points out, it was a false flag. The princess went voluntarily, but the Phoenicians had a vested interest in making it seem like a real abduction in order to foment conflict (from which they would benefit tremendously as international traders). Herodotus says point blank at the opening of book one “According to learned Persians, it was the Phoenicians that caused the conflict”. Then he goes off on a whole excursus on who the Phoenicians are. Why does he open up his book on the Greek and Persian wars by talking about Phoenicians? He was trying to warn us about Semitic merchants bros. We should have listened *exhales*

>>14630407
>Mine has to be the one that started them all, the Histories of Herodotus.
No, the real father of history is Hecataeus of Miletus. Herodotus came later.

>>14632368
Nice.

>>14631652
Dude's literally cited in academic papers to this day, his history was good. But Egypt was bullshit.

>>14630407
Anyway, the Secret History of the Mongols (or the translated excerpt I could find) is pretty great.

>>14630407
OP you should read Gene Wolfes Latro series
I know Wolfes a meme here on /lit/ but he uses Herodotus Histories as the primary source and treats everything it recounts as fact in the books

>>14631652
The thing I like best is he also described how the Pyramids were built
>they dug canals from the Nile to the site
And even described the mechanism used
Yet people still go on about how its a big mystery and we don't know
>and what if aliums

>>14631554
This is less novel than it seems. There was much common speculation on this element of the epic cycle, with different distinct theories arising and support. Sappho for example, defends Helen and believes she left out of love for Paris.

>>14630407
Herodotus is great. Kind of reminds me of Homer's Odyssey, tales of strange peoples and far away lands. As for my favorite ancient writers, I'd have to go with:

1) Plutarch: His 'Lives' is without a doubt one of the greatest historical works ever written. Also, his lesser known "Moralia" is profound and fascinating. I always go back and re-read these, they're an infinite source of wisdom and moral virtue.
2) Homer: Illiad and the Odyssey are the foundational texts for all later western writing. They are masterpieces in their own right, probably the most read and studied books in history after the Bible. They basically were the bible of ancient Greece and Rome before Christianity.
3) Plato: Plato's dialogues are the most influential writings of all time. They're not only intelectually engaging, they're also very witty and profound. Modern consensus is that all philosophy, as it developed over 2000 years, stems from Plato. Another source I often re-read again and again.
4) Ovid: Metamorphoses is the most comprehensive and highest quality retelling of all the popular Greek and Roman myths we know today. The shifting narrative style is also quite innovative and produces a really unique effect. Another classic, infinitely re-readable.


Those are my top 4, but other honorable mentions include:
Herodotus
Thucydides
Polybius
Xenophon
Tacitus
Cicero
Seneca
Longinus - 'On the Sublime'
Livy
Pliny
Lucretius - 'De Rerum Natura'
Suetonious
Lucian of Samosata
Fragments of Epicurus
Aristotle
Greek Dramatists - Aeschylus, Sophocles, Euripides, Aristophanes
Epictetus
Marcus Aurelius

I would mention Virgil, though I never really enjoyed the Aeneid as much as its praised. If I could read the original in Latin I would probably have a better opinion of it. Same goes for basically all the ancient writers. I can't imagine how much better they must be untranslated. I would kill to be able to read ancient Greek and Latin.

>The foulest Babylonian custom is that which compels every woman of the land to sit in the temple of Aphrodite and have intercourse with some stranger at least once in her life. Many women who are rich and proud and disdain to mingle with the rest, drive to the temple in covered carriages drawn by teams, and stand there with a great retinue of attendants. But most sit down in the sacred plot of Aphrodite, with crowns of cord on their heads; there is a great multitude of women coming and going; passages marked by line run every way through the crowd, by which the men pass and make their choice. Once a woman has taken her place there, she does not go away to her home before some stranger has cast money into her lap, and had intercourse with her outside the temple; but while he casts the money, he must say, "I invite you in the name of Mylitta". It does not matter what sum the money is; the woman will never refuse, for that would be a sin, the money being by this act made sacred. So she follows the first man who casts it and rejects no one. After their intercourse, having discharged her sacred duty to the goddess, she goes away to her home; and thereafter there is no bribe however great that will get her. So then the women that are fair and tall are soon free to depart, but the uncomely have long to wait because they cannot fulfil the law; for some of them remain for three years, or four. There is a custom like this in some parts of Cyprus.
This was just a fabrication do deride the babylonians right?

>>14633067
Im pretty sure that was an actual practice

>>14632368
based herodotus

>>14633499
Source: my ass

>>14633540
i saw it with my own eyes bro, im tellin u!!!

just kidding, but actually it’s ive seen it mentioned in a bunch of random books besides herodotus, so i just assumed it was real[\spoiler]

>>14633570
We know Semites practiced sacral prostitution, the only question I can see is if EVERY Babylonian woman had to do this at least once. I can see "every Babylonian woman" actually being something like "only free women who are citizens and unmarried" or something like that, where there's some more complex machinations that Herodotus just isn't aware of.

>>14633601
>Semites
I know this is off topic, but what the fuck ARE semites? are they just a language group? are they an ethnicity? is that ethnicity a subcategory of caucasian? what the hell are they

>>14633640
A fucking mess. IE was just one major push out of their Urheimat into Europe, but Semites are the result of multiple waves of Afro-Asiatic peoples into the Middle East. Then Persia happened. Then the Greeks expanded out, so everyone along the coast got #HELLENIZED. Arabs then fucked EVERYTHING up. So while "Semitic" is a language family within the broader Afro-Asiatic family (think Germanic within IE), "a Semite" can mean all sorts of things when it comes to culture, language, and genetics.

I personally don't like to use "caucasian" as a descriptor because it's too fuzzy.

>>14630407
Herodotus was always skeptical of what he was told by the natives

>>14632901
>Ovid: Metamorphoses
Wait should I be reading this instead of apollodorus?

>>14633962
Exactly. Multiple times he says he finds stuff unlikely, he's just reporting what they said. What else did he have to go off of

>>14633978
It’s definitely much funner than Apollodorus. But the word “should” is kind of a red flag for me when it comes to people reading the classics. If you don’t actually enjoy the classics and approach it like homework, it’s best to leave it aside until you feel like you really want to read it imo

>>14634526
Sorry poor choice of words. Im reading the Greek stuff because I want to. Ever since I played Rome Total War as a kid and chose to be the Greeks not the Romans, Ive wanted to read this stuff.
Have read
>Iliad
>Odyssey
>Argonautica
>Herodotus
>Hesiod's Theogony and Works and Days
>Theban tragedies
>Orestia plays
>Posthomerica
I read some of Hamilton in High School but, not all of it. As such Ive forgotten a lot of the myths that are mentioned elsewhere so I looked for the Greek sauce, found Apollodorus to be a big one so I got it, along with Hyginus' Fabulae and have been reading it.
Only issue is some of the summaries seem a little too quick, didn't know if Ovid's versions were a little longer

>>14630407
Thucydides, for his keen insight into the nature of all confrontations and battles, his aristocratic aloofness, and yes, his (even if dubious) speeches. Also the build up to the mind numbing disaster at Syracuse is just wonderful.
Tacitus. Both Annals and Histories. Particularly fond of both Tiberius and Claudius' respective reigns. The short Germania's also very interesting. Not the story teller Livy is but bests him in the department of insight, psychological, tactical, and otherwise. Do love Livy's bits with respect to the wars with Hannibal, however. Especially the military maneuvering if the great Quintus Fabius Maximus, Cunctator! Livy also supplies the source of Shakespeare's Coriolanus in one of his early books.

>>14635220
>Ever since I played Rome Total War as a kid and chose to be the Greeks not the Romans
Damn, my story is really similar. I got into Age of Empires when I was younger, and then when in the sixth grade we covered the Peloponnesian War I become obsessed. I asked for permission to take the textbook home so I could read that chapter over and over, and I ended up doing a class project about it. It’s not an accident that Pericles was credited with saying pic related. He knew what he was talking about.

>>14636188
>Themistocles, by unanimously approved decree, had the interpreter of Xerxes'ambassadors put to death "for having dared use the Greek language to express the orders of a barbarian."
>A people commits such an act only at the peak of its career. It is decadent, it is dying, when it no longer believes in its language, when it stops believing that its language is the supreme form of expression.
Was antiquity peak humanity?

>>14632368
*takes joint from you* *inhales* That’s not all. There’s another interesting detail there for those paying attention. In the very next sentence he says, “Originally, these people came to our sea from the Red Sea, as it is known”. Red Sea? Sound like another group of ancient Semites? In other words, the Israelites ARE the Phoenicians. They aren’t some special different group, just another Canaanite/Phoenician tribe. Herodotus is redpilled as fuck, and that’s only the first two sentences of his book. *exhales* Good shit, man.

>>14636218
>>14632368
Good stuff, guys, but it gets even better. Take note of some interesting aspects of the ensuing conflict, but first a recap of what you’ve pointed out:
1. The conflict between Persians and Greeks was fomented by “Phoenicians” in order to benefit financially
2. Phoenicians = Israelites
Now who did the preliminary conflict involve (the one preceding the war with the Greeks)? In Book one, section 77, Herodotus mentions four main players—on one side we have Egypt, Lydia, and Babylon, and on the other Persia. Let’s take note of some interesting facts regarding these contenders:
1. Egypt is the preeminent nation of scientifically trained priests at the time
2. Babylon is generally credited historically with the invention of interest debt
3. Lydia is generally credited with the invention of coinage
4. According to Herodotus, at this time Persia had not yet succumbed to “oriental pomp and decadence” but was composed of hardy men living the simple life of warriors like their cousins to the North, the Scythians.
The war, needless to say, since everyone knows, was won by Persia under the leadership of Cyrus, and one of his first acts after conquering Babylon was to issue a decree letting the Jews back to their homeland and financing the construction of their Temple, establishing a new priesthood. In one fell swoop Cyrus has crushed the coinage issuing power of his day, the priestly power, and the interest loaning power. Now, who took over those functions? Who to our day controls the issuance of currency through such bodies as the Federal Reserve? Who has made their fortune through interest lending? Whose religions (yes, plural) dominate the globe as the dominant paradigm for spiritual thinking? I’ll refrain from answering those questions for you, and see if you can connect the dots Herodotus left us with.

>>14636354
>Phoenicians = Israelites
Interesting note by Herodotus here, said Phoenicians were circumcised

>>14636398
Where did he say that? Somehow I missed that

>>14636354
It really gets interesting when you consider this to be the beginning of a conflict which eventually led to the Roman-Punic wars and Jewish wars.

>>14636354
IF the bible is a tool to pacify, how do we reconcile that tale of jesus and the temple money changers?

>>14632368
>>14636218
>>14636354
Wait, are you telling me that the first sentence in the first-ever history book basically says "The Jews started it"?

>>14636442
That’s exactly what he’s saying. That’s the 5th century BC way of saying “Jews did 9/11”.

>>14636400
It's in there I promise you. I do not remember which book but it is. Pretty much kills the idea that the philistine were Phoenicians hence why I remember it

>>14636417
That’s a good point. I wouldn’t suggest an overly simplistic explanation like some people do where they believe that the Bible was a completely consciously concocted instrument for social control or something, because that’s just dumb. It obviously represents something authentic at bottom, as testified by the long history of martyrdom at its beginnings. But its also pretty obvious that it became somewhat co-opted at some point, and was always really a mixed bag from the beginning due to the OT legacy, and also some aspects of NT (like ideas about eternal hell and all that stuff). Basically, I think it’s a pretty mixed bag. We still see some of the authentic side in our day in Orthodox Christians who at least are somewhat resisting “globohomo”. It’s pretty obvious that Catholicism and Protestantism have been corrupt for a long time.

>>14636514
I’ve seen some evidence that the Philistines were Cretan (also referred to as Kaphtorim in the Bible)

>>14636210
Yeah, and as the Pericles quote demonstrates it’s not just some romanticization of the past in retrospect. Even back then they knew how amazing they were and how all future generations would “wonder” at them.

I remember at one point he says that Ethiopians have black semen instead of white because of their skin

>>14636442
holy shit, this is gold. we’ve retroactively sent memes back to the 5th century bc. meme magic confirmed

>>14637201
I’m starting to get this feeling that Herodotus is a time traveling 4chan troll

>>14637077
I think they were. Burial practices and DNA support it.
Herodotus also talks about the Dorians coming down after the Trojan war, as well as people coming home from troy to find Crete barren, no crops, etc. So they left
Also there is supposed to be evidence of an eruption there too so they left at some point (Herodotus says the island was emptied multiple times iirc)
Pottery they found further the Crete theory, as does the description of goliath in the Bible
Also iirc one of the people in table of nations in the bible who is mentioned as being the father of giants I connected with Crete. Stuff starts to fit together. They may have been the sea people but I don't know

>>14637243
Do you think Cretans were also the Hyksos?

>>14637248
>>14637243
oh nvm, you mentioned “sea people” in your post

>>14637248
I don't think so but who knows. Greeks sailed everywhere even then.
Thing is, they are referred to as the shepherd kings by Egyptians and caanites came in a little before them so I wonder if it wasn't hitites or something like that

>>14637264
Egyptians had lots of wars with Hittites, I don’t think they would have referred to them euphemistically since they were so well acquainted with them. The “shepherd kings” things is interesting because it is reminiscent of the Biblical text. Originally (according to the Israelite mythos of the Bible) the Israelites were invited into Egypt as shepherds, specifically to the area of “Goshen” (Eastern bank of Nile). Could be a coincidence, but it’s an interesting parallel.

>>14637279
I've considered that too. Either way, it matches up with the tale of joseph/Moses. It says a king came to power who did not know Joseph. Well the hyksos got driven out by the true Egyptians. Now, if you have just reclaimed your land from some people who brought in others as friends, what are you gonna do with their friends?
You aren't going to know of good they may have done, you'll know them for being your enemy, you'll put their babies to death, enslave them, etc.
And the hyksos thing I think may be related to the famine mentioned in genesis when Josephs family goes to get grain from Egypt. Hyksos may have left their land and gone for a place they deemed more likely to produce crops, Nile river delta.

It's all theory of course. Hyksos could be unrelated to stories in the bible. If you haven't read it, I recommend manetho. Sadly his stuff only survives in quotes from others so you get said peoples spin on it, but it's interesting

>>14637279
>>14637298
Oh yeah forgot to add, Manetho (cited by Josephus so who knows If it's right) said the shepherd kings when kicked out founded Jerusalem

Weird thing is though he then talks about Moses being an Egyptian priest that was sent to a work camp with those who were sick AFTER the hyksos got kicked out
Really wish we had the full text, as it stands there is just quoted fragments

>>14637298
And if I’m not mistaken it was this Pharaoh who was associated with the overthrow of the Hyksos, which just makes it weirder. Note that the God he is named after is “Yah” which is a common way of saying Yaweh in the Bible.

>>14637315

>>14637315
>>14637321
Had not heard of this
Would line up somewhat, son of a pharoh Egypt comes after him he has to bail Assuming his name is derived from yahweh it would make him an Israelite.

>>14637342
I mean, it’s probably just a dead end, but what really interests me there is that this “Yah” is a moon god, given some of the contemporary polemics by Christians against Islam calling Allah a “moon god”.

>>14637367
Well, if Allah is based on a pre Islamic Arabian lunar deity, argument could also be made Arabians invaded and are the hyksos, assuming yah or something similar was their gods name
But then you run into the stuff where the gods have different names but are the same thing like some of the Egyptian and Greek ones. So name could be unrelated to who the hyksos originally were but the lunar deity might still be a connection I don't know.
Going back this far lines between history and myth blur and it gets really difficult to make good calls

>>14637390
Interestingly it seems ilah is the Arabian term for a god
One letter off of iah
Like I said who knows but maybe they were Arabian. They were nomads then right? Shepard kings would suit them too.

>>14637407
Some Arabs were settled city/town dwellers, some were nomads. Mohammed belonged to the former, and interestingly the Quran criticizes nomadic Arabs as being a crude people.

>>14637248
The Hyksos were the Amorites.

>>14637505
Sauce me. I want to hear about this

>>14630407
I see that OP mentioned, therefore it will save me making a new thread, but who are some other writers with prose comparable to Gibbon?

>>14637554
Carlyle

>>14630407
Is it just me or does Herodotus’ Greek name look like it says Hrodotus rather than Herodotus. I’m an amateur at Greek, so I’m probably wrong.

>>14637563
cheers

Can anyone shed light on this depiction of Herodotus? Why is he holding a bowl with fire and what looks like a shortened shepherd’s staff?

>>14637606
oops, forgot image

>>14631652
>G-greeks never fled Ionia to go to Italy
Who says this? It’s well known that Greeks lived in Italy, particularly the south which was literally known as Magna Graecia

>>14638059
It was a theory because academia tend to assume anything Herodotus says besides Persian war stuff is wrong

>>14638833
There were Greek colonies all over the Mediterranean...this isn't controversial

Since people brought up Phoenicians, this video just came out. Haven't watched it yet, though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcMz-MyWawg

>>14631652
For all sad words of tongue and pen, The saddest are these, 'Herodotus was right again'.

>>14638921
But it's hilarious whenever Herodotus is right, not sad.

>>14638880
I know it's retarded man. But in one of the notes in my copy it said that dna testing was done and proved Herodotus right. Just one of those things

>>14639401
Maybe they specifically were referring to Torjans coming to Italy. Not sure how you would prove that genetically though. Maybe an Anatolian component? Though that is pretty common in the Med because of the Neolithic farming expansion. I'm Med and I have substantial Anatolian admixture. Pretty sure I wuzn't Trojans n shieet, but who knows

>>14639401
>But in one of the notes in my copy it said that dna testing was done and proved Herodotus right.
Bullshit.

>>14640087
Penguin classics deluxe edition. I believe it was book 2.
I don't have it with me i am at uni and it is at my parents home. If you don't believe me you can buy it and see for yourself. Until then screw off academia fag

>>14640314
You're confusing the Greeks with the Etruscans (Tyrrhenians).

>>14640343
Yes if I remember right it said some of the Greeks went there and interbred with the Etruscans maybe I'm misremembering but I swear the version I have says that

>>14633067
>but the uncomely have long to wait because they cannot fulfil the law; for some of them remain for three years, or four. There is a custom like this in some parts of Cyprus.
kind of sad

>>14631652
>>THAT EGYPTIAN PHAROH NEVER WENT NORTH ALL THE WAY TO THRACE
>>Other sauces from other nations prove Herodotus right
Tell me more, I thought it was bs

>>14640351
No. This is what he writes:

Now the Lydians have very nearly the same customs as the Hellenes, with the exception that they prostitute their female children; and they were the first of men, so far as we know, who struck and used coin of gold or silver; and also they were the first retail-traders. And the Lydians themselves say that the games which are now in use among them and among the Hellenes were also their invention. These they say were invented among them at the same time as they colonised Tyrsenia, 108 and this is the account they give of them:—In the reign of Atys the son of Manes their king there came to be a grievous dearth over the whole of Lydia; and the Lydians for a time continued to endure it, but afterwards, as it did not cease, they sought for remedies; and one devised one thing and another of them devised another thing. And then were discovered, they say, the ways of playing with the dice and the knucklebones and the ball, and all the other games excepting draughts (for the discovery of this last is not claimed by the Lydians). These games they invented as a resource against the famine, and thus they used to do:—on one of the days they would play games all the time in order that they might not feel the want of food, and on the next they ceased from their games and had food: and thus they went on for eighteen years. As however the evil did not slacken but pressed upon them ever more and more, therefore their king divided the whole Lydian people into two parts, and he appointed by lot one part to remain and the other to go forth from the land; and the king appointed himself to be over that one of the parts which had the lot to stay in the land, and his son to be over that which was departing; and the name of his son was Tyrsenos. So the one party of them, having obtained the lot to go forth from the land, went down to the sea at Smyrna and built ships for themselves, wherein they placed all the movable goods which they had and sailed away to seek for means of living and a land to dwell in; until after passing by many nations they came at last to the land of the Ombricans, 109 and there they founded cities and dwell up to the present time: and changing their name they were called after the king's son who led them out from home, not Lydians but Tyrsenians, taking the name from him.

TLDR: A group of Lydians led by Tyrsenos sailed to Italy, colonized the native Umbrians, and thereafter became known as the Etruscans. No Greeks involved.

>>14640420
Ok you're right. Now, was it the lydians or the Phrygians who he said were from crete i cannot remember

why are scythians so based bros

>>14637569
the h isn't written as you would expect it to be it's actually the backwards apostrophy before the capital eta . You can see the same thing in Homer's name Ὅμηρος

>>14641309
based anon, thank you

>>14633067
>but the uncomely have long to wait because they cannot fulfil the law; for some of them remain for three years, or four. There is a custom like this in some parts of Cyprus.
This isn't surpring at all, seeing as how no woman can refuse if you give her the money (any sum of money, even), it's logical that everyone would avoid the ugly ones. That's what freedom in the sexual market gets you - the exact opposite of what's expected by it ("woah bro anyone can fuck anyone, everyone gets a chance!"). This is the situation of today's sexual market, except the roles are reversed. I don't blame a woman for ignoring ugly or average-looking guys since they can have at least mildly hot ones, but it would be nice if all of the bluepillers could tone it down with the "beauty is subjective, bro" philosophy.

>>14641836
the natural dynamics of the sexual marketplace are the definitive proof that the world was constructed by an evil demiurge.

>>14633067
Now I know what to write my next smut story about.

>>14631652
Was he right about the tribe of tiny african wizards?

>>14632368

>>14633672
IE=Indo-European? As in PIE?

>>14633067
Why such a good practice was ever abandoned?

>>14636442
>>14636460
>>14637203
It's true, that is the sentence he opens his recount of history with. However, there is one sentence before, in which he introduces himself and explains his reason for writing
>What Herodotus the Halicarnassian has learnt by inquiry is here set forth: in order that so the memory of the past may not be blotted out from among men by time, and that great and marvellous deeds done by Greeks and foreigners and especially the reason why they warred against each other may not lack renown.
>and especially the reason why they warred against each other
Herodotus wrote his Histories to warn future generations (((who))) starts wars, so they don't fall for the mistakes of the past. He's trying to keep (((them))) from hiding behind the ignorance of time. He's letting the goyim know.

>>14640403
Read Manetho

>>14641967
Eh, maybe they were just people stunted by mal nourishment and one guy told another and as the tale spread they got smaller?
That's the thing, some of Herodotus really is just folk tales. Theres nuggets of truth in them but you gotta dig through the hyping people do.
The ant thing I wonder if its a translation error like some say, or if there really were pretty big ants. Camel spiders are a thing so maybe its possible they existed and we killed them all?
Tough to say

>>14641967
African Pygmies practicing their traditional shamanic religions. Pygmies were widespread in Africa before the Bantu genocided them.

>>14632368
>>14636218
>>14636354
This way too based for me

Without a single doubt, Livy.

I am a big fan of The Golden Bough even though Frazer uses some reductive reasoning. I don't read it as gospel, but just use it to fill gaps where no better solutions present themselves.

>>14642773
Fuck off, that's not what I asked

>>14641918
How exactly?

>>14642798
The Bantu were Based, look at these subhumans.

>>14632901
Based and old /lit/-pilled.

>>14643778
Humans have an inbuilt desire, that almost borders on metaphysical in its depth, to seek out companionship, to the point where lacking such companionship we feel incomplete or even worthless. The lack of such companionship, or infidelity on the part of a sexual companion, is a huge source of suffering for people. Now look at how the sexual marketplace is naturally designed: a hypergamous hierarchy in which the top dogs take all and the rest languish. It's clear that this aspect of our human nature was designed by some evil entity.

>>14641195
my favorite section of the book desu

>>14645192
>Humans have an inbuilt desire, that almost borders on metaphysical in its depth, to seek out companionship, to the point where lacking such companionship we feel incomplete or even worthless.
Really now? I fantasize about living in a log cabin as far away from people as realistically possible.

>>14645192
>It's clear that this aspect of our human nature was designed by some evil entity
Why do you think that's a necessary conclusion? The sexual marketplace could also be like it is because of the human nature that wasn't designed by anyone.

>>14645313
You are one of the special chosen ones of the Monad. Congratulations.

>>14641960
There’s so much in The Histories that could be used as inspiration for erotica

The Odyssey

>>14646033
baste

>>14637608
bowl of fire has to represent knowledge, I imagine the shepherd's staff alludes to his position as one of the fathers of "history"

>>14638910
ancient med monoculture was just too fucking based. fuck.

>>14640420
sicily and calabria definitely have a lot of Greek blood at least.

>>14646483
Yes, but that is obvious. Southern Italy was a Greek colony.

Never heard this before just encountering the passage in Herodotus. wtf I love Phoenicians now. so hol up, does this mean western philosophy as we know it was started by semites?

>>14646938
>“they should establish a single governmental council”
>semite shilling proto-globalist agenda
yep, checks out

>>14637203
>implying that (((they’re))) nature is just a meme and not horrifyingly real

>>14645192
because it's best for humans that only the betters allowing the scum to breed is extremely dysgenic.
also, what kind of fag are you that you feel that desperate over pussy?

>>14641195
he has a cool hat

>>14647060
>because it's best for humans that only the betters allowing the scum to breed is extremely dysgenic.
i am “better”. reproductive success has nothing to do with quality. often the choices of females are dysgenic and very from aiming at the evolution pf the species toward something greater
>what kind of fag are you that you feel that desperate over pussy?
a normal human being. that kind of feeling is fairly universal.

>>14647093
one of the things scythians are known for

>>14646938
just saw this on wiki, kek. semite confirmed

>>14633067
god i wish i was an ancient babylonian

>>14646938
>>14646997
>>14647624
>ancient semites were shilling for proto-globalism and trading on some kind of proto-stock market
Can’t make this shit up. Some things really never change.

>>14647644
Prostitution still exists in the present day, ya know

>>14646938
>Herodotus goes out of his way to let us know that Thales is Phoenician before telling us about his globalist agenda
So I guess this is the ancient equivalent of “naming the Jew”

>>14641960
>>14645462
> I will now speak of their established customs. The wisest of these, in our judgment, is one which I have learned by inquiry is also a custom of the Eneti in Illyria. It is this: once a year in every village all the maidens as they attained marriageable age were collected and brought together into one place, with a crowd of men standing around. Then a crier would display and offer them for sale one by one, first the fairest of all; and then, when she had fetched a great price, he put up for sale the next most attractive, selling all the maidens as lawful wives. Rich men of Assyria who desired to marry would outbid each other for the fairest; the ordinary people, who desired to marry and had no use for beauty, could take the ugly ones and money besides; for when the crier had sold all the most attractive, he would put up the one that was least beautiful, or crippled, and offer her to whoever would take her to wife for the least amount, until she fell to one who promised to accept least; the money came from the sale of the attractive ones, who thus paid the dowry of the ugly and the crippled. But a man could not give his daughter in marriage to whomever he liked, nor could one that bought a girl take her away without giving security that he would in fact make her his wife.

>>14639222
Checked and based

>>14647709
Me on the right

>>14632368
>>14636218
>>14636354
Guys... if you keep dropping these red pills you unironically might destroy my very concept of reality. You are doing Gods Work.

>>14632901
Just so you know, Latin really isnt that hard to learn as far as languages, especially for an english speaker, are concerned. A good chunk of the vocab should be familiar, or you can relate linguisticly to latin/french derived english words, and the mindset is not that alien. The only real hurdle is going from an analytic to a synthetic language.

>>14645313
Odd that you are communicating on a forum then. I would say its the form and company you dislike, not communicating with people in itself.

Man, FUCK Diodorus Siculus. Most annoying ancient historian to read. Just follow one general geographical area for ONE BOOK.

>>14632368
I never thought of it that way

>>14636354
Are you telling me that all the Rothchilds gold exists because some Phoenicians got a hold of Croesus's treasury over 2700 years ago?

>>14640403
Robert Sepehr

>>14650410
his videos are fun, but also kind of retarded

>>14630407
I like reading biographies. Do they count?
I read the Ray Monk biography of Witty and loved it.

>When Psammetichus [the Pharaoh] found out what they were doing [soldiers abandoning Egypt en masse], he came after them. He caught up with them and made a long speech pleading with them not to abandon their ancestral deities and their wives and children. At this, one of the soldiers pointed to his genitals and said that wherever this was he would have wives and children.
lmao

>>14648428
People are to be taken in very small doses

>>14630407
The ants thing could actually be accurate
>French ethnologist Michel Peissel says that the Himalayan marmot on the Deosai Plateau in Gilgit–Baltistan province of Pakistan, may have been what Herodotus called giant "ants". Much like the province that Herodotus describes, the ground of the Deosai Plateau is rich in gold dust. Peissel interviewed the Minaro tribal people who live in the Deosai Plateau, and they have confirmed that they have, for generations, collected the gold dust that the marmots bring to the surface when digging burrows. The story was widespread in the ancient world and later authors like Pliny the Elder mentioned it in his gold mining section of the Naturalis Historia.
>In his book The Ants' Gold: The Discovery of the Greek El Dorado in the Himalayas, Peissel says that Herodotus may have confused the old Persian word for "marmot" with that for "mountain ant" because he probably did not know any Persian and thus relied on local translators when travelling in the Persian Empire. Herodotus did not claim to have seen the gold-digging "ant" creatures; he stated that he was simply reporting what other travellers told him

>>14652920
The ants were actually an allegory for the Chinese, since the Chinese are very industrious (like ants) and also obey a hivemind (like ants). The gold digging refers to the Chinese tendency to gradually build up their economy by patient, hard work.

>>14631652
The Anglo menace will never leave. They live to deconstruct with their constant calls to skepticism and phony empiricism.

All continentals must vow to defend Herodotus and all the monumental histories of the world against the anglo pest.

>>14650410
comfiest sepehr video right here:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=drGjI9HI_ck

>>14632329
>He predicted Nietzsche
How so? Do you mean about the quote?

>>14654423
I think that's what he meant. Nietzsche overloaded on seriousness.

>>14636442
how will the jews ever recover?

>>14633067
Babylon the first coomer nation

>>14631652
That Egyptian pharaoh never went the way heredotus wrote.
People don't deny some ionians went to Italy.
The dimensions of the monuments given by heredotus are even more comically bigger than the size of armies.