/lit/ - Literature

>>14628821
whats the literary merit of movies?
There some games that one could consider art. But games arent literary pieces they are an interactive medium experienced by all of your senses.

>>14628821
"What Video Games Have to Teach Us About Learning and Literacy" is a fun read. It makes an interesting point about games holding the attention of children while teachers often struggle. It draws parallels between video games and any other topic you would have to apply yourself to learn, both foreign concepts that take repetition and memorization. One takeaway was how identity plays a role in the approach of the student. In a classroom, a kid is whoever they see themselves as, and this can be a self fulfilling prophecy, for better or worse. In a video game, you identity is given to you through the character, and that is the lens in which you learn how to play. A child is overcoming repeated failure to learn a new set of rules, because that's what their character would do.

In terms of writing, I've never found a video game with writing that would stand up without gameplay and visuals. Plenty of games have worthwhile premises though.

>>14628821
A good video game is not good for the same reason that a book is good. The best films are not the ones that have the best writing, but the ones which use the unique qualities of the medium in an exciting way.

>>14628821
Are there any good Kafkaesque video games? Ones where you never accomplish the goal? A video game version of the castle sounds right as fuck to me. Is it possible to have a satisfying video game where failure is nearly inevitable?

>>14628821
Video games are entertainment which is the lowest common denominator of media. Sure some art is entertaining but that's just a subset. If an interactive application isn't entertainment it stops being a video game.

>>14629232
Pathologic 2

>>14628821
There are videogames with videogame merit. Are there any book with videogame merit?

http://shmuplations.com/ico/

>>14628821
>>14629254
I think that's a shallow take. The fact that an interactive application has to be entertainment in order to qualify as a game isn't true, that's like saying a soccer ball has to be entertaining in order to play soccer, or that chess pieces have to be entertaining in order to have a game of chess. The application is nothing but a platform from which the game can emerge by being played. People don't play chess for entertainment, although entertainment may be a byproduct of it. They play it because it's cognitively challenging and competitive. I like the game counter-strike for this reason. The art of the game isn't in the fact that the graphics have a nice aesthetic, or in its plot or in the varying skill levels among players. The art of the game manifests when talented players enter a match and produce something beautiful to behold by pushing the envelope of the meta.

>>14629254
Sometime dialogue in games attempts to be "literary". If plays are considered /lit/ despite being a kind of entertainment then some vidya can certainly be /lit/ on some level. They have writers after all.

That said games that strive for "literary" dialogue are often not fun and most of it is cringe. Sometimes it's kinda good, but then you get into HURR DURR how pretentious is the game LMAO?
I liked Talos Principle's Elohim character and his dialogue, there was also stuff to read in the game :^)

>>14628821
>What does it take for a game to be sophisticated enough to rival intelligent ideas and big emotions that novels have?
A game just needs to be beautiful and subtle enough to resonate authentically with profound human experience. It doesn't even need dialogue, and ideally shouldn't have any, at least until something like a Hemingway-caliber writer directs a game

>What does it take for a game to be sophisticated enough to rival intelligent ideas and big emotions that novels have?
To proficiently perform the element that games have that films and novels both lack, gameplay mechanics, and to have the theme or desired vibe neatly layered in its function.

>>14629430
>The art of the game manifests when talented players enter a match and produce something beautiful to behold by pushing the envelope of the meta.
woah that about sums it

>>14629430
>meta
People who use this word in this way deserve to be shot

>>14628821
>Video games are like porn. The story doesn't really matter, but it's expected to exist.
- some famous dude
Just like Porn, the story in video games will always be secondary to the gameplay. It's inherently inferior because it has to accomodate all the various gameplay loops.

>>14630054
Carmack was right

>>14628943
I love tasting my vidya

Soulsborne games are the perfect example of storytelling that's only possible in a video game.

>>14629232
sounds like the Stanley Parable

>>14628821
I have no mouth but i must scream
Vidya > short story

>>14629232
No More Heroes in a way.