/lit/ - Literature

You talk like a child.

>>14317720
You could have contributed with something of worth, instead you chose to be a cunt and make a snarky comment. Thank you for the bump, I guess.

>>14317701
someone explain why tolstoy said that shapespear is shit

>>14317787
To have Orwell BTFO him:
>One's first feeling is that in describing Shakespeare as a bad writer he is saying something demonstrably untrue. But this is not the case. In reality there is no kind of evidence or argument by which one can show that Shakespeare, or any other writer, is 'good' ... Ultimately there is no test of literary merit except survival, which is itself an index to majority opinion. Artistic theories such as Tolstoy's are quite worthless, because they not only start out with arbitrary assumptions, but depend on vague terms ('sincere', 'important' and so forth) which can be interpreted in any way one chooses. Properly speaking one cannot answer Tolstoy's attack. The interesting question is: why did he make it? But it should be noticed in passing that he uses many weak or dishonest arguments. Some of them are worth pointing out, not because they invalidate his main charge but because they are, so to speak, evidence of malice.

>>14317754
I mean, it's not like your analysis of Lear was particularly insightful.

>>14317841
Never said it was, I was simply stating my opinion on it and why I liked it. You, however, came here not to discuss, but to be a prick and therein lies the difference.

>>14317853
Do you not know where you are? Have you never been here before? This place hasn't been a worthwhile outlet for literary discussion for years. Of course I came out here to be a prick because that's what this board is for. I have real, flesh and blood friends that I can discuss books with.

>>14317881
So, instead of trying to make a difference and actually discussing shit, you perpetuate the same bullshit like many already do and cement the board further down from being tolerable at the very least? How wonderful.

>>14317881
>I have real, flesh and blood friends

>>14317903
You didn't really give us anything to discuss. Your post consists of a lot of high school level opinions and no evidence to back them up. I should also point out that you, too, are perpetuating this bullshit by engaging with me. All you had to do was ignore the trolls.

>>14317951
You're really fixated on my posts being high school for some odd reason, what gives? And I have given material for discussion, it's just that you've come here to do anything but discuss King Lear and are now staying to win points because you're a petty cunt.

>>14317881
>I have real, flesh and blood friends
not with that attitude

Interesting observation OP. It's been a while since I've read any Shakespeare, but I remember being impressed by the extent to which his villains are sympathetic and his heroes unsympathetic. I wonder if this is the specific innovation that has made Shakespeare so memorable among his contemporaries. Was he the one who began literature's long road of moral grey? Certainly nothing like this exists in Chaucer – where his heroes err, they are shown really not to be heroes. It might be useful to look at the attributes of the villains of his contemporaries, to see if the grey appears in them.

>>14317754
Your thread sucks and also doesn't contain anything of worth. Blow it out your ass.

>>14317701
Undergrad-tier. Keep that shit to Goodre*ds

>>14317720
You probably are a child, you simpering little worm.

>>14318187
You're just mad that your shit-tier "analysis" of Lear is so embarrassing nobody wants to participate.

>>14318197
It's not my thread you mongoloid. I have no opinion on King Lear. I don't have an opinion on your IQ either, I have the factual evidence that it's double digit.

I'm sorry everyone in this thread is acting like this. I love Lear too. My favorite theory is that Cordelia and the Fool are symbolically the same person, as they never appear in the same scene, they both serve a similar purpose (Protecting Lear while telling him the bald truth), and when Cordelia dies, Lear calls her his fool. Lear is probably my second favorite Shakespeare play, behind Hamlet. (Normie, I know.)

>>14318098
I'm not that well versed in literary works of that period, but I don't remember anything sticking out as much from the works that I've read. Some of the Greek myth, perhaps, characters like Sisyphus? That's the only thing that comes to mind atm. One of the reasons that I think his work endured through so many centuries and were so acclaimed when rediscovered in the 18th and 19th century has to be because of how timeless and transcendental the themes he covered were. So far I've only read Hamlet, Macbeth, Richard III, Othello and King Lear, but each of those plays has something for everybody and are truly rewarding when revisited for the nth time. Moments such as Desdemona confining in Emilia and that whole conversation about love was absolutely touching and almost brought me to tears, then she's strangled by Othello and that makes it all the more crushing.

>>14318112
Then stop bumping it and let it get archived.

>>14317720
>>14317841
>>14317881
>>14317951
>>14318112
>>14318166
Post your (you)s, samefag

>>14318203
Just look at this seething turd.

>>14318213
It's not everyone, just some sad individual but ignore him and let him have his fun, as pathetic as it is. Haven't heard of that theory before, but the Fool was certainly an interesting character and I love it how he contrasts Lear throughout the play. Also, don't know if this is an actual theory or what happened in the play because I didn't caught onto it until after I was finished with it, but Edgar pretending to be mad around Gloucester as to not make his state any worse really got to me and I feel dumb for not noticing it. Also love how Lear's fall from grace is shown in the play, first he considers himself a dragon, then a dog later on when he realizes how fucked it is. And as for the last part of your post, I find that whole deal about normie = bad being real dump and juvenile, but then again that's 4chan for ya.

>>14317701
Edmund evil?? Maybe it was just the amazing performance but when I saw Ian McKellen's Lear last year I was rooting for Eddy pretty much the whole time.

>>14317881
>I have real, flesh and blood friends

the virgin talk

>>14317806
Orwell was such a legend

>>14317701
do people actually just straight up read plays? aren't they supposed to be enjoyed, oh, I don't know, ON STAGE?

>>14318896
t. stephen brown
They can go either way. Personally, I like reading a play from this time period, whether it be Shakespeare, Jonson, Marlowe, Ford, Dekker, etc. first and then watching it after.