/lit/ - Literature

>>14266900
>dude deserts are cool
>this totally looks like star wars
>dude i mentioned that paul is a mary sue

that

>>14266900
How can the descriptions be esoteric when they blatantly spoil the chapters?

>>14266900
WHY DLNT PAUL AND JESSICA FUCK???

>>14266900
>The characters are all dragged along with the plot and not vice-versa.
This is literally the story though.

>>14266900
Reading it right now and struggling to enjoy it
I'm 330 pages in and just want to finish and move on to 2666 or Seven Pillars of Wisdom
>>14267402
Also this

>>14266900
Not sure what to tell you, but it seems anything more intellectual than Harry Potter is a little too “slow” for you. Might I recommend reading the Divergent series instead?

>>14266900
- Shitty writing style with annoying 3rd omniscient PoV and doubly-annoying intrusion of constant internal monologue.
Herbert was a scientist and a schizo before he was a writer. His worldbuilding, ideas, and scientific knowledge more than make up for any issues you might have with his (good) writing
- Boring characters with zero depth that I couldn’t give a fuck less about.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EightDeadlyWords
If you didn’t hate Baron and want to see him dead, or want to see Paul grow, I don’t know what to say to you
>Obvious plot direction presented in an uninteresting way. Vast majority of the book consists of boring characters sitting in a room talking to each other with some light action here and there. The characters are all dragged along with the plot and not vice-versa.
So basically it was too slow for you and your capeshit zoom zoom brain
- Vignettes that begin each chapter too esoteric to understand or really care about
“No!”
- Dialogue is usually poorly written and coupled with said problem with internal monologue often makes the scenes hard to picture.
“No!”

>>14267629
Ur a towel

>>14266900
>Shitty writing style with annoying 3rd omniscient PoV and doubly-annoying intrusion of constant internal monologue.
I haven't read Dune. Can you give an example?

>>14266900
Frank wrote it in 1964. Not for your fucked in the head generation.
Of course, you do not "get it."
We read it in school a long time ago.
It's just not for you 21st century people.
It was writen in a language of 3 generations ago, before tl;dr and cellphone attention span tards.

>>14267402
just play behind the dune

>>14266900
Ditto. Dune is shameless shiity space opera, where author wanted to create low fantasy novel with MC rising to the top but decided to add a "twist" af it being in space. Even fucking Eragon, even fucking Harry Potter are better books.

>>14266900
too bad you're a brainlet and can't appreciate the creativity of this man. remember this shit was written before star wars. before avatar. before guardians of the galaxy.

other anon nailed it. if you couldn't be repulsed by the baron harkonnen or live in fear of the beast rabban or feyd or wonder at not only the depiction of feudal states in space at the mercy of a vatican-like spacers guild and the mysteries and ethical and religious implications of something like an OC Bible i don't know what to say to you. it's like you don't have an imagination. brb gonna recycle your biomass to make a newer better ghola.

>>14268996
Fuck feodalism and fuck bible.

I read it a few years ago and while I didn't find it exceptionally good I think it was a good triology (it was a triology right?).

The only thing I remember to not like at all was the main character progression. The guy started like a little shit and ended like a fucking messiah demi-god for no reason at all, to the point that I found him to be the most bland character in the books.

>>14269010
>it was a triology right?
y-yes. i read them and loved them as a teenager, but even i couldn't finish chapterhouse dune. the story seemed pretty well wrapped up by the end of the third book.

>>14269005
no u!

Couldn't potential assassin just use chlore instead of having to engage in mellee?

>"science"-fiction where science is rejected and humans have magic

>>14268973
Exactly its overrated

>>14269713
Ecology is science alright. So is Political Science, especially the weaponized hero worship part and its consequences for everyone, the one all but forced to be der fuehrer fully included.

Not everybody cares about autists playing with lazors n rocket fuel n shiet, oblivious to society around them,

>>14266900
>boring characters sitting in a room talking to each other
A morbidly obese and a morbidly vile absolute decadent with an entire poisoned and scoured planet of slaves toiling away to fill his infinite gut, a literal gay pedophile who can't find his dick under all the fat to coom to his young sweet-ass nephew gutting drugged people publicly for what counts as sports, an absolute abomination with not a shread of honour or humanity left but the eternal butthurt that somewhen somewhere many centuries ago his ancestor was castigated by somebody else's ancestor who showed some actual honour and compassion, said butthurt the only thing responsible for dozens of millions of slaves suffering endlessly to get resources to enact a revenge, is a boring character sitting in a room pointing to some desert ball of planet Peanut.
Since when did young Zoomers' bosses became the boring well known Baron so they don't give a fuck about his literal prototype?

If you also didn't care a bit that he was also Paul's own maternal grandfather successfully killing his father and all but condemning his unknown daughter and grandson to torture and death, and so Paul was about as much a Harkonnen vilest scum of the known universe as much a genetical superhuman of the heroic line of Atreides of Ancient Greece, I basically no longer care about your biotrash opinions. Off to the Axolotl Tank with you. You wouldn't last under a Gom Jabbar test for even a second.

>>14269949
Then why set it in space at all?

>>14267595
>thinking Dune is more intellectual than Harry Potter
I see you still haven't matured any at all since you where 13 and got your mind blown by this silly book.

>>14270829
Because why not? Do some autistical physicists have a patent on space in sci-fi?

Herbert wanted to speak of a very very far future of highly evolved people that are very similar to us yet very different due to guided evolution, like the Bene Gesserit decided who got to procreate the best lines. So he did. Paul is basically a transhuman, a supreme evolutionary uebermensch, like 50 years before transhumanism became kewl, with absolute awareness of time-space. His consciousness basically operates above the 4-th dimension, so he perceived his future and his past simultaneously! His consciousness is so developed he perceives his light cone from "future" to "past", going as far back as his genetical ancestors. Which silently presumes the very nature of Reason and how it is tied to the bodies it moves, for example.
Leto II is posthuman, pure and simple. He is posthuman after his very birth - the fact Paul can't see Leto's light-cone presupposes the levels of milti-dimensional spookines spooky even for a transhuman overman. Leto II will shed even the outer image of his human past in the third book. He is not just post-human, he is basically as removed from human as you are from the australopithecus.

Which is beyond brainlets' understanding. They see the words, they process events, but they don't think the presuppositions and implications of what the fuck is happening!

Herbert also seems to have shared Heidegger's, Ted Kacz. and the dudes' distrust for technology. So he made a future society that prohibited "enslaving" technology on the penalty of death. He (speculatively) forbade "enslaving" computers two full generations before the modern digital gulag and spy probes in everything that has a wifi.
When Dune was first published, computers were overglofiried calculators the size of rooms and the processing power beyond the worst cheapes Chinese spy probe you can get a dime a dozen. The Butlerian Jihad already presupposed and dealt with the smartphone zombies under a constant surveillance and control of their digital overlords, with programmers and computer engineers genocided and every "thinking" machine above the abacus prohibited under death penalty - AS A FOOT NOTE in the setting!

>>14268796
Based boomer.

>>14271146
>DUDE, MY OC IS SO KEWL HE IS PRODUCT OF GUIDED EVOLUTION AND CAN SEE INTO THE PAST AND FUTURE AND IS EMPEROR
Fuck this gay shit. Even such trash as HPMOR is not as much revolves around it's main character. Why he wasn't just nuked?

>>14266900
I really enjoyed the 1st book, but the 2nd was such a massive drop in quality.

>>14271314
> Even such trash as HPMOR is not as much revolves around it's main character
God forbid books to have main characters! Especially books critiquing a certain phenomenon of Hero Worship. Books must be about... what exactly?

>>14267629
>Herbert was a scientist and a schizo before he was a writer. His worldbuilding, ideas, and scientific knowledge more than make up for any issues you might have with his (good) writing
autism. prose matters.
>If you didn’t hate Baron and want to see him dead, or want to see Paul grow, I don’t know what to say to you
I'll concede this. The characters are complete plastic, like he said, but their ambitions were developed immaculately.

>>14268796
wow i'm so impressed, boomer.

>>14268796
>Why yes I am an avid Dune reader, how could you tell?

>>14266900
>tvtropes
Now that took me back.

Anytime i open i sci fi fantasy book and it has a map of the world on the first few pages I just skip it. Fantasy books with maps are usually shitty

>>14274496
jerk. i like the maps.

>>14267402
extremely based

>>14266900
Tpp kek, people actually defend this absolute trash.
There is literally a little girl that becomes a teleports-behind-you assassin. And some very last minute lore dump to make you care about a secondary villain because they killed the main one too early.
Dune has the plot and writing of seasonal anime.

>Vignettes that begin each chapter too esoteric to understand or really care about
It's not for you