/lit/ - Literature

>>14180148
>It seems redundant and a waste of time in today's world.

Unlike making this thread for the 9 millionth time

>>14180148
What is the point of existing? What does your self improvement actually accomplish? Nothing, just like nothing any of us does actually has a real point. You think what you do has a point so it makes you feel better to do it, but open your eyes and you'll realize none of it means anything.

>>14180377
t. future an hero

Yeah, I agree OP. Non fiction books are complete bullshit. If a book was written as fiction, it would be called non fiction. You know why? Because it's a fictional story.

The difference is, you can't tell that story in real life. There are no people there. There's no place. You can tell the story of how things are happening in your imagination and your story, even if it's fictional, but you can't show the actual people who were there. The reality is that people were there. People were killed. People were dying. If a book had a scene of some person dying, you'd call it non fiction. But not if that person had an imaginary friend with them who was dying right next to them. That's fiction.

>>14180338
I've only made this thread once.

Non-fiction books that have prose in them are unironically a waste of time

>>14180148
If you have to ask, you’ll never know

>>14180148
“Art is a lie that tells the truth”

>>14180377

>>14180148
Non-fiction is concerned with Truth
Fiction is concerned with Beauty
Literature as a whole is concerned with the Good

>>14180570
>>14180577
>this is your brain on fiction

try actually answering the question

ask Aristotle.

>>14180148
Never go full retard.

>>14180605
I think film does beauty better and in less time.

>>14180391
>but like fiction IS nonfiction
shut the fuck up

>>14180566
so was reading this post

>>14180616
too bad he's dead

>>14180617
i don't read fiction so i should be good

>>14180618
Then why are you posting in /lit/?

>>14180148
There's plebs, there's bugmen, and then there's OP, a faggot pleb bugman. Congrats.

>>14180634
>too bad he's dead
If only there was a way to know what he thought about this... Hmmm...

>>14180693
are you recommending me nonfiction? now you're talking

>>14180678
because i read nonfiction literature

>>14180691
you're a buzzman because all you do is use buzzwords. forgot to put that shit in my filter

>>14180754
>t. idior

>>14180766
the fuck is a tidior

did you mean tidier? you want me to tidy up?

>>14180772
Yes

>Films/TV/Youtube show me the lives of other people

>>14180788
yes

>>14180800
okay zoomer

>>14180783
but why is fiction worth reading?

>>14180802
okay buzzer

>>14180148
>a waste of time
What fucking isn't a waste of time? If your job isn't being a doctor, nurse or fire fighter it most likely is absolutely a waste of time and will never benefit anybody in a tangible way.

Everything is a fucking waste of time and calling something "a waste of time" simply is irrelevant.

>>14180148
Why kiss girls I can just cry alone in my room

>>14180809
>Everything is a fucking waste of time
if you really feel that way then >>14180579

>>14180148
Fiction goes more in-depth than some faggot movie. Just compare Lolita the book vs Lolita the movie. The book wins every time and by a long mile. And reading some dull non-fiction book about hebephilia won't really be as interesting as a well-written narrative. Fiction is strictly for the patrician mind. I say this unironically.

Fiction can do all of those things

>>14180148
It's a waste of time to try to argue with someone who praises TV

>>14180850
You don't like the film once you've seen the book because the characters conflict with the way you imagined them. If you don't read fiction then you won't have that problem. You can also watch several films based off of a book in the time it takes to read the book, and all of those films will add their own depth to the story.

>>14180855
Not as efficiently. Just like an electric scooter could move you from one place to another, but not as fast as a car.

>>14180865
i've been told that everything is a waste of time

>>14180876
I don't think it's the way I "imagined" the characters. That's quite a superficial reason. It's the overall work. Everything is dumbed down in the movie and it doesn't make up for the lack of the majestic prose.
>You can also watch several films based off of a book in the time it takes to read the book, and all of those films will add their own depth to the story.
Not really. Most movie adaptations fall short in terms of content and depth. But let me get this straight, you want just some dumbed down trash you can consume in a short amount of time? Yeah, I don't think this is for you then. Stick to YouTube videos.

>>14180900
Nice dubs. Sure but if you're really a man then you should adhere to your duties or try to find some meaning to what you choose to do with the free time you've been granted, usually where reading and deep thought come into play. Fiction is an artistic style of communicating ideas through fantastic stories.

It's interesting that you ask that, because I'm starting to realize that people are running to fiction as a way to experience normal human emotions that our modern atomized bugman existence robs from us.

>>14180915
>Stick to YouTube videos.

I'll stick to reading nonfiction where I can actually learn about hebephilia.

>Fiction is an artistic style of communicating ideas through fantastic stories.

Yeah, I think film does that better in a shorter time frame.

You can tell who reads too much fiction because they talk like a fucking weirdo and have to make things seem more important than they actually are.

>>14180941
I think the answer to this is that you CREATE the change in reality, instead of accepting it. You would know this if you read non-fiction.

Plato was right: fiction corrupts the soul. :3

>>14180979
Bugman confirmed.

>>14181017
>Plato
>being right about anything
Okay boomer

fiction > non fiction
fiction is actually fun and enjoyable

>>14180988
You can tell someone is a samefag because they sound buthurt and agree with OP.

>>14180979
You're an utilitarian, most people who read fiction are not. The value of a story lays on its capacity of conveying a message without being too analytic. Some people can grasp Christian theology better by reading philosophy while others not as much as reading Dostoyevsky - and you can apply this to almost every subject.

>>14180148
>Reddit/4chan give me the thoughts of real people
Imagine believing this.

>>14180979
Film has its own limitations and if you're that concerned with time spent (on fucking art) then you must not find that much enjoyment in art anyway.

>>14181060
>samefag
>didnt reply to myself

lurk more and learn what words mean newfag

>>14180148
>yet another anti-art nonficfaggot thread
Hey OP, suck my ass.

>>14181046
>i just wanna have FUN!

fiction readers everybody

>>14181107
>>samefag
>>didnt reply to myself
>learn what words mean
I think you need to take your own advice.

>>14181117
That's not what I said. Ah, maybe you actually can't read properly? Would explain a lot.

>>14181128
are you gonna tell me how fiction is nonfiction again?

"i make words mean whatever i want them to"

>>14181150
Non sequitur, newfag.

>>14181145
Just admit you wanna live in a fantasy world instead of actually learning reality.

Literature can show you the lives of other people in much more exhaustive detail than film and is one of the only ways to interact in any meaningful way with certain bygone eras/dead cultures. There's value in reading works that actually came from the hand of an ancient Greek/Chinese/Japanese that isn't necessarily found in just reading some academic's summary and analysis

>>14180816
>if you really feel that way then >>14180579 #
I don't think you either got my point or read my post.
I am not calling life meaningless, just the activities you partake in usually aren't productive in any way.

>>14181159
see, there you go again, newfag. you get called out for being wrong and not knowing what a word means and so now it's "i know you are but what am i"

just gonna filter you and not waste any more of my life like if i were reading a fiction book

>>14181174
I'm not him. Get a clue, you fucking zoomer. You just don't what samefagging is.

>>14181162
>learning reality
If you think you "learn about reality" by watching YouTube/TV you are deluded.

Fiction is able to distill human experiences and to examine life in a way no story bound to reality could.

>>14181179
***don't know

>>14181162
If you want to learn about the reality of how people lived and thought in pre-modern times fiction can be immensely helpful.

The best fiction is an artistic achievement in language and imagination and not being bound to the constraints of those other media (such as: manners, truth, brevity, immediate understandability, etc) it has the most exhaustive potential as an artform

>>14181183
>real people interacting with each other aren't real
>characters that a person made up are

>>14181183
>distill human experiences and to examine life in a way no story bound to reality could.
you mean exaggerate shit

>>14181162
You think your book is learning reality? The only way you learn reality is by actually experiencing reality. Even when reading non-fiction, you're still just reading someone else's thoughts and interpretations put onto a page. You're just hoping it's more correct because the author said it is.

>>14181219
It's backed by explaining things and showing scientific data.

>>14181037
Boomers don't even care about Plato, bro. I dunno what reality you are living in. I am a millennial. :3

>>14181226
Lots of things that were backed by explanations and scientific data turned out to be false.

>>14180618
>better
as if there is a simple spectrum of beauty where objects can be neatly arranged in order from least to most beautiful

>>14181244
better than something with no explanations and no data

>>14181268
>as if there is a simple spectrum of beauty where objects can be neatly arranged in order from least to most beautiful

i can do that. you can't?

>>14181291
pretend i gave you a list of intangible, beautiful things, you spat them back at me in an order of preference that you confused with beauty, and that i told you that you're wrong and to try again

>>14180882
Wouldn't you prefer to walk through a beautiful city so that you may soak it all in instead of looking at a vague image of it as you race past at 100mph?

>>14181327
But that wouldn't leave any time for watching the youtube videos that OP uses as a surrogate for social interaction

>>14181314
that's just your opinion

>>14181327
Yeah I prefer to see a beautiful city instead of someone describing it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qGiXY1SB68

this is better than reading fiction

>>14181344
you replace social interaction with your childish written fantasy worlds

>>14181576
I'd rather be a friendless loser that reads Greek tragedies than a friendless loser that watches youtubers talk into a camera

>>14181593
i prefer to read nonfiction, watch films, and not be a friendless loser but hey man if you're okay with reading fantasies and not having any friends then you do you

>>14181576
>social interaction with your childish written fantasy worlds
Since when watching youtube, a passive endeavor, is social interaction?

>>14181728
no, jose.

>>14180564
That's because you've likely only been here once. We see this shit a billion times a day, anon.

>>14180148
>Reddit


You have to go back faggot

>>14181748
>answering a non-polar question with no
Begone, zoomer.

>>14181593
based
>>14181709
faggot

>>14181238
Boomers love their classics, including Plato. Millennials don't even read. they just watch YouTube or some nonsense.

>>14180148
If you don’t like art or literature, why are you browsing a board about art and literature? Why not just stick to vcr manuals or whatever else you non-fiction plebs are into?

>>14181988
Because muh nonfiction books hurr durr

>>14181970
>Millennials don't even read
That's not true.

I think that you might be working around some people who don't read or don't have the right friends?

Either way, through the booktubers and etc etc everything you see a HUGE uptick in readers. Millennials don't read... ffs. Millennials are the most annoyingly well-read generation in forever. :3

>>14180148
>Reddit
>the thoughts of real people

>>14181988
>>14181997
I think the 'non-fiction' plebs, like me, are into... I dunno… philosophy? Economics?

History? Anything of value. :3

I have literally seen people trying to argue against the definition of 'non-fiction' as if it's supposed to 'feel' a certain way. Things aren't supposed to 'feel' certain ways, fictionfags. They either are or they aren't. You don't get to change a definition because it doesn't feel right.

And then they argue that certain words necessarily will have 'connotations' in the English language.

And I respond by saying not all words have connotations. :3

>>14182014
>Millennials
>well-read
Good one, anon. Slurping up John Greene's latest diarrhea and anxiously awaiting the movie tie-in of dystopian YA novel of the month #234 is not evidence of being well read. Millennials and zoomers have dedicated millions of dollars and the entirety of the academic institution to destroying literature that would permit someone to even become "well-read."

>>14182021
You are interested in philosophy but you don't understand the concept of connotation?

>>14182021
Who are you even talking to? Fucking schizos, man, I swear.

>>14182021
Philosophy is just abstract fiction. Economics is for bugmen. History is essentially fiction.

>>14182060
Not all words have connotations.

>>14182071
>History is...fiction

>>14182082
>History is...fiction
It is. It's certainly biased and not better than a biopic.

>>14181964
t. friendless loser who reads childrens fantasies

>>14181779
make some sense. learn some grammar, juanita.

>>14181988
I like nonfiction literature

>>14182097
The goal of history is for it to be as separated from fiction as humanly possible with different accounts being conflated to arrive at the grander picture.

A good, early example of this would be in Herodotus' Histories, where Herodotus sometimes gives two very long-winded accounts of the same event or location because of two conflicting or different ideas about the event/location. Clearly the idea is to present to the reader the closest idea to the truth, so he makes some estimates at times and states what is the 'most likely' option after giving two theories.

Obviously the idea is that this sort of dialectical process happens behind the scenes in most history books you read, where different stories concerning the event are weighed out, and the one is selected which is understood to be the event with reasonable certainty. :3

>>14180385
He is on the way too freedom, maybe even already there.

>>14180148
I encounter this view sometimes from STEM autists. Weirdly they all watch fictional TV shows, and don't see any discrepancy in their view of fiction books compared with fiction TV.

>>14182483
>The goal of history is for it to be as separated from fiction as humanly possible with different accounts being conflated to arrive at the grander picture.
That's the thing. We never get all of the angles possible. It's simply impossible. Therefore they select the story they want to tell and the result it's nothing more than a fiction.

>>14182467
I did but you can't read
Not my problem

>>14181215
Are you retarded? I'm surprised you can read or even understand speech you fucking mongoloid

>>14182593
try this, espanella

>>14182586
the argument is that you can get the same out of a fictional show/movie as you can from a book but in a smaller time window. so you can consume multiple films involving different people in the time it takes you to read just one book about one person, which would make reading fiction a waste of time today.

>>14183572
>no you're stupid

not an argument. try reading some nonfiction. here maybe this will help
https://changingminds.org/disciplines/argument/argument.htm

>>14182592
Yeah but at least history tries to explain what happened as accurately as possible, whereas fiction tries to be fantastical and exaggerate as much as possible.

>>14180148
Generally people are retarded and so you'll be retarded. Nonfiction is often narrow, blind and fails to address all angles and levels. Fiction sets the stage in a manner that promotes thorough thinking, empathy, emotional maturity, exposes you to a variety of ideas often in conflict, and so on. Fiction, especially that grounded in psychology and history, just has more detail and subtlety, such broadreaching too, than anything else ever does.

>>14184329
Also, good fiction guides you through mental states or passive absorption and mulling over ideas that reading a direct explanation, especially technical cannot. This is because it taps into social and psychological humanly things and masterfully directs your mind through certain ideas and feelings that a retard on reddit or a textbook cannot.

To be sure, they must be complementary for proper effect. But it's not as though fiction is just a shit version of nonfiction, in terms of usability (never mind art and such) fiction has a function that other mediums can't achieve. That said it doesn't have to be fiction, just told as a story, but in those cases you don't have enough real-world material to make something entirely true without misrepresentation or fictional elements.

>>14180148
It's cooler than a lot of non fiction

>>14184316
And what's the problem there? "Realistic = better"?

>>14185766
The issue is the applicability. You'll learn many more useful things from history than you will from fiction. :3

I think we all agree that fiction is more enjoyable than non-fiction. But fiction is not 'better' for your than non-fiction.

>>14185882
History is useless. It's essentially fiction but boring and has no applicability.

idk anon, why are you even interested in literature ?

>>14185888
I will agree that some aspects of history are there to be moved beyond, vid. even aspects that many people today don't comprehend or understand.

Yet I still think that history is important to study for context. :3

>>14185901
>>14181997

>>14185888
>has no applicability
room temperature iq
but keep reading clancy and stephen king tho

>>14186650
Only if you keep reading your Ann Coulter and watching The History Channel.

>>14186663
I'm reading Thucydides' Peloponnesian War but thank you