/lit/ - Literature

Eternal hell.

>>14147952
We typically don't commit suicide because because our consciousness is integrated into an operating system that prioritizes survival and thus tries to End Task on especially self-harming activity.

>>14147957
Most people don't believe in this.

>>14147952
You might not realize this, but killing yourself will not grant the absolute qualitative change from being to non-being that you believe it will.

>>14147976
They will when they've killed theirselves.

>>14148083
based

>>14147952
>Why don't we all commit suicide?
Because I'm not some teenage girl with """depression""".

>>14147957
What if everyone goes to hell,?

close to suicide myself, do you anons have any philosophical, non-religious arguments against suicide? i can't do it any more without a good reason

>>14148080
How do you know, pseud?

>>14148147
Because he's already died and realized that he is the the eternal brahman countless times

i refuse to die without making a positive impact
i want to live for my family
i want to live for the few distant friends i have
i want to live for the uneducated who need help
i want to live to make art that people connect to
i want to live to witness to unbelievers (yeah yeah, cringe)
i want to live to see my kids, whenever i have them
i want to live to look back at this weird, ugly part of my life and see how much i've grown

>>14148179
addendum
i can be a pretty mean guy sometimes, i know my thoughts aren't all flowers 'n rainbows.
kinda lazy too, unsure how much i've gotten over it
weirdly self-centered too, probly why i've typed this book 'n a half

>>14148125
There is no reason not to, in all honesty. The main reasons I haven't done it yet is my fear of death/afterlife and the emotional harm it may impart on my dad.

>>14148125
It is not worth the bother of killing yourself, since you always kill yourself too late.

>>14148200
I was raised in a conservative Protestant home, and still can't shake my fear of hell even though I'm not religious. I don't see myself as depressed either though. I just can't see anything that would be worth living for. Life is pain.

>>14148221
I've had a sort of spiritual awakening recently, but in the past few days I feel I've come back to square one. Now I'm of the belief that a large portion of major religions (Abrahamic, Greek, Vedic, etc.) were products of the euhemerism of ancient Mesopotamian rulers and their contemporaries and history. I truly don't know what to believe. I felt greatly spiritual for a while, but now I'm back to nothing. I hope someday I can escape this life and either find peace, or find the answer.

>>14148247
I've noticed, being subjected to church and Christian private school, that religious people seem so much happier and fulfilled than others. Or maybe they're only happier than me. But sometimes it feels like a tradeoff: my intellectual freedom for a chance at happiness and fulfillment in life if I try Christianity again.

Hegel is the difficult movement beyond pessimism, unless you cop out withSchopenhauer-Mainländer-Nietzsche

>>14147952
>die as quickly as possible
Okay, Ganon.

>>14148276
What would hegel tell me

>>14148098
most people who kill themselves are adult males with existential despair

>>14147952
>What actually is the purpose of continuing to live? Why don't we all commit suicide?
Think about it for yourself. It's up to you. I mean, personally, I couldn't give less of a fuck if anyone else wants to live or not, if they want to kill themselves or not. It's up to them.

>>14147952
I steer clear of anyone who looks like an irl version of Ganon. Physiognomy is real.

>>14147952
Basically because, god knows why, stuff keeps happening, nothing is stopping this shit so we just keep going, we all think lots of different things, so a world wide suicide is impossible, The myth of sisyphus is ok, just be happy anon ;)

>>14148083
>>14148098
based

>>14148301
based, no genelets allowed in the pool

>>14147952
Based Silenus

>>14147952
imagine all the souls at the gate dying to get in the best show there is, the human life. even the ones who get a raw deal, or murdered brutally, pop out the other side and are like that was fuckin epic

>>14148299
>>14148299
That you need to contemplate the whole picture via meta-thinking, you are accustomed to your own vision of reality but there's so much going on right now everywhere, you have to transcend all bias and be free from all of 'em

>>14148468
>even the ones who get a raw deal, or murdered brutally, pop out the other side and are like that was fuckin epic
Imagine being enough of a deluded retard to believe something like this.

>>14148490
its one hundred percent the truth. get into jung, plato, the heroes journey. we want to be here. but getting out of nihilism is part of the journey.

>>14148498
This is refuted by the simple existence of suicides.

>>14148468
based

because you need to have a family and kids. The goal is to procreate and take care of your family

>>14147952
It's a shitty bet. You have literally no idea what or if there is anything after death and whether it will truly be better or less bad as life is now. Suicide is illogical and dumb.

>>14148551
>anti-suicide FUD
lol

most people who kill themselves immediately try to re-enter their bodies

>>14148547
we want to give other spirits the opportunity to be born and grow here. but too many people think children is the purpose and then their mission is done. our spirit's journey is ultimately 'selfish'.

>>14147952
You ready? Here it is
Purpose as in your sole purpose is to reproduce and pass on your genes
But the fact you have conciousness means you can subvert or surpass this default mode of being

>>14148575
Please take your medication.

>>14148597
that is the ice cold biological purpose, but the spiritual purpose is different.

>>14148597
The biological drive is not an "ought," it's just an impulse.

>>14147952
Schopenhauer. He'll cheer you right up.

>>14147957
You mean what we have right now? Are you implying that this world isn't hell? fucking idiot Christfag

>>14148125
Embrace moderate hedonism. Find things you enjoy to do and do the fuck out of them. Nothing really matters, there’s no point to anything, so you might as well get COMFY while you’re waiting to die.

>>14148478
But that is literally impossible for humans in our current form. We only have access to 1 point of view in 3D space. No amount of contemplation will fix that.

>>14148999
This

>>14147952

What reason is there for committing suicide?

>>14148102
Justice will have been served then.

>>14148125
Killing yourself is incredibly painful and traumatic and if you fail you may end up paralyzed for life and no one will mercykill you.
Also in the last moments you will experience a sudden urge of desperate will to live and if you die in this state you will be stuck in it's terror forever as your ability to perceive time infinitely slows down and your conscieousness fades away.
You will experience torment sharpened to the edge for eternity.

>>14148221
>I just can't see anything that would be worth living for.
Find something that's worth dying for then, and live for it instead. This literally cured my nihilism and depression.

>>14149108
No longer desiring to live. Deciding that death would be preferable to continuing to live.

Simple: reincarnation makes suicide pointless. The Demiurge can't create more spirits to inhabit his imperfect material world, so he just recycles what he has. You are stripped of all your memories, and put back into another flesh bag.
The enlightened are those uneaten by the world.

>>14149154
How does collapsing our habitual biosphere or resource depletion conflict with the Demiurge? Does the planet get wiped so often? What happens with excess spirits with less bodies constrained by carrying capacity?

>>14149185
I am also interested in these questions. Perhaps the demiurge and his created reality may be external to what we perceive as time.

>>14149185
>>14149212
>How does collapsing our habitual biosphere or resource depletion conflict with the Demiurge?
The Demiurge does not interfere with his own experiment, what he learns here, he will apply to the future Kalpas. Death and failure are his favorite laws of creation: everything is refined through an endless process of evolution. Just as life is climbing to perfection on a mountain of corpses, the Demiurge climbs to perfection on mountains of dead worlds.
>What happens with excess spirits with less bodies constrained by carrying capacity?
The laws that bind this material world were created by the Demiurge. The dimension of time is a part of it, the three spacial dimensions, causality, and other painful shackles for the Spirit. If an afterlife exists, it is another false reality created by him, serving to recycle souls.
Who knows the true number of Spirits shackled to his world. Perhaps, we all are just one single Spirit?

>>14149325
I see. Where would I start with learning about Gnosticism?

>>14149352
There exists knowledge which can be empirically "proven" - Logos (logic, science).
There even exists knowledge which cannot be proven, but it can be communicated - Pistis (faith).

Then there is knowledge that cannot be proven, and it cannot be communicated. This is Gnosis. Turn away and go back to your life.

>>14148125
whats the point

>>14149154
>implying that the population explosion that we experience doesn't disprove the idea that there is a finite amount of souls for the demiurge can play with

>>14149154
where does he get the souls since there are more people now then ever ?

>>14149377
>>14149410
>because that is somehow beyond the guy who created space and time

Also, you have no idea what you're talking about. "finite amount of souls"? Souls are created by the Demiurge, just as bodies are. It is the Spirit which is uncreated, eternal, immutable, not of this world.
Also, who says that every single living person has a Spirit? Some certainly act as if they don't.

>>14149414
lel

>>14148547
phew thank God i have no desire to have a family or kids.

>>14147952
The Myth of Sisyphus

>>14149443
>life sucks but just be happy because uhhh
great essay

>>14148211
What is this retarded quote even suppose to mean.

>>14149377
>he thinks people under 90 IQ have a soul

>>14147952
unironically the myth of sisyphus
read it when i was 16
but i'd like to reread it

>>14147952
Hello, Rust Cohle.

>>14149325
>>14149154
>>14149364
>>14149414
Read Timaeus.

>>14149015
>only have access to 1 point of view in 3D space. No amount of contemplation will fix that.
Close your eyes nigga

>>14149154
Reincarnation is even more likely if souls do not exist. “We” did not exist before this life, yet people seem to think that we will pass into an eternity of nothingness after this life. If you were brought out of that nothingness, what makes you think you will stay there? You had no identity before this life, and so you will lose your current identity after this life, and you will gain another, and experience life in the form of any living being in the universe. Eternal recurrence, reincarnation, theism, hedonism...what all these systems have in common is that it’s best to be good. Be good to others, improve the world, better yourself. If you want to go one step further you can have faith in Christ, who claims to be the only path to salvation.

>>14149134
You dont even know what nihilism is, faggot
Stfu

>>14149015
And that's the bloody thing, with Hegel is not about the physical world per se, it's about the development of your own conscience, pushing the limits acknowledging everything that exists or has existed, some sort of structure, the so calle "phenomenology", to truly know your role and relationship within reality.

>>14148125
If you die you can never experience anything positive ever again.

You only get ONE SHOT at existence anon. You really want to throw it away early?

>>14147952
For me its the need to coom

Lucretius: One prolongs life only to discover it offers no new pleasures

>>14150311
Reincarnation is impossible. Each consciousness is a unique event that can't be replicated.

>>14150460
That’s a vague description of consciousness. My point is that “you” will lose your identity in this life and assume the consciousness of a newly created being in the next life, just as you were without identity before this life and assumed your current form.

>>14150494
That assumes you can somehow quantify, differentiate and track the energy that makes up my consciousness, when in fact when I die it will all simply turn into different energy states. "I" am an energy state, localized. Without my particular brain, "I" do not exist at all.

>>14150502
You still don’t get what I’m saying. Before your body was created, you had no identity, assuming souls do not exist. So your assignment to your body is totally arbitrary. You could have lived life as any other being. So after you die, you will be as you were before this life, and you will eventually assume the conscious experiment of some random organism in the universe.

>>14150516
No I won't, because I won't exist.

There is no "You" before your brain exists. You literally cannot exist in its absence. When I die, I am gone. Zip. Nada. The only way I can assume some other consciousness is if souls exist, which they don't.

>>14149487
He never says life sucks, quite the opposite. But I should know better than to expect you to read anything other than 4chan memes.

>>14148080
>>14148158

Unironically.

>>14150524
> if souls exist, which they don't.
oh I'm sure you don't have a soul

>>14150534
You don't either, you just cant stand the idea because it obliterates your ego and you can't handle that emotionally.

>>14150524
>When I die, I am gone.
But you were gone before you born in this life, and yet, here you are.

>>14147952
read a book about Jonestown

>>14150546
What's your point?

>>14150453
>You only get ONE SHOT at existence

That would make rebuking life all the more righteous, basically necessary.

>>14150559
I’m saying there’s no reason why you can’t be born again as literally any other being, if souls do not exist. Your current life has no effect on your future experience. You were brought out of nothingness, and you will be brought out again. There is no such thing as death as long as there is still birth. I would go so far as to say that if there were only two humans left in the world, with no other organisms in the universe, and they conceived a child, then everyone who has ever existed would be having a conscious experience as that child. But they would all think they are just one individual. You yourself are composed of multiple past identities, but you do not know it, because you are all experiencing the same thing.

>>14150586
and again, it’s not really “you” that is being traced along and reincarnating as if you are a soul. But my point is that you will always experience life whether you want to or not.

>>14150586
How could I be born again if I only exist within this particular brain? The consciousness within that other being would not be "me", it would be something else.

What you're asserting requires a permanence of souls, otherwise it makes no sense. Just accept that you are not a permanent entity already.

>>14150586
This is a really good, and I think it's compatible from a materialist point of view, basically the way information flows.

>>14150594
Why can’t you exist in the future as a different brain? Why can’t that be “you” as well? Do you think you were just waiting for billions of years until this particular set of genetics was created, allowing you to exist? If you were cloned, would you experience what all the clones are experiencing, all at once?

op is a faggot

>>14150606
We can't wait if we don't exist.

You really seem to not get this. YOU DO NOT EXIST BEFORE BEING CONCEIVED. There is no "you", there is nothing, you don't come from ANYWHERE, you are an energy state produced by your brain, and you will cease to exist ENTIRELY when your brain stops functioning.

>>14150627
Exactly, so after you die, your current brain will be irrelevant. You could be born as some other brain state after this life is over.

>>14150594
>The consciousness within that other being would not be "me", it would be something else.
>>14150627
>you are an energy state produced by your brain
Are you just a set of atoms? Of course not. What are you then, where in that bouncing cloud of particles is the "I"? Why would the "I" be just a wave function, what makes that wave function different from all other functions?
Each second it changes, who you were 5 years ago, or even 5 minutes ago, what you exactly thought - all gone, replaced. Why would continuity like that matter at all, it clearly doesn't. The exact atoms change as well, your body replaces them, your thoughts change, your memories, your ideas, your emotions...

But out of this process arises something far more permanent than any set of atoms, something ephemeral: a consciousness. You can see, hear, touch, smell, perceive your thoughts - only a soul can do that. It is independent of the physical world, because it is not a part of it, you can't pinpoint it to anything. It's like a mathematical formula in this sense, it can be found here, but it's not a any single atom. Like a pattern in the sand, you can't find it in any single grain, you don't even need the same grains, or sand - the pattern is independent of it. This is a soul, and your puny 21st century brain will never be able to comprehend it.

>>14150642
That doesn't make any sense. When my brain is gone, I am also gone. I cannot come back.

>>14150699
That's like saying stars have souls because they have a perpetual fusion reaction going on in their cores. Your consciousness is a self-perpetuating energy state, there is nothing special about that, only that it is conscious.

>>14148125
Camus

>>14150715
>self-perpetuating energy state
When did they start teaching freshmen quantum mechanics? Where do you even come up with terms like "self-perpetuating"? There is no such thing in quantum mechanics.
Was all you get from what I wrote is "process going on in time = soul"? Simply embarrassing. That "puny brain" thing was just a joke, but now I think I was right.

>>14150703
kek imagine being this dumb. Ok anon, here. We'll spoonfeed you. https://youtu.be/rGv27EhQYtk

>>14148125
who would post frogs when you’re gone?

>>14150754
I don't feel embarrassed, and you still aren't making any sense.

>>14150771
Good.

>>14150759
Imagine being this delusional.

>>14150779
It's ok anon. You can just admit you don't get it.

>>14150792
There's nothing to not get, you're just wrong.

>>14150779
You haven't even watched it yet, you pseud.

>>14148647
Do as you please.
So long as the biological imperative is met, everything else is subjective

>>14150627
What do you think about this: The information inside our brains needs a tangible stability we call "I", these "You" and "I" are being reshaped every day through all the data that gets through our senses, a give-and-take, metaphorically speaking we all are a "reincarnation" of somebody else, you will never be able to be "you" again after you die, but us, "I", have always been here, a big heap of information that keeps evolving ,and we all are experiencing it.

>>14150931
just take some DMT man, there will be no more "I"

>>14147952
>>14148125
Myth of Sisyphus - Camus, also On death - Schopenhauer

>>14150295
>>14150343
But your conscience is stil bound by the physical world (your body) - it doesn't just float around whereever it pleases (unless you have experiance astral projection or whatever (i haven't)). Thats why his philosophy is called idealism - it world be ideal if we could do it but we can't .. its not possible in our current state of evolution ... maybe someday

>>14147952
Suicide Note byMitchell Heisman

>>14148125
Why do you want to surrender?

>>14148080
biggest fear of the big brained

>>14148575
>our spirit's journey is ultimately 'selfish'.
how so?

>>14148125
Suicide spreads like a virus anon.
That phenomenon with famous people committing suicide which leads to other people doing it. It happens on a micro level. Someone's friend or brother, or neighbor does it. Then someone else does it. It only spreads and spreads.
I think it has to do with the fact that, like many people say, there really isn't any real reason not too. When living becomes so unbearable, and it easily can, there's always an out option. If the fire building up in the room is so hot. If the smoke is too suffocating. People will jump out of the window for the brief moment of fresh air before slamming against the pavement.

It's truly fucking sad. We are all living the same existence. Everyone in this thread but also every animal and everything that is alive. When we see a fellow survivor quit and voluntarily leave it reminds us all of the suffering of life and how easy you can get taken out. It's like watching your fellow team fall one by one to the realization of hopelessness. Sometimes the belief that you will make it is all that you can have. When I go outside, miserable, but I see a father playing with their kid or the mailman doing their job, or someone going to work all I think is "I can do it too". But when I see people give into the suffering and end it I don't judge them. It only reminds me that if they couldn't bear it then how the fuck can I?

I don't know if that made any sense but anon we're all reacting to one anothers actions all the time. You have no idea what little things you do affect your community. Killing yourself is a big action, and it will bleed consequences which are almost universally negative.

>>14149414
Does the demiurge divide the Spirit in order to make up for the ingrowing population?

>>14151667
>Then someone else does it. It only spreads and spreads.
Easily disporven by the fact that we haven't all killed ourselves.

>>14149130
>Also in the last moments you will experience a sudden urge of desperate will to live and if you die in this state you will be stuck in it's terror forever as your ability to perceive time infinitely slows down and your conscieousness fades away.
You will experience torment sharpened to the edge for eternity.
Elaborate pseud fag

>>14151407
Again, Hegel it's not about understanding the material physical world "as it is", knowing what is "outside" the universe or solving quantum mechanics, nor about conscience as some kind of ghost, he pretty much conceived an universal system that can work inside your own human limitations, something to get rid of bias thinking letting you get the whole picture in every direction, Marx saw this and apply the whole thing to his own materialist perspective, that's the beauty of it, Hegel attempted to create a universal principle to everything we as humans would be able to conceive.

>>14151681
>https://www.hhs.gov/answers/mental-health-and-substance-abuse/what-does-suicide-contagion-mean/index.html
>https://psychcentral.com/lib/protecting-teens-from-the-spread-of-suicide/
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copycat_suicide

>>14150627
This is your brain on modernity

>>14147952
make friends faggot

>>14147952
all the sad cunts should indeed commit suicide so that only non-sad people would remain and make non-moppy children who'd have no inclination towards being fags who off themselves because "le life is le hard"

>>14150769
I would

>>14148125
do eet faggot

>>14147952
Silenus looks like a clown. Is he the original Joker?

>>14147957
fpbp /thread

>>14148125
Read aquinas

>>14148125
>philosophical, non-religious arguments against suicide
You're a pussy if you go through with it.