/lit/ - Literature

>>14042842
This is actually brain dead reasoning that makes zero sense.
>potential to an actual
A potential is something that physically does not exist but can come to exist, e.g a novel that I have not yet written but could write. A foetus is a growing human, it has human DNA, it is already living in so far as an adult human is, otherwise you have to explain what justifies the right to life of a five year old child in relation to a fifty year old? Should we harvest the organs of children to keep the older people alive? Oh wait Ayn Rand would literally agree with that.

>>14042881
It seems to Rand that human being's life begins at birth. Anything before that is considered a pontentiality; a potential, growing human being. It doesn't seem like 'brain dead reasoning' to me. The example of the five year old child it's not applicable here.

>If any among you are confused or taken in by the argument that the cells of an embryo are living human cells, remember that so are all the cells of your body, including the cells of your skin, your tonsils, or your ruptured appendix—and that cutting them is murder, according to the notions of that proposed law.

>>14042842
I wish Ayn Rand were aborted lol

>>14042975
Why yes, if I cut the cells of someone neck to the point where all the other cells in their body begin to decompose then I have committed murder. This is really a non starter, to prove that life begins with birth you must explain what process of being born makes you suddenly a human. Have you spent time around six month old children? They are barely functional.

One of the few instances where I agree with Rand desu. I came close to having a kid with my ex and realized that I would not be able to provide adequately. An abortion would have cost way cheaper than getting a crib and other necessities. I would rather abort one and have another a few years later and actually give him a fighting chance

>>14043048
Stop having sex?

I swear byApolloPhysician, byAsclepius, byHygieia, byPanacea, and by all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will carry out, according to my ability and judgment, this oath and this indenture.
To hold my teacher in this art equal to my own parents; to make him partner in my livelihood; when he is in need ofmoney to sharemine with him; to consider his family as my own brothers, and to teach them this art, if they want to learn it, without fee or indenture; to impart precept, oral instruction, and all other instruction to my own sons, the sons of my teacher, and to indentured pupils who have taken the physician’s oath, but to nobody else.
I will use treatment to help the sick according to my ability and judgment, but never with a view to injury and wrong-doing. Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. Similarly I will not give to a woman apessaryto cause abortion. But I will keep pure and holy both my life and my art. I will not use the knife, not even, verily, on sufferers fromstone, but I will give place to such as are craftsmen therein.
Into whatsoever houses I enter, I will enter to help the sick, and I will abstain from all intentional wrong-doing and harm, especially from abusing the bodies ofman or woman,bond or free. And whatsoever I shall see or hear in the course of my profession, as well as outside my profession in my intercourse with men, if it be what should not be published abroad, I will never divulge, holding such things to be holy secrets.
Now if I carry out this oath, and break it not, may I gain for ever reputation among all men for my life and for my art; but if I break it and forswear myself, may the opposite befall me.
– Translation by W.H.S. Jones.

>>14042842
>Never mind the vicious nonsense of claiming that an embryo has a “right to life.” A piece of protoplasm has no rights
t. a piece of protoplasm

>>14043057
I did, hence the "ex" part. Celibate for 6 months

>>14042842
Pro choice folks are all lazy and aren't responsible enough to practice safe sex. If I child will "ruin" your plans, use a fucking condom. Any rand was an idiot I swear

>>14043092
Condoms break and cost money, it adds up when you have to put one on every time you want to do it. Oral contraceptives have adverse effects on women, ie hormonal imbalances leading to mood swings and weight gain. The day a male medical contraceptive is discovered is the day the abortion debate fucking ends

>>14043028
It's not about what constitutes a "human", it's about what constitutes a person. Although a foetus can be seen as human from its conception, it can never be seen as a person. When it is born, it is separated from its husk (the womb) and starts developing its own personality. A choice between two persons is hard to make under any set of ethics, but when choosing between the rights of a human being with a personality (a person) and the rights of a set of growing human cells without any personality, I don't see how you can think the latter are more important.

>>14043104
The main point of sex is to have children, if you want to get off go beat your meat.

>>14043092
Pro life people make the choice seem so easy. What if you got pregnant from rape? What if you got pregnant by choice but your partner dies, making it impossible for you to support the baby? What if the baby is diagnosed with Down syndrome? (If you want to reply that foetuses with Down syndrome are an exception and can be aborted, then you are also for killing adult downies if your anti-abortion discourse is to be followed consequently)

>>14043130
And what if you want to get off together with your partner, but she has a weird hangup about non-penetrative forms of sex? There is more to life than just the "main" points of things

>>14043147
Either buy a condom, or do not do it till you're ready to have children, i do not see the problem here.

>>14043199
Condoms do not guarantee complete protection, is what I'm saying. Accidents happen, factory damage, warehouse mishandling, sometimes sperm gets through a fucking microscopic hole. Problems that are not obvious when you have the opportunity to have good sex. This is almost on the level of telling a weed addict to just stop smoking if they don't want to face the negative consequences, except sex addiction isn't a real thing.

>>14043217
This is the reason why "don't have sex until marriage" exists.
>This is almost on the level of telling a weed addict to just stop smoking if they don't want to face the negative consequences
Exactly, because that's literally how it works. You can't have both things go your way, people like you only want the pleasure without accepting the consequences.
It's really that simple, either compromise and buy a condom and risk that .1% of it breaking or do not have sex until the both of you are ready to have children.

>>14043092
>>14043130
>>14043199
>>14043252
The concept of rape destroys the entire argument of a pro lifer

>>14043289
Put the child up for adoption.

>>14043289
The sins of others do not justify my own.

a fetus doesn't have rights because none of have rights

>>14043306
Being pregnant for 9 months is a burden that can destroy careers.

>>14043252
If sex was just about procreation, your refractory period would probably be much longer. I have a terrible low libido and yet I'm get ready to have another round within the hour, shooting really weak sperm afterwards. People fuck, contraceptives fail. Even a postinor doesn't guarantee no pregnancy. You're telling people to get a grip in a world that tells them to stop doing exactly that and get in touch with their passions. If you can stay celibate until you're ready to support a kid, good for you. Most people can't. What's easier - hammering the celibacy into their heads or allowing them to yeet their babies until they're ready?

>>14043322
Based. Human rights are intangible and not literal. Speaking as if they are is practically propagandist.

>>14043323
oh no, not her career!

>>14043310
based

>>14043328
>If sex was just about procreation, your refractory period would probably be much longer.
probably true

If we agree that we are a product of our memory, and that we would lose our identity if we lost all out memory, then killing creatures without memory should not be immoral because they do not exist.

>>14043347
nobody cares that you read Derek Parfit dude

>>14043328
Obviously the "yeeting their babies" part, but the problem is, why practice murder? Cleansing half of the human population is also a thing that would fix a lot of things, yet should we do it?
>>14043323
Women should not work.

>>14043342
Bluepilled non-argument, faggot christcuck. Whether you think careers are worthless doesn't change the fact that suffering is perpetuated for what is practically a hypothetical life. Every time a woman bleeds, a similar hypothetical life is lost. Stop performing your mental gymnastics around terms of discussion nobody is interesting in bringing up, like sin. We are not discussing whether abortion should be considered a sin, you fucking massive tard.

>>14043355
>he actually reads philosophy

Abortion is okay because people suck.

>>14043369
I've been pondering the mass genocide question since I hit 14, what prevents me from saying "yeah fuck it 6 billion have to go" is my own counter-argument "who the fuck am I to make decisions for other people"

The argument pro life vs pro choice can be brought down to the argument quantity of life vs quality of life, and any time someone argues that quantity of life is more important than quality, I cannot help but imagine them as autistic retards whose basis for the argument rests on the supposition that they will never be confronted with the realities of the point they're arguing.

>>14043310
>implying abortion is a sin

>>14043355
>implying anyone on this board has actually read something

Condoms successfully stop pregnancy 98% of the time. 450,000,000 condoms are sold a year in America. 2% of those break so that's 9,000,000 broken condoms. Yet there's only 600,000 abortions a year and that number is getting smaller. What does this bros?

You have to be seriously mentally kiked in order to oppose abortion.

>>14043400
Factor chance of successful insemination, sex during pregnancy, percentage of sterile population, percentage of women on female birth control, percentage of couples that climax during vaginal sex even with a condom on (many still pull out for that 2%).

>>14043392
>implying abortion is a sin
Apologies for using such ambiguous terminology when people sperg out at the first hint of theology.

>>14042842
>A bunch of bullshit
Just let them be adopted then. Once they turn 18 let them have the informed decision to commit suicide or not. Whether they get to live should be up to them, not to a women who made a 'mistake'.

>>14043400
Is this reasoning a product of American sex education?

>>14043392
>Qualitee of life
>If you're not living a cookie cutter life you shouldn't live at all
Spoken like a true privileged w*sterner.

Based Varg gets it right again
https://youtu.be/oyQ2_MwRi4o

>>14043427
t. based moralless anon not realising that he's more of a disappointment to his mother than to himself

>>14043431
I'm genuinely confused and not talking a side here. Shouldn't there be 8,400,000 more abortions happening? I'm scared.

>>14043455
You've ignored my post, you coward.

>>14043455
not every broken condom is a pregnancy, there's a window in the ovulation cycle where you can shoot loads into a woman and have a very low chance to get a baby, it's like a couple of days on either side of their bleeding iirc (but it's hard to predict when they bleed if they have irregular cycles)

>>14043458
>Implying it's worth addressing

Too much social status hinges on having sex. The fact that abortion is even mildly common is because of this. Muh rape babies and contraception misshaps are a pretty low percent of why it happens. Its mostly just unga bunga retards

>catholic truecels on their quest against premarital sex, contraception and abortion

>>14043470
>incels are opposed to abortion
I wonder why???

>>14043478
Please guys, don't do it. You'll go to hell. Pray for purity

>>14043478
>>14043479
>le in celery xDDDDDD

>>14043488
bro what if the catholics are wrong and the real god and afterlife are what the african tribes believe in
christianity is pointless without the institutions it has blueprints in the bible for

>>14043479
When i looked at my first child i felt like i could give my life for it without hesitation any time.
Burger society must be really ass-backwards for unironically wanting to murder their own offspring.

Individual based morality is a worthless sham that doesn't lead to anything.

Poor people, immigrants and people with debilitating genetic defects should be encouraged to have abortions, on the other hand rich people should have to pay very high prices to abort.

>>14042842
She's completely correct. Only soft-hearted deluded morons who have never raised children think having unwanted kids raised by unwilling parents is a good plan. Rights start at birth. Before that, it's 100% mom's choice.

>>14043516
>I chose to have a child and was happy when my wish was fulfilled
>someone who is forced to have a child against their will must therefor also be happy when they have a child
I'm from Europe btw, we have legal abortion, high WHO quality of life scores and the ability to reason logically

>>14043544
>someone who is forced to have a child against their will
Should have been more careful then.

Most abortions are carried out by third worlders....but hey let's ban them because we clearly need more of those.

>>14043575
>>14043289
God I wish I could rape your wife so you would be stuck with the logical, physical consequence of the point you're trying to make

>>14043133
>What if you got pregnant from rape? What if you got pregnant by choice but your partner dies, making it impossible for you to support the baby? What if the baby is diagnosed with Down syndrome? (If you want to reply that foetuses with Down syndrome are an exception and can be aborted, then you are also for killing adult downies if your anti-abortion discourse is to be followed consequently)
Let them have the chance to be adopted. If they want to die let them kill themselves.

>>14043502
I believe that religion is a fundamental human concept, especially Catholicism. It is the code in the computer simulation we live in. You can't escape God in this dimension

>>14043323
Oh no, that job is more important than that baby. What a joke.

>>14043585
You're free to try :^), but hypothetically, the child would just be put up for adoption.

>>14043370
Two wrong don't make a right. Just because her career might suffer does that make it ok to abort. That's 3rd grade logic.

>>14043585
Theyre still statistically pretty irrelavant to most abortion cases. Keep appealing to emotion though

>>14043588
>Let's make a child only so we can put it in kiddieprison once it's out
Gee, how kind of you.

>>14043585
>God I wish I could rape your wife
"N-no, we're the moral ones here!" -pro choice babs

>>14043585

>White knights half of humanity but not all of humanity.

>tfw your imoto was a rape baby and your family couldn't be happier

Abortion always fucks with me because I have a radically different frame of reference than most of the opinionated shitposters.

>mfw people without realizing criticize Aristotle thinking that Rand somehow came up with all this shit in isolation

>>14042842
It all depends on the race of the fetus.

>>14043602
>>14043605
>>14043621
I wish my aborted foetuses were still alive so they could all laugh at your triggered responses

>>14043600
>Two wrong don't make a right
Fucking retard.

>>14043671
>admits they were alive
Kek

>>14043593
It's not a baby by any definition.

>>14043671
>Yure le triggr!
Keep killing your(or the bull's) progeny.

>>14043632
think about all the moe cat girls that never had a chance to eat chips because of being aborted.

Her underlying assumptions about the human race are wrong - she isn't a traditionalist, she's an individualist, in other words she's retarded, someone with her mentality can only exist because the world is in a state of perversion made possible by excess, like a bubble in the ocean which at some point must pop. Her ideology is itself unnatural and anti-human. Unfortunately it is also the world ruler, so the "game" is to try and prove her argument wrong without contradicting her assumptions, because if you contradict the assumptions you'll be punished. But the assumptions are monstrous, evil principles calling themselves good.

>>14043671
Do roasties actually take some weird pride in abortion numbers?

If the condome breaks I would abort that fucker right away, keep playing the guilt game, as long as the law on my country allow it I will do it

If quality of life is such an issue when deciding to have a child, should a minimum QoL be enforced to ensure babies are not born into this world for unnecessary suffering?

>>14043722
It's the only way they can prove that they've had sex

>>14043736
No that's a stupid idea

>>14043736
If we get to a point where just about everyone can live a decent life than abortion would be nearly unquestionably immoral

>>14042842
Pretty cynical... What gives a born person 'rights'? We don't have inhering 'rights' either, rather they are extended to us via societal consensus. What is so extreme then, about futher extending that protection to a zygote, which which will become a person if not interfered with? Is it not reasonable to expect that most of those potential people will prefer to exist?

I think there are cases where abortion is justified... Severe extenuating circumstances, genetic/developmental defects, high risk of mother's mortality... But these should be somber and heavily deliberated circumstances. It shouldn't be casual and normalized like you're going in to have a cyst drained or something. This casual attitude only further reinforces the irresponsibility and stupidity which leads to these circumstances, among other poor societal outcomes.

Abortion should be serious business, and a last resort. Adoption should be preferred when abortion isn't strictly necessary. There should be a strong social stigma about getting yourself into an unwanted pregnancy situation. Encouraging such responsibility and restraint is not only beneficial in this context, but for all aspects of society.

I'm also in agreement with anons who are concerned about overpopualtion, but abortion is a rather ghoulish way to deal with that imo. What we need is active eugenics... Offering financial incentives to low IQ, low income and genetically unhealthy people to be sterilized. We could also stop incentivizing single motherhood with welfare. Stop artificially sustaining third-world populations with foreign aid. Put pressure on the major culprits (India & China).

OP here, she said some pretty based things about blacks too. Thoughts?

>Never mind the vicious nonsense of claiming that a nigger has a “right to life.” A no good nigger has no rights—and no life in the human sense of the term. One may argue about the more obviously bleached mulattos, but the essential issue concerns only the blackest of niggers. To equate a white with an actual nigger, is vicious; to advocate the sacrifice of the latter to the former, is unspeakable. Observe that by ascribing rights to the nigger, i.e., the non-rational, the nigger-lovers obliterate the rights of the rational: the right of good whites to set the course of their own lives. The task of building a civilization is a tremendous, lifelong responsibility, which no one should undertake unwittingly or unwillingly. Immigration is not a duty: human beings should not accept the importation of stock-farm animals. For conscientious persons, an illegal immigrant is a disaster; to oppose its deportation is to advocate sacrifice, not for the sake of anyone’s benefit, but for the sake of misery qua misery, for the sake of forbidding happiness and fulfillment to the white race.

>>14043796
bee and arr

>>14043796
Any Rand got rammed by BBC and you know it

>>14043850
I don't care what that Jewess did to be honest.

>>14043289
>Every person that has had an abortion was raped
Kys you fucking retard

>>14043133
I agree with pro abortion stance, but I feel the rape argument is a bit disingenuous since it is statistically extremely unlikely, especialy in modern day. Feels like a call to emotions rather than logic. Its not something to not concider, but it is more of a special case scenario since it does not address the mass cause of unwanted pregnancy, but strawmans an extremely small minority (which should be considered, but it doesnt cover much of unwanted pregnancy.)

>>14042842
Not surprised.
I'm an antinatalist but even to me it's unacceptable, there's a metaphysical sadness to abortion, something pathetic and unnatural , like a broken gear chipping away and crackilng as it corrodes its dents.


This simposn episode becomes more ironic as I read this

>>14043322
>>14043340
Based.

>>14043706
This

>>14043736
Yep. The funny thing is that ideas like the OPs can easily be used to justify eugenics, which is unironically a good idea, but is also against their beliefs. If your point of view is that raising a child is a burden then you probably should never have one.

>>14043602
>>14044246
>>14044259
Look, when you're arguing that abortion is forbidden for everyone, then it doesn't matter which percentage of babies is conceived from rape. Even if it's only one rape baby, it invalidates the whole point of "you should have been more careful".

>>14042881
Your only support for why a fetus is living is that is has human DNA. This doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Imagine if there was a machine which could generate human DNA strands in a petri dish. Would this also constitute a human life?

Tfw passionately anti natalist but also anti abortion except in cases of rape
Any books for this feel?

>>14043444
Not him, but I oppose abortion, all my family does too and... I became a wealthy handsome man, go figure envious lefty lol!

The foetus is a actualised human that is in the process of realizing it's maturity, a retard is still a human but it's potential has been 'retarded' by nature whereas abortion is a artificial retardation.

>>14043028
then the answer is obviously to legalize post-natal abortion

>>14045726
Here you go

https://www.autism-society.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/nextsteps09.pdf

>>14046318
I actually do have autism
My belief stems from the fact that with unchecked abortion society grows more immoral and degenerate since women have a get out of jail free card

>>14045949
This. You wouldn't call a child or adolescent sub-human

>>14046348

>>14042842
if i was a female i would go out of my way to get pregnant on purpose just so i could get recreational abortions. babies are ugly as fuck and loud like a fire alarm why does anyone give a fuck if they get scrabbled? humans are parasites we should be trying to get rid of the whole species

Reminder that equating 'rights' of mother and child is completely retarded.
It would make sense with rape or even spontaneous generation, because in that case the child is forced on the mother. It is an invasion that can be processed out.
But mothers actually had sex. They made the decision of bringing the child around. It is not an invasion then. If anything, it is similar to inviting someone in, kill him, and tell the cops you considered him a burglar.
I support abortion on eugenics grounds but all of this 'my body my choice' is simultaneously pure retardation and pure evil, massacring you own children because they threaten your hedonism.

I support pro-choice but pro-lifers have better propaganda. Pro-choise has a bunch of screeching women even though they would have a vast array of better arguments to choose from other than MUH PATRIARCHY

>>14044660
>Imagine if there was a machine which could generate human DNA strands in a petri dish.
But there isn't.

>>14043589

>>14047285
But if there was, would you say that it's creating humans?

>>14046221
I know you're trolling but genuinely I'd recommend aborting yourself. Those babies you masturbate over the idea of murdering aren't worth much but you've somehow managed to make yourself worth even less.

Imagine living in a society where baby murder is not only acceptable but also one of the prime pillars keeping society from degenerating into a total shitfest that would be hilarious haha

>>14043014
I laughed but I feel bad about it

Mostly just a consequence of our society treating sex like some dumb game and rite of passage

>>14043370
>suffering bad
No, suffering is good. We must eliminate every service that reduces suffering at the cost of others because that's the only way to educate a society of responsible people.
Eliminating suffering is taking away people's challanges for the sake of comfort. That results in a decadent society of weaklings.

>>14043444
>the only people who would oppose abortion are the kind of people who hate their own lives
Sounds like projection desu

>>14043706
Enlightened

>>14042842
>ew
>Ayn Rand? Yikes
>Ayn Rand likes abortion?
>Hmm maybe Ayn Rand not yikes, what say thee fellow redditors?

>>14044660
We consider the unborn from the moment of conception to be a living being for a number of different reasons, not just DNA. The unborn from the moment of conception is a distinct organism belonging to the species homo sapiens and this organism is in a state of development, as in it's growing. That's three reasons. Your DNA generating machine doesn't belong to the species homo sapiens and it isn't in the state of development.

An additional reason your machine doesn't constitute human life is that it doesn't have a rational nature. Human beings are naturally a philosophical animal, meaning they can formulate ideas and accept or reject them. This nature is common to every human regardless of whether it is yet to manifest, as in the case of a young child, or if it isn't manifested because of some privation, like an accident or deformation in the humans development.

>>14048218
Your second paragraph seems to state that humans have a "rational nature" even when they don't, or it isn't "manifested". I agree that a rational nature is a quality which deserves defending, but this wording renders having or not having this rational nature irrelevant so long as a being has a human body.

To your first paragraph, which contrary to what you've stated, I believe only truly contains one argument rather than three, that is that the joining of egg and sperm form a distinct homo sapien, I think you're basing this again on the DNA argument without realizing it. What physical quality does the zygote have at conception which it shares with a human adult? I can see only the DNA, which again is not sufficient to make a human as per my previous argument. If you instead rely on the metaphysical quality of potential of life in the zygote as a quality worth defending, I think you would need to justify why sperm and eggs don't share this quality of potentiality, and shouldn't also be considered humans, and by extension, why abstinence in women shouldn't be regarded with the same seriousness as murder, as it requires them to waste perfectly good eggs (i.e. human beings)

You did also mention that the zygote is in a state of development, which makes it worthy of some level of moral weight, but this frankly confuses me. Why does developing towards becoming a human grant moral weight? Is this not the same as saying that it has potentiality? And if so, I think my above argument needs to be addressed.

>>14042842
> Implying Alisa Rozenbaum isn't just a piece of protoplasm

There's three components which make up a living human being.

1. It's an organism
2. It has human DNA, making it distinct
3. It is in the state of development.

These aren't individual arguments and I'm not saying these things in themselves give human beings moral worth. I'm saying that these things three things are what makes a human being human as opposed to the 'just DNA' that you were arguing against. The reason sperm and eggs on their own don't constitute human life or have the potential for human life is that they don't meet all three criteria. They have human DNA, but they don't have distinct DNA and they are not in a state of development. An egg or sperm cell by themselves will never grow into anything so it can't be said to have the potential to grow into something else. It is at the moment of conception when they meet all three criteria and become human with the potential to grow into an adult human.

As far as this rational nature stuff goes, I don't say that there's a point where humans don't have the nature of a rational animal. That's the opposite of what I said. I said all human beings, at all times, and all stages of development have a rational nature or the potential to philosophize This nature is intrinsic to all humans and is within us even if it doesn't become actualized. This is equivalent to saying that all humans, by nature, have legs. Having legs is part of our nature even if by some accident some humans are born without them or get them eaten by a bear. This rational nature is what gives all human beings moral worth.

>>14048434
meant for >>14048355

>>14042842
Ayn Rand woke me up on the Jewish question.

>>14048434
So I think your only argument with teeth is that sperm and eggs won't develop into humans on their own. The fact that they lack DISTINCT human DNA is irrelevant, as twins lack distinct DNA as well, but they both are humans.

I think there could be an argument made that sperm and eggs do form humans on their own in a way, or at least naturally. In all of the animal kingdom, it's the natural course of things for sperm and egg to find their way together, in a similar way to how it is natural for a zygote to develop into an organism of it's species.

Food for thought, but I'd rather pursue the development argument. Why does something being in the process of developing into a human give it human moral weight? Ill note also that I don't see any other qualities physical or otherwise that this thing holds, so we are talking exclusively about the development giving it moral weight.

I believe this thinking comes from a similar place as your "rational nature" argument. If you think that a homo sapien, even if they lack a rational nature, deserves to be defended as if they had a rational nature, then you would naturally defend a zygote, as well as a mental invalid, or a brain dead person. I understand and sympathize with this sentiment but think it comes from an emotional rather than a logical place. Humans form emotional connections with a wide variety of things, including inanimate objects, but we shouldn't then disregard the physical reality of those things which lack all human qualities other than DNA.

>>14048532
The fact that eggs and sperm don't have distinct DNA isn't the only reason they're not human. They're also not in a state of development. Twins are both equally human because they're distinct individual organisms, even if they have the same DNA. Even if the twins were connected by the hips we would still recognize them as distinct human beings because of the way they ought to be, as in, we recognize that something went wrong with their development.

You're not understanding anything I've said and this is evidenced by the fact that you think I'm arguing that something should have moral worth because it develops into a human. I'm not bothering with you anymore because of this. I don't have the patience for this kind of stupidity.

>>14048564

>There's three components which make up a living human being.
>...
>3. It is in the state of development.

>You're not understanding anything I've said and this is evidenced by the fact that you think I'm arguing that something should have moral worth because it develops into a human

Forgive my misunderstanding.

>>14046451
>humans are parasites we should be trying to get rid of the whole species
Why don't you get the ball rolling, and off your self? Or are you different from all the other supposed parasites?