/lit/ - Literature

For me it's the Merchant of Venice

>>14037851
For me, Macbeth. Short, simple, touches the main points for a tragedy, and is all around solid.

I liked the old Branagh film when I was young. Good acting and I loved the score. But on subsequent viewing I couldn’t ever be sympathetic with the character. Losing interest in tyrant leaders at that age I guess. The language of Shakespeare is always so alluring

>>14037851
The St. Crispin's day speech might be the most beautiful passage in all of litterature

>>14037890
Sounds like Phèdre

>>14037919
Butterfly proving once again that he a faggot amongst faggots

For me it's The Little Ham.

>pay respects to a great film, soundtrack and Shakespeare in general
>Still called names by a bunch of high school dropouts who don’t read because I don’t like tyrants

>>14037919
He's was not a tyrant, he was a model Christian king.

I suggest you read some history.

>>14037964
>S-STOP BEING MEAN TO ME
You'll stop getting picked on when you stop trying to be a snowflake
Drop the fucking trip faggot

>>14037851
Imagine buying a Shakespeare book when they’re all on the web for free. The ultimate pseud move imo.

>>14037964
Unironically go to reddit or find a forum you'd be much happier there.
By the way I hate you.

>>14037964
You are still a beautyful butterfly on the inside. You dont need some trip black magic to show everyone your stripes owo.

>>14037993
It's about the sentimental value nor ethan anything else

>>14037964
here's a tip:
1. Highlight the contents of the name field.
2. Press the "delete" on your keyboard (or the equivalent.
3. ???
4. Congrats! No one makes fun of you for your identity!

>>14038034
He gets some sick sexual pleasure of being bullied.

>>14038048
H-Hot.

Anyways, you idiots always get derailed by mothminister. Just wondering, does anyone know if shakespeare was translated into more modern english in the 1700's? Would be interesting to see a middle ground between shakesperian english and modern english (although its pretty modern by the 1700's, but the dressing is different)

>>14037993
>imagine not buying a physical book because they’re “free” on the internet

>>14038106
Not only have I imagined it, I do it regularly.

>>14038083
Here faggot.

Who wishes that? My cousin Westmoreland? No, my dear cousin. If we are slated to die, the fewer, the better for our country, and if we’re slated to live, the fewer men, the greater the share of honor for each of us. In God’s name, I beg you not to wish for one more man. By God, I am not selfish when it comes to money: I don’t care who eats at my expense. It doesn’t bother me when people borrow my clothing—I don’t care about these concrete things. But if it is a sin to be selfish about honor, I am the most guilty soul alive. No, my cousin, don’t wish that even one man who is now in England were here instead. By God, I wouldn’t lose as much honor as a single man more would cost me, I think—not even if it meant giving up my best hope for victory. Oh, do not wish one more! Instead, make this known throughout the army: whoever has no spirit for this fight, let him depart. He will be given safe conduct and money for his passage home. We would not want to die in the company of a man who fears to die with us. This day is called the Feast of Saint Crispian: he who lives to see this day out and comes home safe will stand tall when this day is named and raise himself up at the mention of Crispian. He who survives this day and lives to see old age shall yearly entertain his neighbors on the eve, saying, “Tomorrow is Saint Crispin’s Day .” He’ll roll up his sleeve and show his scars, saying, “I got these wounds on St. Crispin’s Day.” Old men forget. But these men will remember every detail of what they did today long after they’ve forgotten everything else. And as the wine flows, our names, familiar as household words, will be invoked again: Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter, Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester. Good men will tell their sons this story and the Feast of St. Crispin will never go by, from this day to the end of time, without our being remembered: we few, we happy few, we band of brothers—for whoever sheds his blood with me today shall be my brother. However humble his birth, this day shall grant him nobility. And men back in English now safe in their beds will curse themselves for not having been here, and think less of their own manhood when they listen to the stories of those who fought with us here on St. Crispin’s Day.

Oh wow, thanks daddy. As linguistics is a side interest of mine ive always enjoyed seeing the progress of the written word.

It definitely has a slightly different air to it.

You think people then critizied others for not reading the og version?

>>14037919
>Losing interest in tyrant leaders at that age I guess
How the hell was hal in anyway tyrannical

>>14037983
>>14038610
Didn’t he hang some thieves or something?

>>14038634
>committ crimes
>get punished
Wow looks like we got mother fucking hitler over here boys

>>14038641
Are you intentionally misunderstanding me? How could you possibly think I was saying “it’s bad to punish people for crimes”? The point is stealing is not worthy of capital punishment.

>>14038647
>The point is stealing is not worthy of capital punishment
That's not what they believed at the time, or for much of human history for that matter. It is certainly possible to formulate some very strong arguments in favor of that point, but to simply assert that this notion must be true and dismiss any other beliefs, including those held at the time of Henry V, is intellectually unbecoming.
Secondly, Bardolph was hung not just for mere thievery, but for looting a church, which is a far far more grievous crime. Henry having him hung is a major demonstration of him no longer being a childish prince, who would have let his friend get off easy, to a just king who executes the law as is his duty, regardless of his affection for the accused.

>>14037851
For me, it's Antony and Cleopatra.

>>14037983
I suppose god told him to dethrone another Christian king. What was his excuse again?
>>14037997
I’m quite happy on my board here.
>>14038610
Killing people for .... well, what were the reasons?


For me. King Lear

>>14039415
The english kings had a rightful claim to the french throne that was being denied by the french kings for generations
This meant that henry was trying reclaim land that rightfully belonged to the english crown

>>14037851
K I N G L E A R
I
N
G
L
E
A
R

>>14039538
But it didn’t, hence I call him a bully tyrant

>>14038647
Dude. Wtf? Death was a common punishment for theft in most culture. Of course context changes the severity of punishment.

>>14039564
>But it didn’t
But it did you fucking retard
Henry had a verified claim to the french throne that stretched back generations, making the french kings usurpers and rebels
Henry's war was one of the most justified wars in the medieval era, I'm not even an anglophile and I can understand this

>>14039564
>>14039564
By your logic Jeanne D'arc is Goebbels or some shit

>>14039675
Nah man, historical context doesn't mean anything, it's all very black and white you see.

>>14039675
How was it justified? I can’t even remember if it was explained in the play.

>>14039706
For starters, did you read the play? You have a history of claiming knowledge for books you havent read.
Also fuck you mothnigger

>>14039724
I read parts of it after having watched the film.
>You have a history of claiming knowledge for books you havent read
No. Fuck you and the anonymous trolls you believe like scripture
Kindly answer the question or shove off.

>>14038958
>that’s not what was believed at the time
So? I’m failing to see the relevance. You’re saying because tyranny was socially acceptable at the time, Henry could not have been a tyrant? The power to have someone murdered with no trial for a small crime is for mafia bosses, not just rulers. I mean imagine that: the ruler of your country can point to anyone he likes and have them summarily executed with no trial: you don’t call that tyranny?

>>14037919
Do you get tired of all the attacks?

>>14038610
>>14037983
>not a tyrant
Hm, I wonder what would have happened to someone if they said: “Henry is a tyrant and a retard” in that time? Oh yeah, they would’ve been hanged, because he was a tyrant.

>>14039768
I’m literally chillin’

>>14039706
The claim goes all the way back to edward the third
The french king died without an heir
The closest male relative (eddy III) would be the king under french law
French barons denied him because his claim came from his mother
The english and the french proceeded to fight over this for the next century
Henry was the last hope of the english to win the war, and he basically did
Then he died and his retard son fucked it all up
Claim established in play
>With good acceptance of his majesty;
>Save that there was not time enough to hear,
>As I perceived his grace would fain have done,
>The severals and unhidden passages
>Of his true titles to some certain dukedoms
>And generally to the crown and seat of France
>Derived from Edward, his great-grandfather.

>>14039801
Cool. We've argued a bit, but I don't think all the real mean attacks are right. Weird that a board that reads so much is so unempathetic

>>14039823
The use of trip codes is completely unnecessary, only the most attention seeking of faggots actually bother to get one
If butterfaggot was just a normal anon you'd probably just get a few guys calling him a retard but getting over it

>>14039823
They’re larpers. I doubt most of them read.

>>14039821
Thank you. I knew it was something like that, but I found it acceptable only in my christian teenage years, the same years where I admired Dr Doom! Now I’m anarchist and respect none of their claims to power. Thomas Paine having thoroughly btfo of them all over two hundred years ago

Henry V is great but I love Henry IV 1 & 2. You can’t get a sense of the king he became until you hang with spoiled frat bro Hal and his crew of fuckups, and Falstaff is one of the greatest characters in Shakespeare. Henry’s character arc would be nothing without Prince Hal and Falstaff and the rejection of Falstaff made him a greater man.
Although it’s hard to find a good copy, Orson Welles’ Chimes at Midnight is a great mashup of the Henriad and some of the best Shakespeare on film. Watch that and then a Henry V.

>>14039800
>Oh yeah, they would’ve been hanged
Actually you'd get a year or two in prison

>>14037919
Oldfag here. Funny, for me the old version is Olivier's, and the newer Branagh's. Prefer the former. Never cared for the Branagh film, too much conflation with Henry iv, like he wanted to do 3 plays at once.

>>14039735
>You’re saying because tyranny was socially acceptable at the time, Henry could not have been a tyrant?
No you mongaloid, the point is that what is defined as tyranny changes over time, and taking things out of context is both intellectually dishonest and just straight up retarded.
Hammarabi's code would be, by modern standards, absolute tyranny and consists of a plethora of human rights violations. But by the standards of the time, it was a major milestone in the evolution of just governance and equal protection. It's simply dishonest to expect that people would go from primitive tribal law, where might made right, to modern judicial systems, it's like expecting a toddler to go from crawling straight to being a world class runner. It's for that reason we talk about and study the importance of Hamurabi's code to this day instead of condemning it as some brutal backwards set of grievous human rights violations that would make saudia arabia or the PRC blush, because history happens in a context. The same is true of Henry's acts.

Moreover, you're assuming because we define that as tyranny today, that means that definition is objectively correct, and more over, their understanding was objectively wrong. This assumption needs to be proven for anything you say to be taken with any grain of salt, since it is a very non-insignificant assumption

>>14039862
How cringy

>>14037851
It would be really, really, really easy to put on a production of Henry V in which he is a villain
A villain who gets everything he wants in the end

btw butterfly is <spoiler>female</spoiler>

>>14040938
Hey, Don’t judge. Doom was a cool villain

>>14037964
Lol, butterfly is based and trolling everyone.

>>14039538
Uh, the whole succession thing was a bit iffy. If I remember correctly, the english were trying to take the french throne because the mother of Edward III was the sister of the French king Charles IV, whose male heirs had died. Edward was the closest male relative to him, but according to inheritance law the throne could not pass to or through a woman, which Isabella was. So it went to another cousin Philip VI instead, and then the english got pissed when he confiscated their lands in France for getting uppity about the whole thing. So yeah, Henry wasn't really reclaiming rightful english land, but just getting greedy.

>>14040470
Bro, there were many civilisations before Henry which understood that theft is not worthy of death. Athens, Rome, even the ancient Israelites who were much more primitive than Henry’s time. All of these civilisations upheld reasonable laws and demanded a trial before judges before you could just have someone executed. This argument could work if he was living in primeval times but he wasn’t.

>>14037851
I personally like Titus Andronicus. Nothing beats murder and cannibalism, along with some wonderful imagery to boot.

>>14041765
Again, he didn't hang Bardolph for mere petty theft, but for looting a Church. If you don't see the difference between those two things, you're either an idiot or have zero understanding of the role and significance of the Catholic Church in the Medieval World.
Every single culture you listed had similarly punished people who defiled their religious houses with death, for example the roman practice of executing vestal virgins who had sex before the end of their duties, or the ancient Hebrew commandment which dictated a foreigner who got too close to the tabernacle be executed.

>>14037855
same but i wont cap like ive read them all

>>14037851
Are the Modern Library editions worth it?
They don't sell Norton's where I live

>>14037851
Hamlet though I read it in translation
Tried to read king lear in the original and gave up

>>14037851
>Shakespeare's best play
>anything other than Hamlet

I shiggy, you guys