/lit/ - Literature

>>13913652
This argument sucks. Leftists tend to focus on the crimes they're best-equipped to do something about. An American leftist, then, will focus most on the crimes of America and the major recipients of its aid -- this has been true in leftist American opposition to the Indonesian government, Israel, and Saudi Arabia, none of which are considered 'western', but all of which have a history of protest by American and European leftists.

Additionally, leftists in Nigeria, South Africa, Turkey and China have been routinely murdered or exiled by their governments for their opposition to state crimes. What happened to the Left opposition in the USSR in the 1930s? These examples extend to countries like India and Pakistan, where leftist opposition to state crimes is just as strong, though reprisal is less harsh.

>>13913652
>An American talking about leftists

Hard pass. Come to me when America has more than one political party and doesn't have to rely on fictitious boogeymen to cuck you into the status quo.

>>13913652
>they hate Western civilization
So did Ted. Also he was a tranny. So dilate, I guess.

Remember to sage if you respond

>>13913652
*BZZZ*
*BZZZ*
*BZZZ*
*BZZZ*
*BZZZ*
*BZZZZZZZ*
The fuck is this? Ted said this? It’s all false.
This is smart is some things, but this is not his field of expertise. Not even comparable to Dawkins writing about there being no god, as being an evolutionary biologist he knows there’s no god. Ted is a numbers man. Hates people. Why you gonna trust a sociopath to understand a damn thing about sociology, even less socialism?
Stop kissing his ass.

>>13913752
>This is smart is some things
This guy is smart in some things*

How the hell

>>13913652
You skipped the part where he calls conservatives too retarded to criticize

>>13913652
If he specified the American anarchists and communists, which he himself is a part of, he would be correct.

>>13913752
>>13913759
Agreed on Ted, gal, but you gotta stop with this Dawkins shit.

I think we all know you need some medicine :3

>>13913703
>China
>USSR
You're not serious are you? The leftists were the ones carrying out the crimes.

>>13913752
Because he can see the empirical evidence as we do everywhere we go

>>13913752
>>13913759
>« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ »
>implying anybody cares what you think

>>13913771
lol

>>13913778
>I think we all know you need some medicine :3

Yes, some estrogen pills.

>>13913792
You cared enough to directly quote her.

It's kind of adorable :3

>>13913752
Fuck off butterfag you dumb attention whore, nobody likes you
Stop shitting up every thread

>>13913703
I think you're missing the essential point, which is that the average leftists is motivated more by his psychology then by a rational program to improve the human race. Even if you disagree with this one example, there are lots of others to support this contention.

>>13913777
>Ted
>communist

>>13913777
this is just dumb. sorry.>>13913787

>>13913652
Funny, how he says "leftists" but he means Americans.
Funny how he praises the west for being "strong, rational and successful", yet seeks to destroy it's strength, rationality and success

>>13913787
no! I agree with this. this is correct! the leftist is motivated by his frustrated drive for power, which he tries to satisfy by identifying with a mass movement--and cause will do, provided it isn't explicitly rightist.

>>13913797
No I was referring to my cum. I actually think she most likely understood that reference to be sexual, making you the odd one out. :3

>>13913787
He’s repeating talking points and falsehoods he grew up hearing. Liberals are not leftists. Ut then he brings up socialism and proves he has the same cold war kid propaganda stuffed into his head as the rest of his boomer generation.
The argument that the whites had every right to take the Americas because the natives used to have wars with each other, is asinine. Uhg, me strongk, you weak. It’s what happened, but it’s dishonest

>>13913800
>reee
>REE
>REEEEEEE
Squeal piggy!

>>13913827
>he praises the West
someone has not read him lol

>>13913785
Didn't you read my post? In China, I'm referring to leftist activists who oppose the government, of which there are plenty. The extent to which China is leftist today is deeply contentious.

In the case of the USSR, I clearly referred to the Left Opposition. You can feel free to look up what happened to them.

>>13913806
I don't really think the point is accurate, and there's certainly no way to measure whether or not it's the case.

You can come up with examples for almost anything, that's how anecdotal evidence works. That doesn't make an argument worth engaging with.

>>13913843
I'm using the context of the OP's quote.

>>13913810
>>13913824
How is he not a communist? His entire project is an exercise in attempting to demonstrate that the gulf of inequality created by civilization has been a bad thing. He attacks everything created by non-communist civilization. He dreams of a utopia of "fairness" just like they do. If he wasn't such a dumb Polack pseud he would just get it over with and subscribe to communism.

>>13913840
>When we speak of leftists in this article we have in mind mainly socialists, collectivists, “politically correct” types, feminists, gay and disability activists, animal rights activists and the like. But not everyone who is associated with one of these movements is a leftist. What we are trying to get at in discussing leftism is not so much movement or an ideology as a psychological type, or rather a collection of related types. Thus, what we mean by “leftism” will emerge more clearly in the course of our discussion of leftist psychology.

Why don't you read the fucking manifesto before you talk about it? Oh that's right, because you don't read shit, you are here all day just to gain attention and give your opinions on things you haven't even read.

>>13913876
>communism is about fairness and utopia

read marx

>>13913652
Pretty much dead on
>Smash capitalist imperialism!
>W-what do you mean the Soviet Union was one of the most imperialistic states in modern history? Those Afganis had it coming!

>>13913885
>Marxism is the same as communism

>>13913876
>Marxism is in support of utopianism
Pretty much the exact opposite

>>13913876
Communists use the same technological tools as capitalists do. They are just repressive in a different way.

>>13913806
>which is that the average leftists is motivated more by his psychology then by a rational program to improve the human race
this can just as easily be said of the average right wing boomer

>>13913884
>mainly socialists, collectivists, “politically correct”
So, not socialists, but rather left liberals, “progressives” in Europe “socdem”
>Thus, what we mean by “leftism”
Is not leftism, but what the rightwing want us to believe is the only alternative to their rule. Actual leftism is to be forgotten, ignored, it never was.

Why don’t I read a manifesto. A sociopathic boomer’s manifesto. Hm

>>13913918
the same could probably be said about every human ever
>motivated by his psychology
you dont say

>>13913890
>Smash communist plague before it spreads!
>W-what do you mean the USA was the most imperialist state in modern history? Agent Orange was an honest mistake!
That's just your average "I good, you bad" shit.

The actual soviets were proud of their strength, in fact it was one of the beliefs which held the country together. Most Russians who miss the Soyuz do so, because they want the world to tremble in feat before them.

>>13913876
>He attacks everything created by non-communist civilization.
As opposed to... communist civilization? Kill yourself you dumb shill.

>>13913864
>shuffles goalposts around

>>13913949
Does he ever actually criticize communist ideals or posit a non-communist ideal?

>>13913925
You should swallow something healthy from me :3

>>13913948
>responds with whataboutism
The US was far less "imperialist" than the USSR was during the Cold War and you're an ideological hack if you claim otherwise.

>>13913703
>Leftists tend to focus on the crimes they're best-equipped to do something about.
Which usually amounts to very little. None of them read about colonial history but they all have an opinion. Aside from that, what is universal among them is unwillingness criticize outside cultures for the exact same thing they're criticizing western cultures for. This isn't a matter of having enough information because you can provide it to them and it still won't matter. They hate white people and it's absurd to deny it.

>>13913948
... Except the US never claimed to be anti-imperialist and actively made a point to intervene against the spread of communism

You really don't understand hypocrisy, don't you?
>Soviets were proud of their strength
... Once again you're missing the "hypocrisy" factor here that the quote is talking about

>>13913876
>communism is just dreaming of utopia bro!
>everyone's a communist they just don't know it yet!

>>13913925
>So, not socialists, but rather left liberals
No, socialists. You can stick your head in the sand for as long as you want but socialism doesn't magically become liberalism just because a socialist likes gay shit all of a sudden.

>Why don't I read a manifesto by a sociopathic boomer
Yet you probably jerk off to the communist manifesto

>>13913965
whataboutism would be if I used it to deny that CCCP was imperialistic, which it clearly was. I was just pointing out that both sides engage in the same "you good, I bad" insult throwing.

My primary argument was in this position, since I'm not that interested in derailing the thread to /his/-tier shitposting.

>>13913752
idiotic.
> this is not his field of expertise
Oh, you're gatekeeping now? I suppose the "experts" all have very correct, very sensible takes then
>Not even comparable to Dawkins writing about there being no god, as being an evolutionary biologist he knows there’s no god.
>there's no god
Cringe
> Ted is a numbers man. Hates people. Why you gonna trust a sociopath to understand a damn thing about sociology, even less socialism?
Ted doesn't hate people. He hated industrialists because of what he thought they did to people, who he loved. He had principles and convictions that he used to justify violence against them - he was not acting out of some lust for death or suffering. He is not a sociopath.
As for why you would trust a certain person to understand a certain thing, you don't - that's not how ideas work. The fact of someone's occupation or their "field of expertise" has nothing to do with the strength of their ideas about anything. This is just a dunce-tier appeal to authority. Ted had strong ideas - some of them very true, some of them not. Attend to the ideas directly, not the person who wrote them. instead of attacking the idea, you are attacking the man. This is lazy, dishonest, and idiotic. You should be embarrassed for writing this.

>>13913986
Considering communism constantly fails I would say yes, it really is just dreaming of utopia.

>>13913957
>>13913876
>Some people partly satisfy their need for power by identifying themselves with a powerful organization or mass movement. An individual lacking goals or power joins a movement or an organization, adopts its goals as his own, then works toward those goals. When some of the goals are attained, the individual, even though his personal efforts have played only an insignificant part in the attainment of the goals, feels (through his identification with the movement or organization) as if he had gone through the power process. This phenomenon was exploited by the fascists, nazis and communists.
>In earlier revolutions, leftists of the most power-hungry type, repeatedly, have first cooperated with non-leftist revolutionaries, as well as with leftists of a more libertarian inclination, and later have double- crossed them to seize power for themselves. Robespierre did this in the French Revolution, the Bolsheviks did it in the Russian Revolution, the communists did it in Spain in 1938 and Castro and his followers did it in Cuba. Given the past history of leftism, it would be utterly foolish for non-leftist revolutionaries today to collaborate with leftists.
>Similarly, before the breakdown of communism in the USSR, leftish types in the West would seldom criticize that country. If prodded they would admit that the USSR did many wrong things, but then they would try to find excuses for the communists and begin talking about the faults of the West. They always opposed Western military resistance to communist aggression. Leftish types all over the world vigorously protested the U.S. military action in Vietnam, but when the USSR invaded Afghanistan they did nothing. Not that they approved of the Soviet actions; but because of their leftist faith, they just couldn’t bear to put themselves in opposition to communism.

>>13913925
>>13913962
;3

>>13913950
Where did I move the goalposts? You just didn't read my original post. I clearly mentioned the Left opposition, and was clearly referring to leftists in China who were exiled or murdered due to *state crimes* (i.e. obviously not state actors).

>>13913969
Leftists were able to establish the 40-hour workweek, to more quickly end the Vietnam War, and to improve civil rights for Blacks.

Again, refer to my examples. Plenty of American leftists today routinely criticize Israel and Saudi Arabia for their state violence and racism.

The notion that they hate whites is foolish, they're opposed to feeling pride in being white. This makes sense, in that whiteness has less to do with what your ethnic identity is and more with what it isn't (e.g. one-drop rule).

>>13913752
>sociopath
you're throwing around words without even knowing what they mean
you have zero credibility

>>13913973
>... Except the US never claimed to be anti-imperialist and actively made a point to intervene against the spread of communism
Oh sorry, they said "freedom", "democracy" and "equality of nations". Same hypocrisy, different terminology.

>>13913752
>>13913759
>>13913840
>>13913925
Kill yourself, delusional tranny freak.

>>13914018
>they're opposed to feeling pride in being white. This makes sense
Do you oppose feeling pride in your ethnicity if you're black or aboriginal or whatever?
If you say no, you're a hypocrite applying double standards.
(For the record, I think feeling "pride" in your ethnicity, whether white, black, or whatever, is nonsense.)

>>13913925
I'm a leftist and honestly we don't want you you're not helping leave tripfag

>>13913652
funny to hear that from a tranny who wanted to destroy the products of thousands of years of physical and intellectual labor lmao

>>13914042
It's not hypocritical, for the reason I gave. I also agree with you that, personally, I think it's pointless to feel pride in one's ethnicity.

That being said, whiteness is clearly different. I seriously doubt that Obama would be welcome at a white pride rally, even though he's half-white. Whereas someone who's even an eighth black would almost certainly be welcomed to a Black pride rally. Plenty of people with even small amounts of native american or indigenous latino heritage are welcomed at Native pride or Latino pride festivals or protests.

Black or aboriginal pride is pride in having black or aboriginal ancestors. White pride is pride in having no non-white ancestors. Anyone can test this by simply observing the result if a half-white half-asian or half-white half-black person attends a white pride rally.

>>13913996
>Ted doesn't hate people
Rofl

>>13914021
>Hermit tries to move further away from society. Finds they’ve put a road through once remote space he loved
>snaps and decides to kill some random people. Just as a message that he’s ticked off
>Not a sociopath
Look it up!

>>13914064
Kek, but true. "Whiteness" is unironically about lacking culture and roots, rather than having them. White people with roots don't think of themselves as "white" but rather as Norwegians, Poles, Spaniards etc.

>>13914080
>Rofl
Not an argument, friend. I'll ask you this - in what way do you think Ted hates people, and why do you think he does?

>>13914064
>It's not hypocritical, for the reason I gave.
What reason?

>>13913752
>>13913925
>>13914080
>socialists murder millions of people indiscriminately
>it’s not sociopathy I swear! you just have to give socialism another chance!

>>13914095
Literally read my posts, there is a difference between white pride and pride in other types of heritage, namely that black/indigenous pride is pride in having some number of black/indigenous ancestors, while white pride is pride in having no non-white ancestors. You can test this by seeing how welcome a half- or quarter-black person is at a white pride gathering. For the same reason, white pride is different from French pride or Italian pride. This is why you'll see French pride festivals in countries like Haiti or Senegal.

>>13913925
>Is not leftism
No shit you fucking retard, he is saying it you goddamn moron
>but what the rightwing want us to believe is the only alternative to their rule
My GOD I'm not even joking, have you guys heard about low reading comprehension, look at this shit right here.

>>13914186
this is just according to you, it is perfectly possible to have the kind of white pride you say is impossible

>>13913652
>strong, good, successful
>white men

lol pick one plz. making deep fried butter and wal mart is not exactly the peak of human civilization. music, art, technology have always been the fruits of the jew, asian, and the african peoples. Roman and greeks were brown people, not pale mayos FYI

>>13914939
>and the african peoples.
lel

>>13914967
cope harder, mayogoy

>>13913652
They don't hate the image of being "good". Strong, perhaps, and success they see as the fruit of exploitation of the weak. But they certainly don't hate the image of being "good". They hate the powerful precisely because they don't seem good. Unlike aristocrats of the past, who were often magnanimous and friendly to their inferiors, the new rich, either parvenus or descendants of them, are indifferent or hostile to the underclasses. They have no sense of magnanimity. They're not the image of "good". They climb up the ladder to success and do all they can to bring the ladder up with them so they have less competition to contend with. They're thieves, and there's no honor among them. The leftists are right to see it this way.

>>13914038
>image depicting a nazi frog threatening to shoot a lesbian woman (protected class)
>accompanied by a post encouraging suicide with a hateful message discriminating against another marginalized group of people
Your post is unironically a hate crime

>>13914186
This is because the genes of non-white races degrade white genes, while white genes only enhance non-white genes. Rejection of mixed-raced people by non-white communities is largely a result of instinctive jealousy; rejection of mixed-race people by white communities is for the most part a result of instinctive revulsion

>>13914018
>>13914064
>>13914186
>whiteness and white pride is uniquely evil so it's fine to use double standards against it
>btw ted is totally wrong about us in op quote
not to mention you're entirely wrong either way since racism against mixed people exists in other communities as well. hapas and 'light skin niggas' both report being ostracized by asian and black communities.

>>13914029
... No. No they wanted to intervene and were openly imperialistic. This is exactly what kaczynski was talking about you commie freak

>>13914111

>>13913652
Rent motherfucking free

>>13914080
>sociopath
Sociopath is something oversocialized faggots call normal healthy people.

>>13913652
you fucking clown, lol

>>13913652
>Leftists tend to hate anything that has an image of being strong, good and successful.

>>13914038
I disagree with butterfly quite often, but i absolutely love how she makes aut righters seeth just by existing
Please never stop posting

ITT seething leftists picking at the fringes of his argument and not refuting the central point

>>13913703
Except thats false since their definition of crime is purely personal

>>13917792
hello samefag

>>13915153
>were openly imperialistic
Yet the Mutts always speak of "freedom, equality and democracy" when they invade foreign lands.

>>13917909
>I'm obviously the seething, rump rustled one, but maybe i can hide it by saying THEY are.

>>13917792
Trannies have a very short shelf life.

>>13914042
Words can mean different things in different contexts, you know

>>13918376
I'm not an "alt righter," but what Ted is talking about in the OP is very real. There's a lot of anarchism in the US and it operates exactly as he describes, in various forms, all stemming from the hippie movement.

>>13913752
butt-hurt fly lol

>>13916963
He was under socialized. Well, still is.

>>13917792
Oh, the pressure.
>>13917909
And?