/lit/ - Literature

>>13809591
I like that cover, when will we get some dune-wave aesthetic art? Can't wait for Villeneuve's movie.

Is Dune philosophical fiction or the equivalent of Game of Thrones for pseuds? You decide.

>>13809629
It's Hamlet+Lawrence of Arabia in space

>>13809629
Gorge Fat Fat Martin wished in his wildest dreams that he could write anything comparable to Dune.

>>13809629
GoT is what I imagine a teenager who thinks too highly of himself would write as a fantasy fiction setting. The "politics" and "philosophy" of GoT are so absurdly shallow that it simply boggles my mind. Real-life politics are actually more interesting.

>>13809649
I think that the only reason the show is popular is because couples watch it together and then fuck after the softcore porn scenes and then unconsciously associate the show with blowjobs.

>>13809591
Read this through this summer. Such a fucking good book, didn't even know the knew movie was coming. Started reading it for it's reputation as a fundamental work of sci fi, stayed because of just how well it's written, hardly caring about a lack robots or guns. Do the sequels hold up? is the first one the best?

>>13809690
The adaptation is going to be a series which fucking blows ass. I hate tv series.

>>13809666
The Devil knows his own.

>>13809695
>The adaptation is going to be a series
It's going to be a series... of movies. Directed by the dude who did blade runner 2049. The first book has way too much stuff in it for only one movie to make it justice anyhow. The uninitiated moviegoer couldn't possibly take it all the details of the first chapter And then be ready for all the shit that happens afterwards.

>>13809690
>Do the sequels hold up?
Yes. At least the Golden Path arc (Dune/Messiah/Children/God Emperor). Haven't read Heretics or Chapterhouse.

>is the first one the best?
My personal ranking is Messiah>Dune=God Emperor>Children

>>13809695
There'll be a prequel TV series in preparation for the movie and then an adaptation of the first book in 2 films.

>>13809743
What will the prequel be, just the gom gibbar and the arbitorum and initial fall into the desert before act 2 starts?

>>13809893
If I'm not mistaken it'll serve to explain the Bene Gesserit's process of creating the Kwisatz Haderach.

>>13809909
2 episodes to explain evolutionary humanism?

>>13809591
I want to read Dune. Where should I start lads?

>>13809591
Good but a little bit overatted imo, i read that this summer and was sometimes bored cause too much of these caverns description

>>13809690
Opinions vary but I enjoy all 6 of Frank's books with God Emperor as my overall favorite. Avoid his son's books at all costs.

>>13809591
Dune was great, but everything after that was crap, more or less. I did think it was cool that the Sardaukar were what happened to the Jews, and that religions like Buddhislam and Orange Catholicism developed. But then he brings in crypto-Jews in Chapterhouse, even after making it clear that all human religions had changed in indescribable ways in the long centuries that had elapsed since their foundations. No idea why he backtracked on that. I also noticed that in Chapterhouse you could remove every single section of the book dealing with the crypto-Jews and it did not really affect the in any way so it must have been added later for some reason. But why did he do it? And if he had lived, what was next, Episcopalians and Zoroastrians suddenly popping up? And don't get me started with him shilling for the Dune Tarot!

>>13809690
Personally I rank God Emperor the highest, but I think that's largely out of appreciation for how hard it commits to such a weird, interesting premise. It's the only one in the series that actually made me intrigued with where it was going on my first read.

>>13809938
Dune

>>13809954
Read Hyperion, Dan Simmons has some cool future-religious stuff.

Hope you enjoyed it while it lasted. Villneuve is going to to do Dune what Jackson did to LotR, what D&D did to GoT...

>>13810002
The three Lotr movies were good though.

>>13810002
Sounds radical. But I doubt it's going to go that far; I don't think Dune will ever work as a big crowd-pleasing blockbuster without major revisions. It's too slow, too morally grey, too reliant on long one-on-one dialogue scenes, too sparse in action scenes, and what action scenes it does have are mostly too small in scale. Even if you were to try and pump up all the action scenes and sand away all the objectionable bits, you kind of hit a brick wall once you get to God Emperor.

>>13810030
Well television is dialogue driven like a play but film is action and visual driven. If anon from before is right about them doing the setups with television and then making the actual action as a film it could work. The only thing I'd worry about is it being as fucking stupid as Avatar and then going too archetypal and not leaving enough grey.

>>13810008
“Begone, foul dwimmerlaik, lord of carrion! Leave the dead in peace!”
A cold voice answered: ‘Come not between the Nazgûl and his prey! Or he will not slay thee in thy turn. He will bear thee away to the houses of lamentation, beyond all darkness, where thy flesh shall be devoured, and thy shriveled mind be left naked to the Lidless Eye.”
A sword rang as it was drawn. “Do what you will; but I will hinder it, if I may.”
“Hinder me? Thou fool. No living man may hinder me!”
Then Merry heard of all sounds in that hour the strangest. It seemed that Dernhelm laughed, and the clear voice was like the ring of steel.
“But no living man am I! You look upon a woman. Éowyn I am, Éomund’s daughter. You stand between me and my lord and kin. Begone, if you be not deathless! For living or dark undead, I will smite you, if you touch him.”

movie version:
"I am no man."

>>13810073
The girl power parts were gay as fuck but overall the adaptations were great and were sick white supremacy porn. Also again, in film you are supposed to use as little dialog as possible.

>>13810073
that stuff works on print. It's literature. it makes you visualize and hear the voice. On film it has to be concise.

>>13810058
Dune really is structured much more like a play than a movie, down to most of the battles happening offscreen to be related by other characters. You could probably stage the whole first book with only six or seven sets if you got creative.
>The only thing I'd worry about is it being as fucking stupid as Avatar and then going too archetypal and not leaving enough grey.
The main thing that could ruin this adaptation is if they try to paint Paul becoming a messiah as an unambiguously good thing.

>>13810073
They trimmed the dialog down from a two thousand page doorstopper trilogy for movies? Wtf I hate Hackson now

>>13810002
I will eat a sack of my own hair if somebody manages to make a blockbuster adaptation of God Emperor that's both popular with general audiences and faithful to the book. It'd be like trying to train a dog to ride a bike.

>>13809666
Your sick. Seek our Lord,

>>13810090
>that stuff works on print
Yeah, that's why the books are good and the movies aren't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=132WIdxvgdo
>>13810100
People like this who defend the movies but shit all over the source material are the most confusing to me of all.

>>13810091
Dune is really dangerous in that it is pro-evolutionary humanism lol. The idea of it being made in today's political atmosphere is hilarious. They'll include actual arabs (unlike Lawrence of Arabia) and play up the strong women characters but at the end of the day Paul becomes an ubermensch because of selective breeding and eugenics. And he enslaves an unsuspecting people who were tricked into it. If the sjws don't read into the underlying philosophies it will be hilarious.

>>13810120
The books are a fucking slog especially RotK.

>>13810133
That's how I felt about the movies, especially RotK

>>13810140
The movies don't go into a 20 minute aside about the year the pipeweed was from or who the son of the son of the son is in minas tirath constantly.

>>13810151
No, RotK just had three 30 minute endings of hobbits jumping up and down on a bed hugging and crying.

I read about half of the first book and the characters seem so bland and overly-robotic, especially Paul and Jessica. I understand it plays into the Gesserit bullshit but I honestly can't stand:
>muh paul is hyper-analizing shit again
>he can tell the future wow
>muh jessica holds her breath precisely at the right moment, thanks to her bene gesserit school training
do the themes or personalities of characters change somewhat or should I just drop it?

>>13810162
just finish it, nerd

>>13810161
That's not true though. It had one party and then the elves took frodo and bilbo to heaven.

>>13810122
See the thing that makes all of that work is that the book doesn't shy away from the fact that Paul's rule isn't an unambiguously good thing, and is arguably worse than most alternatives. He starts a war that genocides multiple populations and makes him the biggest murderer in human history, and also cripples the production of the only resource keeping the economy function, all at the expense of a gullible and exploited minority group. If Leto II hadn't picked up the pieces Paul would have ultimately done much more harm than good. That's why the story falls apart if you try to make him the good guy. He's only better than the Harkonnens in that he has better intentions.

>>13810162
They're perfect because they are ascended humans with a scientific device right of kings to rule. While I would agree with Greek flaws not being there at first both characters make mistakes multiple times and there are limits to Paul's foresight.

>>13810161
And the novel had almost 200 pages of that.

>>13810220
Do you enjoy reading? It doesn't sound like you do.

>>13810002
If there's one active director that has both the talent and the autism to make a good Dune adaptation, it's Villeneuve.

>>13810235
Tolkien had no brevity at all and was more focused on world building than story and you know it.

>>13810120
the original trilogy is great, even if it falters with cut content from the books and Return being the weakest one.

>>13810122
It already happened and it was haphazardly "cancelled" in some shitty buzzfeed-like article with tumblr gifs. It failed of course.

>>13810162
>do the themes or personalities of characters change somewhat or should I just drop it?
All characters have massive character development as the story goes on, culminating on what's possibly one of the best characters in modern literature with Leto Atreides II.

>>13810258
What was cancelled the show or the article and was this article happy about the racial inclusion or angry about the underlying evolutionary humanism?

>>13809734
Messiah's got more plotting and can be denser at times, or at least that's what I felt. But yeah, love 'em

>>13810151
Unfortunately

>>13809690
The sequels are not as good, but the overall large themes are quite interesting. Book 1 is undeniably the high point.

There are some editing issues in books 2-4 as well.

"Presently Leto presently looks presently at his presents presently prescience presently"

Still enjoyable though.

>>13810327
If we're talking about a visual medium that is better than film and TV for facts about a world completely unimportant to the main story video games actually fill that niche because they are a second person story medium in which you can choose to waste time reading the lore or not. Morrowind was great for that. Film is not the place for 20 minute asides about a factoid in the pretend world because they are action driven.

>>13810261
ok, what's the best book of the 6?

>>13810400
I'm >>13809734

>>13810258
You misunderstand. "cancelled" in this case refers to the current trend of ganging up on something because it did something egregious, mostly in the eyes of sjws. the article was literally titled Muadib was an entitled white man or some shit like that. and there are actually several articles with that tone.

>>13810400
4 by my vote. 1 is classic and I respect 2's eagerness to tear down its hero. 3 is good but feels like a prelude to 4 sometimes. 5 changes the universe in all kinds of crazy ways which I thought was fun. It also has the first Dune protagonist who manages to stay sane which is nice. 6 can feel weirdly disjointed but in a uniquely Dune way its ending is the most optimistic out of any of them so its not a bad one to go out on even if Frank clearly planned to write more.

>>13810671
meant for>>13810294

>>13809980
>The one constant thread between today and a thousand years from now will be that someone, somewhere, will be planning to kill the Jews

>>13809629
it's obviously philosophical musings of the highest order.

>pic actual quote from book 5.

The music of the Dune games match the book so perfectly

https://youtu.be/12N9n0Tlxdg

>>13811506
>you will never be raped by a hot redhead from a pervy Bene Gesseret splinter sect

Life is cruel.

Why are the Bene Gesserit so based, lads?

>>13809663
So which fantasy books have more interesting politics than Game of Thrones?

Dose anyone have that picture of the Dune reading list?

>>13812977
It's historical fiction, but romanticized to the point of being practically fantasy- Romance of the Three Kingdoms. It's like game of thrones but actually good. Even has its own high-production series, but you can just use youtube.
If you don't mind sci-fi, Left Hand of darkness had better-done politics than GoT, albeit at a more limited scope.

>>13813008
no but its dumb horseshit anyway, just read them in publication order until they get too weird, boring or terrible for your taste

>>13809591
Overrated af

You guys aware of the dune miniseries? https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0142032/.. Everyone laments the failed attempts to film dune but this has been sitting here with hardly any attention being given to it. It isn't perfect but its certainly watchable.

>>13810122
>And he enslaves an unsuspecting people who were tricked into it

But how do you know it wasn't the prophecy being fulfilled? The Fremen believe that to be the case, and even the Atreides and everyone else questions it.

He is fulfilling more than one prophecy at once, all while being prescient. Seems real to me. Whether or not that's 'good' is like questioning whether a fly falling into a spider's web is 'bad'. It is merely causality and nature taking its natural course.

>>13813008
I gotchu

>>13813078
this exactly. the first book, as others have said, trumps the rest, but the drop in quality through the series is a slow one.

>>13809938

Behind the dune

>>13813132

Christ what a mess

>>13813081

To be fair, yes. Its quite dated and has a mediocre longlevity

>>13813141
>read the first one and if you liked it read the one after it, as long as it's by the same author
>repeat process
Huh

GIB BIG TIDDIES BENE GESSERIT GF

>>13813448
Based and coompilled

>>13809980
I have read it, enjoyed it a great deal.

>>13810710
Yeah, makes you think...

>>13810710