/lit/ - Literature

>>13765788
It's not that I disbelieve in God. I just dislike him.

yeah, it's getting really annoying

uhmmmm.... Like? I don't even know what they're uhhhhhmmmmmmm...? OK?

>>13765788
I'll leave if you give me one substantive argument for the existence of YOUR god. that is, not some generic deistic entity, but the god of your religion.

atheism is cool

>>13765830
>>13765836
>durrrrrrr what is faith
go away dumb faggots

>>13765830
How do the remains of Sodom and Gomorrah sound?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwTVFk1HK3Y

>>13765830
Because the Christian civilisation which existed until the 1950s conquered the world. The evidence that Christ is saviour is all around you, you only have to study the lives of the greatest men to see what they all had in common. My belief in God came about through failure in my own life combined with pattern recognition in the lives of others who were successful. My life has since improved significantly since I began APPLYING the teachings of Christ in my life

>>13765869
You sound like one of this Prosperity Gospel retards.

>>13765830
>b-b-buh muh EVIDENCE
this is not a valid argument against religion. christian societies accomplish more than godless groups of heathens. religious vs. nonreligion is an ethical spiritual and moral debate, not an empirical one.

imagine if you told a nihilist "ok but SCIENTIFICALLY PROVE life is meaningless." you accomplish nothing, hinder actual debate, and only end up making an ass of yourself. the same applies here.

What kind of meaning is craven perpetual worship of some cosmic horror?

>>13765909
>imagine if you told a nihilist "ok but SCIENTIFICALLY PROVE life is meaningless." you accomplish nothing, hinder actual debate, and only end up making an ass of yourself. the same applies here.
Meaning is not something that can be scientifically proven or disproven, since it is a non-empirical, philosophical category; thus one would seek to combat the nihilist on philosophical grounds. The existence of an entity which makes historical claims for itself IS something that is empirically provable and if you have no proof for this entity then I have no reason to believe in him.
>>13765849
A lot of cities in the Bible were real. Doesn't prove Yahweh.

>>13765788
>"Fuck all religion! Everyone who believes it is dumb."
>"What? N-no... I didn't want to make fun of Muslims and Je-Jews. Can't we just talk about gay Baptists and pedo Catholics?"
The cowardice is astonishing.

>>13765957
God is not something that can be scientifically proven or disproven. Imagine leading a life ruled by facts and figures. You are spiritually empty. You see in shades of grey.

>>13765957
>City nowhere near volcano is consumed with ash and brimstone
>Is literally the only site of sulfur balls above ground
>So its a city in the middle-east mysteriously covered in sulfurous rock, big deal.

>>13765972
I didn't ask explicitly for scientific proof. I asked for adequate proof of any sort for the existence of YOUR god. This proof can be logical, philosophical, empirical, mathematical, historical, I don't care, but if you expect me to believe in YOUR god you need to be able first to prove that he, not some generic deistic entity, he, exists.

>>13765788
But can you prove the existence of god?
We looked into space with the most sophisticated telescopes and we couldn't see him. So why even believe in something that we have no proof of.

>>13765800
>>13765911
Based and blackpilled. If this God of the Abrahamics exists then (some other) God help us

>>13765989
The proof lies in faith. Again, societies with a strong theological underpinning have achieved greater things than hedonistic caveman societies. Look up the psychological benefits of prayer and then open a history book.

>>13765999
see
>>13765909

>>13766007
And why did they achieve more? Because the teachings of Christ and the Christian faith are the closest we have to a real understanding of God and the laws of the universe. It worked because it is true!

>>13766007
>christians conquered the world
>christianity gives psychological benefits
>christianity has been a force for good in the world
none of these prove anything. if you admit that it's all based on faith, fine, but don't expect me to give up all my reasoning faculties and walk blindly into the cave. you have failed to convince me that your god is real and therefore to stop posting on /lit/. :)

You know what I don't get? Why do people WANT God to exist? Like, what could be more terrifying than a being that exists outside of time and space and you're at his disposal forever. I much prefer shit happening for no reason, but hey, that's just me.

>>13766031
Walking blindly in an out of caves is a cherished passtime of atheist "societies" so its ironic that you'd ascribe that to theism. I tip my fedora to you, based retard.

>>13766007
>The proof lies in faith.

Christians mistake faith for the satisfaction of certainty. True animal faith comes from intrinsic uncertainty given by the limitations of knowledge, it has an element of inherent risk as the potential desired may not arrive.

Ultimately your faith in God is just a cope from your inability to come to terms with the fear of the unknown.

relax guys, you wouldn't need to defend god if he actually existed

>>13766064
>the foundation of every great society throughout history is a cope!!!
>>13766072
ignorant non-argument.

>>13766043
you literally admitted it was based on nothing but faith. anyway your points are all non-sequiturs. I also think religion is important for upholding certain values and providing a system of community and a sense of meaning in society. I think the promulgation of atheism has been utterly disastrous for society. But at the end of the day I still know religion is false.

>>13766031
See
>>13766014

It is impossible to prove it, all we can do is show you so many examples to convince you that Christianity is the truth, in the same way that 0.999999999... equals 1. Since the Christian teachings yield all these benefits, must there not be some truth to those teachings?

>>13766080
you have not followed this argument very well at all as evidenced by your post. read this again. >>13765909

>he hasn't read the whole summa

>>13766041
Because it satisfies the fear of the unknown by making everything known and judged by some ultimate arbiter. It allows one to believe that justice is always satisfied, absolving themselves of any responsibility in producing it: they are "saved," they are favored by their gods and are guaranteed to be good people and get their just rewards - this absolves them of any possibility of moral error.

In short religion is the product of the most degenerate impulses of moral and intellectual laziness that makes them festering grounds for the justification of the unjustifiable. The appropriation of morality by religion is the greatest scam in human history, as no other practice is as immoral and corrupt to its core.

>Christianity and Islam follow the same God
>God gives them different rules

What did it mean by this?

>>13766101
well for one there's the fact that the religions believe in different prophets

>>13766079
If you don't see all human societies as complete failures in the terms of the present, you are willfully ignorant. All you are doing is screaming about how you wuz kangz and attributing your kangmanship to the magical bullshit you believe gives you a justification for claiming to be good without doing jack shit besides promoting political propaganda. Your true religion is politics - as it is for all religious.

>>13766101
Obviously Islam is wrong and its followers are blasphemers.

not literature

>>13766124
edgy post.
>the modern world is shit compared to my perfect, impossible ideal! therefore god dunn real!

>>13766133
>blocks your path

>>13766101
Islam and Christianity have different interpretations of reality. The Christian interpretation, however, is a closer to the true interpretation of reality, evidenced by the difference in the level of civilisation between them

>>13766041
Even if it were a question of whether you chose to believe in God or not (it isn't), you would prefer to live in a universe where there is right and wrong, not where everything is permitted based on arbitrary personal subjective feelings. Belief in God gives your life meaning and frees you from your most base desires, which are ultimately destructive and lead you down the path of darkness.

>>13765830
>mfw he wants proof for something that cannot be proven

>>13765800
This is actually the reason most people are athiests. They just want to pretend there is nothing wrong with porn or masturbation. I'm an atheist and I view these behaviors as terrible, and often the only audience I have responding to me are the religious.

>>13765849
>sodom was destroyed but modern cities are impervious to attack due to powerful gay force shields

>>13766192
They are being destroyed from the inside

>>13765788
No atheist has ever proven that God cannot exist.
Therefore it is possible that God does exist.
As long as it is possible God exists, atheists should be careful in claiming to 'know' that he doesn't.

>>13765788
afraid of the truth, anon?

Do atheists believe people living a Christian lifestyle are harming society?

Daily reminder it has been empirically proven religiosity stifles scientific innovation.

https://www.princeton.edu/~rbenabou/papers/Religion%20December%201g_snd.pdf
http://www.nber.org/papers/w21052.pdf

Daily reminder the overwhelming majority of leading scientists are atheist

https://www.nature.com/articles/28478

Daily reminder religious people are less intelligent according to dozens of studies.

http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/pdf/The_Relation_Between_Intelligence_and_Religiosity__A_Meta-Analysis_and_Some_Proposed_Explanations.pdf

Daily reminder religious people are less educated

https://www.economist.com/news/international/21623712-how-education-makes-people-less-religiousand-less-superstitious-too-falling-away

Religious people are literally a lesser breed of human

>>13766347
asinine post my man. the father of genetics, gregor mendel, was a christian.

>>13766362
>n=1
Based retard

>>13766173
Porn is obviously one thing, but masturbation itself isn't judged either way in the Bible.

Why doesn't god make his presence known?

If it's so essential that I live a certain way, why won't he just tell me?

>>13766755
No point to attempt rational discourse with theists, their minds are too weak to accept the reality that there is no afterlife, do you think they will actually follow a logical thought process to disprove that?

>>13766688
t. protestant heretic.
It absolutely is. Aquinas said masturbation was effeminacy.

I posted a thread asking why atheism is superior to religion and got 50+ assblassted replies calling me a feeble minded idiot. They unironically dismiss religion on the basis that it’s illogical.

No one cares if you believe in god, but constantly kissing ass to a debatable existence is annoying at best and downright insane at certain points. I don’t care enough to wonder if a higher being exists but the keyboard preachers are getting insufferable.

>>13766755
>what is Jesus, Bible, Christianity
God made his presence known you just refuse to believe it

>>13765830
The crucifixion/resurrection of christ in one of the most studied singular events in the world. There has been more secular study on it then many nations entire history, a subject with a majority of secular scholars who have admitted that they have studied it to disprove christianity. The best, after countless years of harsh grueling study by people wholesale obsessed with debunking the faith, have come up empty handed with statements like "theres no empirical evidence of christs miracles" or "there might be a chance that his disciples might have fabricated his divinity though no evidence exists to prove that.

That, atleast should start making you question your kike lies.

>>13766779
99% of atheists are just insecure midwits, the whole excericse is therapeutic for them
you can always tell an actual truth seeker by little they give a shit about appearing intelligent or to be on the “winning” side, or being on a side at all

>>13766826
Hahaha what? The case for Jesus's divinity being developed at a later date is a strong one. Read how Jesus became god by Bart Erhman

>>13765869
1 billion Muslims can't be wrong

>>13765788
>every atheist is from /r/eddit!
>being from /r/eddit is a valid refutation of something's validity!
such impressive logic. I expect nothing less from a christcuk.

>>13766779
you are literally retarded if you think atheism isn't definitionally superior to religion

>religion
>leads to female circumcision, grand inquisitions, burning people who make scientific discoveries that contradict religious dogmas at the stake, stifling of "evil" technological and social progress, and crippling valid forms of inquiry to warp our worldview so that it confirms what the guy in the weirdest hat tells us
>atheism
>allows for scientific freedom, social freedom, advancement in all areas of society, fosters a raising of the individual to a level of autonomy no longer dependent on superstitious presuppositions about morality etc, and doesn't attempt to evangelize or oppress opposing worldviews

inb4
>b-but you're doing that rright now!

no, atheism only takes a polemically stance to religious institutions already in power that have already demonstrated themselves to be totalitarian and inimical to any alternative worldview. it is a defensive struggle that is almost over, since religion is finally dying out. (fun fact: around 90% of scientists identify as atheists, and around 70% of philosophers also identify as atheists. those percentages will only increase as the final old-guard of the previous century die out, e. g. morons like William Lane Craig, Alvin Plantinga, etc.)

>>13766855
>ignores whenever state atheism existed that it lead to horrendous dehumanisation, justification of mass murder and starvation and cultureless artless nothingness
yeah bro let’s be like china and the Soviet Union science FTW

>>13766855
Why do you give a shit about all this? Just ask them to prove their god, they can't do it, they end up screeching like retards about "faith" and Christian civilisation. "Prove your god" is the only three words needed to be put to religion by atheists, all this "religion is bad for us!!" opens unnecessary doorways and ambiguities which obscure the main point which is that there's no proof.

average IQ of the thread smells like 120 and below

>>13766888
>lol u can’t prove god
>b-b-but we will keep all those human rights and ethics and shit that apparently have no basis in reality lol
Why not go all the way if you truly believe in empiricism? Why pretend human life has value?

>>13766925
>If there is no god i would be a edgy nihilist hehe
You never really grow up

>>13766888
P-prove it. Oh you mean you can’t? That means I’m right!

>>13766925
so your argument amounts to
>yeah, I admit I can't prove it
>so I'm going to accuse you of something instead in the hopes you'll forget what you originally asked

look, christdummy, what he's asking is simple: prove god exists. there's nothing else to it. surely you can do it, i mean, you've based your entirely life around the validity of this belief, so surely you can articulate why it is valid?

>>13766855
>appeal to consensus
lmao

You will never escape religion. Either you believe the universe started teleologically and is part of something bigger (einstein, kaku) or the universe is part of something infinite and started randomly (susskind). You can’t have your cake and eat it too. You believe one of those or you reject science, and reject sense. As long as we don’t have adequate information about this area (we never will because anything that lies outside our own time and laws of nature is beyond us) religion will exist.

>>13766936
Epic strawman. I’m just wondering what reason there is to keep the values religion started if you only believe 100% in physical fact. This isn’t even just about god, if you only value empiricism I don’t understand how ethics doesn’t contradict that unless you make an exception
>>13766948
Instead of getting defensive actually address what I said

>>13766925
Didn't say empiricism. the proof you offer could be non-empirical; logical, for instance, mathematical, etc. The point is if you expect me to believe in your religion you need to prove that it is true because I'm not one to take things on blind faith.

As for the other things it makes me happy not to see people suffer and have their autonomy violated so I think it's right to agree on some sort of code of ethics that will guarantee everyone a peaceable happy life. That being said I think that, unless religion can be revived, a hyper nationalistic movement or some different meta narrative is needed to give meaning to people's lives. I think the liberal notion that people will be happy "creating their own meaning" is jejune.

>>13765909
Yeah, atheism is the most brainlet philosophy by far. Imagine if people where having a debate about history and a third person just went 'well they're all dead now so who cares?', that's how intellectually rigorous atheism is.

>>13766980
>it makes me happy
So? Believing in god makes people happy too. I don’t understand how you aren’t holding contradictory views here. If there is no empirical basis for human rights, but it makes them happy, so it’s fine, why is religion not fine?

>>13766167
based Kierkegaard poster. pure materialist brainlets get out.

>>13766969
>Instead of getting defensive actually address what I said
lmao! I just told you I;m not taking the bait and calmly asked you not to duck the issue--and your response is literally "take my bait"

jesus, anon, this is embarrassing. just prove your god. that was the initial issue that you yourself took up. too bad it seems you are inadequate to the task.