/lit/ - Literature

>>13758566
Rene Girard Things Hidden Since the Foundation of the World

Satan is the temptor, and the mimetic crises personified

>>13758566
The Devil is chaos. There is no God, He is a shimmering illusion, there are only demons.

>>13758581
Oof. Blackpilled to the core.

>>13758566
If I took a pill that gave me omniscience for a few seconds, put a gun to your head, and made you bet your life on whether or not there really exists an evil character, the Devil, as known in Christian theology and, moreover, whether the Yahweh who is 3 but only 1 and who commanded his chosen Jews to genocide various other tribes and take others into slavery even though he is morally perfect, exists, what would you say?

If yes, you are mentally ill. If no, stop wasting you time with this shit and read something that is genuinely edifying, cause you've only got a limited time on this earth to read good books.

God not real

>>13758580
I thought you recommended Guenon for a second there.

>>13758581
This feels like a pluralised Schopenhauer doctrine.

>>13758566
Jesus during his life taught esoteric initiatory knowledge that little resembled the system later built up in his name, it's this that accounts for all the absurdities that you mention such as that the all-powerful omnipotent, "loving" God creates innumerable humans only for the devil to win the vast majority over to hell. Most Christian apologetics about this stuff is mouth-breather tier mental gymnastics.

>>13758566
>losing

Who says this? There is no versus or against. God is said to be everlasting love if faith is put in him.

>>13758676
What's the esoteric doctrine? Is it the Gospel of Thomas?

>>13758700
more or less, yes

>>13758713
blessed and logospilled

>>13758676
This is (un?)fortunately true, so far as I can tell. Most nominal Christians will easily dismiss this as “Satanic occult/esotericist ideas”. What started as radical mysticism became codified into (for the most part) a cult of people wearing strange clothing and hating and condemning certain people while also claiming to love everyone and follow and worship someone who said to love everyone and not proudly condemn others (?!).

>>13758566
The Catechism has a very comprehensive and available discussion of the subject.

By Christ's death, I hope all are saved, and by his life I hope all will have life.

>>13758676
Brother, why must you cast dirt in your eye and spit upon the face of your family?

>>13758747
Which catechism? Roman Catechism or Luther's Little Catechism? Either way, both of them accept eternal damnation.

>>13758566
What "battle"? The Devil does the job God gave him. Unless you believe God has limited power and wisdom, he is responsible for everything, including hell. The free will doctrine about humanity doesn't change that. There is no bottle.

>If yes, you are mentally ill. If no, stop wasting you time with this shit and read something that is genuinely edifying, cause you've only got a limited time on this earth to read good books.

>>13758581
Now yuo see...

>>13758566
Yeah nigga the devil is just trying to prove a point

>>13758581
>he is a shimmering illusion
>he

>>13758581
>The Emperor? Not really a fan of corpse on a chair.

>>13758566
The majority of humanity were children who either died in childbirth or at a very young age. Far more children have been born only to die young throughout all of human history compared to the few who grew up and were led astray by Satan.

>>13758676
>the hebrew bible that literally everyone was familiar with
>esoteric
go away.

>>13758580
fpbp

>>13758566
Unstoppable force (God) vs immovable object (Satan and his uncompromising pride that led to rebellion).

From our mortal perspective, God wins when we do what he says and we join in the beatific vision. From God's perspective, [____________].

>>13758566
The devil is God's unwitting factotum. That's the horrifying reality of things.

>>13759780
Which denomination doesn't believe unbaptised infants go to Hell?

>>13759819
Most of them. Not that its biblical

(concerning the depravity of even enfants) Psalm 58:3 - 3The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

(concerning the condition of original sin)
Romans 5:12 - Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression

(Concerning the impossibility of salvation without knowledge of Christ)
Romans 10:14 - How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

>>13758676
Yeah this is honestly the simple truth. Been a Christian for seven years and done a lot of searching and there's really no denying this without engaging in the mental gymnastics you describe. Jesus taught esoteric spiritualism and self-discovery, his sayings weren't intended to be dogmatic but were instead intended to be indications of great internal mysteries for the listener to ponder upon. That he had zero interest in forming an organized religion during his life, or even in writing anything down, only further highlights this truth. Satan is not a literal being in the physical way but instead is a very real metaphysical entity operating within the human spiritual consciousness and world (this is why Paul says we struggle against "evil powers in the heavenly places". Why would evil powers be in the heavenly places? An apologist will run around in circles trying to make some sense out of this simple, intuitive verse and in the end will only succeed in negating it through a long, tiring process)

>>13758581
God is also a demon

>>13759839
That psalm quote is about original sin, doofus. We are all wicked. As soon as the generative process is done, boom, we're astray. The middle quote is about the same thing. The last Romans quote is pretty much accurate.

>>13759819
The catechism of the Catholic Church says babies who die unbaptized should be prayed for. That's it.

>>13759819
Mormons definitely affirm that unbaptized infants are saved. Most modern Christians would probably agree even if it isn't in their doctrine since it's fashionable to be a universalist anyway.

>>13759878
Whether you think the first two quotes are regarding the same issue, they can hardly be called redundant. The former makes a point of saying that no, babies do not have magical baby armor just because they are cute and stupid.

>>13759888
Mormonism is not even a form of Christianity, so into the trash it goes.

>>13758566
>perpetuating nordic jesus

>>13759895
I didn't call them redundant, you drip.

>>13758581
>we live in a society

>>13759917
Oh, so you made a post that actually had nothing to say then, okay.

>>13759912
>implying the israelites looked like apes or trolls
they came out of egypt, anon, which was ruled by meds. spaniards and greeks and italians. nobler features than your nordaboo toeheads

>>13758566
>But wouldn't his dragging the majority of humanity to eternal torment constitute a victory?
All your gods plan

>>13759925
what's it like being unable to read beyond a surface level

>We often say the Devil is on the losing side of the cosmic battle

There is no winning side or losing side to this cosmic battle. The battle goes on forever. The darkness needs the light, and vice versa.

>>13759947
>be God
>be perfect
>"needing" anything

>>13760014

>be perfect
>be angry and jealous

Ok

>>13758566
>his dragging the majority of humanity to eternal torment
Literally what empirical evidence is there of this happening. I'm not even a christfag, but you just sound like someone whos severely depressed. I know me saying this doesn't help you, but I need to say it in order to point out how you're wrong

>>13760042
>implying his perfection must be in accord with human values that we approve and cannot be a perfection beyond our apprehension

>>13760075

You just cut down the very branch you're sitting on. Way to go dumbass

>>13760088
so you say, uncomprehending, and ready to close the book.

>>13760072
The Bible outright says it. Very few will be saved.

>>13760099

You don't know what you did wrong, do you?

>>13760014
a god without believers is presumed dead

>>13758581
he's right u kno

>>13758566
I don't think it's really up to us to judge, but you're right about his plan to drag a chunk of humanity to hell along with him.

>>13758676
why do rich white firstoid teenagers have to make everything esoteric. newsflash, you arent that smart. i went to university with many kids who said the same sorts of things. NONE of them ever«got it».