/lit/ - Literature

''Yours shall be the song of Ice and Fire.'' Mfw Rhaegar's child was spared and it was Jon Sow. (Rhaegar is a hermaphrodite, he had sexed with Eddard.)

>>1369899
>Rhaegars child
Exactly what occurred to me.
When Eddard's sister Lyanna asks him to "Promise" and dies of a fever, she's dying in childbirth and giving birth to Jon Snow.
Jon's the heir to the throne.
He's gonna marry Daenarys and rule.

>(Rhaegar is a hermaphrodite, he had sexed with Eddard.)
Okay maybe we're not on the same page.

The Song of Ice and Fire is a Targaryen prophecy. As for it's fulfillment...

Jon Snow, Tyrion and Daenerys are all Targaryens and will each have a Dragon.

I just finished the 4th and have no idea what your talking about....I do remember the line here >>1369899 though, but not the context it was in....what did I miss?

>>1369907
Rhaegar is talking to a child
He was in love with Eddard's sister Lyanna, remember?
And Danny had a vision of Rhaegar standing over a child, saying the child will be the song of fire and ice.

What are the Targaryens? Dragons. Fire.
What are the Starks? Winter. Ice.

The combination. the song of fire and ice.

It's a child. Rhaegar's child with Lyanna. Which is Jon Snow. Jon is not Eddard's son, he is Rhaegar and Lyanna's son, he's Eddard's nephew, heir to the Iron Throne, etc. He is the prophecy

>>1369899
>Rhaegars child
Exactly what occurred to me.
When Eddard's sister Lyanna asks him to "Promise" and dies of a fever, she's dying in childbirth and giving birth to Jon Snow.
Jon's the heir to the throne.
He's gonna marry Daenarys and rule.

>(Rhaegar is a hermaphrodite, he had sexed with Eddard.)
Okay maybe we're not on the same page.

>>1369907
Oh, and the full context is Rhaegar is saying this to a child in a vision Daenerys has.

>>1369914
Ahhhh, wow thats crazy. Yeah I remember that stuff now, thanks, and yeah it all fits.
How longs the series supposed to be? (if it does get finished)

>>1369924
Total, 7 books. He really is, finally, finishing the fifth, and has already started the sixth. He's dead-set, 100%, no wiggle-room going to make it only 7 long.

His blog post yesterday said he was finishing the last ... waht.... 5 chapters of Dance of Dragons. Something liek that. So I can't imagine it won't be published within the year. Sixth book, who knows?

inb4 the books end with Jon finding out who he is, raising an army, taking back the throne, being built up as a glorious warrior and strategic genius then getting poisoned or back stabbed and then being replaced with whomever plotted to poison him.

So much for the legend lololololol DARK FANTASY SO DEEP

>>1369929
Thats good then.
I didnt like the series so much when I started, but kept reading because it was really well written. As it went my liking for it increased and now I love it (dont think i'll end up liking it as much as WOT though)

Well this explains why he wouldn't even tell his best friend Robert the king when they were all alone together.

>>1369932
I could see Jon dying, quite frankly, but not bot him and Daenerys. One of them will survive to the end. While Martin does stick pretty close to real history (you'd be stunned at how much less bloody this whole affair is compared to things like the Wars of the Roses) he does have a few "heroes" that seem rather untouchable.He has built the whole series around Jon Snow, and while I'm all for destroying fantasy tropes, that would be a bit silly.

>>1369932

It's dark enough that every other character I like dies. There are only four I want to see make it to the end: Arya, Jon, Daenerys and Tyrion. I don't care about the rest.

>>1369949
Yeah pretty much the same for me. Arya's my favourite, damn shes awesome....anyone have any predictions on whats going to happen with her?

>>1369932
If Jon dies in that fashion the whole series would go from awesome to utter shit instantly, specifically if OP is right about the whole rightful heir to the throne thing.

If he's right about Jon, anything short of Jon becoming King and bringing peace to the land and crushing all the vile forces at work would be shit. And George RR Martin would be confirmed for troll of the century intent on being different and edgy for it's sake alone.

I can see either Jon or Dany dying. One of them will be the promised Targaryen, and one will either die during the dragons vs zombies war, or turn out to be one of the SO CRAZY Targaryens. There's still plenty of books to go, and while Jon has been growing increasingly cold in his decision making, Dany is already conquering the hell out of cities at the age of.. what, sixteen or so? I can see one of them becoming a villain. And then Jon represents ice with his Wall and increasing coldness, Dany represents fire with her dragons and tendency to get pissed off and take entire cities, and one of them will eventually be the Messiah-like Targaryen who will take back the North with the dragons, and the song of ice and fire ensues.

>>1369952
Probably die just like Robb and Ned, along with her Wolf.

I'm going to predict Jon being the only stark left by the end and Ghost being the only wolf. So Bran and Rick will probably die eventually as well.

>>1369955
I dont' think so. Characters I can see making it right to the end:
Tyrion, Dany, Jon, Arya. Yes they're my favorites, but so is Davos, and I've grown to like Jaime and Brienne. However, I can see basically any other character dying.

I have a scary thought that Arya will complete her assassin training and actually be the one that kills off either Danny or Jon. That would be fucked.

What I really want to know is what's in store for Bran. I'm hoping he ends up the new lord of Winterfell.

>>1369953
I agree completely. I've been stunned by some character deaths (nothing beats my shock at Eddard's execution, in any book by any author, before or since) but killing Jon at this point, especially if I turn out to be right, would just...I don't even know. It would literally ruin the series for me.

It was painful watching Eddard, Robb, and other favorite characters die, and seeing Joffrey die of simple poisoning seemed to bittersweet. It was far easier than he deserved, and didn't feel like true justice.

But it still felt...right. As though it was acceptable within the context of the series as a whole.

To simply wantonly off Jon would make me just...dislike the series. It wouldn't be rage, or anything, it would be simple disappointment.

>I have a scary thought that Arya will complete her assassin training and actually be the one that kills off either Danny or Jon. That would be fucked.
Nah she's blind now, she'll cleary fall into the river and drown in Braavos[/spolier]

>>1369967
I lol'd.

>>1369969
lol I was kinda serious, dont really think shes gonna go all red devil on our asses

>>1369959
>I dont' think so. Characters I can see making it right to the end:

I don't really think you've fully accepted the anyone can die thing, everyone you like as a character will die and their deaths will continue to shock and surprise you as long as you hold onto your preconceived ideas of what you want the characters to be.

If Jon dies and he's the true heir so be it, your disappointment will be of your own making.

Oh man this thread has made me so excited for A Dance with Dragons.
Joan, Arya and Dany are my favourite characters.

>>1369985
Yeah definitely girls > boys in this series

George seems to like strong female characters, why I wouldn't be surprised to see Dany kill Jon if it comes down to that.

>>1369973
Think what you like, he's essentially written the entire series about Jon and somewhat Danny as well. If they both die, it'd be a rather pointless story.

>>1369905
No, they aren't. Even if Jon and Tyrion do have Targaryen blood, they'd still be bastards. Jon Snow and Tyrion Hill.

I'm personally rooting for Jaime and Cersei to turn out to be Aerys' bastards. Their predesposition to incest (not only they don't see anything wrong with sleeping with each other, Jaime also has no problem with the idea of his children hooking up), Jaime's dream about Joanna, Cersei's madness and "eyes of wildfire" all can be taken as hints about that. It would be more shocking and less cliche and it would make Tyrion fanboys rage so much, haha.

>>1369967
>>1369970
It's not supposed to be permament, I think. The kindly man told her that during her training they will take "her eyes, her ears, her everything". Presumably, they will also give them back once she's finsihed.

where did this stupid theory came from that Jon and Tyrion are Targaryen? They don't even have the purple eyes...

>>1369914
>>1369917
>>1369919
Where are you getting this is Rhaegar? I always thought it was Aegon, or his father.

>>1370040
The Jon one comes from the widely held belief that he isn't Eddard's bastard son at all, but that of prince Rhaegar and Ned's sister, Lyanna.

>>1370026
>It's not supposed to be permament, I think. The kindly man told her that during her training they will take "her eyes, her ears, her everything". Presumably, they will also give them back once she's finsihed.
Well thats a relief, if its true. I actually think the kindly old man is Jaqen, old changy face that he is

>>1370052
No, Jaque is in the Oldtown. He killed Pate (the apprentice in the Citadel) in AFFC prologue as "the Alchemist", took his place and met Sam in Sam's last AFFC chapter.

>>1370066
*Jaqen, geez

>>1370066
How the devil did you come to that????

>>1370044
I think he was saying "his is the song of ice and fire" about Aegon to Elia, but as far as we know, Aegon is dead. If Rhaegar was saying that because he knew that the prophecy was about a child of his, he could have thought it was about Aegon at the time, but it turned out to be about Jon.

>>1370040
Targaryens kept their Valyrian looks mostly because of inbreeding. If Jon is Rhaegar's son and/or the Lannister twins are Aerys' bastards, it would simply mean that the mother's genes were stronger. Tyrion, on the other hand, does have white hair and one dark eye, which is used as an argument by people who believe him to have Targaryen blood.

>>1370068
Uh, the alchemist's description (hook nose, scar on one cheek) matches Jaqen's description from when Arya last saw him exactly. We know that Pate died in his POV chapter, but Sam saw him alive and well in his. Jaqen took his place.

>>1370076
Damn, cant believe i hadnt caught that

>>1370091
Have you caught that Alleras the Sphinx from the same chapters is Oberyn's daughter, just wondering?

>>1370145
No, you're seriously making my head explode. How is that possible? And I thought Sphinx was a dude.

BTW any thoughts on what Jaqen is up to in Oldtown?

>>1370153
She's crossdressing because only men can get Maester's training. When asked, Alleras tells his friends that he's "no lord's son" (but "he" is a lord's daughter, that way he avoids lying) and that his mother was a trader from Summer Islands which matches the desription of Sarella's mother. And in Dorne chapters it's mentioned that Sarella (not very subtle there, spelling your name backwards) is very knowledge-hungry and that she loves Oldtown. Doran Martell says "let's leave her to her little game there".

Not really, but it probably has something to do with Citadel's conspiracy to get rid of magic (IDK if that's mentioned in the books or something that I've read online). Or not — there wasn't any obvious reason for him to travel with the NW's recruits or serve at Harrenhal, but he still did it. We should get more info in ADWD.

>>1370170
lol I never would have thought of that.

I think its said towards the end of AFFC that the Citadels quite against magic and trying to snuff it out. I cant wait to read more about Jaqen though (especially after now knowing that he hadnt completely disappeared), he just oozed coolness

Antone else amped for a Victarion Greyjoy / Strong Belwas fight? That shit's gonna happen.

Also, what word do you think Brienne screamed to save their lives?

I think it would suck if Jaquen still appears somewhere in the next books. Why shouldn't there be more persons like him? His work is done, his debt with Arya is fulfilled. Why should he stick around?

I always liked the thought that no matter how powerful you think you are there are always forces lurking in the shadows that can put an end to everything but they decide no to for some reason.

>>1370170
pic related

Fair enough, but how the hell can any of you say that Tyrion or the Lannister twins have Targaryen blood? Explain this madness...

>>1370188
Now I am.

"Sword" or "Jaime". Maybe "Stannis", because Cat promised her that she wouldn't stand in Brienne's way of taking revenge for Renly, but that's unlikely since that wouldn't help Brienne save Pod.

Whatever it is, I hope it's too late to save Hyle.

>>1370188
valar morghulis hehehe

wait, thats two words..

>>1370188
Tansey?

>>1370195
Its based on the assumption that all three dragons need riders and that Tyrion has a dragon fetish in the first book, though honestly I don't think he needs to be one to ride shotgun.

Also you people seem pretty obvious to standard twists, Eddard was doomed from chapter one what surprised me was how long he stuck around, think about it, children?
Heirs to a noble line as the main characters? Did you really expect them to have comfy childhoods?

>>1370188
she actually screamed "IM STILL A VIRGIN GODDAMMIT!!"

>>1370198
>>1370210

but he was quite specific in writing "She screamed a word." as the cliffhanger, not "She screamed a name."

>>1370191
Jaqen obviously wasn't hanging around in King's Landing just to give Arya life lessons.

My personal theory is that the Faceless Men are in some way going to turn out to be the Big Bad of the series. The idea of a cosmic battle between opposed forces has already been introduced (R'hlor v.s. the Other), that ties in with Fire v.s. Ice; it seems to me that given how widely dispersed the characters are GRRM can't just have the whole plot resolved by what happens at the Wall. LF's plan in the Vale, and what happens in Oldtown are clearly shaping up to be consequential in some way.

>>1370218

I expected Eddard to die, the only ones which really shocked and disappointed me so far were Robb and Catelyn, though I guess Catelyn's sort of still alive.

>>1370224
Now that would be interesting. Couldnt see it finishing in 7 books if thats the case.

>>1370195
Aerys was a rapist (Jaime overhears him hurting his wife during sex as she scremed for him to stop) and he hated Tywin because people were saying that it was Tywin who really ruled the kingdom (as a Hand) and loved him more. This gave birth to the theory that Aerys raped Joanna, Tywin's wife. Now, people think Tyrion might be born of that rape because:
1. He says he dreamed of dragons since he was a child and he's fascinated with them as an adult.
2. His coloring (white hair + a black eye, some Targaryens had eyes that were such dark blue/purple color that they seemed black)
3. The fact that Tywin said that he wished he could prove Tyrion wasn't his but couldn't, I think? That would involve Joanna telling Tywin of the rape but neither of them knowing who gotten her pregnant. Anyway, I'm not a big fan of this theory so I don't know what other arguments are there, but I'm sure there are more.

>>1370234
For the twins, in AFFC, Jaime has a vision of his mother:
>“This is a dream.”
>“Is it?” She smiled sadly. “Count your hands, child.” One. One hand, clasped tight around the sword hilt. Only one. “In my dreams I always have two hands.” He raised his right arm and stared uncomprehending at the ugliness of his stump.
>“We all dream of things we cannot have. Tywin dreamed that his son would be a great knight, that his daughter would be a queen. He dreamed they would be so strong and brave and beautiful that no one would ever laugh at them.”
>“I am a knight,” he told her, “and Cersei is a queen.”
>A tear rolled down her cheek. The woman raised her hood again and turned her back on him. Jaime called after her, but already she was moving away, her skirt whispering lullabies as it brushed across the floor. Don’t leave me, he wanted to call, but of course she’d left them long ago.

Some people take this to mean simply that Jaime sucks as a knight and Cersei as a queen, but it could be read differently as that Tywin didn't have children that could fulfill those roles. There's also everything I said there >>1370026. "Eyes of wildfire" comes from some Sansa chapter, when the city is burning during the battle with Stannis and on top of that, Cersei has a moment with wildfire in AFFC, when she burns the tower of the Hand. "The wildfire was cleansing her, burning away all her rage and fear, filling her with resolve." Jaime compares her to Aerys in his thoughts later. And Tyrion compares Joffrey to Aerys a few times and Joff was clearly mad in a Targaryen-ish way.

>>1370218
I have a simple mind, that's why I enjoy reading books with intriguing, if a bit obvious, twists.
Thanks for the explanation.

>>1370234
>>1370236
Wow, I really need to reread these books...

>>1370255
I need to do that too. But I recommend waiting till the month or two before ADWD release to avoid missing things. I don't think I would have connected Jaqen and the alchemist, if I didn't read the books all together and ACOK wasn't fresh in my mind, for example.

Wow, you just ruined the books for me. Jon is the most generic and boring character in the whole books, the Harry Potter.

Daenerys is cool though

Daenerys is Azor Ahai reborn. She will temper lightbringer in the blood of her lover's heart, just as Azor Ahai did before her. Jon Snow will be her lover, and this event will cause Ghost to briefly forgo silence and howl for the first and last time.

>>1370301
Jon/Dany shippers are so fucking ridiculous, I swear. She doesn't have a clue what to do with an existing sword, much less about making one. If she's Azor Ahai, her lightbringer is her dragons. Her love, Drogo already died so that she could wake them.

>>1370328
I'm not a Jon/Dany shipper. I dislike Jon and he can die alone in the north for all I care, once his POV is no longer necessary. I was merely proposing a theory which has long seemed plausible (if not likely) to me. As far as Daenerys lacking swordsmanship skills is concerned, that hardly seems relevant when talking about a magic sword which could possess all kinds of unknown properties entirely unrelated to sticking dudes with the pointy end.

>>1370338
Sure you aren't. That's why you along with 60% of the fandom are convinced that she and Jon will be lovers, when they haven't even met, there's no guarantee that they will even like each other IF they meet and Dany despises the man Jon loved and called his father.

Magic sword is still that, a sword. If it's shaped as a sword, it's owner uses it to kill people, directly. Lightbringer from the legend was only used as a sword, with the difference between it and the ordinary swords being that it could kill others like dragonglass (and most likely dragon fire) does. Dany won't ever participate in a battle other than from a dragon's back. There's zero need for her to have a literal sword. I know I'm being a little too bitchy here, but that theory is idiotic.

>>1370349
Forgot to mention that original Lightbringer only came to be because Nissa Nissa loved and trusted Azor Ahai and when he came to her and told her to bare her chest, she did it gladly and then her strength went into the sword. I'm trying to imagine Jon Snow, the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch and the self-proclaimed shield that guards the realms of men, baring his chest at request of a chick from a family known for it's madness with a newly forged sword in her hand, in the middle of the bloody WAR FOR THE DAWN and I think if my eyes could roll harder, they would have rolled out of my head.

Not to mentioned she's not his type.

Yeah, I have a lot of feelings of this subject.

Is this series worth reading?

not a troll.

>>1370390
yeah but it's still fantasy

>>1370390
Yes, it's very good.

>>1370367
>Not to mentioned she's not his type.

The real problem with a proper J+D relationship would be that GRRM simply doesn't have enough time to develope it enough that it could have emotional credibility - at this point in the narrative it'd be too obvious it was just a setup for a heroic sacrifice.

If he is going to take the plot this way I hope he realises that it isn't necessary for Jon and Dany to actually fuck, they just need to both meet and recognise that they're related. Either one has enough of a suppressed longing for a family member that actually having sex would be unnecessary for it to be a credible sacrifice.

>>1370437
I don't think it would be credible at all. No sane person would sacrifice themselves for someone they haven't known for long just because they are related to them. Especially in the middle of a war they are leading. And for their relationship to develop even that way, they'll have to like each other first, which I'm not at all sure they will.

>Either one has enough of a suppressed longing for a family member

Jon could still meet Arya, Sansa (who longs to see him as well), Rickon (who probably misses his family horribly, poor child) and Bran (who's closer to Jon geographically than any of the others mentioned) before meeting Dany. Dany is still on another continent, while it's possible that Sansa will have to leave Vale and go North soon — either after marrying Harry or after killing LF.

>>1370188
>Victarion Greyjoy / Strong Belwas

Oooo, I hadn't thought of that. It will entirely depend upon how Danny reacts to his desire to drag her off to Westeros. It's possible she could see it as her chance to conquer, but I really don't think so, she didn't seem to think it was the right time during ASoS.

So yeah, probably a fight.

>Also, what word do you think Brienne screamed to save their lives?
Oh I think that's obvious. Catelyn gave her the choice, the sword or death, as she put it, something like that.

Basically, Brienne screamed "Sword!" which meant she would take up her sword against Jaime.

That makes me sad, because it's rather obvious the two of them are, insanely, spiraling towards some doomed romance. It's all too likely that one of them is going to kill the other. I honestly can't decide which it will be, if it comes to that. Jaime is crippled physically, but Brienne basically loves him and that would be quite a hinderance to her ability to fight him.

>>1370500
I would 'like' a romance between the two, or rather would have back when I first was reading the books as they came out, but it's slowly come to seem pretty impossible, and it would be quite a fanboy-appeasing stretch.

It is entirely possible he could essentially have them "meet" and drop some hint at a future relationship in a final chapter (should they both survive) but really, they've BOTH already their "true love" to this point so I don't see them suddenly falling over each other like lovesick children.

My best guess is that, should they ally, it would be as siblings, knowing the truth of one another.

>>1370502
Brienne is quite a clear-headed fighter (remember how she first fought Jaime and withholded from harming him at first, even though he pissed her off with the dancing remark), so I don't think her feelings will be getting in her way during the actual fight. But she might decide to fight Jaime with her left hand (because it wouldn't be fair or whatever, you know her) before it starts and he would be fighting better than her because of that (she wouldn't have anyone to train with other than Pod and Jaime trained with Ilyn Payne).

>>1370026
>No, they aren't. Even if Jon and Tyrion do have Targaryen blood, they'd still be bastards. Jon Snow and Tyrion Hill.

This isn't necessarily true for Jon. Targaryens in the past had multiple wives. The idea is that Rhaegar and Lyanna got married sometime after the tourney at Harrenhal. This would make Jon his legitimate son and the heir to the throne.

>>1370532
True, I realized that after posting.

>>1370532
>The idea is that Rhaegar and Lyanna got married sometime after the tourney at Harrenhal.
Yeah, that's been my thought all along. I know there is no evidence of it, but it is not a stretch, at all. The way those two were madly in love with each other, and eloped, essentially causing the downfall of the Targaryens...it'd be more surprising if they hadn't been married, I think.

>>1370530
That's true, but I still have a very difficult time seeing her go through with actually killing Jaime.

>>1370538
>>1370530
I also forgot, isn't one of Brienne's hands broken? If it's the right one, that would put her and Jaime on equal grounds.

>>1370551
I can see it, sadly. Brienne killing Jaime will have more emotional impact, I think. She's just so good, but constantly robbed of any chance for happiness and killing Jaime will leave her and readers that like her heart-broken.

Jaime, on the other hand.. It could mess him up, but I won't really be sad for HIM, if he kills Brienne.

Just wanna add a couple things to the whole Tyrion being a dragon theory.

In Jaime's flashback his mother has green eyes (as does Tywin).

Tywin's hate for Tyrion is irrational if it's just because he's a dwarf, but entirely plausible if he knew Tyrion was Aerys' child. It also explains why Tywin would fume when what's-her-face tells him Tyrion is his real son.

>>1370634
>Tywin's hate for Tyrion is irrational if it's just because he's a dwarf

..Not really. I'm not saying it's ok to be prejuduced against little people, but Tywin's pride took a huge hit because of Tyrion's dwarfism and that happened right when he was hit by his beloved wife's death. And when Tyrion got older, other lords refused to accept him for their daughters, even the guy whose daughter was "soiled". And when Jaime joined the KG, Tyrion was left the heir of Casterly Rock, leaving Tywin with the possibility of the main branch of Lannisters being made up of dwarfs in the future. He hated when people laughed at him or his family, so of course he hated that and Tyrion.

"I never win anything," Dolorous Edd complained. "The gods always smiled on Watt, though. When the wildlings knocked him off the Bridge of Skulls, somehow he landed in a nice deep pool of water. How lucky was that, missing all those rocks?"
"Was it a long fall?" Grenn wanted to know. "Did landing in the pool of water save his life?"
"No," said Dolorous Edd. "He was dead already, from that axe in his head. Still, it was pretty lucky, missing the rocks."

doll edd for king say i.

>>1370502

I was under the impression that at the end of AFFC, Victarion was on his way to her? With Euron and the horn?

There's like 3 different factions shipping of to get her at once, is there not?

>>1370783
I think you're right actually. I can't remember, I'd have to pick it up and check. However, I can't imagine that this is going to end well for Victarion.

I'm a fan of the Jon is Rhaegar's bastard child and the coupling of Jon and Daenerys is A Song Of Ice and fire but how the hell will Tyrion fit into all of this? I understand he's going to Braavos at the moment?(Been a while since I read ASOS) so he'll probably join Dany's side to get back at the Lannister's somehow. How great would it be if he actually does burn down Casterly Rock like he imagined/dreamed?

Also, what of Sandor and Gregor Clegane? Hopefully Sandor isn't dead. Not arsed about Gregor.

My theories of what becomes of the character:

Arya: Becomes a badass assassin like everyone imagined and to prove her loyalty one of her first targets will either be Daenerys, someone in her family or who affiliated with her family or either Stannis or Melisandre.

Cersei: Ends up killing herself accidentally because she becomes so insane with the prophecy.

Rickon: Becomes some kind of pirate lord with Osha's help(forgot where he was heading at the end of book 2)

Bran: Obtains awesome power from the Children and uses this to restore Winterfell to its former glory.

Also, does anyone really want a book about the Targaryen's dynasty or some kind of novella? I understand they have the Dunk and Egg books but I mean a full on history of the Targaryens all the way to they're downfall.

The Martells and the Greyjoys IIRC, can't remember who the other faction was.

The guy from the Citadel who jumped on the boat that Samwell had come on. He had the dragon candle or whatever it was. So the third faction is the Citadel

>>1370783
I thought it was just Victarion. Euron tells him to bring Dany to him and Victarion thinks that he will take her for himself.

>There's like 3 different factions shipping of to get her at once, is there not?

Yeah. Quentyn Martell, Victarion and the Golden Company. Unless you also count Tyrion and Varys.

>>1370842

>Also, what of Sandor and Gregor Clegane? Hopefully Sandor isn't dead. Not arsed about Gregor.

Both alive, most likely. Gregor was alive and experimented on for at least some time by that dodgy maester after being poisoned. The maester refers to Cersei having an unstoppable champion, and she's seen ordering armour and being told it would fit no living man. Earlier on, she keeps an "unusually large" dwarf head that she was given during the search for Tyrion, which she presumably sent to Dorne and told them it was Gregor's.

Sandor is probably the huge gravedigger on that island of monks, seen walking with a limp (leg injury) and stopping to pet dogs. The monks have his horse, and the head guy knows an unusual amount about Sandor considering he supposedly only met the guy as he was dying. Since the healer also refers to himself as having "died" (sustained serious injuries in a battle and decided to become a holy man), he likely means that Sandor died as the Hound and started a new life.

There's also a prophetic dream in which Sansa is seen at court, surrounded by three guys. Two are clearly Jaime and Sandor, and the third appears to be zombified Gregor, and he's menacing her. My guess is that at some point, she goes on trial for Joff's murder, and Gregor is threatening her in that he's Cersei/the Lannisters' champion. Given that Sandor is obsessed with Sansa and killing his brother, he probably returns to court as her champion. At least, I hope so, because Ungregor vs Brother Sandor, the world's shittiest monk, sounds awesome.

Zombie Gregor Vs Monk Sandor sounds epic.

And I completely forgot about the paranoia surrounding Joffrey's death. Though, I doubt Sansa did it, she doesn't seem like the killing type. But it would be a complete surprise if she did.

I wouldn't be surprised if it was one of the Tyrells or Little finger(been too long since I read ASOS, actually re-reading AGOT right now) and I forgot if either proclaimed they weren't Joff's murderer.

>>1371094
>Ungregor vs Brother Sandor, the world's shittiest monk
I laughed so loud at that that I choked on my cereal.

I would love to see that.

>>1371105
>Though, I doubt Sansa did it, she doesn't seem like the killing type
I wasn't Sansa, remember? Dontos tells her that her hairnet is magic and will save her. Then one of the pearls or whatever is missing. This after the Queen of Thorns (Margaery's grandmother) fusses with it.

It was Olenna Redwyne. She killed Joffrey. Elaborate plot.

>>1371094
>There's also a prophetic dream in which Sansa is seen at court, surrounded by three guys.

Wait, remind me when that was?

>>1371105
Oh, she will be quite the killing type soon. She kept the hairnet with the poison and I can't wait to see how she uses it (please kill LF, Sansa!)

Bumping

So who do you think will kill Ilyn Payne? I hate that fucker with a vengeance. I hope it's Arya who kills him.

>>1372261
Why? He hasn't done anything bad on his own, did he? Aside from scaring Sansa. It's not like the royal executioner can be blamed for carrying out the orders of his (perceived-as-rightful) king/queen.

But Arya seems like as good a candidate for killing him as any.

>>1372274
I hear what your saying, but I can't get out of my head it's his fault everything went to shit in King's Landing, even if he was just obeying orders. I don't know why. Plus, taking Ice for himself just pissed me off.

It's been a while but I'm pretty sure Ilyn was portrayed as very eager to behead Eddard. Seeing as Arya saw the whole thing I wouldn't be surprised if she goes out of her way to kill him.

>>1372261
everyone on Arya's list is going down, including him.

>>1372290
But he was given it. And it's a Valyrian sword, it's not like he can just shove it somewhere or send it to Robb and just say..ahem, write "I prefered my old one" to Joffrey and Cersei. I was more pissed at Tywin for melting Ice.

>>1372361
Your argument is valid. Im planning a reread in January so I may change my opinion yet.

If Brienne actually kills Jamie, I'll be very disappointed in GRRM.

Best characters of the series (fact):
Arya, Jamie, Sandor.

Only Arya might survive to the end (out of these three).

>>1370026

Yeah, I also think her blindness is temporary, some sort of test. Giving her permanent blindness seems like shoddy writing, since she would either be some boring crippled character or it would be a LOL HEIGHTENED SENSES shit.

Some of the theories in this thread are mindblowing. Really looking forward to the 5th book!

>>1371257

>He saw Sansa crying herself to sleep at night, and he saw Arya watching in silence and holding her secrets hard in her heart. There were shadows all around them. One shadow was as dark as ash, with the terrible face of a hound. Another was armored like the sun, golden and beautiful. Over them both loomed a giant in armor made of stone, but when he opened his visor, there was nothing inside but darkness and thick black blood.

It's not quite how I remember it. I thought Arya dreamt this about Sansa, but Bran dreams it about both of them. Still, it seems to have a zombified Gregor (enormous guy, black dead blood, stone armour- maybe symbolic because he's known as the Mountain?), but it actually sounds like he might be threatening Jaime and Sandor. So.. Jaime turns on Cersei, which seems inevitable anyway, Sandor is back to kill his brother, something to do with Sansa, or possibly even a champion of the Faith (he's now living with a bunch of holy guys, so if they're desperate and Cersei demands Gregor as her champion now she's on trial? Problem is that a) she needs to get Gregor in the Kingsguard before he can defend her, but Loras is horribly injured and may die soon, and b) Gregor is officially dead, so to avoid trouble with Dorne, she'd need to claim it's some other giant guy, but she is mad enough to try that now).

>>1372685
What do you want to happen with them instead?

>>1372917
Oh, thanks! I remember that, though I assumed it was more of a general thing, like "knights who will play part in the girls' lives", rather than a specific incident. Though I think it will likely happem, UnGregor in the KG. They will hear that Arys died in Dorne soon and I think at this point, Cersei just wouldn't give a fuck what they'll think about Gregor. Didn't she give the knight she sent with "Gregor"'s head some secret mission? I think she ordered him to bring Myrcella back and to hell with diplomatic relations.

>>1372930

Yeah, it definitely could be a more general thing. Sandor has already played a part in both girls' lives (Arya's stabby bro, obsessed with Sansa as a love interest/personal agony aunt/representation of innocence to either tear down or protect/possibly even replacement dead little sister), and Arya has been under threat from Gregor before, but neither of them had really spent much time with Jaime, and I suspect it's Ungregor from the description, so possibly encounters with at least two/probably all three yet to come.

Shit, bring Arya back and she can join in the Ungregor vs Brother Sandor fight in another wacky team up. Sandor's going to need all the help he can get, since if he's the gravedigger, he has a serious limp and he's going to get flattened when he and Gregor are lurching comically at each other.

I got tired of ASoIaF both waiting for the next bit to come out and Martin's seeming contempt for the magical / wondrous aspect of fantasy in the place of Medieval Drama.

I had read all of Malazan too and while that had all the World Building / crazy magic I wanted it had less of the other half.

Then I found a series that combined both into one of the best Fantasy series I have ever read.

Good good stuff it was.

>>1372981

I couldn't get past the names in the first few pages. Is it worth it despite of Scrabble disease?

What's the general consensus on the series for /lit/?

>>1373713
It's good and it's never going to be finished.

>>1372981

That series sucks shit. This is a SoIaF thread. Fuck off.

>>1373713
Without a doubt the best fantasy series that I've read.

That said, it's still fantasy.