/lit/ - Literature

What... is this the thread that won't fucking go away? Who is paying you?
She was a whacked out, greedy speed freak who didn't give a shit about anyone else.

>>1365335
Why are you getting trolled?

... I forgot longwinded and boring.

>>1365335
Wait, Rand did meth? Do you have a source for this?

If you want to read about Rand's philosphy, read it. Don't waste your time with a shitty story like Atlas Shrugged.

>>1365335

Faggot. Get out from under your philosophy professor's ball sack for a few minutes, and find out that Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century.

>>1365330

They're both good books. The Fountainhead is the easier read, but Atlas Shrugged gives a much more full idea of what Rand's philosophy is about. You could always try reading her non-fiction too, it lays out the Egoist and Objectivist philosophy in language that makes sense, even to laymen (unlike the vast majority of philosophy texts).

Pay no attention to the Rand haters, they're just asspained that a girl from Russia was intellectually superior (and a better writer) than any of them could ever hope to be.

>>1365381
I don't know, some of the summaries I've read about the dystopia portrayed seem intriguing. Is it just her style and execution? Seems like a novel would be more accessible than some screed.

>>1365389
>objectivism
>workable
>implying that free-will hasn't been summarily disproven making "objecitivism" a fanciful notion at best

>>1365391
I've only read Anthem but it was pretty bad in execution although If I only read a summary it might have sounded good.

>>1365355
I don't expect her stuff as as good as hitler's, but google "ayn Rand" and "meth"
Then google "ayn Rand" and "serial killer"

>>1365394

You must be a retard if you think freewill has been disproven. Show me the "proof" that there is no free will. Proof, not conjecture, or a competing philosophical idea. Good luck with that.

>>1365402

Tons of excellent authors are drug addicts. Not sure how her choice in pharmaceuticals has anything to do with her body of work.

And she may have been a sociopath (I am too, so maybe that's why I like her ideas so much), but sociopath and serial killer are not homonyms last time I checked.

Nice to see the Ayn Rand hate brigade still has no legitimate points to make against her, and instead has to bring up her drug use and mental health.

Stay classy, /lit/.

>>1365407
Neurochemistry

Tons of excellent authors are drug addicts. Not sure how her choice in pharmaceuticals has anything to do with her body of work.

And she may have been a sociopath (I am too, so maybe that's why I like her ideas so much), but sociopath and serial killer were not synonyms last time I checked.

Nice to see the Ayn Rand hate brigade still has no legitimate points to make against her, and instead has to bring up her drug use and mental health.

Stay classy, /lit/.

>>1365415

You've never written on amp, have you?

>>1365415
Anyone who would say "i am a sociopath" is not a sociopath.

>>1365413
I have a problem with philosophy that might makes right.
I have never been able to figure out why so many people who claim to be christians (and no, I am not one) take to her philosophy like dogs to vomit. Their Jesus said more about helping the poor than anything else.

>>1365414
Neurochemistry existing as a subject hasn't disproved anything by that mark alone. There has been and never will be an experiment in Neurochemistry that sets out to disprove freewill either.

>>1365421
If the determinism of neurochemistry exists, then free will cannot--this is a standard argument against free will and I will leave it at that. The burden of proof is on you, because I do not need to prove that something does not exist--and the fact that you think I do shows how young or ignorant or whatever you are--you need to stop following this glenn beck shit while your ahead, son.

>>1365414

Saying the word "neurochemistry" is not the same as showing me proof. The idea that free will doesn't exist because of a few flawed scientific studies is stupid, and there are far more scientist who disagree with the idea that free will has been disproven than there are who agree with those findings. But please, find me some incontrovertible proof that has been unchallenged and is iron clad, and maybe I'll agree with you. Good luck.

>>1365415
>She may have been a sociopath (I am too...)

>>1365423
1. Determinism isn't an argument against free will (radical choice)
2. That hasn't got anything to do with neurochemistry specifically
3. So much run on sentence and non-sequitur, so little argument

>>1365419

"Might makes right" is not the philosophy of Objectivism. But that's probably what your philosophy professor would have me believe, and that's why you believe it.

>>1365417

Well, I have no conscience at all, and do as I please. The only determining factor in whether or not I do illegal or "immoral" things is "Will I get caught", not "Is this right." Plus, my dream is that I'll wake up one day and 90% of the human population of Earth will have died. That's pretty much textbook Sociopathy. You can be highly educated and still a sociopath, we're not all slobbering raving rapist murderers.

Terry Goodkind is a superior philosopher.

>>1365437
You're not a sociopath, pop-psychologist.

>>1365437
You're not a sociopath, you're just 16-years-old. You'll grow up eventually, man. I promise.

>>1365437
You seem to have this mistaken impression philosophy professors are on this crusade against Rand and Objectivism. This is just not the case. It's completely ignored because it is completely irrelevant, badly thought through and badly written rambling which is of no academic consequence.

>>1365437
Like I have nothing more productive to do than read long-winded, self-centered drivel and ponder about how much better I am than everyone else.

Funny thing is, the people who are really benefitting from her way of thinking are laughing at the rest of the poor fools who lap up that drivel and think that freedom for bankers and big business is all that is keeping them from some mythical Stalinist prison camp.
21st century? Try dialing that back 50 years.

>>1365437

>Plus, my dream is that I'll wake up one day and 90% of the human population of Earth will have died.

I don't think you're a sociopath, and I don't think you believe this. I think you're an emotionally and intellectually undeveloped person who still thinks this shtick is supposed to shock and offend others, and by differentiating yourself are granting yourself a measure of freedom solely by standing out against the tapestry of society.

anons & STILDO, stop this.

>>1365439
But his philosophy is derived from Rand.

>>1365450

If you knew me, you'd know that what I'm saying about myself is 100% accurate. But since I have no way of convincing you on an anonymous message board, I wont even try. Just know that there are people out there who really do want to watch the world burn.

Lol, 4chan.

Lol, /lit/.

>>1365491
Oh spare me.
fap fap fappity fap.

>>1365447
Actually I'm a 30 year old white American male. But nice try.

>>1365448
She's ignored because she's dangerous to philosophy professors. She's the antithesis of everything they've spent their careers trying to teach. She's marginalized because she advocates greed and ambition, both of which are deemed immoral by the establishment, and her and her adherents are ridiculed because philosophy students are taught that she's worthless.

>>1365504
Yes, my ass gas is dangerous to philosophy professors too, but I don't act as if the world depended on them.

>>1365504
She's ridiculed because she IS worthless.

>>1365514

Thanks for proving my point. You believe that she's worthless either because that's what you were taught, or you never actually read her body of work (or maybe you tried to read it and weren't bright enough to get through it, or you got through it but were too dim to understand it).

If she was truly worthless, the she would never be brought up in philosophy threads. The fact that she's always brought up in these threads, and the fact that certain people vehemently despise her, is all the proof I need that she's not worthless. No one who was actually worthless would have the ability to make so many pretentious philosofags so asspained.

>>1365491

>But since I have no way of convincing you on an anonymous message board, I wont even try. Just know that there are people out there who really do want to watch the world burn.

I want infinite money for everyone. But that doesn't make me a good person. What are you doing to make the world burn? Prove it! It's perhaps more likely that you're qualified for MENSA than that you are a sociopath. I don't believe that just anyone who says so has an IQ of 130 (i knew a kid that claimed he had an IQ of 190, as unlikely as it would be meaningless) so why should I believe you?

>>1365523
Try and make it a little less obvious you're trolling. Not even her fans suggest it's especially challenging material, that's why she is so popular, it's accessible for stupid people.

>>1365523
It's not the philosophers I am worried about. It's the public who actually believe in the seige mentality and survival of the strongest idea that her name is being used to sell.
And I wouldn't mind so much if I hadn't seen this very same topic brought up two or three times in as many days.

Read the Fountainhead. Quick and you can see what a load of shit her "philosophy" is. But she writes terrible prose.

>>1365527

I just said that there is no way for me to prove it on an anonymous message board. Did you not understand? And my IQ is only 128, so I didn't qualify for mensa.

>>1365530

Not trolling. It's just that it's plainly obvious that no one who actually read her collected works with an open mind could actually believe that she's worthless, so either you're an idiot, or you're the troll in this exchange.

>>1365536

That's the whole point. Her name is being used to sell something that she never herself advocated. The right wing in America is subverting her message, taking only the small parts they like, and ignoring the rest. I'm actually one of the most liberal people I know, and I still think she's one of the most important philosophical voices of the 20th Century. Objectivism is based on giving every man an equal opportunity to either succeed or fail, based solely on their inherent talents and the amount of work they put into their endeavors, it's not about oppressing the masses with might.

she's worthless -- Alan Greenspan, one of her disciples, denounced after the crash 2 years ago -- he couldn't believe how greedy people could be.

What a horse's ass.

http://images.4chan.org/lit/src/1292531263729.png

>>1365545

Oh, I understand it perfectly well, and I think it's bullshit. The odds that you are a sociopath, even given that you're claiming a sociopath, are very low. The odds, on the other hand, that you are normal, simply emotionally undeveloped, actually really emotionally needy, or really good at suppressing your emotions, are very high. Saying, with irony, you want to watch the world burn is fucking stupid, and even if you have those thoughts pass through your head, it's unlikely that you truly believe them, and in the absence of true affirmative fuckery in your past and present, I don't think you're actually a destructive fuck. I also don't think that you'd have any problems giving me such an example, especially on an anonymous board, if you were someone that wanted to world burn. Just give me one example, one really, really poignant example, of you acting, institutionally or interpersonally, on your desire to watch the world burn, and your reaction to this action, and I'll stop, because that would prove your self-analysis is right.

the chart was hilarious!

pic related: defending Ayn Rand

>>1365560
based solely on inherent talents and having nothing to do with gender, race, who your daddy is, where you were born or how you feel about cutting other peoples' throats.

>>1365389

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

Pic extremely related.

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

pic related

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

Pic related.

>>1365582

*without irony

>>1365589
>objectivist doing community service.jpg

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

See pic; it's related.

>>1365419

The reason Evangelical Christian Libertarians take to Rand so frequently is because they don't understand their own religion and like most infants are obsessed with death and escaping from it back into the blissful nothingness of the womb. That Rand is a woman is even more apropos as she became a Mary figure blessing upon these Jesus knockoffs the leeway to become self-righteous knowitall politicians and businessmen who suffer under prolific god-complexes and who all see themselves as ushering their fellow man towards some objectivist utopia as in the last segment of Atlas. 

Unfortunately these manboys never grow up. They have a near psychopathic inability to feel genuine empathy and never realize that until we're all ok none of us are. And that we and us I mean in the most general sense. 

They aren't illuminated, übermensch is not a word in their vocabulary and they lead lives of gluttonous excess and selfishness. Then they bestow upon their heirs this same philosophical nonsense and a fat wad in the bank to wield it with. This is my ultimate damnation of capital. That it becomes an end unto itself rather than a force for liberty or good. 

-jdh

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

See pic; it's related.

No.... Amway is the only workable philosophy of the 21st century!

>Objectivism is the only workable philosophy in the 21st century

See pic of side hacking; it's related.

>>1365582

I got a vasectomy solely because I don't want to contribute to the overpopulation of this planet by semi-intelligent monkeys. I never said I was going to burn the world, I said I'd like to watch it burn. I really would love it if the population of the Earth dropped a couple of zeroes of the end. As a youth, I was arrested 8 times before the age of 21, because I have no conscience and wasn't yet adept at risk/reward analysis. I am a strident atheist, and believe that morals are only a system of superficial behaviors forced on us by a culture based on lies, and as such I choose to ignore them. I base all of my actions on whether or not I want to do them, and whether or not I will be caught if the action in question is illegal, not on the fear that some giant bearded man in the sky will send me to hell, or some "feeling" that what I'm doing might be "wrong". I purposely steal and destroy property from corporations and the government whenever possible if I don't agree with their policies. I'm a manipulative, self-centered asshole, but I'm so good at reading people and successfully lying and/or obfuscating that I can pass as a normal person 95% of the time. When I was a teen, my psychiatrist told my parents that I had the potential to either be one of the most successful people he's ever seen, or one of the most dangerous people he's ever met. He wanted them to have me committed for at least 6 months for observation, but my parents wouldn't do it, and after that I learned to never be truthful about my thought processes with anyone in a position of authority again. My current occupation is drug dealer, and I sell to anyone who has money and I'm certain isn't an undercover cop, even kids.

Need I go on?

>>1365589
>>1365593
>>1365595
>>1365598
>>1365603

Nice samefaggotry there, dude. I love how Rand makes some people so asspained that they can't think straight. She's obviously doing something right if she makes you this angry.

>>1365637
Since you ask, no, you needn't go on. Thanks.

>I sell to anyone who has money and I'm certain isn't an undercover cop, even kids.

pic related: dick-dar going off

>>1365637

>I really would love it if the population of the Earth dropped a couple of zeroes of the end.

I meant "off the end", obviously. as in lose tens of billions of people overnight.

Anyone who needs philosophy to get on with their life is retarded. Trying to prove one philosophy or the other is retarded.

You are all fucking retarded. Why don't you spend time and energy on something that matters instead of this made up intellectualism that only exists in books.

>>1365637
seriously bro you've at this for like two days. i'm worried.

please take up a trip & act like me on here, please. i think we would all care about you, it's good.

>>1365647
Great logic. Hitler makes me angry to. Philosophize about that.

>>1365619

Holy shit yes Amway! Have you seen their new ads? Voice overed by that doofus from Dirty Job I swear I counted the word positivity at least twenty times in the 30 second spot.

disgusting pseudo voodoo psychobabble nonsense

POSITIVITY! GOODNESS! WELLNESS HAPPINESS THROUGH CONSUMPTION. BUY MORE FEEL BETTER

Wahhahhsshjfndjdjdjdjdjfbfbvxujd *cue bill hicks sucking the devils dick soundclip*

somebody has been drinking too much coffee

pic related: baby crying

>>1365637

Okay, cool. At least you're honest! Keep fighting the good fight?

(Seriously, too bad)

What I like about this thread is that its early posts read exactly like those threads where some wannabe author samefags shamelessly to promote his vanity-published new book.

>>1365695
I only samefagged it twice. Really, you idiots only need a nudge to get the ball rolling. I'll stop spamming this every day, when people ignore it. That will never happen.

My recently vanity-published book, "OP is a Fag," is a great introduction to Ayn Rand's 20th century shattering philosophy.

why bother introducing anyone to the philosophy of a burnt-out speed addict?

I think Ayn Rand books are just brimming with truth.

Are we ever going to stop bitching about rand

no, really

>>1365654
Listen friend you're going to grow a conscious some day whether you want to or not. There are some more fundamental truths you'll come to realize. I'll take one of your many examples, stealing:

To steal from another is wrong. You're premeditation before the act is precisely what is evil, that you weigh risk/rewards and getting caught is the only deterrent is a logical failure. You're discounting your own premeditation and the inevitable regret, selfhate and selfdestruction that these acts will lead to.

What if you could steal something else, like a girl's virginity, without getting caught? Would you do it?
I sincerely hope not. I know your not a psycho dude I thought I was at that age too. You'll see.

inb4 depends upon how hot she was lulz
trololol
inb4 Katrina victims stealing food that's diff

Ayn Rand fans are easily trolled.
So serious they are.

>>1365735
That might be a bit easier if sycophants didn't post every day asking if we prefered to read Atlas Plugged, The Fountainhead of Cum, or Bang nails into the back of our hands.

>>1365753
lulz

Though Atlas Pegged is funnier.

-jdh

>>1365738

I'm 30 years old, dude. I'm quite confident that I'm not going to grow a conscience at this point. And "evil" is dictated by societal norms, it has no basis in reality. What you consider to be evil, may be considered totally normal in other societies. Who's to say which version of "evil" the right one? Is eating pork "evil", as the Muslims and Jews believe? Is having sex with a girl under the age of 18 "evil", just because the government says it is? Your notions are puerile. Religion is a crutch for the weak, and control mechanism designed to keep those who have control in control, and almost all of the morals in this society were dictated 2,000 years ago by a crazy old man in a desert. People like you make me sick.

>>1365330
HEY WHY DO YOU CARE? AYN RAND WAS A FUCKING STUPID UNINTELLIGENT BITCH! AT THE END OF AYN RAND SHE EVEN RANTED HER ARROGANT PYSCHOPATHIC CUNT OFF TALKIN ABOUT SHIT HOW THE BOOK GOT PUBLISHED THEN THE INTERVIEWED THE PUBLISHERS - SHE LIED! SHE IS JUST A STUPID FUCKING BITCH WHO WAS TRAUMATIZED AS A KID! FUCKING IDIOT SIMPLETON CUNT WITH NO PHILOSOPHICAL INTELLIGENCE!

rand shamelessly uses her stories to communicate her philosophy. it's a mockery of literature. just read her philosophy and save yourself the rage.

alternatively you can read Anthem. it's a 100 page novel(la) that says the exact same thing as the fountainhead. (never read atlas shrugged, but i imagine that's the same shit too)

>>1365761

>30
>on 4chan
>religion is a crutch for the weak

Hope you're in grad school, dude.

Atlas Plugged made me laugh more than Altlas Pegged.
Fountainhead Job is good, too.

>>1365761

mfw ive been talking genuinely to this psychoguy thinking he was some 18yo randian idiot and he tells me he's 30

lrn2kantianethics

>>1365761
Actions which harm oneself and others is to be avoided.
Actions which help oneself and others are to be sought out.

Morality is not a form of ignorance, it's a form of intelligence. Using your empathetic faculty, you can see that just as you don't want to feel badly, others do not want to feel badly, and therefore an intelligent person will not harm others.

Someone who lacks empathy talking about the uselessness of morals is EXACTLY like someone with severe down syndrome talking about the uselessness of functioning in the world to a reasonable degree.

>>1365787

I dropped out of college, because I couldn't see the point in taking classes that had absolutely nothing to do with my major, and the professors didn't like the way I was always challenging their teachings. Like I said, my current occupation is drug dealer, selling marijuana, pills and heroin mostly.

>>1365793

Kant's philosophy is exactly the opposite of everything I believe. Morality is an artificial construct that has no basis in reality. I would never allow my actions to be dictated by a set of rules whose entire basis is fundamentally flawed. And I stated my age multiple times in this thread, perhaps you should have read more carefully.

And you're posting this all on a website which is advertising anime figurines at the top and bottom of the website and is renown for being nothing but a hive of self-indulgent jackasses

Seriously, what the fuck are you guys doing?

>>1365812

So what? From either side of the argument, you have relatively articulate, expressive, intelligent people that see others that are ignorant or combative of your worldview. Why the fuck should the site's renown mean a damn fucking thing when an argument is right in front of your eyes? Crap, man. Crap.

Drugdealer guy, I was being genuine throughout this thread, I agree morals are a construct of man, they're only ideas etc. But so is everything you ever read or say out loud, get over it. You're obviously intelligent, so keep reading, find out what your morals are. Basically no one book should be your bible; especially not an Ayn Rand book and especially not the bible.

^^^^
What Buddy said.
And yes, I have been quite earnest too, even if I have been doing it by mocking you roundly. Try reading more, or better still, actually talking to people who have a different understanding of the world than yourself.

>16 year old nihilist
>claims to be a sociopath that wants to see the world burn
fucking lol'd

>>1365834

the Bible is my bible

>>1365834

I'm not saying I don't have a system of personal "morals" (although I'd rather not use that word). What I'm saying is that I don't base them off of religion or what other "normal" people (or society at large) consider to be right or wrong. I base them almost solely on risk/reward analysis. So while I may not kill the people that I don't like, it's not because I think that killing them would be wrong, it's because the risks would far out weight the rewards. I also don't indiscriminately steal, in fact I make it a point not to steal from individuals if at all possible (unless they really deserve it), I just steal from corporations and the government. So I guess I do have "morals" of a sort, it's just that I arrived at them by means other than indoctrination, and the reasons behind them would seem strange or "immoral" to the vast majority of people. And my personal code of conduct isn't based on guilt, because I don't have a conscience to feel guilty with. I'm not a monster, my mind just doesn't function the way most people's minds do. Do you get what I'm saying?

>>1365854

He beleefs in NATHINK!