/lit/ - Literature

>>13392251
It was different time.

Yup.
https://youtu.be/Q936WgiD7j8
https://youtu.be/C8BU_R7QoYo
>And if Christ be not risen again, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. - 1 Corinthians 15:14

Expect 0 good replies to this thread.
Also it belongs on /x/

Straight up YES

Yes, Jesus is the Son of God and rose from the dead.

>>13392251
No, it was metaphorical.

>>13392382
People like you are even worse than the christcuck idiots.

>>13392251
Jesus didn't exist, so no

>>13392251
It depends on what you mean by "really" and "rise".

>>13392421
Yeah, fuck that guy for pointing out that miracles aren't real but that we can still appreciate mythology in a non-literal sense. What a moron he is.

>>13392426
The consensus among historians is that there was a historical Jesus. He just probably wasn't magic or whatever.

>>13392454
Miracles are real. As are prophets, people God chooses for the prophetic gift.

t. Knew a person with the prophetic gift IRL.

>>13392466
I don't believe they are.
What was he like?

>>13392454
Miracles are real.

>>13392466
All religions claim to have prophets and miracle-workers. Why don't we ever see these faggots regenerating a limb or something? Why has there been no scientific study that shows miracles are real?

>>13392427
Jesus was a post-modern neo-Marxist.

>>13392478
Nice. Had a small farm and a dog. Did not seek any attention. Helped people who asked. Some pious people visited him regularly.

Honest question.

Should the bible be in the fiction or non-fiction section, I'm at a library right now and I want to be a good person and put it away before someone other than me trips over it

>>13392486
If there was a scientific study to prove miracles are real, then they wouldnt be miracles. But there are many cases of scientifically unexplainable phenomena, no matter what though you will always have a sceptic claiming it can be proved with this other thing. And then when that isnt the case some new person will come up with a new sceptical theory. These cases are never closed. For me it is enough to have a guy to talk to me like he has intimate knowledge of my life and certain facts to know that the prophetic gift is real. And I know there are BS artists trying to make you think that with psychological tricks. That was not the case in the only instance I know of. Combined with private experience and research I came to hold the belief that Christianity is real.

>>13392506
put it in reference

>>13392494
What did he prophesise?

>>13392506
put it in a seperate 'religion' section

>>13392577
I can only give a few separate things that stand out in my mind. Its been years since he passed away. Some ive known firsthand, others ive had credible people confirm to me. Since then Ive been spending more time on reading the Bible rather than being concerned with present day prophets and miracles. Here are a few anecdotes:

- he was told he had the prophetic gift from another person with prophetic gift.
- predicted a car crash occurring moments before it did
- had intimate knowledge of my grandfathers health
- had intimate knowledge about certain facts and feelings I had in my life . it would be impossible to know them.
- accurately described certain problems in my family

Now for some other ones who are more interesting but that I do not remember as vividly so I might have some details wrong:
- the Catholic Church is the "real" church and Christianity is true
- there will only be a few popes left, not sure where we currently are
- a certain part of Mediterranean will be flooded in future with sea rising
- people in hell really do "burn". Ie there is an actual sensation of being burned
- prayer works exceptionally well and is recommended as is holy water, oil etc. Basically stuff people dont use anymore in their homes
- as a child I had one part of my chest sticking out further than the other. Doctor told me it wont fix itself and that if it bothers me I should have surgery. Applied holy/blessed oil to it as a teenager for a few years and it almost completly fixed itself to the point its not noticeable at all today.
- I also have some few short unauthored books that I was given by someone who was on good terms with him. One is by a former president of my country. He had a well publicized "conversion" before his death. Started living in a small hut, reading spiritual texts etc. And this book is as crazy as this sounds a message from him from the afterlife asserting that he knew before he died he was on the wrong path and changed his life in the last moment and that he is now grateful that God allowed him to "speak", basically asserts Christianity. The other books are again without an author but its easy to discern that in one God The Father speaks and in the other two Mary does. i have searched to see whether any of these books are available elsewhere or known elsewhere but they are not. My intimate feeling is that the books are "real" upon reading them as I cant find any errors that would oppose established doctrine and scripture but also the manner of expression and content inside the boom has the feeling of saintliness with no ulterior motives.

>>13392691
*inside the book

>>13392691
So nothing

>>13392454
low-IQ

the more important question is: if he did rise from the dead, how do we know it was due to his divine nature and not the consequence of a faustian pact
the issue of christ possibly being a false prophet, and an agent of lucifer, is not settled

>>13392865
Because only God can grant life.

>>13392251
Yes, he's literally the Son of God.

>>13392251
That's not possible and you know it.

Christfags are insufferably deluded.

>>13392872
according to the bible, that is -- written and edited by the followers of the luciferian j*sus. typical and unsurprising retconning.

>>13392251

>>13392896
Boring and low iq

>>13392251
Yes, anon. Christ is risen indeed.

>>13392905
pic related: you rn

>>13392251
Yes.

Against all odds, yes He did.

>>13392454
That's not what the guy said, you absolute moron. Learn to read. The guy is implying that the story of Jesus's resurrection is intended to be interpreted metaphorically, which is an incredibly stupid and arrogant opinion to hold. If you thought about it just a bit more you would realize how stupid it is to think that the people throughout the ages from the beginning of Christianity all took it literally (which they did, anyone who claims otherwise is lying to you) but we in the 21st century are smarter than that, and realize that it was actually just metaphorical all along. The central point of the doctrine of christianity is just a metaphor, what else is a metaphor? Perhaps L Ron Hubbard's Dianetics is also to be interpreted as a metaphor? It has helped a lot of people, after all. What about flat earthers? It's really surprising how easily the midwits fall into the Peterson's midwit cavalcade with their ridiculuously moronic ideas and then come here to shit all over the threads.

>>13393028
What odds, isn't he omnipotent?

I have a theory, at least.

The Jewish mystical tradition, to which Jesus belonged and revolutionized, speaks to us of the universe as a tree. Westerners modeled the roots, from the darkness, called Qliphoth.

Of course, map is not territory, and it is a graphic simplification to understand the natural world to which we have sensory and rational access.

According to the Catholic model, Jesus went down to hell and came back, resurrected, but I think he's actually still there, in "In the land of the dead" or what psychonauts call it, The Hyperspace.

As a pure divine emanation, Jesus is in a process of rectification of the human species from its "roots", but the work of "refactoring" and purification must respect human freedom. God doesn't want automatons, he/she/xer wants intelligent living beings who can love and be happy.

Then Christ, from within human darkness, has spent 2000 years in a spiritual or archetypal battle for the final ordination of the world in hyperspace (Term that I consider better because it is neutral, has no association with death, heaven or hell). Being a pure form, it transcends space and time, which would explain its appearance after death. It is an emanation that comes from the remote future or another timeline, where everything has been rectified by him and won as King of Humanity. Since it has solved more than one timeline, it gains more traction with each victory, so its power expands from reality and unreality.

But it is not the whole story. The current human economic and social model moves towards a more direct understanding of the fundamental rules of physics through technological development through capitalism. In this way, humanity finds itself in its own quest for ordination and the "powers that be" are in a race to claim creation by right of facts.

Christian hyperstition declares that Christ will achieve it first, on the final day it will be who will rise victorious and execute judgment on humanity as King, as Christianity awaits the victory of Jesus, but the problem is that the reason for all this is free will, the human race may come first to "solve the system".

The religious tradition, all in reality, install in the population hyperstitions where their gods and legendary heroes, intrinsically good, win and thus seeks to generate an effect of "self-fulfilling prophecy" in the long term. The truth is that stories will always be stories and reality always has the last word. Religion is mindware that gains psychic real state so that in reality the wills of allies and enemies germinate or die.

Nature is a dynamic system in constant change and development. For this reason Jesus, who has privileged access to the material and divine declares that "Only the father knows when these things will happen", referring to the end of days, anything can happen. The universe and society are literally alive, we can be programmed but we are intelligent and dynamic.

We can choose our destinations.

>>13393262
stopped reading after the tree remark. Low IQ post

>>13393282
Is there a problem with the model? It's just that.

>>13392251

Categorically.

>>13393053
Yes people regarded it as literal.
That doesn't mean we can't regard it as a metaphor now you autist. Religions evolve over time.

>>13393448
Interpreting it as a metaphor is the most brainlet thing you can do.

>>13393448
i bet your parents used to call you a blockhead

Jesus (Issa) didn't die. It was an illusion.

وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ وَمَا صَلَبُوهُ وَلَٰكِن شُبِّهَ لَهُمْ ۚ

>>13393448
There is absolutely no benefit to thinking that Jesus rising from the dead and ascending to heaven was metaphorical. The men that wrote it write it as a historical event

>>13392251
yes and I'll fight every single pleb that says otherwise

>>13392251
No, he didn't die.

>>13392691
>the Catholic Church is the "real" church and Christianity is true
stoped right there, honey the pope is a heretic obsessed with political power and postulating dogma that fits his interests and you know it; in the modern age his political authority went to shit because people realise what a fraud he was and right know his "holiness" is such pious for muh PR and marketing generating billions of dollars while still maintaining some political influence, very much, perhaps the biggest "influencer" in the world but incomparable with what it had in the medieval times.
THE only church is the CHRISTIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH and you know it

>>13394367
Is the orthodox Church as hardcore on hell as the catholics are?
I want to believe in God but the ideas of hell I hear from the catholics make it hard

>>13394373
well, different priests and monks might have different beliefs regarding hell, the priest i talked to in high schools told me that his vision of hell is that of nonaction, a vast realm of nothingness in which you wonder alone until the second coming when you will be judged again, this version is like the catholic purgatory i guess it's a moral torture caused by your own conciousness and the crippling feeling of loveliness, anyone that has experienced long periods of isolation knows that this is what hell must look like

>>13394400
I just fear I'll never be saved because I can't force myself to have faith
I don't want to reject Jesus but I also can't force myself into accepting him sincerely

>>13392251
Of course not. And to make your faith in the mercy of God dependent on the veracity of a story is absolutely ridiculous.

>>13394400
what he described is just dante's limbo

>>13394415
Would it make you feel better to know there are those of other Faith's in exact same situation? It helps me realise how religion is only relevant to me as culture, as much as I used to abhor so-called cultural Muslims.

the ship to Bergen Wittgenstein wrote of Christ’s Resurrection and of what inclined even him to believe in it. If Christ did not rise from the dead, he reasoned, then he decomposed in the grave like any other man. ‘HE IS DEAD AND DECOMPOSED.’ He had to repeat an underline the thought to appreciate its awfulness. For if that were the case, then Christ was a teacher like any other, ‘and can no longer HELP; and once more we are orphaned and alone. So we have to content ourselves with wisdom and speculation.’ And if that is all we have, then: ‘We are in a sort of hell where we can do nothing but dream, roofed in, as it were, and cut off from heaven.’ If he wanted to be saved, to be redeemed, then wisdom was not enough; he needed faith:

“And faith is faith in what is needed by my HEART, my SOUL, not my speculative intelligence. For it is my soul with its passions, as it were with its flesh and blood, that has to be saved, not my abstract mind. Perhaps we can only say: Only LOVE can believe in the Resurrection. Or: it is LOVE that believes the Resurrection. We might say: Redeeming love believes even in the Resurrection; holds fast even to Resurrection …
What combats doubt is, as it were, REDEMPTION. Holding fast to THIS must be holding fast to that belief. …”

>>13394415
It's ok anon, you can't believe in christianity because you have seen no evidence for it because there is none, and that's an entirely justifiable position to take. You don't believe in Jesus just like you don't believe in literally hundreds of other mutually contradicting religions. I'm sure if there was actually a God he would understand. The important part is being honest.

>>13394415
If you want to believe start living a Christian life, abstaining from sin and trying to cultivate more love in your heart. Chances are faith will come to you. The truth of Christianity isn’t something to be reflected upon but to be lived.

/lit/ is for the discussion of literature, specifically books (fiction & non-fiction), short stories, poetry, creative writing, etc. If you want to discuss history, religion, or the humanities, go to /his/. If you want to discuss politics, go to /pol/. Philosophical discussion can go on either /lit/ or /his/, but those discussions of philosophy that take place on /lit/ should be based around specific philosophical works to which posters can refer.

Check the wiki, the catalog, and the archive before asking for advice or recommendations, and please refrain from starting new threads for questions that can be answered by a search engine.

>>13394623
fuck off nigger

>>13394620
if a car crashes into me while searching for Christ I am damned to hell
where is the fairness in that

>>13394623
What's the difference between literature, history and politics? This thread could be in /x/, /his/, /pol/ or /lit/. There is no more complex knowledge than that concerning this subject, it is simply categorizable anywhere. I don't think a rule is being broken, especially if you consider the Christian myth as that, a myth.

>>13394289
Now this is actually somewhat wrong. Historical writing as we do it now, being based on absolute facts, is rather new. People that wrote stuff about the past in the past made "details" up all the time. Especially stuff like the bible.

>He is not privy to the traditionally transmitted knowledge that the Christ has indeed risen and sits on his Father's right side in Heaven at this very moment, preparing the day of his second coming, the date of which no man on Earth knows.

>>13394942
How is shit like John's revelation not blasphemy?

>>13394972
m8 john's revelation is a prophecy about the end times, it is kino.

>>13392251
Yes, because the bible says so and bibles can't lie.
In fact he even went into the tomb as a tiny brown dude and came out as the big white movie actor from your picture.

>>13392251
No, he never died in the first place. He used his laser vision to turn Judas into dust. The bible is actually a history book from an alternate timeline. That's why there is all this confusion.

>>13394998
You are trash, and all your mind and mouth will ever produce is trash.

>>13395061
fuck off triggered atheist
the bible is irrefutable proof and you know it
Jesus and I will be laughing at you from heaven

>>13394990
so what.
It is still blaspehmy and should not be canon.

>>13393053
why are you attempting to shoehorn historical Jesus as a Christian figure? if you enlightened like I am and see that jesus was not the Christ but never the less view the gospels as the bonafide good news (god is love and the kingdom of god is within you), you have no need for that bs. Christianity is just one big cope for not having a working metaphysics that can contain the good word in a naturalistic universe. Christianity is for midwits and Christians aren't getting saved, they do not have the ears to hear the good news.

>>13392691
>I also have some few short unauthored books that I was given by someone who was on good terms with him. One is by a former president of my country.
LARP: the post

>>13392691
>predicted a car crash occurring moments before it did
Wow, so difficult, not like there's hundreds of them every day.
>had intimate knowledge of my grandfathers health
>had intimate knowledge about certain facts and feelings I had in my life . it would be impossible to know them.
>accurately described certain problems in my family
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading

>>13392314
this

>>13393262
t. Grant Morrison

I find more interesting that he apparently spent his young adult years meditating in India.

>>13394972
>the only unmartyred apostle of Christ's own revelation, which he wrote in exile for being literally too good of a Christian is heretical
ok bud. get out of here

>>13392251
I'm anti-Christianity where I consider it to be nonsense, and am a non-dualist rather than a theist or otherwise, but I try not to hold inherent biases, and can therefore say that I find the Shroud of Turin a very interesting document. I haven't researched it too much, but from the outset it seems very fascinating, Even if it does evidence the resurrection of a man corresponding to Christ, it still doesn't prove the words of the Gospels to belong to him, or if they do, that they are intrinsically true. I still remain anti-Christianity regarding everything else about it, but I am completely able to admit that the Shroud is a very interesting document and I find it very difficult to believe that anyone in history could forge X-RAY DETAILS prior to the X-rays invention.

Unfortunately, people are tribal by nature, so you either have the atheists who reject something in favor of Christianity or the Christians who accept everything which supports their ideology, and so few positions like mine are found, The acceptance that some miraculous things could be true, and others not. It still doesn't prove the rest of the religion, nor does it make the Christians on here any less tiresome to deal with.

>>13396186
the shroud of turin is a Nordic facial profile, jesus was a middle easterner

>>13396226
It looked Middle Eastern to me personally, but regardless, how were there x-ray details on there, for example?

>>13394972
>>13395073

It is integral to the Phenomenology of Scripture that most if not all the ideas that Catholics condemn as "heresy" are actually part of the Canon they themselves sanctioned.

>It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.