/lit/ - Literature

>>12922404
Read Complete Plato, then Aristotle duh

>>12922404
well a classical education was traditionally based on ancient greece (and rome) because the basis of all western education comes from greece (more specifically the iliad). so starting with the greeks would really mean read the iliad & other poems about mythology so really reading the philosophers (that people like >>12922408 recommend) which came much much later is probably a misunderstanding of that idea

>>12922404

«THE GREEKS» BEGIN WITH THE PRESOCRATIC PHILOSOPHERS, BUT PHILOSOPHY DOES NOT BEGIN WITH «THE GREEKS».

>>12922404
Reading 50 shades of grey will teach you more useful stuff than the greeks

>>12922443
the greeks are way dirtier

>Laws is like 400 pages

>>12922416
All The Iliad would grant you is context. The ideas given in Plato and Aristotle's work can be understood independently of most cultural knowledge (to a certain extent). Though yeah, I'd agree with you that reading up on the Pre-Socratics and the mythology does help and is enjoyable in its own right.

>>12922404
it means be a pederast (fuck the greeks)

>>12922404
If you haven't read in 10 years you shouldn't "start with the Greeks"

>>12922603
Nah, Illiad and Odyssey are cited and alluded to loads of times by Plato, I'd say they're necessary for a proper understanding.

>>12922408
>>12922419
>>12922475
>>12922603
>>12922681
THIS IS A LITURATURE FORUM NOT A PHILOSOPHY FORUM
START WITH THE GREEKS MEAN HOMER HESIOD HERODOTUS THUCYDIDES XENOPHON AECHYLUS SOPHOCLES EURIPIDES ARISTOPHANES AND LYRIC POETS

>>12923106
Capslock is cruise control for cool...

>>12923106
Thank you.

You could also watch Donald Kagan's Yale lectures on ancient Greece on YouTube (to supplement not replace your reading of course)

>>12923106
Based. Herodotus is boring and pointless unless you study history.

>>12922475
Man dude, read Plato’s Laws. You are required to. It’s how you know someone isn’t a pseud. If they have done more than just read Plato’s easy shit :3

>>12922404
>>12922404
There's different interpretations on what it means to start with the greeks. The most common method presented on /lit/ is the following.
>Mythology by Edith Hamilton
>The Illiad by Homer
>The Odyssey by Homer
>The Histories by Herodotus
>The First Philosophers by Robin Waterfield (or any collection of early greek philosophy)
>Plato's Complete Works
>Aristotle's Complete Works
You don't need Mythology but it's good for background though.
If you want to be a nerd, then check out other greek authors along the way.
>Euripides
>Sophocles
>Thucydides
>Xenophon
>Aristophanes
>Hesiod

>>12923106
based

People who push for 'start with the greeks' are like the bureaucrats who made sure east asia stayed backwards by forcing confucian classics onto any education. Change my mind.

>>12922603
my point was a classical education has nothing to do with plato & aristotle. homer is the basis of all classical greek culture, and when rome conquered greece, of all roman culture too.

>>12923106

Please kill yourself you utter pleb

>>12923556
Yeah, absolutely, but in the context of philosophy (where you'll most likely hear 'start with the greeks'), Aristotle and Plato are the guys to start with.

>>12923724
true, though me personally i don't like those two. and i think starting with philosophy is a mistake anyway don't you?

>>12923757
Yes, most people should not read philosophy at all

>>12923983
i don't know why anyone would