/lit/ - Literature

>>12876322
you faggots will come up with any reason not to read a book, it's like you're fucking allergic to them

>>12876327
There really is no point to reading translated poetry though. Prose, you can still garner some meaning, but poetry’s meaning is often tied to its verse and rhythm - which is lost in translation.

>spend years learning (dead) language
>no longer into poetry
great going, op

>>12876333
it's just not true. Some of my favorite poetry is in translated from a language I don't speak

>>12876333
You can't learn every language with good poetry, there are just too many and it would take learning to beyond a native proficiency for you to understand it better than a translator who has been working at it for decades. It's better to read a translation and get something out of it than to not read at all. In fact the best solution is to read multiple translations of the same work, as different translations will show different facets of the original.

>>12876322
>he reads poetry

>>12876322
>I’d rather never read something rather than read it with a slight loss in fidelity.
You’re a fool.

I agree. It literally makes no sense

Death is like a shy doorframe
All mother ever did is put her hand on it for support
a little while
Before it, becoming lower and smaller
Turned into a photo frame
In tight support of mother

Tell me why I need to read the above poem in Mandarin to enjoy it?

If it's extremely old shit, written by the Greeks or during the renaissance, I don't give a fuck and read it anyway. Orlando Furioso was pretty good, but then again I speak a Latin language and the difference from the Latin text isn't as extreme as it'd would be from English.

>>12876348
literally how

>>12876524
it makes sense if you're studying classics or something. like if you want to read pindar in english, for example, since his poetry has a lot of info on greek mythology. but generally speaking i agree with you

>>12876322
>implying you know more than 2 languages

>>12876322
>Find a poem in its original language
>Learn the specific words used in that poem
>Now you can understand the original

Here, I solved it for you

I did this with a couple of Baudelaire's poems and it worked desu, although I have to admit I did have some basic knowledge of French beforehand

>>12876322
>Lyric
Meh. Maybe
>Epic
No dipshit

Freindly reminder that any translated poetry you read of a text over 100 years old will be better than 99% of contemporary poetry volumes

>>12876354

>You can't learn every language with good poetry

Which means you will never properly experience all good poetry.

The Japanese man who made 4channel should make a /read/ board for people who read

>>12876333
Literally all poets would disagree with you.

>>12878744
haha

>>12876322
Better than not reading poetry at all, you shithead. Some of the greatest poetry out there is written in languages you will never learn. Imbecile.

Are you claiming you never read the Iliad OP? Unless of course you speak Homeric Greek

>>12876339
How can anyone stop being into poetry!

>>12876322
Some translators are good poets. Maybe there's some mystical link that you think has been severed between the translation and the original text, but the translation might be worth reading as a poem in its own right.

>He read the illiad and odyssey and didnt have that spoken aloud to him in its original language

David Luke's translation of Faust is great and Schlegel's Shakespeare translations are supposed to be good

>>12879528

>>12876322
I liked the translations of the Nietzsche's poems in "The Gay Science"

If you refuse to read translated literature, you're a pseud and a slave to the public opinion. In your spooked out mind, the AUTHOR holds an inherently greater value than a mere "translator". This, ofcourse, is a very pseudish notion, disregarded by the true lovers of literature, who always judge literary works in separation from their creators.

>>12880464
What if the aesthetic can't be translated?

>>12876322
Lay my head down and I'm filled with thoughts of home

>>12880464
You shouldn't refuse to read but you need to know that translations are approximations of the real work. Each language works differently and a writer will be a guy who is a master of his language

I'll give an example:
In Portuguese you have the verb "ser" and "estar" both are translated as "to be" in English.

ser:
>copulative) to be (to have the given quality), especially a quality that is intrinsic or not expected to change, contrasting with estar which denotes a temporary quality
estar:
>(transitive with em or another locational preposition) to be (indicates location in space)
>(copulative) to be (denotes a transient quality; a quality expected to change)

Something is already lost even in the verb "to be"

>>12880464
Personally, I don't see why we should attribute translated poetry to the original poet instead of the translator- if it is done correctly. However it's a much greater task to deliver your message whilst adhering to meter etc. than it is to translate someone else's ideas (especially if the language being translated into doesn't have the same characteristics, e.g. meter is v different in french to english)

>>12880788
You noted a superficial difference, and failed to explain exactly what is that which is "already lost"

>>12880971
It's not superficial though. There's a lot of nuance lost.

You can translate and work around it but you'll lose the power of the original.

>eu não sou doente
>eu estou doente

If you translate this literally:
>I'm not sick
>I am sick
but that's not what it means. This means I'm not sick (chronically), I'm sick (temporarily)

sure you can translate the meaning but you can't have the nuance of the original.

I was reading the translation of Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde
and there's this part
>"If he be Mr. Hyde," he had thought, "I shall be Mr. Seek."

The translator didn't even change the names and put a footnote. To translate this he would have to change the name of Mr. Hyde which would sound ridiculous in PT. Good luck translating puns.

>>12881166
Whats wrong with footnotes?

I can read Arabic and Farsi

Don't like the style of western poetry

>>12881192
https://newrepublic.com/article/113310/vladimir-nabokov-art-translation

>>12877461
>Orlando Furioso
>Latin

>>12881255
That article was a fun read, did Nabby write any more I should read?

>>12881166
Much nuance aside from extreme examples can be approximated with different phrasing.
"eu nao sou doente" could become "I am not sickly" since ser implies a chronic quality to the point of defining a person/thing (if I remember anything from my Spanish classes).

>>12882290
Just read this https://newrepublic.com/article/113310/vladimir-nabokov-art-translation

>>12882290
This stuff is self-evident to anyone who has learned a second language. It's true even you compare indo-european languages now imagine how dramatic it is when you compare a language like Japanese to English.

>>12882414
*when you