/lit/ - Literature

>>12404900
I swear to god, the election of Trump did something to the American psyche. There's no other explanation how fucking Noam Chomsky of all people could start acting like a neocon.

>>12404950
I can think of a reason.

>>12404953
Lay it on us

ba'ath is glorious mohammedan neo-corporatism neo-fascism

(((cho-cho))) wishes to subvert the auncient way of imhotepic-trismegistian ceremonial-alchemic platonist-magic republicanism-aristokratia

he is against the aesthetic-magic build-up of our souls itself

he is against joy & wonder

>>12404900
but yeah, gotta leave vietnam

Leave Vietnam for the commies' sake, but stay in Syria to fend off the Fashies

retard take

>>12405029

corporatism is just a type of proto-socialism id est a type of socialism which actually works

>>12405005
>>12405029
>right wingers seriously think Assad is some neo-hitler and anti-imperialism is fascist

>>12405035
I do recognize the horseshoe

>>12405036

>amalgamation of religious-irrational & auncient corporatist-aeconomic ideals
>not crypto-fascist

>>12404950
BECAUSE HE'S A KIKE

Reminder that he held this position months before Trump pulled out. It isn't some reactionary position.

>>12405059

ba'ath is not reactionary nor is its negation

both tradicalism & anarchy are beyond thought

but the difference is the tradical replaces thought with ceremonial witchcraft & auncient aeconomic ideals whereas the anarch replaces it with nothing

>>12404989
Because he's a communist who wants the US to be the millitary patron of his pet communist faction, the YPG, while they establish a Stalinist statelet in Kurdish Syria. Without the US their enclave is overrun by Turkey and Assad. He's not a pacifist, he supports war for red causes, his anti-war arguments are tactical, not universal. War is moral if it serves communist causes, immoral if it does not. Chomsky has always been a low-brow partisan, see his apologetics for the Khmer Rogue.

>Defend the Kurds.
>Reject behaviorism.
>Stop being racist.
>Stop listening to Zizek.

>>12405108
>>Reject behaviorism.
You act like that's bad. We've moved beyond treating the brain as a black box.

>>12404950
he just makes a living of being a contrarian

>>12405036
Second biggest party in Syria is the Syrian Social Nationalist Party. Pic related is their flag. Assad isn't neo-Hitler but Syria is the closest thing apart from Ukrainian larpers right now

>>12405210
>Second biggest party in Syria is the Syrian Social Nationalist Party
What's their tax plan?

>>12405108
Behaviourists are among the most vile scum of the XX century

>>12405222
Ask Russia for gibs probably

>>12404900
keeping 3 thousand troops there to defend kurds (our allies) from erdogen seems like a good idea
nobody is saying anything about invasion

>>12405108
I agree with all of that.

>>12405260
YPG are a genocidal communist clique comparable to the Khmer Rogue, another group Chomsky suppoerted.

>>12405260
Nah, we should be helping our Turkish allies seize and maintain control of the so-called "kurddistan." Anarchists should be denied autonomy ad a matter of policy. Anarchists ally only with themselves; they're not trustworthy.

>>12405260
"The Kurds" don't even exist, it's a western imperialistic fantasy.

>>12404900
>i am an anarchist
>people should pay more taxes
chumpsky has always been a fucking hack

Gore Vidal became somewhat of a nationalist towards the end of his life.

Hitchens became an imperialist.

Maybe if we're lucky Joe Rogan will become an incel.

>>12405260
The Kurds are our guys in the middle east

We need to help the Kurds, big guy. Turkey would not dare attack a US solider - they think it's far more sporting to get the Iranians to do it.

>>12405353
>Allies

>>12405475
He is a tax dodger.

>>12405283
>>12405353
>>12405386
Kurds have been targeted for ethnic cleansing by multiple polities. In return, they've formed pluriethnic militias. They don't even have a nation-state as core demand - they've shown themselves open to federal or confederal political solutions. They aren't purging any ethnic or economic group, regardless of the redscare-mongering. By most accounts, they are the faction in the conflict with the cleanest sheet.

>>12404900
What he said would be the perfect excuse to invade and stay everywhere forever.
>leave Vietnam? No way, we need to protect our allies
>end the Pancho Villa Expedition? What about our allies?
>keep the boys in Nicaragua because our friends from Bluefields need protection

>>12404900
Holy shit why do people keep strawmaning him??

>>12405568
He has rabbid fanboys. Guaranteed (you)s.

>>12405560
cringe and bluepilled as fuck

>>12405560
YPG are genociding Assyrian Christians for starters
http://www.assyriatv.org/?s=ypg

>>12404950
>There's no other explanation how fucking Noam Chomsky of all people could start acting like a neocon.

truly a (((mystery))) for the ages

>>12405560
Any people willing to embrace anarchism deserves to be targeted. That they measure better than anyone else by our post-war moral metrics just shows the flaws in our thinking.

>>12405560
>They aren't purging any ethnic or economic group
The fuck? they literally took over a Arab city, removed the democratically elected government and put Kurds in positions of power and ghettoised the Arabs.

>>12405669
>(((mystery)))
What did he mean by this?

>>12405531
Turkey is literally in the NATO you fucking retard.

>>12405814
Inb4 some inane nato imperialism bs

>>12405847
Anti-imperialism is an inane position.

>>12405502
Vidal just became increasingly bitter as he aged. I think he even wrote an article sympathetic to McVeigh. Hitchens got messed up by 9/11. Same thing happened to Frank Miller.

Chomsky just wants the US military to provide support for his anarchist pals. He hasn’t really changed.

>>12405237
You won't feel that way once you're corrected.

>>12405893
t. Insane person

>>12405916
>he even wrote an article sympathetic to McVeigh

see here:
http://gen.lib.rus.ec/book/index.php?md5=FBCC8E88AD05557DE595231B2E5F2C54

>>12405690
>That they measure better than anyone else by our post-war moral metrics just shows the flaws in our thinking.
yes, but we don't get to choose where we were mistaken.

>>12405916
>Vidal just became increasingly bitter as he aged
He was always like that, the guy was a self-hating hypocrite whose entire shtick was inspired by fascist sympathizer Charles Coughlin.

>>12405919
based evil behaviourist.

>>12405916
this guy gets it. the dream of the guy is anarcho-syndicalism, so the closest he gets is YPG. he is right by advocating violence if it's the only way.

it's like me and futa, i'd go to war if there was a way for it to exist truly feminine penis. but alas there isn't, girltrans doesn't count.

>>12404950
Yeah...
(((How))) could it be???

>>12405046
>>12405669
>>12406063
He's just a commie, guys. Otherwise he's on our side. He let the goyims know and they haven't let him on (((mainstream media))) since.

>>12406063
>>12406327
Guys, is anyone else seeing these typos?

>>12405095
>War is moral if it serves communist causes, immoral if it does not.
Not his opinion, he oppsed the Soviet Union invading Afghnistan

>>12404900
Invade the world
America is the only state at the current moment capable of implementing a global takeover in favor of freer trade, human rights, and sustainability.
Gotta have a 1wg to turn away from global warming, I'd way rather it was the USA than china or russia and it's going to be one of them.

>>12405814
And? Erdogan's policies are in fundamental opposition to USAs, to the point where future Turkish membership has been questioned

>>12406403
yeah man i totally believe america has the world's best interests in mind. is there perhaps an organization more supportive of human rights than the CIA? i think not

>>12406506
It's not even good but it's better than any alternative and I'm not going to risk the species over some cynical undergrad's complaints

>>12404950
Everyone on either side is acting more schizophrenic than I have ever seen. I think this is the traumatic turning point in American history, and I am collecting enough money to leave the country before shit hits the fan.

>>12405095
>Because he's a communist
Stopped reading

>>12406559
The differences between the various leftist factions amount to little more than semantics to those outside their bubble.

>>12404900
He has so many point right about corporate control that it's almost like it's satire he would have this position. Does he give any good reasons?

>>12406521
Me too brother. Only hard part is deciding northern europe or australia

>>12406403
>a global takeover
>in favor of freer trade, human rights, and sustainability
Do you sincerely believe that?
>Russia
>capable of taking over something
You consumed too much american propaganda. At this point even reading /pol/ will be an improvement for you.

>>12406521
The left have been acting like McCarthy and Mussolini have been hiding behind every corner for decades. The only difference is that they are now allowed to commit violence with impunity.

>Noam Chomsky has long been one of the great obfuscators of AIPAC and the existence of Zionist power over US Middle East policy. One of his most blatant examples of cover-up occurred during the AIPAC conference in early June 2008. In answer to a question on what it would take to change US unconditional support for Israel, Chomsky ignored the servility of US Presidential candidates to Israel and the AIPAC at the AIPAC conference; Congressional approval of AIPAC authored sanctions resolutions and their implementation by Treasury Department Under-Secretary Levey; the role of the ZPC in shaping media demonizing of Iran, Palestine, Hezbollah and Syria. Instead Chomsky engages in vacuous circumlocution. With reference to US support for Israel , he claims, “We have to consider the sources of support.

>The corporate sector in the US , which dominates policy formation, appears to be quite satisfied with the current situation. One indication is the increasing flow of investment to Israel by Intel, Hewlett-Packard, Microsoft and other leading elements of the high tech economy. Military and intelligence relations remain very strong. Since 1967, US intellectuals have had a virtual love affair with Israel , for reasons that relate more to the US than to Israel , in my opinion. That strongly affects portrayal of events and history in media and journals.”

>Chomsky deliberately omits the elementary step of actually looking at the process of ‘policy formation’ and noting the role of the AIPAC lobby in shaping US Middle Eastern policy, a point noted by every major expert, Congressional staffer and observer on and off the scene. He mentions ‘the corporate sector’, a vague entity without mentioning how the Zionist lobby has successfully blocked the major oil companies from investing billions in Iran and who undermined US investment agreements with pre-war Iraq. None of the high tech investors he cites has ever lobbied to shape US policy in the Middle East, least of all pressured the US to support Israeli occupation and eviction of Palestinians, the invasion of Lebanon, its military attack of Syria.

>To suggest that Micro-Soft’s Bill Gates has been lobbying for Israel , as Chomsky does, is the height of silliness. But the Presidents of the 52 Major Jewish Organizations in America have. No conference organized by high-tech companies have ever drawn 65% of the members of Congress and the Senate and all major Presidential candidates to pledge their allegiance to their corporate interests in Israel. But the AIPAC conference in June drew a huge majority of Congress members and McCain, Obama and Clinton who pledged their unconditional support for Israel ’s policies and interests.

>>12406652
Good point, russia is incompetent. I was spitballing other potential candidates for hegemony but yeah Russia's out of the question.
I don't consume any american propaganda lmao.
Yeah I do sincerely believe we need a sort of UN with martial powers and a monopoly of force to wrench us out of our technological and cultural plateau and increase human efficiency to the point that we can prevent our own extinction. Even if it's not global warming eventually it will be something so we'd better get moving fast. It's the only justification but also a completely acceptable one.

>>12406686

>Chomsky’s claim that the US has a love affair with Israel omits the systematic repression by pro-Israel and mostly Jewish professors of any critics of Israel , including the firing, smearing and censorship of critical fellow academics. What makes Chomsky’s simple-minded and blatant cover up of Zion-power in shaping US policy so grotesque is that it occurs at a time when it is at its highest point of power – when AIPAC has presidential candidates publicly swearing unconditional support to Israel at its major conference in Washington even as two top officials of AIPAC have been indicted for espionage for Israel.

>Chomsky, Moyers and Powers (and a host of liberal critics of US threats to bomb Iran ) ignore the power of US Zionists backing of Israel ’s overt war exercises and naked threats to bomb Iran . By covering up the role of the ZPC, who are the principle Congressional and Presidential backers of sanctions, embargo and war, the liberal critics undermine our efforts to prevent a catastrophic war.

>Intellectuals silently complicit with the main purveyors of war for Israel are abdicating their responsibility to speak truth to power – in this case Zionist power. At some point intellectual abdication becomes co-responsibility for a Middle East catastrophe. In the face of the complicity of our political leaders and their Zionist mentors in pursuit of Israel ’s apocalyptic war strategy toward Iran , the American public becomes of utmost relevance (contrary to Chomsky). To argue otherwise is to become complicit with the great crimes committed in our names, by leaders and ideologues with foreign allegiances.

>To continue to masquerade as ‘war critics’ while ignoring the central role of the Zionist Power Configuration makes pundits like Chomsky, Moyers and Powers and their acolytes irrelevant to the anti-war struggle. They are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

>>12406521
>>12406640
Y'all fucking cowards, I hope you are stabbed by Muslims in your chosen shithole

>>12406687
>I do sincerely believe we need a sort of UN with martial powers and a monopoly of force to wrench us out of our technological and cultural plateau and increase human efficiency to the point that we can prevent our own extinction.
This may be true but still if someone's taking over the world and gives this justification, I'll regard him as lying because he most likely doesn't give a shit about saving anything or anyone. No one that idealistic reaches the higher echelons of politics and political power, not in democratic countries, anyway. So if they try to take over my country I'd fight them to death.

>>12405222
Kek, I would love to live in a world where questions as basic and as direct as these could be unilaterally posed to those in power and they could be expected to answer them.

>>12406470
>questioned
Internet bloggers and """pundits""" are of zero relevance to the real world.

>>12406731
OK. You will die. Big deal.

>>12405036
>muh neo hitler
Jesus fucking Christ, all I'm asking is that my country doesn't invade other countries for Israel. That's all I want. Assad could be shitting on women and children, say like the oil scions of Saudi Arabia and I couldn't give less of a fuck.

>>12406864
Yeah but so will you

>>12406704
Fuck you, America doesn't give a fuck about me. I don't have to do shit for them.
Culture wars are coming back in a big way, and have a lot of sway on individual experiences in America this time.
So on one side I have a bunch of SJW tryhard kids and their creepy boomer mentors trying to remove me from any position of power or opportunity and who cheer at any mistake or failure of mine as if it was somehow proof that I don't deserve anything good in my life because of history, even though my ancestors got to the US three generations ago and didn't participate in any of the shit these people complain about, and in fact my entire family just barely managed to pull themselves out of the poverty/abuse cycle with my own parents, making me and my siblings the first people who actually had the opportunity to enter the middle class JUST IN TIME for everyone to decide we didn't earn or deserve it and should have the material benefits taken away from us.
And on the other side I've got a bunch of y'all quaeda low country hill folk with an obsession with right wing identity politics who think that they embody some kind of traditional masculinity even though they're more vain and gay than anyone. And they probably want to kill me too because I'm educated and doing pretty well for myself in a big city on the west coast.
So I'm going to make like my great great grandpappy and get the fuck out, hopefully my children won't have to deal with this bullshit anyway.
Obviously I'm not leaving at this very moment but as soon as one of these factions wins over the other I'm out. I don't care about identity politics or nationalism, I want to take care of mine, achieve my full potential, and have some money on the side for trips and good living. Any action I can take towards that goal I will take. Suck my fat white circumcised dick.

>>12406873
Yeah.

>>12406902
oh it's just another rootless cosmopolitan, please do leave so the people who care about this country can fix it. You're the wandering snip dick leech, going from country to country because he's had a rough time.

>>12406902
Praise be
May our happy families meet one day

>>12406925
cringe

>>12406925
lmao

>>12406704
America is not a land of belonging; nobody 'belongs' in America. This land hates us, we hate each other. It is all reaching its boiling point, where the people and structures are cooked alive. This land doesn't want us here anymore.

>>12406979
This post is poetry, it resonates as true despite logically knowing it's just nonsense.
Books for this feel? Maybe some Stegner?

>>12404900
>>12404950
>the one good thing the American military has done in about 60 years is defend the YPG from Turky
>dude only Trump derangement system would you make you support this
The arrogance of you fucking kids is astounding. Yeah Noam Chomsky is just saying this because he totally hates Trump yo. Not because the Kurdish survival in the path of Turkish lead genocide attempts are something Chomsky has been advocating against since the late 1960s, but because he gives such a big fuck about Trump. Also with the YPG gone Israel becomes the only beacon of democracy in the middle east, actually adding to the US/Israel ideological power.

>The few US Troops in the area are deterrant to a Turkish assault that could be mudrerous and destructive. Since I don't enjoy seeing Kurds massacred once again, the way they are being massacred right now in Southwest Turkey, I think it makes sense to keep these small forces as a deterrent. There is no other potential deterrent. The goal should be holding action until, with luck, some diplomatic procedure can lead to the least worst outcome. I don't think there is an ideal endgame. Any likely outcome I can think of is ugly.
>Yes, logical fallacies should be rooted out, and the anti-imperialist doesn't stop being a human being, one who recognize that generally valid principals can't be applied mechanically without considering circumstances.
He doesn't care about Trump, he cared about stopping Erdogan from committing genocide (who was clearly halted just by the presence of the US in the region). If you're still bothered by this logic, than I can only imagine you still have Bush derangement syndrome, and it's shows what he really did the to American psyche that people continue to suffer from it.
>https://en.annahar.com/article/750141-turkey-calls-on-us-troop-withdrawal-from-manbij
>https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/25/politics/us-troops-turkey-kurds-trump-erdogan/index.html

>>12404900
>Remaining in Syria to prevent a terrible outcome is invasion
Iraq is barely a few years ago...

>>12407069
It seems the US is the only thing standing in the way of civilization triumphing over savagery. We are truly a disgusting nation, but I guess that should be obvious from the fact that we let Goldman’s bones defile our land.

>>12407069
what are you on, kurds basically got erdogan into power
peshmerge are basically sucking erdogans dick as we speak
ypg and pkk having a monopoly on part of the syrian kurdish community currently doesnt mean shit

Still isn't as bad as when commies were defending Nike's child slavery factories and magically dissolving glue.