/lit/ - Literature

The heavily left establishment in media don't even want to acknowledge that half of that stuff even exists, let alone deserves analysis.

It's us lot that'll have to do it.

>>12380195
The Children Of Men

>>12380195

How come we don't have our own Houellebecq? I feel like a lot of modern British life could use someone with his keen observation but I guess the closest thing we've got is Irvine Welsh. Also I was wondering how Deanos never realized they are a meme in the same way Basedboys caught on? That shows how fucked we are, at least Basedboys took the satire lightly and made fun of themselves in good spirit.

>>12380212

What is a Deano? I'm English and I'm sure I'll know the kind of person it refers to but just don't know the terminology.

>>12380195
Something by Dalrymple, perhaps.

>>12380223
The sort of person who hums Chelsea Dagger while playing fifa with Smithie and the Jonesmeister

>>12380223

Deanos are the anti-Basedboys. Instead of Branding themselves with Capeshit they put on a false sense of masculinity, everything they buy is on credit so they don't actually own anything they purchase putting them much further into debt, they don't care about literature or books in general and just drown in endless reality TV and celebrity gossip trying to imitate their lifestyles knowing on the inside they'll never have a life like they do. The thing that separates Deanos from anons is that Deanos have zero sense of community or camaraderie with people he shares his interest with so everything is incredibly hollow to them.

>>12380223
>>12380242

A better explanation would basically be like a Chav except they have ten more IQ points compared to the typically Chav that was prominent last decade. They aren't really traditional working class anymore but they think they are better than those below them while ironically despising the wealthy and elite while imitating a false sense of poshness on social media. They typically go on holiday to trashy places like the worst parts of Spain(costa del sol, Ibiza, Mallorca),or Greece(Kavos). Deano doesn't care about religion since it is for nerds and benders but when Christmas rolls around they suddenly become good loving Christians.

Customer reviews for remote controlled wearable vibrators

>>12380237
>>12380242

Oh right, that guy on the fruit machine at his daughters birthday party at the local.

>>12380266

I wonder if Deano is an exclusive thing to modern Britain and our social mobility and housing problems but it makes me curious if other countries have their own equivalents.

>>12380195
What exactly are deanos and deanoboxes?

>>12380312

See

>>12380262
>>12380242

I should also mention that Deano is that type of person who would make fun of anons for reading in general or reading stuff like manga, comics, fantasy like ASOIAF or Harry Potter before they became incredibly popular but as soon as they have popular blockbuster movie adaptation or TV series they'll instantly pretend to have liked it all along while treating it as their religion but will forget about it the moment the series wraps up and move onto the next trend. Basically you see all that Harry Potter related furniture crap and clothing you see in stores like Ikea? Deano buys that.

>>12380212
Joe Stretch was described as a "British Houellebecq" when he published his first novel Friction a few years ago. I've read about half of it, but didn't really take to it. An Anon in the thread yesterday kindly recommended Nick Hornby's work, so I may check that out.

>>12380204
>The heavily left establishment in media don't even want to acknowledge that half of that stuff even exists
The tories are not particularly concerned either

>>12380262
>Greece(Kavos)
Holy fuck, I remember that place. It was an outright dystopia when I saw it a few years ago. It made me feel better living in my Eastern European slav shithole--at least I don't have to live in a place that was once great and is now rotting from the inside out (I don't mean modern Greece--although the definition may apply--I mean the western world).

>>12380242
>>12380262
>>12380318
>has a lot of loans
>"cultural Christian"
>peacocks on social media
>goes to cheap holiday resorts
>dislikes nerd shit unless it's cool to like it
You're describing about 70% of the Western population, I don't get this meme.

>>12380223
>>12380262
Deano is a reformed Chav, a self-described entrepreneur who works as a team leader in a call center or is head of marketing at a regional events company. He wears tight-fitted shirt, oversized shades, "binges" on Love Island and TOWIE, will have paid off his white BMW in about 10 years, and the mortgage to his tiny redbrick newbuild Deanobox in about 50 years. He's the provincial Loadsamoney, an aspiring Jordan Belfort whose "fave" things in life include his girlfriend Shaz, his furbabies, his designer tracksuits, and the annual holidays to Greece or Spain - often with "the lads" in tow. While the Chav was hostile to society and the economic environment which had condemned it to unemployment etc, Deano is very much an apologist for the status quo, a kind of amoral 30-year-old boomer who thrives in the contemporary economy where self-style entrepreneurialism, existential branding, and showcasing one's ability to keep up with consumer trends dictated by social media and reality TV. He loves England's football team even though it's full of wogs. He has no time for "wasters, complainers or fannies" because in the hyper-competitive socio-economic atmosphere of 2019 Britain, he has come out on top (in the narrow context of his immediate working class environment). While his Chav predecessor would have got drunk on White Lightning and tucked into a kebab on a Friday night while listening to jungle music on his mobile in the park, Deano instead posts instagram selfies of himself tucking into a lavish meal at Nando's with his Kardashian-esque girlfriend, getting drunk and heading to "the bar" to listen to a spotify playlist of "chillaxing summer beats". Nothing will bring the Deano down or draw him to anger. His hobbies include seshes at the gym, learning to trade FX in his spare room, heading to the local bar which once featured in a popular reality TV show, saving up for the trip to Zakynthos, wanking to Fake Taxi Driver, playing with the furbabies, and watching Chelsea draw 0-0 at home to Dinamo Brest.

>>12380195
Same question about life in general in the West. Does où-est-le-bec only cover France? What live in the bastion of the free world, the US of A?

Money by Martin amis

>>12380360
Nice. Books that read like this?

>>12380375
My diary desu

>>12380195
1984

>>12380361
*What about life in the

>>12380375

We should get together and form a group tp write a book about this kind of culture. This could be our next Tundra or Hypersphere.

>>12380360
I'm genuinely tempted to become a deano

>>12380387
>>12380361
Houellebecq only covers France, yes, but much of his work is applicable to other European nations. I think Britain, while suffering from the same kind of malaise as France, requires someone to write about it from within the culture however. Houellebecq's dystopian cityscape, where white office workers are afraid to leave their offices at night because the blacks and arabs have decimated the local area, is somewhat applicable to Britain, though it's more the case here that the Pakis etc have basically taken over without having much to do with the White Brits, outside of child grooming. Maybe it's because France imported people from Africa etc, who are typically more violent than Pakistanis etc, but it's a different landscape nonetheless IMO. His talk about the destruction of the family and local community is also very brutal, and in Britain I think these subjects would need to be dealt with in a less heavy-handed way, as family and community aren't as atomised as they are in France. The tone, essentially, needs to be different for a British writer, as France has a long legacy of philosophical novels which throw around quite expansive sociological themes and assertions, while Britain lacks that history and tends to focus more on class differences, on a local, familial and romantic level, with wider themes coming into play with class difference as the central focus. The working class novels of the 195s & 60s (Billy Liar, Saturday Night Sunday Morning, Room at the Top, Love on the Dole) are relatively modern examples of British writers introducing sociological analysis - popular with Houellebecq - into their works while appealing to the British reading public.

>>12380390
Seriously, I want to read that's just like OP and these three posts:
>>12380242
>>12380262
>>12380360

>>12380375
White City Blue

>>12380390
Collective books are a waste of time. It's a great idea for maybe two days, but people lost interest and the whole thing goes to waste. Consistent, prolonged focus from a single individual on his work is what produces an interesting work of literature, added to that his personal resentments and life experiences. I do believe there is room for some kind of outlet - if only a general on /lit/ - for various literary-orientated Anons to try and "outdo" one another in articulating contemporary life in whatever manner they please.

For example, a "Lovecraftian" response to contemporary British life may be written thusly:

https://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/198621129/#198628465

Or one could write in a picaresque manner similar to Confederacy of Dunces, or a gritty realistic manner, or in a detached sociological-analytical manner, or by means of writing a highly personal and emotive story similar to Hunger or White Nights, etc.

>>12380212
What is Irvin Welsh actually doing nowadays, because the whole thread kinda reminds me of the two monologue from trainspotting and it's somewhat underrated sequel:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=RCxgqHqakXc
https://youtube.com/watch?v=PgsfVJMWL0E

>>12380195
No books, this feel can only be captured by your local community facebook page and your local police's social media filled with boomers demanding shoplifters be put to death and nonces be bummed to death in prison

>>12380406
Thanks for your thoughts.
>The working class novels of the 195s & 60s (Billy Liar, Saturday Night Sunday Morning, Room at the Top, Love on the Dole)
I haven't even heard about any of those. I've read a couple of novels by John Hawkes and a couple by B.S. Johnson: would these come close to the works you're referring? I also have some books by Ann Quin and Christine Rose-Brooks lying around which I don't know anything about, except that they were written during that time.

>>12380427
Trainspotting was a massive hit and for good reason, as it came out all guns blazing and pretty much narrated the birth of the Deano, that is the reformed Chav. I've read a bit of his other books, but they tend to be too overblown for my liking, dwell too much on the sordid aspects of life without factoring in the quaint, the mundane, etc. I should give his other books a go though, and Welsh himself is part of a legacy of Scots writers who attempted to capture their society at the time, e.g. Not Not While The Giro

The British comedy "White Gold" captures the essence of the Deano who works in sales. Despite being set in the 1980s it's still sort of accurate, he doesn't care about people he just wants to make money in order to satisfy his ego.

https://youtu.be/EJsaHrrmFc8

>>12380360
There is no escape

>be me yesterday
>go to graduate assessment centre in London for prestigious job
>explore London after getting there in the morning
>walk through University of London area and see people in the primes of their lives
>every young person's genetics seemed better than ever like humanity is evolving in real-time and leaving my already doomed generics behind; even many women were almost as tall as me (Br
>go to British museum to feel sad
>walk through hip Old Street and feel sad at my wasted 20s
>get to assessment centre at 3 pm
>have to sit with other candidates, who are zoomers who talked about how much they travel etc while I'm 28
>all four girls were normiethots and one was an off the charts GIGA-Stacey; being in their presence depressed me
>first task is to write a report
>found it easy (they would never risk eliminating normies through something too hard)
>second task required me to give a presentation and answer easy questions
>probably did badly because I'm not high energy; I'm an ugly beta with a non posh voice
>third task was an interview by two smug roasties who were probably younger than me
>one was in HR, the other was doing the job I was interviewing for
>was asked braindead competency questions that I stumbled through (with appropriate answers but they'll probably fail me due to some dumb shit)
>will get told result on Monday

This is just depressing. I can't pass job interviews to save my life. The only assessment centres I've passed had no interviews and just tested me with tasks.

I'm currently binging on McDonalds.

>>12380440
I've not read either of those I'm afraid, though there is a poster on /lit/ who has been spamming The Lime Twig by Hawkes for a while now. I think he's a known entity around here, for spamming Hawkes. None of the novelists I mentioned however are necessarily "experimental", although folk like Anthony Burgess take that approach and are praised for their round-about analysis of British society, albeit not through a Realist lens. Haven't heard of the two lady novelists, though I'll check them out.

I don't think Houellebecq would be described as "experimental", although he does include science fiction in his work. He is described as being a "depressive realist", so perhaps JG Ballard is someone you may enjoy reading who is not strictly a realist but still adheres to traditional plot devices etc.

>>12380440
>Christine Rose-Brooks
Sorry, that's Christine Brook-Rose.

>>12380456
It's very similar to the Loadsamoney character introduced by Harry Enfield too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXuRvthgn4U

>>12380212
>Houellebecq
Not saying he'd be Irvine Welsh, but they'd likely be a Scot desu

>>12380483
What's refreshing about H thought is that he is willing to state his sociological observations and general beliefs in a straightforward, articulate manner, while Welsh et al. tend to dress theirs up in a tracksuit and articulate it in local parlance, often having to patronize the initial critique as it would sound unrealistic if spoken in context.

>>12380433
dailymail comments section

>>12380495
>>12380433
I find the comments sections of the national papers in general to be great reading. Most of the time The Guardian's articles have comments sections full of people calling the writer a twat. It's quite uplifting to see.

>>12380459
This is a copy and paste right, with "yesterday" added?

Londonfrog is pretty kino, though he is obviously too far gone mentally.

>>12380474
>Anthony Burgess
>Ballard
Thanks, noted. I also got Welsh and Hornby as recommendations from yesterday's thread. I basically--at times, when I feel bitter myself--enjoy reading stuff in the tone of the posts above, angry and bitter but also detached and ironic. I don't like too much realism and grittiness because it comes across to me as whining; I like a light, satirical tone over everything, as if it wasn't really that big of a deal after all. It stings harder that way. That's pretty much an Anglo thing, isn't it? Frenchies don't have the nerves for it, while Slavs tend to plunge all the way over into the absurd.

>>12380474
Oh, and Hawkes is great (I'm not the one shilling him) and B. S. Johnson is, I guess, a bit "experimental", he's funny and satirical and likes to play his little po-mo games, but hey, it was the fashion at the time, and has working class sensibilities, I guess.

>>12380515
That's fair enough, and there's no accounting for taste. I agree that a lot of realism is often just personal resentment expressed by means of characters presented as a means of garnering pity and shaming those perceived to be wronging them, it can be a bit cringeworthy if done with too heavy a hand, e.g. "Mr. Hardcase slammed down his copy of the Daily Mail and demanded another cup of tea from his wife, who closed her eyes in fright". Not sure if a surreal tone is necessarily Anglo, but I suppose we have less time for philosophical musings and pessimism, unless the latter is communicated in a somewhat self-effacing, grimly comedic tone. The French are just big on theory, while Britain is more colloquial and prefer working from a small point outwards into a larger thesis, rather than a large thesis which is refined to a single story. Plenty of Russian novels are grimly realist, though any sizeable nation of course has a diversity of cultural expression, with Dostoevsky being a somewhat gritty realist (much loved by Houellebecq, and even psychological surrealists like Kafka), while Roadside Picnic or The Life of Insects are Russian books which do a similar thing by surreal means.

Even if he only cover France, Houellebecq can be read by every western country. The hollow morality, the auto-pilot mode, the moral and urban decay, and the overall fatigue don't apply to France only.

>>12380545
Thanks for the rec, I will definitely try to check out some Hawkes books in the future.

>>12380557

I think what makes Houellebecq relatable is that that he writes about very first world problems.

>>12380557
True, it's just a question of how a British author might do a similar thing, i.e. how their work would differ stylistically etc. French sociological-philosophical writing doesn't really have a counterpart in Britain as far as I know. Houellebecq is an heir to Camus et al.

>>12380474
And from skimming what I have by those two lady novelists it looks like they're chock full of the same po-mo shenanigans. I'm not sure if there's any biting social satire and such. Anyway, that's off topic, so I'll work on my recs. Thanks.

>>12380459
>graduate assessment centre
Fucking hate everything about them.
Told it's an 'employer's market', which in reality means they get to take the absolute piss - drag the 'application process' out over a couple of months and have a couple hundred graduates jump through a series of abitrary hoops just to land a standard £20k starting salary job working 9-5 like everybody else. The quality of the degree you've got is meaningless as well, I went to a solid uni yet lumped in with everyone else who only needed 3 D's/UCAS points at A-level to get into their course.

>>12380212
>I guess the closest thing we've got is Irvine Welsh

Welsh's vision of Scotland (and England) is pretty optimistic compared to Houellebecq's vision of France.

>>12380580
I find it surreal to think that, at one point in time, employers were desperate for workers or at least did their best to find and retain employees. Hearing from relatives about being able to quit a job one day and find new work the next is just unimaginable.

>>12380583

When employers today talk about a shortage, they mean 10 applications per place. And I read this about a teacher "shortage", which needs particular qualifications

>>12380583
>second job was being a server at Red Lobster
>one of the few males on staff
>fat roastie boss would squeeze my arms and make inappropriate comments constantly
>let her do it because too afraid of getting fired
>mfw she fired me anyway after I asked for a day off

>>12380591
Have you read Last Night at the Lobster?

>>12380582

Kind of like comparing Zola to Balzac

>>12380580
>£20k starting salary

I hope that’s not in London

>>12380595
No. I prefer not to think of Red Lobster anymore.

What's the literary equivalent to this tweet and its responses lads?

https://twitter.com/DeanoWeekender/status/1081988485387567104

>>12380580
>I went to a solid uni
Unless you went to Oxbridge, you're a literal nobody.

1984

>>12380602
>I hope that’s not in London

it's manageable with a few somalian roommates ;)

>>12380602
I'm in London and was on £20k for about a year and a half before going up to £22k. I have a meme degree however so can't complain.

>>12380583
Yeah, my dad tells me of times where things at least made sense.
You had decent trial periods, of a month, and if they couldn't keep you on they'd pay you within the week and you could find work elsewhere easily. Now you'll be lucky to hear back from an application anywhere within a month, if at all, whilst you're still stuck in the meantime without any work.
Based on what my grandparents/parents have said about how things were in regards to work it doesn't seem like things have improved but instead regressed.

>>12380602
Yep. That's the thing, the process is still the same regardless of whether you're applying for an actual decent quality graduate scheme or something that will do.

>>12380628
Definitely, have heard the same story. My mother and step-father both said they wouldn't bring kids into today's world, and are glad they are on their way out rather than on their way in. Maybe they're just being dumb boomers but I can't help but agree. None of my mates from school, all around 27 years old now, have any kids or are married. Still slaving away in retail etc, living with their parents etc.

>>12380625
welp.

in germany, typical starting salaries with meme degrees are around 30k euro (27k britcoins) and with "hard" degrees 40-52k euro (26-47k britcoins). used to be less in pounds before brexit.

consider that we have much higher income tax tho. earning 4k per month makes you take home only 2400

>>12380651
Is that in somewhere like Berlin, or smaller towns and cities?

Germany seems comfy in the sense that it has various cities of relatively equal size and economic importance, whereas in Britain it's basically London and then the dystopic outer regions where work is sparse.

>>12380641
>My mother and step-father both said they wouldn't bring kids into today's world, and are glad they are on their way out rather than on their way in. Maybe they're just being dumb boomers but I can't help but agree
My father has said the same thing to me virtually every time i've gone back home to see him for the last couple of years, he says he felt like things had peaked in the early 00's and says he's still in disbelief at the rate in which things are seemingly declining. He can't believe how much pressure the younger generations are being put under, and the lack of any meaningful 'good' news.

>>12380664
its nation-wide. far less in the east and a bit more in the industry centers like munich. berlin is neither wealthy nor expensive, its just an average german town

germany has regional disparities as well, but theyre not that great, yeah.

>>12380583
I have only ever gotten jobs through nepotism.
I straight up can't handle the wide scale rejection and humiliation that applying for jobs brings. How can i promote myself to you when everything about this makes me feel worthless?

>>12380610
Youtube comments under a music video.

>>12380664
Berlin is only good for being a student or gay leather fetishist fond of electronic music. Otherwise it's an economical and cultural shithole full of human refuse.

>>12380684
What kind of jobs?

To be fair nepotism is just a part of human nature and I don't have much against it, as if the people getting jobs were really plebs then the companies would fail surely.

>>12380698
Admissions at a university and entry level at a cloud hosting company.

>>12380709
Fair enough.

>>12380204
Someone clearly forgotten that Windrush incident

This country has been going down the fucking pot since the 80s. Since the Tory cunts decided the furthest we as a people we gonna go was post-industrial fucking depression, since Labour assumed the role of a red-flag Tory party. We're in a commercialized prison cell with wifi.

Which major european cities are still good?

>>12380840
fuck cities, cities are the problem

>>12380840
Prague and Budapest are good despitw the gangs of Deanos on stag weekends

>>12380840
I don't think any cities are good, not European, not American. They aren't centres of culture, they're hotspots where the filthy rich go to line their coffers. They're hosts for the parasites that get rich off devouring it's very heart and soul.

>>12380855
>t. resentful provincial faggot
How was that grand sow milking show last Friday?

>>12380840
Tallinn, Utrecht, Nurenberg, Kobenhavn, Oslo, Bergen, Krakow

>>12380863
Ask your mum mate, she was the star attraction.

>>12380868
Case in point.

>>12380195
What does anal sex have to do with anything tho?

>>12380867
Utrecht and Krakow are the only decent cities on that list
>Oslo, Bergen
Absolutely delusional, Norge.

>>12380875
It's now an accepted norm that young women, even in their teens, provide their anus as an optional extra while engaging in a sexual relationship. What was once reserved for a small minority of women (in, say, the 1950s) is now something that most young women feel subconsciously pressured to engage in for the sake of keeping up with their female competitors.

>>12380611
>tfw got rejected from oxbridge two months ago
I really want to die lads
I was already dreaming of it

>>12380868

love socialism
love globalism
love neoliberalism
love the estrogenizing effects of beer
love watching telly
love my asian gp
love my asian doctor
love my south east asian wife
love my son
hate working long hours at my age

simple as

>>12380204
It's really this simple, Hitchens couldn't even find a publisher for his stuff despite it selling extremely well.

>>12380886
but that means the dating market isnt as bad as incels say, if women have to provide extra services

Anyone else feel like we're reliving the early 20th century without the world wars (yet)?
>Steady loss in demographics
>Rise of extreme leftwing and rightwing parties
>Decay in the economic prowess of the population
>The overwhelming feeling of an incoming and inescapable catastrophe

>>12380195
I don’t travel to work on an overcrowded bus.

>>12380580
>that pic
It's the fucking feeling you get when you take a job you need and it's some bullshit like sales and the trainers all have on these BIG SMILES and lay out your targets, your expectations for sick leave, the customer, how it might be a good idea to refresh on this overnight, and you can see in their eyes how they're just a middle management cunt itching to be the real hard driving sales manager and can't wait to see if you can MAKE THE CUT which is just: can you fuck around in this snake pit and be enough of a gay cunt to make friends with the hot girl so you stay safe?

>>12380557
>hollow morality, the auto-pilot mode, the moral and urban decay, and the overall fatigue

You have not visited Eastern Europe apparently. It's the same meta worldview as in the West m8t, the difference being that westerners live in a globalized world with shit tone of opportunities in their own countries while in Eastern Europe it's literally shitholes surrounded by shitholes with no future because of geography

>>12380886
>It's now an accepted norm that young women, even in their teens,
Well in year 7/8 a lot of girls in my year were talking about who they sucked off or tossed off in the years above in passing conversation and showing each other dick pics, like at least a third of the girls in the year had this sort of behaviour, then started doing mkat or other drugs later on in year 10/11

>>12380888
What kind of secondary school did you go to?

>>12380900
Fuck it, I'd be willing to die for a meaningless cause.

>>12380899
Not really, it just shows that the competition for Chad is so intense that women are pulling out all the stops for the sake of getting his attention.

>>12380900
the early 20th century had large demographic surplus actually

you are only right insofar as the economic condition somewhat resembles the 1930s again

>>12380905
I got a handy in 2006 m8 when I was in grade 8. Not too far back but little kids are fucking grubs they'll fuck if they get a chance.

>>12380900
You don't think there's a world war going on right now?

If the native population of almost every city in your country is dropping by 10-20% each decade, but the overall population is growing, then you're at war lad. World War 3 is currently taking place, but the battles are being fought in maternity wards.

>>12380908
private
But I’m not even British, I really just want to vent, because I was ready to be

>>12380901
How do you get there then?

Are we ever going to get better?

>>12380229
Dalrymple is surely the greatest essayist writing in Britain today. He really gets to very core of our dysfunctional society. OP could read no one better than Dr Dalrymple

>>12380840
Belfast

>>12380904
I thought things were actually better in Eastern Europe, not in terms of opportunities but in terms of "peace of life" (less politics, less fat people, trans and all that stuff)

>>12380927
Crowded train

>>12380459
This is londonfrog, he is a foreigner and also a shitskin

Lived in/near a student area with parents until graduating uni in 2015, STEM degree. Temporary warehouse job there. Other minor part time jobs since then. Not originally from London, didn't study there. Home city population ~200k (most likely Slough). Moved to London after March 2017, hence the increased posts (some date back to 2015)
Interning a government job in an open plan office, living in a flat 20-30 minutes commute from the centre (£26k p/a wage). "a civil servant, and probably studied political science or management"
Lives an easy distance from McDonald's, Gym & Tesco where he gets more junk food.
Not his own car, belonged to his mom.
Wears glasses
Areas often visited: Hyde Park, Aldgate East, Camden town, Notting hill Gate, Shoreditch, University of London (fits with the short commute, probably less than 30 minutes as he'll return home briefly for minor things). Generally anywhere in Zone 1.
Camden most commonly visited area, after Notting Hill.
"Notting hill carnival nearby" - NHG most likely local station, but unconfirmed. If "sitting around my favourite station" means actually inside, then less likely. If it means in the general vicinity, then still possible. Shepherd's Bush? (vicinity to NHG, contains shops/cafes). Cost of living is unrealistic for 26k in these areas, but he often borrows money from parents
Regular use of both (Polish) brothels & escorts.
"Apart from having sex with prostitutes I've never done anything with girls, not even flirted. I have a normal westernised accent and grew up here but I have middle eastern parents. I'm fine with my height and all that stuff but I probably have an ugly face (it varies from 2 to 6 out of 10 depending on whether I'm looking in a mirror or taking a picture of myself etc)."

Anon speculates that he lives around Shoreditch due to income/rent levels, as well as mentions of Aldgate East. This contradicts his surprise at seeing AE when visiting, familiarity would have prevented this. Therefore maybe Ladbroke Grove/Latimer Road sort of way, in a shared flat in an ex-council block. It's possible he got very lucky with a flat in one of the ex council blocks near there. There's only a few, Nottingwood House and Winterbourne House. Matches with Tesco (express) and a nearby Gym but McDonald's is a bit of a trek from there. There is a McD and a Starbucks right by NHG.

Usual boards:
/lit/sci/biz/adv/

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>>12380905
>this sort of behaviour

No way, you're understanding the impact of the internet and Chadonomics on the sexual dating market. In my comp in Year 7 I had a similar experience to you, overhearing who got fucked on a park bench that weekend, who let one of the older boys finger them, which girls went off with some lads on the school trip to Thorpe Park etc.

But with free access to pornography, and with social media subcultures luring in tons of the usual maladjusted teens, people now are aware of a range of sexual acts (I typed them out but deleted in disgust) that were previously only dwelled upon by perverts and those who treated sex as central to their alternative lifestyles. DDLG culture for example is now a post-ironic fixture in most girls' sexual development, it's really terrible. This isn't about blurry images of some guy's dick on a Nokia flipphone, but hours upon hours of staring at Pornhub trying to work out how to please a man etc.

>>12380925
Baoarder? Either way I don't sympathize with you dumb bourgie.

ITT: First World Problems

I got a job within 3 weeks just arriving in London. Sure it may not be the best job (I work in a Hotel) in the world nor it may be the job that i studied for (PoliSci) but it's good money and i can afford a shit tone of other things once rent and expenses are covered. In reality London is only non-white in the periphery while the city center is quite well off with wealthy white people

The problem with UK is that there's too many privileged little white kids who whine and don't want to do just ANY type of job, but their special snowflake thing they've been brainwashed to believe in by their parents, peers and society from a young age.

It's quite remarkable how split UK society is when it comes to "work dignity". It's either construction for the british blue collars working class, or office shit for the british white collar vapid and hollow middle class. The rest of them is done by immigrants like me

Also rural mentality. Ever since the UK fell as a superpower there's this sense of lost collective direction. Doesn't help that the country is a literal economic and financial slave to the US either, when just a couple of decades ago it was the master

>>12380957
>when just a couple of decades ago it was the master
Surely you meant couple centuries ago.

>>12380902
For real.
I applied for a sales role and their office was like the fucking Wolf of Wall Street - it was their vendor sales day so they had companies with all their prizes laid out in the front of the office to whoever sold the most in the day and it was fucking surreal how mad it all was with people on the phones screaming as they were fucking around with the games that were there as well. My interview had to be stopped as they went out of the booth to tell everyone to shut the fuck up.
Their actual words for being rejected in the interview was that I was 'too professional and they hadn't seen my personality'. This was my second-stage interview at their offices being interviewed by the same people after having passed the first interview that was all about getting your personality across, which was hard enough having to put on a front and act like a massive smug cunt talking about how much money I want to make. Never again.

>>12380955
Nope, no boarding. I’m just from a third world country and Oxbridge was my shot at leaving to Europe.
But I’m indeed a bourgie, you’re right about that

>>12380957
I found work in a hotel after moving to London too, it was minimum wage and I was the only British person on the team. Could barely live on that money though.

>>12380970
Which country?

>>12380957
>A immigrant without any responsibilities can survive in London
Legitimate question: are immigrants like yourself unaware of the benefits afforded to you and not the natives?

>>12380962
>applied for a sales role
>reee why do they want pushy charismatic characters instead oh whiny betas who cry on 4chan

>>12380962
Where do you work now?

>>12380974
>I was the only British person on the team
>Could barely live on that money though.
He receives subsided housing, you don't.

>>12380941
>in terms of "peace of life" (less politics, less fat people, trans and all that stuff)

Yeah, i guess. But if you're not a follower of the news or any of that bullshit (they started to pop up in the past few years there too but are still small movements) you'll start to quickly realize how shit your life is without money, and that without the violence, money and illegal activities you won't get far in life there.

You just can't sit back and do a 9-5 in Eastern Europe for a living because of the shit pay, and without that you'll start to soon realize that not having trannies, politics or fat people isn't really worth it.

Why do people even care about those trends? I'm not a fan of them either and vehemently oppose them, but i just blocked myself form ever seeing them around me constantly. No social media, no stupid 21st century people ridden with anxiety that create bubbles for themselves as a cope mechanism.

Just shut the toxicity away from the internet/news and you'll deal with it more easily IRL when confronted with it

>>12380957
>wah wah why aren't British people willing to lower themselves to MY third-world standards in their own country

Fuck off.

>>12380970
>Oxbridge was my shot at leaving to Europe
You know there's a fuckton of great universities no worse than Oxbridge both in the UK and on the continent, right? Unless you were planning to study some completely worthless humanishit and just ride on the brandname of the school there's no reason not to try.

>>12380979
>you into reading
I was rejected for being too professional which was my main gripe, not for my personality. So what's your point?

>>12380981
Got a stop-gap job working in a bank. Long hours but gives me friday, saturday, sunday off.

>>12380996
>great universities on the continent
They don't even begin to compare to British universities.

>>12381003
Where abouts? Chances are you're near me if you're anywhere near Cannon Street.

>>12380916
I meant in as in the drop in demographics that followed after the Spanish flu and WWI, except those might have been better as people were still willing to have children despite that.

>>12380921
That sounds like a competition rather than a war.

>>12381007
Indeed, many of them provide better education for much less money.

>>12381008
Not in London anymore, decided it wasn't worth it and moved up norf. Some family was up in Yorkshire already so it wasn't too much of a piss-about trying to relocate temporarily whilst I was looking about.

>>12381014
It's freemarket demographics, the last stage of neoliberalism.

>>12381003
>I was rejected for being too professional
I.e. they wanted an actual sales chad instead of a back office beta.

>>12381018
Fair enough, I'd leave London tomorrow if I could find work elsewhere.

>>12380996
English is the only other languge I speak, and most good unis don’t have undergrad courses in it. Besides, uni in the UK is expensive as shit, and I wouldn’t be able to pay unless I went to Oxbridge, which is really cheap due to all the scholarships and financial assistance you can get

>>12380974

Minimum wage is shit. You could have easily found a better hotel that paid 8.50-9 per hour. I make 9 and planning to be a manager in a couple of years time which is literally the easiest thing to achieve in a Hotel because you just have to show up and do your job.

>>12380978
How's that relevant to anything? It's much harder to claim benefits when you're a couple and when you do it's just too much hassle to keep them because i actually things to do in my free time and don't want to put up with the bullshit of lying constantly so i can live off them. Also you do know you can apply for benefits as a white british person as well yeah?

And as far as i'm aware it's your own British blacks and/or middle easterners who live off the dole. You keep complaining about eastern europeans and being incredibly racist towards them, even tho we work had as shit and don't complain, while at the same time you take in every black criminal from bermuda or nigeria and happily give them your money and our money. What's up with that?

>>12380444
It's ridiculous seeing zoomers pontificate about social changes that they never experienced. The word chav barely existed when Trainspotting was new.

>>12381025
>muh alphas and betas
anon, pls.

>>12381030
Yeah, lived there most my life and it's only getting worse when I go down there. Got off the tube to see wreaths of flowers by a tree on the other side of the road where someone was stabbed to death a few days before. The norf's alright m8, cost of living is far far cheaper here.

>>12380996
>>12381017
But do they offer the same prestige that i could use to brag to my friends and family and their peers?

>>12381035
You've been consuming way to much eurofed propaganda, Poles, Hungarians. Ukrainians, etc are actually well liked here, It's mostly Romanians people are afraid of, a issue we actually share with the Romanian government who we work together with to stop the flow of criminals between both countries.

>>12381035
lmao
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqemucA0jLI

>>12381045
Hence the brand name remark.

>>12381056

>>12381052
Sorry for butting into your conversation, but I'd like to add that here in Spain we also have some issues with Romanians.
A couple of days back a mob almost lynched two of them after they caught them red handed stealing at a home. Apparently they'd been doing it for months and the police had done jackshit to stop them. They needed to call reinforcements to keep the crowd from tearing them apart. And that's just at a small village; in cities it's worse.

>>12381062
>in cities it's worse
You mean like they actually lynch the gyppos?

>>12381035
>while at the same time you take in every black criminal from bermuda or nigeria and happily give them your money and our money.
>be eastern european
>come to the UK for a better life
>get stabbed to death by these groups

Man at least you fucks arent like america, this government shut down sbit is ridicolous. I dont think this "country" will be happy until we dont have borders and were just central and south americas dumping ground. Maybe south america will have a renaissance after this happens with all their trash coming here

>>12381052
>Harlesden is literally a mini Liberia after a civil war literally half an hour from the city center

>Harrow looks like a city in the middle east where a bomb attack is ready to happen

>Dozen of other places with shit tone of sub-human-y looking people living off the dole

>Somehow romanians are the foreign threat everyone has to mobilize against

I'm not sure who's to blame for this situation, the press since they create fake images of reality, or the people that gladly consume this state of affairs and take it for granted.

>>12381056
>British police

You could have at least tried to give a better example.

>>12381066
Kek. No, actually; the gypsies form clans of up to 200 people and they start all kinds of shit. They celebrated New Year's Eve a few days ago by shooting up in the streets, and a few months ago they pulled a drive through in another city.
There's an area in my town called "the 600s" or "las seiscientas" where no one save for gypsies dare enter unless you know a seller. They tend to fuck up everything and you'll find few people who like them.

>>12381052
>>12381062
There's a shit ton of propaganda attempting to push the narrative that Britons are anti-polish, the media got their shit pushed in a while back for claiming a Polish teen was murdered for simply being polish, turned out to be a complete fabrication and the guy was attacked by Romanian gypsies for dating one of their own.

>>12381069
Isn't it usually the educated people who leave for other countries?
Hell, I'm sure that South and Central American immigrants in the US are somewhat pissed at the wave of migrants heading north since they expect them to bring the troubles they tried to escape from with them.

>>12380932
Culture is downstream from politics (as people emulate the cultural tastes of the ruling class to get ahead), and Pareto showed us that all politics is inter elite conflict. So I think things won't get better in any Western society until we get rid of our current governing class (The Brahnins, the administrative state, the Cathedral - it goes by many names) and replace it with another one. This would almost certainly require us to terminate the democratic system, as democracy selects for the sociopathic status seekers who currently rule us.

>>12381094
>the guy was attacked by Romanian gypsies for dating one of their own
Christ, what was that guy thinking? No wonder he got murdered; gypsies don't fuck around. They think of anyone who isn't a gypsy as subhuman and put there only for them to leech off from.

>>12380905
Pretty sure that's common through the ages. From what I've read on times past, the poor were humping like rabbits from that age onwards.
In fact recently there has been a decline in young people having sex

>>12381099
>democracy selects for the sociopathic status seekers
Stick to /a/, cartoon downie.

>>12381103
Stockholm syndrome, Eastern Europeans get caught by it A LOT, they read shit in the newspapers about how its good immigrant workers are willing to work 90 hours a week in piss poor conditions for less than minimum wage and start to actually believe it. Go read about the Tesco car washers in Congleton.

>>12381052
What you on about people hate the poles, it's just you can't sling racial terms at them because they're white like us

wow gj guys nice thread lots of racial hatred
u guys must really be living that good life huh

>>12380195
White Britain is one of those redpills that many have yet to swallow.
I don't know exactly how it happened, but it seems that the overall prosperity (early industrialization) and mild climate, which enabled easy mode survival, caused a chunk of the population to devolve into genetically inferior people, which in turn fuel all the degenerate lifestyles... in a liberal democratic society it all becomes a self-perpetuating machine.

>>12381180
>Hull
This could legitimately be a bizarre retelling of Romeo and Juliet.

>>12381183
classic stefan molyneux spastic take

>>12380989

>Be immigrant from poor country
>Come to rich country and save up money

>Go back home with the money you made which you can invest or live comfortably for the rest of your life without having to worry about the problems that plague the West

Boy it sure sucks to be you, when most of us don't have a another place to migrate to get away from all the bullshit.

>>12381155
Oi you mad that youre becoming a Minority in your OWN country and pakis are grooming tens of thousands of your daughters.


Dumb racist la

>>12381195

Come home, white man.

>>12381217
>moving to a country you're only reminded of when its neighbours announce eurovision tallies
yeah nah thanks

>>12381191
Not an argument.

Obviously it's all speculation, but how else would you explain it?

White Brits are falling behind intellectually and physically. For a nation of this size you'd expect at least some great athletes, but nope. At best you have some in weird sports played by a handful of countries (rugby, cricket...). Oh and Murray, I guess.

>>12381180
Based pollocks btfoing roastie

>>12381195
Nobody stops you from migrating elsewhere.

>>12381244
>food makes people dumber

>>12381217
All of this greenery can be yours to live in. It's also the city where Alexander Pushkin wrote one of his most popular poems during exile.

>>12381240
>Be a small irrelevant country
>Do nothing
>Don't get attention from anyone
>Live a peaceful life away from politics surrounded by trees and scenery

It's a shithole where the average monthly salary is around 200 quid but with prices as in Germany or France, but i don't mind. I plan on saving up and going back eventually.

I actually plan on buying an entire empty village left for dead that costs pennies for myself. There i can satisfy my autistic desire of pioneering new architectural styles for people just for fun.

>>12381244
evolution doesn't happen that fast you retard

the comparative underachievement of white british people educationally is because they're being brought up by a generation that could leave school with no qualifications and get a job regardless, once education becomes something to aspire to due to outright poverty expect that to increase

you also have to bare in mind that the only indians and chinese people who can afford to move to the uk for education are rich as fuck and brought here for the express purpose of being educated

also, the uk is incredibly successful athletically considering the size of the country, if we just use the olympics as a basic standard the uk finished inside the top 20 in medals per capita and was the only country inside that top 20 with a population in excess of 30m

>>12381265
I do apologize for shitposting but this thread just made me home sick. Why couldn't i get along with my parents lads, why couldn't i just suck up my pride and just let them get away with their bullshit towards me, at least they could have given me one of the apartments they own and i wouldn't wageslave in a far away country. Fuck.

>>12381183
>the overall prosperity (early industrialization)
and the decline following de-industrialization

being part of the first generation that is poorer than their parents is a honor

>>12381217
>>12381265
how is a pisspoor slavhole supposed to be comfy

>>12380904
central Europe (not including Germany)> western/eastern Europe

>>12380904
>shitholes surrounded by shitholes with no future because of geograph
how so
how is their geography bad

>>12381286
>Why couldn't i get along with my parents lads, why couldn't i just suck up my pride and just let them get away with their bullshit towards me, at least they could have given me one of the apartments they own and i wouldn't wageslave in a far away country. Fuck.

It's never too late to call them and apologize anon....

>>12381350
Cringe.

>>12381347
Moldavia is a romance speaking country, even though it does have a small slavic speaking minority. You just have to visit Chișinău to understand the vibe i'm talking about.

>Things are always slow
>Nobody hurrying anywhere
>Entire city is like walking through a huge garden
>Public parks with socket plugs and free wi-fi
>Really quiet for a 1mil town

In general Moldavia feels like a nomansland. You can do anything you want and feel anything you want. Nobody bothers you unless you bother them. There's no collective identity coercing you in any way, there's no functional society so to speak that imposes norms, but people are friendly and open once you get to know them. Only individual peoples and their stories. Atomized. Absolute freedom.

>>12381265
There’s an interesting point here. I also moved to the UK from Romania to study and now to work, in large part because I couldn’t do what I do (freelance camera / lighting technician for commercials and such) back home. When I left I had the feeling that Romania has issues that can’t be fixed to do with corruption in the government, lax policies, a general apathy of the populace towards getting stuff done. And indeed the first two are much better taken care of in the UK.

However, the more I’m here, the more I wonder whether I’d ever want to raise a family here. London is expensive sure, but living with my girlfriend we make enough money to have a nice flat and such, but it’s polluted and extremely overcrowded, it takes forever to get anywhere on the best of days (if the tube doesn’t break down of course), driving is pretty much out of the question considering congestion and parking problems. Given what I do I’ve been to good and bad neighbourhoods, schools, million dollar houses, shitty council estates, all kinds of places and the economic discrepancy is ridiculous. Some people live like rats, others leave £25m apartments empty for months at a time cause they’re traveling or have another place to live.

The only solution I can see is what older people I work with have done, move out into the countryside and only come to London when you really must, for work only. However I feel bad for everyone who won’t be able to get out of wageslavery (plenty of entry level jobs in London are at £20k, even £18k before taxes, and a decent flat in a decent neighbourhood can charge about £1k rent a month or more, you do the math). Unless the housing/work crisis can be solved somehow I don’t know how the current generation can have a fulfilling life in the long term.

The reality is we're never gonna live again in a world where the west, and United states in particular is ascendant in the way it was post wwii

I don't think boomers "ruined" it. I think the collapse was inevitable and unsustainable given the rise of globalization. That genie is never going back in the bottle, and the notion of a broad middle consumer class is an anomaly historically. If you have a full time job in the US you're still in the top 1% globally. Resource scarcity and climate change is only gonna make things worse, and I don't think Trump is the end game for the far right either. There is a broad swaths, both old and young, in this country that are going to firmly dig their heels in, without nsome cataclysmic catastrophe which completely reorders our way of life ( on par with WWII or greater)

>>12381398
this yadayada about globalization and resources completely ignores the fact that many issues are completely home-made

the uk chose to de-industrialize, the uk elected times and times again governments that inflated housing prices, made university education unaffordable, defunded anything but london. china didnt force you to do so

>>12381377
There are dozens of laidback green cities in Europe that also aren't full of disgusting commieblocks or financially on par with Africa. Yeah, everyone is attached to their birthplace, but there's really no reason to try and sell the worst shithole in Europe as some kind of hidden "aesthetic" gem. I mean you couldn't find a worse country if you tried, save for meme ones like Transnistria and Donbass.

>>12381408
According to that logic most European cities are poor shitholes because they're not capitals. Chișinău at least is connected to the outside world to a degree and has opportunities somewhat in case you don't want to live in total isolation.

And if you think Moldavia is bad then you haven't been to Ukraine.

>>12381379
London isn't even particularly over crowded compared to other European cities. This thread is the usual whinging from entitled Brits complaining their lives haven't been handed to them
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_Union_cities_proper_by_population_density

>>12381527
someone paid 20k despite university education and having to pay 1k for a decent apartment has the right to complain

>>12381527
The problem isn't overcrowding. The problem is that London gets an absolute fortune spent on it whilst the rest of the country gets relatively little. No other country is as economically centralised around the capital as Britain. It's insane, places outside the south east are genuinely at least one decade behind. Nevermind Cornwall and Wales that are eastern europe tier

>>12381502
moldova is pretty much on par with ukraine

>>12381502
>According to that logic most European cities are poor shitholes
Uh, what? There's no grand logic here. Moldova is a shithole and Chisinau is a pretty mediocre city even for a shithole. And yes, I have been to Ukraine and Kiev, Odessa or Lviv are all individually more exciting and vibrant than the entirety of discounter Romania, not to mention actually more well off.

>>12380901

There we go. There's Deano. Faced with a list: a veritable plague of shit, and be can smile because he found one that does not apply to him. Take that benefit scroungers. Take that City supporters. Deano suffers less and that means Deano has won.

>>12381551
>Size of France
>Population of Spain

>Salary of Moldavia

Nah.

>>12381564
>There's no grand logic here
You make less money in Europe if you don't work in the capital.

>I've been to Kiev Odessa and Lviv

And what else can Ukraine offer aside those 3 cities? The moment you enter the steppe is officially exiting civilization. Moldova has greenery at least and beautiful diverse landscape. And those places themselves are discounted Russia, so i don't understand what point you're trying to make.

Though he is a posh deluded boomer (muh dont blame society, when i was young etc cliches) his books describing his experiences with drug addicts and low class criminals in britain is quite good.

>>12380195
Opinions on Peter Hitchens in all this? is he just a moaning old man or does he have anything of worth to say

>>12381642

posh twat thinking england was a paradise when everybody went to church. not to mention he is a jew so he should just shut up.

>>12381544
If you are paying a grand a month rent in London you are a fool.

Are sloana rangers still a thing? People in america love your accents, so if its really so bad over there move here-or are we only letting in indian software engineers and mexican day laborers?

>>12381658
They still exist. If you are posh, attractive and well connected Britain is pretty awesome, but let's face it, nobody on /lit/ is in that category

Communist Manifesto

>>12381527
I hope you see though that this sort of whataboutism doesn’t solve the issue. I’ve been to Hong Kong and that place is hell on earth for overcrowded-ness, but the general point is that most Londoners spend 2-3 hours of their day commuting between a shitty apartment and a shitty job, telling them some other place is even more crowded won’t make them any happier. I for one am lucky to have a decent apartment and not have to go to an ‘office’ every day, but tens of thousands of people aren’t so lucky.

>>12381544
Yes, this is the point, whether one is a Brit or not the issue is the same. Many people I know and work with are a mix of British and European (from all over - Italy, Spain, France, Nordic countries) feel the same way and have the same issues. If anything, Brits are in a way better off because they have the option to live with their parents in houses their parents own (that is, not having to pay rent). Here’s a simple calculation: if you make 20k/year, you pay taxes on 9k (11k is non taxable), at 20%.

If your rent is around 1k/month, i’ll take away that 11k non taxable for rent per year, and the 20% taxes off the rest of the 9k, and we’re left with 7.2k, or a cool £600 profits per month, out of which you’ll have to take out council tax (about £100), national insurance, bills, home maintanance and food. I can’t calculate those last few as they vary, but you might be left with around £250-£300 actual ‘savings’ a month. A 2 bedroom aprtment in, for example, Croydon (south london, far from the centre, pretty bad neighbourhood) would cost you about £350-£400K to buy, maybe 200k for a 1-bed.
TLDR A person with a ‘normal’ job and job progression doesn’t have a chance to own a good home.

>>12381545
And this is the other side of it. If you go even as far as Slough, Reading, east coast, Leeds, Sunderland, even Manchester (although it’s a bit better there), if looks like a post industrial wasteland, like the movie Threads. And smaller towns feel deserted or the average age is 65. I don’t know what will happen with these places in 20 years.

>>12381662
Nor 99.9% of Britain's population for that matter. The entire 1% model started in England before it migrated to the US.

Who else here is a /pol/ /lit/ cross boarder? Smart when it comes to world issues. Smart when it comes to books.

>>12381624
>You make less money in Europe if you don't work in the capital.
Eh? Not only is it not true for every country in Europe, but how is that even in the slightest relevant to what I said?
>And what else can Ukraine offer aside those 3 cities?
It's a moot point as any one of those cities is already more interesting than anything and everything Moldova has to offer.

>>12380195
Gravity's Rainbow takes place in the 40s and still captures more of that stuff

>>12381668
Yeah life is not all sunshine and rainbows kid. Brits bitch about having a better life than 99% of all the people who've ever lived. These are your problems? That you can't afford a house in the city? That you have to commute? Such whiny bullshit.
Fuck knows how you'd cope with some real trouble.

>>12380204
Isn't there a huge leftist protest going on in France over the same shit?

The Swan by Baudelaire

>>12381793
It's the normal state of French to be on a huge leftist chimpout against something.

>>12381776
there have been many points in history when people have been told this. theres always room for improvement, especially when many problems are home-made

>>12381776
Oh I’m not complaining, on the contrary I work half as much for more money than most and can take a vacation whenever I want.

I’m just observing my environment, the potential reasons why people might feel like what OP listed is going on. It’s up to each person to try NOT to live that way ultimately, but some inevitably will. the question is simply what the results will be in say 20 years.

>>12381688
You know you've lived to read some pretty bizarre shit on the internet when a country so big and populous with 3 civil wars on it's hands and as equally poor as it's smaller western neighbor, is deemed more "interesting". Overpopulated globalist cities from eastern Europe with no identity must be exotic if it gets praise from the first world then

Whatever, to each his own i guess.

>>12381793
Is it just leftists? Thought there was a bit of everybody

>>12381856
no clue why youre so hellbent on defending moldova. its not interesting, its just miserable and the massive population exodus reflects that. there are few places in europe that have less going for them

>>12381876
Maybe he works for the Moldovan board of tourism and they want to attract 1-2 tourists from this thread

>>12381856
>it's bizarre that tiny ultra piss poor shithole is less interesting than a large piss poor shithole
Cope.
>Overpopulated globalist cities from eastern Europe
Ultra cope.

>>12381876
I'm not defending anything, have you even visited Moldova or just base your entire understanding on memes? I have relatives in Ukraine that i used to visit on plentiful occasions when i was younger and i can tell you for a fact that Ukraine is "Wasted Potential: The country". Maybe you've got to see the superficial tourist stuff, but i've actually seen how it is to live in both.

If you've visited both but still claim that the shitshow which is Kiev is "Interesting" then it tells me that you either have a fetish for large sterile high density cities with no identity or you've been to the wrong places in Moldova.

>>12381913
Nah.

how did a /britlit/ thread turn into the discussion whether moldova or ukraine is better? (cripple battle of the century, btw)

>>12381642
He is occasionally rather brilliant, when he isn't a bore that is. If you want to understand Britain today you must read The Abolition of Britain, where he chronicles Britains demise as a moral community

>>12381776
>Bro you're not scrambling in shit fighting for every daily meal so why do you give a shit about social issues

>>12381642
I mean he is a moaning old man with a lot to say, that is indeed worthwhile

>>12381642
He's a legit critic of the left (I'm pretty left for England in case some figures I'm shilling for my side.) The problem with reading him is that a lot of the stuff he writes about is going to be boring as shit if you're not into discussing town planning and religion, so even Anglican vicars on planning councils probably find him boring. He can be incisive but that generally involves pages of unplebbing his readers.

>>12380900
First as tragedy then as farce

>>12381793
What protest?

>>12380900
Has this ever not been the case?

>>12381947
>Ukraine is "Wasted Potential: The country"
As opposed to high-performing achiever paradise that is Moldova?
>shitshow which is Kiev is "Interesting"
It is interesting. It's a big city with plenty to see and plenty to do. If you're looking for something more quaint and architecturally pleasant, there's Lwiw and Odessa as mentioned before. In any case I don't see why you're so adamant that your shithole with an overgrown village for a capital is somehow better than Ukraine in any way.

>>12381652
>>12381642
So Dalrymple AND Hitchens are both Jewish? Why is this?

>>12380840
Liverpool is pretty comfy

>>12381099
>Culture is downstream from politics (as people emulate the cultural tastes of the ruling class to get ahead)
no it's not you fucking mong, it's the opposite, look up how various people killed their degenerate leaders because it was against their mores. The reason we accept pig fuckers as leaders is because society and social bonds have degenerated due to a myriad of factors.

>>12382069
Moldova is shit due to objective reasons. Ukraine is an altogether different case. We didn't have our present things handed over by the people who used to rule over us like Ukraine.

And for your information, Odessa was literally built from scratch by Moldovan settlers during the 18th-19th century. The old historical town is called "Moldovanka" even today. L'wow was built entirely by Poles and Kiev built entirely by Russians. Same as anything of noteworthy interest Ukraine currently possess.

Having said that, i'd rather live in a city which also has a country beside it rather than a country that has only cities inside it, which was in fact the point i was trying to come across when talking about my hometown and other Ukrainian cities.

This subject has gone way too far than i intended but it just shows how much you know of the subject, basing your entire knowledge on memes and having a tourist level understanding of the realities of both countries.

Regardless, Ukraine will continue to be a bigger shithole than Moldova and clueless 1st worlders like you will continue to spout bullshit.

>>12380989
>Why do people even care about those trends? I'm not a fan of them either and vehemently oppose them, but i just blocked myself form ever seeing them around me constantly. No social media, no stupid 21st century people ridden with anxiety that create bubbles for themselves as a cope mechanism.

Because they are becoming inescapable, depending on the country it is illegal to voice opinions against it. And eventually these trends will affect your family and yourself. Just look at America where 70,000 people die because of drugs a year. Look at the demographics, look at terrorism, this things affect your life and reality can't be ignored by unplugging from social. Just unplugging is unhealthy and selfish anyways, like leaving your country and family to get $$$ is unhealthy and selfish.

>>12381244
lol are African girls smarter than white British?

>>12382129
demographics, income & purchasing power statistics, international rankings all aren't up to interpretation and they all show both ukraine and moldova being africa-tier bottom feeders

even if you "prove" that moldova is better than ukraine, you still havent said much, because even parts of india are better than ukraine

>>12381358
Not him but i can only imagine
>West: Ocean, trade networks, highly dense urbanization,

>East: Plains/Mountains and scattered villages

>>12381265
this is the correct attitude, do you have family or are you just autistic? What kind of architecture do you wish to pioneer? you should try to reconcile contemporary needs with historical living quarters and create a harmonic architectural existence.

>>12382129
>Odessa was literally built from scratch by Moldovan settlers during the 18th-19th century.
Don't worry frate, we'll take it back, together with Cernauti
t. Sucevean

>>12381377
>Atomized. Absolute freedom.
hmm this is a problem in the West

>>12382150
eastern europe is literally all flatlants and the claim that mountains are somehow bad for economic development should be weighted against the fact that the alps are one of the wealthiest regions in the world

>>12382082

there are many many cryptojews in the uk.

boris johnson, david cameron, john bercow, ed miliband,... all jews. look it up. dont get fooled by their posh accent

>>12381248
France
>Muslims, blacks, nihilism, atheism, cosmopolitanism

Germany
>Turks, Africans, Muslims, self-inflicting collective pain

USA
>Blacks, violence, ghettos, gentrification, elites, creaturas

It's just not as easy to move somewhere in the west without seeing the same problems everywhere.

>>12382163
this is the single gayest image i have ever seen

>>12382189
just stop browsing 4chan and youll get rid of these "problems" lol

the only actual problems in life are crime and poverty

>>12382180
what? the entirety of the balkans is a mountain range

>>12382202
i didnt mean the balkans, but the eu countries east of germany

>>12382202
So is Switzerland.

>>12380867

lol delusional racist fucks in 4chan think that tallinn is a good place to live.

>>12382223
i dont think those recommendations were based on racial composition. copenhagen, utrecht and nuremberg are extremely diverse.

>>12381776
>EYYY!!! The extended family has collapse, what's left of the nuclear family is being bombarded, we've seen the total upheaval of every tradition that existed and we are now forced to slave away in jobs that have been disconnected from any sense of community and purpose. Sexual relations are now competitions and male/female relationships, if they are even sexual, are to be like bizarre friendships since your spouse has to fulfill all roles formerly occupied by the extended family and the community. The entire populace on earth is one nomadic tribe that wonders from economic opportunity to economic opportunity, where all lands have become fluid just as the populations that occupy them, detaching the people who remain from any historical continuity. But at least, you're not eating fucking spam out of a can like your ancestors!

>>12382248
welcome to life, angsty boi

>>12382129
>Moldova is shit due to objective reasons
Jej, What is that even supposed to mean? And how is that relevant, you humongous cope machine? Both countries are absolute shitholes. If anything it's actually telling that Ukraine's economy only managed to descend to Moldova levels now after years of armed conflict on its territory (and it still has higher GDP per cap kek). You are literally the squalid rural dumpster fire of Europe and no amount of "nuh-uh" and "ur jus clueless gaijin" and "muh hidden gems" is ever gonna change these facts.

>>12382253
you're a materialistic mental midget

>>12380848
Budapest will become shit thx to orban
Prague is good but overcrowded with tourists
Bratislava is great but rather small and overcrowded with commuters from country

>>12382294
Bratislava is just commie blocks

>>12382060
Yellow Jackets lad.

>>12382253
slave mindset, "it is what it is" is the new opiate of the masses

Anybody else here have phimosis?

>>12380996
DON'T fall for this meme. Oxbridge is for autist hoop-jumpers who sweat for grades and have no personality. They've both been ruined by social justice and a focus on statistics instead of actual academic progress. Imperial/Durham/St Andrews are all objectively better

>>12381591
I'm Davey

>>12382581
yeah me mate and frenulum breve

>>12380970
Oxbridge is an overated meme my less economically developed friend. This is St Andrews, but I bet you would have thought it was Oxford

>>12382572
>why everything got to cost money
>why do I have to share a country with people I don't like
Childish man

>>12382776
What about pearly penile papules?

youre literally living in one of the wealthiest countries on earth, with more wealth, security and political freedom than 99.99999% of the humans that ever lived

if youre not happy, youre dysfunctional

>>12380580
>>12380583
>>12380589
>>12380591
>>12380628
I think one of the big problems of the modern worlds nobody seems to talk about is that automation has been killing jobs for quite while already and that we have nowadays already more people in the workforce than there are jobs to be done, while everybody ignores it and sees it solely as something in the far future. David Graber's writings about "bullshit jobs" touch on that a bit.

>>12380580 #
>>12380583 #
>>12380589 #
>>12380591 #
>>12380628 #
I think one of the big problems of the modern worlds nobody seems to talk about is that automation has been killing jobs for quite while already and that we have nowadays already more people in the workforce, especially educated ones, than there are jobs to be done, while everybody ignores it and sees it solely as something in the far future. David Graber's writings about "bullshit jobs" touch on what I mean a bit.

>>12382745
>>12382777
lmao at these oxbridge rejects

>>12383117
What are you studying then mister?

>>12380671
>germany has regional disparities as well, but theyre not that great, yeah.
I think it still quite prevalent, but less obvious. My Ruhr area is still doing only mediocrely and without money from outside it would look quite bit more reminiscent of northern england than germany.

>>12381398
>the boomer cope
People being wealthy in China are irrelevant because immediately after ww2 most of the consumption within the west was BY the west.
There’s a vested interest in keeping an increasing population rate, which keeps employment competitive and maintains a steady increase on housing investments- which are one of the central forms of wealth transfer among the political class.
Because it’s no longer economically or socially viable to start a family young, this population growth has to be supplemented with immigration. The effect of this being that, while native born populations are handed a wealth of social connections and unwritten historical rights, transplant ones aren’t. A population of entirely natives will almost never experience poverty, because Aunt Betty will always have a couch where her child hood friend Veronica’s down and out nephew George can sleep on. In an ahistorical transplant society, Achmed doesn’t know Chang doesn’t know Greg, and in effect they have far less security to bargain with when it comes to work negotiations. What’s more, this social capital CANNOT be created through government policy, at least, not within the term limits of any given politician. It has to be grown and nurtured for multiple generations.
The total disregard for social capital in persuit of material capital is what will continue to make paupers for all of us, while only those with the recourses to regularly fly cross country/internationally and the utterly disenfranchised rural poor will maintain anything semblant to a normal fulfilling human existence.

>>12382537
no it isnt

Its very much like berlin but in much smaller scale

>>12382858
jesus christ guys, are you me?

>>12383209
Bullshit. White westerners have chosen freely to abandon close family relationships, it wasn't forced upon them. Generations have seen the opportunity to fuck off and absolve themselves of the responsibilities of looking after their parents and grabbed it, because they thought their own selfish needs were more important. They've shredded their own social capital, and most immigrant groups have created in their new country the social support network you describe

>>12383237
>when the memes escape memetown and become reality

>>12383010
>David Graber's writings about "bullshit jobs"
Just had a quick glean of some of his stuff, seems an interesting read, nice one anon.

>>12380204
>anything to the left of Reagan is “heavily left”

>>12381793
>A protest must follow the CIA approved political dichotomy
fermez vos jarres les anglos pourri du cul

>>12383237
>literally seeing things in white and brown
This disconnect is universal among all demographic groups, after the first or second generation. Some immigrants do hold onto more traditional values, but that’s a temporary dellay, and I garuntee you their support group is nothing compared to that of a third generation native in a small town.
There’s a reason for the things you described beyond “evil whitey, virtuous hardworking immigrants” you fucking mongaloid.

>>12382024
Please mate, I'm not even British and I find Hitchens not only fascinating but indispensable (though he is quite often a rather repetitive bore).

I must say though, if you expect to read anyone who who will not spend time "unplebbing" the reader, that would mean you expect all other readers to be as sublime a patrician as you are yourself. Considering that you are indeed a lefty, you should, if possible, dismount your high horse, grow up and start with the Greeks

>>12382024
And if you could correct my sentences that would be wonderful, as I am indeed a foreign unwashed pleb

i just hope brexit makes corbyn come to power somehow

>>12383512
accelerationist or idiot?

>>12383512
Personally for me it's anti-semitic bankruptcy :)

>Deano
Hold up, when was this a thing? I didn't know this stereotype got its own name!

>>12380904
Yeah but there are no stinking niggers

>>12383430
>This disconnect is universal among all demographic groups, after the first or second generation.
Not in mine, my deracinated friend. You have the choice about whether to spend time strengthening your familial bonds or to indulge your personal whims, and you make that choice. Why miss out on a piss up with the lads to look after auntie Mary?

>>12383694
Westerners have made a fetish of freedom to the extent they think its the most important thing in the world. They'd rather not have children because it impinges on their freedom to party, they abandon their own families because they can't bear to have someone telling them what to do. They turn to atheism because they don't want a priest judging them. And now they complain that this approach to life is not fulfilling!

Some post-war Japanese novels cover what it's like to have once been an important, imperial nation.

>>12382262
based

Honestly, how many of you are incels. I can’t imagine sex-having men caring about these non-issues

>>12383864
Such as?

How do I into fiction writing? I have no experience of writing anything beyond essays, but I live in a fairly shit post-industrial city up north and I reckon I could fictionalise that pretty well.

>>12384066
Fuck off back to /v/ you anti-intellectual cattle.

>>12384066
Eat shit, you fucking troglodyte.

>>12384162
Could’ve just said “yes, I am”

>>12383770
The people who complain were never given the choice.

>>12384115
jump in the deep end. doing it is the only way you improve.

>>12384115
Ray Bradbury said to write a short story every week for a year. He said this will force you to write constantly, but will also give you a routine sense of accomplishment that will drive you on.

>>12384228

Fuck it, I'm gonna do that. How do I get genuine constructive feedback instead of sending it to all my non-lit mates that will tell me how great I am instead of actually criticising my work?

>>12384271
I'd say to do it yourself. Or post it online on a page. Maybe start a Neocities site, then you'll likely get an older audience than usually hang around on a place like FictionPress.

>>12384066
You're just shallow anon.

Frankfurt school of cultural marxism is to blame.

I think people have become addicted to pessimism and the squalor. Just fictionalizing the issues that are all over the West today doesn't do anything for anyone. I think even at its bleakest an artistic work should attempt to provide some form of healing.

>>12383770
>sins of the fathers, and so on
Taking personal responsibility for your own cultures general trends in order to invalidate the criticism of another persons cultural trends is some top shelf brainletism.
It seems like you’re somewhat defensive as well. I’m not criticizing immigrants, simply the way they’re used to maintain a system that undermines social stabability in return for economic gains of the elite.

>>12384657

I'd say that people are addicted to the feeling of pessimism and squalor, to the point that no-one in a position of squalor is willing or able to accurately reflect on that position. Anyone with the mental acumen to rise up from a position of absolute poverty is bombarded with platitudinal media, which serves to create an in-group based around the poor and uneducated rather than seeking to elevate those with the ability to produce anything of value beyond their given social grouping. Also this is getting too wordy so fuck niggers I guess.

>>12384719
What I mean is that it's like the movie Network, where everyone loves the rant, but at the same time it doesn't solve anything. If every problem Houellebecq had with France was solved tomorrow, how would he sell books? I'm not saying people should ignore the problems or pretend they're actually good, but rather that highlighting problems don't actually solve anything. Recently pessimistic literature has been flying off the shelves, so the system can turn even its most staunch critics to a support structure for the system.

>>12384719
>Also this is getting too wordy so fuck niggers
A toast to that.