/lit/ - Literature

>29. Here is an illustration of the way in which the oversocialized leftist shows his real attachment to the conventional attitudes of our society while pretending to be in rebellion against it. Many leftists push for affirmative action, for moving black people into high-prestige jobs, for improved education in black schools and more money for such schools; the way of life of the black “underclass” they regard as a social disgrace. They want to integrate the black man into the system, make him a business executive, a lawyer, a scientist just like upper-middle-class white people. The leftists will reply that the last thing they want is to make the black man into a copy of the white man; instead, they want to preserve African American culture. But in what does this preservation of African American culture consist? It can hardly consist in anything more than eating black-style food, listening to black-style music, wearing black-style clothing and going to a black- style church or mosque. In other words, it can express itself only in superficial matters. In all ESSENTIAL respects most leftists of the oversocialized type want to make the black man conform to white, middle-class ideals. They want to make him study technical subjects, become an executive or a scientist, spend his life climbing the status ladder to prove that black people are as good as white. They want to make black fathers “responsible,” they want black gangs to become nonviolent, etc. But these are exactly the values of the industrial-technological system. The system couldn’t care less what kind of music a man listens to, what kind of clothes he wears or what religion he believes in as long as he studies in school, holds a respectable job, climbs the status ladder, is a “responsible” parent, is nonviolent and so forth. In effect, however much he may deny it, the oversocialized leftist wants to integrate the black man into the system and make him adopt its values.

He is a pseud and u r a pseud nd gay 2

>>11873916
>i like nature better kill ppl lmao

>>11873976
techno-optimists aren't people, they're more akin to cattle

>>11873916
Kazcynski addresses the shortcomings of ISaiF in his other books. I highly recommend reading them once you are done with the manifesto.

>>11873999
Jews arent people more like cattle who lie and steal alot wow hitler

>>11873999
Nice trips

>>11873916
Pynchon's better

>“The conservatives are fools: They whine about the decay of traditional values, yet they enthusiastically support technological progress and economic growth. Apparently it never occurs to them that you can't make rapid, drastic changes in the technology and the economy of a society without causing rapid changes in all other aspects of the society as well, and that such rapid changes inevitably break down traditional values.”

Hmm... I wonder why /lit/ never discusses this part. Surely a coincidence right guys?

>>11874008
Based, fuck Jews

>>11874023
Everyone here hates Neo-Cons and Cuckservatives already

>>11874032
Cringe based poster

>>11874023
I dislike conservative republicans aswell. There is no doubt leftists and marxists have been way more influental since WW2 though

>>11874015
>some random reclusive writer that no one even knows about is better than THE Unabomber

>>11874045
Some guy who blows people up becaus ehe hates jews is better than anyone

>>11874045
uh yeah

>>11874051
The point is that he believed so strongly in his ideals that he was willing to go out and do what he felt he had to do. Pine cone may as well be John Green compared to good ol' Teddy.

>>11874023
radical centrist

>>11874064
>>11874064
Harming people doesn't make your point more well reasoned you loon. Ted is an intellectual light weight compared to pynchon and everything Ted writes about, Pynchon covers more comprehensively and didn't have to resort to killing people to get his work regarded.

>>11874023
Conservatives have been non factors for most their existence.

>>11873921
>They want to integrate the black man into the system, make him a business executive, a lawyer, a scientist just like upper-middle-class white people.
>The leftists will reply that the last thing they want is to make the black man into a copy of the white man

seems a bit presumptuous and naive. were african american slaves, upon freeing, suddenly supposed to develop a culture distinct from western culture and flexible enough to function (in the sense of giving its proponents sufficient means to survive physically) whilst still within a western country? a bit much.

>>11874064
Hitler believed strongly enough to personally execute 6 million people

>>11874023
It is discussed in every thread. You are conflating politicized children and anti-tech thought. They are diametrically opposed. If you had read the manifesto or any anti-tech material you would know that politics are fundamentally tied with technological progress and industrialisation. If not Kazcynski, then Ellul gives a deeper and more fleshed out analysis of technification (which politics are - the technification of social and economical matters).

If you are a left leaning politicized retard you might want to read Camatte, a communist, whose analysis of technology bears close resemblance to Kaczynski's.

>>11874069
It isn't about whose work is more regarded or which of them is smarter, it's about who has enacted more change in the real world, and I think Ted definitely has done more in that regard than Pynchon.
>>11874078
Exactly, thanks for proving my point.

>>11874087
No i compared him to hitler, you lose. Ted kazinski is animal Hitler

>>11874087
>I think Ted definitely has done more in that regard than Pynchon.
By killing a couple of people, getting arrested, and writing derivative bullshit, okay...

>>11873916
specifically his political views are somewhat on point, but his form of ludditism is completely illogical and made from an irrational point of view. basically his fears of technological progress are the result of misinterpretation of humanity's purpose as being an existence within the world unconstrained. we're not built to be smarter chimpanzees or orangutans, that's how our genus was initially built. we exist as we do because we were naturally and self-artificially selected for this role.

>>11874069
>Ted is an intellectual light weight
Your entire premise for what constitutes an intellectual lightweight is predetermined by societal factors and anglo moralism. Mr Theodore John Kaczynski was in fact the youngest university professor of his time, acclaimed as one of the great genius of his generation. Couple that with the fact that anti-tech authors are far and few in between(most intellectuals do not bother going all the way with the technological question, like the picture suggests), and that Kazcynski's message was echoed by every single one of these thinkers give further proof that in fact, Kaczynski is not only a credible source, but a staple of today's philosophical movements.

>>11874090
>I compared him to literally Hitler. Checkmate
Please let this be a joke

>>11874118
Compared to Pynchon he is yeah

>>11874038
Based cringe based poster

>>11874106
>misinterpretation of humanity's purpose
Oh yes, unlike these good interpretations from our technocrat geniuses
>I fear death therefore we must never die!
>I am a weak goblin therefore we must augment our bodies!
These do not make great arguments for "humanity's purpose".

This statement proves you are ignorant through and through. Pulling from the metaphysical to defend technology! lmao! Go back to your urban dwelling, pleb.

>>11874123
You are deluded, urbanite. There is no competition in intellectualism - the real kind, not academic ''intellectualism''. You are either right or you are not. Get back to your job urbanite, the system will not replace you without your help!

>>11874106
>his political views are somewhat on point
>his form of ludditism is completely illogical
False! Kaczynski never advocates for a certain form of luddism! In his book Anti-Tech Revolution, he gives a great explanation as to why post-revolution fantasies are just that: fantasies. Kaczynski is against technology, that's it! He is not a politicized children with utopian fantasies! Else he would be an activist, a politician, or a reformist!

>>11874122
If you dont see the wrongality in killing people for your cause then you are a deluded psychopath who uses his beliefs as an excuse to hurt others.

>>11874150
>technocrat strawman generalization
the technocrats are wrong too, I don't agree with their interpretation of humanity while definitely disagreeing with luddite ideas.
>we must augment our bodies because we're weak
again I'd argue against this motivation. we must augment ourselves because we're stronger than anything else and are currently the only ones whom have the ability to do so. power stems from power.
>pulling from the metaphysical
what I stated had complete biological basis, so you're deluded if you really think I tried to do this

>>11874185

>>11874067
Literally nothing wrong with radical centrism
>third positionists pls go

>>11874185
>Kaczynski's plan is not 200% completely foolproof therefore he's wrong and I'm smart! Look at me! I wrote a long post that could've been summed up in two sentences!
Take a deep breath on your way out

>>11874188
>violence is bad!
Fuck off anglo moralist. Killing the scientists who developped the nuclear bomb would have been a blessing for humanity. You are a deluded psycopath if you think otherwise (the prefered attack on kazcynski) If you had read Kaczynski you would know he gave an extensive explanation for his use of violence.

>>11874185
>>11874195
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA don't even bother reading this shit

spoiler; WE GOTTA COLONIZE MARS MY DUDE

You have to be a grade A retard if you think that's a viable solution, and completely ignorant of Kaczynski's writing who explains why we'll die before this is even a possibility.

>>11874185
Completely delusional

I'm going to sleep so I'll hit you with the long reply tomorrow. Sleep tight, urbanite.

>>11874075
They did develop a culture you retard. What are you even refuting? Nothing you quoted had anything to do with the things you said.

>>11874078
>personally execute
The only person "personally executed" by Hitler was himself

>>11874188
>killing people for your cause
Yes, because no relevant cause you respect has ever killed! Other than the law, the prison system, the police, all of western civilization, influential racial movements, businesses who have such great ideas they kill others in the market by removing competition, influential presidents, the military, thousands of religious movements, banks, hospitals, etc. etc.

>>11874209

the jealousy is strong here

>>11874226

>You have to be a grade A retard if you think that's a viable solution

rofl, then just call me simple jack and put me on the short bus.

anyway i'm right, and if it isn't functionally possible to leave this planet then we're all doomed anyway. staying stuck on earth as a closed system would not just require a minimum of bad actors that would take advantage of the world post anti-tech revolution. it would also require transcendence of most of humanity's base instincts (no more fast travel, no more meat, strict population control/mass die offs), which barely anyone in these threads is ready to admit

>completely ignorant of Kaczynski's writing who explains why we'll die before this is even a possibility.

try again, i've read everything that uncle ted has published. he argues that it's extremely difficult to predict the timeframe of when, which all reduces to inevitability in the ultimate long run.

obviously this is still the case even with space exploration, but since ted is mostly concerned about time, it doesn't make as much sense as he would like it to

>>11874239

i'm looking forward to an actual dialectic instead of some child that just discovered him going apeshit on me while phoneposting and drinking coffee. please be the former

>>11874252
>They did develop a culture you retard
yes they did. i have no idea why you would even write this (outside of you completely missing my entire point maybe?).

>What are you even refuting
im not refuting anything you overzealous twit. at best im being dismissive towards they way in which he frames the integration of african americans; as exemplifying the "oversocialized" leftists propensity to halfhearted rebellion.

>Nothing you quoted had anything to do with the things you said
...language barrier perhaps?

>>11873916
It's funny since his entire subjectivity is made possible by techno-science. Any actual pre-technological societies would have been even more morally revolting to his sexist beliefs than America in the 1970s-90s. Ted just didn't like people so he ran off and started killing people... the tragicomedy of Elliot Rodger is even more funny than that.

Anyone with a capacity for an expansive awareness today can see technological development isn't expanding freedom and history isn't "rational" strictly speaking, Ted isn't particularly idiosyncratic in that regard, but even if "societal collapse" results from climatic change there's still a window for emancipatory change e.g. marauding stateless gangs organized on democratic principles as agents of revolution.

I hate Ted threads, you're all such pompous pricks. You guys are more dogmatic and closed to ideas than even left-wing university professors.

These kinds of things ought to be discussed, whether it's the flaws and solutions needed for modernity, hell even Rand's ideas on objectivism, post modern interpretations of reality, all kinds of ideas literature provokes and we can't discuss any of it because you guys spend more time shit posting than actually reading and thinking so you can participate in discussions with people that actually know the content. I know Marxists keep rambling about this, everyone claims to have read the Greeks, and Evola or fuck me if anyone tries to discuss Libertarians. Dickheads.

>its another comfy ted thread

>>11874185
>Me smart Ted dumb!

Whoever wrote this can fuck off

>>11874087
> Ted definitely has done more
He has done nothing. Zero. If Teds life were a game matrix in n-dimensional hyperspace, he chose the (n-1) dimensional hyperplane with the vector containing the worst possible options. His utility choices were minorized in the grand scheme of things, he lost the game of life.

Plus, he’s probably taken it in the ass at least once inside prison

>>11874185
>>11874195
>yeah let's buy into the system even more because it will get us off planet
Because a life in service to the system without any real freedom would be so worth extending, right???

>>11873916
Camette said everything he said years before him. He just isn't as attractive to pseuds because he wasn't an edgy serial killer like Ted was. Honestly this idolization of Ted makes the An-Prim movement look completely juvenilie and impotent as a whole, but then again that may just be An-Prim.

>>11874118
What is this image conveying?
Is it a comparison of Kaczynski's critique of liberal "intellectuals" to Peterson's (and Ben Shapiro's, and Prager U's, and Rebel Media's, etc) critique of them?
Or is it implying that Peterson is that very same kind of milquetoast wannabe-rebel?

>>11873916
anarcho-primitivism is sooo 2015. can someone turn off their walkman? i think that one song i once heard at warped tour is being sung by that boy with acne scars.

>>11874925
It’s saying that we need to keep an eye on good ol’ Stinky Pete before he fucks some shit up.

>>11874118
You know what's creepy. Peterson's bags under his eyes and other facial features show a man tormented at night, can't sleep, always dealing with some sort of anxiety or something. Whereas Ted looks at peace, like he sleeps well at night and really doesn't suffer from the same anxieties as a lot of City dwellers living stressful lives.
>>11874925
Who the fuck knows, honestly. I think it's the latter or else they would've had similar quotes side by side to show similarity rather than just a picture of professor Peterson.

>>11874133
Cringe based cringe based poster

can someone tl:dr me on why he thought technology was bad

>>11874023
Except this is exactly why there are more conservative critiques of capitalism than ever. And why tradcaths are becoming more popular.