/lit/ - Literature

>>11824387
the specter of communism indeed haunts europe to this day

could we please stop it with the Marx threads. just read the dude if you're so damn curious.

>>11824426
>Don't talk about authors on /lit/.
Honestly, wannabe jannies are a lot more pathetic than the volunteers themselves.

>>11824387
None.

>>11824453
as if Marx discussions are ever productive on here

>>11824480
*bumps unproductive threads*
that'll show 'em

how once domestic markets become saturated capitalists will always expand for more profit even if it means slavery and environmental degradation If anyone actually read him they would realise he has been pretty spot on..

>>11824387
He got the M-C-M' right

The current wave of technological automation – driven by advanced robotics, encrypted neural networks and furtive distributed data channels, machine learning, and big data voodoo heroin – is expelling labour from the production process faster than it can be reintegrated, disrupting the balance between labour and capital, and threatening a phase shift in global capitalism. The Dehumanisation of the Human: The rapid development and increasing accessibility of technologies that modify human biology, psychology, and sociality – spearheaded by the convergence of nanotechnology, biotechnology, information technology, and cognitive science – threatens to dissolve the cognitive, reproductive, and evolutionary unity of our common form of life.


The idea of free will and our assumed identities and self-understandings, including politics or social standing, are simulations that can and will be ultimately be sloughed off as we enter a post-industrial society. However we choose to feel about this situation doesn't change that it is fact and will happen unless the anarcho-primitivists win.

Markets manufacture:
>Intellectual Intuition
>Deduction
>Time perception
>'Perfection'
>Preference Maximisation.
>Disembodied, Affectless, etc. 'reason'
>Normalisation

Go read him instead of hanging around on /lit/ scrounging for scraps.

>>11824582
Humanity is a means for a superintelligent AI to retroactively create itself.

since this is a garbage thread likely started by /pol/ shitters who can't be bothered reading can someone explain that "capital is sentient" meme. also is nick land worth reading?

>>11824617
no and no

>>11824582
All of that shit is small time compared for the millions of scab labor 80 IQ third world slaves imported to do menial shit labor because it's cheaper to bring them here and let them subsist on welfare from their anchor babies than to violent enslave them.

>>11824632
wouldn't expect anything less. now scurry off back to your safe space

>>11824617
>guy claims to be scientific (i.e. predictive) in his 40 pound tomes
>it's garbage to ask what his predictions were and whether they came to pass
based leftypol

>>11824663
we don't have to spell everything out for you. just fucking read the books or at least the wiipedia page. we are not going to spoonfeed you. if you want to discuss his ideas then do so, but predictions would just be repeating text

>>11824617
markets manufacture intelligence

>>11824617
Nick Land is very based and redpilled

>>11824617
Renaissance rationalization and capitalism took off and created a self-perpetuating highly effective fascist prison-mind-state which is not bound to any territory but rather to amorphous deterrotorialized capital constantly altering reality retroactively to give a sense of time or progression since its inception.

>>11824686
I honestly don't believe you have ever read more than the manifesto.

>>11824387
Global proletarianization has kept up. The last remnants of traditional societies are being sent into the slums without much hope.

The agrarian issue was the biggest fuck up of every country that tried to pull off "socialism in one country" in the 20th century. Today you have multinational corporations patenting forms of life itself and shaking down small farmers. People don't think farming can be monopolized but just watch what happens in the next 50 years. Total proletarianization is just around the corner still.

The central issue with Marx is the tendency of the rate of profit to fall. It makes sense in a pure theoretical competitive laissez faire economy but when the corporate form of enterprise became dominant in the late 19th century, after Marx was dead, the "socialization" of production played out differently and the role of government changed... dynamics like consumer credit, advertising, anything like Keynesian demand management, etc was all undertheorized.

The modern global economy is very much a weird simulacrum but the underlying profit, in value terms, is all that really matters and it can't be empirically assessed since the data simply isn't available.

>>11824840

>The central issue with Marx is the tendency of the rate of profit to fall. It makes sense in a pure theoretical competitive laissez faire economy but when the corporate form of enterprise became dominant in the late 19th century, after Marx was dead, the "socialization" of production played out differently and the role of government changed... dynamics like consumer credit, advertising, anything like Keynesian demand management, etc was all undertheorized

It’s also called “the tendency” of the rate of profit to fall. So the fact it has recovered or sustained a certain level by various means over the past century isn’t exactly a condemnation of an economic law that was never posited. But there are many Marxist academics that have claimed the profit rate has still fallen at points since the Great Depression, and that it has contributed to crises before recovering by various means (either destruction of capital, or something else). Increasing globalization certainly helped sustain profit rates.

>>11824617
gay and redditpilled

why are the marxists on here so poorly read, they fail to realize that marx's philosophy was rejected as contradictory to the philosophy marx built his "historical descriptivism/materialism" on https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/economics/proudhon/letters/46_05_17.htm

also Hegel is a brainlet

>>11824582
This is what the AI fetishists look like in real life

>>11824387

>>11824892
The law was posited by the pure logic of Marxs value theory. s/(c + v) cannot fully explain the dynamics of modern capitalism since it doesn't take into account the role of credit in manipulating the monetary value of goods. There's an underlying real economy that produces goods but the build up of paper claims on potential future wealth and their effect on the distribution of the aggregate surplus value isn't a question to be purely dealt with in these terms. Volume 2+3 of Capital were never fully completed because Marx was still grappling with some these issues to the day he died... e.g. land rent, international banking, etc.

Corporations don't make their internal records public for obvious reasons. Theoretically Marx could be falsified but you're not going to get the right data to do it since it's secret. What those "academics" do is just take monetary data from national accounts and play around with the numbers to try to transform market prices back into value... but in reality there doesn't exist a "national economy" and everything's tied into global financial flows. You could only talk about global aggregate surplus value but that would be even more deceptive since the data's even more murky for any such thing on a global scale

>>11824414
Kek

>>11824573
This to be honest. His critique of capitalism is good, it is the idealogies of his successors that make people think Marx is a dirty name.

Marx was right about the international tendency of capitalism. That it would expand until it filled the world and exhausted all possible markets . Then shit would get weird. Capital would then unlatch itself from the nation-state, becoming semi-autonomous legal entities with ambiguous borders. This would best position capital to begin cannibalizing itself one sustained economic growth becomes untenable.

>>11825560
"Jesus was not a Christian and Marx was not a Marxist."

>>11824387

I remember one criticism is that Marx was too dismissive of Nationalism. Buuut i'd wager Marx's definition of Nationalism was never tried. Germany and America absolutely hated large portions of their country, and their definition of nation was arbitrary. Nationalism would just be another opiate.

>>11825587
How do we stop this apocalyptic future anon?

>>11825587
>>11826211

We don't. This is where Marx fails.
Resources will be eaten up, the wealth divide grows, until it collapses the planet.
Then we start back at the feudal stage. We'll never reach the socialist stage.

>>11824686
>proletariat revolution!
>wtf nigger I'm not gonna spend time trying to convince you to revolt
You're a larping faggot

>>11824387
>predictions
Why is it that Marx is a crystal ball wielder and everyone else is just an economist?

>>11826400
the same reason Hitler's Germany was regarded as a right-wing government.

>>11826400
>Why is it that Marx is a crystal ball wielder
Communism is supposed to be a scientific analysis. Science necessarily must be predictive. Otherwise it's just observation.

>>11826432
>science
>no data
pick one

>>11826432
>>11826563
>implying we need data where we're going