/lit/ - Literature

>>11795540
booty got me

They're kind of orcs with how ugly and stupid they are.

>>11795540
>Opens a can of Monster
>sips
The only good orc is a dead orc.

Anyone got some old fashioned heroic fantasy? Doesn't need to be old, but needs to have that feel.

None of this "GRRRL POWER ACTION GIRL IN A MAN'S WORLD" shit I keep reading.

>>11795540
Orcs are in the same alley with elves and dwarves as utterly overdone, and so almost invariably uninspired and stupid.

>>11795569
>Doesn't need to be old
It pretty much has to be: Sword & Sorcery is a dead genre.

Everyone shitting out their epic fantasies with elf/orc wars, and low fantasy political intrigue, and anime wizard bullshit. That's all we get nowadays. Get used to it.

>>11795577
I'm not opposed to epic fantasies, but fuck me it took me right out of it when they try to inject modern day politics into it.

But I guess everyone wants to be GoT now, so YASSS QUEEN SLAY XD

>>11795574
You might like Scourge of the Betrayer by Jeff Salyards.
Tightly written, not a high fantasy spanning dozen books, interesting characters.

>>11795569
The Belgaraid and The Mandalloren my dude

>>11795540
Thoughts on His Dark Materials? Is 22 too old an age to read the series?

>>11795596
Yes. You should be reading Tolstoyevski.

>>11795577
>anime wizard bullshit
Kek and checked.

>used to love playing D&D and piecing together my own setting
>spent years throwing together fun fantasy settings just for the hell of it
>wrote my own manuscript for a novel that I decided to shelve for personal reasons
>now utterly burnt out from three years of soulless work grind
>all of the escapist joy of fantasy feels childish
>the genre feels bloated and stagnant
>feel a legitimate dread for books as a whole because no one fucking reads anymore
I just want my passion for fantasy rekindled, /lit/. How do I do it?

>>11795636
Find a new group for D&D, get a game going. It never really gets old - you just take a break.

>>11795636
How about you just forget everything?
It's clear you lost the passion and the balls for anything worthwhile.

>>11795569
David Gemmell's Drenai series. Gemmell was the king of Heroic Fantasy.

>>11795642
I get very anxious asking people to do things like that anymore. Somewhere in the years since I've developed some terrible fear that I bother everyone, even though they keep asking me to run a game. I'd rather find a good book to reignite the spark.

>>11795648
fuk u

>>11795697
>I'd rather find a good book to reignite the spark.

Gimme some weird fantasy.

>>11795697
>Somewhere in the years since I've developed some terrible fear that I bother everyone
That could be true. No one wants to be around a moapy spaz.

>>11795721
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6965582-ass-goblins-of-auschwitz

>>11795684
Already read them. Great shit.

>>11795731
Something serious. I can't deal with the ass goblins right now.

>>11795540

>tfw no novel about orc factory workers fighting for union rights

>>11795743
Serious but weird? You may want to elaborate your desire a little.

>>11795753
>tfw no novel about half-ogre breeding farms

>>11795743
Hmmmmm...
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/20344877-we-are-all-completely-fine

>>11795753
The only good unionized orc is a dead orc.

>>11795754
That's a good idea. Weird more in the sense of just very alien or odd in terms of the setting or characters, while still remaining relatively serious in terms of the narrative and the style of writing.

>>11795772
Thanks, I'll give it a shot.

>>11795739
Have you read his other stuff though?

>>11795569
REH's Solomon Kane. Pretty much the first Heroic Fantasy stories written.

>>11795844
I like Solomon Kane just fine, but I was thinking something more traditional.

Knights, damsels, chivalry. All that good shit.

Are there any good youtube channels with audiobooks hidden away? I want some comfy fantashit to listen to at work.

>>11795868
Around page 80 right now. Not hundred-percent sure I make it by deadline: it's good book but not the easiest read I've had.

>Are attractive female orcs immersion breaking for you?

That sexy orc on the Warcraft movie was weird af. I know she's a half human breed, but fuck, the orcs on the movie were so visually stunning it was kinda of a downer to see a non-cgi human with fangs on screen. Also hard to respect something I want to stick my dick in.

>>11795569

>Anyone got some old fashioned heroic fantasy

Have you read The Broken Sword already?
Also Guin Saga, I haven't read the books but the anime is just what you're looking for, and the books are translated.

>>11795540
>How do you feel about orcs?
Boring.
>Are attractive female orcs immersion breaking for you?
No, just especially boring.
>What unique takes on orcs have you read?
Tolkien, unironically. It's frankly kind of depressing how often the originator of some cliche or trope still manages to do it so much better and deeper than all the knock-off hacks that have since come out.

>>11795540
Tolkien invented orcs, anything after that it's a cliché.

>>11795540
>How do you feel about orcs?
Cliched monster race, extremely boring and unimaginative for people to still use them.
>Are attractive female orcs immersion breaking for you?
If I was reading something that centered on how attractive a non-human race is, it's probably smutty trash I'm reading for fapping so I don't care how immersive it is.
>What unique takes on orcs have you read?
Virtually none. Just by dint of being orcs they are walking cliches.

>>11795853
Gemmell's Knights of Dark Renown?

Anything about big titty orc elf women getting colonized by big white cock invaders?

or something idk

Which Shanara book should I read? There are so many. How good is Malazan Book of the Fallen? How about Black Company?

Nothing else really seems good. I just picked up Lord of the Rings but it seems like a normie book people recommend a lot but idk. havent started yet.

>>11795772
Gives me books with that picture in it

>>11796117
Chronicles of Amber might be more down your alley.

>>11796082
>>11796117
I don't know which one of you retards is worse.

Why is SF mixed up with fantasy
Fantasy is shit

>>11796120
I don't think so.

>>11796171
Go ahead, make a SF thread all on its own. See how it works out for you.

>>11796117
Nice try, anon. We don't bait so easily.

>>11796171
Please stay in /outerlit/, soi-cuck.

>>11796177
>>11796183
fantasy is for brainlets, nothing is more low brow than it

>>11796178
>>11796131
But it was a serious question

>>11796126
Ill go check it out, thank you

>>11796194
Why are you still here then?

>>11796172
Post more

>>11796208
ti shit on you

>>11796194
>>11796217
Based fantasy working this geek into a shoot.

>>11796213
That might interrupt the interesting discussion between the pretentious twat and the fantasy fags.

>>11796131
>>11796178
whats wrong with shannara

>>11796236
>fantasy fags take shit like this seriously

lmao

>>11796236
The show was extremely lame, What a let down

>>11796194
>fantasy is for brainlets
The soiest boiest.

>>11796252
>fantasy
>not complete basedboy

Give me some space opera kino about space commies and space muslims getting BTFO by Aryan space warriors.

>>11796259
Anything by John Ringo.

>>11796171
Feel free to make your own SF thread, nothing stopping you.

For the people keep track, would that make him the third or the fourth idiot to try making an independent SF thread?

>>11796258
>he doesn't realize that the most popular sci fi is future fantasy
>thinks he's somehow better than others for it

What a fuck.

>>11796171
You are a walking cliche, you know that right? Every few weeks we get some ridiculous sci-fi elitist who comes in and starts complaining about how sci-fi is better than fantasy and they shouldn't share a thread. A few of them even tried making their own sci-fi general threads. Notice how there's no sci-fi general threads on the board? It's because sci-fi elitists are shit people and can't hold together a community.

>>11796314
Maybe the reason people keep making them is your attitude?
There really is no need to be so obnoxious about reading shitty phonebook fantasy.

>>11796334
scifi elitist are simply too smart to need a community to discuss the latest hero's journey schlock with elves orcs and not-elves and not-orcs

>>11796171
>Fantasy is shit
So is SF, lad. Note also that the only real difference between the two is that some SF pretends to be possible/feasible.

>>11796334
I have to ask - what community?
There is no discussion. It's all one off posts about waifus and what exactly fetishes the author crammed in the novel.

>>11795540
>How do you feel about orcs?
Bored

How can we make green porch monkeys great again?

Any sci-fi/fantasy where the fate of the world/universe/civilization isn't at stake but with a good background that sends the character exploring?

>>11796418
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_History_of_the_Runestaff

>>11796287
If only he didn't write such shit.... I loved his concept of asteroid mining in Troy Rising, but the sequel just stank.

>>11796246
>watching it for the plot
It was one of the few shows recently that featured good looking girls.

>>11795697
Well mate if they’re asking you for a game it stands to reason they want a game. So play it with them.

>>11796426
>If only he didn't write such shit
At least he is self-aware and makes fun of himself. Compare that to most Military SF guys, which are a bunch of autist armchair generals/"military advisors" with ego issues, and he comes across as a saint.

Having finished Port of Shadows, I have to say I'm quite happy with it and that it's probably the best in the series. Though, I admit I am likely extraordinarily biased because I am a sucker for romance subplots. In spite of this, the ending still had a good element of tragedy to it. It was also good seeing the Company back to pre Shadow Games formation.

>>11796552
On second thought, I may have to addend this a little. It's my personal favourite, but probably not the best. Goblin and One Eye were way underused.

>>11796418
The Tschai and Demon Princes series by Jack Vance.

I could do with some good planetary romance myself after I finish Gormenghast.

>>11796603
>Gormenghast
how is that book, its on my backlog of shit to read

>>11796607
My dude, dust it off and join the ladies' auxiliary.
>>11795868
It's worth reading. I don't want to say anything further before the deadline.

List fantasy and sci-fi books you've read that have unique concepts that have stuck with you. Just anything out of the ordinary, something that doesn't pick up all the tropes of the genres, or at least does so with a satisfying twist.

>>11795753
>yfw arcanum fanfiction is all about a magical swordsman and his dog companion being impossible to down.

I loved this game as a teenager but rage quit when it became impossible to clear the gun slinger mastery quest line.

>>11795540
Sffg is to lit as kpg is to mu

>>11796677
not really

It's been more /g/:/csg/ lately, what with the isekai webnovel crowd.

Lads, help me decide. Don't know whether to try out Brett's Demon Cycle, Feist's Magician series, or read Drood by Simmons. Any opinions on them?

And orcs are pretty boring, Tolkien did them best and it's sad that nobody else has done anything unique with them.

Is this series any good? The books are always so hard to miss and I hear it referenced quite a bit.

>>11796916
Depends. Do you like rape?

>>11796916
First book is alright, but they get progressively more retarded in my opinion. But if you like BDSM, rape, pseudo NTR and Ayn Rand then this series is perfect for you.

>>11796963
Which end, giving or receiving?
Seriously though, are there rape scenes, or do you mean that this will series rape my eyes?

I liked the red knight, any other books where the main character is a badass? Or at least they grow into being one.

>read chapter 1 of The Galactic Mage
>7.5hrs left in book
Why is this SO LONG?

>>11796980
There's a scene later on where the protagonist tells his love interest to keep her rape baby.

He's also a rape baby, and every bad guy rapes.

>>11797041
Who Kahlan? She never gets raped. She has a shit ton of rape attempts on her, but none of them succeed and the only person to impregnate her is the protagonist.

>>11797076
Jeez, how many attempted rapes can you possibly fit into a story.

>>11796354
It's better sometimes.

>>11796908
I've only read Feist. He's ok.

>>11796117
>Which Shanara book should I read? There are so many.
Read the first one?
You should read Lord of the Rings first so that you understand how sad Shannara is.

How is The Gap Cycle?
How does it compare to other 90's Space Operas?

>>11795540
Your fictional Jezebels are no match for my complete lack of libido.

>>11797076
Other love interest.

Well I've just finished the tawny man trilogy by Robin Hobb. I read the kingkiller trilogy and the liveship traders earlier in the month so it's been interesting how her writing has evolved. I'd say I liked tawny man more than kingkiller but less than liveship. I think she still is a bit unsubtle when it comes to foreshadowing and plot surprises but unlike her earlier books there were a few moments where I was genuinely surprised (The Black Man for example). Also it's always nice to see characters you like again. My big complaint about her chapter intros being repeated ad nauseum remains but it was less annoying than in kingkiller. I'll probably finish up the next two trilogies she's written as well just to see how the world evolves.

>>11795772
Maybe I'm nitpicking here but why would you go to that level of sexual exaggeration just to giver her ugly man feet?

>>11797322
>unironically being a disgusting footfaggot

What is the Lord of the Rings of space fiction?

>>11795636
Well it seems like you've sort of decided to not have fun so that's a barrier you should try to get past. Do fun witty beach reading fantasy. Hitchhikers or MYTH books or Pratchett.

Alternatively remember how to have fun with a book by reading comedy fiction. Patrick F. Mcmanus's mystery novels are very good fun. David Sedaris's book about animals is cute if you want short stories.

>>11797328
Over the last few threads I've posted about nine different books that I've recently read and the only (you) I've gotten is about porn. Obviously we're all here because we have a common interest. How about instead of bumping the thread with shitty bait replies we post on topic discussion or respond to people's questions, suggestions or recommendations.

>>11797338
old mans war

>>11797338
Star Wars

Is there such a thing as good urban fantasy? I read the first Dresden Files book after years of hearing so much praise for it and it was pure trash. I nearly dropped it within the first chapter but stuck it out to the end only to be disappointed all around.

>>11797568
dark tower

>>11796916
The main characters have a weird notion of morality.

If most other novels they would be considered villains for the kinda shit they pull.

Does anyone have a link to the website where famous fantasy novels are written as if by different authors?

>>11796916
How do you feel about evil chickens?

>>11795559
Don’t be mean to Benadict

>>11796908
Don’t try demon cycle

>>11796908
>>11797638
The Warded Man was a really interesting idea executed very poorly.

>>11797678
Extremely very poorly.

>>11796908
>>11797678
In fairness the first half of the first book is pretty good, before gurl power and ebil men kicked in.

What is the /sffg/ equivalent of Full Metal Daemon Muramasa?

>>11795636
>>all of the escapist joy of fantasy feels childish
>>the genre feels bloated and stagnant
These things are true though. If anything that just means you should read things other than genre fiction for a while.

>>11798128
What's the that of what that is

>>11798156
Short review: https://vnreviews.blog/2015/02/12/full-metal-daemon-muramasa/
OP movie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Le2zxWrD294

>>11798128
Brandon Sanderson has a monopoly to anime fantasy.

>>11798181
Not an anime

>>11798172
>justice is bad
yeah alright that sounds fantastic

How much natural science/engineering do I have to know in order to write a space opera? It doesn't need to be Hard SF™, but I'd rather it not be completely silly or embarrassing, either.

>>11798210
>Implying justice actually exists and itsn't just a self-serving illusion that humans create

>>11798217
at least 4 wikipedia pages worth

>>11798217
just research as you go or make stuff up. sci-fi and fantasy are all about making shit up.
create a universe without quantum physics. or make it so gravity doesn't actually affect space and time.
its all up to you.

>>11798225
just because it's an illusion doesn't mean it's not got value

>>11798274
It has whatever value, or lack of value, that people attribute to it.

>>11798274
Doesn't it, though? Take the case of a murderer. Punishing the murderer doesn't "right" anything about the crime. The victim is still dead and there isn't some sort of metaphysical balance being achieved. If anything it's simply a dressed-up form of revenge, and not even the revenge of the victim, who is no longer alive to take it, but a revenge for the satisfaction of those remaining. You could justify it under the idea that the murderer is a threat to society, sure, but that is just self-preservation and hardly "justice." When a person is comforted by this, are they actually being comforted by the illusion of justice or are they merely using the illusion of justice to sublimate the feelings of satisfaction gained through revenge?

>>11798372
Justice doesn't have to be revenge. It can also be reimbursement and comfort to the victim's family, as well as the rehabilitation of the killer and making sure he won't do this shit again.

>>11798379
Those things are not what people generally mean when they refer to justice, which is something more akin to the 'making right' of an evil. The first two, besides, are simply means of making the victim feel better and do nothing to eliminate the crime which has been committed, and the latter is again a matter of self-preservation.

>>11798398
So you think we should do nothing? Or are you just being a smartass and throwing around semantics to make yourself feel smarter than the rest of us? What's the point of all this?

>>11797568
Discworld books set in Ankh Morpork. Guards! Guards! for example.

>>11798409
Putting it another way, it seems that you're agreeing with me, but trying to maintain the concept of justice by redefining it as the result of the perceived carrying out of justice. It's like you're saying, "justice is what you get when you use the illusion of justice to create a desirable effect in a person," but this is circular, right? There isn't any point, I was just responding to >>11798210. As for what we should do, I'm fine with simply being honest that what we're doing is revenge without trying to tidy it up into something nobler.

>>11798417
>I'm fine with simply being honest that what we're doing is revenge without trying to tidy it up into something nobler.
Well, I'm in fact not agreeing with you, and I think you're a pretentious ponce.

>>11798425
Carry on then.

>>11798398
>which is something more akin to the 'making right' of an evil. The first two, besides, are simply means of making the victim feel better and do nothing to eliminate the crime which has been committed (...)
You present this as some sort of contradiction, but it isn't. Providing comfort to the deprived is a part justice.

>I'm fine with simply being honest that what we're doing is revenge without trying to tidy it up into something nobler.
Justice is so much more than institutionalized revenge, although some would definitely like it to be.

>>11798436
>You present this as some sort of contradiction, but it isn't. Providing comfort to the deprived is a part justice.
It isn't. Often the "deprived" exist as abstract entities, non-persons, and those not directly victimized or substantially harmed.
>Justice is so much more than institutionalized revenge, although some would definitely like it to be.
It isn't. Do you not think this ennoblement of our baser desires provides a convenient justification for the pursuit of harmful actions? If you say, "I'm not getting revenge, I'm getting justice," that paves the way for all sorts of things. I think people build restrictions upon this into our "justice system", and create some degree of impartiality, because they realize what's actually going on, rather than being deluded into thinking "justice is blind" or some nonsense.

What is this book like?

>>11798459
Pretty great, that's what it's like.

>>11798459
Pretty good, that’s what it’s like.

>>11798372
>this is what virtue ethics does to people

"Just self-preservation" is good enough for me. I want fewer murders, therefore I want murderers to be punished (or rehabilitated, or prevented). "Justice", whether or not it "really" "exists", achieves this goal.

>>11798512
Speaking for cases which don't involve me, I feel the same way. For personal crimes it would become an emotional issue of revenge. If anything I'm denying virtue ethics here, I think.

>>11797338
Probably the Foundation Trilogy

>>11798558
>For personal crimes it would become an emotional issue of revenge
Which is why you have signed a social contract preventing you from committing revenge, instead transferring that role to an impartial court system.

rand = sasuke

>>11798193
It's not even anime, it's a shitty VN.
"The main themes of Full Metal Daemon Muramasa are the natures of evil, justice and vengeance; all pointing down to the self-destructive human behavior."
It's so bad it's hilarious.

>>11798620
Muramasa is kamige you dweeb.

>>11798593
>Which is why you have signed a social contract
I did not.
>preventing you from committing revenge, instead transferring that role to an impartial court system.
Anyone who is honest about this will admit they view the court system as a proxy so that they can get revenge vicariously.

>>11797105
You'd be superseded. Over the course of the series there are about a dozen different men that try to rape her. She even gets magic raped when another woman creates some sort of link between them so everything she feels Kahlan feels, and then this woman proceeds to hire some random guy brutally fuck her. All in front of the protagonist too. Goodkind is a very kinky guy.

>>11798638
>kamige
HAHAHAHAHA!!!
How shamfur.

>>11798648
>I did not.
You refuse to use the designated street?
>vicarious revenge
Well yeah, that's what >>11798593 said. Justice is a standardized form of revenge. It also has the preventative motive as well though so it's not simply justice=revenge. The victim's and the society's goals being met, ideally.

>>11798648
Revenge is about nothing other than catharsis and getting to feel better. But justice makes it worthwhile for all of society.

>>11797033
cause it's only 1 book

>>11796171
I exclusively read scifi and scifi is fantasy

>>11796171
you havent read nonfiction fantasy

>>11799051
Fuck off already.

>>11799075
no you fuck off

Are we being invaded by /a or something? Or is there a large overlap between fantasy fags and weebs?

anyone read this in the original Russian? I've been learning some pyccкий in my spare time and was thinking of using it as a learning aid, seeing as I love the book so much. Is it a tough read?

>>11799142
Brandon Sanderson is probably the most popular fantasy writer currently, and his books are basically anime in literature form. It's a logical conclusion.

>>11799142
It's all the same shit, west or east. Anime only seems weird because the TV hasn't told you to like it yet.
The sooner you realize this the better.

>>11799147
>reading books by Russians

>>11799195
are you new here?

>>11799186
>Anime only seems weird because the TV hasn't told you to like it yet.
You weebs are divorced from reality.

Whoa, I'm surprised that /lit/ is talking about Muramasa.

It's a really cool game. It's essentially what happens when you take a dude who's pretty morally upright and put him in a situation where he has to use underhanded means (primarily the killing of innocents) in order to stop an unquestionable evil for the greater good. I don't think the game is really deep or anything but the execution is fantastic. Kageaki is one of my favorite protags in fiction. He is essentially what I wish batman would have been.

Check it out if you ever learn japanese or if it ever gets translated

Is there a book out there where a morally upright and pure character is put into all sorts of grey situations and forced to make tough choices... and yet he pulls it off without compromising his ideals, by picking less obvious third options and going out on his way to do the absolute right thing even when the whole world is against him?

There's a lot of grimdark shit about the world wearing down the hero and turning him into barely better than the villains - or even a villain altogether - or else failing to do this and ending up with everyone dying or some shit because he couldn't "compromise". I'd like to read something more optimistic for a change, that would show that it's always possible to be better than that.

>>11799318
harry potter faggot

enjoy your mary stu trash

>>11799318
>Is there a book out there where a morally upright and pure character is put into all sorts of grey situations and forced to make tough choices... and yet he pulls it off without compromising his ideals, by picking less obvious third options and going out on his way to do the absolute right thing even when the whole world is against him?
The Gospels.
>>11799318
>There's a lot of grimdark shit about the world wearing down the hero and turning him into barely better than the villains - or even a villain altogether - or else failing to do this and ending up with everyone dying or some shit because he couldn't "compromise".
Moral relativism, invented to counteract the popularity of the Gospels.

>>11799318
The New Testament

>>11799361
>>11799373
>>11799382
Huh.

Guess I'll have to write one myself.

>>11799303
Any thematically similar works in English that you would recommend?

>>11799195
If you've not tried Roadside Picnic, I really recommend. It's a fantastic book, with a really impressive modern cultural legacy.

>>11799303
I thought it was in english on the vita system

>>11799318
>Is there a book out there where a morally upright and pure character is put into all sorts of grey situations and forced to make tough choices... and yet he pulls it off without compromising his ideals, by picking less obvious third options and going out on his way to do the absolute right thing even when the whole world is against him?
The closest thing I can think of would be Rorschach in Watchmen, but I don't think that's what you're after.

>>11799432
>I successfully made the thread about video games once so I'm going to keep trying

>>11799432
No, Muramasa isn't translated and probably never will be. Hanachirasu, the other VN written by the same author, is translated, though.

>>11799455
Oh its a VN, there is a vita game called muramasa in english but its the wrong one. Nevermind.

Zindell is actually in the sticky!
I loved the Ea Cycle, its one of my favorite works of fantasy.

>I-i thought i was the only one cuz of american coverart

>>11799318
>that would show that it's always possible to be better than that.
It isn't, though.

>>11799564
Maybe not always, but definitely more often than all these modern, supposedly mature, grimdark faggots like to depict.

Usually either there's a better option that's glaringly obvious but no one ever brings it up, or it's some kind of really arbitrary bullshit. I've honestly gotten sick of it.

>>11799586
Try the Ea cycle then. Its got that classic epic fantasy feeling and the main character remains interesting throughout.

What is the maximum number of rape scenes you would be comfortable with in a fantasy novel? "None" is not an acceptable answer since at least one is a given.

>>11799318
Gallad in Wheel if Time.

>>11799634
One, but only if there's consent.

>>11799634
How do you define a rape scene? Does the whole thing has to take place in the open? Is fade-to-black okay? Does it still count if it happened somewhere nearby, and while it wasn't outright stated that someone was raped, it was made pretty obvious in context?

The first type out of three I don't like, less because of some moral reasons and more because it's almost invariably written all ham-handedly, as either fetish bait or to make someone obviously the villain, or both. The other two are okay, though. The book I'm currently writing contains both types.

>>11799634
Around 40% of the page count

>>11799646
Graphic depiction of the entire rape.

Is this a good series to get into?

>>11799666
Good choice, Satan.

>>11799666
Just read the first two parts. Endymion retcons the ending just for the sake of getting to wrirte mediocre cash grab sequels.

>>11798982
>The Galactic Mage, Book 2 on bibliotik
Wrong.

>>11797575
You think dark tower is urban? Most of the books are western or post apocalyptic imo

>>11797568
Does The City of Saints and Madmen count as urban fantasy? What about Perdido Street Station or The City & the City? The Anubis Gates?

>>11799634
I don't have strong feelins on this but I felt really uncomfortable when R Scott Bakker had his savage / orc trope dude (Cnuur or some shit with accents on every vowel) fuck a hole in the ground after a battle.

>>11799666
First one is one of the best sci-fi books ever written, second is also very strong but has a distinct change in tone.
3 and 4 r shit

>>11799142
It's almost as if we were on a weeb website.

>>11799686
i treat it as a 1 book novel so i dont get disappointed

has this been done?

>Isekkai
>as the story goes on, nothing is reveal ed about the characters backstories
>eventually, they themselves notice and realize there are huge gaps in their memories related to just about anything personal
>they know their names, they remember their hometowns and favorite movies, but they dont remember people they knew or their relationships
>they start beginning to suspect that the setting itself is altering their memories and filling the gaps with vauge feelings of longing as a way of driving them towards their assigned quests

i think michael-scott earle just came but under a different pen name trying to cut ties to his old name.
so here i am browsing mobilisms fantasy and sci-fi section just to see whats been released recently. when i stumble upon pic related. premise seemed kinda interesting so i download it not paying much attention to the cover or the author since i never heard of him. when i opened the book up. picrelated is what i see.
there is only two people that do this these custom fonts in that way long with a picture of just the book name in front of a chapter. the first is harmon cooper but he isnt banned and still does stuff on amazon. the second is michael-scott earle.

tldr:
i may have completely by accentident stumbled upon michael-scott earle trying to get back into amazon by taking on a new persona.

>>11799988 (checked)
https://www.reddit.com/r/litrpg/comments/8zg7uu/another_author_disappears_via_ban_from_amazon/
>amazon shoas shitrpg
good riddance

>>11799988
>>11800082
I haven't followed recent events. What's up with this Michael-Scott Earle guy, and why do things keep getting banned from Amazon?

I'm looking for a really fun read, but I'm not a /sffg/ guy at all. Any recs?

>>11800194
If you want something more personalized than the charts linked in the OP you have to give us something more to work on. What do you consider "fun"?

>>11799318
>Is there a book out there where a morally upright and pure character is put into all sorts of grey situations and forced to make tough choices... and yet he pulls it off without compromising his ideals, by picking less obvious third options and going out on his way to do the absolute right thing even when the whole world is against him?

>>11800194
>>11800208
I enjoyed the first half of Red Mars because of the personalities, but the second half became a myriad of nonsense, and the characters became secondary.

I'm finishing LOTR, it's okay. I find Tolkein's prose too dry. I want more poetry and panache.

Otherwise, I'm just trying to read through the /canon/ of philosophy. Right now, I'm working through Emerson, the German Idealists, and Nietzsche. I'm enjoying their stuff.

>>11800243
>I want more poetry and panache.
Check out Tanith Lee if you're a prosefag. One of the few female writers in fantasy/sci-fi worth reading and her prose is pretty unique.

>>11800254
Thanks, I'll give her a check.

>>11800243
And Zindell, his characters are amazing. Panache a plenty

>>11800172
I guess they don't want shit clogging up their system.

>>11800222
Fuck yeah!

>>11800377
>I guess they don't want shit clogging up their system.
Then how come they started the whole KDP program to begin with?

>>11800194
>>11800243
Embassytown

>>11800387
Ah but they had no idea just how much shit there is out there.
LitRPG shit, web novels shit, badly copied chinese shit, badly copied VN shit, furry shit, the list goes on and on. Poor Amazon was awash in a sea of poo.

>>11800410
>Vagina Miéville
Why are you so mean anon?

>>11800419
I can't get aroused over a tail that short.

>>11800450
That photo was not there to arouse you filthy degenerate.

>>11800462
All furries are for arousing, anon. That's why they're called furshit.

>>11800462
I don't get why you're posting them then. What's the correlation?

>>11800463
But that girl is just some cosplayer having fun. Not a borderline obese, socially retarded loser in a 10k fursuit.

>>11800470
I was illustrating my point about furry shit on Amazon.

>>11800482
Fursuits are more commonly in the 2-3k range, but I digress.
Know any books that feature character wearing aviators?

>>11800495
>Know any books that feature character wearing aviators?
A classic.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3367772-top-gun

>>11799637

>>11799839
Grimgar and log horizon touch on this.

In grimgar they can't quite figure out who or what they are, merely having vague impressions of the people they first spawned with.
In log horizon they suspect that they lose memories everytime they die.

>>11800940
You wouldn't talk to the old crazy cat lady so why are you not ignoring the dumb weeb?
Come now.

>>11799988
narc on him lol

>>11800172
Okay so basically MSE writes/wrote these trashy Men's Adventure stuff. IIRC he's got one series about a guy who gets turned into a tiger-man super soldier, another about a marine that gets abducted by a space ship that needs him to kill stuff, and something about a guy who trains dinosaurs. Tons of hot women throw themselves at the main characters and there are poorly written sex scenes. But hey, that stuff sells, and he was something like the 5th or 10th most popular Kindle Unlimited author and was allegedly making a couple hundred thousand dollars a month.

He got banned off Amazon for apparently using some kind of formatting fuckery to make Amazon think that his books had more pages in than then they actually did and apparently also something where the book would jump to the last page so that anybody trying it out through Kindle Unlimited would automatically count as having "read" the book. This is apparently quite common in cutthroat world of KU romance writing (look up "cockygate"), so it was just Amazon cleaning house of him and similar book-stuffers.

In early August Amazon offered to let him come back if he got a "real publisher", and he was apparently back for a couple days before they apparently kicked him off again because apparently he didn't even bother to set up a shell company based out of a Delaware PO BOX.

He's also attempted to trademark the phrase "Dragon Slayer" and book covers where somebody is posing with a gun.

>>11801142
>cockygate
"How an author trademarking the word “cocky” turned the romance novel industry inside out."

Words fail me.

Are Elizabeth Moon's SF books good? I do like her fantasy (Paksenarrion) ones.

>>11801421
I've only read her Vatta's War stuff but I like it. It's a similar "growth of a hero" setup: A junior military officer gets kicked out of the military for causing a scandal, to get her out of the way her family gives her a old trading ship destined for the breaker's yards but she ends up fighting pirates who blew up the FTL telephone network.

The sequel series is just strange so far, in the first one the protagonist spends most of it stuck on a life raft and then a secret base on Mystery Island. Then in the second one she spends most of it trapped in a house while her planet's immigration agents try to arrest her and (for no reason) behaves like a bitch to her sister who's trying to help, then the back third of the book is about The Conspiracy starting a civil war which gets resolved because of how heroic and great the protagonist is. It's been a notable, Honor Harrington style decline in quality so far. First series is still good though.

What's some SciFi that covers the Singularity and how society adapts to it (or fails to)?

>>11795540
daily reminder

What are these genres missing? I'd like to start writing but I don't know where to start or where to go for criticism. I want to do something with a timeless appeal, but not just derivative.

>>11801574
>I want to do something with a timeless appeal
Then don't jam a bunch of modern day political bullshit into your stories or write whatever is currently trendy.

>>11801574
Side-character dealing with personal and small problems while stuck on the fringes of an epic fantasy tale. Greatly effected by, but never really able to influence, the clash of prophesied heroes and villains with ancient calculated malice. The tangible villain of the story being a similarly insignificant what's-their-name in the grand scheme of things, with the only difference being that they're a bit of a dick, so the story won't really devolve into sword-fights and murdering. Rival contract workers, couriers or small business owners. Maybe even have them be a former friend or a by-gone summer love.

Anyone have any related recommendations?

>>11801574
>timeless appeal
>but not derivative
>genre fiction

>>11801702
Not JUST derivative. As in bringing something new to old ideas.

Are there any /sffg/-approved VNs?

>>11801738
For sure.

>>11796171
Because this world is hell and evil goes largely unpunished.

>>11796236
I only looked at the cover, got horrible flashbacks of the fantasy books I read as a child, and legitimately gagged.

>>11796653
Hyperion, up to book four and I stopped.

>>11801543
his story is shit anyway

>>11798673
Can't imagine why people look down on this genre.

>>11801804
Fantasy is people trying to rip off Tolkien. Scifi is people who have no idea how humans behave writing about rockets, or trying to rip off Star Wars/Trek.

Any good books with elves and dark elves in it?

Hey guys, it's bunnyanon with one last shill.

Still a few hours left of the book's giveaway. If you live in the US, and haven't gotten too interested in the book but would be okay with free stuff, feel free to give it a go.
https://www.goodreads.com/giveaway/show/283512-the-straggler-s-mask

That'll be all. Think I'll take a break out of shilling for a while, write a new book or two. Currently doing a sex scene for the sequel.

>>11801913
>Currently doing a sex scene for the sequel.
>these books are not about the sexual exploits of my self-insert-fursona I swear please get baited into reading this

>>11800082
>KU is half of my income
>So I put out a book a month.
>I just bought a new house and I'm a full time author, losing Amazon would really screw me over.
Jesus Christ, I can't imagine banking a fucking mortgage on this. Or being somebody who reads books being pumped out assembly line style monthly.

>>11801942
If the main character is my self-insert, then how come he's so small and weak and useless, everyone keeps kicking him around, and terrible in bed to boot?

>>11801973
Maybe he shouldn't cheat if he's got so much at stake. Didn't he get enough money to get by already?

>>11801977
cause thats what turns you on

>>11802026
But then wouldn't you abusing me, say, by calling my book furshit and never reading it, also turn me on?

>>11802031
that is not me, i just showed up

>>11795596
I just read the new Book of Dust and it was fantastic. HDM is a fantastic YA series. I'm 32 tho btw and love trash like Crichton and GURRM.
>Books are for THINKING, not enjoyin'!

>>11796916
Honestly having read the entire series I can't really recommend it. The first last 8 or however books are so bad compared to the first 4. Reading Soul of the Fire is like hitting a brick wall.
I tried to read The Omen Machine a couple of years ago and I gave it up halfway through which I never do.
>>11797595
LOL
>>11801789
Thomas Covenant Chronicles

>>11796171
>Now, to separate science fiction from fantasy. This is impossible to do, and a moment’s thought will show why. Take psionics; take mutants such as we find in Ted Sturgeon’s wonderful MORE THAN HUMAN. If the reader believes that such mutants could exist, then he will view Sturgeon’s novel as science fiction. If, however, he believes that such mutants are, like wizards and dragons, not possible, nor will ever be possible, then he is reading a fantasy novel. Fantasy involves that which general opinion regards as impossible; science fiction involves that which general opinion regards as possible under the right circumstances. This is in essence a judgment-call, since what is possible and what is not possible is not objectively known but is, rather, a subjective belief on the part of the author and of the reader.

>>11797338
Dune. This isn't debatable

>>11797512
lol no
>>11797568
Faerie Tale by Feist

>>11798225
Justice was created by God so it is anything but an illusion

>>11802156
Go back to write, Brandon

>>11802168
I write already, you fool, even as we speak. You cannot possibly fathom my pace or dedication.

>>11795540
>How do you feel about orcs?
Depends on the mythology. Tolkienesque shit shouldn’t have girl orcs. They are birthed from evil magic or man/elf rape.
>Are attractive female orcs immersion breaking for you?
Full female orcs should be ugly but muscular in a hot way. Hot orcs should be half something else.
>What unique takes on orcs have you read?
Nothing really Tolkienesque aestics are played out.

Give me some books that are "Sci-fi alien structure that is being explored and is spooky or malevolent". Here are some I have read so far.

>Blindsight - Peter Watts (v. good)
>Gateway - Frederik Pohl (not that good)
>Moon - Aldys Bundy (quite bad)
>Diamond Dogs - Alistair Reynolds (v. good but massive blue balls)
>Ship of Fools "aka Unto Leviathan" - Paul Russo (horrible)
>Hyperion - Dan Simmons (excellent)
>Rendezvous with Rama - Arthur C. Clarke (excellent)
>2001 A Space Odyssey - Arthur C. Clarke (p good)

>>11802198
There are Lovecraft stories that do that, At the Mountains of Madness, The Nameless City and The Shadow Out of Time come to mind. In the Walls of Eryx fits your description exactly too, though it might be a lot simpler than what you're looking for, but it's very short anyway.

I'm reading Greg Egan's Orthogonal series and this is probably the most challenging work of his that I've read so far.

I find myself thumbing back to previous chapters to re-read the basics of his fictional take on relativity and light.
There are literal spacetime diagrams in the book.
The characters discuss the solutions to their fictional light propagation equation and conclude that the universe needs the topology of a torus to prevent exponential solutions from existing.
What an awesome read.

>>11802198
Richard Morgan's Broken Angles (sequel to Altered Carbon) is about an abandoned alien spacecraft. Was an OK read (nothing special), though if you liked Altered Carbon it might be worth reading.

>>11801711
Hey maybe before trying to reinvent the genre you should try actually learning to write in it first?

>>11802198
How does Gateway fit into your criteria? It's just a bunch of tiny ships.

>>11795569
Nine Princes in Amber by Zelazny

>>11795596
I read the Dark Materials and there's a bunch of things that should make me like it but I was underwhelmed. I like YA but couldn't get into it at all.

>>11795636
A lot of the newer big fantasy series are kinda bad actually. Your tastes might have matured but there's still quality fantasy of you look past the bestsellers.
Or you might have depression.

>>11795556
fpbp

>>11802315
That's why I asked where to start writting so I can develop.

>>11802322
The ships and the 'motherships' that the baby ships dock in are alien. There's mystery/unease in terms of the baby ships being mysterious and impossible to fully control, and the book talks about alien architecture and artifacts (admittedly this is all pretty boring; those weird artifacts they find are never cool or spooky and the 'tunnel' architecture of the motherships and within some of the planets is nothing special either)

You can definitely argue it doesn't fit the criteria I suppose

>>11802323
same zelazny as lord of light? because that book was /lit/

>>11802073
This/10
Didn't even read the 6th one so good to know I was right in thinking it wasn't getting better.

>>11802269
I only read the first Orthogonal book. I was too much of a brainlet although I loved the concept of ever-advancing technology.

>>11802390
Write what interests you. If you don't find it interesting nobody else will either, because it will lack genuine passion.

Wasp Factory was fucked.

What is some other Bankscore that isn't Culture crap?

>>11801421
Remnant Population>The Speed of Dark
Both are good tho

>>11802758
Against A Dark Background is the best of his standalone books IMO.

>>11801498
Check out the metamorphosis of prime intellect. I read it back in highschool and at the time it was freely available online. Interesting piece, more novella than novel. The AI refuses to let people die so humans create death cults where they make a sport out of physical trauma iirc. I found it interesting when I read it.

>>11802785
>The AI refuses to let people die

well that's fucking terrifying

is it scared of being alone?

are there any scifi/fantasy novels where the main characters are homos

>>11802789
It's been years since I read and I'd need to read a plot summary to refresh myself. iirc it perceives death as a wrong it can prevent and the protagonist of the novel wishes to dies and tries to convince the machine to let her. Even in highschool I think I finished it on a single weekend day. It's a novella and if you're curious about it you could find out in a few hours.

>>11802829
Lord of the rings

>>11802846
I know this is a joke response but actually books where the main characters are super best friends are just as good if not better and I already love sam/frodo so thx in advance for any similar recommendations

>>11802872
Robin Hobb's farseer books have a strong male friendship that delves into what you're looking for. You want the kingkiller trilogy or the tawny man trilogy. Kingkiller really only gets into it around book 2 and 3. Tawny man is much more focused on the relationship but you can't skip the first trilogy because you wouldn't know the characters (can skip the second liveship traders trilogy though). Also it's a bit scattered in the novels and they have the intellectual depth of harry potter but the Outlander books explore an unrequited romantic male attraction that evolves into a strong friendship. They're actually quite fun in a summer beach kind of way.

>>11796653
Vurt
Light - Harrison
Gas, Sewer and Electric
Last Call
Carve the Sky
Phantom Tollbooth
The Jungle Books
Lord of Light
The Night Circus
Zod Wallop
Cloud's End
Software - Rucker

>>11796653

>>11802758
I liked The Bridge

>>11802198
Eon by Greg Bear
Titan by John Varley

What was bad about Ship of Fools? I have it on my reading list

>>11801498
It's not what you're looking for but the short story Traveller's Rest by David I. Masson was pretty neat and features at least parts of a society where there is a lot of time dilation going on.

>>11801543
>Trash
>Trash 2.0
>Where's Trash vol. 3?!?!?!?!?!
Or you could read something good

>>11801574
Protip: you're not going to write something great by taking a vote.

>>11801574
More hard SF

>>11802829
Swordspoint

>>11803011
Hard SF is a meme, anon.

>>11803033
You're a meme

>>11802829
Quest for Lost Heroes has a gay couple among the protags, but their faggotry is so subtle that they could be mistaken for simply being very close best friends. But if you want something more (intentionally) graphic then I guess The Steel Remains. Couldn't finish it myself because the author intentionally made the protag a flaming faggot and the gay sex scenes intentionally graphic.

>>11803036
Well this meme is going to rape you.

>>11801574
There's a complete lack of adventure in modern fantasy. Every books is required by publishers to have at least 12 POVs and a bunch of political bullshit.

>>11801574
Instead of looking at what's missing look instead at what's saturating the market and do the opposite.

>>11802198
Ringworld - Niven
Diaspora - Egan
Raft - Baxter

>>11802906
both sound interesting, thank you
>>11803040
>but their faggotry is so subtle that they could be mistaken for simply being very close best friends.
honestly that might be my fav, thanks for the rec anon. might try the other one too
>>11803019

>>11802829
China Mountain Zhang.

>>11803040
>the gay sex scenes intentionally graphic.

They seemed about the same as the sex scenes in Altered Carbon IMO, I think Morgan just has issues with sex in general.

>>11803142
>honestly that might be my fav, thanks for the rec anon. might try the other one too
Yea it's the best way to do fags in fantasy. They don't do anything gay at all in the entire book and it makes sense given their characterization.

>>11799988
so i finished reading the book and i actually enjoyed it for what it is. its a fun little space adventure with a bit of romance. i dont actually think its michael-scott earle. the story is rather simple:

>guy worked for mega corp as broker
>got fired and is now broke
>turns out he has some cash stashed away and he and his assistant (the cat girl) go and get it
>they pick up the money and an engineer(the silver haired girl) on that planet and tussle with a gangster in the process which ends in them brokering a deal to repair the docks with the help of the ship drones and the engineer so mining companies can come to the backwater planet and mine shit in turn bringing back business to the shithole
>they leave and go to a planet of fish people and save the son of the headhoncho
>suits him fine since he actually wants to broker a deal for the planet to piss on the megacorps that all want the planet too because the planete is conveniently surrounded by worm holes that lead all over the galaxy and it would make a convenient trading hub
>to earn the right to broker a deal mc has to do three trials. he proceeds to more or less ace them and also meets an old rival. we get some background story on the cat girl and how shes a test tube baby called a gen-mod and such people are usually used as sex slaves
>trials over everyone has a party
>end of book 1


its not bad actually. no grammar mistakes i could find and the language used isnt simple or repetitive. thankfully no "ltrpg" elements. also doesnt feel like an MSE book. well apart from both girls falling for the mc.
im actually giving it the benefit of the doubt and say its not MSE and just some random guy who wants in on the pulp cashcow that is KU.
still its not bad. could have been way worse.

Let's get our politics on and test our mettle at Diplomacy

www.playdiplomacy.com/
Is an online version of the board game Diplomacy. With your objective being to conquer a number of points on the map, there's zero chance in the game and it comes down to who makes what order. Players will work together and backstab each other but only 1 can be on top.

This game is played with a 24hour turn timer, the only thing you need to do every day is tell your various armies and fleets what you want them to do.

Once you've made your account, go to
https://www.playdiplomacy.com/games.php?subpage=joinable&game_id=148405
to locate the game "Clover"

Password is trump

This game will only start when 7 people sign up, it will be a battle between multiple boards. 2 left

>>11802829
the Night's Masque trilogy

it's about not-elves coming to Shakespearean times and about gay actors being gay

How does chronicles of Amber manage to be so good despite being in first person?

>>11803813
There are no rules in writing, only guidelines - guidelines that the inexperienced and the incompetent should follow like gospel, but that a great author can readily disregard.

"No first person" is one such guideline.

What is the grimdarkest fantasy novel?

>>11803849
The Witcher.

>>11803870
>

>>11803849
Second Apocalypse series

>>11803849
Dark Lord by Ed Greenwood.
The things that happen in that just ain't right.

>>11802198
>>Gateway - Frederik Pohl (not that good)
excuse me who the fuck do you think you are

New bread?

>>11803175
sex???????

>>11804582
nope. its fade to black and implications.

>>11803849
Probably Bakker's garbage. I mean a 6 year old boy gets RAPED in the fucking prologue of the very first book. Doesn't get any grimderp than that.

>>11804594
>6 year old boy gets RAPED
By a man or a woman?

>>11804117
dear that last part of the first book.
had to drop it once they got captured. shit is just inhumane. is Ed Greenwood a cuck? a masochist? just a bad person?
dropped the book hard and never looked back.

>>11804602
Man, you degenerate.