/lit/ - Literature

>take the Zhuangzi-pill poster comes up with a new gimmick

the final red-pill of chinese thought is actually the I-ching

>>11785958
>Politics

Fuck off.

>>11785951

>>11785987
>Western philosophy
>The dialectic inevitably leads to the inverse of the Kantian conception of morality, which, as Nietzsche deconstructed, leads inevitably to the consequentialist view of the moral question, and...


>Eastern philosophy
>Waterfalls are cool. Be like a waterfall.


Western philosophy was a mistake.

>>11785987
Fear mongering faggotry.

>>11785987
People like this should be fucking shot.

>>11785998
kek, this is pretty good

>>11785987
The Semitic religions and their offshoots were a big fucking mistake

>>11785998
kek

>>11785987
>LOL U GO 2 HEL!

Every fucking time.

>>11785987
This but unironically. You faggots don't understand the implications of a Christ

>>11786099
Christ was just a typical eastern mystic who was misunderstood by the people of his time because of their minds being distorted by the influence of Jewish and Greek thought

>The kingdom of heaven is within
>easier for a camel to pass through eye of needle than for a rich man to enter heaven
>lol actually just pray to a statue of me and believe in me and join some rituals and you get happy fun-time in sky when you die, nothing transcendental in this life, nope! nothing!

>>11785978
>I-ching
taoism is derived from the i ching, same as confucianism

>>11786115
Says you, who gives a shit. We aren't going to argue eachother into a religious perspective. That screencap is horrendous tho, as is your reply. He is a priest, of course he would say they would lead someone to hell, he's a fucking priests, its actually more amazing he even claimed that the text were 'interesting'. Much less could be said about the crowd this picture panders to, and even exist.

>>11785978
I-Ching is astrology, Meyers Briggs tier. It is beautiful tho. Taoism/Confucianism are lit tho.

>>11786121
Yes, I'm aware that's why I posted it. If you're woke enough you can get an entire distillation of chinese wisdom and metaphysics from reading it, you have to be on like level 83 for that though. Zhuangzi, Liezi etc are still only in the 50's.

>>11786129
>Taoism/Confucianism are lit tho
you can't have either without the i ching. just because people can use the i ching for divination does not mean that this is its main purpose. its a metaphysical codex of sorts

>>11785951
I'm not kidding - Taoism taught me how to enjoy life again. Western philosophers just told me enjoying myself isn't important. I'll stick to the Orientals, thanks.

>>11786121
So Confucius made the I-Ching, ka-ching?

>>11786147
wat

>>>Western religious thought and philosophy always tells you to abstain from pleasurable persuits

Why even live?

>>11785998
This post was a mistake

>>11786146
Enjoy burning in an agonizing hell for all eternity for picking the wrong side, loser lmao.

>>11786146
You're probably learning some boomer version of taoism

>>11786115

lol yi jing was retroactively appropriated by both daoists and confucians during the han dynasty because it was one of the few books to survive qin shi huangdi's purge. divinatory texts and agricultural manuals were spared. The yi from yijing, means easy. It was the literally "divination for dummies" of the warring states period. But it really didn't matter what the original text said because in its subsequent history it was overlayed with such deep layers of hermeneutical interference and philosophical sophistication that people actually came to think of it as a philosophical text in its own right. The yijing is boring, but what people did with it - from the zhouyi cantong qi to the wilhelm-jung "translation" is what's interesting about it.

>>11786146
>Western philosophers just told me enjoying myself isn't important
This is correct though

>>11786185
>doesn't know who Epicurus is

>>11786198
Anyone can read Zhuangzhi and Laozi’s fundamental texts of Daoism (which are not super difficult if you’re used to philosophical thinking and poetic language) and get their own interpretation of it. It’s not that hard. I’m sick of this chauvinistic idea on /lit/ “Dude lol my intepretation of Eastern philosophy is better than yours you’re just a Starbucks drinking pseudo-Orientalist”

>>11786198
No, boomers don't know how to enjoy themselves.

>>11786205
It's incorrect in my case. I prefer enjoying myself.

>>11786267
>if i like it it is important

>>11786205
You are one BORING motherfuckers.

>>11786200
So you admit that God is a cruel, jealous tyrant, yes?

>>11786123
I didn't think that was a tactic that priests actually used. When I had my first real doubts about Christianity, a man from my church sat down with me and we discussed it calmly in a way that settled my confusion yet didn't leave me with some overly rigid emotional message like "repent now and you will experience ever-lasting bliss!". I'm not sure if I lucked out, but this was in the heart of the South where Christians are supposedly as wacky as they come, yet I've never had a bad experience.

Taoism, like most traditional religions, is actually mostly correct, simply missing the crucial component of the Christian God, and thus having some distorted values and perspectives. I doubt that Satan could cook up a belief system made up of nothing but lies. Such a worldview would just immediately drive itself to extinction. Only isolated psychopaths usually adopt such positions. I think Marxism (or leftism in general) is probably the closest thing to a pure lie that Satan would bother trying to push on a mass scale. It contains just enough truth to let it to survive and do as much damage as possible.

>>11786803
I think you are literally insane.

>>11786803
Christianity is just a breakaway sect of Judaism which itself acquired almost all of its doctrines from Zoroastrianism after the Persians freed the Jews from Babylon and rules them as subjects for ~400 years afterwards. The Jews didn't fully understand what they had been taught by the Persians though and the god they came up was an absurd caricature of Ahura Mazda. Jesus actually brought it closer back to what it was but then this was distorted by various additional layers of thought added in over the centuries from Jewish legalistic thinking to various strains of Greek philosophy. The Christian concept of god and the trinity is just a massive clusterfuck that emerged from a bunch of different cultures mixing their ideas and you can trace the roots of it all back primarily to the Persians and from them to the proto-Indo-Europeans. It's basically like if telegony was real and some whore banged the whole town and then the kid she had at the end was a mix of everyone's traits. Christianity is good for mid-wits to have feel-good outlets and for community bonding but for people of high intelligence Daoism/Vedanta/Tantra/Sufism/Mahayana and to some extent Neoplatonism are where the real stuff is.

>nothing personal kid, in fact I'm doing you a favor by giving you the whole truth up front

>>11786922
I think you are literally a effeminate faggot or a chick.

>>11786929
You mean.. GASP Religion can... EVOLVE?!

>>11786935
Yeah.. I just think you're batshit insane, nice comeback, needs a little work though.

>>11786922
Insanity is not knowing the difference between right and wrong. I picture you as a godless literal faggot liberal drooling and babbling about how all cultures are equal and morality is relative. Is that about right, you insane moron?

>>11786948
you threw the biggest hissyfit to get yourselves de-pathologized only to turn around and cuntily diagnose everyone else

>>11786929
>Christianity is just a breakaway sect of Judaism
Stopped reading there. Christianity is not descended from Pharisaism.

>>11786948
That wasn't my response and I didn't delete it. Stop false-flagging, liar.

>>11786929
damn dude

any books on this?

the way many of you faggots are acting just proves that none of you understand a single bit of the serious sides of the philosophies you tout

>>11786948
>>11786962
I was the one who wrote that, I deleted it because I thought it was a lame and ineffective response, although I still thing you’re kind of a fag. I’m not even a Christian like that guy is, it’s more just the “OMGGGGF U BELIEBE IN THE DEVIL AND GOD AND ARE CHRISTIAN????!!! HOW F&$@@KING CRAZY ARE YOU!!!l” mindset I found laughable.

>>11786314
>god gives humans perfect happiness for eternity on the condition that they remain obedient
>humans disobey for the entirety of history
>god never stops forgiving
>"GOD IS CRUEL REEEEE"

if it were truly mature, learned, patient and wise practitioners of the best streams of Eastern and Western philosophy meeting together,

they would pretty much agree on everything

they're not gonna turn into a couple pussy babies slapping each other trying to decide who is right. like a buncha immature little boys. that's what you 4chan incels do.

>>11785951
>Taoists
if retarded Taoists are right, why do they larp as buddhists with their retarded mahayana?

>>11785951
Fuck Taoists, goddamn faggots. Real niggas are Daoists

>>11786064
>Spelling Hel in its original form.

Clearly not a man who would fall for child's forgery of other religions.

>>11786977
>Be a fuckboy poofter with unlimited power
>Create beings of your own image (fuck, the ego on this guy) with the capacity to fail you
>Tempt them to fail knowing the human condition completely
>Based Angel decides to stick it to daddy and tempt them further
>they break
>Lol i guess i should commend my flock to eternal pain and suffering

>>11786929
Seconding this >>11786963 . Give us some books on this topic.

>>11786803
based schizo poster

>>11787050
>taoism is a single religion of a single time

>>11786803
This is literally correct. It's why astrology and shit like that is sometimes quite accurate. It's Satan's way of getting you in before he fucks you

>>11786978
This, guys, this.

Difference of perspective does not equal difference on fundamental issues.

Though I would like to know more about how exactly did OP even come to the conclusion that "muh side is right" when Dao is against single encompassing truth over others.

>>11787284
In the Gospels, Jesus Himself explained that Satan is the father of lies. All lies ultimately come from Satan, and people who love and practice lies are the children of Satan. This doctrine, as well as the literal existence of Satan, is orthodox Christian theology, and in no way indicative of any form of mental disturbance. Of course you already know this, and you're just engaging in gaslighting, because you're a liar to the core of your being.

>>11787300
>astrology is the work of satan
what a high-iq religion you got going there

>>11787336
What about psychopathy and brain chemistry? People who are created by god with a predisposition to lie and not understand why it is wrong? Is it satans fault the child is born this way, completely undermining doctrine, with a sentence to live in burning agony forever in the afterlife or is it gods hand that ultimately judges the conception unworthy of his love.

>>11787340
When indulged in or taken seriously, occultism and divination and the like represent a lack of faith in God and a substitution of that proper faith with superstition, and are as such idols and sins, and hence the work of Satan. The Bible, the Church Fathers, and the canon laws and bylaws of various churches agree on this point (with some caveats). There's no need for you to insult the intelligence of any body of believers simply because you are unaware of the premises behind their conclusions.

>>11787348
>what about
Indeed.

>>11787368
>oh no someone made a valid point when questing my beliefs
>Hehe i know i'll cleverly dodge the question so i don't have to defend my stance or interpretation of my religion.
You're the worst kind of christfag.

>>11787340
>astrology is the work of satan
Not quite. It's more that anything that is not conceretely God can be manipulated by Satan. This is why the New Age is so dangerous. Watch this footage and tell me it's not demonic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7gzSsqMgCk

>>11787429
>it’s only okay when we do it

>>11787383
>cleverly
Compliment accepted.

>hate china for my whole life
>get convinced to watch three kingdoms
>end up reading it and then a bunch of other chinese books
>chinese history turns out to be fucking amazing and a lot of their older literature is lotr tier
>finally, i ready myself to enter the depths of chinese philosophy...
>"Uh, like, just stop thinking, lol. If you want to step past this river, see, you can't do it, but if you become one with the world there's no longer any river to cross and you're all powerful!"
Needless to say, I think chinks are /his/ territory.

>>11786295
>what is perspective

>>11786954
Christianity didn't work for me, this does.

Sorry if that offends you.

>>11787451
That's a lie, you didn't real accept the compliment. It was a work of satan guiding your hand, when we resort to burning the heathens and witches at the pyre your name will be first on the list.

>>11787452
>I can't see the value or achieve a complete meditative state and don't see the power behind cutting ties to all want
I don't subscribe to eastern religion but they made some great points.

>>11787452
Mate, I've been fascinated by ancient China for a looong time now.

>>11787485
I never said I don't see the value in achieving a meditative state. That's just not actually addressing any of the fundamental issues of philosophy. Might as well just tell people to kill themselves and stop thinking about things because there's no real truth to find anyway. No matter how uplifting and ethical you make anything in the Eastern tradition sound, it ultimately reaches an eerily similar conclusion as total nihilism.

>>11787491
It is top tier history.

>>11787473
Okay, you're fucked up in the head, get some help before you hurt someone you fucking sociopath.

>>11786188
And your evidence is a guy who thought the west had reached its natural conclusion and would die of its own decadence. Its going to be a Long asian century I see.

>>11787494
>Might as well just tell people to kill themselves and stop thinking about things because there's no real truth to find anyway
I laughed sincerely. But still, Buddha taught that it's ok to want to live and eat, drink and generally maintain health and keep yourself alive. That's like saying hinduism is a scam because lol i can just kill myself to reincarnate if my gf dumps me. I wouldn't say it's nihilism because the path to enlightenment is a goal and meaning of life itself but i suppose that's just my interpretation.

>>11787471
It doesn't offend me. There's nothing sadder in the world than a false convert, except an apostate.

>>11787473
Unintentional compliments are guaranteed to be sincere. I'm genuinely flattered.

>>11787499
>He genuinely believes someone else believes there's going to be a day of the rope
Embarrassing
>>11787595
Tbh i don't see how a true, sane christen can call someone else a literal faggot, liberal insane moron and then say there's nothing more sad than a false convert.

>>11787595
It's think you are stuck in some sort of hell-realm.

I will pray for you.

>>11785987
*tips little boy*

>>11787609
>Tbh i don't see
You need say no more.

>>11787686
Truly you have received your reward in full.

>>11787694
>>11786018
>>11786025
>>11786064
>>11786099
>>11787694
high iq brothers detected
this is why i come to /lit/

>>11787752
That pic should be in a fucking museum.

>>11787752
Fuck, I've never noticed that the laptop has a similar image on it, on which you can also see a similar image but from an anime.

>>11787429
bruh that looks lit

>>11785998
"like"

naw dude scrub off that boomer alan watt shitface interpretation. The taoists were deadass serious, they said be a rock. Not "like" a rock, no, be a fucking rock.

be a rock.

>>11785998
heh

>>11787457
irrelevant to the absolute truth

>>11786135
Wait, how can you get an entire distillation of Chinese philosophy from using the I Ching?

t. I Ching user and chinese philosophy reader.

>>11788670
Wow, that's rock man.

Can i read the I-Ching front to back? I have it on my list.

>>11789055
by being woke enough

>>11789055
I think he’s referring to the symbolism of it instead of using it practically and literally as a divination tool. It’s literally called “The Book of Changes”, so instead of interpreting the hexagrams as referring to literal events so that you can divine the future, you view it as a totality, a catalog of the changes and cycles life, the universe, and man goes through. Refer it to cosmological, psychological, and natural processes. It’s sufficiently enigmatic and universal that you could read much into it — whether this is a plus or a minus for it’s supposed profundity I’ll leave it for you to judge.

>>11787752
Are you being sarcastic? If you are, then fuck you.

>>11786193
Enjoy your stay in heaven with pearl-clutching bigot and self-hating autists. I'll be in hell with the pornstars, the scientists and the cool musicians, thanks.
And your mom.

>>11789317
Its more of a "shake coins write out corresponding results and turn to page indicated thing. Its an Oracle, not safe for buttbaby christfags 100%

>>11789317
You have to start in the middle and simultaneously go backward and forward from there.

NATURE IS SATANS CHURCH.

>>11785978
>a fucking game manual for aristocrats
You took one too many pills desu