/lit/ - Literature

There never was any good science fiction

Niggers and women can't write worth shit

Poetry should be held with equal regard to prose

I like reading Star Wars novels.

Fantasy is one of the most immature, least subversive genres. Even its canon is of average quality.

I have to try to stay attentive to books. I have to make myself lose touch of the fact of boring looking words on a boring page and imagine. Slight anxiety of boredom creeps into my heart when I think about it.

I haven't even read half the books on my bookshelf. It makes me feel pretentious and behind.

Fantasy and science fiction have more engaging characters and plots than regular literature.

>>1170273

Then why waste the money buying them? Not raging, just curious.

>>1170274
>fantasy
>engaging characters

nope.avi

>>1170281

yes.jpg

...Stephenson?

*awaits rocks to face*

>>1170273
Exactly this. D:

Chinua Achebe doesn't deserve all the praise he gets. I could write better than him in third grade.

Also, what the fuck is the deal with Camus? I had never heard of him before yesterday. Since then, I've seen his name a dozen times on /lit/, heard a friend reference him, and I saw a quote by him on a physics website, (and I saw his name somewhere else, but I can't remember where) WHAT THE FUCK.

>>1170287
alright, two good scifi books have been written since the eighties

poul anderson says no

I really don`t care for books written after 1950.

>>1170292
Gonna try to sneak another in there.
...bradbury?

>>1170290

I'd agree with that; Things Fall Apart was a decent read, but it's not like it posed any spectacular insight into the nature of ideological insensitivity. It's also extremely incomplete as a cultural study, so what does it really accomplish?

>>1170304
I dunno.
the only thing I've read by him after the classic stuff is From The Dust Returned, which I didn't enjoy very much.

>>1170306
that's cool, he actually died way before I thought he did so i deleted that one.

>>1170307
bradbury is still alive, man

>>1170306
wow nevermind that dudes still trucking, im bad at reading author bios. Yeah, his stuff is cool, and some of it is post 80s.

deleting all of your posts does not help this thread at all, man.

>>1170312
sorry, I was deleing when i thought i said something retarded. Instead it was all retarded. reissuing
..bradbury

him and stephenson are the only post 80s ones I can think of that I like, though.

>>1170271
What is that canon? Seriously. There's no single correct answer so I'm not even particularly trying to trap you or anything. I'm curious to know what is perceived as canon by someone who disliked the genre.

I enjoyed Mein Kampf

>>1170259
Apparently Gibson has ones past the 80s, I haven't read any after then but I liked the ones before. Maybe you should check it out.

T.S. Eliot is good, but does not touch my soul

>>1170271
Neil Gaiman reaches into fantasy, I really doubt you will find his stuff predictable and repetitive. Please try it.

>>1170331
And I single handedly killed a thread. Go me.

>>1170346

It's still on the front page, man.

/lit/ is really, really slow at these hours.

the harry potter books are for little kids.

>>1170353
...thanks?

>>1170331
>main character is a social outcast, filled with ennui
>suddenly, secret world
>main character is now a very important person
>falls in love, saves the other world, chooses to stay there

China Miéville is just awful

Neil Gaiman has two ideas, and they aren't even his.

Tolkien was the best thing to happen to fantasy.

>>1170363
Ouch. Hurts to sound wrong that easily. How about dr strange and mr norrel?

>>1170371
Lol i actually just said dr strange. Johnathan strange. I'm so off today, /ck taught me how to make white russians.

Tolkien was the best thing to happen to anythihng

tom robbins is a bitch and everyone who likes his books were dropped on their head as a baby

Tolkien was the worst thing to happen to anything.

Tolkien was prejudice against communists.

Orson Scott Card's gay marriage editorial made me respect him more.

As much as I love Sartre his plays aren't that amazing as far as literary value is concerned.

>>1170392

youre so wrong

>>1170374
This. Anyone who says anything bad about Tolkien is either a) a fool or b)a person with a dangerous agenda.

>>1170421
sauce?

Sci-fi fandom and culture is filled with more nit-pickers and killjoys. I don't care how "familiar" a novel is if it's enjoyable.

Animal Farm was one of the worst books I've read.

Rudy Rucker has such an amazing imagination that I have tried to read nearly everything he's written, yet he writes so terribly that I have yet to finish a single book.

im a writer because i can't sing in a band

I am spiteful towards mediocre writes because even though they're not really good they at least got an idea and work around it

Don Quixote is worth studying for its influence on literature, but the novel itself is tiresome and sadistic

"Literary merit" is subjective to the point of being meaningless.

I don't see any point in reading much contemporary lit since there is more classics than I can ever read in my lifetime available & it will be a while before the true classics from our time rise to the top.

>>1171192

Second.

the hitchhikers guide is terrible and unfunny

Writers Workshops are a waste of time. Get a book of basic grammar, and write what you want.

>>1171225
Studying literature academically in order to be a writer is dumb.

>>1171220
so are you

>>1171232
eating so much the shape of your body exceeds the basic human form as well

>>1171242

I think John Ringo is a good writer.

counterpoint: all science-fiction written before the 80's were from terrible writers with bizarre sexual fetishes and fascist politics

Brandon Sanderson says hi

Modern science fiction is all semi-autobiographical dreck.

"What if I had a poor relationship with my mother...IN SPACE!"

>>1171252

>"What if I had a poor relationship with my mother...IN SPACE!"

I lol'd hard

>>1171248
But at least it was fun.

modern writing is fun too. most of lit reads terrible stuff on the same level as a Diablo II novelization.

Chicks can't write sci-fi/fantasy/horror.

Canadian publishers marginalize themselves by publishing only fiction that conforms to some outdated liberal idea of "Canadian perspective".

Lovecraft is astonishingly overrated.

>>1171252

"You never breast fed me! That's why I'm so weak."

"No, it's because you lived in zero-G for 20 years, son."

Ayn Rand is not that bad of a writer.

I love China Mieville, I would even go so far as to say that I was completely gay for him (Seriously, have you seen him IRL?) but The Scar really pissed me off. Uther Dull pissed me off, making an otherwise good character random and ambiguous to cover plot holes or move the plot along is a complete dick move.

>>1171264
may i recommend colbert's TekWar series. really think it'd be something you enjoy

http://www.amazon.com/Stephen-Colberts-Tek-Jansen-1/dp/1932664785

I only read classics because it's impossible to keep up with contemporary lit.

Americans writers are vastly overrated by Americans & most of /lit/.

Post-Colonialism and Feminism are bullshit disciplines made up so that people who've gotten the short end of the power stick in history (niggers, indians, women, gooks, etc) can feel good about themselves or relevant.

>>1171284

forgot my trip guys

>>1171284
soon it will be you who is writing about being oppressed. gook supremacy

I don't mind writing about the oppressed, so long as the protagonist actually accomplishes something. I'm not saying he single-handedly saves his people or anything like that, but at least SOMETHING.

I hate feminist or racist (yes, racist) literature where the guy/girl just sits there and bitches for 200 pages and then dies. If I wanted that, I'd read a biography.

>>1171294
china = Potemkin economy. american exceptionalism ftw

>>1171302
you're arguing about plot though. a book can have no plot, but still be complex and beautifully written enough to be worth reading

Almost no writers handle description or background well and I often skip long expository sections.

>>1171305

Even an interpersonal or introspective accomplishment is accomplishment enough. If it literally has no plot than what is it? Prose poetry? It's certainly not a novel.

>>1171309
those would be your personal problems with the written word though, and not at all the majority opinion

Wtb more sci-fi authors on par with Bradbury, Clarke, and Asimov

you guys forgot me

>>1171324
also Michael Crichton

>>1171318
wts phillip k. dick

>>1171318
you forgot Heinlein

>>1171316

That would be your personal problem with my post, and not at all the majority opinion.

No good science fiction?

http://clarkesworldmagazine.com/johnson_10_09/

Read one line, then say that again, to my face you faggot.

>>1171369
Has anyone really been far as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

>>1170259
I liked Chasm City by Alastair Reynolds. It's from 2001.

>>1170259

Old Man's War by John Scalzi
and
Blasphemy by Douglas Preston I thought were both pretty good. Last recent sci-fi i've read

Fuckers.

>>1170259

Hyperion Cantos.

>>1171318
Seconded.
>>1171342
Heinlein is too busy nursing his hard on for marines to be par with Asimov.
>>1171369
I don't know what made my day, you or http://www.fictionpress.com/s/2851507/10/The_Civil_War_Let_Freedom_Ring

>>1171324
<3

>>1171324
you're too good for the genre. any genre. have my babies.

I read books because I want people to think I'm smarter than I really am.

That's not meant to be like... an insult to the people on here. I'm sure most of you aren't like that. But it's the reason I started reading books "for pleasure."

>>1171504
That makes me sad. I hope you find something that you genuinely enjoy reading.

>>1171504
I read books because I enjoy them immensely. I easily get immersed in the story told. However, I also read to broaden my understanding of culture.

Not to mention, they are great conversational pieces. I would much rather have a discussion on Huxley then why you couldn't find that pair of shoes you were looking 3 hours for.

If you only read to appear smarter, people will be able to see that.

>>1171492

>Starship Troopers
>Suddenly, Heinlein is a fascist with a hard on for marines
>Ignore every other book he's written
>mfw

Heinlein is a hippie faggot who wants to get a sex change so he can suck his clone's cock, not a fascist.

I read so many books because I'm lonely

>>1171567
what, you don't remember the hard-on he had for the marines in Stranger in a Strange Land?

>>1171586

No, I don't.

I can't stand Catch-22.

>>1171571

Also he's a super-genetically-engineered dark-skinned woman in New Zealand.

But where did all you zombies come from?

>>1170259
>No good science fiction has been published since the 80's.

That would depend on your definition of 'science'.

I enjoyed Catcher in the Rye

>>1171592
yeah, me either. that guy is a tool.

I have a tummy ache.

>>1171369
Clarkesworld is shit.

>>1171369
What kind of fat fangirl shit is this?

hey fuck you man

Classic literature is boring.

The only people who enjoyed brave new world are pretentious hipsters.

I read fiction to escape from my drab life.

I'm writing fan fiction.
Avatar: The Last Airbender Fan fiction with an OC
oh god i'm so sorry

This whole fad of being anti-elitist is a massive pain in the ass and merely people justifying their more genre-driven tastes in the face of non-existent criticism and their own sense of insecurity.

Nobody cares that you think Ulysses is pretentious. You're the pretentious one for thinking anyone gives a damn when we all read trashy sci-fi novels on top of things with more literary aspirations.

And don't get me started about the Science-majors having a cry because everything isn't objective enough for them.

Or the people who try to start a discussion without actually talking about the text because we really are going to start talking about a novel just because you said hurr durr it is good.

Or the terrible writers who can't keep their shit in one thread.

Or the people that try to disprove philosophers in two sentences.

I am a big fish in a small pond when it comes to books around my friends, yet a small fish in a huge pond around here. It both saddens and gladdens me.

I'm reading The Trial, and while I GET how the whole scenario is a sort of proxy for existentialism, with K. getting screwed over because he applies his own logic to the weird dream-like logical disconnects of the world around him, rather than accepting the terms and realities of existence and trying to simply BE , I'm not particularly a fan of how Kafka writes or existentialism in general.

I did like reading some short stories by Borges though. It's just so... meaty. I can't explain it. The stories have palpable WEIGHT, you know?

>meaters excavation
... seriously captcha you're freaking me out.

>>1172619

Thank you. The best response for someone calling something pretentious without anything backing them up is to call them pretentious in turn, since they have the pretence of supposing that they are qualified to make that sort of judgment.

Ulysees was just Joyce being silly and incomprehensible for the sake of being silly and incomprehensible. He insured his longevity by people trying to figure out what the hell he was saying.

>>1172640
What qualifications do you need to make judgements of taste?

>>1172659
that turns out to be a pretty interesting and important question!

>>1172659

None, but if you don't like it, just say that you don't, and why. There's no need to go about judging it by calling it "pretentious" (which is more than a matter of taste).

>>1172659
What qualifications do you have to challenge his qualifications? What qualifications do I have to challenge your qualifications, and what qualifications do I have to challenge my own?

YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE. YOU SEE?

Iian Banks writes boring sci-fi and meandering literary fiction.

I'm trying to catch up on reading iconic books to increase my awareness of literary references so I can know what people are talking about and be able to make references of my own.

Post-modernism ruined literature.

>>1174729
No. It was you

Books with political messages are the only books I can enjoy anymore.

I've never been to /lit/ before. You people seem to know what you are talking about. Therefore please rip apart my two favourite book series' because I am too biased to do it:

His Dark Materials
&
Wheel of Time

Thank you.

>>1174729
Post-modernism died in the 80's

Contemporary literature is good; you're upset because you're too lazy to dig for it, accepting the spoon-fed "canon" given to you by your high-school teachers and trendy alternative choices like Cormac McCarthy and Kurt Vonnegut

I really can't stand contemporary literature, and it's easier to dive into old books anyway.

>>1174771
Post-modernism is a gelatinous monster that swallows all who try to stand against it.

Contemporary literature is self-indulgent navel-gazing fit only for the phonies on NPR.

Stephen King is probably the best living writer.

>>1170259

wut about dem horus heresy bookz?

The Hyperion novels are overly long and boring.

I enjoyed Eragon.

Contemporary "literary fiction" is a genre with formula constraints as rigid as those found in romance and science fiction. Jonathan Franzen's entire career is founded on meeting genre expectations.

>>1170290
OH GOD, IRONY

fine. I'll say it: the great gatsby, catcher in the rye, and pretty much any steinbeck book, are all pieces of shit. they are contrite literature spoon fed to the literary community as amazing writing, but elmore leonard writes better.

The golden age of sci-fi is 14 years-old.

Science fiction didn't change. You're the one who changed.

American literary fiction has been reduced to novels about Manhattanites, Brooklyinites, Jews, Manhattan Jews, Brooklyn Jews, homosexuals, Jewish homosexuals, Manhattanite Jewish homosexuals, Brooklynite Jewish homosexuals, and the occasional immigrant story from increasingly exotic ethnicities.

>>1174856
you forgot the black female american experience

I could do without reading a single "minority in America" story ever again. It is probably my least favorite category of literature.

>>1175459
I think anyone who's ever been through an American high school can do without another "minority in America" story ever again.

I've embarked on an epic journey to read every Star Wars book ever written, even the crappy ones

>>1171567
Can someone tell me who that is? I swear it looks familiar but I can't place it.

>>1175479
Rozen Maiden

>>1175459
Don't like Invisible Man?

>>1175909
seriously

even in the "one black author your 12th grade english teacher's heard of" canon there's some killer shit

William Gibson & Bruce Sterling.

>>1175909

Actually, I have read Invisible Man. And yes, I did like it. But that's really just about the only thing from that aforementioned category that I'd ever read again.

>>1175939
Waiting for you to respond to >>1175910, you fucking pussy racist.

Yeah, that's what I thought. Nothing.

>>1175943

You know what? No, I have nothing.

Instead of being a massive shit, why don't you throw out some recommendations?

>>1175954

I'm not the asshole you responded to, but Langston Hughes's book of short stories "The Ways of White Folks" is pretty great. I especially liked how he criticized whites who fawn over blacks both directly and by having those characters always come to grief.

who let the fucking uppity nigger in this thread? gtfo and stop pretending your race likes anything than government handouts, fried chicken and rape.