/lit/ - Literature

What kind of conservatism, anon. There are quite a few.

>>11508390
Paleoconservativism, High Toryism, Catholic conservatism, classical conservatism, and Konservative Revolution all welcome

Bump

>>11508379
V I K T O R
O
R
B
A
N

attempting a conservative reading of Marx's Das Kapital lads, wish me luck

>>11509010
Use Sheldon Wolin as your guide

Really enjoying Growth Of The Soil - I've always idealized the kind of life described in this book, and I feel that the author conveys his ideas well.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what to read next? I'd prefer some non-fiction.

Conservatism is gay. It's agreeing to a small piece of the pie. Only by doing what needs to be done, by reacting, can you return to and achieve the proper state of affairs.

>>11509035
You might try Wendell Berry


Also check out

https://www.frontporchrepublic.com/2009/05/the-decline-of-middle-america-and-the-problem-of-meritocracy/

>>11509064
Not such how you're dichotomy makes sense. The Konservative Revolution was reactionary. So is paleoconservatism in general

Conservatism? More like convirgintism

>>11509124
I'm not a virgin although I wish I was. I wasn't always a Christian, but I have been celibate since my baptism

Currently reading Madness and Civilization. I am enjoying how he writes but he does tend to drag on things.

>>11509146
He's pretty lucid as far as philosophy goes

>>11508390
Mostly just reactions against modern capitalism.

>>11509133
Why would anyone do this? It isn't the fucking 1200's anymore.

>>11509157
Yeah but he goes on about these historical things. I'm not exactly complaining though because they are enjoyable.

>>11509162
Saving for marriage to make it more enjoyable.

>>11509173
But it doesn't. Working with a partner over time and developing a sexual side of a relationship as it grows from the beginning makes it more enjoyable. Creating some kind of false barrier to entry to make it taboo so you are more psychologically prone to enjoying something that is far inferior to working on a relationship, and at this point you are just lying to yourself.

>>11509186
Why are you in conservative general dude?

>>11509162
My belief in Christ. I became Orthodox out of genuine belief, not LARP'ing

>>11509202
Not him, but not all right wingers are so sexually frigid.

>>11509731
This is about conservativism, not right wingers in general. Even conservatives who are promiscuous womanizers tend to have relatively frigid ideas on sexual norms, often with a double standard applied to women. And definitely opposed to homosexuality

>>11509035
Kirkpatrick Sale. Pynchon's close friend.

Glad to see we are still trying at this.

If we are trying to preserve our past and our culture, I propose returning to the near past where our board culture didn't include a conservative general.

>>11510465
my man

>>11510440
my man

>>11510465
Cringe and bluepilled.

>>11511124
Le based pede

What's the relationship between fascism and conservatism?

Comment from a different thread, was ruminating on Dr Hook's song Soup Stone, arguing with anprim brainlet:

>"A basic self-evident fact of phenomenal reality is that there may be cycles and repetition, but never actual recreation of a specific previous state in identical terms. Similarly, while you plant seeds, you can't ungrow a plant. You can only grow seeds, with change every time. Perhaps predictable, but never identical.

>That's why even if we consciously reproduced the conditions of European feudalism, it would never ever behave historically in the same way, you'd have to wind back the entire universe to do that.

>Honestly, Bookchin's Our Synthetic Environment explains with science why we simply keep compounding errors by trying to deal with extremely complex interconnected systems as if they were simple abstract arrangements of elementals in the platonic sense.

>You can try all you want to go backward, but the real lesson of conservatism, real Traditionalism, is to use the lessons of the past not to dictate the future but to inform our actions as the future unfolds."

>>11510465
There's that word—culture. "Board culture" is a relatively new term to 4chan, and a particularly divisive one. On one hand, every board undoubtedly has its own unique culture—it's why we're proud to call ourselves /v/irgins and /k/ommandos. On the other hand, "culture" is often used to justify posts that have little to do with the topic of a board. Under the guise of "board culture," countless off-topic threads are created every day, pushing on-topic discussion off the board. What is considered acceptable board culture is often a grey area, since the term is usually suited to an individual's personal taste, or that of a vocal minority. As one Anon so aptly put it, "One man's 'culture' is another man's 'shitpost.'

stop shitposting, you have to go back as in 'further back' because whichever 'board culture' you are appealing to is a concept that was killed by Late moot The Late, the man of infinite idiocies, which also include /qa/'s precursor - whence the above paragraph and Anon came - the ruining of ye olden /sp/, and the founding of that very same /pol/ your entire existence is currently revolving around

>>11511265
Fascism (not conservatism) was born out of futurismo (not conservatism), D'Annunzio's decadentismo (not conservatism), Sorel's and other non-marxist-left revolutionary syndacalism (not conservatism), the ideas of Italian nationalists such as Prezzolini (not conservatism), Federzoni (not conservatism), and Papini (not conservatism), and founded by a failed (not conservatism) socialist (not conservatism) journalist (not conservatism) who read Nietzsche (not conservatism) and Vilfrido Pareto (not conservatism), and whose foremost philosophical guru was Giovanni Gentile with his neo-hegelianism (not conservatism). Fascism (not conservatism) seized power (not conservatism) by revolutionary means (not conservatism), promoted autarky as economic policy (not conservatism), fought a war against the king himself (not conservatism) and created its own state (not conservatism).

>>11511265
return to a mythical past vs maintenance of existing structures

>>11511285

Response to a friend that asked about the same comment:

>For the other question, I was clarifying a point about reaction/regressiveness with emphasis that anglo-american pragmatism that is associated with liberalism and often is labeled as progressive, is conservative/traditional. That it is not a modular elective but the primary functional component.

>The action in con/trad today is to follow tradition not just "even though it makes no sense" but "BECAUSE it makes no sense in our context".


>This fundamental problem in con/trad thought fully arised after these few years of introspection on that subject, during a convo w an anprim, suddenly I remembered the Dr Hook song Soup Stone, and the pragmatic core of lower class tradition which had been instilled into my naturally libertine heart as a kid-- which that song encapsulates.

>>11511298
"_______ culture" where ______ is "board", "forum", "community" et c is an offshoot of PC office/corporate policy.
It is used as a term most famously by SJWs and neolibs to assert dominance. Read any CoC for a tech concern.
I think it bled into common usage by the Fandom Convention Subcultures.

It's complete faggotry and needs to go.

>>11511298
>the founding of that very same /pol/ your entire existence is currently revolving around
Pure projection.

>>11511332
>we should safeguard our culture, but only the culture I like
>unironically believes subculture began with the internet
Who could be behind this post?

>>11511334
never clicked on /pol/ and I have like seven filters for posts like the one above yours lmao

>>11511338
Point one is simple projection but I don't see how you get point two, because PC corporate culture and conventions have been around since wayyy back.
Conventions over pop culture started at least in the 70s and same for post-women's-lib office policy

>>11511346
Skulduggery and myopia

>>11508405
what about trve perennialism?

>>11511298
board culture is a nebulous gestalt beyond our reckoning or control,

>>11511360
*was

>>11511265
They can seem similar. Dollfuss is often called a fascist for example, although really he was just conservative. Burke would be called a fascist if he were alive today (he strongly opposed democracy and supported prison for subversives, including anyone who spoke ill of the king).

In reality there are very different theories underlying them, but to make an easy distinction: fascism is totalitarian. Conservatism can be very authoritarian, but it's never *totalitarian*. Franco's daughter made this important distinction.

>>11511357
No

>>11511332
Based and redpilled.

bump

>>11509186
>But it doesn't. Working with a partner over time and developing a sexual side of a relationship as it grows from the beginning makes it more enjoyable.

That's not necessarily true. People regardless of their political beliefs on premarital sex can still manage to ruin their sexual relationship with their partner. It's more important to realize that people should spend time trying to alter their flaws for the better. And that doesn't require sexual intimacy, but rather something less base and more complex: reason and dialogue.

People who can't control their sexual urges long enough to figure out how to be a more efficient and responsible human being deserve to be used like the cattle they are.

>>11508379
>tfw call myself a 'conservative', actually just neomarxist with a thing for the greeks, catholic aesthetics, Lasch, Ellul and Murray Bookchin's Social Ecology

I can't really bring myself to hate gays, women, trannies or brown people. i mean some of them are nice

>>11515005
Don't really "hate", m8. It's just homosexuality definitely has a cancerous culture, and female suffrage has not done us any good. And immigrants vote for the "managerial state". I don't even hate transsexuals, I just think they're confused.

>>11515005
>>11515234
This for the most part, fine with everyone but immigrants.

bump

>>11515005
>>11515005
The key word is just "some" though my friend.

peter hitchens roger scruton

>>11518762
Scruton is on the chart, but you're also right about Hitchens, he's great

>>11514672
I would disagree. Sexual intimacy is the foundation of the highest degree of trust capable between two individuals. Evidenced quote convincingly by the myriad of research done on the relationship between vulnerability and trust.

>>11519045
>Sexual intimacy is the foundation of the highest degree of trust
It rather should stem from trust


Mind if I fuck your wife? I mean if fucking makes me trustworthy, she can trust me then, and you trust her after all. Whores are the most trusted profession, so it must be reassuring knowing that your wife is one

>>11519267
Not him, but rarely have I seen someone drop the ball that conclusively on /lit/.

>>11519359
Increased sexuality has lead to decreased commitment in our society. Trying to play off sex occurring earlier in a relationship as making it stronger (i.e. more durable) is nothing short of wilful and banal ignorance.

>>11519655
This, but only in that pomo sex is divorced/abstracted from its physical fact, that is the function of procreation.
Sex is only for making children, and if it does not make children it is only another vice like drugs, drink, gambling.

what's the conservative opinion on ephebophilia?

Conservatism is irrelevant now. The jew-wise right is the only relevant right now.

>>11520304
Javier, pls

>>11508379
>Conservatism
>fleur-de-lis

Wut

>>11520340
"Conservative" as a term for a political position was first used to mean those in favor of the Bourbon Restoration

For record, I will recommend the Archived Ante-Nicean library 4 volumes which have the full works of Clement, John Martyr, Tianon, Theophilus, and church fathers who form the Platonic bridge to early Christianity before the geopolitics burned those bridges to the ancient world. Also Photius, will shill in this thread too, because I found a four volume Oxford Lucian because of his reviews and shitloads of other stuff.

>>11521711
What page is that in your image?

bump

>>11508379
Are there any conservatives who could beat Chomsky in a debate?

>>11524012
Chomsky is a jewish intellectual fraudster. You must not be too bright.

>>11519267
I'm not even sure what your point is, desu.

>>11524012

>>11524034
t. annoying namefag who wants to watch his non-existent wife get fucked.

>>11524029
ive never seen a refutation of his arguments its all ad hominem

>>11524044
If I wanted to watch someones non-existant wife get fucked I'd pretend to have understood the presuppositional substructure of the character of your argument, pronounce the two of you joined in holy matrimony, and cum over her face as you sat naked and crying in the corner of your subconscious; masturbating to the thought of anyone taking you seriously.

>>11508379
Recommend some latin literature to me. Cicero apparently inspired Plutarch's humanism; is his work worthwhile, or is it humanist drivel?

>>11524107
I'll bite: what arguments of Chomsky's should conservatives be confronting?

>>11524306
any of them. literally refute as single one and ill be impressed.

>>11524431
So his linguistics, his political activism...?

>>11524445
political shit

>>11524189
>>11524189

Wow nothing on that plate looks good

>>11524457
the lemon

>>11524012
>chimpsky

>>11522596
Just the Lucian page

>>11524445
scared bucko

>>11524431
>I'm 15 and Howard zinn wrote my textbook

>>11524608
people have been trying to refute chomsky since before you were born and it hasn't been done. everyone runs away scared.

>>11524189
Cicero is humanist af but very worth reading just the same. Solid discoursing on duty as the basis of society rather than individualism.

>>11524449
Chomsky is attacking a liberal paradigm more than a conservative one.

>>11524648
Chomsky can't even beat Foucault and Zizek

>>11509173
How the fuck would you know what makes sex more enjoyable? Everyone I've spoken to about first time sex agrees that it's at the very least extremely uncomfortable if not outright unpleasant the first time and only gets better with experience. You're just depriving yourself years of pleasure for the sake of traditions that stopped making sense when contraception and modern medicine became widely available. If you were religious like >>11509216
and therefore believed the omnipresent creator of the universe wanted you to remain celibate until marriage than this shit would make sense.
>>11514672
People regardless of their political beliefs can also still agree that the earth is flat, that doesn't make that belief any less retarded.

That feel when you absolutely destroy someone so hard it turns out they're a janny or a mod and delete your insult out of pure shame.

>>11526414
In fact, allow me to retreive the post from the archive.

>>11524044
If I wanted to watch someones non-existent wife get fucked I'd pretend to have understood the presuppositional substructure of the character of your argument, pronounce the two of you joined in holy matrimony, and cum over her face as you sat naked and crying in the corner of your subconscious; masturbating to the thought of anyone taking you seriously.

>>11526414
>>11526490
*snap*

bump

>Calhoun to Kuypor
Great chart. I was going to make one, but this is much better than what mine would have been.

Recs:
>Lincoln the Man by Edgar Lee Masters
>History of the United States by Cecil Chesterton
>works of Jefferson Davis
>Essays of Johnson and Addison
>Notes on Democracy by HL Mencken

>>11526490
I bet this sounded really good in your head

bump