/lit/ - Literature

the fucking Greeks

The Pre-Socratic Philosophers, any given text. These guys are easy

Plato, esp. the dialogues Crito, Phaedo and Euthyphro, the Apology, and finally The Republic

Aristotle's Ethics and Politics in that order, then Organon, but only if you want difficult materialist philosophy. Followed by Thomas Aquinas' Summa Theologica.

Epictetus for Stoicism followed by Meditations by Marcus Aurelius, then Plotinus and the Gnostics for more Platonic metaphysics and early christian religion

Go straight into the Roman philosophers, especially Cicero and Livy for organic continuation of philosophy as a field, maybe grabbing Plotinus if you want simpler politics than Aristotle's. From the Romans you begin to branch out into various more specialized fields before reconvening towards the end of the Renaissance, with dank remasters of Antique and Classical thought making up most of the interrim.

>>11313041
>maybe grabbing Plotinus
*Polybius, fuck

>>11313041
>totally ignores eastern philosophy

read Zhuangzi

and you're pretty much set

>>11313048
That's fair, go from Epictetus and Aurelius into the Eastern Philosophies as Stoicism is a gateway drug to Buddhism.

>>11313041
>reading the Organon after Ethics, while altogether omitting the Metaphysics
>forgetting about Plato's Gorgias, Symposium, Parmenides, and Timaeus dialogues
>suggesting a complete newcomer to the world of philosophy to dive into Cicero without having read Gorgias and On Rhetoric
>omitting Boethius as the gap between the Classical era and the Scholastics

>>11313055
That's not a bad way to do it.
It's how I did it, upon recollection

Unironically start with the Greeks.

Read one of Plato's easy dialogues like Ion or Euthyphro.

>>11313087
thank you for these corrections. I'm not a one-man philosophical library. But I will defend my summarizing, as presenting any newcomer with a backlog of literature miles long tends to discourage or generally confuse them. We can safely assume OP would be paying many visits to /lit/ between his readings and would likely pick up the gaps in any recommendations along the way.

Is Metaphysics really a key precedent to the Organon? I've often seen them recommended separately.

>>11313117
Other way around. Metaphysics is, I'd say, the product of Aristotle's cummulative knowledge on both the subject of metaphysics as developed by philosophers prior to him (including Parmenides, Democritus, and Plato), as well as an exercise on formal logic, applied together to create a metaphysical system which was used, and expanded by philosophers like Aquinas, Hegel, and Heidegger afterwards. Aristotle's On the Soul might be important to people who are interested in theology.

>>11313167
Ah, thanks for the clarification. I'm making my own way through Nicomachean Ethics right now (though I'm procrastinating by reading Don Quixote)

draw an interest out ofsmall topics and short books before you cave in on yourself with a large set of principles that require only one author.

>>11313041
how absolutely necessary is it to start with greeks before play dough?

>>11313041
Anon:
>Posts a decent guide to western philosophy
Every reply:
>Let me spell out for you exactly how you are developmentally disabled

I feel bad. I liked your guide.

>>11313041
>recommending the entire Summa to someone who isn't specifically focused on theology
oh shit nigger what are you doing

>>11313041
have you read all of summa theologica?

asking honestly

>>11313227
>>11313242
No I haven't read the entirety of the Summa, I thought it would be obvious to anyone who pursued it that they would need to break it down by sections of interest.

>>11313031
I genuinely think Martin Luther was one of the most destructive thinkers in the history of Christianity. Which leaves me conflicted, since I think Quakerism is the most meaningful branch of Christianity, and it's technically a form of Protestantism.

>>11313012
Don't waste your time on philosophy. Do literally anything else. Start by turning around and doing something that will make you happy, or more productive. The end of philosophical studies is either producing more philosophy, being knowledgeable but unhappy, or giving up on philosophy.

>>11313205
Plato was a Greek man. Greek culture had been alive for more than 400 years (1000 if you count the Mycenaeans as the first Greeks). He wrote his dialogues for an ancient Greek audience, and made references to many concepts (like virtue) which had already been present in Greek culture for hundreds of years. If you haven't at least already read The Iliad and the Theogony by the time you start reading Plato's Apology, you won't understand shit about it.

>>11313274
I disagree, by virtue that the underlying concepts of Plato's jargon which should by all means be alien and strange to us have instead been baked-in to modern Western thought through the constant use and references to Platonic philosophy throughout the entire developmental experience of modern Western Liberalism. Anyone who can graduate highschool can roughly understand Plato and have little issue in seeking clarification for the few nagging exotic ideas.

That said, having read Theogony, Works and Days, the Iliad and Odyssey, the Histories and/or a couple of background tragedies are all helpful for further cementing Plato's philosophy within its own timeframe.

>>11313270
I have actually been a lot happier since I got into philosophy. I feel that I actually have meaning now.

You need to know clearly what you want to know. What do you want to know? The truth? Moral principles? Self help?

>>11313012
Guide dump incoming

>>11314297
2/11

>>11314298
3/11

>>11314303
4/11

>>11314306
5/11

>>11313012

What do you want? If you want a thorough philosophical education, you're going to have to invest many, many years into it. If you just want an overview, Copleston's History of Philosohy is the gold standard.

>>11313041

Not to jump on the bandwagon of haters, but

>The Pre-Socratic Philosophers, any given text. These guys are easy

Parmenides still makes my mind hurt m8, they're only easy in surface readings.

>>11314310
6/11

>>11314319
7/11

>>11314321
8/11

>>11314323
9/11

>>11314326
10/11

>>11314326
11/11

start with plato especially apology and crito than the rest of the greeks; you should also read the greek plays and homer

>>11313031
First post, best post.

>>11314297
>>11314298
>>11314303
>>11314306
>>11314310
>>11314319
>>11314321
>>11314323
>>11314326
>>11314328
>>11314332
Holy shit thanks. I haven't seen a complete set of these charts on here in ages.

>>11313012
I wouldn't bother much reading the original sources unless you are VERY serious about reading philosophy.

I recommend Kenny's History of Ancient Philosophy.