/lit/ - Literature

*blocks your path*

>>11161780
OP, have you seen anti-Œdipe? what's your thought on anti-Œdipe?

https://www.timeshighereducation.com/books/the-shrink-from-hell/159376.article

>>11161803
based

>>11161780
Why are psychanalists still taken seriously, considering they have very little empirical basis for their statements? Genuine question.
Hasn't psychoanalysis already basically been confirmed as a pseudoscience, borderline witch doctor-tier?
Would very much like you guys interested in this to explain the case

>>11161803
https://youtu.be/6aqGYYBwKbQ?t=5m6s
Gets shut down in three words; throws gone-off milk in response

>>11161891
>Hurr everything in front of my eyes is all there is!
Are you only pretending to be retarded? Because psychotherapy has helped a lot of people deal with a variety of internal problems, the proof is in the pudding. Also a lot of contemporary studies in neuroscience and psychology are finally starting to show that a lot of Freud and lacan's ideas about the mind were actually correct

>>11161803
Lefty_pol.jpg

>>11161891
Do you even know who Lacan is? He is applying Hegel to the unconscious mind. Hegel has the best argument for anything ever and Lacan the genius he is applied it to Freud.

>>11161780
is reading bruce fink the only way to understand this guy? i read one of fink's books but still didn't seem to make much sense without more psychoanalytic, which i'm not interested enough to actually study

>>11161925
>Be psychoanalysis
>Epistemological critiques destroy your legitimacy as a valid form of knowledge
>"Well, it wasn't meant to be a science anyway you goys"
>Years later
>"It was ACTUALLY meant to be a science hahaha we were kidding all along haha here's the empirical proofs you were asking us all along"

>>11161925
psychoanalysis has literally never cured anyone though

>>11161872
>Élisabeth Roudinesco
>Roudinesco was born to half-Jewish parents

Everytime

>>11161891
spoken therapy works though, if it works it empirically works. Psychology is kind of a meme discipline, but inside that meme spoken therapy seems like a sound idea so far, until it gets proven to maybe make things worse in a few years, who knows knowing how things turn out in psychology

the underlying theories of the spoken therapy don't seem to matter much, all spoken therapies seem to give similarly positive results, so using psychoanalysis is as good an idea as anything else so far

>>11161925
I never heard of neuroscience approved lacan's idea, it is genuinely good news!
can you give me some example of it? any articles, report, name of related neuroscientist...

>>11161970
it was just a metaphor, there aren't any specific papers

>>11161780
Overrated.
Still based on Freudian nonsense ultimately. Only mentally unsound philosophers like Zizek cab relate to him.

>>11161955
If you want to actually understand him first start with the Greeks, read Descartes, Spinoza, de Sade, Kant, Rousseau, Schelling, Schiller, Hegel, Marx, Stirner, Freu, Dostoyevsky, Kojève, Joyce, Nietzsche, Bataille, Heidegger, Zizek and then you can read Lacan

>>11161979
t. haven't read one quarter of those

>>11161978
Freud is just one of his influences.

>>11161979
>Stirner
make it less obvious less time

>>11161974
>it was just a metaphor

>>11161978
what
then why you said lacan's ideas starting to empirically proved by neuroscience and psychology

>>11161974
what
then why you said lacan's ideas starting to empirically proved by neuroscience and psychology

>>11161995
>>11161993
as a metaphor for their therapeutic power and philosophical importance

>>11161978
sory

>>11161985
Have you not heard of the Super Ego?

>>11161970
Here you go.

>>11161997
how even a metaphor works when literal sentence crying out to be empirical use only

>>11162005
I read it, that literature released before even lacan's father was born

>>11161803
Bro I fucking love the Mars Volta!

>>11162014
Are you having a stroke?

>>11161891
Its a fun and great way to enjoy art and literature. Makes it much more interesting and fresh. For me at least.

i wanna get into lacanian theory (but i will start in september).

this summer i wanna prepare for this. recommend me 10-12 books which i must read before reading lacan(ians)?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matheme

>"Matheme", for Lacan, was not simply the imitation of science by philosophy, but the ideal of a perfect means for the integral transmission of knowledge. Natural language, with its constant "metonymic slide", fails here, where mathematics succeeds.

Seems like an enlightened chap, not sure why you'd hate on him for being "obscure".

>>11161970
I'm the anon you replied to, here's some links/articles that might serve your interests:

http://npsa-association.org/

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2015/08/neuroscience-psychoanalysis-casey-schwartz-mind-fields/401999/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4452801/

>>11161891
>Hasn't psychoanalysis already basically been confirmed as a pseudoscience, borderline witch doctor-tier?
oy vey, empiricism is bad !! its all scientism!!1 STEMcucks BTFO

>>11164184
Be familiar with Hegel, Heidegger, and Freud for starters.

>>11164229
diagrams are the work of the devil

>>11161925
Psychotherapy != psychoanalysis retard
Also nice sources.

>>11161891
Yes. It's becoming more irrelevant every year and, funnily enough, only survives in literature departments.

Lacan makes hacks look good. PBJ is unironically more of a scholar than Lacan is.

>>11167149
To understand Lacan you must have a good grasp on the whole Western philosophy, most of its literature, art, psychology, at least some understanding of logic, linguistics, history of sciences.
To "get" Peterson you need to have watched a few pepe memes on the internet and hate SJWS

> muh Lacan

lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mImbHxmMmdE

Just read Girard.

Guys, any ideas what should I start with if I want to get into postmodern philosophy and all that stuff? I guess the best move here is to read a book which goes through all of it, like a beginning. After that read those French books one by one.

>>11162014
I think by metaphor he meant lie

>>11167491
relatively easy to read books that you could call postmodern are lyotards "postmodern condition", foucault's "discipline and punish". I would suggest Terry Eagletons "what is literature" it is a book on literature theory, but presents well the theoretical backbone of structuralism, post-structuralism and psychoanalysis, without these movements you can not understand postmodern philosophy. I would also suggest to get a good grasp on psychoanalysis, marxism and neeche before dwelving into pomo theory

>>11167149
I bet you haven't even read Hegel

>>11168901
Wrong

>>11169495
Cite me act 321 of the pheonomology without refering to the book

>>11161893
>French Psychoanalysts

Incredible how they are able to say even less meaningful things than Freud an Reich,like they fart from their mouths and suddenly this others pseuds aplaud them for talking gibberish made up by j*ws like they're some kinda of gods who reveal the secrets of the human mind...
Lacan should have been burned into a gigantic bonfire just like every other "psychoanalist", just for the damages this kinds have done to western thought/civilization. Absolutely disgusting.

>>11161984
The father of psychoanalysis is "just" one of his influences, Whoaaah duuude, I think you're into something here...

>>11167122
>he doesn't realise psychotherapy is just applied psychoanalysis
Also if you weren't a complete invalid you would've seen my links to sources a couple of posts above >>11164315

>>11161893
Lacan doesn't respond sincerely until Debord is escorted out, just sneers paternally and insinuates. The fucking Molyneux of the 60's

>>11161891
take any pseudoscience and overanalyse it. Youll manufacture meaning and insight from nothing.

Lacan isnt important, its the analysis of his works that is.

>>11170491
>>11161891
Neither of you have even bothered to learn about Lacan