/lit/ - Literature

>>11146371
Too heuristic. Listen to the tapes from jonestown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMrFCwYAZxE

An arbitrary conception is not enough

>>11146371
My God is a human-breeder. His sole purpose is for humans to achieve a level of power worthy enough to be in direct contact with him. Therefore, He wants me to kill all the ugly, dumb, masses in the world, or at least advocate for certain policies (restrictive genetic engineering). How will you tell me I'm wrong, if this is my religious belief?

>>11146415
>>11146477
Yes, this is the main critique of religion, while the transcendent good is infallible, people's conceptions of it aren't, this is why I stress this the importance of the correct way of teaching it.

But you both have, in a way agreed with me, a person is more likely to act if they believe their actions are in accordance with their idea of the transcendent good, however wrong their conception is, in both scenarios they undertake some of the most extreme actions possible for a person to do, ie kill themselves or others and while this is obviously terrible, why can't the inverse be true and allow for them to undertake the most virtuous and extremely good actions if they truly believe it to be inline with the transcendent good?

>>11146516
>kill themselves or others and while this is obviously terrible
why?
you are working with some assumptions, that you have yet to prove

>>11146477
Also, to add onto this, you can construct a philosophical system with these exact axioms without the use of God and still have it be logically sound, and without the use of God there would be no way to prove this system as good or bad, as it would require the use of transcendent good (and therefore bad)

Monotheistic religion is even more retarded than atheism. Thoughts on this fact?

>>11146371
You can do the exact same shit in a far more convenient, reasonable, and undestructive manner without some transcendent good predicated on the supernatural. Most people are content with some basic ethical arguments based in human interaction, or simply combined with the ethics that their society imparts upon them (even if they are vehemently individualistic and anti-religious, which few are).

>>11146635
Pain and suffering is a universal constant that everyone recognizes as bad, murder and suicide arguably bring about the most pain and suffering and is therefore bad, God or not, we all feel pain

>>11146371
I don't follow any particular religion because I'm not confident in my knowledge of something so beyond my perception. However, what I do perceive, is that I enjoy life. I enjoy success, I want to be attractive. I want a hot wife, successful children. This only agrees with evolution, that organisms want to ensure the survival of the species. How is this more abstract than religious beliefs?

>>11146662
boring nazi memes
>muh rule of the chosen
kys
You have to conquer to rule, faggot.

>>11146713
>Pain and suffering is a universal constant
It is subjective, you feel it, i don't. Why should i care.
A lion kills a zebra, the zebra feels pain!!!
Who cares?

>>11146701
What if society imparts on to them flawed morals? Look at Nazi Germany and communist Russia, we are lucky to have been born in a society built upon religious beliefs in a time of relative economic and social prosperity, all of which can fail, and then what?

>>11146729
You're not outlining a philosophical system, you are defining what is, ie what you find to be enjoyable, (which isn't too far removed from your basal desires), but you haven't defined what you ought to do about them

>>11146768
>we are lucky to have been born in a society built upon religious beliefs
>Look at Nazi Germany and communist Russia
What is wrong with their moral system?
I was born in soviet russia, the moral "landscape" was way better than what you amerimuts and europoor have now.
Your "morality" is destroying you.

>>11146739
That quote is undeniably correct even if he is a nazi.
>You have to conquer to rule
That is precisely what Eggers means and he is upset that his people have forgotten that. We seem to be on the same track here, you and I.

>>11146752
If you're suggesting everyone ignores eachothers suffering and acts selfishly, society collapses and everyone's worse off. This is akin to the transcendent "bad" as nobody wants to live in pure anarchy, and the ones that do evidently don't get very far as we have evolved to construct social societies for the betterment of humanity

>>11146800
If it was better it wouldn't have lead to the slaughter of millions of people and ultimately collapsed, this is self evident.

>>11146841
Everything you do is for your own benefit. You don't kill some people because you like them. You don't kill other people because of the justice system. You help some because they might help you later. You don't help some because you don't care about them.

>>11146803
Except in reality the jews you speak of have "conquered" maybe not in some idyllic way but there are other means to an end.

>>11146662
It's the only logical conclusion from studying human interactions with the material world (cf. Metaphysics)

>>11146853
It was worse in terms of competition, sure, but there were plenty other factors involved. But extend one country's morals to cover the planet. Would you rather every country be like Hitler's Germany, or modern America?

>>11146803
I wish you good luck then anon.
Create your army and conquer europe or whatever you want.
Remember that morality is imposed by the rulers/lord of the land on the masses of slaves/citizens. And not something natural.
This is the way cuckstianity was imposed, islam spread.
And yeah christianity (with it's compassion for the """poor""" people of this world, it's inherent internationalism, anti-hierarchical and life denying values) is one of the main causes of the modern european decadence.

>>11146862
https://youtu.be/vQxTUQhVbg4
This is a pretty succinct that rebutes what I think you're trying to say, which isn't what I came here to argue about

>>11146853
>slaughter of millions of people
western corporate propaganda, do you think that your rulers are interested in what is "true"

>ultimately collapsed
All countries have economical crisis from time to time, idiots (who were corupted by western money) decided to destroy the best society in human history

>>11146878
Neithers perfect, one systemically slaughtered little kids, the fact you are seeming to advocate for that one is a nice advocation for what I stated in the OP, you shouldn't have to philosophicaly ponder the ethics of slaughtering kids to understand it's bad

>>11146878
>But extend one country's morals to cover the planet
Hitler's Germany, kill all non whites, and all sub-optimal whites.
Would be the best of the possible worlds.

>>11146911
Our perception of what benefits is not always what will truly benefit us. We have competing desires within us. I may have a really important assignment, but I'm tired and I want to go asleep. My body perceives the latter as more beneficial so I will do it. It's nice to consider how we'd act if everything we did truly benefited us (actualized our goals).

>>11146963
It's not bad if the kids grow up to subvert your system. The fact that two systems can disagree on an issue so much just proves how subjective morality is. If everyone had the same desires, morality wouldn't even be discussed.

>>11146970
>>11146944
I'm not going to argue anymore with anything pertaining to what you're saying in these two posts but I urge you to at least consider the possibly that you have a flawed world view as it's not in my best interests to engage engage in this sort of debate

>>11146865
>this is my opinion
Alright lad, keep on sucking baby foreskins if that's what feels right to you

>>11147022
Hitler's Germany was concerned with physical health, strong families, and technological advancement. I'd put more faith in that system to ensure the survival of the species than any other. But it really depends on what you think the goal of society is (if you even care to ponder it).

>>11146898
I will not because the time for that has passed, not since the 40's (or whatever neo-nazis believe), but many centuries ago. This civilization is doomed. Now is not the time to focus on politics. This is the time to prepare for the future to protect one's own bloodline and a time to shitpost on 4chan.

>>11147022
>conflating a nazi poster, with a national bolshevisk poster

anon i...

>interests to engage engage
remain in your safe space, were everything is all right, even though your values are going to destroy your society (unless you are non-white then cheers).

This is OP, I'm going to work and if this thread is still up by the time I come back I'll discuss some more, peace.

>>11147082
>a Vargian perspective hah
have fun till you can, you are going to be outbreed in your own country, once they finish destroying the cities they are going to get to you too. Look at South Africa.
Wait till they come to rape you wife and daughters.
Probably non of us will survive, there is no hope, no meaning, no purpuse.
Good luck.

>>11146841
>for the betterment of humanity
look at modern humans, are they better?
in what way?
They are weak and degenerate. Just genocide the shit out of them.
There is no reason for them to exist.

>pure anarchy
maybe that is better, only the strongest will survive and transmit his genes with all the women available. Modern society is so disgenic that its destruction is almost desirable.

>>11147086
>going to work
disgusting wage-slave
is your jewish boss paying you well for your service, i wonder if you are proping the bull that is going to slay your wife/gf while you are at work. You disgusting subhuman cuck.
Have fun ^_^

>>11147128
>Vargian perspective
Top jej
>Look at South Africa
The situation is vastly different for European countries. South Africa is native negro land. This may come off as extremely edgy but imho the whites living there sort of had it coming. At the very least they should have formed stronger and better armed communities.
I don't think the immigrant hordes are a big issue. It is the upcoming plethora of different conflicts, war and famine that will wipe most of us out (maybe 99 %). You're right. There is no hope for most of us. The future earth will not be an easy place to live. But that is precisely what makes it so hopeful in a larger scale. If there will be any human survivors, they will be the strongest, the fittest and most important of all be native to the land they inhabit. Just as nature intended, unlike what we have now. Even if me and my bloodline were to die the natural order will inevitably be restored.

>>11146898
>Christianity is one of the main causes of Europe's decadence
Objectivily wrong anon. Most of Europe have been denying Christianity for some time in favor of secular "humanism", or simply atheism. However, these ideas (memes) are weak, and that's why Islam is taking over.

>>11146371
don't worry dude, the masses have plenty of substitutes for religion: identity politics, politics in general, sports, [insert here].

furthermore, your argument does not make sense.
> ) forming a mental conception of the transcendent good (God, Christ, etc)
as in aestheticizing Good? what? huh? personifying? Isn't personification an imperfect simile ? What? Also, you probably should not aestheticize that which transcends the material, RIGHT?! creating aesthetic God = imperfecting Him.

>2) mapping that concept/image to one's own body
again, aestheticization? really? idk even know what this means? how does crucifixion map on to wha?

>3) acting in accordance with that image
okay thank God you admit that you are aestheticizing / personifying God. Why can't an atheist aestheticize or personify like a deist? what makes this ability exclusive?
ok. go home be done. Wake up early tomorrow to take the Eucharist.

>>11147578
that guy is a homosexual who makes awful posts on twitter. are you guys actually this fucking stupid? that’s tyr he takes cock in his ass and has never made a single good post on twitter >>11147659
the conditions which caused european nihilism come from christfaggotry being poisonous

>>11147676
What guy? The one in my pic? I thought he was some dude from /fit/

>>11147659
Chris*ian*ty is what lead to this cancer. It is a decadent religion that worships weakness and lies.