/lit/ - Literature

there's of course going to be idiots like this

the media giving them the attention they want isn't helping though and makes a lot of Americans to seem more stupid or ignorant than they actually are.

Btw, I am English, most Americans are ordinary people.

Should just be a burn all religious texts day.

30 Years ago copies of Annie on my mind were burned in the USA and the Government didn't care. Why? Because there are no insane Lesbians and Gays who will kill themself in the name of bullshit.
When it's okay when it's done to other minorities, it's okay when it's don to muslims too, they don't deserve a special treatment.

Burning books in general is bullshit but burning the Quaran is not worser than burning any other book and doesn't deserve a special treatment.

>>1111374
fund it.

>>1111364
>most Americans are ordinary people.

That's just not true.

Burning shit is really a crappy way to win people over to your side. And in the age of the automated printing press, burning books isn't really going to do anything.

Let 'em have their bonfire.

>>1111383
30 years ago many things were different. Right now there is huge conflict between the Christian west and the Islamic east and it's obvious that a public burning of their holy book will incite more hate and violence in Afghanistan, not to mention every other majority-Islam country.

Obviously burning any kind of book is outrageous, especially if it is done solely to disrespect whole groups of people, the difference here is a lot of people will die because of one batshit insane pastor.

>>1111395

Thank you for pointing out the stupidity of that statement. That shit's just a fucking lie. The west in general isn't like most of the world, and when you take into account the U.S.'s differences when compared to Europe, it should be obvious that we are not "normal".

There are actual psychological studies showing that we're actually a very bad test group for psychology as a science because of our uniqueness (i.e., psychologists get very unreliable information from us when making inductive claims because of how blatantly our view of the world is when compared to majority of people).

>>1111422
That's because the average American only gets two weeks holiday a year. Also the fact that you have no publically funded news source keeping the rest in check. So you get a distorted/american view of the rest of the world if you are the average joe.

Bible/American flag burning day on 9/11 anyone?

>>1111422
just how does something as vague as our collective world-view affect results in some narrow pschological study

>>1111411
>Obviously burning any kind of book is outrageous

Do you worship books or something?

>the difference here is a lot of people will die because of one batshit insane pastor.

People are responsible for their own actions. If fundamentalist muslims are so little in control of themselves that any slight to their religion causes them to go into batshit insane mode then THEY are the problem. Burning books is not batshit insane. The people who respond to it by killing *are*.

>>1111441

It's not about our collective world view... Also, "narrow study", eh? Seems like you're jumping the gun.

>>1111411
>the difference here is a lot of people will die because of one batshit insane pastor.
So aggressivity and dumbness makes you special? Fuck no!
Dumb muslims have to realise that their rage and aggressivity won't help them, doing everything to please them and keep them quiet will only make them more aggressive, not less.
(I don't talk about the many normal moderate muslims, only the rage apes)

>>1111411
>a lot of people will die because of one batshit insane pastor.

honestly, if it wasn't this the sand-niggers would find some other bullshit to get all up-in-arms about. if it's not political sketches appearing in newspapers, then they'll just fabricate it. the effect that this will have on their view of the west in the long-run will be insignificant compared to their more fundamental grievances w/ our way of life and the fact that jerusalem is controlled by judeochristians

>>1111445
excuse me, pal, but any zealot will go nuts if slightly offended about their religion.
but, the difference here is that christians have already destroyed and subjugated their way to the "top of the chart" as it were, and the Muslim faith is just offending YOU in your modern times.

tl;dr religion is the single biggest flaw of mankind

>>1111445
Agreed. Anyone that's read the Koran knows that the extremist minority are actually the good muslims. The Majority have to twist their interpetation in order to live peacefully with the rest of the world.

inb4 Muslims in denial say in Arabic that's not true.

>>1111454
can you give an example of how americans' world-view affects psychological studies

>>1111436
I would but sadly I live in Germany and no one here except the scum turks care about religion anymore.
No one would react if we would burn bibles here and burning american flags would get even less attention.

>>1111469

You say "twist their interpretation", I say "understanding historical context and listening to professional scholars".

THIS IS AMERICA

MUSLIMS BLEW UP THE TOWERS

NOW WE BURN THEIR BOOKS

THIS IS AMERICA

>>1111489
There's no "understanding" about it. Osama Bin Laden is looked on as a hero in comparison to their own leaders that they can't trust (USA keeps supporting scam elections & corrupt leaders). You can't just pretend The Jihad isn't in the Koran.

>>1111506
I'm pretty sure 'jihad' means an internal struggle to rid one's self of vices, and not murdering anyone who doesn't agree with you.

odd that a country with 28% literacy would care so much about a book-burning. can you imagine, they'll be coming home from a productive day of stoning adultresses (=rape victims) only to get their panties all in a wad about some books being burned on the other side of the world.

>>1111506
Any more than you can claim that condoning the genocide of any peoples to worship graven images isn't in the Bible.

you act like Florida is representative of all of America. Most of the states have such different views and customs that they're basically their own countries.

>>1111506
lol

the united states has meddled in the internal politics of the region + supported illegitimate corrupt oppressive leaders who are widely disliked. also, all muslim extremism and violence is entirely the result of the nature of the muslim religion, which is evil. there is no possible way in which the actions of the united states could have done everything to contribute to muslim dislike for the united states, muslims are just evil.

that is literally what you are saying.

>>1111512
Any progress towards democracy is viewed by Islam as heretic because it denies the fundamental tyranny of Allah.

>>1111355
America is the only country that does this kind of shit? Oh, now I know.

>>1111465
>implying I'm a Christian

>>1111475

Sure.

Here's a link to a recent study discussing the subject itself: http://www2.psych.ubc.ca/~henrich/pdfs/Weird_People_BBS_final02.pdf

The study itself focuses on westerners in general, but it also focuses on Americans too. I can't give you what you're looking for, though, because I'm not talking about an ideological, or religious, etc. world view, I'm talking about our psychological impulses, our intuitions--they're quite different because of the society we live in (industrialized, with very little attachment to nature). Think of the degradation of our biological advances (how we're losing resistance to viruses) because of our way of life in general (modern society), well something very similar is happening psychologically. We (in industrialized societies) don't perceive shapes the same way, for example, as people who have lived in remote parts of Africa do.

To go back to the original point: a lot of psychological studies are taken with Americans as subjects, and this is fudging the data that we get in research because of how limited and narrow our test group is. There's been quite a bit of change in psychological academic associations to change this narrow focus of essentially only western and American perspectives in tests because they're finding that many of the results don't apply in other parts of the world, where they view things differently (which is a significant problem).

>>1111523
>Stirner

You may not be Christian, but you're probably libertarian (is that what you call bourgeois fascism these days?), which is worse.

>>1111518
>all muslim extremism and violence is entirely the result of the nature of the muslim religion
Not "evil" per say. But not in accordance with the rest of the modern world.

>here is no possible way in which the actions of the united states could have done everything to contribute to muslim dislike for the united states
It's not just USA. It's Britain, Egypt, Spain also I think. True Islam is at odds with the rest of the world. Most muslims ignore this though since they are good & peaceful people.

>>1111528
>implying I'm not apolitical

Also:
>bourgeois

lol'd

>>1111530
*Also to reply more directly to you the USA has supported or ignored dictators all over the globe. Yet it's just Islam extremists that seem to react this badly.

>>1111530
TyBrax. TyBrax.

The point I'm trying to make is that it is possible that the violence and hatred of the west in the Middle East is at least in part caused by the actions of the West - the United States as well as Britain and other nations - in interfering in Mideast politics, propping up states or regimes seen as illegitimate, etc. I

>>1111523
mea culpa I got a bit carried away. I don't know what faith you call your own and I really don't care.
But I stand by my ethnic slur!

>>1111526
> I can't give you what you're looking for, though, because I'm not talking about an ideological, or religious, etc. world view

that was apparently my own misinterpretation, but this is essentially what i was asking for, thank you.

>>1111530
Per say? What fucking language is that, retard?

>>1111538
>the violence and hatred of the west in the Middle East is at least in part caused by the actions of the West
OK then I agree with you. But Islam itself is half or more of the problem.

>>1111550
Troll'd

>>1111445
Fair enough, but the point here is that there is no good reason for burning a ton of Koran's on 9/11.

9/11 had nothing to do religion, sure it was the reason used by extremists but the fact is those people aren't Muslims, they're just assholes who want to kill American's, and religion is always the perfect excuse.

It's motivated by hate and will cause no good whatsoever, and I don't like that.

>>1111550

not sure if serious

Muslims have to learn to be tolerant. Tolerance is just another word for not giving a fuck. When muslims learn to not give a fuck about Americans who burn Korans they'll also learn to not give a fuck about a ton of other things.
Not giving a fuck is an important part of being a cultured man.

By burning their book many muslims will realise that it's completly unimportant for them if some people on the other half of the globus burn the Koran or if they do not.
A first step to not giving a fuck.

>>1111566
>surprised that the denizens of /lit/ are illiterate
hmph. you must be new here.

>>1111574
The problem is that they feel they are being better Muslims by "giving a fuck". Technically they are.

>>1111575

Been here since day 2 (not day 2, per say, but the very late hours of day 1).

>>1111566
Serious as fuck. PER FUCKING SE, YOU ILLITERATES. WTF is so hard about that?

Whatever happened to that thing called the 1st amendment?

Yes, Islamic extremists flew planes into the WTC. But there will always be extremist fucks in any religion. But does anybody remember the Spanish Inquisition? Christianity had it's heyday too.

>>1111596
see:
>>1111519

Tolerance is for weak people. Real men fight for their God given right to tell other people how to live!

>>1111596
add to that witch burning in Salem

>>1111604
Yeah, and?

>>1111613
Well unless you don't advocate democracy you should have a problem with Islam.

there's some debate on whether islam is compatible with democracy.

can someone lay out the facts here?

>>1111645
other than the fact that there are democracies where the vast majority of the people are muslim?

>>1111645
There's no "debate" about it It's established fact between intellectuals. Democracy is anathema to Islam, the most Conservative group in the world.

>>1111658
You forgot to mention that the majority of muslims are "bad" at being muslims.

How are people so ignorant as to think the U.S. didn't provoke the 9/11 attacks? Or reciprocally, that the faux-religious leaders of the Islamic states didn't twist the teachings of the Koran for their own profit? Furthermore, realize, it's pretty obvious that the majority of people in both the United States and the Middle East are in no position to direct foreign policy or religious theology.

As such, both party's leaders have resorted to the time-honored tradition of abandoning logical arguments in favor of "mud-slinging" when confronted with the same. Actions such as the NYC/WTC Mosque project are blatantly obvious ploys to polarize Americans against their Muslim neighbors.

Why would they do this you ask? As it stands, 99% of Americans oppose the "jihadist" agenda and DO NOT sympathize with potential terrorists planning and executing future attacks. Emigrating Muslims initially sought refuge in America from the totalitarian countries they left with the promise of "The Land of the Free".

What do they find when they get here? Millions of Americans practically foaming at the mouth, stirred on by ignorant fucks like this Florida preacher and Faux News, racially and religiously persecuting them. Ironically, this is directly against everything America supposedly stands for according to our Constitution. And we expect these people to willfully ignore the faction of people preaching the destruction of "The Great Evil"? How many generations of persecution can a people withstand before agreeing to turn a blind eye to potential terror attacks in the future?

Prejudice ignites more prejudice, prejudice leads to hate, hate leads to violence.

>>1111668
Just as bad as Christians in a country where most of the pop. is Christian.

>>1111676
>How are people so ignorant as to think the U.S. didn't provoke the 9/11 attacks? Or reciprocally, that the faux-religious leaders of the Islamic states didn't twist the teachings of the Koran for their own profit?
They may be the minority but they are the ones actually being more honest in their interpretation of the Koran.

>As it stands, 99% of Americans oppose the "jihadist" agenda and DO NOT sympathize with potential terrorists planning and executing future attacks
>illions of Americans practically foaming at the mouth, stirred on by ignorant fucks like this Florida preacher and Faux News, racially and religiously persecuting them
Oh right you're pulling this crap out of your ass.

>>1111681
The Christians in the USA aren't bad at being Christians though. Jesus advocated democracy. Most Christians are co-existing with democracy.

>>1111683
-Rhetorical Despotism

-No, you're right-Americans want more terrorist attacks on our soil, we're using reverse psychology to trick people into bombing us. Fox news continues to run, therefore people watch it, repeatedly.

>>1111700
sympathize != agree with

Millions of people don't agree with Fox News. Less than 5% of the USA is Faux News zealots.

>The Rev. Terry Jones
>Terry Jones

This is clearly a Python sketch.

>>1111709
NO ONE EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!

>>1111709

No it isn't.

>>1111713
Our one most heinous weapon is koran burning, koran burning and ruthless efficiency, our two weapons are koran burning and ruthless efficiency... and surprise, our three weapons are koran burning, ruthless efficiency and surprise.

>>1111713


NO ONE EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQU- oh bugger

>>1111698
Not true. Jesus advocated homosexual orgies. What a fag!

>>1111734
lol, it's just like in the monthy python

>>1111709

Holy shit. Imagine, for one moment, if this anon was correct. With the world's cameras on him, just as the first Quran is about to be lit, he rips off a silicon mask and NO-ONE EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION.

It would be so so glorious.

>>1111661
and said intellectuals know this to be true why

>>1111708
I'm not going to waste time arguing whether people believe in what Fox says, or in what it means to "believe" or "agree" etc. The point of my argument is that, American citizens, born and raised here, are very very very very unlikely to support a violent foreign power seeking to overthrow their birth-nation.

I believe immigrants from the Middle East, who have been preached to by religious fanatics since the day they were born and forced under penalty of death to pay, at minimum, lip service to their tyrannical leaders. From my knowledge of Islam, Muslims have as much right and responsibility to attack and kill their neighbors as their Jewish cousins. The Old Testament is full of stories of god calling for the destruction of heathen tribes. I assume the same is true of Islam (save "People of the Book" restriction), and it wouldn't take a genius to assume the mantle of religious tyrant for one's own prophet.

That's why I brought up rhetorical despotism.

>>1111722

No one got it or chose to ignore it.

>>1111747
>derogatory term to refer to homosexuals
Sigh, when will modern atheists ever learn to be tolerant of anyone different.

>>1111756
They have read the Western Holy books & note that the Koran stands out as far more violent than the others. That the Koran advocates slavery & raping of women (who will then be stoned if they accuse their abusers). They know the context of when then book was written & who the author was (Muhammed a brutal War-lord).

>>1111767
fine. I'll humor you.

>>1111722
Yes. It is.

>>1111801

Nope, it's definitely not.

>>1111820

I'm quite sure it isn't! Definitely not!

>>1111807
Is.

WHAT? YOU WANNA BURN KORANS EH? WELL WHEN SOMEBODY COMES RUNNIN' AT YOU, WIELDING A PIECE OF FRESH FRUIT AND ALL YOU'VE GOT TO DEFEND YOURSELF IS A BURNING HOLY TEXT, DON'T COME CRYING TO ME

>>1111825
ISSSSSS!!!

>>1111676
If I provoke you, and you kill me with an axe, you're still to blame, not me.

>>1111836

I can't afford to pay you any more.

>>1111676
that's a very broad definition of 'provoke' you're using

quick question (dont wanna derail the thread). is it legal to dress up as jesus and set yourself on fire? i need this info for a project, tia!

glenn beck opposes the burning

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/07/AR2010090705913.html?hpid%3Dtopnews&
amp;sub=AR

>>1111870
Provided you don't use special effects, and legitimately do set yourself ablaze, I think you're okay.

Good luck.

>>1111870
no law per say (amidoinitrite??), however you'd be breaking the law if you injured anyone else or caused damage to personal property. also, you could legally be detained if it's believed you are attempting to commit suicide. and i'm sure that if the police were aware that you were doing it, and you're doing it without professional assistance and e.m.s. present, then they could intervene and prevent it.

>>1111901
>then they could intervene

i meant *would* intervene, and they would be justified in doing so