/lit/ - Literature

>>10820759
If you check out the early chapters of the book 'Flowers for Algernon' you will get a decent first person perspective on what it's like to be a PoC

>>10820759
Jordan B. Peterson - 12 Rules for Life

>>10820759
The "I'm underprivileged because I'm not white" is a literal meme, dude. You should realize that for a long time people have played the race card, and will continue to do so. Does that mean that no one who's not white isn't oppressed? No, it just means you have to sit through 98% liberals complaining if you want to know about actual trials and oppression, like the Rwandan genocide for instance

You can't learn that kind of things from books. Go out there and get to know people from beyond your world to expand you understanding.

Crenshaw's On Intersectionality

Your image filename says intersectionality.jpg so you may already be aware of the concept and the author

This is a pretty good book. It doesn't really dig as deep into the issues in terms of pure factual explanation but i think its a great history book that is very important for understanding post-modern thought.

what about some books that will help me understand the oppression of queer people? I'm sadly not very familiar with the history of the community but I do realize queerphobic attitudes are a systemic problem to which all people like me contribute

Jon Rawls' a theory of justice is also kind of related too, I guess. It's not specifically about opression and more about equality, but there you go.

>>10820780
t. white dude

>>10820759
Jesus Christ. Stop this disgusting self-flallegation right now. How about you "sincerely" read some philosophy, and THEN read the garbage theory this stuff is based on. Please use your brain before you buy into something.

>>10820815
your image is a white chick though

>>10820815
Define white privilege. Be specific. Give examples. I'm listening. Also how would something like affirmative action not be considered black privilege?

>>10820818
Nice catch, champ.

>>10820816
but the cannon of philosophy as we know it is eurocentric, it was made by straight white dudes FOR straight white dudes. Its hard seeing the relevance and the sublimity of all those white male philosophers when they also said such horrible things about women, queers and people of color. and I am saying this as a straight white dude myself

>tfw gay and watching all these pathetic little straight cucks submitting to me...
a century ago I would have been the submissive, the rejected, the subhuman... but now you all bow down before me of your own accord, infected by a morality which serves my ends, bent prostrate for reasons you barely understand, my sexuality a holy mystery to you, forced reverence...

>>10820759
You don't need a book, just get one of pic related and try fitting a circular peg into a square hole, then start screaming at the toy because square holes don't fit circular pegs, all the while blindly ignoring circular holes because separate is not equal.

>>10820829
Bullshit. Human reason supercedes all categories of race and gender. Your assumption that gender is primary is groundless and indefencible.

>>10820759
Why are you asking 4chan

>>10820829
That's what non-whites don't get. "white priviledge" is not oppression. It's the fact that whites created these institutions, and of course that means that they will best suit the interests and abilities of white people. The fact that this upsets non-whites is just a symptom of their inability to create their own institutions and consequent need to parasitically attach themselves to something not meant for them.

>>10820843
the concept of universal western reason has been used to justify imperialism and the genocide and continued oppression of queers, women and people of color

>>10820829
>thousands of years of man clawing tooth and nail with every inch of his intellect to understand the universe
>see the morals of today slowly take shape
>see science spring forth from natural philosophy and slowly fill in the gaps of our ignorance allowing us to realize being gay is a part of nature, that aids isn't a gay curse, that all races are generally the same, that women deserve the same rights as men and arent inferior
>most of those men are white so why would anything they say be relevant to men who aren't white?

honestly wtf are you on about? I can't even begin to understand where you're coming from without ascribing white angst to your position.

>>10820843
>Human reason supercedes all categories of race and gender
That's actually a fairly modern perspective. Kant certainly didn't think aboriginal people were autonomous and resonable beings.

>>10820856
>a symptom of their inability to create their own institutions and consequent need to parasitically attach themselves to something not meant for them.
end thread
end all gender and race studies also

>>10820859
And he would be right, because reason is subject to development like anything else, and therefore we are proud of what we have cultivated.

>>10820843
>human reason
t. materialist fundy. libs are some of the most racist people imaginable in that they seek to force their particular perverted varient of white thinking onto other peoples. Take blacks for example. Common sense dictates that for ~90% of them school beyond 5th grade is not useful or healthy, yet liberal materialist zeal dictates that the white man knows best.

>>10820868
>because reason is subject to development like anything else
No it isn't. It's intrinsic to human beings.

>>10820822
white people have benefited from unearned affirmative action for the last 500 years

>>10820874
Human beings are subject to development.

>>10820876
m8 u fucking what

>>10820882
That's a meaningless statement. You'll be hard pressed to find any group of peoples that lack any sort of self-determination.

>>10820876
??????

>>10820876
kek, not sure if you were being sarcastic but I've heard non whites say this shit and it's depressing af. They've internalized the white definition of success as their own. It's like the child of a borderline pd mother, absolute codependency and lack of individuation. As a white man this is p disturbing. I guess it's ultimately our fault for pushing so hard with colonialism.

>>10820876
Again, I asked you to be specific and it seems you can't actually define what white privilege is or give concrete examples

>>10820890
Your thoughts are so unclear I can't understand what you're saying.

>>10820904
>I can't understand what you're saying.
Why discuss Kant if you ignore the basics, then, hmmm?

>>10820897
are you fucking blind? Donald Trump is fucking president

>>10820759
>straight white dude
rote, seen at least 5-10 shitlib journos and actors say that exact phrase “straight white DUDE” in the last 5 years

how does it feel being an agent of a political agenda that doesn’t care about you in the least? it’d be like being a jewish nazi i guess

>>10820759
god fucking damnitt i just realized this was bait, well played OP

>>10820926
Notice how you always hear "white guys" over "white men" now?

>>10820815
t. blue haired lesbian

>>10820909
If you can't make your point without jargon, I'll assume you're the one who doesn't understand Kant.

>>10820925
>Donald Trump is fucking president
Because the Republican party adopted new rules that they failed to playtest in the aftermath of the 2012 attempted coup by the Ron Paul deligates, and the Democratic Party decided it was Hillary Clinton's turn.

She was pretty much the only person he could have beat

>>10820904
>>10820909
If you want a really brief and boiled down explanation, Kant considered human beings worth of consideration under the categorical imperative based on the idea that human beings are autonomous agents, that is, self-determined and able to manifest their own will, as opposed to, say, animals, who are completeley heteronomous and thus subject to external causes.

This ability to trascend their own circumstances is unique to human beings and, as it stands, pretty much intrinsic to all of them. As I said, you'd be hard pressed to find any group of peoples who simply aren't self-determined.

>>10820935
You should probably first define what you mean by development. If you're bringing race realism into the mix, you should at least have the balls to bring it out and not pussyfoot around it like the coward crypto-fascist that you are.

>>10820759
Their plight doesn't matter. They are oppressed because they are mediocre.

>>10820925
Ok? Last time I checked illegal immigration was still illegal. Also you're referring to the president, not how the average huwh*te male is in your eyes so ebil.

>>10820897
Not who you responded to, there is probably infinite manifestations, but some off the top of my head are simple things we don't notice. WP is growing up watching tv and movies where 99percent of the characters look like you, your politicians and local business owners look like you. People don't look at you like you're going to steal things every time you go into a convenience store, not being generally harassed by law enforcement, etc. it's a bunch of almost unnoticeable little perks white people get that they don't even think matter. No one is asking white people to feel bad or guilty. It's more about just fucking chilling out and not making a big deal about it when someone else gets a seat at the table.

>>10820897
Concrete examples? How about black men being overrepresented in prison. How about women making 60 cents on the dollar compared to men. How about literally all women living in fear of being sexually harassed by MEN. How about women not being able to walk down the street at night without fear of a man jumping out and raping her? Have you had enough or should I keep going?? How about women not being CEOs? How about women being underrepresented in STEM fields. How about blacks being murdered in Chicago because of white politicians' gun laws? I could go on and on. But you enjoy your privilege .

>>10820948
shouldn't it be called black disadvantage instead of white privilege because asians and non-puerto rican hispanics also have the same "privilege"

>>10820948
Thank you for finally giving a reasonable answer, but would the same thing not happen to whites in a majority black country?

>>10820952
>>10820952
blacks are overrepresented in prison because they are overrepresented in murder and robbery, women are paid less than men because they have less credentials and negotiate less, are u really tryna come with these basic bitch talking points?

>>10820943
So to manifest reason is to be human. And reason manifests itself in time. So there are degrees of self-determination, and thus civilisation – and it is quite possible to distinguish between them, without recourse to "race realism," or whatever else bullshit jargon you can think of.

>>10820952
Worm aren't in STEM because *news flash* they'd rather do other things. This is how the world works. Trying to force women to go into stem when they don't want to won't necessarily make it more appealing to them, in fact it might have the opposite effect. Also "muh pay gap" is based on overall earnings, not accounting for different fields, hours worked, etc. I would go into more detail but you're to lazy to do a google search so I'm too lazy to explain it to you properly.

>>10820970
>So there are degrees of self-determination
Which degrees? Sounds like a completely arbitrary classification to me, prove it isn't.

>>10820971
the pay gap is going away, at least nominally since companies figured out they can trick women by changing their job titles into something nice sounding but low paying, and switch the actual high earning positions into something nondescript that women won't go into b/c they can't use it for social capital.

>>10820982
well didn't napoleon say something about that like "men will die for a ribbon"

>>10820815
>>10820822
>>10820876

i'm white and i don't care. you can't make me. it's trouble enough getting out of bed in the morning. if i have white privilege, good, thats one thing in life that isn't out to get me. does it seem fair in the big picture? no. but you can't expect me to solve that. i'm just trying to earn money for groceries to keep this horrifying biological machine running. i don't have time to worry about the moderately disadvantaged in a world of the damned. i don't even care to think about the damned.

>>10820952
everyone, I wrote that long diatribe and I don't even believe any of it. I don't know what it is about 4chan that makes me want to LARP and shitpost.

>>10820977
Human evolution is a fact, however you want to carve it up. So the burden of proof is on you to prove reason is timeless – good luck.

>>10820992
not that I believe in white privilege bullshit at all, but this made me think. If depression makes you unable to empathize with others, does that make recreational drug use, particularly stimulant use to increase energy, the moral choice?

>>10820836
falseflag.

>>10820996
We all know deep down sjws are right about absolutely everything but don't dare admit it even to ourselves

>>10820779
No, no, that's about being MORE white.

>>10820836
You are just a straight guy being flippant about queer suffering and queer oppression because it's nothing to you

>>10820759
>Books about marginalized folks and systems of oppression
You wouldn't be using this language if you weren't already well acquainted with that discourse. I get that you're trying to inject it onto the board, and I don't have a problem with that, but at least be honest.

These books are probably what you plan on posting later in the thread, so I'll save you the time.

>>10821020
Those aren't exactly niche terms

>65 posts
>26 posters
jesus christ

>>10821006
>>10821011
nope, I have simply transcended the dialectics of ressentiment. I do not perpetuate the New Left political schema but I have no qualms turning it to my own advantage. heterosexuals are nothing but mindless slaves, ready to turn from self-righteous hatred to abject self-abasement, from throwing gays off bridges to unquestioningly accepting HRT therapy for their kids - all within a few paltry decades - thinking themselves "good" at every turn... the mediocrity of the human race... yes, continue your petty work, my useful idiots, my tarantulas... i shall exploit you all! your achievements are nothing to me in moral terms, simply conditions to be taken advantage of.

>>10821011
why do libs care about queer suffering and not aspie suffering? Is it because they're perverts?

>>10821021
They're used almost exclusively by instersctional leftists. No one else thinks in terms of systems of oppression, and no else is deluded enough to use the term folks when they have a masters degree. They're the carefully selected terms of a highly standardized discourse. Using them in such a way indicates that you already participate in that discourse to some extent.

>>10821028
woke af

>>10821028
holy fuck you must be a faggot cause that's the gayest LARP i've ever read.

>>10821007
this is probably more accurate than you think. idpol makes rational sense but at some point we get tired of rational sense. the bourgoise are never going to willingly surrender the luxuries of exploitation, and nobody but the down and out want to be viewed as a statistic or a confluence of forces.
not that today's progressives are looking for armed revolt or a Brave New World calculator society but that's where these modes of thought take you in the extreme and it frightens people.
i think most conservatism is self aware selfishness that masks as something else.

t. conservative

Im a half black gay brazilian, and I assure you its all bullshit. Everyone can live a normal life if they try. Everyone has their own dificulties. This thing about systematic oppression of minorities in todays America is just a result of your self centered culture mixed with post ww2 philosophy and neoliberalism. Dont believe this bullshit. Ive been in this "community" for years and everyone is just repeating the same meaningless phrases and terms over and over. From my own experience as a minority, my only problems in my life were caused by financial difficulty. Thats the worst thing you can go throu. Being poor is worse than being black gay a tranny etc, you just dont talk abiut that in Ameroca because you cant question liberalism. Dont get into this rabbit hole, OP. There is nothing to gain from it.

>>10820997
So you are a fucking coward crypto-fascist. Not only that, but also a mentally deficient coward crypto-fascist. I'm sorry dude, but you have to prove how fucking natural selection even benefit lesser intelligence first before you jump into conclusions, fucking moron dipshit.

Then we can start discussing which particular genes define intelligence

Since you won't have answers to any, I guess I win.

>>10821030
>Is it because they're perverts?
hadn't thought of it that way but you're probably right. retarded people are genetic mistakes and broken from day 1. perverts are Good Liberal Americans exercising their Freedom Of Mind and being punished for it. it's liberalism's love of free choice and disregard for those who cannot serve the economy. only communism is in favor of retards.

>>10821055
>you have to prove how fucking natural selection even benefit lesser intelligence first
not that guy but arent there millions of examples of evolutionary fitness that dont "prefer" greater intelligence

>>10821052
>Im a half black gay brazilian,

>>10821059
>not that guy but arent there millions of examples of evolutionary fitness that dont "prefer" greater intelligence
But it needs to be proven specifically for human beings since intelligence is undoubtedly the greatest evolutionary advantage that exists for them. As a matter of fact, the development of language and social ties are probably the most significant and advanced traits.

>>10821049
They're only right in that it's obvious that being born black for example makes you less likely to win "the game" of modern society, which is getting to materialist heaven (sex, money, status). The problem of today is that whereas even 50 years ago people played a number of different games (black ghetto status game, dozens of seperate games for seperate career tracks) now that everyone is connected through the internet/media and jobs for the common people aren't stable enough to use as a personal identity, we're all forced to play the same game and the losers are upset and the winners are guilty and it's suddenly less of a game and more of a struggle.

>>10821058
so being gay is a choice then?

>>10821062
an unqualified conjecture from someone with no knowledge (not proof): developments in agriculture and creating hierarchical city-based societies might be less fit than stable hunter-gatherer societies for certain populations depending on geography, ecosystem climate and political circumstance

>>10821055
the vast majority of species are naturally selected for traits other than intelligence. you should be well aware there are many niches in the natural world.

some hypotheses for the relatively high iq of ashkenazi jews is a kind of cultural / economic sexual selection. jewish tradition strongly encourages literacy and esteems those who can study and critically interpret their law. this increases the odds that intelligent members of their culture will mate off with other high value members. economically, jews also could exploit a niche in finance because of christian / islamic banning of usury. finance requires significant intelligence and judgment to be successful, and successful financiers could afford many children.

>>10821059
>>10821062
And that's not mentioning that the most common ancestor for human beings is 200,000 years old. By evolutionary terms it is really fairly fucking recent, simply there isn't enough time for there to exist significance variance in intelligence between human races.

The genetic difference between different species of chimpanzees is fairly massive compared to the genetic difference between human races.

>>10821077
>an unqualified conjecture from someone with no knowledge (not proof)
A brazen statement considering the pointless diatribe you just came up with.

>>10821085
>A brazen statement considering the pointless diatribe you just came up with.
i'm not that guy idiot

>>10821085
If you include Pygmies as being human it's more like 300k years apparently.

Also what kind of logic are you using to say that 200k years isn't enough? It took what 5million to branch off from chimps? 200k years is 5% of that, which is a substantial amount

>>10821055
>>10821058
>>10821059
>>10821062
>>10821077
>>10821083
>>10821085

And all of this doesn't take into account the Flynn effect, which sees massive trend upwards from one generation to the next. Particulary noteworthy is the case of Kenyan children studied from 1984 uintil 1998, which saw an incredible rise of IQ tests of about 30 points as the latest generation went through a significant life quality improvement, meaning that differences in intelligence are mostly accounted for by external circumstances such as education and nourishment!

Not to mention the gap between white students and black students on IQ tests has been steadily closing with each passing year, suggesting it's context what matters the most when it comes to IQ!

And that's not taking into account that IQ only accounts for fucking abstract thinking! Studies have been shown that you can, as a matter of fact, study for IQ testing and see your own results improved, meaning that they are not good methods to measure intelligence at all!

I can go all day.

>>10821085
>A brazen statement considering the pointless diatribe you just came up with.
I'm talking about your comment on hunter gatherer societies as if had any bearing on evolution. At all.

>>10821096
>which sees massive trend upwards from one generation to the next. Particulary noteworthy is the case of Kenyan children studied from 1984 uintil 1998, which saw an incredible rise of IQ tests of about 30 points as the latest generation went through a significant life quality improvement, meaning that differences in intelligence are mostly accounted for by external circumstances such as education and nourishment!
>Not to mention the gap between white students and black students on IQ tests has been steadily closing with each passing year, suggesting it's context what matters the most when it comes to IQ!
Literally none of this is true lmao

>>10821093
>Also what kind of logic are you using to say that 200k years isn't enough?
It's called evolution, read up on it.

>>10821103
You can google it lol

>>10821096
>IQ only accounts for fucking abstract thinking
well yeah, abstract thinking is also known as intelligence

>>10821107
you dont get off that easy m8.

Skin color, skull shape, many other things changed in that time period, why exactly can genes involved with intelligence not change.

What makes it 'just not long enough' and why am i supposed to believe that isn't entirely politically motivated

>>10821102
hunter-gatherer and agricultural/industrial are two completely different environments, two total different contexts with different criterion of success for humans to live inside. conjecturally, some amount of traits will become more or less fit. different mental needs.

>>10821085
the fixation index based on single nucleotide pairings between sub saharan africans and japanese, is 0.192, and between finns and swedes is about 0.005

the amount of variation between dog breeds is about 0.3, and we can all observe trait differences between collies and pugs.

>>10821109
This level of cherry picking pretty much is an admission of defeat.

Just admit that you are an ignorant plebe already. A lowly mediocre, pasty white cletus who sees himself outperformed by everyone around him.

>>10821113
Two contexts which in the larger and infinitely more broader context of evolution have existed for just a tiny tiny tiny tiny tiny tiny sliver of time. Thus irrelevant, like your comment.

>>10821107
for example is 500k years long enough? How about 1million

Do you have some kind of chart that says 10IQ points per million years. Is this entirely bullshit you pulled out of your ass

>>10821116
I'm pretty sure you're just fucking around but it's late and I'm in a bad mood so you can suck on my PhD program admission you goddamn pleb.

>>10821116
iq tests, sat, act, are strongly correlated with overall life success. its definitely measuring something salient and useful.

>>10821116
you didn't post any sources

btw here's an entire book of sources
and you don't get to say the book is wrong, you have to say why the individual sources in it are wrong
https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/jp-rushton-race-evolution-behavior-unabridged-1997-edition.pdf

>>10821128
>so you can suck on my PhD program admission you goddamn pleb.
You are so fucking mad right now, literally in tears. Goddamn, inventing PhD programs, goddamn.

Bye, cletus.

>>10821005
No. It just makes you more of a degenerate

>>10820858
do you seriously think a Person of Color or a Queer would be able to look at the same history, the history of their oppression and degradation and dehumanisation at the hands of people like you and think: gee it sure was nice of those white dudes to invent philosophy and human rights?

>>10821137
It sure was nice we brought you out the fucking cannibalizing savagery you lived in and gave you technology

>>10821132
Nobody has posted any sources except you and your shitty wordpress link.

>>10821122
you can read a book on evolution so you can find out how long do complex organisms even take to develop

>>10821137
>person of color

this term is so lame. might as well say colored person. or brown, while youre at it. even black people are brown.

>>10821076
in the eyes of the law it is, as much as any free choice or personal preference.

it may be deterministic on some genetic/neurochemical level but how is being gay any less of a choice than killing a person?

>>10821118
why are you being so rude? you've activated your partisan-brain mode and have become improperly hostile.

>>10821146
the proper term is nigger

>>10821148
Tone policing also counts as an admission of defeat. Why is it so hard to admit you people have been fed garbage on your cantonese cartoon board?

>>10821144
I pointed out to you that humans and chimps only split 5million years ago.

200k is 5% of that, explain to me why that's not long enough or just admit you are arguing without having any fucking clue why it's not long enough, that you couldn't even begin to formulate an argument for it, and that the only reason anybody says it's not long enough is precisely because it's the amount of time since the last common ancestor.

Also that isn't a shitty wordpress link it's a book full of academic sources

>>10821137
yes a lot of non-whites and queers do it every day faggot. also queers invented philosophy, nice attempt to erase our existence, leftoid...

>>10820815
Actually I'm brown

>>10821153
You haven't posted any sources, so you haven't 'won' at all, you haven't even addressed anybody's arguments, you just said 'read a book'

>>10821148
dude you are literally advocating for eugenics and genocide, because that's what the implications of your ideology are

>>10821144
look up punctuated equilibrium. species can evolve quickly.

for example, tibetans fairly recently evolved the ability to breathe at extremely high altitudes in the past several thousand years.

>>10820829
>and I am saying this as a straight white dude myself
Are you jewish?

>>10821153
you sure are keen on "defeating" the opponent for someone who calls people crypto-facists. not even the anon you replied to but keking at your life.

>>10821158
>>10821157
t. straight white dude

>>10821163
>racial differences -----> genocide
stop projecting your own hatred of differences onto others

>>10821163
why are you shitting on David Hume's grave

>>10821153
>tone policing
insidious phrase. any criticism lobbied against your unpleasant and ungraceful behaviour is tarnished with the connotation of some sort of systematic attempt to silence you. the paradox is that the application of the label "tone policing" to someone else's words is itself a proscription, an attempt to police their words. a refusal to engage unless they adhere to your own standards, the boundaries by which you will allow your discourse to be criticised.
>>10821163
you are likely confusing me with another anon. my only contributions to this conversation have been to suggest that a possible explanation of difference in evolutionary selection for intelligence. there are variations in human intelligence between people, and the ones that people claim exist between different populations are no more dramatic (as far as i know) than those that exist between a person of below average and above average intelligence. it doesn't strike as me as needing a particularly long stretch of time to develop.

>>10821155
>explain to me why that's not long enough
Because it's a random process which only happens with every birth. Stuff like skin color, or lactose tolerance only involves a handful of genes. In the case for lactose tolerance, a single measly gene. Gene makeup can only change so much with each birth.

Intelligence is conformed by thousands of genes, that's why no racial theory pseudo-science can pinpoint to a specific gene that accounts for intelligence.

>Also that isn't a shitty wordpress link it's a book full of academic sources
You linked me a full fucking book from an extremely dubious source. Here, I'll return the favor

https://www.amazon.com.mx/Evolution-Douglas-J-Futuyma/dp/1605356050/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1520662062&sr=8-4&keywords=evolution

>>10820759
Can anyone truly look at OP's pic related and not feel the dehumanization? Humans are just attributes to these monsters, there is no soul

>>10821180
You have literally nothing to say except, for whatever reason, cry about me insulting you, on the board where everyone calls everybody else retards for reading fucking Harry Potter.
Either go into the other threads and start shunning everyone's "unpleasant and ungraceful behaviour" or, quite frankly, leave.

>>10821181
So there being many genes associated with something means it can't be selected for in 200k years? What the fuck kind of logic is that. You could change the average IQ in a single generation if you cut off the bottom 90%

Once again if 200k isn't enought to do literally anything, then how is 5million enough to go from human to chimp?

here is another book about this:
https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/the-10000-year-explosion-how-civilization-accelerated-human-evolution-2009-by-gregory-cochran-henry-harpending.pdf

>>10821195
Do you seriously think that people who read and enjoy Harry Potter as adults are not retarded? I'm not even being sarcastic, and by retarded I mean dullards not worth my time.

>>10821203
Are you the same guy? Do you really want to go on a tangent about Harry Potter? Really?

Do you actually have anything remotely of consequence to talk about? At all?

>>10821195
your rudeness has a quality of bitterness to it - not the same sort of shameless, self-aware bitterness we all casually indulge in, but one of ugly self-assurance. you can't handle anyone calling attention to something unpleasant in your behaviour. you don't shrug it off, you engage with it more venomously than any other part of the discussion, and shoot out terms that indicate a transparent sense of victimhood (tone policing), all while trying to act above it all. you are the worst breed of moralist.

>>10821209
nope different guy, I'm mostly fucking with you since it's obvious you're in the wrong place.

>>10821211
I didn't even finish reading your comment. Reply to me if you wish, it's not like you add anything of value.

>>10821211
>worst breed of moralist.
They're descended from the New England Puritan extremists

>>10821216
*infects you with treatment-resistant lice*

>>10821194
I bet you don't 'feel the dehumanization' when presenting an eurocentric cannon as the be all end all of human achievement, or when someone makes a joke that perpetuates systems of oppression, or when reading alt right posts, or when a black man is murdered by white cops. But suddenly when people start studying systems of oppresion and trying to build a more empathetic society, suddenly you start complaining about dehumanisation. and that is because you have been reminded of your complicity in systemic inhumanity

>>10821233
>when a black man is murdered by white cops
What about when black men rape and murder by the tens of thousands, many of which are white people

You know, the reason they're getting shot by cops, including being incapable of cooperating even slightly

>>10821198
Not to be nitpicky but the latest estimate is 7 million years.

Nice shit book by the way

>>10821233
what's stopping black people from presenting an afrocentric cannon as the be all and end all of human achievement. Because I honestly wouldn't give a fuck if they did since it affects me to a degree equal to 0.

>>10821250
you going to make even a single argument

>>10820759
Anything about working class white people, or working class people of any race. When people talk about straight white dudes they're talking about rich straight white dudes.

>>10821233
also on a crime committed to death by cop ratio, whites are more likely to be victims of un-deserved police violence

>>10821269
when people talk about privileged white guys they mean jews but they're scared to say it

>>10821233
you're essentially claiming that europeans have no right to be european in their own countries, but must instead include alien cultures within their very own institutions. That's absurd and anyone who stands for it is a fucking coward.

>>10821273
they're completely unaware of who even is jewish. They don't even realize people like Kissinger or fucking Bernanke are jewish

>>10821276
Go ahead, what does it mean to be european?

>>10821284
so you want him to justify his own existence? ...that is very, very problematic, to say the least.

>>10821284
curiousity, trancendence, rationality combined with the capacity for deep emotion (as opposed to the pure unfeeling reason of orientals or the unbridled savage emotion of negroids)

>>10821284
what does it mean to be native american?

>>10821265
Because niggers had no concept of a written language until the white man came. They were too dumb to have their language evolve beyond a system of click sounds.

>>10821296
>>10821284
that good enough for you?

>>10821298
u know germans and swedes n shit had no written language until like 1000AD right? i'm against the colonization of europe by islamic imperialists, but "muh writing" doesn't quite hold up

>>10821296
asians arent protoss. the chinese have all kinds of weirdo irrational behaviours. just look at asian parenting.
>>10821303
germans are not humans......

>>10820759
you need to think differently OP

>>10821296
now that I think about it that's what makes whites so dominant. Asians have the means to project their will, but no will substantial enough to project. Africans have will to the brim but not enough rationality to project it into the world. Only whites were able to achieve this

>>10821318
>Asians have no will
Have you heard of Genghis Khan

>>10821317
that was the greatest suicide of all time man so defiant so willful, a true master

>>10821321
Sorry, by Asian I meant East Asian, specifically Chinese since those are the asians I am most familiar with culturally.

>>10821330
You should really qualify it culturally then, saying they dont have the will is vague as fuck senpai.

ITT: the corpse of lit

disgusting thread, absolutely disgusting

>>10821284
Tell me what justice means?
The problem with the modern left is they've never done anything real thought. There's an ever a debate about what the good is, what is ethical. They just assume late capitalism is the order of the day and justice is when a certain % of black trannies get to share in the fruits.

>>10820957
No, because don't think they do. Just because some people might be "functionally white" (like myself) doesn't mean they're not benefiting partiallyfromthisphenomenon. While receiving surface benefits, they may also be suffering from some conflicted feelings about this, even if they don't truly understand those feelings, or where theycomefrom.
>>10820961
Sure, partially. People in other countries around the world are still consuming American media on a huge scale, though. And there are places like South Africa or even Mexico or some places in South America where the politicians are largely white, or just lighter skinned than the population at large. If you watch Spanish language television even in the US, the vastmajorityof people on these shows are light skinned. ive witnessed the casting process up close and personal. And a lot of this comes from the people on the very, very top trying to project a certain image or protect a certain image, for whatever reason.

I am trying to think of a place where a young white child could grow up unexposed to any role models they can identify with.

>>10821560
>I am trying to think of a place where a young white child could grow up unexposed to any role models they can identify with.
Any non American white country. Of course you assume skin colour is the most important node of self identification. Actually the most important thing is nationality, and non American whites have very few people who are like them in movies.
Though we seem to be assuming that 'people who look like me' is a positive necessary thing which you haven't shown at all

>>10820818
I don't agree with the image but even I'm not this retarded

>>10820808
Rawls is bullshit. Assumes the whole world deep down wants American liberalism.
I'm jihadi John. I think you should convert to Islam or die. Even with a veil of ignorance, nothing has changed. You should still convert or die, and if I'm not Islamic when the veil is lifted, then I will convert, no problem

Ignoring what is inevitably a shitstream from /pol/

Open City by Teju Cole
There, There by Tommy Orange
Anything written by Toni Morrison, early Margaret Atwood, like Surfacing.

George Orwell often wrote about marginalized peoples. Conservatives like to forget he was a socialist.

It is a perfectly fine question to ask. All people's are oppressed but if you haven't noticed that white dudes are over represented you're either not paying attention or are a white man who wants it to stay that way.

>no religion
>assumption of race
>ignorance of ideology
It's shit. Go back to plebbit.

This writer is really good. Anyway as a white person you cannot understand what it is to be marginalized at least in the same way as a woman, p.o.c. etc.

>>10821572
When we are talking about media one is exposed to as a child? Of course the visual is what's more important to a child. In general a child isn't going to understand the significance of an English accent vs. an American, or American southern accent, and even if there is dubbing. If you grow up watching shit dubbed in your language, it's what you're used to. It's a pretty obvious and accepted fact that kids choose role models who they can identify with, and that's for one reason or another. Like so many boys love spider man, and many girls love Elsa, almost purely based on gender, and Princess Sophia is insanely popular not only because Sophia is one of the most popular names in the US for the past 5+ years, she is also the daughter of a single mom who marries a king. Visuals are not the most important factor, but they're a very powerful hook, and a more important factor if you happen to go back 20 or so years ago, where the population of tv and movies was far more overwhelmingly white.

>>10821598
YOu're point about the disney characters is false. Kids of both genders identify with both.

>>10821585
>All people's are oppressed but if you haven't noticed that white dudes are over represented
If you haven't noticed it's the rich bourgeoisie who are over represented you havent been paying attention. Class explains modern society far more effectively than race. Whenever some wealthy ivy league graduate tells me that money and class are less significant that whatever affects them is, I smell a bourgeois rat.

>>10821604
Race is used to further the strategies of the upper classes. Racial oppression and class warfare coexist coincide and i would say that in america the latter depends upon the former. Nice evasion soy boy.

>>10821604
Oh boy is it possible both coould exist. I'm poor as fuck, anyway dude. I live in cooperative housing and work at a library, asshole.

>>10821598
Dude literally check your American privilege. You've been educated into seeing skin colour as the most important thing , but that's not true worldwide. There were no French people in star wars, but you think I identify with the americans just because there white?

>>10821601
I'm sure they do. But those are outliers. Girls like Disney princesses, boys like fighters. There is a lot of crossover. But growing up without access to any reference of a person who resembles you in some way can be alienating. There is plenty of examples of adult stars and filmmakers expressing such. This is why Uhura in Star Trek wassuchabigdeal, and the Cosbys, and even Tyler Perry, to a lesser extent. People find it comfy when the characters of their fiction are relatable.

>>10820829
The standard model of physics is eurocentric. Yet it maps excellently to the reality experienced by all humans. The same can be said of Western philosophy, regardless of its origins.

>>10821617
Who did you identify with? This is a fun fact that could help me understand you. Were you resentful of media from Hollywood because it was produced byAmericans?

>>10821610
>in america
Why the fuck should I care about that?
If you don't realise 90% of oppression is class based you havent been paying attention.
Americans of any hue are barely oppressed at all compared to the global proletariat

>>10821585
>if you haven't noticed that white dudes are over represented
this is america's contribution to the world. the concept of 'white dudes'. even the indigenous populations of europe are being punished by the american's transplanted guilty conscience.

>>10821617
And I never said it was the most important thing, but it definitely is a powerful factor for those in the US who grew up, not white.
And I recognize my American privilege. Consider it recognized. My California privilege even more so.

>>10821620
huge leap off a cliff with no parachute how the fuck do you prove that

>>10821625
That is interesting because most of the extremely poor people in the world are not white.

>>10821626
You call it transplanted, but Europeans have plenty to be guilty about.

Who Speaks for the Negro? By Robert Penn Warren. The most honest and objective look race relations I have come across. Also written at a time when the black/white issue was a powder keg.

>>10821621
Not him, but American media is alienating to non americans, regardless of the skin colour of the characters. To me (bong) the fresh Prince of bel air was a fish out of water tale, but about a British guy surrounded by rich americans. Something like Robin hood Prince of thieves are very weird (reaching for movies that came out in my childhood ) . All the heroes are americans and the villains are British. You ended up rooting for the sheriff of Nottingham, and not just because of based Rickman

>>10821637
every collective has plenty to be guilty about. should all pre-existing identities be torn down and reinvented so that individuals can exist under new, unblemished collectives? should the inhabitants of europe torment themselves with scruples about the 'over-representation' of people with white skin? or should the sickness be confined to dying colonies, quarantined in the new world.

>>10821626
It has nothing to do with guilt. But in anything manufactured by HOLLYWOOD, or even perhaps the UK white people have def been over represented if you look at the population represented in those lands. There is nothing wrong with wanting a movie produced in California to look more like a California street, or a movie meant to be seen by the world, to look more like the people who are going to be buying the ticket.

For the most part, if you're making a historical drama, it makes sense to have the actors look like the people they're representing from the past. But then I look at something like Hamilton, and see the value in having a cast that looks more like New York today, than the continental congress before the revolution.

>>10821649
hamilton is a play for brainlet elite whites and "poc" journalists, not poor blacks.

>>10821649
Historical drama can be cast however the director wants. There's plenty of stuff that you're talking about that still trys to adhere to race.

>>10821646
The first part of what you said wouldn't be so bad. You are pretending like humanity can't balance the two spinning plates of the old and new like we always have.

>>10821641
This is a really facinating pov for me to consider. And thanks, it's kind of obvious, but I never noticed it. We turn to the Brits to give us that certain Special something when looking for a villain. But the UK does make a lot of its own media, right? And English actors very often become Hollywood regulars because of their classical training.

>>10821649
it is not confined to re-presentation. even the space we inhabit is now 'over-represented' with white skins...
>>10821662
the point is that it would be an exercise in pathology. when one has obsessive thoughts, one must ignore their compulsions rather than try to alleviate their anxiety by performing them.

it not books, but each person is unique unto themselves.
while many people have shared expierences
and there are correlates with these expierences like race, age, gender etc....
it is by no means a causal connection.

here is some non book reading about that.

https://msu.edu/course/psy/442/stereotypes.ppt/sld003.htm

https://www.wiscontext.org/how-kids-learn-about-race-stereotypes-and-prejudice

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=2442521&page=1

https://opentextbc.ca/socialpsychology/chapter/social-categorization-and-stereotyping/

http://www.everydaysociologyblog.com/2012/05/understanding-generalizations-and-stereotypes.html

http://feellikeyoubelong.com/whats-up-blog/2015/8/24/stereotypes-vs-generalizations

http://www.columbia.edu/cu/news/research/08/10/memory.html

http://iameduard.com/overgeneralization/

https://sites.google.com/site/thebcbas/aba-toolbox/generalization

http://learningindia.in/generalizations-and-stereotypes/

https://fedrz.wordpress.com/2009/03/22/in-general-people-who-dont-generalize-are-idiots/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Other_(philosophy)

>>10821655
Are you talking about class, or are you talking about race? Obviously anything on Broadway isn't going to appeal to poor people as a rule.

>>10821662
>>10821672
phrase correction: not ignore (the impulse) to compulsion, but to acknowledge yet not give in (alleviating in the short term, ultimately strengthening the grip of anxiety)

>>10821672
Wow I thought only high-schoolers still thought Freud had all the answers. ACtually plenty sschools of thought advocate expressing your anxieties, like the West should do about all the peoples theyve harmed and continue to harm

>>10821675
class and race intersect, do they not? i would argue that "poor black" and "poor white" are (very generally) distinct communities and identities, distinct from each other, and quite markedly distinct from "rich blacks" and "rich whites".
>>10821680
thats not freudian. see >>10821679 its basic CBT. stop erasing my struggles with mental illness, how problematic. i hope you avoid making that kind of comment in the future since you have caused me suffering, i demand that you alter your self-perception to exclude that kind of action from now on, because you have potentially taken a toll on my mental wellbeing and may do so again to another individual in the future.

Why does this obvious bait thread has so many replies

Why is this thread still up and meanwhile the on-topic Culture of Critique thread got deleted last night?

>>10821684
Of the 1800 billionaires in the world, 12 are black. The 9 richest people in the world have a combined wealth that is more than the poorest 3 billion people in the world have

>>10821689
Because /pol/ is your containment board and safe space go there.

>>10821629
How so? It's a pretty banal statement. Certain elements of western philosophy are clearly powerful and useful tools that transcend gender, race, etc. Just as aspects of eastern philosophy do. Why can't a white man enrich his life by studying eastern philosophy? Why can't an Asian woman gain valuable insight from reading Plato? Because it wasn't made by someone with the right skin tone and private parts?
Your way of thinking is the thing that lies behind true racism.

>>10821696
there are like 5 posts about books itt

>>10820759
man this board sucks

>>10821704
/lit/ is an intersectional feminist board shitlord

>>10821129
perhaps it is becuase
certain "Gateways to success"
like a good college, and career actually require these things.

Seems like circular reasoning to me.
I mean god didn't come down and give us iq, sat and act.
It was a man.
that decided to start a business off of taking tests.
this man
also had a degree in psychology.

>>10821684
Class and race do intersect. But poor whites benefit from the infrastructure and culture established by rich whites in a very common and general way. Poor blacks basically have hip hop and professional sports. There is always Obama and Oprah, but that is more of a stretch. The point is that the current climate in filmmaking in California is much more adept at tackling the race issue than the class issue.
The race issue is easier, (though not easy) because of the diverse nature of the US. Class is so much messier. But we may get there someday.

>>10821137
A peoples history , by Howrd Zinn
The autobiography of Frederick Douglas
Harriet Tubman

don't know about any gay shit.
getting turned on by poop, and things that have poop come out of them are unhealthy.

>>10821666
It all gets internalised
>You know that scene in Animal House where there’s a fellow playing folk music on the guitar, and John Belushi picks up the guitar and destroys it. And the cinema loves it. Belushi just smashes it and then waggles his eyebrows at the camera. Everyone thinks, “God, is he great!” Well, the British comedian would want to play the folk singer.

>tfw most "leftists" are unable to reach the obvious conclusion that focusing on id pol quenches any revolutionary momentum a society might have

Please, do go on.
It makes my capitalist self very pleased to know revolution won't be coming to america ever

>>10821736
I always thought Belishi's character was intentionally a complete asshole. But then again, Americans do love an asshole.

>>10821737
Rebellion>Revolution.

None of it means anything it is best to continue kicking against the pricks.

>>10821693
an enlightening statistic, but i'm not sure what you are trying to demonstrate by it. here are a few general musings of my own:

lots are jewish. lots of (most?) jews are also poor, middle or working class. i'd wager they might, on average, have a slightly stronger cultural affiliation between class distinctions than other ethnicities and racial affiliations due to the strength of the jewish collective identity, however fractious "jews" really are.

ethnicity is probably a more reliable indicator than racial or civilisational categorisation/affiliation. when talking about the west's misdeeds, how much responsibilty should we apply to european jews? jewish culture has been profoundly influential on the direction and values of "western civilisation", and jews have certainly played some part, whether crucial or accessory, in some of the excesses of european capital, war or colonialism. yet jews have also been brutally marginalised and rejected, at turns, by that very same "west" or "christendom" or by ethnic/national/religious groups contained, according to our definitions, within it. does belonging to the west, or having influence upon it, incur responsibility - not simply in the causal sense of the word, but in the moral and persisting one?

homosexuality as a collective category rather than an individual trait has been used to the detriment and edification of people who are gay. we can perhaps see here that the genesis of identity comes from the recognition of different and sometimes conflicting needs, values and shared experiences between people. but when we start treating it as a concrete, persisting thing to which we can ascribe moral status, might not the logical conclusion be to start asking european, arabic or japanese homosexuals to account for the traditions of pederasty? something previously exalted but now considered abusive, victimising in light of differences in our attitude toward the child and of informed consent. it might seem ridiculous but the connection is about as "real" as the connection between past members of any given group identity and present/future members of a group identity - excluding sexual reproduction, but we don't believe that children inherit their father's sins on the basis of genes alone, do we?

forgive me if my ramblings have missed some crucial aspects of your thought. they are not intended to be confrontational. more like exploratory

>>10820759

>>10821782
I would say that the cultural influence of Judaism has at all times in Europe's history remained marginal to the Christian and even pre-christian native beliefs of those places, only it is easier to parse and categorize the beliefs of another so the Jews by virtue of their self-imposed alienation are easily scapegoated since it is easier to see what their influence is than it is to sort out what the pervasive culture really "is" like being a fish in water and not knowing what "wetness" consists of; i think it is right to damn the jews for their culture but not to the exclusion of the native european culture which is just as blameworthy.

What you say about homosexual identity is absolutely correct insofar as it has historically been defined by institutions with a largely punitive outlook (even under the guise of "therapy") but as economic stability increases, the autonomous expression as homosexuals as to what their exclusive experiences "mean" can be looked at collectively as a self-determined "identity" which does not fall under your Foucauldian criticism as neatly.

Today we are seeing self-expression with all its attendant messiness. We can no longer rely on the comforts of postmodernist critical theory to navigate through the morass of otherness and intersection. Many people are extremely angst-ridden in the absence of a supertheory and this, in my opinion, is arousing a cultural death drive on all sides: towards tyranny, both classic and technocratic, towards universal animosity towards even self annihilation qua collectivization.

All i know to do is lift, run and meditate. Fear really is the mind killer.

>>10821803
the example of homosexuals is interesting. i am one, and it is obviously important part of my experience and sense of self (this is water), and also, perhaps irrationally, i sometimes feel not only consolation and communion but some sort of pride in my partaking in the collective existence of homosexuals. at the same time, i use this example to try and acquit other groups (like europeans, westerners etc.) of their collective crimes. ultimately i don't think there is any significant alleviation to individual or collective suffering in negative justice inflicted deliberately on a group.

you are right. barbarism will only become more attractive with its promise to eliminate these anxieties. the allure of brutal simplicity, of the flight from neurotic complexity. the promise of fascism is dangerously intoxicating.

>>10821810
Individuality is lonely. Mankind will fuck itself into the ocean. I really have through experimentation been forced to conclude that I am hetero, but I find homosexual experience fascinating..have you read any Genet?

>>10821815
not yet, but I've got some of his stuff on my shelf, waiting to be read. the homo stuff i've read so far has mostly been mann, gide, wilde, mishima. more transgressive stuff i'm interesting in reading sometime includes genet, as well as delany and purdy. i also find homoeroticism in otherwise 'straight' or non-gay people's writing or experience fascinating. raw human experience - sexuality - eludes easy classification.

what was it like to live in the world before the Word? breath floating over the void.

>>10820857
>imperialism and genocide

During that era we put our own children in mines. You're not special snowflakes because you're brown or gay. You just aren't.

>>10821835
>what was it like to live in the world before the Word? breath floating over the void.
Beautiful
>>10821845
Now we just put african children in mines

>>10820896
It's our fault for not pushing hard enough

>>10820759
Julius Evola “Ride the Tiger”
Oswold Spengler “Decline of the West”
Cornelius Codreanu “For my Legionairres”
George’s Sorel “The illusions of progress”
T E Hulme “selected writings”
EM Cioran “a short history of decay”
TS Eliot “complete poems”
Ezra Pound “Canto 72”
Wyndham Lewis “the art of being ruled / against the demon of progress in the arts / tarr”
Nick Land “fanged nomenua”
Tom Sunic “against democracy and equality”
Guillaume Faye “Europe colonised”

That should give you a broad understanding of intersectionality, Privilege, minority rights, and contempary race and power politics. You will be woke AF

>>10820829
Do you believe that people are equal?

Why do any of you reply to this utter shite?

>>10820992
I know that feel. I'm not well, and I just don't have the capacity to empathize with people right now, maybe in the future things will be different. Privilege, as I understand it, does not take into account the universal capacity for human suffering, the possibility of a hedonic treadmill*, or genetic factors that may predisposition one towards depression. I may as well just be glad my life is at least relatively comfortable compared to that of the rest of the world, instead of feeling guilt over something I can't even change.

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonic_treadmill

Late to this thread, but I find all of Sven Lindqvist's works very readable, and he succeeds in making me furious every time.
I'd call his style historical journalism. He gives the who, what, why, and when of colonial atrocities, cherry-picking the more interesting and informative events in the history of genocide and oppression.

>>10820815
Whites SHOULD see race so that they are able TO CARE and WORK for the interests of their OWN GROUP

>>10821920
Then go ahead, as it is right now you're just whining on a japanese imageboard. Do something.

>>10821920
>yeah goyim work for the group
Why should i care? The group does nothing for me.

>>10821077
If they were less fit, how could humanity survive the transition. And change is horizontal not vertical.

The handicapped of hunter gathers in agricultural society that you described is actually a theoretical hypothesis for the existence of dyslexia.

>>10821918
>Swede propounds white guilt
Poetry

>>10821847

Except we're not sovereign over them today.

Do Americans actually consider themselves marginalized? They are the richest most powerful people in the world, how can they possibly be oppressed?

>>10821994
Relative to other Americans, anon. Not the world at large.

>>10820822
Having average IQ 1 s.d. above the coloureds.

>>10821994
Dude you have to remember that when they talk about 'white' or 'black' people, that this doesn't translate outside of America. Plenty of people who are 'white' in USA would not be considered 'white' outside, same for a lot of American 'blacks'. Ideally they need a different word so when they say 'white' its clear that they mean 'white people in America'

>>10821055
Look how quickly the mask falls to reveal a screeching SJW faggot! Go back to your safe space, and stop pretending to read Kant. In fact, get out of philosophy, woman.

>>10821560
>I am trying to think of a place where a young white child could grow up unexposed to any role models they can identify with.

liberals are ultimately mediacucks who worship mass culture and insist everyone find existential meaning and 'role models' in it.

>>10820952
I'm really not sure if this guy serious. If he is, it's a little bit scary how america is getting consumed by some weird disfigured ideology. I'm from russia so we had some experience with that in the past. It didn't end well. So i hope you ameribros will be alright.

>>10822557
kek yeah what the fuck is with this
i swear its some industry psyops shit

>>10820759
This and debouis
>>10820816
>How about you read some philsophy
Fuck off psued

>>10820759
i wrote a kindle ebook and it's not about being oppressed for being gay, it's about knowing about magic and people being afraid of that, and also they're gay. it's different, but i was pointing my art at that https://www.amazon.com/How-We-Bent-Light-Lamere-ebook/dp/B079Z3VT2W/ and it's on the best seller list right now

>>10821700
you made the jump from "Western science has been the best for a few hundred years," to "Therefore all our philosophy is best."

There's nothing connecting the two, and your eurocentrism is indicative of a lack of study. So when Chinese science was far superior, we all should have been Confucianists, Taoists or Legalists? You've just made a correlation that would sound smart to a bunch of drunk white-supremacist freshman.

Suprised no one has brought up the New Jim Crow. Which answers literally every question and half-fact /pol can level about why blacks make up a large portion of people in jail. It should be obvious that we live in a police-state that targets certain people (from the poor to mexicans) but NJC lays out details and evidence about how cops stalk black neighborhoods, and how black neighborhoods are created and forced into poverty in the first place. /pol/ need you to not make the simple jump to, "oh, the cops are racsit to, which perpetuates a cycle set up when slaves were brought out." /pol/ people need you to have this simplistic worldview of "Oh well the people of color in my life seem to act this certain way so there must be some ??????? thing that makes this inherent." But in fact it's not even hard to point to the structural problems that hold blacks, hispanics and poor people down in this country. Saddest thing is is /pol/ only plays itself by not uniting as a working class with the people they've been made to hate, and that's exactly what the upper-class needs to stay rich and keep sucking up /pol/s tax dollars.

>>10822590
The modern left has been reduced to an auxiliary branch of the marketing and HR departments. An enforcer of standardised psychopolitical
consumer regimes, telling you who you are and what you must do. All princesses, superheroes, presidents and tv role models are fundamentally alike, and their fundamental goodness is unquestioned. progressive politics limits itself to superficial tinkering of the visual incarnation of those archetypes, seeking to maximise efficiency and psychopolitical absorption of potentially disruptive elements.

>>10822707
Or maybe the masses actually don't want boring conservative and exclusionary themes.

>>10822707
Also, for someone who supposedly knows a lot about leftists, you've missed the fact that the tropes you've pulled out are anazlyzed and critiqued all the time in leftist journals. To miss that you'd have to have not even looked at the material... OH WAIT

>this thread
So this is what a literary-political discussion amongst the half-educated looks like.

sage goes in all fields

>>10821007
>>10821049
“SJW” positions are correct if you accept certain axioms regarding universal morality and the value of life for it’s own sake. Of course, you don’t have to buy into those things at all.

>>10822714
>>10822717
yikes

>>10822723
Also you have to buy into their position on self knowledge and general epistemology

>>10821632
Non-whites are so obviously the lumpenproletariat that it's just hilarious at this point how self described commies don't see it.

>>10820759
does anyone else feel a lot more contempt for homosexuals and non whites than before? It's like they want to be pitied and have us 'white dudes' enter into some sort of dysfunctional codependent relationship with them. It also feels oddly christian, the way corporations and ad agencies use their supposed suffering to guilt trip us, much like the church frightened medieval peasants with crucifixes and gruesome representations of martyrdom. and many of them are probably better off than you on absolute economic terms.

>>10822778
before... what?

>>10822670
>so when chinese science was far superior
so, never then?

>>10822770
>>10821632
>implying american racial politics map onto ethnic groups outside america

>>10821947
Not him but where do you get your alphabet, your numbers, your language, your ideas, your values? These things did not appear in a vacuum and at best are a response to what the group gave you. You will always be dependent on groups either directly or indirectly.

>>10822670
>So when Chinese science was far superior
Leftist scholars everyone. That was when the Greeks were around, and I don't think the Chinese did much better than the Greeks, science-wise. Hell, these homos figured out the circumference of the earth and the distance between the earth and the sun.

>>10820759
at the end of the day I don't have any hatred for other races, nor do I deny my privilege within white systems, which exists for good reason, in that they are systems created by white people.

I really am just tired of other races though. They are so fucking boring, ugly, and just cognitively taxing for no good reason. I wish I grew up in an all white area so my head could be filled with the fruits of my people, not useless garbage about MLK, Ghandi, Rupi Kaur, etc. I'm sure these are fine people, but they are alien to me and they're struggles are therefore inapplicable.

>>10822779
>before... what?

the current cultural and political moment. homos/trannies have always been a presence on imageboards, didn't mind them back then, but I can't bring myself to respect someone who seems to enjoy being weak and pitiful.

>>10822827
but anon you're being weak and pitiful right now

>>10820759
>folks

>>10822832
well, at least nI do not harbour a sense of snivelling self righteous superiority grounded entirely on the fact I get fucked in the ass

I seriously don't get what "recognizing my white privelege" is ever going to actually solve for minorities. I'm some regular shlub like wtf can I actually do for you. Does just hearing a white say those words give them a mental orgasm or something?

>>10822855
It's just power tripping by a specific group of upper middle class black and jewish women who control the SJW movement. They have no real power.

>>10821994
>They are the richest most powerful people in the world
90% of Americans are retarded though. And I don't mean this in some gay self hating sucking up to Europe way, you guys are mostly retarded too, we carry your fucked up genes. Throw a ton of non whites in the mix and you get the dystopian stratified hellscape our nation has become. We are also a culture of supreme narcissism, a sense of collective well being doesn't factor into the individual's mind in American techno-media society. The logic of American late stage capitalism has now subsumed the social justice movement under the culture of social media narcissism, hence why everybody wants to be a victim now. Are all my statements wildly generalizing and unqualified? Yes. But spend some time here (or better yet read our "media") if you doubt them.

t. American

>>10822855
it's a public shaming ritual, it accomplishes absolutely nothing of value

>>10822791
he was given those things so that he could be useful to the group, nothing more. consider it human bondage

>>10822877
white dudes are not used to the shame everyone else experiences. Racism is real and some people are definitely entitled and need to be taken down from their perch. Just look at some of the white dude posters in this thread for godsakes

>>10820759
Bait.

>>10822942
>Just look at some of the white dude posters in this thread for godsakes
>people disagreeing with me only further justifies my position.
You guys are so authoritarian.

>>10822942
>t. nonwhite
kek at your opinion

>>10821708
Nice bait

>>10822942
Kek

>>10820759
Don't succumb to this self-flagellation and mental shaming. It's not worth it. Be proud of who you are. Don't let anyone tell you that you are lesser because you are a straight white male.

>>10820759
The 120 Days of Sodom.

>>10822942
>need to be taken down from their perch
you need to have your teeth kicked in

>>10823007
Identity politics is extremely toxic, my advice is to everybody ITT is to steer the fuck clear of it except when it's immediately beneficial to you (i.e. playing the social justice card to help your career). It's extremely easy in the epoch of post-modern fragmentation and social media alienation to fall into an identity echo chamber, whether it's social justice or some form of white nationalism. Fuck all of that shit. I've been down both rabbit holes, first as a indoctrinated intersectional uni leftie and then as a bitter post-grad who fell into (for complete lack of a better term) the "alt-right" for a bit, or at least an extremely racist "white" identity reconstruction project. As someone who already suffers from an ill defined sense of self it took a long time for me to realize I'm making myself fodder for internet meme movements.

>>10821007
they are wrong about most things

>>10821852
Wow mate, good list of progressive books but you haven't read the most tolerant ones yet-'The Reign of Quantity and the Sign of the Times' by Rene Guenon
'The Camp of the Saints' by Jean Raspail
'Race, Evolution and Behavior' by J. Phillipe Rushton.

>>10820952
>How about black men being overrepresented in prison.
Because they commit more crimes, statistically speaking. You can say they commit more crimes due to social injustices and imbalances and a cycle of poverty and violence since they were enslaved, but, regardless, black men in America are over-represented in violent crimes.
> How about women making 60 cents on the dollar compared to men.
God, what an embarrassing myth. This is because: women take lower paying jobs; women on average work less hours; and, maternity leave; all of these skew this bullshit statistic. Adjusted accordingly, women actually make about 98 cents to the dollar per men, which is statistically a negligible difference and probably even in the range of error.

>How about literally all women living in fear of being sexually harassed by MEN.
Get over yourself. The belief that you're so hurt by a man cat-calling you or making sexually inappropriate suggestions, jokes, remarks, comments etc. is actually not feminist at all but the antithesis of feminist, because it assumes women are so weak, sheltered, infantilized and coddled that some sexual remarks will leave them traumatized and quivering in their shoes. Moreover, this is balanced by a general extreme frowning on of violence by men against women (you can't hit a woman, bro!), whereas male-male violence is much more acceptable (even if we pretend to be a peaceful society), with such bullying and the threat/possibility of violence, and the idea that you're a weakling and worthless if you can't handle it, being a part of typical masculinity. It's just something men and boys grow up with and become used to.

>How about women not being able to walk down the street at night without fear of a man jumping out and raping her?
Learn how to fight, take a martial arts class, carry a gun or knife or pepper spray. It's no one's fault that women are physically, biologically weaker than men and that certain men are conscienceless beasts who can't control themselves. Also, men can just as well be afraid to walk down streets at night for fear of getting mugged or attacked, this is more a symptom of just shitty ghetto neighborhoods at night and shitty ghetto people.

>Have you had enough or should I keep going?? How about women not being CEOs? How about women being underrepresented in STEM fields.
Have you ever considered it's because women don't want to be in These fields and there are biological, neurological differences between men and women leading to different personality traits and styles of cognition? In the Netherlands, where they've gone the furthest in promoting gender equality and making it much easier for people of either sex taking whatever job they want, it turns out men and women naturally aligned themselves into more stereotypically masculine and feminine professions respectively.

>How about blacks being murdered in Chicago because of white politicians' gun laws?
Murdered by other black people

>>10821052
There's some important truths right here but no one will listen because it goes against their preconceptions

>>10820759
wow how pathetic

this is white guilt realized

go read mein kampf or something u fucking cuckold

>>10821195
This board is literally becoming Reddit. I actually miss /pol/tards, they kept out the SJWs and Redditors.

Just look at Jamaica and how it treats its gays

>>10823035
>first as a indoctrinated intersectional uni leftie and then as a bitter post-grad who fell into (for complete lack of a better term) the "alt-right" for a bit, or at least an extremely racist "white" identity reconstruction project.

wow, congratulations on being a fucking retard

>>10821284
What does it mean to be African? God, I hate communists

>>10823507
It has gotten so bad that I, dare I say, found myself reading more and shitposting here less.

>>10821060
fuck off nigger and listen

>>10823507
>/pol/ is not reddit
wew

>>10823685
i love seeing bourgeois liberals getting btfo and since the left isn't up to the job anymore i go to the_donald, it's a guilty pleasure like jacking off to trannies, it;s a little embarrasing but i thoroughly enjoy it, and it also helps check the detached from reality hysteria on the nytimes, what a world we're living in where donald trumps subreddit tells the news more accurately and reliably than the nytimes

>>10823719
I get that the change of pace is refreshing but r/T_D is not in any sense an accurate source for news. Most of the stuff that hits the top is completely fallacious attempt to preemptively discredit anyone who might trip up Trump.

>>10823685
r/the_donald was started by /pol/tards, so it's not really that simple

>>10823730
>muh fake news narrative

if u think the nytimes is reporting anything trump related accurately ur fuckin buggin

>>10820815
I will always be a color-blind liberal:
>make systems as open and fair as possible
>remove all laws and policies that unfairly discriminate
that's all you can do, without fussing to "correct" imbalances that you assume would be exactly proportional to the population in some ideal world that exists solely in your own head.

>>10823524
live and learn I guess

>>10821096
>suggesting it's context what matters the most when it comes to IQ!
I.Q. is over 80% heritable. that's not small - it's MOST of the effect.

>>10821009
Fuck off then you communist apologist scum. Petersons places the individual as paramount indeoendent of your group identity. It sure is good to have a clear sense of ehat systemic opression looks like but that pursuit doesn't excuse ideological degeneracy.
Clean up your room bucko.

>>10823903
I wanna dissolve the system in a deluzian acid explosion 2018 new age consciousness shift. It's been 50 years since the summer of love and mai 68 so we might as well give it a go.

>>10822567
The whole of western society is partially consumed by this postmodern neo-marxist ideologie. It's indeed a dangerous game to play. Probably the worst part is that this has been in the universities and education system since the Ussr collapsed and now it has finally sunk so broadly into the trained helplessness consumerism slave culture that we have become that our mere existance might be at stake but we'll see. I remain optimistic and i'm sure as hell trying to varry my load.

Read up on Jordan B. Petersons work it's enlightening. He's a great individual and intellectual

>>10820996
Upvoted

>>10823938
that system is the only reason why you can leave your house without fearing for your life, why you're cool in the summer and warm in the winter, why you're not starving to death.
it would be wiser if you didn't try to blow up the boat that's carrying you.

>>10823993
wow, what idyllic system are you talking about?

>>10823993
Didn't Ted K say man's struggle for survival was the true spice of life? Absolute revolution is what I want, we can perish alone or rise collectively to the superior dimensional wavelength. I'm not saying it will be easy, people will die and data processing centers will go boom. But there is no other way

>>10824012
Canada - feels nice to live in one of the few functional, high trust, economically sound nations.
I assume the person I responded to lives in the west - only someone who has forgotten or never known what it's like to live through a real revolution could ever wish to go through one personally.
>>10824015
all pose - these wishes could only have sprouted out of a protracted, luxurious boredom that comes from living in a society free of significant levels of conflict and privation.
which calls into question the sensibility of your project, bien sûr.

>>10820759
The New Testament, OP.

The only correct answer.

Wages of Whiteness by David Roediger if you're actually serious

>>10823475
Thanks for acknowledging, dude. Most of the times people dont want to listen to what I have to say about race, identity etc even though i am a part of the group they want to "defend" or represent. Not being white or being homossexual only crosses my mind few times a week at most, and its not even an inconvenience that big, or a problem at all. Im just neutral about it, because I have some things to take care of in my life that are more intense and soul crushing, like my financial situation, the fact that I have to study 15 hours a day to get into med school next year, and all of the other life afflictions that we all go through. As I said, none of the people who take part in the progressive left that I know are working class. All of them are college students and dont give a fuck about anything, they are completely out of touch with reality. My mother is a sewer and has to work everyday despite having a bone disease to be able to pay our rent. She never got into highschool, never got into college. And she is white and heterossexual. Neither the right nor the left represent the working class today, its two faces of the same coin: neoliberalism for gay people and neoliberalism for christians. Literally each and every one of my problems would be instantly solved by money and employment. But thats not a part of anyones political agenda. Its just trannies vs christians, black vs white etc and all of this discussion takes place in academia wich is dominated by middle class people whose parents are doctors and engineers and live inside a gated community.

>>10820941
Sanders likely would have beat trump with white working class support in MI, WI, and PA, Hispanic support which Clinton focused on was 50% in the non-swing states of Texas and California

>>10820941
>She was pretty much the only person he could have beat
She was literally the worst candidate they could possibly run. She even won the popular vote in the 2008 primary, and still lost to Obama. Hell, if Hitler where to magically come back from the dead, and somehow became eligible to run for POTUS, she would still find a way to lose.

>>10824374
If Hitler were to magically come back and run for President the world would rejoice in universal harmony and the happy days of eternal spring would arrive

can we all agree at least that Western Civilization is the best and superior civilization that ever existed?

Jews>Whites>Everyone else

>>10820829
>FOR straight white dudes
hegel wrote for traps exclusively

>>10820829
>straight
lol

>>10820796
seconding this
>>10820853
and honestly this

The absolute state of /lit/, unironically taking seriously concepts such as intersectionality. Wew.