/lit/ - Literature

>>10769663
"No!"

>>10769663
Honestly, fuck Euron. He's so goddamn ridiculous I liked the show version of him better.

sanderfag a hack

My girlfriend and I are starting a two-person book club with this book. We don't know much about it going in.

Help, I've been reading a lot of Gibson and Richard Morgan, and need more vague just out of reach world building that their pose delivers really well.

Who else come close in the cyberpunk genre? Or sci-fi in general, I suppose.

>>10769776

You've got Neal Stephenson, but his writing is a lot less stylistic, I'd say? I prefer it but I'm also a dummy who likes Snow Crash a lot and everyone here seems to hate it.

Well the thing is, i'm in a Book club and next month we have "Epic Fantasy" as the month kind of book we have to read, and i really want to read something great with my hommies.
But it has to be a book around 300-350 pages, not too long like Sanderson paper bricks (we had already read mistborn 1). Something with a good world building, nice characters.
We already read king's kiler chronicles, a wizard of earthsea, very good books.
I'm kinda lost and i think the best option it's to read an stand alones book.

>>10769860
I don't know, The Hobbit? Sabriel? The page restriction is kind of harsh for that genre.

>>10769663
Any Crimson Shadow fans here? Think I'm gonna re-read them during March.

>>10769860
Lord Valentine's Castle

Why is Gardens of the Moon so disliked? I'm reading it now and finding it pretty interesting.

>>10769860
Lies of Locke Lamora if you feel like you want to read about bro love

>>10770021
>juggling 101

>>10769860
Shades of Grey by Jasper Fforde
The library at mount char

>>10770061
casuals that are "into fantasy" because they read harry potter as a child and played dnd once back in college

>>10770061
it became too popular, and a lot of people on the creative boards define their personality by thinking they are superior to others because of their taste/interests.

It's pretty good, but it's the worst one of the series, so you'll only go up from there.

Webnovels are novels too

Just finished this I'm not sure I liked it and I don't know if I'm in for the long haul. I respect the author's worldbuilding and usually enjoy not getting handholding exposition but even so, his ending converged so messily and his power dynamics were so arcane and obscure it didnt feel mysterious to me after a whole, only tiresome. fucking Lorn got rekt by some rando Tiste Andii (that will turn out to have an epic backstory in book 754, I suppose) that was bs. Also I got Rake shoved down my throat as the coolest baddest fucker ever but I don't want to swallow

Maybe I should give book 2 a chance, I don't know guys

>>10770275
Heh, I stopped midway through it after the MC's forced waifu got incinerated or something in some magic fuckery. Haven't picked it up since.

>>10769757
that cover art is dank though

Finished pic related this evening. I enjoyed it and rate it 4.5 out of 5 stars. Do I dive right in to the next two books or take a break for variety's sake?

>>10770363
depends on what else you have to read

>>10770363
I thought the sequels were better (same goes for his stand-alone books)

>>10769860
Three Hearts and Three Lions

>>10770363

keep going

>tfw scene on the cover is actually in book
Cover alone is almost enough to sell it. Being a Zelazny seals the deal.
Actually 3 shorts. Sci-Fi detective stories with the same MC, the first two of which do not feature robots. Cover is great for building tension toward the final climax of part 3. Zelanzy delivers with his usual flair (more apparent in parts 2-3) and I couldn't help but consider parallels with Asimov's whodonits, though less cerebral.
An enjoyable quick read whose main conceit (a man who evades tracking by the Central Data Authority) is as germane now as it was in '69. I award this 4/5 bardic dolphins.

>>10770363

I never understand how people like this series, I rank it down there with shit like Sword of Truth. I guess Abercrombie is at least a compelling writer, but god; the story and most of the characters are so laughably bad.

>I had been working on a project with another science fiction writer in New Mexico, George R. R. Martin. George gave me some papers on the project to look over. Shannon [Roger’s daughter, age six at the time] came over while I was working and asked me what I was looking at. I said, “These are some ideas George has given me.”

>Sometime later, a local newspaper reporter asked Shannon if she knew where I got my ideas. She answered, “George R. R. Martin gives them to him.”

>>10770275

The first book is definitely the weakest in the series, but it's not bad - I usually start on the third book when I re-read it, though. I honestly don't even remember who kills Lorn, that's a pretty minor event in the scheme of the books - it's purely there to frame the character that replaces her.

And yes, the imagery is pretty cliche - very 80s dungeons and dragons handbook cover. That stops at the waters edge, though - the character's are very much defined by their personalities and dialogue, which are some of the best in any book I've read regardless of genre.

If you can put aside the imagery and forgive him for occaisionally going into full on anthropology professor mode - which you can easily skip over without losing anything - it's going to be your favorite series of all time, especially if you read for characters. If you're more of a Sanderson power level action movie kind of guy that needs big setpieces to stay interested, it's probably not going to do it for you.

>>10769860
>wants epic fantasy
>under 350 pages
choose one

>>10770275

I should also note that the powers aren't meant to be mysterious - if I'm remembering correctly, that's mostly the sticksnare character fucking with people in the early books. You come to fully understand how all magic works as the series progresses, and it's pretty straightforward.

>>10771200

Oh, and Lorn wasn't killed by a Tiste Andii at all, you got that very mixed up. She's killed by an avowed of the Crimson Guard who are some of the most powerful assholes in the entire series. At one point a squad of guardsman with one avowed quite literally kill a god.

>>10769663
Any litrpg where a guy becomes a sexy girl and hates it? Asking for a friend.

>>10769716
>le finger in bum
>less ridiculous
Brainlet

>>10770174
I started fantasy by reading Lord of the Rings when I was 11 and I found Gardens of the Moon very hard to get into.

>>10771161

We're reading Childhood's End by Arthur C. Clarke! This is actually the first book we're reading that is not in the public domain, so you'll have to either buy, borrow, steal or pirate this book. I'm not generally an e-book reader so I have no experience pirating books but I'm sure our friendly neighbourhood search engine know more than I do.

>>10771323
nice. the other stories are banned from the next vote right?

>>10771341
Flow My Tears is automatically nominated since it came second, the other two are banned for one round.

>>10769757
Like anon said, that cover art is dank. And when I looked up the author on Goodreads it said that others have also enjoyed Gene Wolfe which is always a good sign. Have anyone read anything by this John Crowley? I'm genuinely interested.

>>10770275
read book two and then get right into book three famalam you'll be glad you did

if Gardens of the Moon is so bad why don't people just skip it? The story seems to jump around a lot anyway.

>>10769757
>book's name is "Ka", also the noise a crow makes
>cover is a crow
>author's name is "crowley"
seems a bit egotistical

>>10771387
i interpreted it as one big prologue to the series, like, the whole novel takes place "before the starting credits roll", if you will
it's really erratic and choppy as you say, and it honestly doesn't matter if you miss a lot, just as long as you get the general idea of what's happening before everything starts happening, know what i'm sayin?

>>10771396
but yea as an afterthought, this series is NOT for people with short attention spans, so really, i would say to anyone who "wants to skip" or "rushes through" any part of it whatsoever, then the damn thing probably isn't for you
i mean like every book is 1000+ pages what the hell is somebody doing getting into a 10000+ page series if they don't want to read a lot lmao
millenials man, millenials

>>10771405
It's more the investment that's the problem. I like long book series, but to have to read three doorstoppers just to find out whether or not I'll even like the series? Too much up front cost. There are so many other series out there.

>>10771157

Did you read the whole trilogy? Starts off shaky as fuck but absolutely worth staying til the end, and the standalone books that come afterwards improve by leaps and bounds.

>>10771383
John Crowley is outer lit

who would win in a war, a futuristic sci fi civilization of people wearing togas, or a futuristic sci fi civilization of people wearing really big collars?

>want to read this book
>£183 on amazon
>out of print on publisher's website

Why? How to read?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lifecycle-Software-Objects-Ted-Chiang/dp/1596063173
https://subterraneanpress.com/the-lifecycle-of-software-objects

>>10771477
But he writes fantasy and sci-fi?`

Nice digits.

>>10771603
obviously collars
>protect your neck like wu tang said
>can be used as a weapon
>togas are extremely large, heavy and unwieldy and present a massive tactical disadvantage

>>10771664
A man willing to wear a toga is clearly a tremendous badass. It says to the world "I don't even need to use both arms to slap your shit in".

>>10771664
but the collar people are usually in a stage of "we are the heads of a galactic union" while togas usually implies they already reached some kinda utopia, elevated above any threat

I have read all Dresden books and really enjoyed it to my great shame.
Should I continue to go down the urban-fantasy rabbit-hole or do a genre shift?

>>10771619
Its published in 2011. Are there no ebooks? Have you searched on libgen or IRC?

>>10771603
>>10771664
>>10771669
>>10771682
>this tripe inspires more conversation than the whole of human history's contributions to sci-fi and fantasy
the absolute state of genre fiction

>>10771696
I don't like ebooks I want a physical copy

>>10771698
what did you mean by this?

>>10770275
>Just finished this I'm not sure I liked it and I don't know if I'm in for the long haul.
I've read 4 books and gave up, every single one of them left me with that same feeling. Kind of cool concepts and characters that somehow feel hamfisted and books never deliver satisfactory endings so they make you crave for more... simply not worth my time, too many pages of mediocre literature.

>>10771698
U mad your thread didn't get more than 3 replies?

>>10771323
No need to search, the info is in the sticky. Here's a bunch of editions/formats: http://b-ok.org/s/?q=Childhood%27s+End

Recently finished Snow Crash. Loved the more esoteric backstory and lore stuff, didn't like a lot of the actual narrative. It felt as if the author was hastily making a shell for his ideas, and that made some moments (especially the ending) fall flat. Overall really good setting and the fact that it was written in 1992 is pretty crazy in some respects. I'm starting to read The Fifth Head of Cerberus, and I like the prose of the few pages that I've read so far.

>>10771698
Everyone would like an opportunity to flex their creative muscles while getting some (You)s. That post provided just that. Play to your audience.

What are some good fantasy novels with heavy bdsm?

>malazan has good dialogue

*Tips fedora*

>>10770061
I actually liked it more than Deadhouse Gates

>>10771705
>download the ebook
>sacrifice some dead trees
>go to a office depot
>bind dead trees
>?????
>profit

>>10771861
Oh, thanks for reminding me.

First for Stephenson is a pearly penile papule with a word processor.

>>10771717
>>10771386
>>10771228>>10771209>>10771200
>>10770343
Thanks for your input anons

I might keep going after going through other titles in my reading list for this year

>>10771861
The first story of Fifth Head is quite Proustian in style

First for more recs like Daniel Black and Super Sales on Super heroes

>>10771861
>Loved the more esoteric backstory and lore stuff
>It felt as if the author was hastily making a shell for his ideas

This is basically every Stephenson book I've read, but I think he gets better at it.

Where did the Stephenson hate come from anyway? It's not like even he was talked about regularly before.
Is it just one guy falseflagging?

>>10772214
Yeah, it's literally just me. I haven't even read Snowcrash. I read like thirty pages of Anathem and decided I hate his face. I'll stop.

>>10771383
I read Little, Big and the only things I found I common with Gene Wolfe are the shift of PoVs (or shift in setting more like), the vague dreamlike settings and the neck breaking pace in Wizard/Knight.

>>10771861
Yeah, well, so he predicted stuff.
>Such a visionary!!!
Jules Verne did the same, but nobody should value either literature for the accuracy of its predictions.
I hated Snow Crash but the linguistic approach was quite interesting, and a few concepts were quite elegantly expressed. What wasn't interesting at all was all the fucking hand holding and exposition. Literally, American-taste scifi written for retards who can't figure shit out on their own.

>>10771717
cool I read 4 two. i didn't necessarily think they were bad, i just never felt an urge to continue.

Honest question: what's the best science fiction novel you've read in terms of prose alone? Something where you were blown away by the writing itself, regardless of how you felt about the plot/characters/etc.

>>10772280
Blindsight

>>10772280
Echopraxia

>>10772280
Probably something by Vance.

>>10771383
I thought Little, Big was nearly unreadable. In the wrong mood for it maybe.

>>10771323
Nice, wonder where I can get a cheap copy..

Just finished The Dragons of Babel.
Esme was best daughter.

What should I read now?

>>10772280
Book of the New Sun

>>10771696
Continue but be carefull, its a world full of shit books, i personally recomend sergei lukianenko night watch series for a russian grey take on good vs evil, also check laundry files series and craft sequence, they are at least interesting premises

>/lit/ tells me that Sanderson is garbage
>Warbreaker is fun as hell
Is Sanderson actually good or is it a one time case?

>>10772523
He's got good and bad stuff. He can pitch his books a little young, and seems to have a pretty constricted emotional range, but I always stick up for him because he reintroduced the idea of endings into fantasy books.

>>10772523
I've read Warbreaker, Elantris, Stormlight, Emperor's Soul and a couple of short stories and my opinion is that Warbreaker is leagues better than the others.

>>10772523
His WoW aesthetics and the autism of his world building is appalling. But hey, this is SFFG, where tastes are not like other tastes in /lit/.

>>10771323
yo monthly reading guy. you should record what has already been ready in a pastebin or something for reference purposes. maybe also what has been read which month.

>>10772929
I'm keeping track of what we've read, I assume you want me to include a link to the list in my posts? Putting a link at the bottom of the image seem reasonable, right?

>>10772280
Definitely not Blindsight or BotNS despite how they're easily my favourite Sci-fi books out there

Gateway was a pleasure to read, as was Too Like the Lightning

>>10773015
sure, thats fine. it was mostly so that we nothing comes up twice but if you keep track its fine.

>>10773222
Nice digits. My highly advanced tracking system I'm to lazy to delete the covers I use to make the images will make sure that no book that we've already read may enter.

>>10772267
I wasn't saying the visionary stuff had much merit in terms of the literature itself, and of course there are authors who were much more amazing in terms of their speculation. You are completely right about the exposition, though. There are two chapters that are just Hiro stating the setting's lore to some other characters and that was fucking aggravating.

>>10772523
>female warrior

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSWjrhpuLEI

Is this you, /sffg/?

>>10773271
>criticizes literature
>has videogames on his bookshelf

>>10773320
Well if you dont like videogames, you must be a snob. Dark Souls is by far more intellectually rewarding than Hamlet.

>>10773261
If you want a good take on the female warrior read Monstrous Regiment

>>10773355
Who is trolling who

>>10773271
>muh muh real literature
I can see from the thumbnail that that guy is an idiot.

>>10773397
Rothfuss gave it 5 stars, so I'm assuming it's absolute dogshit.

>>10772099
plz reply

>>10773271
most books in his collection are fanfics, shitty adaptations of mass effect an eve online

>>10773657
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/21846804-into-the-abyss

it is of same style, and even enjoyable

and is on the same list
https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/82507.Displaced_To_A_Different_Time_Or_World

>Nobody is reading Legend of Condor Heroes

Fucking Christ fellas

What's the deal?

>>10773853
>his backlog is not at least a year long
I will read it, in due time.

>>10771696
>I have read all Dresden books and really enjoyed it to my great shame.
The Dresden books are like high quality fast food. Not every meal has to be a home-cooked masterpiece.

>>10773721
man demons of astlan really tapers off after the first book. it became such a drag in the second and i forced my self to finish it then i didnt even bother with the rest.

I contend Bernard Cornwell's Warlord Chronicles created a new genre called 'hard fantasy' where the "fantasy" in the series is left up to the readers to decide if it's real or not.

>>10773397
>female warrior
>good take
No such thing

>>10774184
It becomes obviously real by the end of the last book, unless Derfel was high or something.

Any good sci-fi books that are set in megastructures/space-borne mega cities/megacities in general?

I'm looking for some kind of asteroid megastructure deal.

>>10774378
Search the archives. One of your ilk requested the same shit regularly.

>>10774345
>It becomes obviously real by the end of the last book
It doesn't though. It could still be entirely coincidental. You also need to consider that Derfel isn't a reliable narrator when it comes to magic since he believes it's real.

I'm in the even of finishing The Black Company and now, since I'm near the end and all the plot threads are visible, I decided to research a bit about it, and the general consensus was that the following books are nowhere near as good as the first.
Now, what does /sffg/ think about it? Should I bother reading the other books in the series or should I start something else? I started Malazan in parallel with Black Company but Malazan felt really cheesy (like some dungeon and dragons fanfic) and dropped it 20 pages in or so, while continuing Black Company.

>>10774556
>like some dungeon and dragons fanfic

>>10774559
Or some warcraft fanfic.
It feels that way, and the dialogue was bad in those few pages. I can only hope it gets better if I am to read 10k pages worth of fantasy.

>>10774559
Malazan started off as a RPG for Erikson and his friend(s).

>>10774597
i know, that's why I pointed it out.

>>10774604
o-oh...

>>10774378
>Any good sci-fi books that are set in megastructures/space-borne mega cities/megacities in general?

Iain M. Banks' Culture books. Lots of it is set in Orbitals (i.e. Ringworlds)

>>10774597
>>10774604
Yeah, I knew something didn't feel like a book. It felt too much like someone would read on /tg/ or some tabletop RPG campaign. I don't say it's bad, but it's high fantasy and doesn't even try to have any nuance. Just a bunch of dudes and different races running around doing stuff. It feels like it has no cohesion.

>>10774620
general consensus is that GotM is pretty bad, but if you can trudge through it then the rest are decent to good. if you really not feeling it but still want to try to get into Malazan, then feel free to skip to Deadhouse Gates. if you don't like that one, then I wouldn't bother with the rest.

Malazan/Gardens of the Moon went from tabletop campaign, to movie script, to finally settling down as a novel. it's a little rough for a lot of people.

>>10774556
The chronicles of the Black Company (first 3 I think) are all good, the ones afterwards aren't really worth it.
Cook fell in love with Lady too hard.

>>10774643
And same as you, most people talked about the first 3 books, and what came after. Are the first 3 books a complete story? I'd hate to read and invest into all 3 of them, only to have the trilogy end in a cliffhanger à la Bakker with his bullshit Second Apocalypse.

>>10774692
From what I can remember it is.

>>10774692
>posting worst girl

this is arriving tomorrow

very excited

>>10774692
>tfw no 400 year old virgin waifu to deflower
it hurts being a kissless beta eternal virgin

>>10774692
I don't really remember, but at some point I left the series and it didn't leave the bitter residue of gurm or robert jordan. I think you're safe in reading them until you've had had enough and can walk away with good feelings.

>>10772280
Aniara is poetry and not prose, but it's great. If we're talking strictly prose, maybe The Slynx or Stations of the Tide.

>>10774692
>Are the first 3 books a complete story?
I wouldn't say COMPLETE (as in every single loose thread is tied up), but yes the first 3 novels can be read as their own story arc. After that though I would say the series becomes more about great moments and less about great storytelling.

>>10774718
If you like it -- or even if you don't like it but are intrigued by it -- check out the Kefahuchi Tract books by M John Harrison for a similar sense of dislocation.

>>10774718
How is the translation supposed to be? How many translations are there, just one?

summarize the malazan series

>>10774765
Big, loud, confusing.

>>10774754
mine >>10774718 is the new translation, the translator is the hottie in pic related, Olena Bormashenko

meant to be slightly better than the older translation but both are good

>>10774747
thanks for the rec anon

>>10774713
>doing the exact same thing

>>10774765
No, no. I killed everyone to PROTECT them. Those other guys are teh ebil.

Guys do you think i will get a virgin waifu? Like in black company or my mangas?

>>10774810
just b(eliev)e (in) yourself

>>10774692
Friendly reminder that Eliza Dushku will play the Lady if they ever make the Black Company adaptation.

>>10774793
*dies*

>>10774810
not unless you find a good christian or muslim woman.

>>10774765
Yeah, remember that guy from last book, the world ending universe destroyer we barely stopped?
He was just kinda grumpy. THIS freak, he rapes guys like him for breakfast.

>>10774830
so it's dragon ball z?

One of the most annoying aspects of Malazan for me was still not having any answers for certain characters' motivation. Now I'm not the type of person that needs everything explained or spelled out for them, but characters would make major decisions or do something that affected the overall story and by the end of the series (10 books and thousands of pages) we still have no idea why they did those things which is ridiculous.

In a lot of ways Malazan is really like a Michael Bay movie: It throws a bunch of shit at you to try and hide the fact the story is either convoluted or just not very good.

>>10774810
Yes, but only if you catch the attention of an ancient evil tyrant witch and frequently wet yourself in front of her.

>>10769794
Neal Stephenson's writing feels dry, for lack of a better way to describe it. There's also a weirdly humorous manner to it that feels weird considering the subject matter and the things that happen in his books

Is this worth a read?

Fantasyfags, why do you prefer fantasy over sci-fi?

>>10774932
I like dynastic politics, fantasy, historical fiction or sci-fi.
Everything else is for gay nerds.

>>10774932
it's more interesting
sci-fi writers always seem to be either jerking off over how insignificant and silly the human race is or jerking off about their 'bleeding edge' ideas. I want a good story first and foremost, or at least an interesting one.

>>10774932
i like magic.
cant do magic in scifi easily without a lot of bullshit. the closest thing to it was in an old novel i read where people had the ability to manipulate the atoms around them. and setting that up took a lot of convenient anime level of exposition.
with magic its just fucking magic and works. there might be a magic system or magic indirectly but its just fucking magic no explaining needed.

>>10774932
I prefer sci-fi but honestly the crop of modern writers is really bad, there isn't anyone that is a must read. The better authors seems to be writing fantasy at present.

>>10774975
And who might these fantasy authors be?

>>10774975
>The better authors seems to be writing fantasy at present.
Name two.
I'll give you one for free.

>>10774939
Okay, I guess you like some sci-fi with a bit of fantasy sauce like Dune.

>>10774960
Is all that you've read of sci-fi Blindsight? jeez.

>>10774963
>i like magic
BRAINLET.

>>10774975
Maybe fantasy's just easier to dramatize?

>>10774984
>BRAINLET.
im a man of simple tastes anon. i enjoy adventure and romance in a fantasy setting thats pretty much it.

>>10774926
seems pretty generic, my man. just read the accursed kings or something if you want a bunch of selfish inbred nobles acting stupid, at least you get some history out of it.

>>10774932
i like swords and horses more than guns and spaceships

>>10775042
What about swords and spaceships?

>>10774981
>>10774980
we all know its george and brandon

>>10774984
>Maybe fantasy's just easier to dramatize?
This is what I think too. I prefer sci-fi, like the other guy, but honestly it's much harder to find a decent sci-fi than fantasy. There's also much more fantasy than sci-fi at the moment, so that may be part of the reason.

Is this the ultimate proof of Europeans being cucks by nature?

>>10772280
Neuromancer

>>10775001
Already have senpai need more

>>10773853
Nothing I know about Chinese literature leads me to believe that it will be good.

>>10774932
It's written for STEMfags and computers are pretty boring (and I've worked in IT for over 14 years).
Prose is usually pot-boiler shit tier.
I don't like the science aspect. I don't like when the workings of technology are explained in minute detail.
Fights between factions depend too much on which side has a technological edge. All these big scale wars are boring. There's usually a lot of secrecy or inside knowledge revolving technology which sickens me, and you can predict how these secrets will be played out to resolve a plot development.
I don't know why, but the ethical dilemmas in SF are usually very unoriginal. I mean, I've watched Star Trek. There are literally very few new concepts to find, at least in what I've read.
Space also makes a shit setting for describing action.

All the above said, I do like "scifi" like Gene Wolfe or Jack Vance. I've watched lots of SciFi in film and tv and anime. It's just thar I'd rather re-read Planetes for a 3rd time rather than reading Asimov, Clarke, Dune or Bradbury.

>>10774932
Pulp sci-fi is kino tier. Right up there with the best fantasy has to offer. Whereas I couldn't give less of a shit about "hard" sci-fi or pretentious sci-fi.

>>10775579
What do you like about fantasy?

>>10774932
Beyond being pretty much the same thing fundamentally sci-fi is usually more limited and unimaginative compared to fantasy. I can get lost reading a fantasy story and its bizarre, twisted, yet beautiful world but sci-fi is usually just some boring spiel about technology, single biome worlds all over the galaxy, space messiahs, insane AIs bent on organic extinction, ravenous hive minds trying to take over or consume everything, and goddamn retarded psuedo-philosophical rants on existence/meaning/peace/unity.

Just ordered these Conan books. What am I in for?

>>10776133
I read only the original Conan stories and that one novel where he's a teenager and during a massive Cimmerian spergout he just goes deeper and deeper in Aquilonia and ends up being the rogue we have all come to love. It's all up to the writers I suppose, a lot of aspiring authors have cut their teeth in Conan stories or novels. Conan used to be the "gimme 500 words on Black Sabbath" of scifi/fantasy

>>10772280
Blindsight, unironically

>>10774340
Brienne of Tarth. Book version, not show version.

>>10774932
I'm more of a scifi fag and I don't enjoy fantasy because a good chunk of it is just le ebin 50,000 page 40 time bullshit and there's a lot of fucking shit with elves and dwarves that reads like a WoW quest. It's not so much that I like scifi more it's just that a lot of fantasy is shit. I can't remember the last good fantasy book I read.

>>10773355
>Dark Souls is by far more intellectually rewarding than Hamlet.
That's setting a pretty low bar.

>>10776155
These are all the original, unedited stories by Howard, plus miscellanea. I only know Conan from the Arnold movies and some video games.

>>10774340
Dune has a bunch you pleb.

>>10773505
Don't get triggered so easily. Nothing says bad authors can't enjoy good books, friendo.

>>10774340
Take it easy with the prejudices there, grumpy-pants.

>>10774932
It's basically speculative historical fiction and I love history. Especially classical era.

>>10776184
You're in for a ride my friend. Beyond the Black River is my favorite fantasy thing ever.

Who is best girl in fantasy? Who is worst girl? I think we can all agree the latter is Egwene from Wheel of Time, but I think the former has some stiff competition.

>>10776193
>Who is best girl in fantasy
Yennefer from the Witcher books. Or Serwa from Aspect Emperor.

>Who is worst girl
Any Wheel of Time girl.

Slayers is kino

>>10774692
>>10774713
>>10774793
I've never read Black Company but this art is making me want to. What am I in for if I do it?

>>10776198
>Yennefer
Big bait even if ironic.

>>10776220
She's got that weird combination of being driven and independent yet tremendously loyal. yes she cucks Geralt in that one short story but there's a lot more to the characters and series than that.

>>10776193
Belit or Dorcas are the best

>>10776198
>witcher
*pukes gently*

>>10776232
>Dorcas
Cersei's handmaiden in AFFC?

>>10776235

>>10776193
Athene

>>10774932
Fantasy is garbage for children. Name one good series besides LotR and Latro in the Mist.

>>10776261
LOTR is overrated/

>>10776269
I agree, but a lot of people love it and it's such and influential work you can't dismiss it. The only thing other than these 2 worth reading is Conan.

>>10776277
What about Poe and dare I say it, even Lovecraft?

>>10776284
>Lovecraft
Only the Dream Cycle is fantasy, but yes, it is amazing

>Poe
Yeah, he's 10/10

Don't you dare mention King, but Barker has some pretty good stories.

>>10776290
>Dream Cycle
my nigga. Hugely underrated.

>>10776232
>>witcher
>*pukes gently*
It's good.

>>10776307
It's literally Conan for retards and tasteless shits, git gud

>>10776310
It has very little to do with Conan in content, themes, or tone. I take it you're only familiar with the games?

>>10776261
>Name one good series besides LotR and Latro in the Mist.

Robin Hobb's Farseer series. Ok it's coming of age but also mature and some of the best characterisation in all of SFF

>>10776297
It's almost as good or as good as the Chtulhu Mythos, but shadowed by its more popular peer in the same way that Dune looms large over The White Plague or Left Hand of Darkness over The Dispossessed

>>10776261
Amber.

>>10775158
>a black guy gets cucked by this brother
>Is this the ultimate proof of Europeans being cucks by nature?
What did you mean by this?

>>10776261
>series
How to spot a brainlet 101. I'm mainly a sci-fi fag but here's a couple of fantasy books/series I really enjoyed:
Dying Earth
Lyonesse
Jonathan Strange
Howl's Moving Castle
Lud-in-the-Mist
First book of Locke Lamora
Good Omens
Warbreaker

>>10776330
>>10776334
>>10776347

Thanks for the (You)s and the recs lads.

>>10776365
a cunning gambit

>>10774932
I don't like when sci-fi writers base everything on the current understanding of the universe and they do it all the time, i would much rather have someone find the "mass effect particle" that basically gives space magic than have someone base the limits of the world on the fact that "it says so in the book" even though we know shit about quantum mechanics and other shenanigans.

Also there is often a kind of limit in sci-fi, writers assume that they know everything there is to know about the world and brood over it. In fantasy characters are much more humble and even if they are in hell they see it as the hell of the unknown. Paradoxically though fantasy is more contained in the world that the author has built with some inherent rules as opposed to sci-fi where there is an infinite universe that basically is same shit as here so everything feels like filler content.

Anyway it's mostly how I feel about things and not factual state of how things are. In general in fantasy i feel life and in sci-fi death.

Finished Altered Carbon (the novel)

I liked that the prose was a no-frills, no-nonsense kind of thing. It felt like a soldier writing down a mission report, which makes sense considering the protagonist's background.

Are the sequels worth it?

>>10776438
This is incoherent and wrong to the point I think I'm reading performance art or a child's inane ramblings

>>10774158
third book is ok if you only read main characters chapters and every third or so other charterers

>>10776208
Rather crazy magic that's either interesting or too convenient as a plot resolving device
Rogues and stealth ops, mercenaries with a code of honor, sort of
Mages living up to 400 years
Gallows humor, silly jokes
Flying carpets
Bad guys hardly ever staying dead
Many ups and downs. Later series is set in fantasy South East Asia.

>>10772520
Ahh I remember reading a nightwatch book some time ago and it was not bad.
And I'll look into the others thanks.

>>10773958
You are right they aren't bad. But when I browsed through the urban-fantasy category on goodreads it was Dresden-files and then a big fat load of teen-vampire-romance novels. And that mixture makes me rather concerned for the quality.

I just bought House of Suns and A Fire Upon the Deep.

>>10776133
>What am I in for?
Stories that will feel surprisingly fresh (especially compared to today's fantasy) despite being written almost a century ago. And if you like them you definitely need to purchase their Solomon Kane collection as well. And if you end up becoming a Howard nerd go ahead and buy Bran Mak Morn and Kull as well.

>>10774932
I like to imagine I'm a female slave wearing the protagonists sweaty loincloth as a mask. That's why it's called Fantasy. We're all like that.

Any others who liked Kings of the Wyld?
It was as videogame-y and cliche-filled as it gets, but it was a fun read for me.

>>10776505
Most of it is shit. That guy wrote the first Dresden Files book as a joke and was surprised it caught on.

Is Conan canon to the Cthulhu Mythos?

>>10776578
Yes, but mostly because HPL and REH were penpals. Stygians worship Elder Gods and Lemuria and Mu are both mentioned in Conan and Cthulhu stories

>>10776599
Why were humans so much better at dealing with elder shit in the Antediluvian days?

>>10776474
Just re-read my post and it isn't as bad as I thought, here are a couple of examples:

Solaris: humanity and life are shit, we have greed and stuff, we will misuse this great power, destroy everything pls (i'm pretty sure this was not protagonist's views but it was voice of a smart scientist man and this was what I remembered the most)

Legend, drenai series: hey we are alive now and we have stuff important to us, we will die some day anyway so let's die today for what is important.

Anyway I'm pretty sure it's just that infinity triggers some sort of trauma in me and I don't mind not being objective here or people enjoying what they enjoy, the question was why I enjoy something and this is the stuff I take away from the works.

>>10776613
They faced death and misery and war on a daily basis. Also, they expected wizards and demons to intervene in their lives, so the authorities were prone to believe this hoodoo shit and send 1000 guys with weapons to investigate.

>>10776630
But even 1000 guys with modern weapons were only useful against low level shit like Deep Ones or Cthulhu in the modern day stuff.

>>10776627
So you avoid existentialist depression and fantasy is an outlet for your thrill seeking mindset and taste for the weird and fantastic without the void of infinity and space hanging over the procedings. Did I get this right?

>>10776456
Just finished Broken Angels and halfway through woken Furies.

Oh yes indeed it's worth it.

>>10776654
Sort of, I'm dealing with some aspects of existentialist dread on it's own time in general though I believe there is more truth in embracing one's mortality in a way that makes you feel good about it than to drown in hopelessness of current mainstream representation of reality. I'm exploring later as well but as far as fiction goes i prefer the works that are not about accepting that mindset but rather challenging it in different ways. As a result my everyday isn't as filled with dread as it was some years ago.

In any case I don't ignore sci-fi but I'm one of those fags that thinks that there was nothing wrong about "love is the greatest force in the universe" in that one Nolan's space movie. Right now I'm reading Hyperion and am really enjoying it, is it considered "proper sci-fi"? And again the question was about preference and at the end of the die my preferences lie in a developed world that feels lived in and exploration of questions of honor and being, fantasy or not.

>>10776694
>In any case I don't ignore sci-fi but I'm one of those fags that thinks that there was nothing wrong about "love is the greatest force in the universe" in that one Nolan's space movie.
You get that wasn't meant literally right

>>10776365
You cheeky bastard

>>10776438
You should read >>10774718. It deal with the unknown and unexplainable.

>>10776639
>low level shit like Deep Ones or Cthulhu
???

>>10776720
Howdy stranger, Metaphor Detector 5000TM over here.
I believe this person (>>10776694) refers to love as a more influential force on the Universe compared to gravity in the metaphorical sense (as intended by the script of the Science Fiction movie, InterstellarTM).

>>10776747
They suck and can be damaged with mundane explosives. Cthulhu less so but they're both far cries from a true Great Old One.

>>10776613
>>10776630
In both Shadow Over Innsmouth and Dunwich Horror humanity do a great job of fucking up whatever horror is at large. But I have not read Conan, so I don't know what kind of shit they faced back then.

>>10776694
I just think you're very ignorant about sci-fi tebehe. Yes, Hyperion is a great book and a poll would rate it in the top 10-20 sci fi books of all time.

>intrastellan
LMAO who gives a shit about that garbage

>>10776753
Cthulhu is a Great Old One.

>>10774926
I started this book since 2010... I still haven't passed the first page. It was annoying so I dropped it, looking to pick it up at a later time.. 8+ years later...

>>10776757
Mostly wizards, higher beings are usually trapped or lost in the Hyborian Age. There are weird creatures like apemen or hellsteeds but not 50 feet tall Shivas swinging 6 swords and a dick that coyld bludgeon a man to death. Since REH is quintessentially optimistic HPL, it goes like
>wizard conjures up shit
>conan finds out
>kills giant snake in catacomb
>kills wizard
>cult dies

>>10776762
He's just among their highest priests. Not a true Great Old One.

>>10776777
Who'd be a Great Older One? Nyarlathotep? Azathoth? Yogg-Soggoth?

>>10776781
All three of those count, yes.

>>10774932
>sci-fi fag wants to know why his independent threads always die

>>10776769
>conan finds out
lol Conan couldn't care less about wizards and cults do as long as it doesn't affect him personally.

Lovecraft should be banned from /sffg/ and given its own general.

>>10776783
I think I get it. The more its form is just a swirling mass of chaos and madness, the likelier it is the being in question is a Great Older One. Azathoth for example, the Blind Idiot. His shape is almost like a vortex so he is more pure and undiluted. Lessers take familiar but alien forms: Chtulhu as an octopusreptile, Yig the snake, Mother Hydra the Lizard, etc. Their forms are better defined and thus less pure. Did I get it right?

I just read pic related and don't understand what makes it one of the greatest sci fi novels of all time. Nothing about it seems that extraordinary.

>>10776792
I should have said
>gets fucked by/gets involved due to woman with wizard
>kills big snek in tomb
>kills wizard
>fucks said woman

>>10776720
In a sense it was as far as being able to achieve seemingly impossible. If we go with biocentrism stuff the line between metaphor and reality becomes really thin.

>>10776738
Yeah I love the movie and how reverent the guide was towards zone

>>10776758
I enjoyed the theater experience and just gave it as an example of something that triggered a lot of people. I wouldn't call myself very ignorant about sci-fi, just pretty ignorant.

>>10776804
The last 30 pages are incredible. Other than that yeah, not that special

>>10776802
It's more about how far they're removed from conventional concepts of time, space, and mortality. Cthulhu is only partially so, which is why he can die (albeit he doesn't die as normal mortals do). Azathoth, Yog-Sothoth, and Nyarlathotep? Mortality is meaningless to them.

>>10776811
Interstellar was optimistic humanist scifi rather than nihilistic pessimist scifi, basically. The takeaway was that human desire and will could achieve anything through limitless acquisition of knowledge and ingenuity. Most scifi used to be that way, decades ago.

>>10776830

The thing they "killed" in CoC was only Chuhlu's 3D shadow, like that ball angel in NGE.

I think HPL intended for his true form to not even be imaginable by mere humans let alone something that you could fight or kill.

>>10776133
THE. TIME. OF. YOUR. LIFE.

The only dated thing about them is Howard using the word "thews" for Conan's rippling muscles, otherwise it's all good. He also assumes a lot of different roles in the stories, he's a thief, he's an adventuring explorer, he's a pirate, he's a warlord, he's a king, etc.

Straight shooting, no frills, fuck-off-with-your-spells-you-effeminate-wizard-poofter, sword & sorcery, fear of ghosts and the supernatural, ultimate male power fantasy. Jack Reacher wants to be him.

Frazetta's artwork of Conan has made people assume he's just a loincloth wearing barbarian but he's so much more.

>>10776843
It's still something that could be hindered by man. The big three mentioned before cannot be. Well, except Nyarlathotep in the Dreamlands because humans are strangely powerful there.

>>10776261
>trying passive aggressive reverse psychology to get recs
No one here is stupid enough you idiot.

what was the one with Yog-Sothoth again?

>>10776830
Doesn't that reflect in their physical being too? A being remote from the normal constraints of existence becomes esotheric in shape and is thus almost impossible to explain in pure descriptive terms when it comes to what it looks like exactly.

>>10776810
That's more like it.

>>10776844
>Frazetta
I miss these kinds of covers.

>>10776852
There were a few. The biggest was Lurker at the Threshold.

>>10776853
Yeah thinking of it it does seem to. Yog-Sothoth and Azathoth both have hugely abstract shapes. I don't think we've ever actually had Nyarlathotep described. It usually appears impersonating a human. Or even worse, a negro

I lift to channel vital Celtic powers through image training Conan the Commercial

>>10776208
Tsundere sisters trying to kill eachother

>>10776861
The only film that got it right was Hellraiser 2. Just a big fucking cube of nothing that is so distant in shape and being that comprehension or communication is impossible.

>>10776133
>>10776844

And if you want more sword & sorcery you can check out Karl Edward Wagner's 'Kane' series. Slightly more modern and he clearly gets a lot of inspiration from Conan

>>10776856
Me too, buddy. Me too.

>>10776844
>made people assume he's just a loincloth wearing barbarian but he's so much more.
Yeah as far as I remember he is wearing armor of all sorts most of the time.

Also Conan is oft quite profound in his dealing with the supernatural.
"I have known many gods. He who denies them is as blind as he who trusts them too deeply. I seek not beyond death. ... I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content "

Really a good character.

>>10776526
>dinosaur lying to people about fossils being fresh

>>10776505
>browsed through the urban-fantasy category on goodreads

>>10776954
>lilith saintcrow

what a name... i'm already aroused

How do you define "sword and sorcery" against other types of fantasy?

>>10776975

It's like if fantasy was Baldur's Gate and DA:O then sword and sorcery would be like Diablo and Sacred.

>>10776975
Homer's Odyssey could be classed as Sword & Sorcery since it features swords and magic. It's generally considered to be "lowbrow".

>>10776133
Where did you order them? They're expensive as fuck if you want them new from Amazon.

>>10776975
Sword and Sorcery is the 'dark and gritty' fantasy grimderpers wish their fantasy was.

>>10777005
>It's generally considered to be "lowbrow".
Even that deconstructionist marxist homo Moorcock admits the greatness of Sword and Sorcery.

>>10777010
>expensive as fuck
https://www.amazon.com/Coming-Conan-Cimmerian-Robert-Howard/dp/0739440810/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

>>10777027
>Even that deconstructionist marxist homo Moorcock admits the greatness of Sword and Sorcery.

Well, he does write pretty good S&S himself.

>>10777035
>tfw I'm a retard
Thanks.

>want to write my own book
>don't really have "a story to tell", just want to write some fun fantasy
>haven't been writing my entire life, so I know it would be shit anyway

What are some good science fiction, fantasy or horror with a snow backdrop or take place in a world covered entirely in ice? Read GRRM's Bitterblooms last night and it was pretty decent. It's cold as fuck outside and the mood is right for this type of stuff.

>>10777227
Daniel Black by William Brown

>>10776804
I agree. However, I think a lot of people were blown away by the last part in 1953, especially by the way it was portrayed as more or less a good thing.

>>10777051
>Well, he does write pretty good S&S himself.

I will never stop loving how Moorcock bitched about S&S pulp and then turned around and wrote a bunch of it because that was all he could do.

>>10777227
Ice by Anna Kavan

>read through thread
>it's a bunch of s&s pulp fags shitting on their betters because they know their genre a shit
Like clockwork

Is the Hainish Cycle any good?

>>10777227
Do you wish to read about riders and their semi-sentient horse companions who guide truck caravans through snowy mountain passes in a world where every village is walled to keep away psychic predators? Spoiler: It's depressing

don't read women lol
They are so terrible with their ridiculous tropes & feminist nonsense

>>10777692
Just avoid those particular women then.

>>10777701
name a good female author

>>10777704
Colleen McCullough

>>10776176
>>10776186
>>10776188
You're all wrong

>>10777704
I ain't gonna spoonfeed yah flabbajack.

>>10777746
shes not sci-fi/fantasy

>>10774184
Masters of Rome is a bit like this. Fortuna's favourites is taken pretty literally.

>>10777756
>Sulla, Marius, Caesar etc are all great because a goddess liked them
>not fantasy

>>10777759
*tips fedora*

>>10777780
I'll tip you into a pot of cum if you don't shut your gub

>>10777796
Women compulsively write romance and homosexuality into everything, its disgusting

>>10777638
Probably if you like her politics and this >>10777806

>>10777227
Left Hand of Darkness.

>>10777806
And why do men hate romance?

>>10777855
Romance is man-taming.

>>10777000
Baldur's Gate and DA:O are both sword and sorcery fantasy nerd

>>10777704
Ursula K. LeGuin

>>10777870
It's the duty of a man to be a provider and father. You are the male equivalent of a roastie.

>>10776330
Liveship Traders is great, too. Reading the second book now and I think I'm enjoying it even more than Farseer, really.

>>10777934
Absolutely not.

She's only slightly better than Anne Rice but she's still trash next to a great like Sanderson.

>>10777964
Is it opposite day or something?

Is Cordwainer Smith worth getting into?
I have only read the "Scanners Live In Vain", it was delightfully weird, yet I can't help but detect the flavor of the All-American Glurge a la Bradbury in it.
Is it like that for the rest of his stories?
Or am I mistaken about him?

>>10772280
New moon or literally anything by Mcdonald.

>>10778088
>Dragonbone Chair
fuck that slut Miriamel

>>10776791
>sci-fi fag
Nope. When I wrote "fantasyfags", I was including myself. The goal of the question was to find out why I personally prefer fantasy.

I've made a new thread for us all to continue our discussions in:

>>10778690
>>10778690
>>10778690
>>10778690
:^)

>>10778087
Scanners Live in Vain is his best story, although not the only good one. Worth getting into. Plus, I'm almost certain he introduced catgirls into Western culture.

>All-American Glurge
wtf are you talking about