/lit/ - Literature

Why is it necessary?

>>10459754
I DONT KNOW WHAT TO READ. PLEASE WE NEED TO DO THIS BEFORE THE NEW YEAR

>>10459761
Its true, what if a book we thought was patrician last year is now garbage
Like Steppenwolf for example

>>10459775
simply unread the garbage ones

Anyone that cares enough to do it can start it.

>>10459761

>>10459747
2016 captured our zeitgeist perfectly.

Roughly speaking, nothings changed. Our tastes aren't any different, and there haven't been any new memes for us.
Realistically, we won't need a new chart until 2020.

>>10459792
Not at all, Dostoevsky has fallen out of fashion after him being king last year and there's been a massive rise in interest in French literature and a David Foster Wallace revival. This is all incredibly important and merits documentation

>>10459747
Why not just do a top 10 of books released in 2017?

>>10459789
>>10459792
The fact that IJ dropped from the 1st place in 2016 perfectly coincides with the redditor influx (culture of critique, peterson, memes gallore, ...).
What a dreck this place has become.

>>10459805
Because contemporary books are garbage and deserve no recognition

>>10459812
Its gotten better. I remember back when there were daily threads on the Gulag Archipelago. The /pol/edditors are gradually seeing the light

Someone did it some month ago, but everyone dismissed it.

>>10459812
the /lit/(reddit)cord released a """"""""""""""""""""/lit/"""""""""""""""""""" Top 100 for 2017 and it was utter shit. IJ was at like #40

>>10459818
That's because it was a hoax orchestrated by low IQ discord homos

>>10459826

>>10459828
Well, maybe it's time to organize a better one.

>>10459826
IJ is fucking awful. People like you who haven't stopped posting about it since the noughts need to fuck off, it's simply posturing. Posturing simply, simply-put.

>>10459877
If I wanted to hear a redditors opinion I'd have gone to reddit

>>10459877
>using discord to gossip about anonymous posters
>using discord for anything other than staying in touch with friends who you don’t want to text with

>>10459877
>implying it’s not the defining work of the turn of the millennia
Imagine being this much of a brainlet.

>>10459826
Was that out earlier this year? If I recall, Bible was 1, Shakespeare was 2 and fucking Finnegans Wake was 3

in the garbage where it belongs

>>10459887
>>10459889
>>10459890
i-is /lit/ back?

>>10459887
You're already here.

>>10459890
It has some social importance - it's like watching bored yuppie sadboys wake up to the fact that it's hard to watch all that TV and porn :'(. It's vapid entertainment-bashing, rather than going for the bigger picture -- it's what milquetoast liberals do to "rock the boat".

>>10459910
Why would you want your board to be the same for another decade? Sorry we're not talking about that radical book you read as an undergraduate like ten years ago, when you could really impress a broad with the sheer WEIGHT of that DOORSTOPPER.

>>10459913
There is no fucking bigger picture that's the problem and why Infinite Jest is so important. You can have all the esoteric and high minded discourse you want in their appropriate ghettos but you're still a trapped and empty being if you have no way of connecting that consciousness with regular life without reverting to a sad ironic memer.

>>10459928
It's funny that you've completely made DFW into an ironic sad meme then. There is only "esoteric and high-minded discourse" to those unwilling to do anything remotely political outside of shitting on "consumerism"... the resources are there for you, you need only come out and reach for it.

>I don't care about the books, I just like seeing them arranged into different orders

>>10459804
Dostoevsky is timeless and is still one of our most favored authors. I'll concede on the point about french lit, but DFW's revival has been trivial since he's never lost our attention.

Incredibly important? Hardly. Anon it's all minutiae at this point

>>10459747

>>10459943
>is sensitive about the word consumerism
this board and /fit/ have the most normalfags by far

https://www.reddit.com/r/raerth/comments/cpxkq/reddits_favourite_books/c0udvs9/
>ctrl f infite jest
>crypto redditors on 4chan perennially btfo

>>10459789
>Camus at #2
>>10459812
IJ is awful and you have shit taste!

>>10459965
>sensitive about the word consumerism
Literally what? I just think DFW is full of platitudes and, generally, just a cowardly person. He goes for the low-hanging fruit, not for the crest of the tree.

>>10459965
No /pol/ does you fucking moron

>>10459943
>the resources are there for you, you need only come out and reach for it
I don't think DFW is bad, I just think he is average and average against several thousand years of the great writers is not a flattering comparison. I liked his articles he wrote. I enjoyed them for exactly what they were, a reasonably well written document to read on a lazy Sunday and forget about its existence afterwards. However the 1000 page novel only magnifies his mediocre talents. It's one thing to make a book that requires rereading and critical thought to align events and to sort out the timeline but I wouldn't call it a success if the book was so turgid that as soon as I finished I would never return nor think about it again. To this I would compare him to Pynchon.
Also his short stories are dogshite. The very best of them is at best average and that isn't many of them.

>>10459968
holy fuck i can't even imagine having this shit of taste
if i could but with one hand sink all of discord into the sea

>>10459968
>ctrl f infite jest
>crypto redditors on 4chan perennially btfo
But half of lit has always hated DFW.

>>10459943
>to do anything remotely political

See you're already missing the God damn point, this has so much more to do than mere politics. """ Political action""" is part of the problem, its as bad as just going to Marvel films

what is it with dfwposters being the same kind of memeing retards like frogposters are
your saint is turning in his grave

>>10459994
It's the same as all the real ones minus the jokes, the memes of the moment and the books chosen by the new people which might account for only 20 of the results.

>>10460002
How do I know you're some yuppie who just uses DFW's boring, milquetoast lifestyle to justify their own?

>>10460016
t. discordfag

/lit/ is actually /tv/-levels of bad, so I'm not surprised that any/all hardworking OC makers have left the board.

>>10460025
>/tv/
>bad

>>10460018
Why care? What's wrong with a milquetoast lifestyle. Why does any of this fucking matter to you?

>>10460021
>thinks that Harry Potter and Vonnegut deserve to be on the list
Not that I am but I would rather be a discordfag than whatever the hell you are.

>>10460060
its pathetic, you live once and that’s it. there is no afterwards to make up for being a coward while still here

>>10460002
>as bad as just going to Marvel films
damn, so woke about the popular media

>>10459990
i don’t count reddit outposts as boards anon

>>10460073
You keep throwing around this term coward like it actually means something in this context.

>>10460073
Why is it pathetic, why not be a "coward"?
You see the problem here is exactly the type of LARPer attitude that he was writing against. You're not actually living you're just looking for an easy performance to fantacize is what really matters while I bet like so many you neglect your actual family, social relations and daily exchanges because nothing on the ground can really matter to you. They don't count because they're not part of the "big picture". You can be a reactionary high minded hero in your mind while jacking off to porn and being just as much of an atomized bugman as the people you loath. Because their reality counts but yours doesn't just because you don't engage with it

>>10460070
Vonnegut and even Harry Potter are unironically better than the thirty or so japshit you discordfags forced onto your list

>>10460076
Its all popular media that's the problem. The retards posting in the Trump general on /pol/ are just as bad as any nu-male talking about star wars. Its why """street battles""" look like comic con

>>10460099
>Vonnegut better than anything
wanna know how i know you are also lowkey buttmad about the exclusion of murakami as well?

>>10460106
are you Matthew Bellamy's ghostwriter or something

>>10459968
Holy fuck this list
lol just lol

>>10460119
I don't know who that is but epic zinger buddy, you should have a sitcom

>>10459747

>>10459812
It dropped three fucking spots.
Redditor influx doesn't change the chart because those people don't read, they just meme on about NRx and Peterson.

Discordfags are SEETHING in this thread

>>10459968
this isn't canon

>>10460099
>not that I am
>calls me one anyway
Also there are only seven entries by Japanese authors, not 30. Just so everyone can see how much of a pleb you are you are saying that Vonnegut and even Harry Potter are better than Kawabata, Mishima, Dazai, Ōe, Tanizaki, Endo, and Sōseki
As I said before I may not be a discordfag but I would rather be one than what you are.

>>10460161
You do know the post says so itself right?

>>10460164
>only seven

>>10460166

nae cunt on /lit/ reads literature.

the generic academic literature canons have been shpeeled out for years as top 100 lists . /lit/ doesn't even attend academic institutions anymore.

just read 2017's list, you needy fuck.

bunch of numpties

>>10459789
This is the sort of list that dilettantes makes when asked to make a list of 'good' books

>>10459747
QUICK, BEFORE I'M FORCED TO FORM MY OWN OPINION!

>>10460188
Okay I missed one, it's eight. Miscounting is better than thinking that JK Rowling should be on the lit list.

map of meaning was pretty good

>>10460212
This is the sort of list that gets made on a board with a low user base and and even lower voting base only get a couple of votes to choose books they really like.

>>10459968
>Shakespeare is one entry
>Homer is one entry
>Anna Karenina at 4 and before The Brothers Karamazov
>Finnegans Wake at 5
>2666 in the fucking top 25
>all of this japanese lit
>Euripides in front of Sophocles and Aeschylus (again all three just three entries)
>Everything That Rises Must Converge instead of A Good Man is Hard to Find
>Frankenstein in the top 50
>Infinite Jest at 42 just to be contrarian
>the back 30 are just atrocious besides a few (like The Aeneid which is way out of place)
>no Lolita
>no Fitzgerald or Hemingway
the absolute STATE of the "/lit/"cord
the sad thing is you know they are actually serious about this too lel

>>10460219
so was the second harry potter book and 50 shades of grey

>>10460269
>>Anna Karenina at 4 and before The Brothers Karamazov
dostofags are truly the bronies of literature

>>10460360
delete this

>>10460269
>Shakespeare is one entry
Because including everything he ever wrote isn't good enough.
>Anna Karenina at 4 and before The Brothers Karamazov
Unironically thinking that Dosto is a better writer than Tolstoy. Disgusting.
>all of this japanese lit
Better than all the meme shit they got rid of to make room for it
>Euripides in front of Sophocles and Aeschylus (again all three just three entries)
It might surprise you to know but outside of Nietzsche's echo chamber lots of people really love Euripides more than the other two. Also you are complaining about the entire Euripides and the complete Oresteia being a single entry. Perhaps you wanted an entry for every single poem that someone wrote, that way we can have Shakespeare occupy the entire list. Are you autistic?
>Infinite Jest at 42 just to be contrarian
No anon, having it in there at all is contrarian. Having it at number 1 is just pleb.
>no Fitzgerald or Hemingway
Of all of the worlds great authors you cry because these two aren't in it. Who the fuck thinks that Hemingway deserves to be on here but doesn't mention someone like Racine?

>>10459747
Not again, there was I guess two threads about it and every anon was discussing if the list of "some year" was fake or if wasn't. It was a mess, it's nonsense try to do another one, because some anon's can adulterat the votes.

>>10460899
Discordfags should be gassed. Your list is rigged, fuck off, don't call it /lit/'s top 100 when a tiny fraction of board voted on it.

>>10459789
Hey, here's an idea for a meaningful list. How about we make a top 100, but forbid voting for the books from the older lists? That way we'd create a fairly original selection that might draw people to lesser known but still important and valuable books and writers.

>>10461084
Also we might make top 50 lists specifically for lyric poets, dramas and comics, stuff that is usually ignored in favour of big meme novels and epics

>>10461102
>>10460899
at least use a trip so I can filter (You)

>>10461084
>Discordfags should be gassed
I'm not a discordfag.
>Your list is rigged
It's not my list.
>don't call it /lit/'s top 100 when a tiny fraction of board voted on it
I didn't call it anything.
>inb4 you're lying and you are a discordfag

>>10461142
>someone called me out on being a pleb, somebody do something about it
You are responding to two people by the way, not one. Also encouraging trip fags, what the fuck is wrong with you?

>>10459968
Absolutely Haram

>>10461415
tripfagging is an excellent way to allow me to never see they're shit posts ever again.
Call it selfish but works on my machine. /lit/ is dead anyway.

>>10459923
Because old /lit/ had a level of discourse that was above the entry-level humanities course that this board has become.

>>10461427
>entry-level humanities course
I wish lit were like that. Pol is fundamentally anti-academic, the r9k crowd is also mostly. It's hard to have a serious discussion when a citation or a link is to an academic and the response is some Jewish conspiracy against white people.

>>10461520
I really don't understand those people. Is it that they've consumed everything available in their echo chamber, and now they need to strike out in the wider world for validation? I imagine that they gravitate to lit because they see it as being full of intelligent people and they'll be in good company, but when they're presented with evidence that their bat-shit ideas won't gain traction, rather than slink away in shame they double down harder. What possesses people to do this?

It's sad that the parasites have started to overtake the host. The discourse on lit is driving away posters that actually care about literature, and every day the catalogue's literature threads are diluted with more and more bullshit. Combine that with mods that just don't give a shit, and you're witnessing the demise of a board culture.

>>10461520
>>10461561
Sincerely fuck off to reddit both of you. There's a reason this board is anti-Academic and its because academics are worthless and themselves anti-intellectual. You may not believe in the Jewish control of the academy but if you deny the intense politicized component of the humanities then you're utterly deluded

>>10461574
See? They lack even basic self-awareness! The Literature board is anti-academic? The fucking literature board? You really need to stop parroting and have a long look at yourself, because this is just sad. The unexamined life is not worth living.

>>10461574
>but if you deny the intense politicized component of the humanities
>I can believe anything I want without evidence because of political elements in a part of academia
Truly said by someone who knows nothing about academia or the peer review system. Instead of whining that some girl said something you didn't like maybe you should spend your time on the academics who do good work which you would know if you read them. Or perhaps you could read the objections people have to the papers you don't like which is an easy thing to do because everything is peer reviewed.

The discord is a friend simulator full of highschoolers who play quiz bowl. Imagine an echo chamber of fifty butterflies and feministers and you’ll have an idea of what it’s like

>>10461574
>intense politicized component of the humanities
Except pol hate all forms of academia which disagrees with them including the fields that are not subject to increase in liberalism. They have to hate science because otherwise they can't justify their racism and sexism.

>>10461614
Well that would require curiosity and intellectual effort. It's so much easier to accept the simple idea that nothing can be known due to vague conspiracies, and that way their ignorance and close-mindedness can seem to them a virtue. They're standing in a tide pool while shouting into the ocean about their personal depth.

>>10459983
>not liking Camus or DFW
control your brainlet level

>>10461588
Yeah because you can't possibly open up a book without the great academys approval.
You're a duped fool

>>10461632
>They have to hate science because otherwise they can't justify their racism and sexism.

lol imagine actually believing this

>>10461632
Let's head over to /pol/ and attempt to renew interest in phrenology. I think they'll bite.

>>10461649
Phrenology is legit

>>10461561
This. I'm sick and tired of scrolling past a dozen threads that are clearly cross posters trying to bait or otherwise ignoring the board rules.

>>10461574
part of the problem, everybody can tell you've been on this board less than 2 years

>>10461668
Wrong

>>10461561
/lit/ has always been a board full of plebs that are just starting out on the canon

in fact I think it has improved with time, there are some anons who are fairly well read these days

>>10461614
>>10461634
Or I could just ignore them because their thoughts and writings literally do not matter at all outside their self fellating circles

>>10461709
Because no one has ever written anything ever in an academic setting which would be ever relevant when it comes to reading books. I mean it's not like literary criticism, aesthetics, or history have any bearing on books. You can just make it all up yourself!

>>10461728
>You can just make it all up yourself!

Yeah you totally fucking can

IT
IS
ALWAYS
THE
SAME

>>10461728
Hahahhha what the FUCK

>>10459968
soyboy core

IF THE PALE KING IS NOT #1 IN THE LIST I THINK /lit/ SUCKS

>>10459747
These lists are always just the same few books shuffled around anyways.

>>10460042
this

>>10461747
Yea you can, but you would be wrong.

Add it.

>>10459968
Book selection ain't bad but the order is totally fucked

there were probably like 5 good books released this year, none of which were read because everyone is catching up on the last 2500 years of lit

>>10462292
1-5: go mofo.

>>10459877
On the one hand, you've got people that love DFW too much. On the other, there are people like you that hate his work far more than he deserves, probably because you trust Harold Bloom way more than than you should. Either way, there's genuine love or hate for him, it's his popularity that makes people have the one extreme reaction or the other.

IJ is good, neither great not awful, but simply overrated.

>>10459761
*dabs to postmodernism*

>>10462628
>if I take the middle way everyone but me is wrong
DFW is a hack. IJ isn't good, at best it can be described as mediocre.

>>10462915
Wrong, it's a beautiful tortured work and he's the only recently born author worthy of the canon

>>10459826
I honestly think Discord did more damage to 4chan than any other thing in the history of this site, /vg/ is absolutely wrecked thanks to it, and you had the tardos spamming their shitty-ass 2017 list here pretending it was from /lit/.
It's just amazing how cancerous and subversive it is.

>>10463054
Its like a micro version of Judaism

>>10463054
I don't know what discord is so I don't understand what you mean, please elaborate.

>>10459968
I wish I could take this chart back to 2012 /lit/ so we could have a laugh. I miss those days honest. Are any of you guys still around?

>>10463355

i remember 2012 /lit/. some guy kept doing threads where he bought stuff for people off of their amazon wish lists, and he bought me a few books.

and on books--people actually talked about them instead of, like, arguing about the overall aesthetic and oeuvre of the board any time someone tries to start a discussion.

also generally was way less racist.

it was good times.

>>10463355
jahookie motherfucker

>>10460138

>>10463368
I basically just lurk and report threads these days. Not sure what I'm still doing here. Habit, I guess.

>>10459789
>Ulysses
>Moby Dick
>IJ dropped down

truly, we live in the most reddit of times

#1 BABY

>>10459968
>>10463355
>>10463368
>>10464846

I think it's time to leave friends.

>>10464846
Pretty much. There was one actual /lit/ thread a couple weeks ago, I think. Not reason enough to visit.

this 2017 list looks way better than the earlier lists. what's the problem?

>>10465292
>redpills get pseud oldscum to leave

Wtf I love Hitler now

>>10465345
Because only discordfags voted on it. There's no Lolita on the whole list and some writers' opera are arbitrarily treated as single works (comedies, tragedies, sonnets and epic poems? Yeah that's just one book).

>>10465345
i honestly feel bad for you if you think that's a good list

>>10465613
So some invite only clique, not sure that counts.

>>10465613
We didn't vote, a couple guys came up with the titles

How about multiple lists and not just one? You can't really compare poetry to novels, and it's autistic when you see Paradise Lost ranked below some trendy novel. How about a poetry list, non-fiction list, and a literature list?

no one gives a shit
contain your autism

I posted >>10466301, since my other thread got removed. I'll make the results and collation public so you can check for yourselves.

>>10466314
please don't

>>10466314
Why did this kill the thread?

>>10466314

>>10466301 got removed too lol

>>10467591
I said I was going to bed, and a discord-janitor pounced. >>10467600 is the new thread.

Survey is at https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfCJVnSTO8pJCd12Uagawf69Flsfa2RS0lXGHTt5Nc9lGwIQQ/viewform?usp=sf_link#responses if they remove that too.

>>10459812
ulysses rising in rank and the bible suddenly appearing in the top 10 is the exact opposite of what a redditor influx would look like

redditor influx would be slaughterhouse 5 suddenly leaping up the chart and the martian making an appearance somewhere

>>10465658
lol that's even more sad

>>10467722
>the bible suddenly appearing in the top 10

literally r/jordanbpeterson or wherever they come from

>>10468099
i dont think he was even about in 2016

>>10461728
Christ anon. It's been years since a reaction image got me good. Thank you.

>>10465640
He didn't say it was good, he said it was better which I find hard to disagree with. It's the exact same list without the troll entries like Harry Potter and without the pleb ones Fight Club. The only way you could think this list is worse is if you actually like those books.

>>10465613
> writers' opera are arbitrarily treated as single works (comedies, tragedies, sonnets and epic poems? Yeah that's just one book).
That only happens once in the new list. Collecting multiple works (though not all of them) as a single entry has been done in every single one of the polls. The new one only has five that aren't covered by the other polls. How come people only complain about it now?

>>10469899
I think it’s because there were other issues with Discord fabricating a list, and it wasn’t shilled hard before now.

Discord users should just rely on this list tbqhwyf

>>10459968
worst one yet, delete this

Not a discordfag (wasn't even aware we had one) but their list is fine. Fuck these polls anyways, it's the same shit and some outsider faggots always spread it around reddit.

>>10465613
Well I do have all of Shakespere in a single book, so yes it is.

I saved the link to vote in case this happened. I think crooked mods may have banned our chart maker.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QVUneg8EeFVZMEuEYfR8NYou_et6DUoRnjQDijoJe7c/edit?usp=sharing

>>10459761
reread the big 4