/lit/ - Literature

Don't know about era defining artists, but Berlin is definitely the go-to city for thriving art scene.

>>10421928
Probably Budapest. All the western Europe capitals are riddled with subhuman scum. Gypsies begging for money, African street-vendors accosting you, groups of middle-easterners threatening people and harassing women etc. Homeless peope and piss everywhere. Avoid Paris, Berlin, London.

Why would our era be defined by something analogous to another era? Paris was of its time, you shouldn't be looking for a direct equivalent elsewhere.

>>10421928
/lit/

It's on the internet- there's no reason anymore to start art collectives in person when most artists are easily accessible with the touch of a mouse.

>>10421928
It isn't but it should be Romania. Buy a house for 5k and live off of savings while fucking around and writing shit. Economically it's about equivalent.

>>10421951
can't go drinking with them though

>>10421938
Nice, it’s on my list. I’ve heard nothing but good things. I’ve somehow managed to skirt around it, even after many trips to Europe.

>>10421942
Those add texture though. Plus, I think a big theme of this generation is mass-migration and global income inequality. When I can watch a live stream of Americans living in relative splendour from the shithole mud hut I share with my eight brothers and sisters, why don’t I too share a right to that life, if all that separates us is a made up border and a couple undersea cables.

>>10421943
Not a direct equivalent. The expat thing is more that I’m more interested in how people from my culture are viewing the world through our shared lens.

>>10421944
>>10421951
I fucking hope not, after seeing the sorry self-loathing state of this board. (Jk love you retards)

>>10421958
Also the last true bastion of the Latin language.

I elect Taipei as the next /lit/ cultural centre.

>>10421963
>Those add texture though. Plus, I think a big theme of this generation is mass-migration and global income inequality. When I can watch a live stream of Americans living in relative splendour from the shithole mud hut I share with my eight brothers and sisters, why don’t I too share a right to that life, if all that separates us is a made up border and a couple undersea cables.

>>10421942
>All the western Europe capitals are riddled with subhuman scum. Gypsies begging for money, African street-vendors accosting you, groups of middle-easterners threatening people and harassing women etc. Homeless peope and piss everywhere. Avoid Paris, Berlin, London.
Paris in the 1920s m8. Read the OP again.

>>10421972
>asia

>>10421942
>African street-vendors accosting you
those guys are great tho

>>10421942
>describes the ideal conditions for emergence of great art
>avoid it
/the_pol/ never ceases to redefine the limits of retardation.

>>10421928
The only real answer is Shanghai

>>10421942
And 1920s Paris was riddled with whores, gangs of orphans, drug addicts and alcoholics, syphilis, and the whole diaspora of impoverished eastern european deserting their shitholes.
As we know, it was great

Chicago

>1920s Paris
>thriving

that's decades after any relevant literature was written in paris
>muh hemingway
>muh beckett

try hugo, flaubert or rousseau

>>10421972
t. Tao Lin

>>10422157
>thinks by referencing one great time period I’m discounting the others
>mfw two things can’t both be great

>>10421942
Born and raised in Budapest.

>local art scene reduced to ~4 small districts out of 23
>3 out of 4 is half-ghetto
>lit journals going under
>publishing is fucked
>self-publishing is pointless for such a small market
>alt-right-ish government keeps closing independent art studios and community centers
>American “liberalism” infected humanities to some degree
>””””feminists”””” and other yank-trash BS will destroy the legitimate resistance of universities, intellectuals and artists
>pro-gov faggots put into HS and Uni leadership positions (principals, deans and rectors)
>deteriorating education in general
>gov supported anti-intellectualism at large

It’s just like any other major European city, except we’re fucked by a meme government. Writers and poets don’t hang out with each other anymore, it’s all disconnected, fragmented. Actors are the only ones who have their own bars, cafès etc., and that’s because they work together.

If you’re into arts, Budapest has a lot to offer. Museums, exhibitions, readings, etc. If you’re an artist looking to get together with likeminded individuals, you’ll be as lost as anywhere else.

Budapest used to have a great artistic community back in the 1920-1930s. It was fucked by fascism. What survived of it was fucked by communism. Revival in 1990s. What you see now is either part of the rejuvenation process, or the last push before it’s all gone.

>>10422149

Yes but those were at least white people who didn't massively stand out until you closely inspected them. Now there are entire neighborhoods where you stared at because you are the only of one of the only white faces in a sea of brown and black.

What makes a /lit/ city great is not only the literary culture of that city but also the physical inhabitants themselves. In a truly /lit/ city you can wander the streets in a dérive, overhearing snatches of intelligent conversation on the sidewalk and coming face to face with beautiful well-dressed women every time you turn a corner; a city full of limitless possibilities for adventures and sophistication.

That's all been ruined. The great western cities look like post-apocalyptic shitholes. You walk outside and if you aren't physically assaulted by some dark-skinned individual with prognathism you are assaulted by the stench of piss at every turn. Intelligent beautiful women no longer feel comfortable walking the streets alone except for a few neighborhoods. You can't walk home alone late after a night at the bar without having to dodge crowds of Shudras looking to rob someone.

The only truly great /lit/ cities in Europe are the large cultured ones with rich histories that are still overwhelmingly white but which aren't in the poorest countries, i.e. Budapest, St. Petersburg, Prague, Warsaw, the Baltic capitals.

>>10422322

Overall you guys are vastly better off than shitholes like Paris. Yeah it sucks that the government is curtailing or cutting support for certain artistic venues but the flip side of that is that government supported arts stuff tends to be shitty or shills progressive ideology, when people have to rely on genuine talent and not grant money to get their work out than the best rise to the top.

I would much rather live in a city with a rich culture that was safe and overwhelmingly white than a city where the government supported artists but had severe problems with terrorism, street crime, overcrowded, dirty and full of shit and piss etc etc.

What makes a city /lit/ is just as much the atmosphere and quality of life as it is the actual 'arts' scene. In every city there is going to be an arts and intellectual scene, just in some cities it is a little bigger or has access to more public funds. Ultimately though if the city is shit the scene is not worth it.

>>10422356

They also support “ideologically compatible” art, so there’s no winning in this situation. We don’t have terrorism, that’s true. We have petty street crime instead. Muggers, random fights. Low income and quality of life will do that. You’ll have your street merchants peddling fake-Armani all the same.

A city being ethnically more homogeneous than Paris won’t mean it’s better in any way. I love my city, but that’s just bullshit, they’re not even comparable.

The atmosphere is great though. As long as you don’t look at the /pol/-tier billboards, ignore all the homeless, and don’t leave the Vth, VIth districts, and stick to the better parts of the VIIth, VIIIth and XIIIth...

>>10422332
You seem so out of touch with reality you might even be American.

>>10421928
Seoul

>>10422356
Just because a shithole is "ethnically homogenous", its not guaranteed to be good. Ukraine and Romania are shithole countries, Hungary is barely better.

>>10422564
Those countries are hardly ethnic homogenious desu.

>>10422332
>>10422356
Jesus Christ, I hope this is bait. You sound like a 14 year old poltard living in his basement somewhere is Midwestern US suburb.

>>10422570
>hungary
>not ethnically homogeneous
there's some roma and germans they haven't killed yet but hungary has been impossible to invade or leave for hundred of years without a major secret service agency abducting you.

>>10421951
This
The Internet is the greatest tool for exchanging and developing ideas, bohemia has become pointless

Rotherham, UK

>>10422596
>or leave
hungary's retarded government is scaring away its skilled workers and academics in record numbers for recent history

>>10422564
Africa is african, and a shithole. Paris now has lots of africans, and is now a shithole.

>>10422564
>Hungary is barely better than Ukraine
>*Dumb shit*

>>10422596
Hungary is ethnically homogenous in the sense that most citizens have long lost their “native” cultural identity. There is no such thing as ethnically Hungarian. Hundreds of years of occupation, massacres that asked for immigration, mingling due to political convenience, etc. We’re mixed as fuck.
As I said I live in Budapest, and most of my friends can trace their ancestry back to Romania, Croatia, Slovakia, Ukraine, Germany, etc. We just don’t give a fuck. It doesn’t matter.

Funny anecdote:
>far rightist politician
>pure Hungarian blood right here
>fucking minorities
>he finds out he has Jewish ancestry
>mfw

>>10422785
Never been to Ukraine but I think it’s somewhat comparable. There are many truly depressing small towns and villages in Hungary that would make you think of some 3rd world country. It’s easy to forget that in such a capital-centric country.

>>10422805
>never been to Ukraine but let me make a comparison anyways
The main difference is that Ukraine is one big shithole with armed conflicts raging on, while we have functioning cities and Budapest too with poor countryside in between them.

>>10422729
>in record numbers
because nobody left before. it does make it easier to learn hungarian than it's ever been too, but that's just because, again, it was impossible to find hungarian spoken anywhere else for fucking ever
>>10422794
>>10422794
>>he finds out he has Jewish ancestry
kek
hungarians used be more spread out over the carparthians but they used also own more of them too, so ethnically, those regions were probably more hungarian before the treaty than hungary was at the time. [for instance ukraine and romania got a lot of places that have more hungarians than some areas in hungary, because of hundred year ago. they now consider themselves citizens of there, but hungary viewed for a long time it to be their duty to stop the turks raping the precious women of the carpathians first]

hungary isn't the clusterfuck of races or immigration or locations that other places in the ex-soviet bloc or the balkans are. compared to pretty much anywhere except finland it's hard to find a more coherent volks/spachbund than hungary [which the far right exploits]. and finland cheats by inbreeding and never leaving the village.

>>10421928
I would very much like to know if there are still "scenes" anon, as I like the feel of it quite a lot, but I don't know if that's a thing in the internet age. The local flavor every scene needs to thrive is dissolved with online communities. But for all means I hope there is a vibrant scene, especially somewhere in Europe so I've got an excuse to move. I'm tired of the "artist" live, aka being surrounded by niggers, immigrants and other detestable types.

>>10422873
Scenes still exist IRL, but its mostly things heavily based in the physical world like drugs and partying

>>10421928
For artists? I don't know. But I think Boston is going to overtake Silicon Valley in the realm of technology. Boston simply has too many great universities.

>>10421928
I have a large penis and don't masturbate

>>10421963
>why don’t I too share a right to that life
find the nearest bridge and jump off
if you're still alive, repeat

>>10422515
>>10422580
Try the fucking redpill, or go to a nigger hate thread on /pol/ and see the truth for yourself

>>10422882
So it isn't an art scene, it's a drug scene. Degenerates. Yes drugs were always mixed in with art communities, but it shouldn't be a requisite to be in it.

>>10422910

>>10422926
He means other "scenes" like music or dance

>>10421928
Unironically Brooklyn, especially neighborhoods in early stages of gentrification

>>10422551
>implying soulless gooks could make art

>>10422948
tbf that's true of art scenes in general, albeit in my experience visual arts people tend to be a special kind of fucked in the head

>>10421928
/lit/

>>10421928
Cleveland, Ohio

>>10421972
Taipei is legitimately great and I support this plan.

>>10422965
this this this a thousand times this
The only asian music I respect is Indian because they stick to their shit and get good at it. Other asians are always trying too hard to fit in, so they start playing violin in the craddle to become super virtuosi, but that's the extent of it. They aren't creative, they're mechanical copycats. Why the fuck don't they try to do something original with their own music? The only chink playing classical I like is Yo Yo Ma. And of course there's loads of chinks in prog because they see it as intellectual. Oh how I miss the likes of Genesis, prog with soul and not some wanking

>>10423086
go to bed

>>10421983
roastie

>>10423107
The city, not the book. I haven't read the book.

>>10421998
not good for art when rent is sky high and your only shot at paying low rent is living among a bunch of rapists and criminals who will try to fuck you over 24/7.

>>10421928
>Or, is the Paris of today just you fucking losers sitting in your basement fondling your little weiners?

Hate to say it but yeah

>>10423119
That’s any interesting major western city. Eastern-Europe even, if you look at rent from a local perspective.

>>10423063
kek

>>10422564
>"ethnically homogenous"
ever been to the white trash areas of the 'Murikun southeast? "ethnically homogenous", totally devoid of culture, intellect, art, or any support for anything like it. Except muh football, y'all.

>>10423119
>all poor people are rapists and criminals who want to fuck you over

>>10423342
I made no reference to poor people, but to a very specific group that swarms the likes of Paris. Feel free to see for yourself.

>>10423262
Exactly. There's one 'ethnically homogenous' country in the world today, and that's North Korea, a sterile police state wasteland mired in poverty because nothing is allowed in or out because it would pollute the cleanest race. Play-acting stormfaggots need to leave.

>>10423386
By using North Korea as an example you're implying all races are the same. Zimbabwe is also ethnically homogenous. Iceland as well. Can you guess the difference?

Folks should ask themselves why are they expecting to see 21st cities following the mold of 20th century cities. A lot will change in the near future, arts communities included.

>>10423401
Zimbabwe has 16 offical languages. It’s not really a good example of a homogenic country.

>>10421928
no where. all expats do now is go to bars and get drunk and try to fuck each other. it's the most degenerate unproductive and nihilistic community there is. china, vietnam, and korea seem to be the hot spots.

>>10423427
China expat. Can confirm. I write like two thousand words a day at least, but I don't know anyone else with any hobbies except drinking and fucking. Feels bad man.

>>10423427
Op here, see you in Vietnam. I’m planning on heading through Asia soon, but in reality, it does seem that the internet is where we’re gonna share our dreams and words and wisdom.

>>10423427
That's because these days 90% of young travellers do it for instagram pics and "being artsy". Hard to find a diamond in a sea of shit. Any hostel will confirm your affirmation that they're all disgusting degenerates. You can't even have a laugh at it, it's so pathetic.

>>10423489
i am upset instagram has given up on coffee art. she's no longer my gf.

>>10421928
Show me a genuinely Bohemian neighbourhood and I'll show you a murder of Jews waiting to gentrify it and make a killing.

It's Mexico City

>>10423526
>Bohemian
>jews gentrifying the western sudetenland
kind of wish this was happening, please produce pics

>>10423546
this looks like an entirely new kind of hell

Am I the only anon in this thread who realises how futile it is to expect the age old bohemian model to withstand all the changes Europe has gone through?

>>10421928

1) The expatriate community of 1920s Paris was lame even back in the 1920s. A boorish pack of middling middle-brows writing back-guard fiction for lower-middle-brow's back home who couldn't do for themselves. Everything actually cutting-edge at the time swirled around the nexus of Ezra Pound and, to a lesser extent, Wyndham and the Vorticists in the European Anglosphere, or the proto-fascist Futurists on the continental side.

2) Seeking out a "set" is such a tryhard thing to do. Especially one as overly romanticised and plebified as Parisian post-war expats. You need to stop being such a clumsy little doofus and start really trying to connect with art on a personal level.

>>10423546
Is this real?

>>10423589
yes
mexico city has insane sprawl. over 20 million people.

>>10423571
>this looks like an entirely new kind of hell
which is exactly the point. You can't expect to create great works relevant to our age by looking for a lifestyle that hasn't existed for almost a century. I honestly find these kind of shitholes extremely interesting, my next suggestion would be Cario. Both cities have nice areas that wouldn't look out of place in western Europe but those are boring

>>10423589
it doesn't all look like this

>>10423607
Why don't you go to Pakistan then? There are surely several adventures to be had over there. The Afghani caves are also a good call.

Maybe Madrid? Cheap whores, sangria and rent and the Prado nearby seems like a good deal.

>>10423703
Spain is the best desu.

>>10423664
Pakastani culture disgusts me and offers nothing of value once you trudge through it's endless shit. Just witnessing the accelerating effect of 21st century technology, poverty and endless growth on top of a deeply historically rich land is alone interestingly enough to visit cairo. I can't wait to see the city 20 years in the future, an overgrown dustbowl with 4000 year old monuments seen between the glass and concrete towers dotting the landscape. The perfect blend between old(really old not 500 year old European city old) and the future. Rome could come close to this if the gentrification wasn't so bad

>>10423489
>it's another starter pack meme that isn't precise or poignant description of concrete type but just some generic unconnected activities compiled by a bitter fuming autist
Why does reddit have to ruin everything? Worse than virgin vs chad becoming plain bad vs good, desu.

>>10423735
It's also a physical manifestation of the coming century, ancient mysticism remerging amongst the failures of the enlightenment contrasted by the technological advances the failed philosophies have retreated to after their rejection from the polictal and religious process

cars, cheap air travel and relentless americanization has ruined this kind of stuff

>>10421928
Paris is still an expat community. Got a problem with fakerefugee art? Are you racist?

>>10421942
>Gypsies begging for money, African street-vendors accosting you
is this viewed as a threat to the american person?

>>10423800
as a threat to the human person, yes

>>10423800
they think crossing the street without a sanctioned guide is a threat to the american person, so probably yes.

>>10421928
Berlin is the city that majority of European artists (that move) move to atm.

You're supposed to be the ubermensch within the imperfect hellhole. You can also still find the grass roots of French Paris, German Berlin, and English London.

>>10421983
My friend and I bought wanted to buy street beers in front of the Eiffel Tower, 2 for 5€. We both pulled money out, though, so after I had already paid and received the two beers, the vendor grabbed the 5€ out of my friend's hand too, dropped two more bottles on the grass in front of us and left.

>>10424126
shiiieeeet rip paris

>>10421928
the 1920s paris of the modern era is the subreddit for pic related

>>10423546
oh hey its southern california

PARIS YES

>>10424206
That's what they get for colonizing Africa.

Singapore is where any and all futureminded people should gather

>>10422155
This. This town's about to erupt with all the creative endeavors going on throughout it.

>>10424223
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
The gooks and chinks spamming this thread never get old

>>10424223
yeah as long as you're only less than a hundred years into the future futureminded because that shit is gonna be underwater

>>10424210
t.

>>10422157
>Ignoring all art forms except for literature.

What about Picasso and Salvador?

>>10424206
oh thank god, nothing worse than germans on holiday

>>10422957
Only correct answer.
The bohemianism of the early 20th century is alive in Brooklyn - talk to any young artist and they'll tell you it's the place to be.

Though the /pol/fags in this thread would hate it because there are a lot of black people (despite gentrification) and the culture is very left-wing.

>>10421942
If they arent there who am I supposed to buy weed from?

>>10421972

Go to bed Tao.

you're posting on it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAExa9P7hME

>>10423433
Please tell me how to do what you do

>>10425520
You got a university degree? Find an ESL agency online and shoot your CV over to them. It's pretty easy to get work, and if you start at one of the big, more reliable schools, they'll help you with rent, accomodation and so on. I'd recommend looking for work in south China (more developed). And stay away from teaching kids.

>>10425334
it's the place to be to live a sham artistic lifestyle when your parents subsidize your existence.

>>10425582
>Implying that wasn't true for Paris, Berlin and literally every other "artistic" city
Creatives are almost always trust fund kiddies who enjoy pretending to be poor.

I heard the not shitty part of Chicago is pretty popping for art

>>10421972
That looks nice desu. How expensive is it?

>>10422551
>Seoul
It's a nice place to live but sadly there's not much of an art scene. On top of that very few people here seems to read for pleasure so the literary scene is also weak. The majority of popular books are translated from Japanese or English. Essay collections & self improvement books seem to be the most common reading material.

>>10422551
The literary scene is a joke and even at academic levels consists mostly of translated Japanese and English works. Not coincidentally, the "art scene" basically consists of poorly-comprehended imitations of Western and Japanese works.

>>10423427
I came in here to pretty much post this. You're absolutely correct. If any of them/us take a break from living a caricature of modern urban life it's to figure out a way to make more money.

>>10422322
Sounds like the state is trying not to waste tax payer money, pity Canada doesn’t do that. Let art survive solely on the market.

>>10424206
This is Chateau D'Eau metro station. The area is like a little Africa. Go to some place of London or NYC and it will be the same : people from another country living in the same area.

Why don't you post a picture of Passy Metro Station ? oh sure, it would not fit the simplistic message you're trying to convey.

>>10426318
Now I want to go to Triangle de Choisy, take pictures and pretend Paris has been invaded by chinamen

Paris Shock Syndrome.
>a thriving expat community of artists churning out the works that will serve to define their era
What is 4chan? Or the internet at large? This is it my guy, there is no larger or more important community. It lacks the exciting lights and street life that you are envisioning, but the internet is that place. It's even filled with crazed obsessive autists like every other art movement.

>>10421963
>Those add texture though. Plus, I think a big theme of this generation is mass-migration and global income inequality. When I can watch a live stream of Americans living in relative splendour from the shithole mud hut I share with my eight brothers and sisters, why don’t I too share a right to that life, if all that separates us is a made up border and a couple undersea cables.
>I don't live in the West, but let me tell you what adds 'texture'
>I have a right to other peoples shit because I too am a human bean
Yes please come to our magic dirt so you can also call yourself a Real American™, or so that you can become a European™.

>>10423489
This picture is more likely to describe a wholesome person, who makes virgins mad because she seems to be slightly above basic Starbucks bitches, but doesn't talk to the kind of guy who made this pic, and the likes who post it.

Sure, there are lots of spiritual wannabe persons in social media. But hey, if they actually travel to those places, if they actually practice those hobbies; they're above the pseudo-intellectual and bitter basement-dwellers who are resentful of them.

>>10424258
Holy shit. He has the face of a fatty and the body of a hungry skeleton.

It would suck to be him.

5 years ago it was Youtube.

>needing to live in a specifc city to be creative so you can be part of a 'scene'

what a pointless excuse for a lack of creativity and drive. some of the greatest books were written huts in the middle of nowhere or boring towns or shitty industrial hellholes. You do not need to live 'muh arty' city to be a writer.

>>10426173
>Hungarian government
>Not wanting to waste tax payer money

Joke of the month kek

>>10423092
>>10422965
>>10422551
While I can't approve of racist language, I have to agree - to suggest Seoul is some bastion of anything artistic, be it music, lit, visual art - makes me make all kinds of weird, wincing, confounded faces, but most of all it just confirms you've never been to Korea in your life, and I'm confused why you would say that if you haven't. Mechanical plastic surgery ravaged robotic copycat cheating motherfuckers, every single one, is what the culture promotes, although that doesn't mean they're all bad people. Fuck Korea and its oligopolist orwellian government and its glacial pace of social progress and its blatent, brazen, disgusting rip offs of every single goddam thing in the culture, from wagon wheels to smartphones to trap music. Boy, does the capital sure fail spectacularly in delivering its titular promise

>>10423119
I've lived in an immigrant heavy part of Paris and it was fine. Sure, it didn't have the muh western culture thing going, but people were nothing but polite a friendly, even generous when I was hard up. A lot of them, even if not educated, enjoyed shooting the shit over drinks about art and literature, current or past, western or not.
The one group to look out for are the gypsys, everyone hates them. Just be careful at the major train stations.

>>10423703
Downside: the Spanish
The Prado is by and far the loudest museum I've been to. It's as loud as a burgerstani bar on 3 dollar bud light pitcher night.
I'm not somebody who gets into fights, but I nearly got into a fight in front of the garden of earthly delights because some ass kept pushing me and reaching his phone in front of my face to take pictures