/lit/ - Literature

>>14237536
>Pindar
fucking based

>>14237457
I've read more than this obvs, but Calvino and Pynch and Vollman and DFW and Cormac McThesaurus and Hesse didn't do it for me.

>>14237209
And I don't have all my books here with me but:

Iliad and Odyssey - Lattimore or Fagles, they're both dece / Aeneid - Fitzgerald
Paradise Lost - Milton
Leaves of Grass - Whitman
A Canticle for Leibowitz - Miller
Galapagos - Vonnegut
The Hobbit & LoTR & Silmarillion - Tolkien
Les Mis - Hugo
The Idiot - Dostoevsky
Emerson's essays
Rant - Palahniuk

>>14237346
Yes read it. It's great. It's about time to read it again, maybe with the cadence of link related. Slight spoilers obvs from the final passages.

https://youtu.be/sthmEkUjACM?t=62

>>14237209
Good taste OP. I liked that B&N's Paradise Lost.

page 8 bump

>>14237110
>Has any atheist ever become unironically religious through theological discussion?
Probably.

>What is the point of these threads?
Philosophical discussion, allegedly. We have problem of evil threads almost daily. I'm slightly surprised the topic always catches on and hasn't gone the way of Pynchposting.

>Why am I even here?
You're not, you're cooming.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQms6ZZzM4I

>>14236792
No.

https://archive.org/details/ost-military-doctrine-fm3_22x9/page/n107

>>14237042
>ad hominem
good argument Aquinas btfo

>>14236599
It doesn't.

>>14236874
show me the infinite fractions of that distance

now show me the finite, knowable fractions of that distance

then explain to me how time isn't knowable only in finite and cyclical spans

>>14236931
this

>>14236909
what happened fren

>>14236791
>Not raised anything.
>I stated out as a lefty.
And now?

>We just need to drop our arrogance
Agreed.

>spit out the fruit that is poisoning us (i.e. the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil
Can you elaborate, how does a person abandon knowledge of good and evil? Seems to me like an attempt at henosis by submission to God, except you're not sure which doctrine (and therefore which practice) correctly represents God. You're mostly leaning towards Judaism but aren't of them. And correct me if I'm wrong but I detect a bit of gnostic belief here as well (the fruit of the tree), which is at odds with praising God at all. Is there any philosophical or moral ideal you can identify in your belief?

>How can you call yourself a monotheist and believe in the trinity?
Rudely put but I'll answer anyway because you seem like an honest seeker. Consubstantiality and the Council of Nicea. The Romans before this held their religious beliefs to be true because they were ancient; this is part of it, and probably most of the authority man can claim with regard to traditions. Catholicism is not only ancient and reveals the truth but also the good and beautiful. Divine origin is good enough for me.

>I'm a muslim in the sense I sumbit to G-d.
But that is not the whole of Islam. Catholics submit to God as well, don't you think? Or Jews, especially? Even Protestants and Baptists make a point of putting their lives and faith in God.

Anyway. I recommend you find a branch to settle on. You probably will in time as you read and understand more. Check out those books I mentioned. Don't let intellectual vanity and pride keep you away from sharing in the love of God with a community.

>>14236688
You're just mad you're not as interesting or eloquent. Hitch is one of my favorite people. He loved to study God despite himself.

>>14236341
Shylock's tormet at being btfo is beside the point. The triumph of Christian mercy is infinitely more important.

>Isiah 45:8
“Shower, O heavens, from above, and let the clouds rain down righteousness; let the earth open, that salvation and righteousness may bear fruit; let the earth cause them both to sprout; I the LORD have created it.

>Portia, in William Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice, Act 4, Scene 1
The quality of mercy is not strained.
It droppeth as the gentle rain from heaven
Upon the place beneath. It is twice blest:
It blesseth him that gives and him that takes.
'Tis mightiest in the mightiest; it becomes
The thronèd monarch better than his crown.
His scepter shows the force of temporal power,
The attribute to awe and majesty
Wherein doth sit the dread and fear of kings;
But mercy is above this sceptered sway.
It is enthronèd in the hearts of kings;
It is an attribute to God Himself;
And earthly power doth then show likest God's
When mercy seasons justice. Therefore, Jew,
Though justice be thy plea, consider this:
That in the course of justice none of us
Should see salvation. We do pray for mercy,
And that same prayer doth teach us all to render
The deeds of mercy. I have spoke thus much
To mitigate the justice of thy plea,
Which, if thou follow, this strict court of Venice
Must needs give sentence 'gainst the merchant there.

no you're based

>>14236525
>So your a Catholic?
A bad one yeah. I was raised into it then left around adolescence like the majority of people my age. I only came back to the church a few years ago, and to God a few years before that. What is your religious background? What tradition were you raised in, if any?

>What are your thoughts on the beni noah idea?
Not familiar with it. If you mean keeping the laws of Noah, that's fine. Can't hurt someone who would have no faith otherwise. I believe the church is right about a universal call to holiness. God is calling us, always. We just forget to listen most of the time. And for some, gradually we hear the call more strongly and become oriented towards him as best we can. This can mean beginning thinking about spirituality at all, changes in ways faith is practiced, changing the nuances of our belief, or answering the call of the Lord truly and enthusiastically; a transformation of the heart, being born again as scripture says.

>>14234743
Nah, more like a world-shunning martyr cult that endangered the social order by declaring pious Romans idolators and achieving the same remarkable results in individuals as the philosophical schools without any learning, only by belief and a strictly enforced social order of their own.

*presumptuous

>>14236286
>I'm not a Christian. I can't take Yeshua as a saviour. Only G-d can forgive sins imo.
>May our Lord guide and bless us.
So what do you pray? How do you say a Glory Be or Hail Mary without praising the Son like the Father? So far it seems you are simply Jewish.

>Books for this feel?
The New Testament. You may also enjoy Popular Patristics' St. Athanasius On The Incarnation. Or Harnack's Marcion if you want to examine some of the early controversy about the person of Jesus. Or as another anon has serendipitously brought up, Wilken's Christians as the Romans Saw Them. Any of these will undoubtedly give you a perspective on Christ.

>Bonus questions: how do you pray? What words and physical positions do you put yourself in? When? How often?
Most days, but not every day. When I don't pray I honestly later recognize that I've been feeling terrible, I get caught up in the world and forget my purpose and foundation. I'll say evening prayers in bed before falling asleep. Several Hail Mary, Our Father, Glory Be, etc. A full rosary sometimes. During the day, I'll stop into the chapel and say a few prayers when I remember. Honestly the stress has been getting to me lately and I've neglected it.

>>14236384
>Am i just letting materiality get in the way?
A little.

>I feel like physical positions help ground our awareness of our position within and as creation.
You're not wrong. Kneeling is for lack of a better term a somatic component, a sign of penitence, to God and as a reminder to our own self. It can't be bad to quietly and privately express your contrition as best as or however you can.

Ultimately I'd say read what you want. Be good. I would say God will find you whether you reach for him or not, but you already revere God. In which case I would say Jesus will find you whether you reach for him or not. But that sounds presumptive. I can't help identifying with your position a little, I used to be somewhat the same way. I think it was a lack of humility on my part. A belief that I was wise. I was not.

>>14236122
>Even the US military deploys mindfulness among its commanders and troops, teaching them how to focus on their breath as they pull the trigger.
Breath control is for practical purposes, the body is steadiest (ie most accurate) holding at full exhale. It's not about mindfulness.

Yeah meditation has some value. I'm suspicious of any secular agency that advertises its product as the sacred however. People seem to reject their inherited traditions out of hand (if they hadn't been rejected a generation or two before). Can't help feeling this scientism on one hand and new age garbage on the other are partially responsible.

>>14235927
TEAM JACOB

>>14235928
Niebuhr's Christ & Culture. Good so far.

>>14232949
Bishop Robert Barron
Casey Cole OFM
Dan Horan OFM and them Chicago boyz
Jordan Peterson for better or worse

>>14234091
>wasn't prepared to fight, therefore he got crucified

>>14234394
>he refused to fight.

Do you know why that is?

Because forgiveness is what he preached, and crucifixion is what his Father asked of him. Seriously, read the NT.